Occupy Wall Street protest

[robertlouis]

Hey, listen.

I completely respect your views, beliefs and opinions. I just disagree with them is all.

I guess I'm more along the line of "the hanging judge". Kill someone, you deserve to die. In the Bernardo case I mentioned above there was video evidence of the rape torture and murder of the three girls.

Both he and his wife should be 6 feet under.

Again, my opinion.

But we have both kind of gone off topic of the thread,

OK, briefly, I respect your views too without agreeing with them. What made me "SMH" was your assertion that the family of the victim should be actively involved in the execution. That can never be right.

[cockgobbler]

OK, briefly, I respect your views too without agreeing with them. What made me "SMH" was your assertion that the family of the victim should be actively involved in the execution. That can never be right.

Again, repsecting your opinion, I really think that if someone killed a member of my family I would want to be the one to flip the switch.

If that situation ever actually materalized would my opinion differ?

I can honestly say I don'r know for sure, but I THINK not.

[BluegrassCat]

Blue Grass Cat.....It's clear that neither of us is going to convince the other, so let's attempt a slightly different approach. You, your left wing brethern on HA, and every lib in the country love to parrot the administration's nonsense about the wonderful effects of the billion dollar stimulus, some of us on the hand prefer to deal in mathematic absolutes and maintain its un-provable to quantify a "saved or created" job, and that the vast majority of the money went to bail out states that made bad spending decesions themselves, and that before we embark on stimulus 2, 3, etc. we should have some clear data on the affects of such enormous deficit spending because that money either has to be borrowed or printed. Now read what Senator Toomey asks the non-partisan Congressional Budget Office director, Mr. Elmendorf at a Congressional Hearing. For those who aren't familiar with the CBO, they're essentially the country's accounting firm......This is enormously instructive as you, your idol Paul Krugman and the Dems assure us we can spend our way to prosperity rather than into oblivion.

Dear God, does your intellectual dishonesty know no bounds??? You claim you want to deal in facts, please start, I've been waiting. The entire economics profession has countless charts, graphs and models that all point to the effectiveness of the stimulus and the need for more. Here's one based on the model by conservative Douglas Holtz-Eakin:


Where's your evidence? If what you claim is so obviously true it would show up in the data. You can only point to dishonest Heritage Foundation graphs which I've already debunked in the Politics section. The balance of evidence completely vindicates Keynesianism and refutes your austerity approach.

SEN. TOOMEY: I know it is your view that the recent huge increase in spending and the corresponding big deficits have generated more economic growth and more job creation that we would have had in the absence of those things. But surely you'd agree, that that essentially asks for a comparison to a counterfactual, and as such, it's completely impossible to prove?

DR. DOUGLAS ELMENDORF, director of the CBO: Yes, that's right, senator.

As for your testimony, first of all the CBO director says he believes according to the evidence that the stimulus worked and more stimulus is needed so case basically closed. But you're taken in by a deceptive and meaningless question by the radical extremist Toomey. Let me illustrate how useless this question by posing another.

SEN TOOMEY: I know it is your view that the recent failure to drop atomic weapons on Chicago has saved millions of lives that would have been lost if we had dropped nuclear bombs on the city. But surely you'd agree, that that essentially asks for a comparison to a counterfactual, and as such, it's completely impossible to prove?

DR. DOUGLAS ELMENDORF, director of the CBO: Yes, that's right, senator.

You see this? Every counterfactual is impossible to prove! And since time only appears to go in one direction we can't go back to do experiments to see what would have happened. But this does not mean we have no idea how the world works because we can track different policies across locations and over time. And the evidence from all this research says, as the CBO director says, the stimulus worked and we need more.

TOOMEY: The last point I'd just like to ask is, I think it's your view but I like to ask, is it your view that if we were to pursue revenue neutral tax reform, that would have the effect of broadening the base upon which taxes are applied and lowering marginal rates, that it is true both with respect to such corporate reform or individual reform that that would have a pro-growth effect on the economy, which of course would in turn generates more income for the government?

ELMENDORF: Yes, that's right. Again, the amount would depend on the specifics of the proposal.

Of course you remain unconvinced, on both spending and lowering tax rates but now at least you have the facts, and can completely indulge in your own economic fairy tales. Enjoy.

This is basically a red herring. I've never said that tax-cuts are not stimulative, just that they're far less stimulative than fiscal policy and hence a waste of money. It's up to you to defend why you think tax cuts are stimulative but fiscal policy is not, because all the evidence and the experts contradict that claim. In a previous post in this thread I already outlined the case for infrastructure spending now.

You haven't provided a single shred of evidence for your point of view, just misdirection, character assassination and wildly incorrect claims. Btw I'm still waiting for all those examples of when Krugman was "flat out wrong." But I'm not holding my breath.

[asic600]

If there's one thing we can all agree on...if we hadn't wasted $1 Trillion in Iraq (thanks Bush supporters you know who you were), we would probably be $1 Trillion (+interest) wealthier as a nation. We would probably also be working on getting to Mars, building the fastest supercolliders and the world's fastest computer instead. We're way behind in education and it's starting to show on our trajectory to 2nd world status (thanks crappy educational system, bad parents, rap music and restrictions on smart immigrants from scaaary countries coming here).

[cockgobbler]

Serious question from a non Amrerican:

Is there a chance the Democrats will put someone up against Obama for the Dem nomination?

There was a report on a poll i heard on the local news here in Toronto Canada that Hilary Clinton would destroy any republican candidate by something like 20 points.

[cockgobbler]

If there's one thing we can all agree on...if we hadn't wasted $1 Trillion in Iraq (thanks Bush supporters you know who you were), we would probably be $1 Trillion (+interest) wealthier as a nation. We would probably also be working on getting to Mars, building the fastest supercolliders and the world's fastest computer instead. We're way behind in education and it's starting to show on our trajectory to 2nd world status (thanks crappy educational system, bad parents, rap music and restrictions on smart immigrants from scaaary countries coming here).

I'm a conservative voter (granted Conservative in Canada is somewhat different than the US, here in Canada the Conservative Prime Minister has no intrest in opening the gay marriage or abortion (both legal) debates)) but from the numbers I've seen Obama has added to the debt in 3 1/2 years as much as Bush added in 8 years.

Am I wrong?

[robertlouis]

Again, repsecting your opinion, I really think that if someone killed a member of my family I would want to be the one to flip the switch.

If that situation ever actually materalized would my opinion differ?

I can honestly say I don'r know for sure, but I THINK not.

We'll have to agree to disagree. I only hope that if the event actually occurred, you would refuse.

[robertlouis]

Serious question from a non Amrerican:

Is there a chance the Democrats will put someone up against Obama for the Dem nomination?

There was a report on a poll i heard on the local news here in Toronto Canada that Hilary Clinton would destroy any republican candidate by something like 20 points.

Just wait to see what the Republican hate machine would do to a Hillary candidacy. Although Hillary against Bachmann would be fun...

[cockgobbler]

We'll have to agree to disagree. I only hope that if the event actually occurred, you would refuse.

Well, it's a moot point anyway since Canada doesn't have the death peanality.

Good repsectful healthy debate though.

Respect is something that is unfortunately missing in political debate on both sides of the border.

[cockgobbler]

Just wait to see what the Republican hate machine would do to a Hillary candidacy. Although Hillary against Bachmann would be fun...

CAT FIGHT!!!!!!!