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I turned to msnbc this afternoon and still see mccain and palin talking about obama telling the truth(truth about what) and still linking him to bill ayers people do not want to him that s****.Mccain is running one of the most dirtiest campains i've seen in a long time.
i guess i heard wrong from the people in my unit about obama's foreign supporters. but who cares about wutever anyones policy is? the prez might have the most power a single person can have in the US, but he is not the overall authority. he can get shot down for anything if anyone else remembers grade school social science with the checks and balances system. everyone says bush was a bad president fails to realize that we could not go to war unless congress backed it, along with other follies the gov't has done in the recent years. thats my opinion, but u don't have to agree with it IN FACT, this IS a discussion board
one last thing to remember, no matter who becomes president, not even the majority of the US will like how his/her term goes, the only reason ppl say JFK jr. was great was because he didnt serve a whole term with more chances to disappoint the citizens like most presidents do
ok last thing i wanted to say, if anyone is for taxing the richest americans more than they already do check this out really quick:
Q:
What percent of taxes does the top 1 percent pay and what percent of the income do they make?
A:
The top 1 percent of all households got 18 percent of all personal income and paid nearly 28 percent of all federal taxes in 2005, according to the Congressional Budget Office. The top 1 percent now pay a significantly larger share of taxes than before President Bush's tax cuts, and also have a larger share of income.
here's where i got it
http://www.factcheck.org/askfactchec...s_the_top.html
i was trying to find how much the top 2% pay but i couldn't find it, its usually mind blowing to me
now don't get me wrong, we could tax 'em more, but most ignorant ppl(like me sometimes) believe that the financial elite don't pay any taxes. if this is below you sry for bringing nothing new to the table, for everyone else... food for thought..?
This is a legitimate concern and has the Sekrit Service tied in knots. While a significant number of voters (By current polls) want to see this man ascend to the presidency, there are certainly a significant number of Americans (Or so they pretend) that want him as worm food.Quote:
What I was saying is SOME shady white folk who make comments and then sort of have an evil laugh at the notion of Obama being killed.
Contrary to accepted norms, even the KKK has endorsed Obama. What the fuck is =THAT= about?
It's a given that this job (The presidency) is ripe for attracting lead (Jackson, Lincoln, Garfield, McKinley, Teddy Rooselvelt, FDR, JFK, Ford, Reagan), but this round is especially elevated to the angers of the American people, politically, racially, and ideologically.
I'm sure that even the conspiracy theorists have devised a scenario that places Biden at the helm of the action. I know the man, and seriously doubt such a possibility, but I don't know the extent of the machinery behind such a thought.
another obstacle about this election is how the outside world will see the US if Obama doesn't win. my teacher brought this up and it make you think, yeah maybe the US is racist if they don't vote for Obama which could lead to problems abroad if McCain wins
That's a no brainer, they know the whole election even if Obama loses, will cause a backlash that will swell their ranks (and as a result: their funding).Quote:
Originally Posted by BeardedOne
The Klan's plan is for all these "angry white people" hearing of Obama being with "blacks who were terrorists in the 70s" will help their recruiting. And that's assuming Obama loses, if he wins- then there's at least 4 years for that hatred to fester within those who are already ideologically close to these groups, but without affiliation.
To be honest, I think the Klan is right here- I have no doubts that some will, because of this election, take the step to joining the Klan OR other similar minded groups... I think, I hope this will be a relatively insignificant % of people, but even if its 1 in X00,000 - that's still plenty for a white supremacist world where membership has been on the decline since the 1970s. The Klan hasn't had the power, or membership that it's had in history, the old timers there certainly know how TINY these groups are compared to "the good old days" and they'd do anything they can think of to "bring the good old days back"
Do not by any means misunderstand the dangers of the situation here, the Klan is only one of hundreds (if not thousands) of these hate groups, and because it is the most well known- it is the only one people tend to know of, talk about, or think about. These groups are all equally dangerous per person, and we know that the conservative terrorist groups are very proficient at hiding their own when the system wants someone for a terrorist act. Remember some of the abortion doctor assassins successfully evaded law enforcement for quite a long time.
We know from history that in times of economic crisis, these hate groups explode in support & membership- if this economic crisis gets out of hand, it could easily become the perfect storm for race relations in America.
The hate groups themselves are not the only ones posing the danger, unaffiliated individuals can, and already are, posing individual threats against minorities. There is a case this year in PA not far from me where a group of teenage high school boys beat to death an Hispanic guy assuming he was an illegal (he was he legally and was engaged to a girl who is a US citizen, the guy was literally weeks away from citizenship because of the engagement, all it would have taken was being married). I kind of think if it were without the US citizen fiancee, no one would have given a shit that a small group of 15-18 year old high school students beat to death some factory worker (murder is no less wrong when the unarmed victim is an illegal).
I don't deny that there is one of those stupid chain emails going around, but don't be mislead here- snopes is dropping the ball on this one.Quote:
Originally Posted by braveman
The Klan, and other groups- really are using this election to help with recruiting. Don't believe me? Here's an article from Time magazine talking about the issue from Sept. 26: BTW the emphasis in bold is added by me, not TIME magazine.
The quote is talking about the Klan's presence at a University that was to hear McCain speak.Quote:
The Klan will, however, have pamphlets and membership applications on hand for any audience members who happen to share the Klansmen's views. Some examples of those views: Obama's election "could be the destruction of America," says Greene, who states categorically that he would not vote for a black candidate. Says the Emperor of the Mississippi White Knights (the group's ritual leader), who asked not to be identified: "Locally, every place that has come under black rule has declined, and has declined sharply." He cited Jackson, Miss., and Washington, D.C., as examples. "Not all black people are particularly bad people," the emperor adds. But leadership, he asserts, "is just not in their character ... it's just not in their ability." The Obama campaign did not return requests for comment.
http://www.time.com/time/politics/ar...xid=rss-nation
EDIT/ADD- like I said, they see and know there will be a benefit here whether Obama wins or loses. Snopes may very well be right in that there has been no formal endorsement, but many of these groups are so tiny, fractured and independent that even if they did make an endorsement- we'd never know it. I don't buy that anyone was voting for Obama in the primaries out of some weird, perverted hate group party line of "anything being better than Hillary" but nonetheless there IS strong evidence that these groups are taking action to get support from those disenchanted by Obama or his alleged associates.
A lot of people have. Maybe it's because of his administration's tendency to trample on the bill of rights... and not because of his skin color?Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkThanos
That's the whole difference. In theory, a hate crime is a hate crime only if its done BECAUSE of racist views, and not as a byproduct of something else (like defending civil liberties). The law traditionally cares about the thinking behind a crime to a point, hence why premeditated murder is different from accidentally killing someone while being criminally negligent.
I agree that they're on the fringe, but that doesn't mean they'll stay there absolutely.Quote:
Originally Posted by braveman
Hate groups have been growing in certain European countries, and in the case of antisemitism, crime is actually increasing in countries like Russia, France, etc... not decreasing. Just because hate is going out of style in the here and now of America, does not mean that change is to last (although I hope it does).
However I agree it is unlikely that these groups will suddenly swell in size or power anytime on the visible horizon, so we pretty much agree there.
But the danger is more than just group membership statistics, and will be cold comfort for the victim of anyone who gets individually "inspired" who then goes out and murders someone based on hate doctrines. The group of teenage boys that beat a Hispanic to death in northern PA had no hate group affiliations, and their actions if going by the statistics, show a violence on the scale that exceeds that of some of these small klan chapters (many of which are insignificantly small and have not, in recent years, murdered anyone).
You didn't see Hispanics being suspected of being illegal and promptly getting beaten to death by high school students before the Republicans started going off about the "illegal alien problem" in the national political realm- I personally see a link here, not a cause and effect relationship, but more like a minor attributing/influencing factor- and this is what I fear the Obama backlash may lead to, even if it is rare isolated incidents, in the future.
Note I am not saying this means that Obama shouldn't have run for president. Perceived change always causes a backlash of -some- kind, but at the same time it would be false to assume that these groups will not benefit from this election process, especially when you have networks like Faux news trying to convince the masses that Obama is bed fellows with black terrorists of the 1970s (hmm, didn't that network also LIE and say that Obama was educated in his early childhood in a radical islamic religious school?).
The sad irony of the whole thing is that McCain lost the 2000 primaries largely because of racism on the part of the neo-cons.
So you're saying that the litmus test for deciding whether a crime was racially motivated should rest on what slurs or insults were used during the act?Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkThanos
There are victims that would have been killed by a criminal(s) regardless what their skin color, orientation, or sex is.