Someone needs to sue the TSA

[BellaBellucci]

Bella's logic and pissing and moaning about her civil liberties being violated is absurb at best.

As usual, my arguments can't be respected because to do so might actually allow them to gain momentum. Well, if that's the case:

http://www.eagletribune.com/newhamps...canner-protest

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/home/50...gents.html.csp

http://www1.whdh.com/news/articles/n...oliday-travel/

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/di...tripping-down/

Shall I continue? What's absurd is your implication that I'm the only one who has a problem with all of this.

I'm going to rest my case here because your argument has lost all logical cohesion.

~BB~

[DaveinBoston]

You are too funny.

Do you think that a private agency could possibly handle providing the infrastructure to maintain security at every airport in the country? Wouldnt it be great if it was a contract that went out to bid like other projects and we got a new agency each 3-5 years (the lowest bidder) and changed out the workforce.

Please tell me what private agency could actually handle a security force that size....?????????????????????????????????????????? ???

The airlines are in trouble because of the economy and cost of fuel... and the fact that a plane still has to fly if its full or has 5 people on board.

What planet are you on that you dont think air cargo doesnt get screened and/or xrayed?

You are concerned about being forced back into the stone age? Again... no one is forcing you to do anything. You have a choice...

You mean a privately owned plane in a quasi-public airport where the screening is conducted by officials who are not employees of that airline or the airport at a time when air travel is already on the decline. That means that despite the industry being in trouble, the government is making it harder to fly. And really? Must I be forced back into the stone age by taking a prohibitively less convenient mode of transportation as the only alternative to participating in an Orwellian experiment? Yet cargo (again) is our weakest link. They can X-ray inanimate objects all they like but they don't; instead they electronically strip search us. Come on with that. People depend on air travel and most dangerous things that get onto a plane are in luggage or cardboard boxes.

So question: if they had a way to require you to go through a bio-metric scan every time you got behind the wheel, would your argument be that people should walk? Really? So instead of taking that energy and fighting for our rights, you expect us to just give it away to the government instead just because you choose too? Sounds pretty selfish to me. Don't even get me started on the 5th Amendment implications possible if law enforcement ever points to airline security as a precedent to determine what is a reasonable search. Pretty soon they'll be able to strip search anyone they like.

If I had to go on a bio-metric scan to drive? Seriously... why? Is someone trying to use my car as a weapon and fly it into the side of a building? Is a passenger going to jump into my car with C-4 in their underwear? Im beginning to think you border insanity.

By the way... are you talking about the 4th Amendmant? The 5th has to do with self-incrimation.


Do you also like Obamacare? TARP? Do you drive a 'Government Motors' automobile?

I think Obama is a socialist-muslim-liar and currently our worst president to date. TARP sucks and people like Barney Frank helped cause the whole melt down. My tax money went to bail out people who took out irresponsible loans. What about my house?


I'm sorry, this may come off as personal, but I find it disgusting that anybody would submit themselves to that level or scrutiny just to lower the odds of being injured when those odds are already at 1:500,000. You have a greater chance of having an autistic child (1:150), and really, how many of those do you know well?

Wow... you are crazy. I was speaking if a proecdure lessened my chance of dying I'd do it. What on Gods green earth does me knowing a kid with Autism have to do with airline security? By the way, one of my co-workers son's has severe autism, to the point where he's been institutionalized. We have an annual fundraiser at work....


That's exactly my point! What do full body scans have to do with lowering the chances that someone will bring a non-metallic agent that can't fit into a body cavity onto a plane when, again, if it reaches the security line it's already too late? Makes no sense, does it?

If it reaches the security line.. it's too late? Really? If they catch them in line... they dont get to blow up the plane do they????? DO THEY?


So again I ask, because people are blowing themselves up making meth, should we ban cigarette lighters? Of course not. Your argument that my argument is ridiculous... is ridiculous.

HEY NUT JOB.... CIGARETTE LIGHTERS ARE BANNED ON PLANES

Oh, you mean the arbitrary speed limits that dull our driving skills? There are no speed limits in most of Europe and far fewer highway fatalities. Do you know why? Because personal responsibility makes Europeans better drivers overall. And alcohol? OMG! The effects of alcohol vary by the person. I know plenty of people who could run a Gran Prix at .08 and plenty who couldn't ride a bike at .02. I mean you're talking to a girl who comes from the only state in the country that doesn't require auto insurance. I don't agree with it, but I took advantage on occasion when I was living there. Do you think that state's roads have descended into chaos? Of course not. Extra points if you can name the state.

Oh yes.. that old chestnut.. "I drive better drunk"...HAHAHA

Personal responsibility makes European better? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
In France in 2004, it was estimated that because of the cost of driving, there were 800,000 unlicensed drivers... just in FRANCE...HAHAHHA

There are speed limits in Europe Einstein.. they are just higher than here. And lets talk about the cameras on the highways in Europe that take pictures of your car when speeding and mail you a ticket... IS THAT VIOLATING YOUR RIGHT TO PRIVACY?

You want to talk Drinking and driving in Europe?

Sweden, for example, considers a BAC of .02 as a DUI, and in Italy the state can sell your vehicle if you get a DUI. Most countries use a graduated BAC as punishment... the higher the BAC, the worse the punishment.

Here in the US, you get your wrist slapped.

Furthermore, how come people are not supposed to discriminate against other people based on their experiences, but the government can discriminate against every person based on nothing other than arguable statistics. I mean, hell, if you want to go there, what's Constitutional about our drug policy? Not a DAMN thing.

I have no idea what this sentence means. Discriminate against people based on experiences? HUH? Drug policies? I think you are on drugs!

That's irrelevant. They're against the scanners for everyone, not just pilots.



It was accepted practice at the time that we all now know is wrong. Full body scanners are accepted by many people too... see where I'm going with this? The Founders did not have the political clout to shake up the status quo enough to provide everyone with the same freedoms in their time, hence their foresight dictated that the Constitution be a sort of wish list. Even though everyone didn't have equal rights back then, they worded the Bill of Rights in such a way that eventually they would have to, and in fact we did extend those rights to everyone.

You made a statement saying what the founding fathers would say about scanners violating rights... well... Im going by our founding fathers believes at that day... SLAVES WERE THE WAY. THATS WHAT THEY BELIEVED. You cant pick and chose... well they were right this way.. because it would prove what you are saying but not right in other respects.

The Founding Fathers didnt have the polictical clout to provide everyone with the same freedoms? They were the ONLY POLICITICAN. If they didnt have slaves themselves your statement would carry a little more credit.


'Hypocritical?' Try 'idealistic.'



Are you kidding? These were guys who pranced around in powdered wigs, makeup, and ruffles, sometimes even on the battlefield. Again, please spare me the historical relativism. If you have such a problem with how much things have changed since the beginning of our nation, please do try your hand at re-writing the Constitution.



And the most ironic name of a corporation in the history of history is...

~BB~

Dont worry. Im not going to respond to any futher replies from you. I think whatever meds you've been on have affected your brain.

[BellaBellucci]

What planet are you on that you dont think air cargo doesnt get screened and/or xrayed?

Ok, I guess I'm not done. You have more 'absurd' arguments for me to debunk.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...n-hills-radar/

http://www.nextgov.com/nextgov/ng_20...9.php?oref=rss

http://www.govexec.com/dailyfed/1110/110410nj1.htm

Google is your friend.

You are concerned about being forced back into the stone age? Again... no one is forcing you to do anything. You have a choice...

Sure, I have a choice: I can drive the three days next time I want to go back to Boston. Not much of a choice, is it?

If I had to go on a bio-metric scan to drive? Seriously... why? Is someone trying to use my car as a weapon and fly it into the side of a building? Is a passenger going to jump into my car with C-4 in their underwear? Im beginning to think you border insanity.

By the way... are you talking about the 4th Amendmant? The 5th has to do with self-incrimation.

Why? Well why should you have to do a scan to fly? The government obviously can make you and many others do anything it wants with only a minimal justification. For the last time, body scans provide no real security advantages. You've yet to argue that point and my comparison to driving is intended to point of the silliness of your argument.

I think Obama is a socialist-muslim-liar and currently our worst president to date. TARP sucks and people like Barney Frank helped cause the whole melt down. My tax money went to bail out people who took out irresponsible loans. What about my house?

Finally we agree on something.

Wow... you are crazy. I was speaking if a proecdure lessened my chance of dying I'd do it. What on Gods green earth does me knowing a kid with Autism have to do with airline security? By the way, one of my co-workers son's has severe autism, to the point where he's been institutionalized. We have an annual fundraiser at work....

It's about odds. So the answer to my question (how many autistic children do you know well?) is one and yet you hold a fundraiser. So statistically speaking, you'd have to know 166,667 terror victims to justify your argument on that level. (1:150 versus 1:25 million).

If it reaches the security line.. it's too late? Really? If they catch them in line... they dont get to blow up the plane do they????? DO THEY?

No, they blow up the tightly coiled security line which contains approximately the same number of people as the plane. Minus the property damage, it's the exact same outcome.

HEY NUT JOB.... CIGARETTE LIGHTERS ARE BANNED ON PLANES

I meant everywhere. I don't see anyone cooking meth on an airplane either, do you? This was an argument about overreaching, not literally about banning cigarette lighters.

There are speed limits in Europe Einstein.. they are just higher than here. And lets talk about the cameras on the highways in Europe that take pictures of your car when speeding and mail you a ticket... IS THAT VIOLATING YOUR RIGHT TO PRIVACY?

Absolutely. As do the red light cameras we use here. Not to mention the selective enforcement and payola issues that go along with them. They don't make drivers any better. And I never said there were no speed limits. I said there were fewer speed limits. There are also more designated high speed areas than we have here.

I have no idea what this sentence means. Discriminate against people based on experiences? HUH? Drug policies? I think you are on drugs!

The point is that polite society is not supposed to be judgmental yet our government sets criminal drug policy based on weighted statistics (often based on the personal judgments of those in power) that serve the true purpose of the drug war: perpetuating the prison/industrial complex, and it's unconstitutional. The same thing goes for the scanners: the government has essentially deemed air travel unsafe without their unconstitutional practices based on statistics that are cherry picked to reflect nothing but their own interests. They used the same technique to outlaw marijuana. Scanners are the new millennium's Reefer Madness. Get it now? It's all propaganda.

The Founding Fathers didnt have the polictical clout to provide everyone with the same freedoms? They were the ONLY POLICITICAN. If they didnt have slaves themselves your statement would carry a little more credit.

Really? What about the economy of the time? So there were no landowners? What about the Crown? Just because there were so few American politicians in the newly formed government, it doesn't mean that the nation lacked other political figures, organizations, and interests.

Dont worry. Im not going to respond to any futher replies from you. I think whatever meds you've been on have affected your brain.

Attacking your opponent directly is the #1 tell-tale sign of a weak argument. Arguing with you is like taking candy from a baby, and frankly, you're starting to make me feel a little guilty about it.

~BB~

[lisaparadise]

bella your persistant ill give that that but your not gonna win this period lol you must be a republican

[BellaBellucci]

bella your persistant ill give that that but your not gonna win this period lol you must be a republican

Well there's no win or lose really. It comes down to a choice: you can be emotional about it or you can be logical. In fact, it can be directly correlated to the theism versus anti-theism debate which will continue forever. Personally, I choose to be logical but also faithful so I'm agnostic. And no I'm not a Republican; I'm a Libertarian.

For the last time, some people may not mind the scanner, but many do, and they have the right to object to a definite strip search versus a 1:25,000,000 chance of death.

~BB~

[DaveinBoston]

bella your persistant ill give that that but your not gonna win this period lol you must be a republican

At some point I have to discontinue banging my head against a wall.

She is clearly thought-impared...although looking at your new pictures...and caught the video on your site... it impairs my thought process as a certain amount of blood flows away from my brain into a lower part of my body (well the bigger brain anyway...lol)

[BellaBellucci]

although looking at your new pictures...and caught the video on your site... it impairs my thought process as a certain amount of blood flows away from my brain into a lower part of my body (well the bigger brain anyway...lol)

I can live with that. Good debate.

~BB~

[lisaparadise]

At some point I have to discontinue banging my head against a wall.

She is clearly thought-impared...although looking at your new pictures...and caught the video on your site... it impairs my thought process as a certain amount of blood flows away from my brain into a lower part of my body (well the bigger brain anyway...lol)

yer such a perv lol i love it thank you dave

[DaveinBoston]

yer such a perv lol i love it thank you dave

That body brings it out in me

[kieron]

There are major security holes in just about every part of society, but the point is that unless you want to live in a totalitarian state then you need to just deal with it. Ending up on a watch list that prevents you from traveling by air, without so much as a hearing before hand, and then having no real way to get off of it, is a blatant violation of due process imo. Of course that has never stopped the government before.

Invasive body scans, excessive pat downs, secret "enemy" lists, etc are all signs of deterioration into a police state. Justifications could be found for any number of heavy handed tactics, but that does not mean that we should want to live in a society that employs those practices.

I agree with NYBURBS comment here!