Occupy Wall Street protest

[Prospero]

Yvonne - a little reminder of the blood and murder that soaks the entire American nation - ask a few of your surviving navajo or Sioux or Comanche or Algonquin about imperialism.
But of course that was all a long time ago.

[Prospero]

The Atlantic Charter was never a signed deal merely a loose and unsigned agreement and Churchill rebuffed Roosevelt when he attempted to apply pressure on the UK. He saw it as an agreemnt which referred to the land dominated by the Axis powers. Not to the long held parts of the British Empire. It certainly was background noise to the eventual independence of india and many African parts of the british empire. but it is still wrong to imply that the US forced an end to the british empire.

Shame they didn't though.

The Charter should also have applied to the parts of Europe occupied by the Soviets but of course, their empire lasted a lot later than the British empire. And of course China is still an imperialist power today occupying Tibet and many parts of China which were once independent of Han Chinese domination.

Don't get me wrong. I'm wholly against empire. Any empires.

[Prospero]

I was immensely pleased that America elected a black guy as president. I admire Obama though am also somewhat disappointed. Yes - we have not yet had a black PM. I truly hope we will when a man or woman with the stature to lead arises. i am sure it won't be long.

But it is also false to say we only elect rich white men. Margaret Thatcher (loathsome as she was) came from a very modest lower middle class background. So did Harold Wilson Labour PM in the 1960s and James Callaghan, another later Labour PM. The leader of the labour party today has political heritage (a radical left wing father) but no significant wealth. Shamefully Cameron is a wealthy toff - an old Etonian.

[Prospero]

And with respect to OnYourKnees and his insulting riposte - i re-read what Robertlouis wrote. He referred to the Koch family's pernicious influence on the tea party (about which there is growing documentation) and didn't seem to offer generalisations about Americans at all - but rather about the visible racist dimension to the tea party. So OnYourKnees - does the racism of part of the movement not bother you? Isn't racism poisonous wherever it comes from And are you happy to see the movement so manipulated by rich billionaires in their own interests? Or is all that just a left-wing conspiracy to besmirch the Tea party?

I notice you didn't respnd to my pointing out the cheapness of your jibe about hiding behind fake identity's when Robertlouis even uses his own picture as an avatar. While you use a girl's image?

Any thoughts?

Or maybe you prefer to "just shut and play with yourself?"

[Silcc69]

And with respect to OnYourKnees and his insulting riposte - i re-read what Robertlouis wrote. He referred to the Koch family's pernicious influence on the tea party (about which there is growing documentation) and didn't seem to offer generalisations about Americans at all - but rather about the visible racist dimension to the tea party. So OnYourKnees - does the racism of part of the movement not bother you? Isn't racism poisonous wherever it comes from And are you happy to see the movement so manipulated by rich billionaires in their own interests? Or is all that just a left-wing conspiracy to besmirch the Tea party?

I notice you didn't respnd to my pointing out the cheapness of your jibe about hiding behind fake identity's when Robertlouis even uses his own picture as an avatar. While you use a girl's image?

Any thoughts?

Or maybe you prefer to "just shut and play with yourself?"

You have been here long enough to know how OMK exactly operates. I don't think he is even worth replying to anymore just a waste of time really.

[Prospero]

Silcc69 - I actually hadn't really paid much attention to him until now. But I'll follow your advice. Ta.

[Stavros]

‘The Sherman Antitrust Act’ was instated after the 1929 Great Depression

Silc, the 'Sherman Act' was passed in Congress in 1890, and first used to break up John D. Rockefeller's Standard Oil empire in 1911.

Yvonne, I don't expect to see a black Prime Minister in the UK in my lifetime, it is not impossible but the three parties we have do not at the present moment have any MP's who appear likely to climb the greasy pole to greatness. The UK is not as diverse as the USA, which I consider to be one of its greatest assets; I also think from personal experience that there is a quiet phobia of foreigners here which does not exist in the USA in the same manner because most Americans are descended from immigrants; it ceases to be quiet in the anonymous comments to newspaper articles where immigration and multi-culturalism are often the targets of much rage and sarcasm, notably in The Daily Telegraph.

Anglo-American relations have veered between competition for influence and resources in the Middle East (notably in the 1930s); and co-operation, as in the First and Second World Wars. Churchill was half-American and was never entirely trusted by the British establishment, or indeed the Conservative Party, which he joined when it was clear his first party, the Liberals, would not win another election. But Anglo-American relations are quite complex and I don't know what it has to do with the Wall St Occupation, or even why this thread is in General Discussion. Tra-la-la.

[Prospero]

I agree Stavros. It should be in the politics strand - but only a moderator could divert this fast flowing river at this point.

Yes - America IS indeed a nation made of immigrants and people from elsewhere which makes the racism of so many whites so disturbing.

As to British xenophobia. it is vile and wholly unnacceptable. But really that SHOULD become a thread in politics and religion.

[Yvonne183]

Yvonne - a little reminder of the blood and murder that soaks the entire American nation - ask a few of your surviving navajo or Sioux or Comanche or Algonquin about imperialism.
But of course that was all a long time ago.

I never said that the US is squeaky clean, the US is far from it. My point is that the UK is no better. You are still in Ireland where you don't belong, you have committed just as much atrocities in India and Africa as we did to the Indians in the US. You have joined the US in Iraq and Afghanistan so that wiould make that point mute about those wars. While we were in Vietnam you guys were in Malaysia making raids into Indonesia hunting down,,( now get ready for this word) insurgents.

Most of the trouble spots of the world in modern times were caused by British interference,,, Iraq/Kuwait,,,India/Pakistan,,, Serbia/Croatia,,,, South Africa,,, Israel/Palestine These are all areas where British tried to make policy and the outcomes were disasters.

I never said the US is a good guy, but you Brits have no hold on the moral high ground, you guys were just as evil as we were, so you are in no way ready to preach to the US on what are the right way to live. You guys even had riots just recently in your past year cause of the injustice to the poor and such,,, if you guys were so enlightened with what is righteous then why were there peasant riots in your land of self righteousness?

[Yvonne183]

‘The Sherman Antitrust Act’ was instated after the 1929 Great Depression

Silc, the 'Sherman Act' was passed in Congress in 1890, and first used to break up John D. Rockefeller's Standard Oil empire in 1911.

Yvonne, I don't expect to see a black Prime Minister in the UK in my lifetime, it is not impossible but the three parties we have do not at the present moment have any MP's who appear likely to climb the greasy pole to greatness. The UK is not as diverse as the USA, which I consider to be one of its greatest assets; I also think from personal experience that there is a quiet phobia of foreigners here which does not exist in the USA in the same manner because most Americans are descended from immigrants; it ceases to be quiet in the anonymous comments to newspaper articles where immigration and multi-culturalism are often the targets of much rage and sarcasm, notably in The Daily Telegraph.

Anglo-American relations have veered between competition for influence and resources in the Middle East (notably in the 1930s); and co-operation, as in the First and Second World Wars. Churchill was half-American and was never entirely trusted by the British establishment, or indeed the Conservative Party, which he joined when it was clear his first party, the Liberals, would not win another election. But Anglo-American relations are quite complex and I don't know what it has to do with the Wall St Occupation, or even why this thread is in General Discussion. Tra-la-la.

Starvos, i didn't hear you complain when the talk went off topic with posts about Canadian musicians so why does it bother you so that the topic went into anglo/american posts?