Andrej Pejic

[jamiethewild]

...I just don't have the interest. The fashion industry thrives on being cutting edge and "oddballness", and this person is the oddball de jour. The only reason he thrives today is because he looks so much like the current crop of very tall, very thin models, who have a very androgynous presentation, and are mostly from Eastern Europe ( as he is), but with the added twist of being male. He is certainly not something that any transwomen I know hold in adulation.

Lets play a game, shall we...let's look at a couple of youtube videos from the early 90's, with real women whose presentation defined femininity for that time. The great Queens and transwomen of the era sought to emulate these gorgeous females, and something has been lost since then, I think...ask a transwoman of today if she would like to look like Andrej or Christy Turlington...

I feel ya on this !!!

[jamiethewild]

Damn look at this bottomXO sissifying this thread /forum ... take a chill pill and smell the coffee ... TS Forum not gay forum

[GrimFusion]

Damn look at this bottomXO sissifying this thread /forum ... take a chill pill and smell the coffee ... TS Forum not gay forum

That's what we've all been saying. Shit doesn't get through, though; that's the problem. BottomXO is obsessed about who's secretly gay and who isn't. That's true blue desperation to get dicked if I've ever seen it. Desperation stinks.

[amberskyi]

Amber, I don't know if you'd been following his posts around here. He tends to call people like Dan, gay, as an insult. Not just here, other posts as well. I'm not calling him that as an insult to him, it's to point out the fact that he is using it as a slur, when he himself is in fact begging men to plug him, half of his posts are stereotypically gay. It is his attack on others when it is clearly him who is insulted by who he is. Psychologists call it transferance. And it's seperate from someone liking Andrej Pejic. That's a really simplistic way to look at it.

The greater argument, which I've seen on this site way too many times to argue over here, is this whole notion of "a boy in a dress" and whether or not someone is gay for liking someone like you. There are men on here who would make the exact same argument about you. I believe FreddieGomez has about others on here. Amber, are you a boy in a dress? I don't think so, and I would never call you that. Yet, you do have a penis, and wear dresses. Do you see yourself as a woman or a boy in a dress? I'm guessing not. I'm guessing you aren't wearing a bra for giggles or because someone is paying you to do so. I'm thinking its because there's something inside of you that identifies yourself and female. Do you really and truly believe that all the men on here who are interested in you sexually want to go home and watch gay porn, or pick up guys on the side? There's a scale to things that isn't black and white on here. When does someone just stop being a guy who is fem and become a trannsexual? Most of the women on here can't give a consistent answer to it. If a woman in transition doesn't have her implants, is she just a gay guy in a dress?

The greater point to this, with very few exceptions that I've seen among the guys, there's a greater femine quality that has to be present. It can't just be a guy in a skirt, otherwise there'd be a thousand Braveheart posts dedicated to Mel Gibson. That Prince Flackoo guy, Ben likes him and posts a lot of photos, Ben is unique on here among the people I've seen. and that's cool. If someone went after Ben like that, I'd stand up and defend Ben too. But I think Ben is the exception. I lurked for many a year before taking a more active role on here. You don't see many other guys posting Flackoo. He doesn't have that fem quality. Andrej has it, he may not identify himself that way, but he gives it off and certainly trades on his ability to do so. It doesn't matter what Pejic thinks, it's what the person viewing him thinks. That is what I'd say, and I stand by this, 99% of the men on here who do appreciate him, like about him. It's why I say, and stand by the fact, that the overwhelming majority of men on here identify as straight. They don't want a male porn star, they want something that has that female quality.

So go ahead and laugh if you want. But that idiot calling Dan gay is like someone calling you a guy in a dress. It was meant to be mean, a slur, and it was meant to offend. And if someone on here ever did that to you, I'd take offense at that too and tee off and the jerk just as I did here. As much as the petty arguments on here seem to always come to the surface, the fact is that this is a community where we support each other because of a common thing that most of the people outside of here look down on with scorn and shame. If an idiot is going to come in here and spread hate, I don't want him here. That's what Bottom did. I stand my decision to rip him a new one.

regardless of where a trans woman is in her transition she is a woman regardless because thats how she feels.being a trans woman is much more than looking feminine. femininity shouldnt be confused with womanliness. its a certain essence,vibe,demeanor or what ever you want to call it that some one who isnt a woman isnt going to have no matter how fem.people can call me a boy in a dress if they like but i know who i am.i know the nights ive cried myself to sleep cause i wanted nothing else than to have my body reflect the woman i knew i was meant to be.regardless of the fact that i have a penis there are men who recognize the woman inside of me and is attracted to that and to me those men are straight.there are men who are attracted to the cock on a ts woman more than anything but im not going to shoot myself in that face by going in to that lol
im not here to judge people or put anyone down.im just stating the facts. andrej is a man,he considers himself to be male.so to find him attractive is to have homosexual feelings and desires (i dont think theres anything wrong with that).i feel the same way about men who are attracted to crossdressers (not to be confused with early transitioners or ts woman who are just dressing up for the first time) and tv's. at the end of the day its a man.
these are just my feelings on the matter and shouldnt be confused with judgment.

[jamiethewild]

That's what we've all been saying. Shit doesn't get through, though; that's the problem. BottomXO is obsessed about who's secretly gay and who isn't. That's true blue desperation to get dicked if I've ever seen it. Desperation stinks.

Hahaha i know .... this bitch needs relax go elsewhere he'll be a freak among many men in here / real world haven't been reading much but sure looks like it . as i read more... reminds of a mental dude that no has brain just thinks of cocks 24/7 hiding on the lockers like a sissy wanting some but never does get it hahah eww ...

[danthepoetman]

Damn look at this bottomXO sissifying this thread /forum ... take a chill pill and smell the coffee ... TS Forum not gay forum

Jesus! thank you, Jamie. A down to earth, grounded lady with great common sense who tell things the way they are!
None of this really has anything to do whatsoever with Andrej Pejik. He’s just a model for whom we have some admiration because of his feminine qualities, whether by the way, we recognize them or not. And nobody is pretending, as far as I know, that he’s a woman: that’s ridiculous. You just have someone here who’s mixing everything, and insulting everyone, and who in the end, implicitly denies the fact that t-women are women by considering everyone here gay. Which is utterly fucking absurd (excuse my French once again)!!!!

[JenniferParisHusband]

regardless of where a trans woman is in her transition she is a woman regardless because thats how she feels.being a trans woman is much more than looking feminine. femininity shouldnt be confused with womanliness. its a certain essence,vibe,demeanor or what ever you want to call it that some one who isnt a woman isnt going to have no matter how fem.people can call me a boy in a dress if they like but i know who i am.i know the nights ive cried myself to sleep cause i wanted nothing else than to have my body reflect the woman i knew i was meant to be.regardless of the fact that i have a penis there are men who recognize the woman inside of me and is attracted to that and to me those men are straight.there are men who are attracted to the cock on a ts woman more than anything but im not going to shoot myself in that face by going in to that lol
im not here to judge people or put anyone down.im just stating the facts. andrej is a man,he considers himself to be male.so to find him attractive is to have homosexual feelings and desires (i dont think theres anything wrong with that).i feel the same way about men who are attracted to crossdressers (not to be confused with early transitioners or ts woman who are just dressing up for the first time) and tv's. at the end of the day its a man.
these are just my feelings on the matter and shouldnt be confused with judgment.

I can respect that. Thanks for the honest words.

[danthepoetman]

Amber, I don't know if you'd been following his posts around here. He tends to call people like Dan, gay, as an insult. Not just here, other posts as well. I'm not calling him that as an insult to him, it's to point out the fact that he is using it as a slur, when he himself is in fact begging men to plug him, half of his posts are stereotypically gay. It is his attack on others when it is clearly him who is insulted by who he is. Psychologists call it transferance. And it's seperate from someone liking Andrej Pejic. That's a really simplistic way to look at it.

The greater argument, which I've seen on this site way too many times to argue over here, is this whole notion of "a boy in a dress" and whether or not someone is gay for liking someone like you. There are men on here who would make the exact same argument about you. I believe FreddieGomez has about others on here. Amber, are you a boy in a dress? I don't think so, and I would never call you that. Yet, you do have a penis, and wear dresses. Do you see yourself as a woman or a boy in a dress? I'm guessing not. I'm guessing you aren't wearing a bra for giggles or because someone is paying you to do so. I'm thinking its because there's something inside of you that identifies yourself and female. Do you really and truly believe that all the men on here who are interested in you sexually want to go home and watch gay porn, or pick up guys on the side? There's a scale to things that isn't black and white on here. When does someone just stop being a guy who is fem and become a trannsexual? Most of the women on here can't give a consistent answer to it. If a woman in transition doesn't have her implants, is she just a gay guy in a dress?

The greater point to this, with very few exceptions that I've seen among the guys, there's a greater femine quality that has to be present. It can't just be a guy in a skirt, otherwise there'd be a thousand Braveheart posts dedicated to Mel Gibson. That Prince Flackoo guy, Ben likes him and posts a lot of photos, Ben is unique on here among the people I've seen. and that's cool. If someone went after Ben like that, I'd stand up and defend Ben too. But I think Ben is the exception. I lurked for many a year before taking a more active role on here. You don't see many other guys posting Flackoo. He doesn't have that fem quality. Andrej has it, he may not identify himself that way, but he gives it off and certainly trades on his ability to do so. It doesn't matter what Pejic thinks, it's what the person viewing him thinks. That is what I'd say, and I stand by this, 99% of the men on here who do appreciate him, like about him. It's why I say, and stand by the fact, that the overwhelming majority of men on here identify as straight. They don't want a male porn star, they want something that has that female quality.

So go ahead and laugh if you want. But that idiot calling Dan gay is like someone calling you a guy in a dress. It was meant to be mean, a slur, and it was meant to offend. And if someone on here ever did that to you, I'd take offense at that too and tee off and the jerk just as I did here. As much as the petty arguments on here seem to always come to the surface, the fact is that this is a community where we support each other because of a common thing that most of the people outside of here look down on with scorn and shame. If an idiot is going to come in here and spread hate, I don't want him here. That's what Bottom did. I stand my decision to rip him a new one.

regardless of where a trans woman is in her transition she is a woman regardless because thats how she feels.being a trans woman is much more than looking feminine. femininity shouldnt be confused with womanliness. its a certain essence,vibe,demeanor or what ever you want to call it that some one who isnt a woman isnt going to have no matter how fem.people can call me a boy in a dress if they like but i know who i am.i know the nights ive cried myself to sleep cause i wanted nothing else than to have my body reflect the woman i knew i was meant to be.regardless of the fact that i have a penis there are men who recognize the woman inside of me and is attracted to that and to me those men are straight.there are men who are attracted to the cock on a ts woman more than anything but im not going to shoot myself in that face by going in to that lol
im not here to judge people or put anyone down.im just stating the facts. andrej is a man,he considers himself to be male.so to find him attractive is to have homosexual feelings and desires (i dont think theres anything wrong with that).i feel the same way about men who are attracted to crossdressers (not to be confused with early transitioners or ts woman who are just dressing up for the first time) and tv's. at the end of the day its a man.
these are just my feelings on the matter and shouldnt be confused with judgment.

Beautifully put, and absolutely accurate, in my opinion, JPH.
Amber, I’ve heard Pejik talked about himself a few times. And that’s precisely where the problem emerges. He says he wasn’t happy with his look as a male, and that he constructed himself a look on his own. He insist that the look he has is not a look imposed on him by the fashion industry, but his creation, the look he wanted to have in his daily life. It seems he was discovered with this look, in a McDonald’s or what have you, by an agent of some kind. He doesn’t define himself as male. He constantly repeats that he doesn’t believe in genres anymore, he doesn’t believe that there is a line to be drawn between men and women. I don’t personally agree with that. But you have to respect the concept, and you have to admit he doesn’t exactly fit the straight definition of a “man”. Now the femininity he is trying to exploit on himself you might like or dislike, but it is there, it’s obvious and even striking to say the least. That we would find a thread on him on this forum shouldn’t be surprising then, isn’t it? And some other models are adopting the same kind of attitude. JPH’s argument is very valid: why would you draw a line? Why would you think you have the key to what gay is or isn’t? Pejik doesn’t seem to consider himself a woman, but he doesn’t consider himself a man either…
JPH’s point is ultimately that men on this forum recognize, against a large majority of people in our society (who are doing exactly that, judging), t-women to be women, and that most express a real admiration not only for t-women’s beauty, but also for your courage and dedication. We all consider t-women to be women to the fullest extent, and we all (or almost all) have desire for femininity, not virility (brrrr!). By his slurs, bottomguy is implying the opposite, he’s implying that you aren’t women and that we are all gay; and therefore, that there is no reason for us not to have desire for him, who’s so obviously a gay man! And moreover, he insults us because we don’t! It doesn’t have anything to do with Pejik precisely. It’s because we are not gay that he insults us! This is why your reaction seemed a little strange to me too. Your equation “interest for Pejik”=”gay desire”, just doesn’t make sense, and doesn’t define this bottomguy’s attitude in the least bit either, on the contrary… Understand that I’m saying all this to you only with the greatest respect. I understand your feelings as a woman and I respect them; but you have to understand where we’re coming from in all of this. Please!

[Merkurie]

Physical attractiveness is objective, external.
Gender identity is subjective, internal.
People being attracted to Andrej for his feminine beauty should be obvious. He dos'nt give off a lot of obvious masculinity. And as a couture model he earns a living projecting the current high fashion ideal of beauty. That is his trade and its not surprising for men to be attracted to that.

That is objective attraction. If you hung out with Andrej he may completely turn the men off if he has no "essence" of femininity" in person. There are otherwise attractive gentic women who are so unfeminine they are also a turn off.

What Andrej's gender identity is is subjective, internal. And frankly take with a grain of salt anything from Andrej because I have heard him say basically everything about his gender identity and it is different nearly every time. But remember creating that confusion is Andrej's meal ticket.

[amberskyi]

Beautifully put, and absolutely accurate, in my opinion, JPH.
Amber, I’ve heard Pejik talked about himself a few times. And that’s precisely where the problem emerges. He says he wasn’t happy with his look as a male, and that he constructed himself a look on his own. He insist that the look he has is not a look imposed on him by the fashion industry, but his creation, the look he wanted to have in his daily life. It seems he was discovered with this look, in a McDonald’s or what have you, by an agent of some kind. He doesn’t define himself as male. He constantly repeats that he doesn’t believe in genres anymore, he doesn’t believe that there is a line to be drawn between men and women. I don’t personally agree with that. But you have to respect the concept, and you have to admit he doesn’t exactly fit the straight definition of a “man”. Now the femininity he is trying to exploit on himself you might like or dislike, but it is there, it’s obvious and even striking to say the least. That we would find a thread on him on this forum shouldn’t be surprising then, isn’t it? And some other models are adopting the same kind of attitude. JPH’s argument is very valid: why would you draw a line? Why would you think you have the key to what gay is or isn’t? Pejik doesn’t seem to consider himself a woman, but he doesn’t consider himself a man either…
JPH’s point is ultimately that men on this forum recognize, against a large majority of people in our society (who are doing exactly that, judging), t-women to be women, and that most express a real admiration not only for t-women’s beauty, but also for your courage and dedication. We all consider t-women to be women to the fullest extent, and we all (or almost all) have desire for femininity, not virility (brrrr!). By his slurs, bottomguy is implying the opposite, he’s implying that you aren’t women and that we are all gay; and therefore, that there is no reason for us not to have desire for him, who’s so obviously a gay man! And moreover, he insults us because we don’t! It doesn’t have anything to do with Pejik precisely. It’s because we are not gay that he insults us! This is why your reaction seemed a little strange to me too. Your equation “interest for Pejik”=”gay desire”, just doesn’t make sense, and doesn’t define this bottomguy’s attitude in the least bit either, on the contrary… Understand that I’m saying all this to you only with the greatest respect. I understand your feelings as a woman and I respect them; but you have to understand where we’re coming from in all of this. Please!

you do notice that your using male pronouns while talking about him right lol.like the poster underneath you said (merkurie i think it is) i have seen him talk about himself and his gender in variety of conflicting and confusing ways but feeling like a woman was something he's never expressed.
i think alot of what society thinks about trans woman is what they are exposed to in the media.they see people like Andrej, rupauls drag race and jerry springer and think thats what being trans is all about.on some part i think the porn industry is also responsible for what people think about trans woman as well. we're not exactly represented as woman who want nothing other than to live their lives as woman but as inbetweeners, confused and comical.i personally dont have anything against Andrej (i think he's gorgeous) or the men attracted to him.im just not going to pretend that being attracted to him is the same as being attracted to me or that its hetrosexual to be into him.
im not calling anyone names or trying to put anyone down.i respect how you and others may feel about it.i feel how i fell and im not going to change my mind.i think i expressed my opinion in an intelligent and respectful manner.i really dont have much else to say on the matter.