17yr old black kid shot and killed for walking in white suburbia?

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Originally Posted by DaveO

It's a tragedy that Trayvon died, but Zimmerman had a right to confront him about why he was in the gated community without being physically attacked by Trayvon. Keep in mind that the whole gated community was private property, including the streets and sidewalks.

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Oh dear ... where to start? Go back and read some.

WEll Queens, I see Trayvon as a tall 17 year old Teen, am I correct? Is he a teen or an adult? He's skinny, look at his face book pics, and he has on baggy pants at the store am I correct? He's not a built guy, he was only 17 am I correct?

He could be seen as a threat because he's tall, but here's the ass kicker, you said you see him as a threat, Zimmerman seen him as a threat but one thing Zimmerman had over him was THE MIGHTY GUN, am I correct? Zimmerman seen Trayvon and he seen how tall he was, bet if Zimmerman didn't have that gun I bet he would of stayed in the car. Just as you see Trayvon as a threat.

Now me I don't see Trayvon as a threat maybe because I am 6'1 230 lbs muscle, it is certain short men have size complexes in the world, so to me he's not a threat. The thing is how is he a threat in a store just buying goods? Unless you're talking about he would look like a threat to you as you walked down the street. If that's the case every time I see African descent youth in my hood I should see all of them as threats because they are taller than me. smh

I MEAN LOOK AT HIM HE DOESN'T HAVE ANY REAL MUSCLE MASS HE'S SKINNY, IF YOU DON'T SEE THAT QUEENS THEN I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO SAY.

http://img1.imagehousing.com/6/6556f...3a602191ea.jpg

So there you have it.

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Originally Posted by Queens Guy

I think it does, as a lot of information has just been released.

Once we reach a point where nothing new comes along, which will probably happen in a few weeks after all of this newly released information is digested, I think you're right, it will become mostly a matter of everybody forming their own opinion. At that point this thread will become stale and we'll just have to wait until the trial happens.

Right now, it's interesting to see how different people interpret the same evidence or information. The things that are what they are, instead of things that lead to speculation. For instance, the video of Trayvon at the 7-11 buying the skittles and iced tea is what it is. Just a video of him at the store.

But jamesedward and I have different takeaways from it. I see a person who looks more like a young man than the tiny tot in the little league football jersey or the other picture of Trayvon in an orange t-shirt that has been shown so much in this story. jamesedward, correct me if I'm wrong, I don't want to put words in your mouth, but you see him as a thin guy, maybe even scrawny. I see Trayvon as more of a potential threat because of that video. I could hold off that tiny tot like in a Three Stooges clip. Just put my hand on his forehead while he swings his short arms. But the Trayvon in the video is taller and has more reach. He could land jabs on me if we squared off. jamesedward doesn't see it that way.

So, I think it's still useful, for now.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by DaveO

It's a tragedy that Trayvon died, but Zimmerman had a right to confront him about why he was in the gated community without being physically attacked by Trayvon. Keep in mind that the whole gated community was private property, including the streets and sidewalks.

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:dead: Do you even know this case? Being you said Zimmerman was attacked, one witness will shut that theory down.

The girlfriend was on the phone and Trayvon said he was being followed, now Tray asked Zimmerman what is he following him for, after the dispatcher told ZIMMERMAN NOT TO ENGAGE THE TEEN!!!

The neighborhood watch rules are 1. Don't carry a weapon, Zimmerman violated that rule we know that because he shot someone. 2. Don't engage people, call the police, he violated that too.

So now that you know that, he has the right to do what?

Ok lets say he does, he was unprofessional in approaching Tray and you don't look like you're stalking some one if you need to ask them a question. I don't even know how many times I have to say this. But Zimm was not professional and is not a professional. He should have waited by the mail box and wait for the police who are professional handle it, no he wanted to handle it and ended up shooting a teen.

If he had the right to follow Trayvon why on earth would the dispatcher tell Zimm "WE DON'T NEED YOU TO DO THAT", They would of told him "GO AHEAD PROCEED BECAUSE YOU'RE THE NEIGHBORHOOD CAPTAIN". The dispatcher don't know that dude from a can of paint.

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Originally Posted by jamesedwards

If he had the right to follow Trayvon why on earth would the dispatcher tell Zimm "WE DON'T NEED YOU TO DO THAT", They would of told him "GO AHEAD PROCEED BECAUSE YOU'RE THE NEIGHBORHOOD CAPTAIN". The dispatcher don't know that dude from a can of paint.

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Liability.

If the dispatcher tells him to proceed, he places the liability on himself and/or the city. They are trained to tell you to back off and break contact. But there is no law saying you must.

BTW, in most areas, a 911 dispatcher is not a LEO. The dispatcher has no authority to give orders... only advice.

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Although Zimmerman's a piece of shit, I don't generalize his actions or behavior to ALL people who look like him.

I shouldn't be, but part of me is still surprised the level of deep seated animus some White people have towards Blacks in general. A Black person commits a crime and suddenly that's supposed to be representative of ALL Black people.

There are White folks on this board who are pure bred racists, TO THE BONE, but it begins and ends with THEM, in my mind. I don't say, 'damn since this asshole is a bigot, all White people are.'

Can't believe some you are saying because other Black people have committed heinous criminal acts, a HUMAN BEING like Trayvon who happens to be Black doesn't rank anyone White person's sympathy.

There are multiple stories over the years not featured in the mainstream media, about Black enlisted soldiers stationed in Japan who have been murdered for being sexually intimate with Japanese women. Should I hate ALL Japanese now, or Asians in general??

I understand the disgust when reading or hearing about in the media that person A committed a crime against person B, but the hate some of you carry with you for all people a particular group is shocking to me.

Hard4janira, you are a deeply troubled soul. The murder of those USC grad students was wrong, the murder of Trayvon was wrong. Why does it have to be one of the other??

As for Trayvon being perceived as a 'threat', even when unarmed, is ludicrous to me.
As a kid I've seen skinny Black kids like Trayvon get beat down by their mother's(!), much less a grown man who outweighs him by 40#.

There's something to be said for some of you having an irrational fear of someone else's skin color.

There's racism on both sides of the fence. Unfortunately many people are fighting fire with fire instead of cutting out racism altogether. I'm not justifying any form of racism but I've met a fair amount of both white and black people who feel their racist views are "justified" for different reasons. All I'm saying is people need to drop the whole racial bullshit and focus on what's important, especially in criminal cases.

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Originally Posted by Stavros

1) If your first comment is true, why are there are so many Black Americans in prison, if they can commit crimes with impunity. Or is it the case that the ones in prison are innocent and its the guilty who go free?

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You're correct on that point. They do go to jail (repeatedly), so impunity is not the correct term. What I should have said is they get a pass from the media because everybody expects this behavior out of them I suppose. Where is the media outrage and uproar over the two asian grad students who were murdered while sitting in their car? Where are the accusations of racism and hate crime when there is little doubt they were targeted because of thier race? The fact is black poeple are probably the most racist hate filled people in the country (not that whtie people aren't). I'm just saying that black people exhibit so much anger violence towards other races because they have MASSIVE inferiority complexes that they refuse to admit. Who else advocates the killing of Korean grocers because they are EARNING money in black neighborhoods? Black people are a fucking disaster area in America (I apologize to those of you who have actually clawed your way to respecabiltity - you get a bad rap but you're stuck in a barrel of rotten apples).

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Originally Posted by Stavros

2) Trayvon had a strong father figure in his life, something that runs completely against the stereotypes other BMs have used on this thread who follow the Charles Murray school of Sociology that caricatures 'Black families' as fatherless, moms addicted to crack or booze, dependent on welfare, dysfunctional, disengaged with society at lage, involved in crime, drug addiction etc etc.

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Wrong. He had a father figure in his life but we can question whether or not it was a strong one. Martin was suspended from school for drug possession and had other behavioral problems in the past. I'd argue his parents weren't doing a very good job at raising thier son. but I probably have MUCH higher standards than his parents (or Barrack Obama apparently).

Korean immigrants have been earmarked for special set-aside loans that allow them to open stores in impoverished Black communities, yet Black entrepreneurs who live in the same communities can't get a loan to open a hotdog cart. That's where the resentment comes from. Immigrants come into a Black ghetto, extract the wealth and then go home to their split level ranch home in the vanilla suburbs.

I assumed the Chinese grad students at USC were killed by gang violence, that's why it's not a major story because it's not new.

The Trayvon Martin case wouldn't be on the national radar if Zimmerman had been arrested in the beginning. His being able to walk after admitting to murdering an unarmed teen is why Trayvon's death became a 'cause'. It wasn't, ' oh, a Black kid was murdered, let's elevate his death into a national media story.'

'Black people are a fucking disaster area in America'???
If you get a chance, Hard4janira, look up how many AA live in poverty, how many of them are working class and lower middle class, and how many of them are incarcerated.
Jesus Christ, the bile that comes out of your mouth like it's the God's honest truth.

Just wondering, do you consider yourself a racist?? And are you proud to be one??

There are individuals on this board who are blackmailers. There are individuals who have wished other board members physical harm, up to and including death. But, they love to call eveyone they can a racist, when they are the standard bearers for hate mongering.....how very odd.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hard4janira

Black people are a fucking disaster area in America

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On the other hand, MalcolmX would have said that America was a disaster for Black people; anyway both you and he are wrong. Aside from the fact that Americans come from diverse origins, and are of course all equally American, you seem to be saying that the development of the US economy would have taken the course it has in spite of, not because of the presence of slavery in your country. That is simply absurd, as absurd as me arguing that India, Australia, New Zealand and Canada have been irrelevant to the development of the United Kingdom. You could be given a list of people in literature, in music, in sport, in culture, in politics all of whom trace their roots to Africa though slavery, all of whom should make you proud to be an American. But I cannot tell you what to think or feel, and there isn't much more I can say if you have already made up your mind. There is good and bad in all societies, a tired cliche I know, but it matters if one group of people are isolated from the rest, because in America that runs counter to the very principle of equality and individual liberty on which your state is based.

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Originally Posted by jamesedwards

WEll Queens, I see Trayvon as a tall 17 year old Teen, am I correct? Is he a teen or an adult? He's skinny, look at his face book pics, and he has on baggy pants at the store am I correct? He's not a built guy, he was only 17 am I correct?

He could be seen as a threat because he's tall, but here's the ass kicker, you said you see him as a threat, Zimmerman seen him as a threat but one thing Zimmerman had over him was THE MIGHTY GUN, am I correct? Zimmerman seen Trayvon and he seen how tall he was, bet if Zimmerman didn't have that gun I bet he would of stayed in the car. Just as you see Trayvon as a threat.

Now me I don't see Trayvon as a threat maybe because I am 6'1 230 lbs muscle, it is certain short men have size complexes in the world, so to me he's not a threat. The thing is how is he a threat in a store just buying goods? Unless you're talking about he would look like a threat to you as you walked down the street. If that's the case every time I see African descent youth in my hood I should see all of them as threats because they are taller than me. smh

I MEAN LOOK AT HIM HE DOESN'T HAVE ANY REAL MUSCLE MASS HE'S SKINNY, IF YOU DON'T SEE THAT QUEENS THEN I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO SAY.

http://img1.imagehousing.com/6/6556f...3a602191ea.jpg

So there you have it.

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james,

I guess we did take away different things after seeing the video.

I didn't say, or I didn't mean to say, that I saw the video version of Trayvon as a threat, to me personally. I'm about the same size as you, know how to fight, etc, and I really wouldn't sweat Trayvon that much. My only concern would be to make sure I got inside his jab and get to grappling distance.

I did not, with a capital NOT, say that Trayvon did anything in the store that made him look like a threat. He was just a teenager buying some snacks. Nothing about that video leads me to think anything about what happened later that night.

My point was that I compared him to the previous photos I've seen. The little kid in the football uniform, the smiling kid in the orange shirt. Compared to the little kid version of Trayvon we've seen, the 'new' version is more of a threat.

This is a criticism of the media, too. It's hard to believe that with all the pictures people put up on facebook, myspace, etc, these days that the media couldn't have shown more recent pictures of him. I'm one of those people that thinks the media is trying to 'create a narrative'. Just tell me what happened, as accurately as you can, and don't make anything up. NBC/MSNBC lost all credibility to me when they did that misleading edit job on the Zimmerman 911 call, cutting down the 13 seconds to 6, eliminating the part where the dispatcher asks Zimmerman to tell him the race of the 'suspicious male'. They 'created' their version news, they didn't report it.

I think we are going to have to agree to disagree on this one, jamesedward, at this point. Maybe we'll agree as more information comes out, though. I don't have any animosity toward you and I don't feel any from you. I think we both do agree that we want to see justice. Maybe we can share a drink at one of the T-girl parties sometime.

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Originally Posted by fastingforlife

There are individuals on this board who are blackmailers. There are individuals who have wished other board members physical harm, up to and including death. But, they love to call eveyone they can a racist, when they are the standard bearers for hate mongering.....how very odd.

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DOn't be cryptic. Who are you trying to protect??lol
Make your case or don't say anything.

I know I told a poster he should go suck on the barrel of a shotgun. And I got called on it.
Who's calling 'everyone' a racist?? Not a single person on this board has called 'everyone else' a racist. But they do exist in a little club here on HA. That's indisputable.

Are you calling me a hate monger??
Helps to be clear about what it is you're trying to say when you're attempting to make a point.

And how can anyone on this site be a blackmailer??

For instance if I repeatedly told members randomly to go suck on shotgun barrels and people complained, eventually I know I would be asked to cut it out, or I'd be banned.

That's not blackmail, it's a basic rule for conduct on a message board.

By the way, how else is one supposed to interpret hard4janira's statement?? As a factual observation?? It was a crazy thing to say but at least the dude has laid his cards out there, so next time I won't have to be surprised.

Seanchai, utilizing the skills of a typicall 11 year old, was able to discover my identity when I made comments within another thread that he disapproved of. To silence and intimidate me, he threathened to out my interest in this site to my wife, children and employer, violating the code of honor that we all extend to each other, regardless of our differences. Not one board member had the courage to call him on his act of blackmail. Which, by the way is a crime.............even in our little world. I am stunned that the moderator/administrator hasn't banned him. However, I chose not to report him, expecting others to do that.

In the matter of your wish that I die, I do not accept, as others do that it was simple hyperbole. But, I will be generous and call it an overzealous remark by a member of the thought police.

Rationalizing Racial Oppression: How the Right Misuses Crime Data to Justify Unequal Policing
Whenever I write an article about racism, or give a speech concerning the ongoing reality of discrimination in the labor market, I am assailed by those who refuse to believe what virtually any study done in the past two decades confirms: namely, that people of color are not seeing things, nor crazy when they suggest that racial bias is very much a modern-day phenomenon.
These assaults typically arrive in my e-mail inbox, within hours of an article going out over the web, as if pre-prepared long before, and as if their authors were simply waiting for an opportunity to pick an electronic fight.
Sometimes their retorts are little more than racist rants about how blacks and Latinos are lazy, or how American Indians are all drunk. But oftentimes the denial comes wrapped in far more sophisticated garb than that, occasionally bordering on the scholarly, in fact. While some of the conservatives who regale me with their rationalizations for racial inequality manage to quote a gaggle of right wing “experts” to help make their case, the claims they forward are hardly the stronger for it.
For example, the argument that racial wage gaps merely reflect different levels of experience and qualifications between whites and blacks are simply untenable, when one examines the data. Fact is, earnings gaps persist at all levels of education. According to Census data, whites with high school diplomas, college degrees or Master’s Degrees all earn approximately twenty percent more than their black counterparts. Even more striking, whites with professional degrees (such as medicine or law) earn, on average, thirty-one percent more than similar blacks and fifty-two percent more than similar Latinos (1). Even when levels of work experience are the same between blacks and whites, the racial wage gap remains between 10-20 percent (2).
Looking at whites and blacks of similar age, doing the same work, earnings gaps remain significant. Among 25-34 year olds, white lawyers, computer programmers, and carpenters earn, on average, about one-fourth more than comparable blacks; white doctors and accountants earn, on average, one-third more than comparable blacks; and even white janitors earn sixteen percent more, on average, than comparable blacks (3).
Although these gaps do not necessarily reflect overt discrimination by employers — in fact, they mostly reflect the segmented labor market, whereby whites have greater access to more lucrative clients and companies — the effect is the same: whites continue to receive advantages in the labor market over equally qualified blacks.
And contrary to the claims of some, differences in black and white wages are not the result of different cognitive abilities or IQ scores. The results of over thirty studies confirm that test scores and other academic achievement differences can account for no more than three percent of the wage gaps between whites and blacks (4).
The two most common excuses for racial wage inequity are age and geography: excuses popularized by black conservatives like Thomas Sowell, and repeated ad infinitum by white reactionaries like Abigail and Stephen Thernstrom. Since blacks are, on average, younger than whites they will earn less, so the argument goes; and since blacks disproportionately live in the South — a lower-wage region of the country — they will earn less, even if there were no racism operating in labor markets

http://www.timwise.org/2005/05/excus...he-job-market/

http://www.timwise.org/2005/05/excus...minal-justice/

Rationalizing Racial Oppression

http://www.counterpunch.org/2009/08/...al-oppression/




DWB ("driving while black"), "racial profiling," these terms refer to a certain portion of racism. Those with "white privilege," are not subjected to it. It's more than a matter of discrimination in terms of selective enforcement. (Other forms of racism occur on the job, for example, but this site focuses on a different aspect, "Voting While Black," VWB, or attempted VWB (aka "Voting While Black or Brown"). http://medicolegal.tripod.com/dwb.htm

Seanchai is a moderator here

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Originally Posted by fastingforlife

Seanchai, utilizing the skills of a typicall 11 year old, was able to discover my identity when I made comments within another thread that he disapproved of. To silence and intimidate me, he threathened to out my interest in this site to my wife, children and employer, violating the code of honor that we all extend to each other, regardless of our differences. Not one board member had the courage to call him on his act of blackmail. Which, by the way is a crime.............even in our little world. I am stunned that the moderator/administrator hasn't banned him. However, I chose not to report him, expecting others to do that.

In the matter of your wish that I die, I do not accept, as others do that it was simple hyperbole. But, I will be generous and call it an overzealous remark by a member of the thought police.

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Originally Posted by natina

Seanchai is a moderator here

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No wonder he operates with impunity.....very sad, indeed.

BREAKING NEWS ZIMMERMAN WITNESS CHANGES STORY

Key witness in Trayvon Martin shooting changed story


http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/20...ged-story?lite

That advice ZIMMERMAN SHOULD OF FOLLOWED THAT NIGHT!!!
Yeah liability, but also the dispatcher new Zimmerman wasn't a cop, meaning a professional so the call was right.

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Originally Posted by theoryman

Liability.

If the dispatcher tells him to proceed, he places the liability on himself and/or the city. They are trained to tell you to back off and break contact. But there is no law saying you must.

BTW, in most areas, a 911 dispatcher is not a LEO. The dispatcher has no authority to give orders... only advice.

--

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HOld up where in the hell did they get he was 6'3? Report said he was only 5'11, Trayvon that is. Where is they getting the 6'3 shit from? wtf is going on here.

Key witness in Trayvon Martin shooting changed story

BAmmmmmmmmmmmmmm lol :dead: That was a key witness for Zimmerman NOT ANYMORE LOL Who's case falling apart now? That's the same guy that said Tray was on top too lol He'll probably change that too "YA KNOW THINKING ABOUT IT, I, I, UMMMMMM I REALLY COULDN'T BECAUSE IT WAS DARK" LOL :dead:

That was the man at his door who slammed the door when Zimmerman and Tray go into it, and he slammed his door and it made the first pop sound before the gun went off, he ran upstairs to call police. How many ear witnesses there are 22? WoW I know Two women said they heard Tray yelling for help and their story has been consistent on three different occasions!!!

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A key witness to the Trayvon Martin shooting changed the story he had given Sanford, Fla., police, telling state authorities he was not sure who was screaming during the altercation with George Zimmerman, NBC Dateline confirmed Friday.
The man known as Witness #6 originally told Sanford police Zimmerman cried for help. The witness stuck to his account that he saw Martin, 17, straddling Zimmerman and pinning him to the ground before Martin was shot.

On March 20, according to the Orlando Sentinel, while sitting for a follow-up interview by a Florida Department of Law Enforcement investigator the witness said that he was no longer sure who was calling for help.
"At first, I thought it was the person on the ground, just because, you know, me thinking rationally, if someone was on top, the person on the bottom would be yelling," he said, according to the Sentinel. "I truly can't tell who, after thinking about it, was yelling for help just because it was so dark out on that sidewalk. You can't see a mouth …"
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Court docs: Trayvon Martin shooting 'ultimately avoidable by Zimmerman'

http://openchannel.msnbc.msn.com/_ne...in=usnews&lite

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Originally Posted by giovanni_hotel

As a kid I've seen skinny Black kids like Trayvon get beat down by their mother's(!), much less a grown man who outweighs him by 40#.

There's something to be said for some of you having an irrational fear of someone else's skin color.

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:werd: You hit it on the head, as I told Queen I don't see Trayvon as a threat, now the news said he was only 5'11 not no dam 6'3, see how they tried to make a monster out of him? A teen just going to the store they want to make him the killer when he's dead, how the fuck does that work?

Yep you nailed it, FEAR!!! Fear of a young African descent male because some others did crime. It goes deeper than that but I won't even comment cause some are not on that level.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hard4janira

The fact is black poeple are probably the most racist hate filled people in the country (not that whtie people aren't). I'm just saying that black people exhibit so much anger violence towards other races because they have MASSIVE inferiority complexes that they refuse to admit. Who else advocates the killing of Korean grocers because they are EARNING money in black neighborhoods? Black people are a fucking disaster area in America (I apologize to those of you who have actually clawed your way to respecabiltity - you get a bad rap but you're stuck in a barrel of rotten apples).

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Classic!!! the most pompous jack ass rhetoric yet, who can out do this person?

You said African descent people are the most racist? First off I don't us the word black to describe myself or my people, it's a foolish misnomer made up by Caucasian people who run this govt to classify us in a racial status so we're not black, we are African descent, or some perfer African american. Now that I got that out the way.

How dare you call my people the MOST RACIST in America? Are you fucking kidding me? If we were the most racist there would have been racial fights that would of lasted for 200 years.

Do you have a factual statistic showing African descent people are the most racist? Or is that her own personal opinion? I hope you have a statistic, because your personal is just that and it sounds foolish!!!

Do you even know what the real word RACISM MEANS? No it doesn't mean hate, hate means hate and that's it, to be a racist from the old dictionary not these new watered down ass dictionaries to beguile people in bullshit. If you look up the word hate, the word racism is not there, so the word hate can't mean racism, that shit makes no sense. If I hate cookies of every kind am I being a racist?

Give me the definition of a racist if you can, not this new modern shit, if you can't then I will correct you and type you a nice little educational note on real racism and why my people aren't. And you had the nerve to say "AND THE FACT IS......." That's no dam fact that's your personal opinion!!!

THEN YOU SAID THIS BULLSHIT!!! YES I HAD TO CALL IT BULLSHIT BECAUSE IT SMELLS LIKE BULLS SHIT!!!
"I'm just saying that black people exhibit so much anger violence towards other races because they have MASSIVE inferiority complexes that they refuse to admit."

Inferiority complex? Are you fucking kidding me ? LOL You don't even know the extent of why some African descent people are angry at Caucasians, don't say other races, it's mostly Caucasians. Since you said this, you never gave the reason why African descent people have an inferiority complex, you just said we do and that's it, you gave no history or scientific proof, nothing. And we are suppose to believe that? Give ten reasons why we have inferiority complexes, if you can.

I will respond to you.

Well the guy changed his story and said he wasn't sure who was yelling for help, but assumed it was zimmerman since he did see trayvon on top of him mma style beating him down. One could only assume that the person getting the crap beat out of them would be the one calling for help. I guess you can decide how that makes either of them look. Also, the police report says trayvon is 6'0 160 lbs and zimmerman is at 5'9 with no weight listed, but most news pages are listing him at 170 lbs.

Also, pic posted is related to this thread. Its Zimmerman after he got is ass beat lol kinda looks like a cholo to me

depraved indifference

I keep hearing many on this board make excuses for zimmerman but he is in the fight of his life for his life because the federal charge is the death penalty for this


Criminally Negligent Homicide


(or "depraved indifference") in the language of the indictment for second degree murder.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/politi...oAT_story.html


What this means is that the state is not attempting to prove that Zimmerman willfully murdered Trayvon Martin.


Instead they will set out to prove that -- by going after Trayvon with a loaded gun:


-- even after he had been reminded not to by the 911 operator


-- despite the proper protocols for any neighborhood watch program


-- despite zimmerman's own training in law enforcement



Zimmerman recklessly endangered Trayvon's life.


He WILLFULLY CREATED the circumstances where the gun was used.




In the absence of any eyewitness who had a clear view of the start of the fight,


or the firing of the gun.


Florida authorities wisely avoided the pitfalls of attempting to prove that Zimmerman willfully shot Trayvon in a situation where he had other options.


If the Jury believes that Zimmerman's actions willfully created a situation where he might well use his gun...




then he's guilty under the law.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AmyDaly

Also, the police report says trayvon is 6'0 160 lbs and zimmerman is at 5'9 with no weight listed, but most news pages are listing him at 170 lbs.

Also, pic posted is related to this thread. Its Zimmerman after he got is ass beat lol kinda looks like a cholo to me

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I just heard the report and I don't trust the police report because they have been fucking up ever since. Anytime they tell the public that clown Zimmerman is clean and comes to find out he's not I can'f fuck with Sanford dept, and to back me up that's why they want that chief or whatever the hell his position is to step down.
Here's what the medical examiner said, those the people I listen to in their report because they are thorough in their shit!!!

http://img1.imagehousing.com/62/8927...9b09df859b.jpg

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/20...ged-story?lite

Well if he wouldn't have gotten out of his SUV his ass wouldn't look like a cholo!!! You don't run up on people, even if you are a dam watchmen. Even when I trained as a security officer back in the day, unarmed, they told me to not engage to call police and have information about any suspects. That's what I would of done instead trying to be a dam hero.

From the other report he faces, life if convicted on 2nd degree murder, but since the race thing is now pertinent, if he is convicted of that HE WILL GET THE DEATH PENALTY FOR A RACE HATE CRIME KILLING!!! Which I don't think he will get, but if he was to get it, I WOULD BE IN TOTAL SHOCK!!! More likely he'll get life in prison or some time!!!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by natina

depraved indifference




(or "depraved indifference") in the language of the indictment for second degree murder.

Florida authorities wisely avoided the pitfalls of attempting to prove that Zimmerman willfully shot Trayvon in a situation where he had other options.


If the Jury believes that Zimmerman's actions willfully created a situation where he might well use his gun...

then he's guilty under the law.

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LOL.

Zimmerman may be 170# now after starving himself after going in seclusion for three months, but he wasn't 170# on the night of the altercation.

About the pic you posted Amy, this is one of the main reasons I think Trayvon decided to fight Zimmerman. With his shaved head and red jacket, after following Trayvon for three blocks, IMO this kid thought he was being run up on by a gang banger.
http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/att...1&d=1337504097

It's typical of gang members to ask 'who you with?' or 'what are you doing here?' when they're checking out strangers who they feel shouldn't be on their turf.

IMO at night Zimmerman looked just as threatening to Trayvon as Travyon erroneously looked to George Zimmerman.

To constitute depraved indifference, the defendant's conduct must be 'so wanton, so deficient in a moral sense of concern, so lacking in regard for the life or lives of others, and so blameworthy as to warrant the same criminal liability as that which the law imposes upon a person who intentionally causes a crime. Depraved indifference focuses on the risk created by the defendant’s conduct, not the injuries actually resulting.
In one case, People v Register, 60 NY2d 273, 469 NYS2d 599 (1983),while exploring the meaning of "depraved indifference recklessness" the Court of Appeals ruled that intoxication is not a defense or excuse to "depraved mind murder," although it may be to intentional murder. Its analysis started with distinguishing reckless manslaughter from the "depraved indifference recklessness" necessary for murder:
"to bring defendant’s conduct within the murder statute, the People were required to establish also that defendant’s act was imminently dangerous and presented a very high risk of death to others and that it was committed under circumstances which evidenced a wanton indifference to human life or a depravity of mind. . . . . The crime differs from intentional murder in that it results not from a specific, conscious intent to cause death, but from an indifference to or disregard of the risks attending defendant’s conduct." 60 NY2d at 274.





http://definitions.uslegal.com/d/depraved-indifference/

zimmerman is 250lbs


travon martin is 157lbs and skinny

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jamesedwards

Here's what the medical examiner said, those the people I listen to in their report because they are thorough in their shit!!!

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I tend to believe the medical examiner more as well, and yes, it does list him at 5'11 158 lbs on that report. In comparison to zimmerman, he is about 2 inches taller and 12 lbs lighter. Pretty negligible differences. The 7-11 video gives a good idea of the actual size of him compared to the clerk. It also looks like the coroners report also indicates 2 injuries on martin. His knuckles from punching zimmerman, and the gun shot wound that was made from being shot from inches apart.

Here is the coroners report: http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2012/im....pdf?hpt=hp_t1

Zimmerman lied claiming he was the one hollering for help a witness collaborated it then...

after information leaked that the voice forensically analyzed and it wasn't Zimmerman hollering for help the witness took back there story that it Zimmerman hollering for help Zimmerman caught in a lie cause he did not know the incident was being recorded on 911 tapes

* ZIMMERMAN IS A LIER
* ZIMMERMAN LIED ABOUT CRYING FOR HELP
** ZIMMERMAN LIED ABOUT CRYING FOR HELP HE DID NOT KNOW THE INCIDENT WAS BEING RECORDED

Zimmerman told police that he screamed for help during his confrontation with Martin, 17. He claims

lies coming back to haunt you and destroy your defense zimmerman

Trayvon Martin case 911 call: Screams not George Zimmerman's, 2 experts say

The voice heard crying for help on a 911 call just before Trayvon Martin was shot to death was not that of George Zimmerman, according to two forensic voice identification experts, one of whom told MSNBC on Sunday that he believes the evidence is strong enough to use in court.

"The tests concluded that it's not the voice of Mr. Zimmerman," Tom Owen, of Owen Forensic Services LLC and chair emeritus for the American Board of Recorded Evidence, told MSNBC.
Asked if he thought such tests would be admissible in court, Owen said "yes" and noted he had recently used similar testing in testimony at a Connecticut murder case that involved 911 call.

The voice heard crying for help on a 911 call just before Trayvon Martin was shot to death was not that of George Zimmerman, according to two forensic voice identification experts, one of whom told MSNBC on Sunday that he believes the evidence is strong enough to use in court.

"The tests concluded that it's not the voice of Mr. Zimmerman," Tom Owen, of Owen Forensic Services LLC and chair emeritus for the American Board of Recorded Evidence, told MSNBC.
Asked if he thought such tests would be admissible in court, Owen said "yes" and noted he had recently used similar testing in testimony at a Connecticut murder case that involved 911 call.
The conclusions of Owen and another audio expert were first reported by the Orlando Sentinel on Saturday.
Zimmerman told police that he screamed for help during his confrontation with Martin, 17. He claims the shooting was self-defense.
The 911 call, reposted in this YouTube clip, came on the night of Feb. 26 from a woman who reported someone crying out for help in a gated community in Sanford, Fla.
In the recording of her phone call, panicked cries and a gunshot are heard.

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/20...-2-experts-say

Key witness in Trayvon Martin shooting changed story
http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/20...ged-story?lite

Mary Cutcher, Witnesses in the Trayvon Martin, George Zimmerman Shooting
Expert Voice Analysists Say 911 Screams are NOT From Zimmerman - YouTube

Witness in Trayvon Martin murder fingers police
Witness in Trayvon Martin murder fingers police - YouTube

Quote:

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Originally Posted by natina

Zimmerman lied claiming he was the one hollering for help a witness collaborated it then...

after information leaked that the voice forensically analyzed and it wasn't Zimmerman hollering for help the witness took back there story that it Zimmerman hollering for help Zimmerman caught in a lie cause he did not know the incident was being recorded on 911 tapes

The voice heard crying for help on a 911 call just before Trayvon Martin was shot to death was not that of George Zimmerman, according to two forensic voice identification experts, one of whom told MSNBC on Sunday that he believes the evidence is strong enough to use in court.

---

ORLANDO, Florida (Reuters) - An FBI expert found crucial evidence in the Trayvon Martin case was inconclusive, saying it was impossible to tell if the voice screaming for help belonged to the black Florida teenager or his shooter George Zimmerman just before the neighborhood watch captain pulled the trigger.

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2...ated-community

Quote:

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Originally Posted by giovanni_hotel

Korean immigrants have been earmarked for special set-aside loans that allow them to open stores in impoverished Black communities, yet Black entrepreneurs who live in the same communities can't get a loan to open a hotdog cart. That's where the resentment comes from. Immigrants come into a Black ghetto, extract the wealth and then go home to their split level ranch home in the vanilla suburbs.

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First of all, even if this is true (which I find suspicious), it doesn't justity advocating thier killing in rap music does it? Or does it? What exactly is racism in your world? Another thing is this: Black people have no right whatsoever to complaining about special loans - what do you think the community reinvestment act was all about? The federal government stepped in and forced banks to make loans to sub-prime borrowers in 'under-represended' communities during the past two decades which partly led to the housing crisis we are suffering through now. Does this give me the right to advocate the killing of Blacks and Hispanics because they got foreclosed on and I have to pick up the tab through corporate bailouts and bailouts of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac which guaranteed those loans?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by giovanni_hotel

I assumed the Chinese grad students at USC were killed by gang violence, that's why it's not a major story because it's not new.

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So if I am a black male in a gang and I decide to target my victims because of thier race and systematiclly execute them then it's not worth making a big stink over because this shit happens all the time.... Holy fucking shit is this your logic? So if Zimmerman was in a gang (instead of a neighborhood watch program) then nobody would be following this story right? What difference does it make if somebody is in a gang or in the klu-klux-klan when they murder somebody? One cime is not worse than the other.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by giovanni_hotel

The Trayvon Martin case wouldn't be on the national radar if Zimmerman had been arrested in the beginning. His being able to walk after admitting to murdering an unarmed teen is why Trayvon's death became a 'cause'. It wasn't, ' oh, a Black kid was murdered, let's elevate his death into a national media story.'

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I agree w/ you to a point. I think an arrest may have been warranted in this case - but you are way off base using the word 'murder' as if Zimmerman is guilty and must be found guilty in court. He hasn't been convicted of jack shit yet and I suspect the absolute WORSE that should happen is a manslaughter charge (if that even).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by giovanni_hotel

'Black people are a fucking disaster area in America'???If you get a chance, Hard4janira, look up how many AA live in poverty, how many of them are working class and lower middle class, and how many of them are incarcerated.
Jesus Christ, the bile that comes out of your mouth like it's the God's honest truth.

Just wondering, do you consider yourself a racist?? And are you proud to be one??

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I know that a lot of black people are hard working folks just trying to make a living. But the fact that your community is by and large a disaster area is your own fault. Black men are failing thier community because they are not stepping up to the plate as strong leaders and father figures. You can spin it however you want but the black community will continue flounder until they start to develop stronger family units led by men.

I do think that the government is partly responsible for keeping minority familes broken due to the government programs that encourage poor choices. There is no penalty for having any number of kids out of wedlock or receiving benefits for raising your family as a single parent. The problem with this is that there is no incentive for a black male to stay with a woman and raise his children. The government will give her money in any case regardless. If you think this is silly, I suggest you google the man in Kentucky (I think in his 20's still) that has 30 children from 11 different women. What kind of human being is this, that has no regard for anything other than what hole he can stick is dick into and no thought given to how he can feed those hungry mouths. Talk about dumping your burden on society - how many of those 30 kids were born on Medicaid do you think?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stavros

On the other hand, MalcolmX would have said that America was a disaster for Black people; anyway both you and he are wrong. Aside from the fact that Americans come from diverse origins, and are of course all equally American, you seem to be saying that the development of the US economy would have taken the course it has in spite of, not because of the presence of slavery in your country. That is simply absurd, as absurd as me arguing that India, Australia, New Zealand and Canada have been irrelevant to the development of the United Kingdom. You could be given a list of people in literature, in music, in sport, in culture, in politics all of whom trace their roots to Africa though slavery, all of whom should make you proud to be an American. But I cannot tell you what to think or feel, and there isn't much more I can say if you have already made up your mind. There is good and bad in all societies, a tired cliche I know, but it matters if one group of people are isolated from the rest, because in America that runs counter to the very principle of equality and individual liberty on which your state is based.

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With all due respect, there isn't one black person living in this country who has been enslaved. Nor thier parents, nor thier parents parents, nor thier parents, parents, parents. I'm not suggesting that black people have always had equal opportunity. They haven't, but they certianly haven't made the most of the opportunity that they DO HAVE. Black communities in America are a disaster area - this a fact that is not open to debate. Just look at the % of black men in prison and tell me otherwise. We could go on all day about the reasons why (and I don't really care to) but that doesn't mean you should't acknowledge the problem. Black people actually CAN fix the problems internally, by having stronger familes and have a commitment to education that you see in white and asian familes. If you had this, the black community would clean itself up in 2 generations. And being 'poor' has nothing to do with it. Poor asians flood into this country all the time. They work hard, take nothing from the government, focus on education and bam - thier kids are the valedictorians going to med school. It's a fact.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AmyDaly

I tend to believe the medical examiner more as well, and yes, it does list him at 5'11 158 lbs on that report. In comparison to zimmerman, he is about 2 inches taller and 12 lbs lighter. Pretty negligible differences. The 7-11 video gives a good idea of the actual size of him compared to the clerk. It also looks like the coroners report also indicates 2 injuries on martin. His knuckles from punching zimmerman, and the gun shot wound that was made from being shot from inches apart.

Here is the coroners report: http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2012/im....pdf?hpt=hp_t1

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I know he had injuries it's also said either he did punch Zimmerman or those injuries came from him trying to get away. Zimmerman has a little nick scratch on the top of his nose that's not consistent to Tray's hand injuries, because if Zimmerman has one cut on his face which isn't even an inch and Tray has two scares on each hand, the sum of that equation doesn't match up. So he may have got those on his hand trying to get away.

But from here on out I don't trust anything the Police dept in Sanford say they lost credibility with me mistakes ago. They handled that case terribly and I wonder why they are still in business. In light of this case the police dept past is haunting them at the same time. A can of worms have opened up on them.

At this time those who said the prosecution's case is diminishing, is not the case! It's a lie. The funny thing is the new charge brought on Zimmerman that wasn't there before is a racial crime and could get if convicted the death penalty is crazy because if he really wasn't racist this wouldn't have came up, and it looks like he won't get convicted of that but 2snd degree murder he probably will. Like I said if he gets convicted of the hate crime murder I would be in shock. A whole new can of worms opened up on Zimmerman with the employee saying Zimmerman made fun of him on the job dissing him about the middle eastern terrorist thingy then he got fired by HR because he kept calling them like a lunatic. All this is showing he is a crazy character, a lunatic at best. The the African descent woman that said he is a racist, as time goes on more is opening up on him. Nothing is looking good for him he has a dark past. Tray was 17 was only that 17 he has only been on the earth a short time and don't have much to make him out to be a monster. They tried but it's not going to work.

If those experts show professionally that it was Trayvon screaming that again is a plus and shows he feared for his life. It really looks bad for Zimmerman because he is on record lying that IT WAS HIM! If that happens and they bring in a couple of more experts and they say it was Trayvon yelling it's over for Zimmerman. Prosecutors job will be to show Zimmerman has no credibility and that he is a liar and if that shows he lied it's over for him. Once you tell one lie it's a wrap. Never mind what the mother and father say of Trayvon and Zimmerman's dad said, the experts with years of service and able to prove with a ratio of over 90% accuracy is going to bust Zimmerman in his head and the defense will fall apart. But we have to see.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AmyDaly

ORLANDO, Florida (Reuters) - An FBI expert found crucial evidence in the Trayvon Martin case was inconclusive, saying it was impossible to tell if the voice screaming for help belonged to the black Florida teenager or his shooter George Zimmerman just before the neighborhood watch captain pulled the trigger.

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2...ated-community

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Wrong, voice recognition can find out who's voice that is. What happens is the voice is taken from the different phones of people that called the police. You record/sample a part where the caller isn't talking and all you need is a small part. You take that sample time stretch analyze it to a good length, then there is compression filter equipment and software that can filter out the noise of any back ground noise, once that's established you will see a graph of the stress levels of the voice. It will be visible and audio able. Get Zimmerman to yell since he claimed he was the one yelling, sample his voice and analyze it, the voice is like a finger print every voice has a different signature than another person. That's how it's done so it can be done I don't know what the hell the FBI is talking about. I said this before the 2 experts said it was Tray's voice, I said here they need to do a voice recognition test.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by giovanni_hotel
Korean immigrants have been earmarked for special set-aside loans that allow them to open stores in impoverished Black communities, yet Black entrepreneurs who live in the same communities can't get a loan to open a hotdog cart. That's where the resentment comes from. Immigrants come into a Black ghetto, extract the wealth and then go home to their split level ranch home in the vanilla suburbs.

---

Very good point, people from Inida, Arabs, Korean, Chinese, Japanese, etc open up in African descent communities and live. There are so many Korean or Chinese restaurants it's ridiculous, and they are filthy. Roaches, cats, rats etc all around the food, food cooked in the same grease, but if you go and watch what they eat, they don't eat what they sell us. I don't eat from any of those stores and our own people need to stop shopping at those stores, yes they are angry but stop being angry organize and stop eating out of these filthy stores and manage our money. If we wanted our own stores in our own communities like we had back in the day it could happen and wouldn't even need a loan, a person could go in get the price of the place come back pay for it and then rock, and turning over money in our hood. In so called Jewish communties their money turns over in their community 4 times our community NONE!!! We get the cash and it's gone into another community hands.

That's why I don't use the status black, because we can't get certain benefits, and I am telling my people stop using this term in everyday life and applications. Those that are of other cultures get more benefits than we do, you can have a west Indian who roots is straight from African and is darker than you are, when he comes here he doesn't put down black on an application he puts other, and I use to wonder why. Now I know why because it's about words of art and law and status and classification identification status. That's why this govt was so hell bent on classifying us and getting the NAACP to pick a classification for African descent people and those fools picked black.

But the main issue African Americans are angry at Caucasians per say is slavery that has been a mental issue and the govt knows this. The effects of slavery has been handed down from generation to generation and this is well documented. Most Caucasian won't understand this and I don't expect them to, but those Caucasians who are available to test this knows this is one of the big reasons, the govt does too. But on a scale like someone said African descent people are THE MOST RACIST in America I told that person prove it, show me the old definition for racism not this new watered down definition of racism. African descent people can hate another race, prejudge another race but can't be racist, being a racist is not just hating another race, the old definition of racism tells the real deal. Hate is Hate. If anyone can go get the definition of hate and show me where the word racism is of it's meaning and synonymous to it I will acknowledge it, and I am still waiting for that person to give me an answer.

hard4janira

Quote:

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With all due respect, there isn't one black person living in this country who has been enslaved. Nor thier parents, nor thier parents parents, nor thier parents, parents, parents.

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This is untrue on so many historical levels it's not even worth going into. Maybe you need to do some academic studies not online studying on slavery of the middle passage from Africa to the Americas. No scholar, professor or Doctor of the field and study of slavery would agree with you. Did you even know the Constitution still allows slavery? THIS DAY IN 2012!!! Let me give you some knowledge, there is a physical slavery and a mental slavery, mental slavery is more dangerous than physical slavery and I will leave it at that.

Quote:

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I'm not suggesting that black people have always had equal opportunity. They haven't, but they certianly haven't made the most of the opportunity that they DO HAVE.

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This absolutely makes no sense, if in one hand you say African descent people haven't had EQUAL OPPS then in the next hand you say they haven't made the most of OPPS, how in the world can you tell if there hasn't been equality? There's no logic to that at all!! Do you even read the things you say? SMH Ever since Martin L. King sign that document to be assimilated in this country African descent lost their businesses and the communities, now go back and look at history. I am from Harlem and I remember our communities had lots of African descent own stores, then I seen a change happen where we were losing our communities and businesses and immigrants started coming in.

Quote:

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Black communities in America are a disaster area - this a fact that is not open to debate. Just look at the % of black men in prison and tell me otherwise. We could go on all day about the reasons why (and I don't really care to) but that doesn't mean you should't acknowledge the problem.

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Wow!!! Statistically Caucasians commit more crimes than African descent people, that's a fact, yet there are more African descent in jail, 70% !!! And that's why. A lot of African Americans are getting out of jail who have done over 15 years for a crime they never committed by DNA which wasn't around in earlier times, and I got every African America that has gotten out of Jail from DNA justice even black Panthers Geronimo Pratt!!! So I wonder how many are really in there that didn't commit a crime hum? African Americans getting shot without weapons, Amedo Dialo was an honor student who parents came from Africa over here, he got shot 41 times for no dam reason by Caucasian cops in the entrance to where he lived. How does that work? Yes there are African Americans killing one another, so are Chinese, Hispanics, Caucasians etc, there is good and bad in each nation. I acknowledge a problem alright and I know just who it is.

Quote:

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Black people actually CAN fix the problems internally, by having stronger familes and have a commitment to education that you see in white and asian familes. If you had this, the black community would clean itself up in 2 generations. And being 'poor' has nothing to do with it. Poor asians flood into this country all the time. They work hard, take nothing from the government, focus on education and bam - thier kids are the valedictorians going to med school. It's a fact.

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:whoa It's funny that I can't find anything to agree with you on. But I can with just one thing, African descent people can fix the problems but every time we do here comes the govt to break that up, why do you think every time we get a strong African descent leader THEY ARE FREAKIN KILLED!!!
Lets say there is a community of 10,000 of African descent people, not one African descent own business in that area, Korean or Chinese food shops own businesses and don't hire not ONE African descent person from that community. From the five boroughs of NEW YORK I have never seen in 20 years one Chinese or Korean food shop hire my people. And no one says nothing, I notice it that's why I don't support it besides the nasty unhealthy food. Lets say we boycott them so bad they move out, we get a store of our own, within 2 years the govt will hike the prices some how on that business it will be down before it even started. Then the next Chinese shop will pop up. This is how the Govt gets down African descent farmers are treated unfair to Caucasian counter parts and I can go into that but I won't you get it.

You said poor Asians come here and take nothing from the Govt and set up shop? Let me ask you, how does a POOR person who has nothing end up with a business in a community of people that are not of them and make thousands upon thousands of dollars without the Govt giving them anything? POOR is what you said, a poor person has absolutely no ends. You explain that to us logically and with proof please, I gotta see this.

The way you talk you think there is some magic wand and throw sprinkles over people heads and everything is good. Education? Are you freaking serious? Every time there is a cut where do they hit first? EDUCATION!!! It's a plan you fuck up education then you keep those who are poor, POOR !!! The education in this country is watered down and basically not really teaching my people who they really are but the Caucasian's history, I can go into how that destroys the mental but I am not. Another thing, education for my people is so crazy it's CRAZY!!! When the Govt seen that more African descent people were heading for college, what they do? RAISE THE PRICES!!! See you're not going in depth to what's going on, you don't see the real picture and who the dam puppet master is!!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jamesedwards

hard4janira



This is untrue on so many historical levels it's not even worth going into. Maybe you need to do some academic studies not online studying on slavery of the middle passage from Africa to the Americas. No scholar, professor or Doctor of the field and study of slavery would agree with you. Did you even know the Constitution still allows slavery? THIS DAY IN 2012!!! Let me give you some knowledge, there is a physical slavery and a mental slavery, mental slavery is more dangerous than physical slavery and I will leave it at that.



This absolutely makes no sense, if in one hand you say African descent people haven't had EQUAL OPPS then in the next hand you say they haven't made the most of OPPS, how in the world can you tell if there hasn't been equality? There's no logic to that at all!! Do you even read the things you say? SMH Ever since Martin L. King sign that document to be assimilated in this country African descent lost their businesses and the communities, now go back and look at history. I am from Harlem and I remember our communities had lots of African descent own stores, then I seen a change happen where we were losing our communities and businesses and immigrants started coming in.




Wow!!! Statistically Caucasians commit more crimes than African descent people, that's a fact, yet there are more African descent in jail, 70% !!! And that's why. A lot of African Americans are getting out of jail who have done over 15 years for a crime they never committed by DNA which wasn't around in earlier times, and I got every African America that has gotten out of Jail from DNA justice even black Panthers Geronimo Pratt!!! So I wonder how many are really in there that didn't commit a crime hum? African Americans getting shot without weapons, Amedo Dialo was an honor student who parents came from Africa over here, he got shot 41 times for no dam reason by Caucasian cops in the entrance to where he lived. How does that work? Yes there are African Americans killing one another, so are Chinese, Hispanics, Caucasians etc, there is good and bad in each nation. I acknowledge a problem alright and I know just who it is.



:whoa It's funny that I can't find anything to agree with you on. But I can with just one thing, African descent people can fix the problems but every time we do here comes the govt to break that up, why do you think every time we get a strong African descent leader THEY ARE FREAKIN KILLED!!!
Lets say there is a community of 10,000 of African descent people, not one African descent own business in that area, Korean or Chinese food shops own businesses and don't hire not ONE African descent person from that community. From the five boroughs of NEW YORK I have never seen in 20 years one Chinese or Korean food shop hire my people. And no one says nothing, I notice it that's why I don't support it besides the nasty unhealthy food. Lets say we boycott them so bad they move out, we get a store of our own, within 2 years the govt will hike the prices some how on that business it will be down before it even started. Then the next Chinese shop will pop up. This is how the Govt gets down African descent farmers are treated unfair to Caucasian counter parts and I can go into that but I won't you get it.

You said poor Asians come here and take nothing from the Govt and set up shop? Let me ask you, how does a POOR person who has nothing end up with a business in a community of people that are not of them and make thousands upon thousands of dollars without the Govt giving them anything? POOR is what you said, a poor person has absolutely no ends. You explain that to us logically and with proof please, I gotta see this.

The way you talk you think there is some magic wand and throw sprinkles over people heads and everything is good. Education? Are you freaking serious? Every time there is a cut where do they hit first? EDUCATION!!! It's a plan you fuck up education then you keep those who are poor, POOR !!! The education in this country is watered down and basically not really teaching my people who they really are but the Caucasian's history, I can go into how that destroys the mental but I am not. Another thing, education for my people is so crazy it's CRAZY!!! When the Govt seen that more African descent people were heading for college, what they do? RAISE THE PRICES!!! See you're not going in depth to what's going on, you don't see the real picture and who the dam puppet master is!!

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pay that Nut Case no mind, he knows that you are educated thats why he keeps fucking with you