Climate change could mean the extinction of our species

Just a word on “ice ages” large and small.

As mentioned in my previous post, the occurrences of ice ages are thought to be determined by the precession cycles of the Earth’s spin axis and orbital parameters. But of course fluctuations in ocean currents, tectonic shifts and concomitant volcanism have played roles in past glaciations of the Earth’s surface. There is much yet to be understood about what causes the coming and going of ice-ages.

The last ice-age began 110 000 years ago, reached maximal glaciation about 22 000 years ago. In spite of current anthropocentric warming (from which civilization risks extinction) the next ice age is inevitable, though it is millennia in the future. Rest assured, the invisible hand of the market is not thinking that far in advance.

Of course our Mr. Clifford wasn’t referring to this sort of ice-age in our near future, but a “little ice-age.” As explained no such petite ice-age is ever likely to result from fluctuations in solar activity; fluctuations in solar luminosity, yes, but not the fluctuations in Sunspot activity and solar flares. Luminosity is astronomically stable...fluctuations in luminosity sufficiently large to effect terrestrial climate occur on the order of giga-years.

There have been petite ice-ages. In recent geologic history they are caused by increased albedo due to increased particulate matter or water vapor in the atmosphere. The ejecta from meteorite strikes and violent volcanic eruptions have been known causes. A forest fire of significant scale might conceivably increase the albedo enough to create a petite ice-age. So too might multiple nuclear explosions. Unfortunately for the conspiracy theorists out there, not jet contrails. Warning: many reports of petite ice ages are just local rather than global changes in climate

Petite ice-ages often last for one, two or three years. If if they were caused by solar activity (which is not the case) their duration would be considerably less than the eleven period of Sunspot activity. The carbon-dioxide in our atmosphere will remain a problem on a time scale far larger than that.

http://nyti.ms/14pZxpw

We are all going to die that's a given......None of us here are going to be wiped out by climate change another given so to the future generations that may or may not be because no on really knows shit for certain, well who seriously gives an ass.........I say live for the moment not the if's and but's:whistle:

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well who seriously gives an ass...

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about what? Your children? The children of your sisters, brothers and friends? Their children? Yeah. Screw them. 'cause we can really be certain about anything, it follows we should certainly screw our children's and their children's future. There are a lot of moments in a lifetime. Why does living once and a while for the moment preclude once and a while living for the future?

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Originally Posted by joeninety

We are all going to die that's a given......None of us here are going to be wiped out by climate change another given so to the future generations that may or may not be because no on really knows shit for certain, well who seriously gives an ass.........I say live for the moment not the if's and but's:whistle:

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You are free to dismiss it if you want, but that doesn't mean the issues around climate change are a fantasy even if they don't directly affect you. If you see climate change in the context of resource management, the interactive relationship we humans have with the planet is not just crucial to our survival -it does impact the planet.

Yes, like George Carlin in the satire on Earth Day we have seen many times, 4 billion years of planet earth doesn't give much prominence to humans, and campaigns to Save the Whale!, Save the Snail Darter! because otherwise we are all doomed can sound overwrought, even if the threat to species if very real, with or without us: but we are not on the planet earth a billion years ago, we are here now -you are here now, and probably for the next 50 years or so, and it is because of humans in the past protesting about the quality of life in their locality that chemicals firms are not allowed to dump effluent in the local river; lead has been removed from gasoline; food production is (to some extent) controlled so you are not buying diseased meat; there are large areas of the natural environment in North America and Europe that are protected from industrial development so you can enjoy Yosemite, or wander around the New Forest looking at wild horses.

There is a moment of bitter irony in Carlin's nihilist rant -he pauses to reach for a cup of water and drinks it -right there, in that moment, he insults millions of people who cannot do just that: think of a Palestinian on the West Bank living under occupation whose access to water is rationed while settlers are jumping in and out of swimming pools and washing their cars. The last time I was on the West Bank I had to drink bottled water and the kitchen in a hostel I once lived in was closed because there was no water.

Or consider the fate of Lima, in Peru, which is running out of water altogether and more than a million have no access to running water but must buy it from trucks at inflated rates:
http://www.350resources.org.uk/2011/...fall-declines/

That something as basic to life as a glass of water is a political issue suggests that you have a right not to care, until the day when you wake up and turn on your tap, and nothing comes out. It has already happened in Barnhart, Texas where farming communities that survived for decades have run out of water, in their case owing to fracking in the area. A case of gas for your cars being more important than water for your cattle -or for you?
http://www.theguardian.com/environme...e-oil-no-water

You should also be aware that your fellow Americans in Alaska are living on land that is disappearing into the sea, because of climate change: you may argue they choose to live in a precarious environment, but do you think the Inuit, the Inupiat and the other communities in that part of the world would really rather live in Chicago or Oklahaoma?
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...n_3678828.html

Very good post Stavros. Only one small correction. He's one of yours, not one of ours. His profile says he's from Doncaster.

oops! We are all family, anyway...sorry Joe!

White House Brings Back Solar Panels - YouTube

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Originally Posted by joeninety

We are all going to die that's a given......None of us here are going to be wiped out by climate change another given so to the future generations that may or may not be because no on really knows shit for certain, well who seriously gives an ass.........I say live for the moment not the if's and but's:whistle:

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It's a personal choice.... I mean, if those are your values, well, those are your values.
A lot of people will point out that it's human nature to be greedy and selfish. True, very true. But it's also human nature to be caring, kind and empathetic. I mean, anything human beings do is by definition human nature. And, too, it all hinges on the reward system. I mean, if a society, a system, a culture, as it were, rewards greediness and selfishness then, yep!, people will be greedy and selfish. That's understood. So, yeah, it all hinges on the reward system. If the culture, the system, the structure, as it were, rewards kindness, compassion and caring, well, people will be that. Human nature, as it were, is very flexible.
I happen to think we should care about others.

Human nature is not absolutely flexible, once a person is born and the early upbringing does it's job , that person is fixed. Even when we act selflessly we are acting selfishly, nature made us this way. (Altruism) ,It's the latest modification nature has developed but don't kid yourself s it's just a fancier kind of selfishness.Most people at most of human history always have valued greed and selfishness. Tell me of a time and a place were it hasn't truly been so. Even at our most Altruistic we are expressing selfishness. But to speak honest about Nature, she's a murderous Bitch, unsentimental and vicious. To hell with Nature. My concern is for me first , you second and the trees and the dirt last unless, it preserves me first, you second. If the vast majority of the population of this world are unconcerned with what happens to there environment, I say for those who trully are conserned go live in a deep bunker ,pull your efforts and isolate your self's from the rest of the idiots. And wate for there demise,you will be right in the end. Don't wait for the Obama's of this world to get there act together. They won't and it will be to late for you.