Which lunatic in this country actually forecast the North East to remain? The mind boggles!
I was surprised by the result although everyone I know voted to leave. Good riddance to the "millionaires club".
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Which lunatic in this country actually forecast the North East to remain? The mind boggles!
I was surprised by the result although everyone I know voted to leave. Good riddance to the "millionaires club".
I sincerely hope this decision won't be as regretful as it seems now to be. :(
No, it is worse! I hated the phrase that lots of people came out with "I'm not racist but ..". Racism was a major element in many people's voting. We now become Little England and the establishment (a nasty part than it had before) takes control.Quote:
Originally Posted by trish
With Sterling down 10% it should be good for London tourism.
If you work for Barclays or HSBC, not so good.
Beyond that, anyone who says they know is simply guessing.
I know where Martin48 is coming from, we have the EDF & their friends over here but ordinary people are concerned about jobs and falling wages. They are not racists!
There was a left wing group led by the Socialist labour party called "Lexit"; of course, they weren't invited to take part in any live televised debates due to the "far right" media in this country ignoring them.
They stood up against EU austerity, privatisation policies and free movement of capital amongst other things.
When Cameron was elected he was obsessed with the UK's National debt. Well; now we can pay it all off(£157bn) within 9 weeks with the £170m we will be saving every week. Difficult decisions my eye!
It's only fallen by 7% now, already risen by 3%!Quote:
Originally Posted by flabbybody
Maths was never my strong point, but I wish that were the case. Even taking the now accepted (US) definition of a billion as 1000 million, 170m for 9 weeks "only" comes to 1.53bn...:(Quote:
Originally Posted by peejaye
I didn't say anything because this is the type of decision that is really tough to evaluate if you do not live in UK and experience firsthand the costs and benefits of EU membership. My sense is that people were well aware of the costs of membership but the benefits of being in the EU are hard to evaluate until later (benefits of status quo can easily be taken for granted). It's not the initial shock that will tell whether this is a good decision, but ten years down the road, when we see what investment activity looks like and if the UK loses its triple A credit rating (S&P says it will) whether it can regain it.
I watched an interview with Corbyn shortly after the vote last night, and he did not seem too disturbed by the result. That's my honest appraisal of his reaction....not trying to lay blame on him, but he's unaware of impressions and probably does not realize that such a reaction only strengthens the perception that he was not committed to the remain campaign.
But peejaye, who do you think is going to benefit from this result if not millionaires? Someone I know has spent most of the day on the phone with his broker buying stock at bargain prices. The only way you will become a millionaire is when it costs a million to buy a pint of milk!Quote:
Originally Posted by peejaye
The left has never had a coherent position on Europe, because it cannot decide amongst itself what a 'revolutionary' strategy looks like. Corbyn and the left of the Labour Party were opposed to the Common Market/EU from the moment the European Communities Act was passed in 1972, and it was only because they lost one election after another to the Tories that they had to find common cause with the Labour moderates, and found it in the social chapter of the Single Market as presented to them by (Socialist) Jacques Delors at the Party Conference in 1986. In his heart, Corbyn is delighted with the result, because for his group, the EU is a capitalist club and the key battleground is Britain where we can elect and de-elect governments and build 'socialism in one country', if not using the same methods as Stalin (though one does wonder about that at times).Quote:
Originally Posted by peejaye
By contrast, the Italian Trotskyist, Toni Negri who was an influential intellectual figure in the workers strikes in the 1970s and 1980s in northern Italy before being tainted with Red Brigade violence (which he had nothing to do with), sees globalization as a positive moment in capitalism that has brought workers across the world together in a common fight where before they had been isolated and defeated by host governments (his arguments are in the book Empire co-written with Michael Hardt, published in 2000).
In the UK the bleak reality is that Labour is falling to pieces and Corbyn cannot survive much longer, as if that mattered. The question is if we have a General Election in October will UKIP mop up Labour seats and become the main opposition, which is their current ambition?
But events are moving fast and we have to watch the newsfeeds and not panic...
The wealthier someone is the easier it is to withstand a financial shock or a decrease in the nominal value of their stock portfolio. It's much harder to tell someone who has savings from 5 decades of hard work tied up in a stock portfolio that the market will correct or that a ten percent overnight decrease in their net worth is just an overreaction of the market. As you indicate volatility presents a risk but also an opportunity for people with lots of capital.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stavros
No one knows what will happen. People are sick of the way this country as been ran by wealthy public schoolboys for so long. Especially up here in the North of England.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stavros
Don't panic, chill out and enjoy the footy.
I'm not shedding too many tears for wealthy Brits. Thanks to BREXIT they'll be much fewer of them
I guess of one thing both the Leave and the Remain camp positively can agree on, and that is that Cameron is a complete and utter twat.
One thing I found interesting about this process is the demand for politicians to resign out of honor. An American politician could be a corpse and would still be grasping the reins of power until there was a formal impeachment process:).Quote:
Originally Posted by chupapau
Now the right wing wackos in France have been emboldened
Welcome to FREXIT.
Goodbye EU
The French vote in two phases in an exhaustive ballot, on the second run if there is a straight rub-off between Le Pen and the Conservative or Socialist candidate, the French will unite to keep Le Pen and her party out of government.Quote:
Originally Posted by flabbybody
24 hours after the referendum result the situation is not clear, and is not going to be clear for some time.
In the UK-
-Cameron has said he will not lead negotiations on Article 50 of the Lisbon Treaty and the assumption is that the new leader of the Conservative Party will do it. But it remains an assumption because the Tories are deeply divided on the EU and it is not clear if the person they choose in early October will command the respect of the House. Boris Johnson may appear the logical candidate, but while popular in the party, he has no popularity in the Parliamentary party he has only been a member of since 2015, and there are no outstanding candidates to replace David Cameron who are also from the Brexit faction, and no 'unity' candidates either, unless Theresa May is thought the 'safest' pair of hands who will appeal to both sides of the divided party.
-In such cases a vote of No Confidence could well force the new leader to call a General Election, if not in October then in November, maybe even on the Thursday following the US Presidential election.
-The problem with this is that in the current state of the country, a general election result may not produce a House of Commons with one party in overall control. On current evidence the Scottish National Party would remain the main party in Scotland, but while I don't see Labour regaining any of its seats there, the powerful performance of Scottish Tory leader Ruth Davidson could see the Tories win some seats in Scotland, complicating any moves to a new referendum there on Independence.
But with Labour so weak as a party -and as with the Tories we don't know who will lead the party if Corbyn is ousted at the September party conference- and having lost so many votes to the UKIP position, the nightmare scenario is of a Commons where the two largest parties are the Conservatives and the Scottish National Party with Labour and UKIP making up the rest but no consensus on how to form a government or who should be in it. Even if there is no general election, and even if there is and the Tories are the largest party, just as it was Parliament that took the UK into the Common Market, Parliament must vote on the exit and could either reject it outright, or as is more likely, have to vote on key provisions which in some cases may not meet the demands of UKIP or some Tories for a 'complete break' with the EU.
-For example, last night Daniel Hannan, Conservative MEP made it clear on the BBC Newsnight programme that he did not want the UK to leave the single market and that this also means retaining the right of free movement of labour. To his gobsmacked interviewer he had to explain the new arrangement would not allow free movement of citizens, but free movement of Labour would not be a problem. If UKIP were to be a force in the Commons would this pragmatic compromise be acceptable?
-An additional problem is that the markets do not like uncertainty, but that it what we will have for next six months and as this also has an impact on other economies, the EU may try to force the pace of the UK's exit, although I am not sure how they can do this as I don't believe they can force a UK government to take action on Article 50. Either way, the Bank of England may indeed have to spend some or even all of its £250bn contingency fund to prop up the pound and the banks. But what happens if all that money is spent and there is no sign of stable government with coherent policies?
-There is a claim that Brexit never expected to win, and that is why they have no plan and the Tory leaders of it are calling for Article 50 to be delayed rather than be invoked right now. The long-term status of Scotland, Northern Ireland and Gibraltar must also be dealt with, while a petition calling for a second referendum to be held with a threshold of legitimacy at a turnout of 75% and vote either way of at least 65% has received 100,000 signatures so must be debated in Parliament. Meanwhile, it appears all other business in the Commons has ground to a halt and that the EU will be the only issue on the agenda for the foreseeable future.
-In other words, the referendum is over, the trading has yet to begin, but nobody knows what is being traded, or who is going to lead the talks. One imagines Boris Johnson morphing into Oliver Hardy and whacking his old Etonian rival Laurel Cameron over the head as he explodes- Here's another fine mess you've got me into!
Thank you for the update Stavros...I think
As Churchill stated: "Democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the others"
As expected, every day brings a new cluster of developments most of which appear to show that the 'popular vote' -as in, voted for by the people- has become the most unpopular (as in, don't like, wish it hadn't happened) vote in living memory.
-The crisis in Labour has taken a new twist as shadow Cabinet MP Hillary Benn has been sacked for trying to organise a leadership coup against Corbyn, Heidi Alexander another shadow Cabinet MP has resigned, some others expected to follow this weekend, with Corbyn's leadership on the line at a meeting of the Parliamentary Labour Party next Tuesday.
-As expected, Theresa May is emerging as the 'stop Boris' candidate in the Tory party, and while Chancellor George Osborne's political ambitions are now dust, he is probably being asked not to resign as turmoil on the markets is expected to start again on Monday and if he resigns that will send a message to the markets that the government has lost control of economic and fiscal policy making.
-Anna Soubry, the Conservative government's small business minister, has said Boris Johnson never believed in an 'independent Britain' outside the EU but joined the Leave campaign to get one over on David Cameron not expecting Leave to win.
-The Independent neatly summaries the issues the Leave campaign said were of cardinal importance that have been magically dismissed, as summed up with staggering and insulting arrogance by an arrogant and insulting Tory Liam Fox (who was sacked as Defence Minister a few years ago for running an independent foreign policy unit in his department):
“A lot of things were said in advance of this referendum that we might want to think about again,” said the Conservative former Defence Minister Liam Fox.
Thus:
-the immigration issue was not that important, as free movement of labour will carry on, if the EU allows the UK to remain in the single market;
-applying for Article 50 terms of withdrawal need not happen soon, if ever (which is the implication made by Liam Fox);
-Nigel Farage also told Good Morning Britain that the claim written on the side of the Vote Leave Battle Bus – that leaving the EU would release £350m a week that could be spent on the NHS – was "a mistake". "It wasn’t one of my adverts," he said.
The petition for a second referendum has now acquired more than 2 million signatures and will be debated but at the moment it looks unlikely to materialise into a second referendum.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...s-7103076.html
Meanwhile Donald Trump in Scotland has been seen entertaining Rupert Murdoch...I wonder which one of them has made the most money from the UK stock market's bargain basement sales?
The poor and ignorant, as usual, have lost the most. The result of over 2 decades of spin, has spun out of control.
Democracy is a responsibility, do never cast your vote lightly, and always look further than the candidates arguments. The millions of people who fought and died for this right deserve it. Just an advice for the US voters, coming autumn.
WTF are all you people talking about? Can someone please explain to me what exactly; ordinary, working class people, like myself have lost exactly? I would like facts, not speculation. Simple English would be appreciated.
Respect democracy, the majority have spoken.
Quote:
Originally Posted by peejaye
the future
Ordinary people like you have lost what we all have lost -political stability.Quote:
Originally Posted by peejaye
A year ago a General Election produced a Conservative government with a mandate to rule for five years, by the end of this year we may have a coalition government because both of the main parties are in disarray with no known leader in the Conservative Party identified as the next Prime Minister and the Labour leader's position under intense challenge; and in two or five years time we may have lost Scotland from the Union in which case the UK as you and I know it will also have been lost.
I don't see how any new leader of the Conservative Party can just assume the position of Prime Minister, and we don't know how the exit from the UK will be negotiated, who will do it, or even what issues are going to be on the agenda, as nobody from the Leave campaign thought to write them down. With Scotland in more or less open rebellion and discontent in Northern Ireland threatening to re-open old wounds there, I am surprised that you cannot see that we have lost that degree of stability we had a year ago, even if you did not like either a Tory government or Corbyn as leader of Labour.
This week we may find financial instability added to the political instability, and you as a tax-payer will lose with regard to the value of your pension (or pension fund if you are still working), you will lose out if you have a holiday in continental Europe where a weaker pound means higher prices, and while some financial stability will return at some time we may be left with an economy that investors have no confidence in supporting which in the long term means ordinary people losing their jobs.
If the Leave campaign were able to give us an idea of what it is that in reality we have gained, then my answer might be different, but until Article 50 is invoked and we see what is on the negotiating table we will not have a concrete idea of what we have lost and gained, which leaves us with the situation where this morning Farage could glibly admit that there will be a recession, as if even a minor recession in his terms was no big deal, so you can add to the loss of political stability, financial stability, and confidence in the British economy, a loss of intelligence. But that is not why I do not have a headless chicken for supper. In view of the lies we were told by the Leave campaign, pork pies it is.
You haven't lost anything. You've just changed things. Whether the changes are for better or worse, at least in the more immediate future, only time will tell.Quote:
Originally Posted by peejaye
You will hear all types of hyperbole, but with this vote you neither created heaven nor the apocalypse. It will just be different. It might even change the face of the UK in the future, but you'll survive it and move on.
The reality is, with a vote this close, you'll hear a lot of horse shit...for a long time.
Anyway, for better or worse, what's done is done...now move along and make it work.
I'm sure you will.
Scotland (Northern Ireland and unsurprisingly Gibraltar) all voted overwhelmingly to remain. In Scotland's case 62:38 in favour of remaining.
Now, browsing the BBC News website, I came across this article.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...itics-36633244
Nicola Sturgeon says MSPs at Holyrood could veto Brexit
"Scotland's First Minister Nicola Sturgeon has told the BBC that Holyrood could try to block the UK's exit from the EU."
I have no idea if this is even feasible. From reading the article it would appear not and that she was manouvered into making the comment by some "decidedly adept questioning". However, it does fuel the flames that the UK is no longer a politically "United" country, despite the result of the Scottish independence referendum.
On Thursday afternoon it cost me $1.50 to buy one Pound Sterling on the spot New York foreign exchange market. On Friday morning it was worth $1.35
Everything that is not created in your own country will cost you much more, from iPhones to French wine.
An American company with British holdings has suffered a one day loss in asset value that has occurred only a few times in modern economic history. Future UK investment is on permanent hold. In the world of finance your once proud island nation has become toxic.
I can go on but I won't
It is about timing, Fred, because in the long term your pragmatic view may prevail, and the UK will adjust and survive, but in the short to medium term we don't know if that will include Scotland and Northern Ireland, and in the short term in particular the uncertainty over our government spooks the markets, and raises questions among those who might have been thinking of investing in the UK, setting up long term problems of economic growth, or slower growth than we would want. The Brexit argument often conceded that it could take 10 years to re-calibrate the economy, but that could be the last best 10 years of my life, or the 10 years in which a university graduate ought to be developing a professional career, or a school-leaver learning a trade and starting a family, but a decade of high unemployment, high interest rates (or negative interest rates), inflation, low growth, low opportunity, and a generally moribund mood. It is a pessimistic view, but that is not surprising when you look at the people who got us into this mess, people who do not encourage me to think the new arrangements will be better than what we had last week.Quote:
Originally Posted by fred41
I believe Britain will renegotiate a new treaty with the EU in order to stay in. They don't want to see the break up of the UK with Scotland seeking full independence and Northern Ireland seeking a border union with the Irish Republic. Neither would they want to see a domino effect of others pulling out of the EU. Brexit voters will learn they have been duped especially those who voted on immigration and payments to the EU
Thanks Fred, I think your views are realistic.
Stavros; I asked for facts, not speculation or your own personal views but thanks anyway.
I don't regard this country or this government as stable, I never have for the last 5/6 years. Public money as been shared out between the Politicians and their wealthy friends for far too long. One disaster after another. Look at the selling of Royal Mail, undersold by millions and the West Coast rail franchise; £40m pissed against the wall by these arseholes, no one battered an eyelid. Business as usual! Disgrace!
There; that's my views; for what it's worth.
I look forward to the future now this countries biggest arsehole as resigned. Boris Johnson will not be the next leader of the Conservatives so anyone else is better than what we had.
Stavros; I asked for facts, not speculation or your own personal views but thanks anyway.
-At this stage, Peejaye, most of the facts you want are still speculations, but you could consider the speculations on the markets with regard to the pound and the value of companies, it at least gives you a sense of how both markets in the UK and world-wide are reacting, because for example, the vote on the EU by impacting on Sterling, has now had an impact on the Yen the Japanese were not expecting, just one example of the reality of globalization and how a crisis that began in the UK could spread through Europe and the rest of the world.
You may have little sympathy for the banking sector, so the report that Investment banks have reacted immediately to Britain’s referendum result, with some of the City’s largest institutions approaching regulators to secure licences and lining up executives to relocate (Ireland or Germany seem to be favoured destinations) may not surprise you, but investment banks do invest, and not just in UK property and their assets are part of the UK's total capital assets and are a source of tax revenue for the government. Given the inherent problems in the UK economy of low productivity and a persistent trade deficit, it is hardly surprising that investors around the world do not see an exit from the EU at this stage as a positive move, but hey, when you are 64 maybe they will have changed their mind about the UK.
The quote above it from this article-
http://www.cnbc.com/2016/06/26/finan...f-britain.html
The Financial Times wrote an interesting piece on sterling when it fell in February, many of the arguments still hold, just as its review of the sectors of the economy -small businesses, farmers- reveals who the winners and losers were thought to be in February this year.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/caf3e77e-d...#axzz4CmGSjBlq
Day 6 of BREXIT. We survived.... the world did not end.
On Monday I bought shares of Barclays and Vodafone
I'm back to my normal routine of debauchery. God save the Queen
Jeremy Corbyn the exception of course.Quote:
Originally Posted by broncofan
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articl...r-party-leader
I'm not a Brit, just to be clear...
Seems to me though, that all the speculative BS, from the most elated hurrahs to the deepest doom and gloom, is just a lot of rehash of the same old economic theologies. Why the economic focus? Isn't this really more about social issues? Too much foreign influence etc...? Culture clash & culture shock? Yada yada them v us? England never was part of the eurozone anyway, was it? So why would anything economic be happening regardless of brexit or because of it?
As an aside:
Will everyone have to show a passport to 'bark (em & de) the "chunnel" now? Visas?
Can the Welchers, Scotch, or Ulsteranians opt out of brexit? Maybe even join the eurozone on their own?
Passport thing has to be worked out. I'm guessing Brussels will inflict as much pain as possible and that would include the indignity of requiring traveling Brits to show papers.
Scots and Northern Ireland are gone. Scotland will vote for a breakaway referendum and apply for EU membership as an independent nation. Northern Ireland will join the EU via unification with The Irish Republic.
Whales?...unless you're a a Tom Jones fan, who gives a fuck.
For Americans who confuse the terms England and U.K. it will no long matter. The two will be one and the same.
This post is a response to those by Hippifried and Flabbybody above-
First, on passports -most continental Europeans have identity cards, which means that while someone from France can drive north to Amsterdam without carrying a passport, they will normally have an official ID card to show if they are stopped (as well as a driving licence and so on). Because we do not have ID cards in the UK we tend to travel with a passport, even though in theory I do not need a passport to travel from London to Paris as long as I have some form of identity to prove that I am Stavros rather than claim I am Napoleon Bonaparte. The main difference if the UK leaves the EU will be that at international borders citizens of the UK will not be able to pass through 'EU Passports' so that if flying from London to Paris I will have to line up alongside Americans, Canadians, the Chinese etc to go through passport control. We will also have to print new passports as the ones we have now have 'European Union' on the cover.
Second, the impact on the UK economy of Brexit will take some years to take effect, because that is how economies work. The underlying weakness of the UK economy means that we are not prepared for Brexit, literally in the sense that neither the existing government nor the Leave campaign ever had a contingency plan or indeed, any plan at all, other than the Bank of England's contingency fund to shore up banks should they come under pressure, and also because the UK economy is fundamentally weak -with London the exception to prove the rule as I have pointed out in posts in other threads.
Productivity in the UK is at an all time low and is I believe the lowest in the advanced economies of the G7 and has been for many years. 20 years ago our deficit on manufactured trade was running at around 1.5% whereas these days it is around 5% which exacerbates our balance of payments deficit and increases the burden of foreign debt. The instant attacks on the Stock Market last week were the first sign that investors did not have confidence in the UK economy as a result of the Referendum vote, but while markets have stabilized, it is a mistake to read this as if the panic was over, because the FTSE100 is made up of the large multi-national corporations whose assets and operations are global,.
By contrast, if you look at the performance of the FTSE 250 List which is made up mostly of British companies, the picture is gloomy as stock on this market fell by 13.6% in the first week of trading and has only recovered by 5%. The impact on UK firms has been spelled out thus:
Banks, house builders and travel stocks have borne the brunt of the pain because they are the most sensitive to the UK economy. Shawbrook, Aldermore, Onesavings Bank and Virgin Money have all lost between 40pc and 50pc of their value. Shares in RBS have fallen around 40pc since the referendum vote and Taylor Wimpey, the UK’s biggest house builder, is off nearly 40pc. Foxtons and easyJet have been the first companies to issue profit warnings in the wake of Brexit.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/...e-ftse-100-to/
We know that the first reaction of British firms has been to cut investment forecasts, and to predict that in addition to weaker profits, hiring will slow down, wages will not increase, and job losses are inevitable. These may be signs of a recession rather than economic collapse, so the language of panic may well have been overdone for political purposes, but it would have been strange to think that the UK economy on leaving the EU would suddenly burst into a frenzy of investment and productivity when we knew in practical terms the reality of leaving will not begin for a minimum of two years when the formal break begins. And if you accept that contracts signed for say 10 years will be honoured, the full impact will take 10 years and on present evidence, even with Scotland remaining in the UK the overall picture looks bleak. Bear in mind also, that when Mrs Thatcher began the demolition of Britain's manufacturing sector (we lost 25% of industrial production capacity under her leadership) and sent the UK into recession, we had North Sea oil and gas revenue at its peak to fund the worst hit -in effect, billions of ££ was spent on unemployment benefit throughout the 1980s. We do not have revenues at that level anymore, indeed thousands of workers in Aberdeen have been laid off as the oil and gas industry in the UK begins to decline.
The third point, mostly in relation to Hippifried's post, is that this is a very big deal indeed, and is the most traumatic event in British politics in my lifetime, and that includes Suez in 1956, and the election of Mrs Thatcher in 1979. As I said in an earlier post, a year ago David Cameron won a parliamentary majority for the Conservative Party, their first since 1993, and his party was on course to rule without challenge for five years. Now Cameron is about to go, both his party and the main opposition Labour party are in open civil war over their leadership, nobody has a plan for Brexit, nobody has a clue what the country will even look like in two years time, the economy is an express train without brakes heading toward a brick wall, the UK has plunged the rest of the EU into the same shadow of economic uncertainty and by taking itself out will be taking out of the EU the values and expertise in law and diplomacy the UK brought to it while weakening the UK's reputation internationally and, for example, casting doubt on the right of the UK to sit on the Security Council of the UN.
The point about my Texit thread is that you start out with a stupid idea, but through a permissive attitude to political debate, end up losing what you thought you could not lose in a million years, in one year.
We got here because when Cameron's Tory party was in coalition with the Liberal Democrats between 2010-2015 it came under pressure from UKIP which won more representatives to the European Parliament than the Conservatives, and when two Tory MPs in the Commons switched parties joining UKIP, he panicked and promised an EU referendum if the party won the 2015 election, and he did so to quieten down the anti-EU faction in his party that has been there since 1972. What Cameron did not expect was to win a majority in the 2015 election, but he did, and with UKIP failing to make any impact, it gave him a strong hand -and he blew it, betting the car, and the house, and indeed, the country on a throw of the dice. Had the man any brains, he would have not held the referendum, but he decided not to renege on his promise convinced that Remain would win comfortably, and as a result we are living in a nightmare that is not going to end soon.
Today Theresa May has announced she is running for leadership of the party, the same Home Secretary who wants to introduce a law to monitor internet browsing habits and emails, who has presided over the shambles known as the UK Border Agency, and who wants to repeal the Human Rights Act (199-eight) Boris Johnson, who will put his name forward this morning, is a fraud and a liar -he was sacked from The Times for writing stories that were made up because he couldn't be bothered to do proper research- and who challenged Cameron because when they were at Eton Johnson considered Cameron a 'stupid boy' and was incensed when the lad became Prime Minister, not the best foundations on which to lead the country. He has been an MP for barely a year, and his attendance in the House has been occasional, possibly the worst of any of the new MPs who were elected in 2015, and before that he won two terms as Mayor of London, reneging on almost every promise he made.
The result of the EU referendum vote is, put simply, a catastrophe for the UK.
That's just ALL your opinion again! Stavros; Are you a Politician?....because you certainly sound like one!
David Cameron, on one of the televised debates, mentioned "The economy" almost 100 times!
As hippifred said; It's more about the social side of things and people! Remember them? NOT fcuking money and the god damn economy!
In addition to, or as a substitute for my views you can verify facts about the UK economy by looking them up, so allowing for measurements that may not be precise, you can ask questions about and get reasonably factual answers on productivity, the debt, investor confidence and plans and so forth, and it is utterly critical given that we live in a capitalist society.Quote:
Originally Posted by peejaye
In the meantime Boris Johnson has now pulled out of the leadership contest for the Conservative Party, possibly because of a major falling out with Michael Gove, whose wife let it be known in a 'leaked' email Johnson does not have the endorsement of Rupert Murdoch.
This leaves Theresa May as the leading candidate, and if she does win, her long established position of seniority in the government means we will not need a General Election, which would also be a relief to the Labour Party as it gives them four years in which to sort themselves out if they can.
She will be challenged by Liam Fox, who was Defence Secretary in the Coalition governent before being forced to resign in disgrace, which clearly annoyed him so that he now believes he can just waltz back into a position of power as if his dodgy past had never happened. There are times when you cannot be surprised if most people think politicians live on another planet.
You can read about Fox here-
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics...ave-ended-2011
Taking a break from your constituents again Stavros? :D
You are very well informed Stavros although I suspect our views on Politics differ very much!
As I understand it the vote on BREXIT is a recommendation leave the EU and although it may be politically impossible to refuse it is not legally binding. Here in the US we’re hearing a lot of stories about buyers regret. There are people claiming they only voted to leave as a protest - never dreaming the leaves would win.
If someone hoping to replace Cameron runs for Prime Minister promising they will not officially apply to leave the EU and if that person wins, it can be read as a mandate by the people reversing BREXIT. Am I right? To me it seems a more reasonable approach than petitioning for another vote to leave or stay, yet serves that function. Is there anyone running for Prime Minister making such a promise or is there anyone likely to?
(meant to ask this here and not in the TEXIT thread - sorry).