I wasn't there. Were you? I'm just going based on the Q of what if GZ had not ended the fight as he did? Do you know how long TM would have gone for? Given the screams from GZ in the 911 calls... TM hadn't found a reason to stop yet.Quote:
Originally Posted by Silcc69
You clearly are unaware of the degrees of controls that exist today... not to mention the very real legal liabilities such an has every time they go anywhere. In some states a store owner placing a small sign can make the carrier into a felon (if found to be carrying)... other states are less restrictive.Quote:
Originally Posted by robertlouis
Why not focus then on the attitude in the war zone that is certain parts of Chicago where hundreds are injured or killed every year... and by guns owned and used by people who are not complying with existing laws & controls.Quote:
Originally Posted by robertlouis
To each country their own then.Quote:
Originally Posted by robertlouis
Gee, should we say that those who oppose the freedom to hire hit men for murder are intolerant bigots? How about those opposed to the phlogiston theory of combustion; are they bigots? Hey, about those who oppose the freedom to own children; bigots? Or those opposed to the carry of concealed firearms in public places because of the increased risk of accidental injury or death to innocent bystanders. Those people are bigots too, eh? Talk about knowing the meanings of words! You need to look up "bigotry."
I'm pretty sure your mind is just part of the problem.Quote:
Originally Posted by bobvela
If GZ hadn't been armed he would have wussed out. There never would've been a confrontation, the police would've questioned Martin on what he was doing in the neighborhood and let him go his way. There would have been no crime committed because none was in progress or planned to begin with and no one would be dead. Instead, GZ carried a concealed gun and that made all the difference.
Yes, really. It's the most like hypothesis. You know it is.Quote:
Really? How do you know that?
No, you assume. I wasn't making any assumption about how people like you think. I merely going on what Zimmerman's own lawyer said about his client. He was afraid for his life. If his pants are full of shit, you must acquit. Haven't we all seen enough of Zimmerman to know he's a wuss who self-confidence depends on the gun he carries?Quote:
A sad thing about anti-gun bigots like you is you do not understand how the minds of those of us who carry. You assume ...
I've already said, I'm not blaming GZ. I blaming concealed carry. Subtract the gun from this scenario and everything comes out fine.Quote:
Your insistence on blaming GZ for acting...
Quote:
Originally Posted by trish
Concealed carry may have saved Zimmerman's life. How far would have "the boy child" gone with punching and hitting GZ's head on the concrete?
I have held back posting on this thread waiting for the actual facts and court trial to happen. There are no winners with this event and Martin loss his life. The jury was able to focus on what happened in the court room and make their decision. Zimmerman went into the trial after over a year of spinning-of-facts, altered voice recordings, claimed to be a racist, call a white/ Hispanic (what?), etc. The local police and prosecutor saw it for what it was- self-defense. Not until the usual race and hate mongers came to town (news media, Jackson, Sharpton, Black Panthers, Obama, Holder, DoJ) did this get ramped-up with a special prosecutor appointed.
Unfortunately for Martin he chooses to fight a man with a CPL and used his firearm it to end the assault. He could have continued walking to where he was staying. Instead he came back to confront Zimmerman.
Neighborhood watches have been going on for years. Around my house we are more aware than ever with crime on the rise. Section 8 housing has brought a lot of the bad elements into the area. Guess what, they walk down the street (our sidewalks are fine) with their hoodies pulled way over their heads, and slowly go by cars looking into the windows. They are ‘scouting’. Later that night the window gets knocked-out and items get taken. Cities are cutting back on staff so when you call to report that a strange guy is scouting cars maybe they’ll send a cop in 45 minutes or so. The next day the cops come and make the report for the stuff stolen. Two of these thugs were ‘greeted’, told we’re onto what they’re doing, cops have been called, and get the fuck out of our neighborhood. B&E’s, even some broad daylight hold-ups have been happening. As GZ said, “they always get away”.
Now where is the outrage over all of the killing in Chicago? Oh, that’s Holder’s old stomping grounds.
STORY #1
40 YEARS SENTENCE for zimmerman like antics
Texas man gets 40 years in stand-your-ground case
HOUSTON -- Retired Texas firefighter Raul Rodriguez, armed with a handgun and video camera, had claimed he was standing his ground and had no choice but to use deadly force when he fatally shot his unarmed neighbor after confronting him about a noisy party.
A jury decided otherwise Wednesday, sentencing Rodriguez to 40 years in prison for killing the neighbor, Kelly Danaher, a 36-year-old elementary school teacher. Prosecutors said they are hopeful the punishment will stop others from settling matters with violence and trying to use Texas' version of a stand-your-ground law as a defense.
"I think it sends a clear message that this was not a case of stand-your-ground," said prosecutor Kelli Johnson. "And I think from his behavior, his intent, the provocation ... shows that this had ... nothing to do with self-defense."
Rodriguez, who faced up to life in prison for the 2010 killing, will be eligible for parole in 20 years. Jurors deliberated about five hours Wednesday before reaching their verdict. The same jury convicted him of murder on June 13.
His reference to standing his ground was similar to the claim made by George Zimmerman, a neighborhood watch volunteer who is citing Florida's stand-your-ground law in his defense in the fatal February shooting of an unarmed teenager, Trayvon Martin. Rodriguez's case, however, was decided under a different kind of self-defense doctrine.
During closing arguments earlier Wednesday in the trial's punishment phase, Johnson referenced Zimmerman but told jurors that case was different from what Rodriguez was convicted of doing.
In a 22-minute video he recorded that night, Rodriguez can be heard telling a police dispatcher "my life is in danger now" and "these people are going to go try and kill me." He then said, "I'm standing my ground here," and fatally shot Danaher and wounded the other two men.
STORY #2
Oklahoma City pharmacist Jerome Ersland gets life; judge refuses to suspend any prison time
A judge Monday refused to cut any time off the life term of a pharmacist convicted of murder for fatally shooting a robber.
“It's injustice of a monumental proportion,” Jerome Jay Ersland, 59, said after his formal sentencing.
His lead defense attorney, Irven Box, asked that Ersland be given probation for life. Oklahoma County District Judge Ray C. Elliott refused, saying he saw no reason to suspend any of the sentence.
“I'm going to appeal,” Ersland told a large throng of news reporters and cameramen as sheriff's deputies led him in chains to a jail elevator.
The judge's decision means Ersland likely will die in prison unless he wins on appeal, the law is changed or a governor grants clemency. Under current law, Ersland will have to serve more than 38 years before he is eligible for parole.
Box called the jury verdict a tragedy. He said the outcome “more than likely” would have been different if jurors could have heard witnesses and testimony disallowed by the judge.
“We really strongly believe that we didn't play on a level playing field,” he said. “We believe that we have a lot … of issues to appeal from.”
A jury in May chose the life term as punishment. Ersland was convicted of first-degree murder for fatally shooting an unarmed robber inside the Reliable Discount Pharmacy in south Oklahoma City two years ago.
Prosecutors said the fallen robber, Antwun “Speedy” Parker, 16, was unconscious from a shot to the head when Ersland got a second gun and shot him five more times. Prosecutors at trial called the final shots an execution. Ersland said he was defending himself and two female co-workers. He claimed the masked robber was getting back up.
A second robber, Jevontai Ingram, had fled already. Ingram, then 14, did have a gun.
2 other men sentenced
Also Monday, another judge sentenced the two men who planned the drugstore robbery. Both were convicted in May of first-degree murder for Parker's death.
Quote:
Originally Posted by trish
MORE INFO FOR STORY #1
fire fighter pulls a zimmerman over loud music
Firefighter Shoots, Kills Neighbor Over Loud Music - YouTube
MORE INFO FOR STORY #2
OKC pharmacist guilty of murder for killing injured robber
Jay Ersland, a pharmacist from Oklahoma City, has been convicted of murder after he killed a robber during a holdup at his business in 2009.
The defense argued that it was self-defense, but Ersland had shot the robber, chased after his accomplice and came back into the store, where he unloaded his gun into the injured suspect, who was lying on the floor.
From the Daily Oklahoman:
Prater played for jurors again a security camera recording of the shooting. He stopped it at points, telling jurors the pharmacist turned his back to the downed robber to get a second gun to shoot the robber again.
“It's a human trait. You don't turn your back on something you're afraid of,” Prater said.
http://blogs.kansascity.com/crime_sc...ed-robber.html
Ersland Charged With Murder in Pharmacy Shooting - YouTube
Nice post.
Some food for thought:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2sL2f0PoqME