Six million Jews

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Originally Posted by Dahlia Babe Ailhad

Trish, AGAIN, i have already stated my confusion about the articles.

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That means, i don't know what to think.

Not everything is bull crap on the net.



Babe,
xoxo

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Originally Posted by Dahlia Babe Ailhad

Trish, AGAIN, i have already stated my confusion about the articles.

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After eight pages and this silliness still confuses you? Why? What do you find confusing about this? Some preWWII writings mention the word "holocaust" (which at the time meant "sacrifice" and did not yet refer to the genocide perpetrated by the NAZIs). So what? Explain exactly, in your own words, what you think is confusing about that?

Hi trish,

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Originally Posted by Dahlia Babe Ailhad

For the word holocaust as a burnt offering:
The persecuted Russian Jewish people were not "offering anything to God in a burnt offering on an alter" as they were being persecuted, and beaten, so THAT meaning of word, holocaust, i think can not be assigned to fit into the meaning of the newspaper article author's words.
It's just strange that the word was mentioned before the war even started.

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And i had asked you if you were suggesting if the rabbi authors in the articles were using "holocaust" to say that the Jewish people were offering up their homes and belongings in exchange for their "freedom". I did disagree with that.
Did you answer that, by the way? I must have missed that.

You're asking me WHAT I THINK in my own words?
Well, as i have said, and said, again, i am not sure what to think.
Not good enough? Sorry, honestly.
I won't be rushed into a making a hasty decision when i am NOT SURE what to think about it.
There has not been much of a discussion, really.

I've basically been accused and accused and accused. Not by you, but the "time traveler"?...and the "Jehova's hypothesis" comment?... seemed rather insincere, and the ridiculing Valiant Thor comments were below the belt.
It seems if any one disagrees with you or has a different belief, you ridicule them for it. That's not fair. That's rather ignorant behavior, trish. Sorry to be the one to tell you.

And then the bronco makes his big "comeback" coming in with again with MORE accusations. Pfffffft! What jerk - a schmuck.

The majority of this thread is you asking the same questions over and over again and me saying what i've written in my responses over and over again.

I never said in this thread, 'Please ask me what i think.'
I asked for a discussion. Not to be tried as if in a court.

A 'discussion" is not only you offering your personal opinion, and it's case closed.
And then bronco coming in, foaming at the mouth.

I see no REAL discussion with the many members of the forum like i thought it would be. I was planning to sit back and read.

I've been defending myself, basically, against ruthless, and false accusations!!!

Bronco is over there reloading his bad attitude. Looking for more ways to INSULT- his own character by being how he is.
Must be unmarried with a rotten, self-centered attitude like that. Who'd want it? He acts like the Strict Orthodox but he has no idea what his Holy Book says. What a fake.

Thanks,
Babe,
xoxo

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Originally Posted by trish

After eight pages and this silliness still confuses you?

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Trish,

The silliness comes from you repeating your questions after i address them to the best of my ability. Think about it.


Re-asking the same questions will not produce different responses from me.

What is that saying again?...
"The sign of insanity is the repetition of an action which produces the same futile results". Something like that.



Babe,
xoxo

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Originally Posted by broncofan

Read this article. It was written after the Holocaust ended.

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I am not your secretary. Okay?

If i can find things like i have already done - anyone can - even a dopey person like you. Change your meds!

I have found various archived articles from before 1945 and it took me less than a few minutes to find them, upon YOUR VERY insincere, challenging, hateful request.
I've read them, and posted them, all within only a few minutes.
BUT NOOOO not good enough when i find one from 1945?

You like to split hairs, eh, freakofan?
Get OUT!!
Don't let the the swinging door hit your ass on the way out. I don't want a dirty skid-mark. GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!

YOU see what i do, you FREAK? Eh?
When i disapprove of a low class post, i make it PUBLIC - NOT like what you do by hunting down my posts and voting them down like you did in the Happy Holiday thread, and when you hunted down my other posts, too.
Hypocrite!! Backstabber!!

You are supposed to try to be better in life as a Jewish man. NOT WORSE. You are so far gone - you are a LOST soul in the world. AND you will be a lost soul on the Day when that Day arrives when God judges you and your hatred.
Your soul is full of hatred!!! HATER!!!
GRRRRR~!!


I hate posting comments like this!!!!!
Stay away from my threads. Such a petty little man you turned out to be!!

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http://www.merc.ca/vbulletin/images/smilies/mondieu.gif

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Originally Posted by Dahlia Babe Ailhad

Trish,

The silliness comes from you repeating your questions after i address them to the best of my ability. Think about it.


Re-asking the same questions will not produce different responses from me.

What is that saying again?...
"The sign of insanity is the repetition of an action which produces the same futile results". ...

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Simple machines respond in the same way to the same input. People, who are capable of thinking and learning, modify their behaviors and beliefs.

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And i had asked you if you were suggesting if the rabbi authors in the articles were using "holocaust" to say that the Jewish people were offering up their homes and belongings in exchange for their "freedom". I did disagree with that.

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Yes, I answered that. No, it was not being suggested that the Jewish people were “offering” up their homes, their livelihood and community as a sacrifice, but rather that their loss was a sacrifice nevertheless. It’s not an outlandish use of language to say, for example, that many lives were sacrificed before we learned how to inoculate against smallpox. You can quibble that it’s not exactly accurate were one to insist on a literal reading of the word “sacrifice,” but it can’t be denied that figuratively such usage is common. The same with holocaust. You can argue that not all the homes were burnt and you can say they weren’t sacrificed to Jehovah. But in that time (before the word “holocaust” referred to the genocide committed by the NAZIs) it could easily have been used figuratively to mean a sacrifice of almost any sort.

An antisemite sorts through three decades of newspaper articles and cherry picks a mere three hundred articles (which, as far as we know, have not been vetted by any independent source) which mention the number “sixty million” or the word “holocaust,” and somehow you are snowed by this?! It’s soooo confusing for you? It’s time to tell us why? What is it about the facts and logic here (I’m not asking for a personal story) that you find so alluring, mysterious or in need of explanation?

BTW Truly, if someone is willing to take seriously the existence of a space alien named Thor, then I figure that same someone is open-minded enough to consider the possibility that information can be sent from the future back through time. Indeed, I would speculate that same someone might be open to the possibility that the 271 newspaper articles are indeed evidence of just that conjecture.

Dahlia, you've had no "real discussion" on this thread for three simple reasons.

1. Your information sources are at best misrepresentative and at worst completely fake.

2. Trish has answered your questions on page 3, post 25 and several times since, including the post above, to the satisfaction of everyone else except you. The question remains, why you can't accept her explanation?

3. You attack anyone who posts an opinion that you don't agree with on the thread, including me for daring to suggest that the internet may not be the universal source of truth you think it is. Yet, you accuse everyone of attacking you. Double standards?

Icedentally, how do you expect to start a discussion without asking what people believe in? Discussion is all about personal opinions.

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Originally Posted by Dahlia Babe Ailhad

BUT NOOOO not good enough when i find one from 1945?

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I asked you whether you vetted the articles or took the word of the person who excerpted them, who many healthy skeptics would believe had a motive not to be honest. You did not answer whether you had done that in advance but instead frantically started doing it. The issue was not whether the articles are genuine, but whether you assumed they were without checking independent sources.

To show your diligence you post an article as an example that is from 1945, at the tail end of the Holocaust. How does an article reporting 6 million casualties from the Holocaust prove that the number 6 million was used before the Holocaust? The fact is it does not. You hadn't read the article and did not know its contents. This was one of something like five articles you posted and were not even aware of what it contained. The person who copied the article thought it was proof that the Holocaust was made up, or he would not have saved it as jewmadeup.jpg.

It is also relevant that the only places these articles are located are extremely anti-semitic, Holocaust-denial websites. Every other person who thinks the number 6 million being used before the Holocaust signifies something is making the argument that the Holocaust is a lie. Yet you continue to pretend you are not saying that.

I've also answered your question, though obliquely. The articles refer to a number of things. When they refer to Eastern European atrocities, they use the word holocaust, in lower case letters. Many of the articles refer to the Kishinev pogrom where homes were literally burned. These types of pogroms took place for several decades around that time. When the articles refer to 6 million they were often referring to existing population estimates, such as six million Jews in Russia.

But it's a waste of time to talk about the articles unless you have a point to make. Saying you find it confusing is not an answer.

In addition to answering your question, I've also tried to head off any conclusion to be drawn from the conspiracy angle by pointing out that among Holocaust scholars the number six million does not have any special significance. It is an average. The studies that were done on the Holocaust by men such as Raul Hilberg were exhaustive studies, filling books over a thousand pages long. They did not posit round figures...but numbers like 5.1 million or 5.7 million or 6.2 million. But I have a question for you.

Are we to believe that in addition to just having an innocent question about newspaper articles that list the number six million, you also think Jewish people get too much attention for the Holocaust (as you posted in the other thread), are primarily responsible for the trans-atlantic slave trade, and are responsible as a group (rather than as individuals) for producing degrading songs? And you so innocently stumbled onto this information on a harmless site crafted by merely curious people who write articles like The Jew Joke Al Franken, or How Israel Did 9/11, or The Jews who Run Hollywood? There's a name for this type of activity. It's called anti-semitism.

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Originally Posted by Dahlia Babe Ailhad

Hi everybody,

I do not appreciate certain people trying to dominate this thread with FALSE accusations.
I can't apologize when people misquote me and take mo y words or intentions out of context .
I really hurts how i was called an anti-Semite. I have said nothing against Jewish people as a race or the religion they follow. And moderators should do their part to remove such false accusations. However, anything goes in this area of the board, it seems.
I know who i am, and i will never be told who and what i am by biased people who refuse to look passed their...lol never mind lol.

Whatever happened in Europe during history definitely happened. There is doubt about that.
Whatever happens in my neighborhood (and my city and country) happens, also. There is no doubt about that, either.
Whatever happens on this forum, has happened and will continue to happen as the days go by. That is incontestable.
Life happens!

So, again, whatever "happened" in Europe - happened.
I will not, can not, say what had happened over there, because i was not there when it, whatever "it" might be, happened.
Neither were the large majority, if any at all, of the members of this forum here, were there during the war.

The video i posted in the first post of this thread, has blown all of my perceptions, and beliefs clearly out of focus. I do not know WHAT to believe anymore.
I grew up believing what many believe simply because there was no way to dig deep into the matter for truths. Times certainly have changed in that respect, with the instant access to information provided by the internet.

What do i believe?... i still am not quite sure. I do know that humans can be a ruthless, conniving, viciously nasty, despicable, murderous species of beings who would kill their own brother for the most stupid reasons imaginable like, who "stole" the last beer or the last cigarette in the dwelling - not to mention religious dogma which is a very serious human affliction.

I truly believe that all western humans are vile and that is, in large part, because of the obsession with religious dogma - who is right or wrong?...who should live or die?...who deserves a country or who should be removed from their homeland and WHY?....who burns people alive?...who plans to bring down skyscrapers?...who is an anti-Semite and who is not?...who is informed and who is stupid, ignorant, or simply naïve?...and most of all, who chooses to close their eyes to it all to protect a "system of beliefs" called, lies - and that goes for ANY system of beliefs that exist within any branch human knowledge

It's a very nasty business conducted by the nastiest individuals on this planet - marionette politicians controlled by evil minded, greedy, ruthless, and extremely wealthy puppet masters who could do so much more for humanity than they do than simply wanting to control it.
And please, don't ANY ONE think that because one is of a certain religious faith that they are "saved" from man's ruthlessness - the hammer will fall on everyone except the chosen few of the elite. So be aware of that. If you think being Muslim, Jewish, Christian or whatever faith you use to is going to protect you from the hammer of the elite, you are the naïve ones.
The quest for power is the root of all the evil that exists.
Propaganda, and everything related to it, controls the minds of once inherently good people and turns them all against each other in the worst ways.
That's not "life in the big city", that is sadly just life.

I've mentioned what i have read, and my Polish friend's mom, and the stories i've heard people saying, all throughout my existence about what had happened.
I, like everyone else, had very naïvely, accepted it all as fact just because so many people were sayings the same things.
What i've only just realized during this thread and the by comments is that all those people (people i've personally met in my life) were/are all reading the "same, one book" and all the reports were based on what that "same, one book" says.
The "same, one book" is to say, the "oft repeated opinions" passed down throughout history.

Well, i've been digging around the net and listening and watching videos (documentaries, lectures) from various people, Jewish and non-Jewish alike, and i've learned that there are other versions of what had "happened".
I've recently watched videos from people who are called anti-Semites (although they, themselves, self-identify as, revisionists.
I've watched videos of Holocaust survivors, former Nazi SS men, historians on both sides, rabbis, priests, the GOCC, a rabbi who converted to Orthodox Christianity etc.
I've seen proofs which clearly point at facts - not popular facts, or course, because such facts incite the same attitudes from either very naïve, or very ignorant, and/or even very arrogant people who are so quick to eagerly ridicule, criticize and defame anybody who expresses different beliefs.
It's as if everyone has to believe in what everyone else says to believe in - or else it's, dumm da dummdum!!

Maybe these people agree with everything that is said by the masses simply out of, perhaps, respect for their elders, or respect for a particular political agenda from which they will, one day, (maybe) benefit - somehow.
Maybe they just don't care...you know?...so long as the useless television works and the beer store is open - that's all that matters. You all know who you are.
I don't drink nor do i watch television.
I am always on a quest for knowledge and i do keep an open mind. And i do have a good sense of judgement when it comes to what i read and watch. I really don't need any one lecturing me on what i watch or believe in. You are in NO position to tell me WHO and what i am - unless you have a hidden agenda.
I don't!

It's come to the point that in our modern world, the word, anti-Semite, is thrown around more than baseballs or footballs are thrown around.
It is, as if, it has become a tool to stop any intellectual, intelligent conversations from taking place and/or opinions from being expressed.
Clear examples of this, what i would call a "crime", are very visible within this very thread.
It's like being bullied, and no one is allowed to stop it.

Do i like modern Jewish people?...yes, i do. Always have.
It's just too bad some of them consider any non-Jewish people to be socially below worthless animals.
That is teaching which is taught in the Babylonian Talmud.
AND i can admit that some humans CAN be like worthless animals - that, is very true. However, i digress.

However, history can not be ignored, like it or not!
It's called history for a reason.
I really can't understand how lies become history and how history can become lies. All people want is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
When lies become a truth (or vice versa), that is a clear indication of just how much clout money has in the controlling minds of selfish, uncaring, greedy, power-hungry human beings (or maybe they are NOT human beings). Lol! Can any one REALLY say who is a human or is not a human on our planet? Good luck with that one! I am sure the "know-it-alls" will all chime in with their responses to that comment.

In closing:
Every day it becomes clearer to me how stories can be passed off as truth or lies in these days of instant information, and yes, misinformation, too.
It seems very suspicious to me how facts can be called lies simply because those facts happen to piss off any race of people simply because they were taught, all of their lives, to believe a completely different story for completely different reasons, other than telling the truth.

Have a chuckle.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TYZBKqemQrU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8t9JEROAzQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mV7m6IIN_tI

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Have a great day.
Babe,
xoxo