China is not our friend and Russia is an antagonistic pain in the ass whenever it can be.
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China is not our friend and Russia is an antagonistic pain in the ass whenever it can be.
OK, the US and China are rivals in some aspects, but arent they our biggest trading partners? Whatever happened to the days of "the evil communist, menance", and all the fear that went with it. Weren't they trying to take over the world, which the exact same thing Islam is now accused of?Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladin
I'm not saying there are no issues, but a general fear of all Islam, is not the solution.
well the big 3 religions all suck,
The list of friends of the United States is a very short one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladin
Man, you just continue to talk out of your ass. You have no idea at all what you're talking about.Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
Juan Williams is not a liberal. One needs to hold liberal viewpoints in order to be a liberal, not just have dark skin. And Americans are afraid of Muslims because people like Juan Williams go on TV and tell them that they should fear Muslims. Q.E.D.
Promise Keepers is an international Christian men’s organization founded by the head football coach at the University of Colorado Boulder. Their rallies attract thousands. They are very much a mainstream evangelical Christian organization and they firmly believe that men hold dominion over women. The Lord’s Resistance Army is a terrorist organization founded in Uganda that has killed and mutilated tens of thousands of people over the last decade. They kidnap children and force them to serve as soldiers and they use rape as a weapon. And they do it for Jesus. Neither of these groups is in Idaho playing army. Again, you have literally no idea what you’re talking about.Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
A) You have no idea at all what Muslims teach their kids in schools. You’ve never seen a Muslim school in your life.Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
B) Saudi Arabia is not a moderate Muslim country. It’s a theocracy. Indonesia is a moderate Muslim country. In fact, Indonesia is the most populous Muslim country on the planet. I’ve spent a significant amount of time in Indonesia, and they don’t hate Americans. They don’t even teach it in their schools.
That’s kinda funny, coming from somebody who couldn’t be arsed to google “Promise Keepers.”Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
It doesn’t make me feel better. I sincerely wish you were not an ignorant bigot. The U.S. and the world would be a lot better if people like you made an effort to be less ignorant.Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
See several quick links I provided earlier in this thread. It’s also not difficult to simply google “Muslims condemn violence” or “Muslims condemn attacks.” But then that would be really inconvenient for your argument, so maybe you should just stick your fingers back in your ears and go, “La la la la…”Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
Or, we could have some fun by turning this on it’s head. I provided you a golden opportunity to condemn the LRA’s Christian terror campaign, and you declined. Why do you support Christian terrorism?
He didn't say you should fear Muslims...he simply said that if he got on a plane and saw people wearing Muslim clothing (i.e. clearly identifying themselves as Muslims) he would get nervous.Quote:
Originally Posted by thombergeron
He also mentioned that all Muslims shouldn't be held accountable for the actions of a few extremists.
I suggest that if you're going to accuse someone else of "talking out of their ass"...you should probably not do the same thing.
This is fucking ridiculous. What's he nervous about? That they're going to paint his toenails?Quote:
Originally Posted by fred41
He sees someone in the cabin in a keffiyeh and his first thought is, Uh oh, that guy might blow up the plane.
How does that not communicate to people, especially to people watching fucking Bill O'Reilly, that Muslims are dangerous?
Are you a native English speaker? smh
Still no moderate Christians willing to condemn Christian terrorism, I guess?
There's a huge difference between telling someone they "should" be nervous...and understanding why someone might "feel" nervous.Quote:
Originally Posted by thombergeron
..and everyone's experiences aren't the same.
...and yeah,...I understand the English language...clearly a whole lot better than you do...you only understand what you want to understand.SMH
Why would anyone be afraid of Chinese women?Quote:
Originally Posted by thombergeron
You may not have noticed that I wasn't the one who brought up Juan Williams in the first place. Plainly, the nuance you have so painstaking parsed was a bit too subtle for mouthbreathers like onmyknees, who now cite Williams' comments as evidence for the widespread fear of Muslim. Again, Q.E.D.Quote:
Originally Posted by fred41
You don't win an argument against what you feel is misinformation...with more misinformation.QEDQuote:
Originally Posted by thombergeron
Every time I show them two twenties they give me a forty dollar head job. Seems like a good deal to me. I like China Ladies.:jerkoffQuote:
Originally Posted by bte
Quote:
Originally Posted by thombergeron
Why do you continue to deflect attention off radical Islam and attempt to draw some equivalency between the Promise Keepers and Muslim extremists? I know full well what the Promise keepers are. I understand what you're attempting to do, but it's a huge fail. Here is what Professor J. Terry from Drew University who has studied them for years said in an expose about them..
Racial reconciliation was central to PK’s message back in the 1990s. The genius of PK, in one sense, was that it tapped into that decade’s multicultural zeitgeist, giving it a spiritual spin. The stadium rallies provided tableaux of white, Latino, Asian, Native American, and African American men, singing, holding hands, and praying together in a show of Christian male bonding. True, Promise Keepers provided no theological or political critique of structural racism in the United States—racism was deemed a personal sin to be confessed.
These attitudes about race found their iconic moment at the 1997 DC rally. When white evangelist John Dawson knelt in prayer to ask forgiveness from his African American brothers for his own sin of racism, men of color gathered around him to affirm his repentance and accept his apology. PK rallies always seemed to draw mostly white men, but there was (and remains) a very real and significant African American presence in leadership positions. PK’s current President, Raleigh Washington, a black man, got his start back in the 1990s as PK’s VP for Reconciliation.
That's a little different picture than the one you would have us believe. I don't support them in any way, but you reveal yourself when you bring them up in the same discussion as radical Islam. And again....they seem to pose no threat of violence to anyone other than you....Don't try to draw comparisons that don't exist. It's a totally abstract argument, and it does a disservice to the victims of radical Muslims worldwide. Are you trying to tell me because some Promise Keepers once viewed women as subservient, that's a dotted line to Islam ?? That's laughable and intellectually dishonest. Shame on you....The following paragraph seems to lay your fantasies to waste..(Dr. Terry continues)
The reconciliation of the sexes was a headliner theme. Back in the ’90s, PK had a kind of ladies’ auxiliary, the “Promise Reapers,” who cheered the men on as they arrived for the stadium rallies. But on Friday night Jane Hansen Hoyt, president of Aglow International (the influential evangelical women’s ministry) became the first woman ever to speak at a PK event. And what a powerful speech it was, delivered in a driving rainstorm.
you continue...A) You have no idea at all what Muslims teach their kids in schools. You've never seen a Muslim school in your life.
Hey Mr. Apologist......I've been to Saudi Ariba working on a petroleum pipe line. I know exactly what they teach in many Madrass's and how they live, and don't tell me they don't detest the west..... Don't make assumptions about me based on your limited knowledge of me, and apparently most Americans. It's Ignorant.
"See several quick links I provided earlier in this thread. It’s also not difficult to simply google “Muslims condemn violence” or “Muslims condemn attacks.” But then that would be really inconvenient for your argument, so maybe you should just stick your fingers back in your ears and go, “La la la la…”
That's another knee slapper. There's what a billion Muslims world wide?...and you post a couple links about Muslims who condemn the attack . I'm sure they're are, just like I'm sure I could get a certain portion of the population to say they saw Elvis just leave the building. You can bury your head in the desert sands to avoid the reality and to convince yourself you have all the answers, but I'm telling you it's a fact that polls taken face to face in largely Muslim countries from Egypt to Saudi Ariba, to Afghanistan to Iraq to Lybia, to Pakistan to most recently Turkey that they do not have a favorable view of the US. What does that translate too? A fertile breeding ground for more hate. I'm sorry if that rocks your world, but those are facts. You can find an exception to any situation and You can be my guest and turn the other cheek, and indulge in fantasies, but seared into my memory was on a sunny early fall day I saw people who I probably passed in the street at some point in lower Manhattan, jumping to their death from a fiery inferno, so take your attempt at comparisons to The Promise Keepers, and to other Christians and your attempts to downplay Islamic hatred toward the west and stick it up your hypocritical, misleading ass. I give you facts about Muslim terrorists who planned and plotted attacks on the US while on US soil and you give me some horseshit about the IRA and the promise Keepers????? Your attempt to mitigate radical Islam's world wide attacks by deflecting attention to Christian Groups is weak. Tell me it's false that Christians are being killed and mistreated in most Muslims countries while those governments look the other way. Tell us all. We're waiting. You mention Indonesia....glad you brought that up. I spoke recently to a University Professor who fled there with his wife because of the creeping problem with Muslim fundamentalism. Is he wrong?? When was the last time you were there? Maybe you'd like to tell us about that problem when you're done deflecting our attention. ?? Sometime next month there's going to be Congressional Hearings by the Committe on Homeland Security on this very topic. You can call Rep. King, the chairman an Islamaphobic hater, but that would make you ignorant...so why don't we see what these hearings reveal...??
And finally you ask...".Why do you support Christian terrorism" I don't and by comparision it's rare, but you know what I do support?? That you be forced to watch the unedited , unsanatized version of the 911 bombings, and the search for survivors and then talk to me about Christian terrorism. What's next up for you.....911 was an inside job by the CIA ? Look...here's the bottom line, so save all your comparisons and equlivincies..I have a perfect right to be to be either mildly, or severally suspicious of those identifying themselves as Muslims who I don't know personally...based on the fact that all US attacks were perpetrated by Muslims who moved about us freely and blended into to everyday society. As long as my suspension does not translate into physical action or overt discrimination, I'm not only perfectly free to have those feelings, but probably prudent... despite the outrage by you and other sympathizers. It's called Freedom of Association. Goggle it ! LMAO
And one more thing.......this belongs in the Political Threads. If I want to get the Muslim slant on things, I'll simply tune into Al Jazerra...but here I'd rather be talking to, and looking at pictures of Sexy Ladies.
I would like to point out that Religion has been hijacked by extremists for centuries on all sides. We had our Crusades and they had their Jihads...
So when they go to church they are told we WESTERNERS are BAD. When we go to church we are told that Muslims are BAD. This should make you think about religion more than the people. I know a few Muslims personally and they're really nice people. Now they approve of way less things than i do but it doesn't make them evil....
Last one for me...again this belongs on the Religion Forum... But Ignorance?????? LMFAO>>> Oh your dad is a muslim...so this is personal to you ?????? Well it's personal to me too for other reasons. ....What do you mean he's a "prick"? I'd like to hear that explanation....And what are are saying that 3 out of 10 that are religious ?? By religious are you saying they're peaceful? Because Bin Laden is religious and so was the blind sheik. . What is a REAL Muslim ? So a suicide bomber yelling God is Great is a fake Muslim ? You may have just made my point unwittingly. Look....if you love peace and denounce radical Islam in all forms, I have no issue with you...why are you looking for one? You should be joining me in denouncing them.Quote:
Originally Posted by kyoJecours
Very eye-opening poll. Overwhelmingly, this board says Muslims are no good. I agree. Fuck 'em!
I might be considered anti-Islamic but I'm not Islamophobic. Many annoy the shit out of me but I'm not afraid of them.
I think Reno 911 said it best ... "there's 2 kinds of muslims , the kill whitey muslims and the kill everybody else muslims."
Ummm… because you continue to insist that all Muslims are evil and to deny that Christians could possibly commit evil themselves. Do you see what happens when you’re unable to understand things in anything other than black and white? You argue yourself into a corner and say a lot of stupid things.Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
That’s funny, because 24 hours ago you thought they were a militia in Idaho. I told you Google would be handy.Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
Way to cherry-pick Terry’s essay for irrelevant quotes. I don’t think I ever claimed Promise Keepers were white supremacists, because they’re not. Tony Evan’s, one of the groups founders, is black. In the same essay that you cut –and-pasted from:Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
“There was Tony Evans too, the Dallas-based pastor who, back in the day, incensed the movement’s critics when he told the guys at the stadium rallies to take back their rightful place as the head of the family, urging their women to submit.”
I know you’re having difficulty following the conversation here, but Lisa claimed Muslims suck because they claim ownership over their wives. I merely pointed out that that’s not an exclusive criticism of Islam, since certain Christian groups, such as the Promise Keepers, believe the same thing.
Again, I think that demanding that other human being submit to you in the name of God is kind of a radical idea. Maybe you don’t, but that would be something that you have in common with radical Islam.Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
Given that you described Saudi Arabia as a “moderate Muslim country,” I have an extraordinarily difficult time believing that you’ve ever set foot there. I’ve been there, and it’s a fucking armpit full of intolerant assholes.Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
And sorry, kiddo. I don’t have to know you to know you have never been in a madrassa in Saudi. If you had any idea what you were talking about, you would know what colossal horseshit that is. Madrassa’s generally don’t invite in American oil workers to peruse their lesson plans.
You just couldn’t bring yourself to do the google search, huh? You asked where were the moderate Muslims condemning violence. Here are 1.1 million examples for you:Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
muslims condemn violence - Google Search
You’re welcome.
Let me try to state this very simply for you. I despise terrorism, Muslim, Christian, or otherwise. But al Qaeda is maybe a couple of thousand guys. The other 999,998,000 Muslims, I don’t really have a problem with. I wish they didn’t insist on wasting humanity’s time with this superstitious bullshit, but I feel the same way about Christians, Jews, etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
I have never once attempted to “mitigate” attacks by radical Islam, nor have I ever defended such attacks, nor apologized for them, nor offered any excuse for violence committed against civilians in any way whatsoever. I defy you to offer a single shred of evidence of my “support” of fanaticism by any group, at all, ever. I uniformly condemn religious extremism in all forms, and I think that all religions are a cancer on humanity.Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
You, on the other hand, insist on blaming an entire class of innocent people for the actions of a handful of insane people, and denying the existence of violence, murder, and mayhem committed by those with whom you share faith and ideology.
It’s false. There are 47 Muslim majority countries in the world. Muslim-Christian sectarian violence is occurring in a handful of those.Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
I was there 8 weeks ago. The Indonesian archipelago has been experiencing ethnic strife for about a thousand years. It is the most ethnically diverse country on earth. Sectarian violence in Indonesia is ethnic in origin. That ethnicity is some areas is tied to religious observance is not relevant, novel, nor that interesting. You said Muslim everywhere hate Americans. I’m telling you for a fact that Muslim Indonesians do not hate Americans. If you ever get out of your mom’s basement and visit there, you will be 100% safe everywhere you go.Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
You should ask this little boy how rare it is. You should ask the Archdiocese of Kigali what they were up to while 800,000 Rwandans Tutsis were being hacked to death, way back before anyone had ever even heard of Osama bin Laden.Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
http://www.aymu.org/img/Photos/photo...urnt%20kid.gif
Misinformation? He fucking said it. It's on tape. If you want to give Juan Williams the benefit of the doubt about what he "meant," that's fine. But I don't, and from his comments, it's pretty clear that onmyknees heard the same thing that I did.Quote:
Originally Posted by fred41
I just wish muslims weren't in Australia .But i don't blame them i blame the Australian government for bringing them here
FFS why on earth does anybody take such time to spout such an amount (Thombergeron and onmyknees I didn't read by the way) of shit about ANY topic other than transsexuals on a fucking transsexual forum.
You might aswell have written all of the above in squeezy cheese on a big cracker and eaten it right away...........either way, nobody would give a shit.
Religion as a whole is the major problem, but Islam is a scourge of modern society. A 14th Century doctrine / belief existing in the 21st Century. To think this religion was once the centre of reason and enlightenment during the Christian 'Dark Ages'....
Listen here motha fucka. I am the Resident Luana Araujo Fan, okay? Not you. And by the way, Islam still IS the centre of reason and enlightnement, so shut up.Quote:
Originally Posted by f1manoz
Hey shit for brains....I told him to take it to the Political forum...but that's right...you didn't read it....maybe you should have then you wouldn't have looked so stupid!!!!!!!! LMAO..You payin' for the space here?? I didn't think so . And besides that...where the fuck you been if you been if you think the only thing discussed here is transexuals ? Instead of whining and wasting space lamenting about what somebody else said ...why don't you try a contribution and then I'll judge that ! :fu:Quote:
Originally Posted by tommymageeshemales2
I can honestly say that I haven't read a single post from this thread. But my pick of the poll options was "good" simply because I want to believe that that most people are good, despite life being so contrary. As soon as you start trying to define a people/person by saying muslim that really means as much as jewish, black, white, short, sluggish, amphibian (maybe verging on a way that Troy Mc'Clure is gonna love ya) and maybe as much as people that just like wearing socks to bed...I can't take that question with any more seriousness than a homeless person asking me what Plato really meant.
I just wish muslims weren't in Australia .But i don't blame them i blame the Australian government for bringing them here
A Filipina friend of mine has nothing but bile for Australia, because of attitudes like yours directed at her, not because she is transgendered but because she isn't blonde and blue eyed and six foot tall... the ease with which Australians sledge people who are not 'white' cricket-loving lager louts suggests Muslims are just one category of people on a long list...luckily for you I have a personal pledge never to set foot in the place.
Since 9/11 there have been nearly 17,000 acts of non-combat terror by muslims. There have been about a dozen acts during the same time period by all other religions combined, none by Roman Catholics. the muslim faith is a filthy faith of death. they are the cockroaches of humanity, in desparate need of extermination like any other pesky insect.
It's too simplistic a poll Dino. The religion itself, in my opinion, bad as I'm not a fan of any religion but muslims themselves are far too varied for all of them to be placed into such broad groups.
Terrorism at it's core is a method to even military odds by inspiring fear in civilians. If you are spouting about how all muslims are evil and out to kill you and your loved ones not only are you allowing terrorists to win but actively recruiting for them by displaying the same stupidity and cowardice they do. The West has an undeniable problem in the Islamic world. Some of that is of our own doing, some of it is religous based particuarly in the form of wahabi islam and some of it is simply powerplay between differing nations and regions.
Terrorists want you to stop fighting them and instead fight the populace in which they shelter. It's a tried and tested method of increasing both support and recruitment for their cause. Take the I.R.A. you don't comabt such a group by firebombing Dublin. Too many people try talking tough and end up betraying their own cowardice. Fight muslim terrorists not muslims.
I am not going to say that some Muslims are good or some Muslims are bad. I do know that a Muslim man by the name Muzzammil Hassan in Buffalo, New York, who is the founder and chief executive officer of Bridges TV which aimed to show Muslims in a positive light and to get rid of stereotypes surrounding Muslims, beheaded his wife because she wanted a divorce (I think).
I am sure by all accounts he wouldn't be considered extreme, before he did this act. But nobody in their right mind would agree that this type of behavior is acceptable. Honor killings are constantly being taken place even in America. A Muslim cab driver honor killed his two daughters because he felt they were being to westernized. His wife even aided in providing him an alibi even though he killed her children.
Islam is not of peace and I really don't know how anybody can think that.
Crimes like those are repulsive and completely unacceptable BTE and there are elements of islam that are troglodyte in their interpretations. That doesn't mean islam can't be a religion of peace though, millions upon millions of muslims mange to make it that every day.
In college, I actually studied Islam. Some elements of Islam are good. They have something called Zagat, which they give money to the poor. But if you look at the polls conducted in the Middle East, then you will see that their way of thinking is sort of fucked up.Quote:
Originally Posted by wendell
plenty of problems in islam no doubt about that BTE but plenty of good as well. Although to be fair I despise religion so good in the sense of not homicidal maniacs rather than choice of philosophy. Take Honour killings. There are lots of then in America as you point out. However there are tens of millions of muslims living in America the moderates far outweighthe demented.
I agree with you. But with the case of the man who beheaded his wife in NY, I am sure that plenty of people would consider him a moderate. A guy who founded a TV company that aimed to quell the stereotypes of Muslims and to put them in a better light, while at the end of the day, he was exactly what he was preaching against.Quote:
Originally Posted by wendell
I do not know, I have met some pretty cool Muslims so I am sure they are out there. Don't know if people know this or not, but Dave Chappelle is a Muslim or was a Muslim not exactly which and he is one of the funniest people on the planet.
Also religion is not bad per say. Its the people that follow the religion are bad. I am not a fan of religion, but at the same time I recognize the purpose that religion has in people lives.
I think the problem is BTE, and it's one we have in Britain to is that most muslims are simply ordinary people that want to get on with their lives. Those who make the most noise about being moderate tend to actually be those with something to hide. That holds true for plenty of other things as well.
We seem to pretty much agree so I want to make it clear that islam has alot to answer for in my opinion and it's practice in some countries is degrading to Mankind and revolting to see. It's just that those in the West have been getting a pretty bad rap since 9/11 and it's only rarely deserved.
True, but sometimes the bad rap is well deserved, although sometimes it isn't.Quote:
Originally Posted by wendell
That was the whole point. Vote "Good", "No Good", or walk on by not voting at all. It gets people to stick their own necks out instead of copy and paste someone else's words.Quote:
Originally Posted by wendell
There has been a lot of brutal honesty here which is a good thing. Most all people have some prejudice in their hearts, even if it's against their own people. Some are better at hiding it from the rest of us.
I 100% agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by kyoJecours
Terorists and (muslim) extremists are nothing to do with Islam.
These few bad people are using Islam as religion for their own benefits.
There are bad and good people everywhere in this entire world..I guess we just have to adapt and be tolerant and open minded for all the differences...and hopefully we will respect and understand each other and be united as the citizens of the world.
I'm not muslim btw, and having no issue to admit if I were one.
I was born and raised in Indonesia, which majority of us are muslim, but I was born Buddhist.
My 2 cents:yingyang:
Tia
There some things being mixed up here. I think honor killings come from an ethnic heritage, and is not something sanctioned by the Koran. Something I read, said that many people there, dont know the difference themselves. But there were honor killings in ancient Rome. Many men here, commit violence on women who are leaving them, but we dont blame their relgion, in the case of Christianity, or others. In some latin cultures men, get light sentences for killing their wives when they are caught cheating.Quote:
Originally Posted by bte
I think issues like this, need to be addressed. But not by attacking the religion, but facing the individual issues. I see non-violence as a practice that should be spread, for the good of all.
it's not personal for me... i just have a better insight into the discussion than a lot of people here. to be honest most of the people who are against islam don't actually have the first clue about the religion... even if they think they do. listen there are many aspects of islam that i disagree with but in essence they are not much different to all other religious people. the misconception which pisses me off is how people associate all muslims with terrorists. the muslim population is HUGE... the percentage who are extremists are TINY in comparison. i denounce radical islam completely but trust me my muslim relatives and all other true muslims probably hate the fanatics more than anybody else because they have their name dragged through the gutter.Quote:
Originally Posted by onmyknees
and yes the problem is ignorance. i disagree 100% with the entire concept of religion full stop but i still find it important to say that REAL MUSLIMS HATE RADICAL EXTREMISTS and it's not fair for the perception of all muslims to be fanatics. people often quote the koran to show what a terrible religion islam is... but there is a large proportion of modern muslims who understand that a religion which is centuries old needs to be adapted. they treat women equally, they help people who are less fortunate, etc etc. they are decent people. now i know there are many who are the opposite... and i will join you in condemning them but the only point i'm trying to make is that labelling an entire religion and all its followers as evil is ridiculous.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyoJecours
:iagree: Amen..........