Re: 17yr old black kid shot and killed for walking in white suburbia?
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Originally Posted by
dderek123
The evidence presented in court suggests that's not how it went.
The evidence presented by Zimmerman. Martin was dead, so he couldn't testify.
It's a damn shame Martin didn't survive, then he could go to jail for attempted murder, right? Or would it be attempted manslaughter.? haha
Re: 17yr old black kid shot and killed for walking in white suburbia?
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Originally Posted by
trish
Zimmerman is not guilty. I'm good with that. It's good that he had a trial. I make no claims about racism in this case, though it's clear Zimmerman profiled the boy he killed. But the claim that
is crazy. Really? More vigilantes ignoring the police and killing more teenagers will make our gated communities even better? What we really need is less guns, no more concealed carry, an end to stand your ground laws and no more public sanctioned vigilantism.
Woah you're right that is a crazy claim, vigilanteism isn't what people need. Just look at what's going on in Egypt. Also agree with you on the concealed carry laws. It shouldn't be so easy.
Re: 17yr old black kid shot and killed for walking in white suburbia?
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Originally Posted by
trish
Zimmerman is not guilty. I'm good with that. It's good that he had a trial.
So you are happy with blowing quite a bit of tax payer dollars on a case that was unwinnable and gave the Martin family a false sense of hope? Good to know!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
trish
I make no claims about racism in this case, though it's clear Zimmerman profiled the boy he killed.
So? Nothing is inherently wrong with profiling... or are you saying he 'racially profiled'? In which case you would be contradicting yourself.
Just 'profiled'? You probably do it 100+ times a day without even thinking about it. Which outfit goes best with the shoes you want to wear? Profiling! Am I in the mood for soup or salad with my lunch today? Profiling! This car salesmen strikes me as kinda sleazy. Profiling! Someone is banging your head into the sidewalk and you fear for your life? Profiling!
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Originally Posted by
trish
More vigilantes
I don't think you understand the meaning of the word you are using.
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Originally Posted by
trish
ignoring the police
GZ ignored the police? When? And don't say the dispatcher because they are not only not police... but have as much legal authority to give orders as you do. Doubly so when their statement of "we don't need you to do that" was simply a CYA (cover your ass) move... and response being "Ok", not "screw you! I'm going to go shoot me someone!"
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Originally Posted by
trish
and killing more teenagers will make our gated communities even better?
Yes... I am advocating for the mass killing of teenagers... but only in gated communities. You got me!
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Originally Posted by
trish
What we really need is less guns,
There are about as many firearms in this country as it has people in it... good luck with that.
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Originally Posted by
trish
no more concealed carry,
Given the fact that not long ago... the courts threw out the concealed handgun band in Illinois and forced the state to pass a CPL law... things are not going your way.
Of course why let facts get in the way of your clearly emotional ranting? In places that have loosened the requirements to legally carry a weapon... violent crime rates actually go down.
It will be very interesting to watch what happens in the war-zone that is Chicago as a result of the new law.
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Originally Posted by
trish
an end to stand your ground laws
Again, you have no idea what you are talking about. Stand your ground doesn't really apply here. In most states you have the right to use lethal force in order to prevent injury or death... the circumstances that must be in place vary from place to place, stand your ground simply does not require you to attempt to retreat or hide... something GZ was unable to do when he was mounted by TM and being repeatedly assaulted.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
trish
and no more public sanctioned vigilantism.
Did I miss a memo from the Sanford Police Department that gave GZ carte blanche to do such a thing? No... you still clearly do not understand what the meaning of vigilantism.
I stand by what I said... ALL of our neighborhoods... gated or not would be better off if more people kept an eye out on the goings on and reported things that were off.
Again you are focusing on a specific emotional aspect and ignoring the larger picture:
- Many people throughout the country who have organized or non-organized neighborhood watch programs.
- Many people report suspicious activity about things happening to the police.
- Many people are free to walk where they have the legal right to be, even if that direction is in the same direction as someone else who may or may not be up to something.
- Many people carry legal or illegal weapons on their persons for the purpose of self-defense.
Which of the first three are you against? Because those are part of what was happened that night... & TM was just unlucky to run into and assault someone that #4 applied to.
Re: 17yr old black kid shot and killed for walking in white suburbia?
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Originally Posted by
buttslinger
The evidence presented by Zimmerman. Martin was dead, so he couldn't testify.
You must be ignoring the testimony from the witnesses for the prosecution which corroborated the evidence presented by Zimmerman.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
buttslinger
It's a damn shame Martin didn't survive, then he could go to jail for attempted murder, right? Or would it be attempted manslaughter.? haha
While you laugh... there is an unfortunate aspect to that where if GZ wasn't armed that evening... TM may have caused worse injury or even death to GZ. If caught, he would be just another incarcerated black youth. While yes, TM would still be alive, but his family would still be suffering because of his actions.
Re: 17yr old black kid shot and killed for walking in white suburbia?
If GZ hadn't been armed he would have wussed out. There never would've been a confrontation, the police would've questioned Martin on what he was doing in the neighborhood and let him go his way. There would have been no crime committed because none was in progress or planned to begin with and no one would be dead. Instead, GZ carried a concealed gun and that made all the difference.
Re: 17yr old black kid shot and killed for walking in white suburbia?
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Originally Posted by
trish
If GZ hadn't been armed he would have wussed out. <other theoretical nonsense>
Really? How do you know that?
A sad thing about anti-gun bigots like you is you do not understand how the minds of those of us who carry.
You assume that when we do so we have a sense of power and invulnerability and use that feeling to do things we wouldn't otherwise (not unlike a bit of liquid courage when at a bar and trying to work up the nerve to ask someone out)... which is true for a small number of people.
Most of us treat carrying a weapon the way we do wearing shoes or carrying a wallet... as just part of our normal daily routine and just make sure we have it and do not give it a second thought until entering a place we know we cannot carry (assuming we know).
Think of how much the average guy keeps in his wallet (or women and their purse)... do they need all of that stuff every day? Nope... but would just prefer to have it on hand 'just in case' but don't give it much thought until they need their Space Camp ID card for some random reason.
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Originally Posted by
trish
Instead, GZ carried a concealed gun and that made all the difference.
Liar. If you want to get into hypotheticals... had TM not doubled back and assaulted GZ... TM would be alive today. Your insistence on blaming GZ for acting legally (but perhaps stupidly (which on it's own is not illegal)) but ignoring the criminal act of TM that directly lead to his death is pathetic and once again demonstrates you do not care about facts... you just care about blood.
Re: 17yr old black kid shot and killed for walking in white suburbia?
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Most of us treat carrying a weapon the way we do wearing shoes or carrying a wallet
One might've hoped you would treat a gun with more caution and respect than you would a pair of shoes. It seems those who admit to carrying concealed firearms are hotheads prone to calling those who oppose them with ideas and reason "liars" and "bigots". Can people like that really be trusted with firearms? Instead them have shoes and wallets.
Re: 17yr old black kid shot and killed for walking in white suburbia?
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Originally Posted by
bobvela
You must be ignoring the testimony from the witnesses for the prosecution which corroborated the evidence presented by Zimmerman.
While you laugh... there is an unfortunate aspect to that where if GZ wasn't armed that evening... TM may have caused worse injury or even death to GZ. If caught, he would be just another incarcerated black youth. While yes, TM would still be alive, but his family would still be suffering because of his actions.
Wait you mean to tell me that a 17 year old would've beatin a 28 year old man to death lol gosh you conservatives.....
Re: 17yr old black kid shot and killed for walking in white suburbia?
What a sad fucked-up country. Too many guns people, and not enough controls.
Would tighter control on gun-carrying have prevented this tragedy? Don't know, nobody does, but there can be no doubt that a culture in which carrying guns is entirely accpetable, concealed or otherwise, breeds a certain attitude.
You can have no idea just how incredibly alien and bizarre the whole set-up appears from the perspective of a country with some of the tightest gun control laws in the world.
And I know I'm safer here.
Re: 17yr old black kid shot and killed for walking in white suburbia?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
trish
One might've hoped you would treat a gun with more caution and respect than you would a pair of shoes.
The shoes I am wearing cost ~$40 and can do little harm... the revolver in my pocket cost ~$500 and can do a great deal of harm if misused... so yes, steps are taken, but the latter does not give me some 'steel courage'
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Originally Posted by
trish
It seems those who admit to carrying concealed firearms are hotheads prone to calling those who oppose them with ideas and reason "liars" and "bigots".
You again don't seem to understand the meaning of words. When you make a factually incorrect statement, one that you either know to be untrue... you are by definition a liar. Should I refer to you as a cucumber instead?
What are anti-gay marriage advocates often called? Close minded? Hate filled? Bigoted? Why? Because they are intolerant of the views of others. You repeatedly show yourself to be quite intolerant of the views of those of us who safely and legally carry weapons and hurt no one... and seem to wish to stop us. What does that make you again?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
trish
Can people like that really be trusted with firearms? Instead them have shoes and wallets.
Sadly for you... it's not up to you as I've been licensed to carry a good number of states... and do. No issues yet, odd that eh?
