17yr old black kid shot and killed for walking in white suburbia?

[broncofan]

Affirmative defenses almost always shift the burden of proof. They are for defendants to prove in order to escape liability despite committing the acts spelled out in statutory law. The prosecution has the burden of proof for the underlying defense, but typically not for an affirmative defense.

I just graduated from law school. This doesn't mean I am right about this jurisdiction and how they treat self-defense. There may be some jurisdictions where lack of justification is part of the prosecution's case but this seems fairly counter-intuitive.

As for using deadly force, the person asserting self-defense has to both believe he is required to use it and it has to be objectively reasonable. It can't just be his opinion but also that which a reasonable person in that situation would have.

The reason this area of the law is so confused is that each state may treat self-defense differently. As for murder there are model codes but each state is allowed to adopt it in their fashion. Further, each state has its own precedent from cases that help explain how the statutes have been interpreted when there were similar fact patterns.

The broad principles laid out in the article by starkem are useful. Imminence for instance. Is Zimmerman permitted to use deadly force prior to the point in time at which he faces a deadly threat? Anyone who is losing a fight is at the eventual mercy of their attacker if they have no duty to retreat. They just may anticipate the deadly threat before it's there.

Edit: I am not saying you are wrong about how self-defense is treated. It may not be treated as a typical affirmative defense (which results in burden shifting). Or it may only require a shift in the burden of producing evidence but without shifting the burden of persuasion. I'm guessing this last scenario is the case which would mean that lack of justification is part of the prosecutor's case as you say. It does put the prosecution in the position of having to prove a negative as part of their case.

[Queens Guy]

Affirmative defenses almost always shift the burden of proof. They are for defendants to prove in order to escape liability despite committing the acts spelled out in statutory law. The prosecution has the burden of proof for the underlying defense, but typically not for an affirmative defense.

I just graduated from law school. This doesn't mean I am right about this jurisdiction and how they treat self-defense. There may be some jurisdictions where lack of justification is part of the prosecution's case but this seems fairly counter-intuitive.

As for using deadly force, the person asserting self-defense has to both believe he is required to use it and it has to be objectively reasonable. It can't just be his opinion but also that which a reasonable person in that situation would have.

The reason this area of the law is so confused is that each state may treat self-defense differently. As for murder there are model codes but each state is allowed to adopt it in their fashion. Further, each state has its own precedent from cases that help explain how the statutes have been interpreted when there were similar fact patterns.

The broad principles laid out in the article by starkem are useful. Imminence for instance. Is Zimmerman permitted to use deadly force prior to the point in time at which he faces a deadly threat? Anyone who is losing a fight is at the eventual mercy of their attacker if they have no duty to retreat. They just may anticipate the deadly threat before it's there.

Self-defense varying from State to State matches up with what the Professor said about how he taught Florida-specific things in addition to the general information contained in the book.

I'll let the Professor speak for himself, by attaching a link. If you look on youtube, some people have been uploading each day's testimony, so you can look for him by name.

Here is a link to one of the local TV stations in Orlando doing what I think is a good job reporting that day's testimony. Doing a much, much better job than what I saw on the networks.

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/geo...z/-/index.html

[broncofan]

Self-defense varying from State to State matches up with what the Professor said about how he taught Florida-specific things in addition to the general information contained in the book.

I'll let the Professor speak for himself, by attaching a link. If you look on youtube, some people have been uploading each day's testimony, so you can look for him by name.

Here is a link to one of the local TV stations in Orlando doing what I think is a good job reporting that day's testimony. Doing a much, much better job than what I saw on the networks.

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/geo...z/-/index.html

Thanks. I'll look into it!

[natina]

LIVE trial

http://www.wftv.com/s/zimmerman-livestream/

[hippifried]

Seems to me that defining self defense in this case does no good until there's a clear definition of assault.

[TSBootyLondon]

did anyone see the dog that was shot repeatedly for 'sniffing an officers feet'!

Granted it was the owners fault for leaving the windows open but the officer shot repeatedly and didn't even kill it! left it lying in extreme pain!

[natina]

Defense Motion to Acquit Zimmerman Denied

Earlier: Trayvon Martin's mom testifies

(Newser) – Trayvon Martin's mother and brother took the stand today in George Zimmerman's trial, followed by the medical examiner who performed Martin's autopsy, and the prosecution rested its case around 5pm. The defense will now present its case; defense attorney Mark O'Mara started by asking the judge to acquit Zimmerman because there is no direct evidence that spite played a role in the killing. The judge denied the motion, CNN reports. Earlier, with the court playing a 911 tape from the night of the shooting, Sybrina and Jahvaris Fulton both identified the screams on the tape as belonging to Martin, the Orlando Sentinel reports. Among the details from today's testimony:

• Sybrina Fulton told the court that Martin had a pair of tattoos bearing the names of his great-grandmother, grandmother, and herself.
• O'Mara asked Sybrina if anyone had "prepared" her before she heard the recording; she said no.
• He also noted that "the only alternative" to Martin screaming was Zimmerman screaming, which would suggest the teen was responsible for his own death, he said; he asked whether she hoped her son wasn't at fault. "I would hope for this to never have happened," she said.
• Jahvaris acknowledged having initially told the media he wasn't certain who was screaming. "I didn't want to believe it was him," he said, per the San Jose Mercury News.

During his testimony, the medical examiner said Trayvon was alive for a while after being shot, "still in pain" and "suffering."

http://www.newser.com/story/170543/t...re-my-son.html

[natina]

Did George Zimmerman LIE (A Lot!) Under Oath?

"In the spring of 2010, a military prosecutor with the Army taught a college class near here that delved into Florida's Stand Your Ground law. One of his pupils stood out for his diligence: George Zimmerman, who earned an A."*

George Zimmerman may have perjured himself in his trial. Did Trayvon Martin grab Zimmerman's gun like he said? Did Zimmerman not know about the "Stand Your Ground" laws taught in his law school class, which he aced? Cenk Uygur and Ana Kasparian discuss.

[natina]

these videos say very much about zimmerman

GEORGE ZIMMERMAN TRIAL OPENING STATEMENTS PROSECUTION

motion to dismiss murder charge denied
WATCH: Prosecution Argues Against Acquittal - Zimmerman Din't Act Out of Self-Defense

Prosecution rests in Zimmerman trial; defense asks for acquittal
SANFORD, Fla. (AP) — The prosecution in the murder trial of George Zimmerman wrapped up its case after a dramatic day of testimony Friday, with Travyon Martin's mother and brother saying the screams for help that can be heard in the background on a 911 call came from the 17-year-old.

[natina]

Crowd On MSNBC Cheers As Motion To Dismiss Charges Against George Zimmerman DENIED!


On Friday, the state of Florida wrapped up its presentation of the case against George Zimmerman for the 2012 murder of Trayvon Martin. Following the state resting, Zimmerman's counselors argued a motion before the judge to acquit Zimmerman due to a lack of evidence. What that motion was dismissed by the presiding judge, a crowd attending the Essence Festival in New Orleans where MSNBC is broadcasting live burst into cheers and applause.

Zimmerman's attorney, Mark O'Mara, concluded his request for an acquittal by noting that Martin "did cause his own death." The judge summarily dismissed O'Mara's motion and proceeded to instruct him to begin the defense phase of the trial by calling their first witness.


The crowd at the Essence Festival that had been watching the proceedings as MSNBC's hosts broadcast live from that event exploded in cheers upon hearing the news that Zimmerman will not be acquitted without a jury passing a verdict of "not guilty."

Watch the clip below via MSNBC: