Printable View
‘Precious Angels’: 3 Sisters Killed When Suspected Drunk Driver Slams Into Car From Behind google this article and see if you cry. …..….by the bullet......or by the bottle...…...just the same, except the far left does not do a body count on dui caused deaths....im sorry to the administrators but I needed to say this.... thank you
:dead: Why this is a silly argument has been discussed ad nauseum in these threads.
http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/sho...arm-gun/page16
http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/sho...Warm-Gun/page5
Perhaps you should stick to the word association thread?
i'll try that this is the first time in this area of hung angels
Okay. I might have misunderstood you, but it's not clear what exactly your point is or what it has to do with the "far left". Yes, it is sad, but what are you proposing should be done?
There are statistics on DUI-related deaths, so nobody is conspiring to hide the problem. https://www.cdc.gov/motorvehiclesafe...factsheet.html
Is there some sort of solution to the problem of drunk driving that the "hard left" is blocking? I don't know where you get the idea that drunk driving deaths is a partisan issue. Do liberals want to make it easier to drive drunk or harder to prosecute drunk drivers?
The comparison to guns of course is bad because people on the left only want regulations that in every other developed country result in fewer deaths. People on the right are blocking even the most common sense regulations....
What you've shown is a total inability to think about this issue and discuss it in an honest way.
What a weird thread...
maybe it is the way I stating it. Every time a gun death the media picks up on the guns . more than a dui causing a death. Alcohol is in sports. Hard for me to describe expect too many dui deaths and no one is talking abut it. a person can have multiple dui and society says boo. the town drunk was a laughable item, watch Otis on the Andy Griffin show. I'm not against drinking, however for an example I have been more bars than I ca count But I have one drink and it last me all night. Again people do shots have multiple drinks, beer etc. and walk out the door drive and are legally drunk. the bar, the alcohol company is not responsible for the deaths of people killed during a dui. However now the owner of the gun shop who went by the law and sold the gun to the person who killed in Gilro is being sued as well as the gun manufacture. Why???
There's a lot of confusion there. I'll try to deal with some of it. We tried to ban alcohol altogether in this country and there was a huge underground market for it and enormous amounts of organized crime associated with it.
We now regulate alcohol and require that people are 21 before they can drink. Our federal government makes funding to the states contingent on their enforcement of the requirement that the drinking age be 21. People can vote and serve in the military at the age of 18.
People who drive drunk are prosecuted for it. They have to pay thousands of dollars, it goes on their record, and can have career consequences. If someone kills someone while drinking and driving, they are prosecuted for manslaughter.
We allow people to have military weapons in this country. Weapons that have no purpose except to kill lots of people at one time.. People who have been paying attention think this is preventable because other countries have lower rates of gun deaths and more restrictive gun laws.
The argument about gun manufacturers is your weakest one. First, I've said this a few times but look up dram shop acts. Bars have liability to third parties for serving people who are obviously drunk. Gun manufacturers do not even have to face the kind of liability at common law that companies in every other industry do because of the PLCAA. Now there's question about how often gun manufacturers could be sued successfully for selling dangerous products but they have blanket immunity by statute. They don't even have to defend lawsuits.
Also, a bit confused about the Andy Griffith show reference. The show depicted someone being drunk and not driving? We should allow people to commit mass murder because of this?
I'm pretty sure that shootings where small numbers die get about the same attention as DUI deaths involving the same numbers. It's only the mass shootings that get big media attention. That's true of most things - eg plane crashes get more attention than car accidents even though many more people die in car accidents over time.Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbitfufu
Multiple DUI offences are subject to heavier penalties, so I don't think it's true that society is indifferent.
You are still quite vague about what you think should be done to reduce DUI deaths. If you really are concerned and not just using it as a diversion then you must have some ideas.
The thing about gun deaths is that there are some obvious things that could be done that are being blocked due to the political power of the gun lobby. These are the sort of things that have been proposed:
- Tighter background checks to stop people with criminal or mental illness histories from buying guns. At present there are huge loopholes.
- Red flag laws to allow guns to be confiscated where there is probable cause that people may be a threat.
- Bans on high-capacity magazine or military assault weapons that can kill many people in a short period.
Are you opposed to these measures and, if so, why?
:werd:Ill let this thread die. I had to vent after seeing two little girls die as well as dad. Just frustration on stupid the world is. Between politicians, ultra billionaires that keep making more than God. Thank for listening to my rant of the week.:confused:
yeah dying is not a good human habbit I would say...
keep the good work of making thread fufu ... I love the way you do it
Cars don’t kill people, people do. No. Wait a minute. That’s not true. In the 70’s, Ford Pintos had a problem. Their gas tanks occasionally exploded from rear-end taps. Back then, not all cars had seat belts and people died who didn’t have to. We raised our standards and passed laws. Still, some vehicular deaths are indeed due to drivers. They speed, they get reckless, they get distracted, they don’t use their belts and some drive under the influence. We have laws against all that too. To get a license drivers have to demonstrate their knowledge of the law, the safety protocols, their ability to drive and the ability of their eyes to see the road. If you want to get tougher on manufacturers and drivers alike, I’m probably with you. I just want the same for guns, hunters and marksmen too.
The media doesn’t create the news, people do. Columbine occurred during the Assault Weapons Ban. As far as I know it was the only mass shooting to take place during the ban. After the ban we had (in order of highest deaths) the Las Vegas shooting (58 ), the one at the Orlando nightclub (49), the Virginia Tech shooting (32), Sandy Hook (27}, Sutherland Springs (26), El Paso (20), Stoneman Douglas (17), San Bernardino (14), Fort Hood (14), Binghamton (13), Virginia Beach (12), Thousand Oaks (12), Washington Navy Yard (12), Aurora Theater (12), Pittsburgh Synagogue(11) and Santa Fe High School (10). If you read local papers you would also see the media reporting weekly on scores of suicides, single shooters and stupid firearm accidents.
In the UK the Dunblane shooting resulted in much tighter gun laws particularly for hand guns. Result (touch wood) it's never happened again.
There's an argument to be made for shotguns and hunting rifles but there is no need for any civilian to own an assault rifle. The idea that it's a constitutional right to be able to own a weapon designed for one purpose, to kill people is a total joke.
Same in Australia since guns were tightly restricted after the 1996 Port Arthur massacre. The "guns don't kill, people kill" crowd like to blame it on mental illness, video games, etc but I'm pretty sure we have a similar incidence of those things.Quote:
Originally Posted by Laphroaig
A guy with a history of mental illness recently ran amok with a knife in Sydney CBD - killed one and wounded another before he was tackled to the ground. I hate to think how many would have died if he'd had an assault rifle.
yet alcohol has ruined ….how many families???? alcoholics, beating, abuse, single parents, child abuse etc. how many of you overdrank and had wished they had not!! drinking in high school college drunks, ohhh its ok I'm just having fun, blowing off steam!! but do the alcohol manufactures have to reconcile their companies. ok im wrong the ad says "drink responsible" maybe that should be saying that on a box of ammo, " use wisely"
Scotland introduced a minimum pricing for alcohol a few years ago. Probably still too early to judge if there's been an effect but the issue is being acknowledged and some attempts made to minimise the effects.Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbitfufu
Where's the equivalent gun control laws in the US? Why does every single attempt to address the issue get shot down (deliberate pun) by the NRA and other pro gun lobbies? I'll ask the question again, what right does any civilian have to own an assault rifle?
There is also evidence that younger people are drinking less and moving to low/no alcohol alternatives
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-45807152
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-48676943
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49355057
Nail on the head. With every major public health crisis there should be an attempt to figure out ways to maintain the utility of the activity while addressing its risks. As Trish pointed out, there have been a lot of safety features added to cars, including mandatory seatbelts and airbags. We didn't ban the car (except the pinto; the assault weapon of automobiles;) because modern life depends on them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Laphroaig
We tried to ban alcohol and it was impossible to enforce. Most countries have tried to find ways to address the various risks associated with it. Lobbies have not shut down any attempt to address its risks by threatening rebellion as the NRA has with guns.
What is the utility of guns? People use them for hunting and lawfully for self-defense. But the NRA makes people think assault rifles are protected by the second amendment (they're not) and useful for self-defense. They fire a zillion bullets per second and are best used to shoot lots of people at once. They are a tool that facilitates mass murder.
The NRA wanted to legalize silencers on weapons. Can you imagine the stupidity?
Rabbitfufu has said nothing about any of the recommendations filghy made on the previous page. He's made zero recommendations for making drinking less hazardous or preventing drunk driving.
The subject of alcohol is pure dilution of the gun problem. I hate to say it but he's Mr. Fanti light. Slightly less strident, a bit less obnoxious, but the same sleight of hand. And he thought he was going to get in trouble for posting this thread....lame
How many people would those killers have killed if armed with a bow and arrow?Quote:
Originally Posted by trish
At the NRA's behest, the Republican congress also weakened restrictions on people with mental illnesses acquiring guns, which clearly shows their hypocrisy and bad faith on the issue. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...mental-n727221Quote:
Originally Posted by broncofan
The New York AG is going after the NRA's non-profit status, it seems Wayne Lapierre is using member's dues to furnish a lavish lifestyle for him and his wife. Ollie North is threatening to spill the beans on the whole sordid truth after he was forced out earlier this year, so while the NRA still has it's steel curtain with the Republicans, internally they are in turmoil. That's cool with me.
I understand completely why a gun enthusiast would want an AR-15, compared to a .22 rifle, it's newer, shinier, faster, sexier. Just like a car enthusiast craves a Porsche over a Volkswagen. It is actually legal to own a fully automatic machine gun in the USA, but you have to go through a long series of background checks, jump through tons of hoops, and pay lots of money for a license. If you get a gun dealer's license you can own a whole warehouse of guns.
The reason why Transsexual Prostitution is illegal in the US is because the general population sees a tranny ho and sees a greater threat than a redneck with a gunrack in his pickup. They see a tranny ho and see their kids threatened, they see STDs, and of course all tranny hoes carry knives. Tranny hoes bring crime and drugs with them.
You have to be careful when you take away freedom from someone, majority rules is how we got Trump. Obamacare is how we got Mitch McConnell. Prohibition brought us Al Capone.
I think it might be better to let the NRA and the RNC implode rather than be shouted down. Let the racists hang themselves, if possible. Take a page from the Putin playbook.
Actually, I don’t carry a shive - but don’t tell anyone (don’t want to lose my mystic). But it’s true that certain segments of the U.S. population are ruled by their phobia of the other. Drunks armed to the teeth while waving confederate flags are okay. Black man with a cell phone that can be “mistaken” for a gun - that’s a death sentence.
I take one exception to your post buttslinger: Majority rule is not how we got Trump. I blaming him on the electoral college (and the Ruskees).
Unfortunately it’s not clear to me anything’s about to implode (except perhaps the economy and civilization in general). I think the RNC is here to stay. Even if the NRA goes there will always be (or at least for a long long time) an appetite for guns and organizations promoting them and selling them. In my opinion racism, homophobia, Islamophobia, anti-Semitism and all our other phobias are just part of the human condition. We’ll never be free of them. The only way to keep them under control and to speak out against them and demonstrate through example that we all have shared values. There’s plenty of real shit out there that actually deserves our fearful attention.
Yeah, that's the second time I've been corrected on Trump's crowd size, I like to get into the shoes of my opponent. I think my case is that "our" opponent is "us" and I was shocked to death when I found out how many of "them" there are out there. In the case of the NRA, minority rules. Most people want sane gun laws. McConnell rules.
The human mind weighs three pounds, the bacteria in our gut also weighs three pounds and sometimes is referred to as our second brain, and of course we all know what happens when we let our dicks do the thinking. My gut bacteria is hoping for a scary recession BEFORE November 2020. Then sane gun and car laws will follow.
assault rifles shoots only 1,000,000 rounds a minute?? I'm trying to say anyone can get booze and kill innocent people and there is no background check on beer yet billions if dollars are spent yearly on broken families, shattered dreams, etc. alcohol kills and the industry that manufactures it and held harmless. that's bad when company's make tons of money and they are not held accountable for ruining lives. I could quote numbers but why? Think about every Friday and Saturday the people coming out of bars drunk, and bars let them go home and destroy people. Get into bar fights, Get into fights with loved ones, cant go to work the next day, almost all of you have done it, but me as a responsible ar 15 owner has not shot one person.
Alcohol ruins many lives, but most of the tragedies are self inflicted. Guns are more often used for suicide rather than murder. It's usually your friends that do you in, not your enemies. People on this site aren't looking for answers, they already know the answer.
hmm...Quote:
Originally Posted by buttslinger
he he, let me stick my dick in your mouth, then hmmm....Quote:
Originally Posted by smalltownguy
haw haw haw.
Sorry Smalltown, one of my neighbor's trees fell into my yard yesterday during a summer storm, and it's going to cost me bigtime, hence it shall cost this forum!!! All my old friends who did a lot of drugs are shadows of our former selves, yet I never heard any of them issue any regrets. God will not test us beyond our strength, or something like that. People live in all different fashions, and they die in all different fashions, we do what we can. In the mean time, in between time, ain't we got fun?
Why own one? You've dodged that question twice already and I'd argue that if you can't answer then you're not a responsible owner as you have no reason to have one.Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbitfufu
A while back there was some guy on here who said "I need an assault weapon because I train other people to use them!!!!" I said, okay and what do they need them for? The guy downvoted the post. He hadn't thought that far ahead.Quote:
Originally Posted by Laphroaig
Rabbitfufu didn't comment on any of the recommendations by filghy because it's easier to argue against a total prohibitionist strawman than deal with actual recommendations. He didn't comment on what should be done to regulate alcohol because he doesn't have recommendations and just wants to use it as an excuse to stockpile guns.
And to rabbitfufu, no I didn't state an exact number of bullets per interval of time an assault weapon can fire. I said "zillion" which is not a real number but was used to indicate a lot. Why do so many gun people think it's convincing to show people who favor gun control that there's some technical detail they don't know about their weapons? Does the fucking thing shoot a lot of bullets really quickly and mow down lots of people? Am I right on that point?
Sandy Hook in its gruesome way presented the US with the opportunity for radical change, but Congress chose not to. If the reaction to dead children was one of such indifference- and indifference to, even causing suffering to, children seems to be standard policy in the US-, why would those people ever bother to look at the facts and make up their mind to ban assault weapons, to broaden background checks, to ban arms fairs, to make online purchases of weapons illegal -ultimately to either repeal the 2nd Amendment, or amend its wording? This is one issue which does not cross the aisle, and until Republicans lose their control of the legislative agenda, nothing will change.
Sorry, but if you only mention alcohol-related deaths in the context of guns and you refuse to offer any solutions then your professed concern does not appear to be sincere. Further discussion is a waste of time if you just keep repeating the same lines and refuse to address any of the points other people have made in response.Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbitfufu
I guess I'm going to have to bring this post over here:Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbitfufu
Number of alcohol impaired crash fatalities in 2016- 10,497 28% of all crash deaths.
Number of gun deaths in 2015 - 14,925. Number of people injured- 26,819.
Since you want to play the "Think of the children" game:
2016- Teens and Children killed with guns- 1,876
Children killed in drunk driving accidents- A total of 1,233 children 14 and younger were killed in motor vehicle
traffic crashes in 2016. Of these 1,233 fatalities, 214 children (17%)
died in alcohol-impaired-driving crashes. Of these 214 child deaths:
■
■
115 (54%) were occupants of vehicles with drivers who had BACs
of .08 g/dL or higher;
■
■
61 (29%) were occupants of other vehicles;
■
■
36 (17%) were nonoccupants (pedestrians, pedalcyclists, or other
nonoccupants); and
■
■
2 (<1%) were drivers
I'm a person who happens to think if there is a hell, there is a special place in it for drunk drivers. But when a person drives drunk they don't intend to kill a person. When a person wants to intimidate, rob, or murder, the use of a firearm makes it easier for them to achieve anyone of those intentions.
I want to make it clear that, I DON'T WANT TO BAN GUNS. So I'm not being a hypocrite when I'm saying that there is a huge difference between violent gun deaths and drunk driving deaths.
When Obama said Republicans in rural areas who have seen all the jobs disappear and therefore cling to their guns and religion, maybe he should have said Freedom and Family. If you live in Smalltown USA, and you plan to die in Smalltown USA, you don't need a College Education or a high paying job. If everyone in your family has had guns for generations, guns aren't the problem, Hightalkers and Transgenders who want to break up your family values are. In the Senate, South Dakota gets the same number of Senators as California. So if a relatively small bunch of ranchers or farmers will go vote for guns, in a few sparsely populated rural states, that's enough to keep McConnell in power.
If I had Trump's taxes, or video of him pissing on a Bible with three hookers, I'd drop a tease on October First, 2020, then I'd release the proof on Halloween Night. I would send all the Republicans out on a limb, and then saw it off.
Oh yeah, FuFu's argument is ridiculous, but on Fox & Friends he would be wrong but well-meaning.
my argument at the beging id why the media picks on gun related deaths an not alcohol related deaths. I have no solutions, no answers just a post for all of use to think about. When we become adults at 18 or 21 in certain areas, we are to become citizens and help each other not to kill anyone by any means, by gun, by alcohol, or anything else. We are responsible for ourselves and not imposing our lives over others. On all the laws this nation makes us humans canot even obey a simple 10 that is a base for all laws.
The difference is that your constitution blesses gun ownership and that your woolly argument seeks to blame global media for something which is the responsibility of the American population. Your constitution has evolved a culture where the individual needs to have a gun in order to feel part of Team USA.Quote:
….by the bullet......or by the bottle...…...just the same, except the far left does not do a body count on dui caused deaths...
It’s not just the same because in the vast majority of gun-related cases it was pre-meditated whereas in alcohol-related cases it wasn’t...as others have stated before.
So why do you need an AR15 - here’s its track record of mass killing from Wikipedia:
Use in crime and mass shootingsEdit
A majority of firearm-related homicides in the United States involve the use of handguns.[58][59][60] According to a 2013 analysis by Mayors Against Illegal Guns, 14 out of 93 mass shootings involved high-capacity magazines or assault weapons.[61]Nevertheless, AR-15 style rifles have played a prominent role in many high-profile mass shootings in the United States[62] and have come to be widely characterized as the weapon of choice for perpetrators of these crimes.[63] AR-15s or similar rifles were the primary weapons used in around half of the 10 deadliest mass shootings in modern American history,[64][65] including the 2012 Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting, the 2015 San Bernardino attack,[5] the 2017 Las Vegas shooting,[66] the 2017 Sutherland Springs church shooting,[66] and the 2018 Stoneman Douglas High School shooting.[67] Gun expert Dean Hazen and mass murder researcher Dr. Pete Blair think that mass shooters' gun choices have less to do with the AR-15's specific characteristics but rather with familiarity and a copycat effect.[68][69]
By the way other countries and creeds are available.
After a while it may become pointless to argue, none of us have to authority to sign laws that will bring about far reaching, logical, fair, forward moving changes to our car and gun safety policies. For that we need to hear from the all-seeing wisdom and mountainous intellect of our elected leaders.
This guy can barely write his poorly thought out arguments, why are any of you actually trying to engage him?
I figured it was preferable to not engaging him and still writing a post in his thread. I mean, why not? You don't get a lot of pro assault weapon arguments that look like they could have been written by James Joyce.Quote:
Originally Posted by javier81
As for Rabbitfufu, he does have a difficult choice between purchasing his 16th gun and learning how to use an apostrophe.
is it not important to address the various issues within this thread through discussion and hopefully education. Even if he doesn't benefit, others may do so from reading the arguments and information presented.Quote:
Originally Posted by javier81