Germans who watched porn on Redtube told to pay up

[Stavros]

I'm an adult producer and a musician so I can say without any speculation where folks ought to stand on this issue. Busting some schmuck for downloading music = bad. Anyone who is earnest about making music will be making it whether they get paid or not and live performance will always be a viable form of income. The music business model has simply changed with the times. There is a less profitable platform on which to profit from music making, but a lot of good comes with the loss in the form of independent, non-homogenous musical offerings made at an accessible grass roots level.

Porn on the other hand... there's is no freakin' reason to make porn other than to profit from it, (or to have a never watched personal copy of a shitilly executed home movie made by you and your gross wife, hidden away in a closet for years.)

They'll never stop online theft but I'll definitely root for folks who would act as a thorn in the side those who insist that I shouldn't be able to pay rent by providing a service people love. I hope this German thing goes far. When you peel back all the layers the thief has to answer to ME, not Redtube, not a lawyer, not his wife or family. Fuckin' ME. Continue to justify your theft then be prepared to make your own shitty porn cause that's the only option you'll have left.

Cameras are expensive, start saving up. (It'll be easy with all the money you save on free porn.)

Powerfully argued and I agree with it, except I don't want to see my neighbours home video (and if you saw my neighbours, neither would you, no matter how extreme your fetish). I don't know how this can be tackled at the individual level, so the only other thing I would ask is: do younger people go to live music events? Because while a lot of the time I play CDs, it is that visceral, sensational, almost tactile experience of being in the same room as a musician that has given me so many unforgettable experiences. Maybe the trend ought to be for live music not to be recorded, and for bands/performers that gain a reputation not recording so that the only way to see an act is to see it live...

[jenssch]

there is in no way this is going to work. they already tried this with mp3s and only ended up fining a mom and the ocassional kid all concluding with them finally changing their tune

another problem is that they don't understand the infrastructure and landscape of piracy. suing the occasional random joe for plopping into a tubesite is exactly like going for the occasional drug user who buys for a few bags of his favorite narcotic from the popular streetdealer whilst behind the scenes you have an entire cartel making sure the market is well stocked. eventually, drug user 1 is replaced by another newb in the scene asking "where can i get my drugs?"

in fact, in the "fantasized" event they do even shutdown a bunch of tubesites, i only see others (or the same ones) coming back online with a more secure design to protect their user base, you know, exactly like the back online and better secure, mega upload

they do understand.
these guys dont want to take down anybody, they just want to rip-off some people.
even if it holds no ground, i bet there will be thousands who are ashamed and silently pay the fee.

that kind scam has been around forever and is especially popular for porns.

[Brittany St Jordan]

A good portion of the tube sites are owned by a company called Manwin. Manwin was berated for hosting tube sites so instead of taking them down they have also taken over some of the bigger name sites in porn over the past few years. (Use Google) Someone once mentioned the idea it would be pretty sweet if Manwin kept using the tube sites to lure the folks in with the quasi legal content and then one day flipped the switch to make it all PPV. Where only the legal owners of the content would give Manwin permission to host it and get a portion of the income generated from people watching it.

Whether that actually happens or not, who knows? It will be a really sweet victory for content producers and independent models you are always having their work stolen and spread amongst the masses for free.

Nobody has ever read a review about how great the latest Porsche is to drive and then went and stole one to share it with their friends. Test driving is far from stealing so using piracy to sample content before committing to an actual purchase I can agree with. It is the rampant disregard for "The rich fuckers, bitches and sluts who make porn already tons of money" argument people use that is upsetting whenever I hear people use it as an excuse for their thievery.

Tube sites are only a portion of the theft though. Using the same analogy as above, they are the meth dealers in the exploding mobile homes of the internet. Yes, they provide a means for people to get their fix but really have no idea what in the fuck they are doing other than having the ability to say "I run a tube site" to their friends. With the file sharing sites like Mega Upload, it makes it hard to track the dealer or the user so when either is caught it is a good day for porn producers everywhere.

So what happens to the people who are unable to pay $20 for a DVD or for site memberships and insist that they have to download everything because they are unable to afford it? They do what everyone else in the world does when that are unable afford something. They go without it until they can afford it.

There needs to be a technology that can identify the ip address of where the content is being downloaded from and if it is from one not of the copyright owner the file then becomes a virus which destroys their entire hard drive only after sending an email to everyone in their address book a list of all of the video and photo files on their computer. Let this happen and watch piracy drop like a drunk chick on prom night.

[Jackal]

Are these people even the copyright owners and how are they going to prove any of this?This reminds me of a few years ago when I received letters, phone calls and voice mails from a debt collection agencies demanding money from "my car insurance provider." The problem was that, at that time, I never drove a car, purchased car insurance or possessed a driver's licence. This seems like a scam to trick people. They are common.

[bluesoul]

There needs to be a technology that can identify the ip address of where the content is being downloaded from and if it is from one not of the copyright owner the file then becomes a virus which destroys their entire hard drive only after sending an email to everyone in their address book a list of all of the video and photo files on their computer. Let this happen and watch piracy drop like a drunk chick on prom night.

there is. but it's useless because there is also a technology that can mask the ip address of where the content is being downloaded from or make it seem like it's coming from another location- when in reality it is not.

also, something similar to the virus idea was tried and failed after also being found illegal.

So what happens to the people who are unable to pay $20 for a DVD or for site memberships and insist that they have to download everything because they are unable to afford it? They do what everyone else in the world does when that are unable afford something. They go without it until they can afford it.

i like this point a lot. but here's the deal: we live in a capitalist world where everyone is obsessed and consumed about getting things- particularly media. we have phones to take pictures and apps to post on instagram.

the idea of downloading and uploading is now infused as part of "what we do" on the computer to the point where the average porn consumer really doesn't see anything different about reading an article on wikipedia and downloading the latest video from their favorite website illegally. in fact, don't most people strictly run blogs where they share copyright material?

[Brittany St Jordan]

in fact, don't most people strictly run blogs where they share copyright material?

Yes, however, they also point the material back to the original provider or wherever they found it at so that people can can go to that specific site. This generate traffic for the original content provider and in sometimes often money through ads and promotions. Again, Here is a great car, why you should buy and where to to buy it at. Not, here is a car and where to steal it, how to share your stolen car with your friends and fuck the people who made the car because they already have money.

[bluesoul]

Yes, however, they also point the material back to the original provider or wherever they found it at so that people can can go to that specific site. This generate traffic for the original content provider and in sometimes often money through ads and promotions. Again, Here is a great car, why you should buy and where to to buy it at. Not, here is a car and where to steal it, how to share your stolen car with your friends and fuck the people who made the car because they already have money.

interesting because i've seen more links pointing towards where the content came from on tubesites than on blogs. usually, the tube sites have a few minutes of a scene with a big logo @ the end. also, the video might identify the talent or scene name/title.

on blog sites it's just the picture or a gif of a scene. most people either end up coming here and asking for id help, or possibly just including the image in their collection and mentioning it as one of those "scenes they've always been looking for"

[Brittany St Jordan]

interesting because i've seen more links pointing towards where the content came from on tubesites than on blogs. usually, the tube sites have a few minutes of a scene with a big logo @ the end. also, the video might identify the talent or scene name/title.

on blog sites it's just the picture or a gif of a scene. most people either end up coming here and asking for id help, or possibly just including the image in their collection and mentioning it as one of those "scenes they've always been looking for"

That is all affiliate content created for the purpose of promoting the original site. What I am talking about is the actual theft of the site content, ripped DVDs and dumping of entire photo sets for people to access for free. Two completely different aspects of tube sites and file sharing.

[bluesoul]

That is all affiliate content created for the purpose of promoting the original site. What I am talking about is the actual theft of the site content, ripped DVDs and dumping of entire photo sets for people to access for free. Two completely different aspects of tube sites and file sharing.

if you download a torrent of an entire ripped dvd or entire photosets, they give as much information as to where the content originates from in the information pack.

also, if you download an entire ripped dvd, none of the information is changed. so if a company includes it's logo, website, email etc. all that is left intact.

blogs however usually have to alter this information due to size limitations or making the content quicker to access. below is an example of what i mean of a movie being offered illegally for free with all the information one would need to acquire it legally (front and back cover with company logo/website and full cast list that can quickly be googled)

[Brittany St Jordan]

if you download a torrent of an entire ripped dvd or entire photosets, they give as much information as to where the content originates from in the information pack.

also, if you download an entire ripped dvd, none of the information is changed. so if a company includes it's logo, website, email etc. all that is left intact.

blogs however usually have to alter this information due to size limitations or making the content quicker to access. below is an example of what i mean of a movie being offered illegally for free with all the information one would need to acquire it legally (front and back cover with company logo/website and full cast list that can quickly be googled)

Again, "here is where I stole the car from. You can buy one if you like or take this stolen one I have for you" Stolen content is stolen content and there is no way to possibly justify it. The bloggers with the affiliate content is they way to spread the word about stuff people enjoy. Throwing up full copies of stolen property and listing the the owner does nothing to drive traffic to or generate income for the owner of the content.

It isn't about logos and who made it. It is about profits being taken away from the people who created it. Companies, both bog and small, all need to be able to make a profit from the works they produce. This can be porn or late TV gadgets. Business is business and when people are undermining the ability for the people who created the product that is destructive to everyone. Soon everyone will be shooting amateur porn with smartphones because that is all they can afford to use.

A lot of work goes into each of those shoots. Models have to get their wardrobe and make-up together and possibly get some new toys depending on the science. Photographers have to be hired to shoot the photos. Video guys have to come and shoot the video. Sometimes this is done by the same person. Some models require make-up artists as they are unable to do their own. All of this takes time to accomplish.

Once the scene is done then it is off to be edited. Both the photos and the video get tweaked and twerked to get it ready for production. For a solo site that ends there. When there is a DVD the process happens three or four and maybe five times for each scene on the DVD. Then there is cover work, distribution, marketing and should there be a sparkle of hope there will be a sale made to turn a profit.

So yea, when 1000 people steal a single pirated version of something that is taking roughly $20,000 in DVD sales from the company. This is only a small fraction of what really happens so when you scale it up for accuracy the numbers get into the millions of dollars companies are losing to piracy.

I will play my own devil's advocate for a moment and say that yes, there is some truth that the piracy does broaden the fan base as it gets to people who may not have otherwise seen the content and learned that a particular company or model existed until they saw the pirated content. If that person turns into a paying fan or member to a site then piracy works for the purpose of drawing in that one person. However, most people are going to stick with the free illegal stuff than pay for the content they want.

So the question is, how do we produce content we know is going to be stolen more than it is purchased while offering it to our honest fans who pay for it without charging them an outrageous amount for the content? Is the day of the porn company production now an antiquated means to creating and distributing content? When the porn companies die off where will the content come from?

What is unable to be pirated? Live cam shows and escorting. Yes, I know you can technically record the cam show and all of that but there are very people doing that so it is of no concern. The live personal interaction of cam shows and escorting is where a lot of models go to because of the fact that creating content and having it ripped off does little to pay the bills or put food on the table. That is why I enjoy my cam shows as much as I do because I know that when I am done for the day there will be a paycheck regardless if someone recorded my show or not.