Re: Occupy Wall Street protest
Im starting to become dissillusioned with the movement. Been down there a good amount of times to support and it has dramatically changed. The last couple days before Zucotti was shut down were bad, lots of fighting, junkies, and freeloaders. Its a shame because the real activists have a heart of gold, and are there for all the right reasons, but are being overshadowed by bad people. On Thursday it became pretty much an anti-cop rally, and i left early and dont plan on returning anytime soon. I know some of the stuff we've seen online with the police has been shocking, but based on my own personal account (have been there to support OWS over 2 dozen days/nights), the police have been professional and its been large groups of young punk kids and squatters who are instigating confrontation with them.
Re: Occupy Wall Street protest
A movement without clear direction, A) Doesn't get very far, B) doesn't last very long, C) Does nothing but piss off the people they are trying to impress and, D) Their message (whatever it was intended to be) becomes lost.
A mob is just that, a mob.
Re: Occupy Wall Street protest
Re: Occupy Wall Street protest
Quote:
Originally Posted by
trish
Helpless case. Apparently the better argument is the bigger argument. Okay then: The Bush Housing and Banking Collapse has Greed, Tax Cuts, Deregulation and Two off-the-book Wars written all over it.
Really now Trish? Do Tell. You are so pathetically and woefully wrong it's painful. Your Bush derrangement syndrome has taken an otherwise open mind and closed it. I'm friends with former Congressman Chris Shays. He routinely sparred with the majority Democrats for years about the stability and the social engineering of Fannie and Freddie. Google it. Get educated, but in the meantime put down the NY Times and watch this.
Timeline shows Bush, McCain warning Dems of financial and housing crisis; meltdown - YouTube
Barney Frank Caught Lying About Fannie Mae - YouTube
Re: Occupy Wall Street protest
Quote:
Originally Posted by
EyeCumInPiece
Im starting to become dissillusioned with the movement. Been down there a good amount of times to support and it has dramatically changed. The last couple days before Zucotti was shut down were bad, lots of fighting, junkies, and freeloaders. Its a shame because the real activists have a heart of gold, and are there for all the right reasons, but are being overshadowed by bad people. On Thursday it became pretty much an anti-cop rally, and i left early and dont plan on returning anytime soon. I know some of the stuff we've seen online with the police has been shocking, but based on my own personal account (have been there to support OWS over 2 dozen days/nights), the police have been professional and its been large groups of young punk kids and squatters who are instigating confrontation with them.
If there are so-called junkies, well, we as a society should help them. I think the problem with our culture is that we simply abandon people. We simply don't care. Ya know, part of the problem is: the visible loss of care.
People are moral agents. We expect people to act morally. And most people, if they aren't psychopathic, are deeply moral and decent. It's the culture that drives out our humanity, as it were. (And, too, our culture is all about serving our own interests and who cares about anyone else. And that goes against the core nature of being a human being: empathy for other human beings. Now, you can't humanize people. Because people are human. But you can certainly dehumanize people. Think: Germans in Nazi Germany.
The nature of being a human being allows for all sorts of behaviors. Anyone of us, under the right circumstances, can either be an absolute saint or a gas chamber attendant.
Institutions by their very design -- whether government or corporations -- are monstrous. (They are monstrous precisely because they're rationally designed. And constructed, as it were, to not care about right and wrong. That's the institutional system of both government and corporations. It's not the people. But the institution.
A corporation isn't a moral agent. Nor is a government institution. That's the problem in our society. Because these amoral -- again, not caring about right and wrong -- institutions have ultimate power in our society.) But people, deep down, are good, decent and moral. It's the culture that DRIVES that decency out of us!
Again, in our narcissistic culture it's important to drive that out of people's heads. The act of care and concern for others.
Re: Occupy Wall Street protest
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CORVETTEDUDE
A movement without clear direction, A) Doesn't get very far, B) doesn't last very long, C) Does nothing but piss off the people they are trying to impress and, D) Their message (whatever it was intended to be) becomes lost.
A mob is just that, a mob.
If the direction, message or intent were clear, it wouldn't be a movement. If it was trying to impress anyone, or cared who got pissed off, it wouldn't be a movement. The US hasn't seen a real movement in 40 years. Contrary to popular meme & myth, the "Tea Party" (®?) was never a movement. It's an organization, directly affiliated with a political party, with media backing, put together top down, with specific strategy, tactics, & agenda. A movement, by its very nature, is disorganized. It's a bottom up groundswell. No leaders. No spokesmen. No specific philosophy.
Messy as it is, this current movement has a common denominator running through all the protests across the country & around the world. It's clear if you ignore the petty bullshit & lies.
2 parts:
Anger. Welcome to the real rage against the machine. What really has people pissed is the (reak or perceived) total lack of accountability for the obvious fraud that crashed the economy. The capital markets are right back where they were before the crash, have been for the last 2 years, & nothing's being produced except more junk paper. The same assholes are pushing out the same shit. Hedge bets are still controlling the flow of capital. WTF?!! I'm pissed. Aren't you?
Fear: Folks don't want to lose their representative democracy. It's hard to articulate because the revisionists, pundits, & other assorted assholes have distorted the language to the point where people are afraid to use the proper descriptives. I'm not. This movement is anti-fascist. Now don't anybody start yammering about nazis & ovens because that's not fascism. Simple version, fascism is corporate control of government. This movement isn't about "socialism" or any crackpot Marx shit. Left to their own devices, corporations will always try to swallow up the competition & gain monopoly status. That's why we have regulations & anti-trust legislation. Monopolies are anathema to a free market. Want to see free enterprize disappear? Just allow private monopolies. Fascismis just one step ahead of feudalism.
It's not a mob either. The only ones acting like a mob are the powers that be with these unnecessary police riots. The lame excuses for sending in the troopers would be laughable if it wasn't so sad.
Re: Occupy Wall Street protest
Re: Occupy Wall Street protest
Re: Occupy Wall Street protest
Quote:
Originally Posted by
EyeCumInPiece
Im starting to become dissillusioned with the movement. Been down there a good amount of times to support and it has dramatically changed. The last couple days before Zucotti was shut down were bad, lots of fighting, junkies, and freeloaders. Its a shame because the real activists have a heart of gold, and are there for all the right reasons, but are being overshadowed by bad people. On Thursday it became pretty much an anti-cop rally, and i left early and dont plan on returning anytime soon. I know some of the stuff we've seen online with the police has been shocking, but based on my own personal account (have been there to support OWS over 2 dozen days/nights), the police have been professional and its been large groups of young punk kids and squatters who are instigating confrontation with them.
Occupy Wall Street complaining about freeloaders... the ultimate irony.
Re: Occupy Wall Street protest
[quote=Revolution brother!:soapbox[/QUOTE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by
russtafa
Yep exactly
Simon Johnson - on Starting a Revolution - YouTube
The Quiet Coup by Simon Johnson:
http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/...ngle_page=true
