Grooby Legal Action against Piracy ...

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Originally Posted by Niccolo

So all that crap at the beginning of the thread when you cried about Russian and Eastern European crime 'rings' (is there such a thing?) was just bullshit. You know perfectly well that you won't achieve a damn thing in the long term, and you have failed to make the case that a download = a lost sale. So now, you say that you're doing this pour encourages les outres, and ... wait for it ... to make money. The former clearly isn't going to work. I'm sure you know that perfectly well. You're only doing this to make money. That was put to you several times earlier on, and you tried to weasel out of acknowledging that. Oh well, at least we all know now.

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Where do you get this "crime ring" idea from? Let's get my quote right;

"Nobody is doing this for fun - it's an organised business, much of it originating in Russia, China and Eastern Europe."

The people either running sites showing links to stolen content, or posting the stolen content themselves for download ARE running it as a business, and most of them come from countries that it's hard to take criminal action against. It's an organised full time business for them, as they get an upsell percentage on people buying download accounts. It's no bullshit.

You might find this hard to believe but I'm in this to turn a profit as without that profit, I can't pay anyone or continue to produce. If someone has MADE THE CHOICE TO ACT ILLEGALLY AND STEAL FROM US - then yes, we'll take action against them in an attempt to raises revenue from otherwise losses. This should also discourage others doing it.

You should possibly read more - on my post on 9th Sept I clearly stated;

"4. Yes, this is a revenue generating venture as well as to warn people not to download our content. You have a choice, you can either do it - or not do it. There is no in-between. If you are stealing our content, then you have the potential to be sued. I've no interest in playing semantics with you."

I don't see anywhere where I "weasled out of it" - I'm not going to answer every single post, I made my statements and you can take from that what you will. We've always went after piracy where we can and if we can recoup revenue by doing that we will.

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Originally Posted by kyoJecours

i'm finding it hard to have sympathy for people in the porn industry. ok what's happening is legally wrong but it's not as if the porn world is some sort of moral highground. it's the same as people downloading music for free... yes industy people are missing out on income but the way they brainwash, exploit and manipulate the public i couldn't really give a fuck. plus i get free tunes :)

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What's moral high ground got to do with it? My high ground is to ensure that all the people that work for the company (incl. myself) get paid well, get excellent benefits and enjoy working for the company. Without this company there would be a lot less money going into many pockets in all corners of the industry.
Exploitation? Maybe you should check your clothes/shoe labels? Which supermarkets to you shop at and which coffee chain are you drinking from?

You are an idiot.

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Originally Posted by kyoJecours

i'm finding it hard to have sympathy for people in the porn industry. ok what's happening is legally wrong but it's not as if the porn world is some sort of moral highground. it's the same as people downloading music for free... yes industy people are missing out on income but the way they brainwash, exploit and manipulate the public i couldn't really give a fuck. plus i get free tunes :)

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your a moron plain and simple,its people like you who give porn a bad rep,your like the dude who takes a candybar out of a store without paying and saying cool ill have to try that again.porn is no different than any other bussiness were all in it to make money from the owners to the performers cameraman etc the leak needs to stop period.

you compare taking a candy bar from a store to stealing copyrighted material from a morally bankrupt industry... and i'm the moron? and by the way i don't watch pirate porn material anyway. and i'm not saying you're not right to try and recoup that money... but you should understand why 90% of people on the outside don't give a shit when you'll take advantage of anyone from any angle to get their money.

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I don't think there is any expectation of shutting own a piracy "ring" (is there such a thing?) but by hitting individuals we hope to set an example and also bring in some revenue as compensation for our losses. - Seanchai

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http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/ima...ons/report.gif

As I said, all your original bleating about Eastern European crime rings pirating porn movies is just a front to make yourself appear as if you're taking a stance based on morals/laws, when in reality, as you've said, you know perfectly well that the action you are actually choosing to take will have ZERO effect on these crime rings which YOU started crying about at the beginning of the thread. Instead you have elected to target an entirely different group: individual people, and you're doing that pour encourager les autres, which you've just admitted. And to make money. Which you've just admitted. Since the former won't work, you're left with the latter.

(Oh and compensation for your 'losses'? Don't make me laugh. It's been pointed out to you several times on this thread that some guy in Boise, Idaho watching or listening to a pirated piece of film/music on their PC does not inevitably equate to a loss for the artist/producer. You have yet to deal with that counterargument properly. And if one of the premises in your argument is obviously false, then your whole argument sucketh.)

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Originally Posted by kyoJecours

you compare taking a candy bar from a store to stealing copyrighted material from a morally bankrupt industry... and i'm the moron? and by the way i don't watch pirate porn material anyway. and i'm not saying you're not right to try and recoup that money... but you should understand why 90% of people on the outside don't give a shit when you'll take advantage of anyone from any angle to get their money.

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It's EXACTLY the same. That stolen candy bar lowers my revenue, I then have to adjust my business possibly losing staff, I don't buy as much candy from the manufacturer (who may or maybe not, is exploiting his cacao workforce), who needs less raw product and less printing of his wrapper. As the manufacturers revenue is also lost, he can't spend as much on advertising and his transportation needs are minus one candy bar, so that needs adjusting also. It's EXACTLY the same. You are hurting multiple people on multiple levels - it is theft.


Why are we morally bankrupt? Explain? Explain the morals to me, so I can understand this. Why do you think we take advantage of "anyone from any angle to get their money" - we provide a good and honest service, with excellent levels of customer service?

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Originally Posted by Niccolo

http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/ima...ons/report.gif

As I said, all your original bleating about Eastern European crime rings pirating porn movies is just a front to make yourself appear as if you're taking a stance based on morals/laws, when in reality, as you've said, you know perfectly well that the action you are actually choosing to take will have ZERO effect on these crime rings which YOU started crying about at the beginning of the thread. Instead you have elected to target an entirely different group: individual people, and you're doing that pour encourager les autres, which you've just admitted. And to make money. Which you've just admitted. Since the former won't work, you're left with the latter.

(Oh and compensation for your 'losses'? Don't make me laugh. It's been pointed out to you several times on this thread that some guy in Boise, Idaho watching or listening to a pirated piece of film/music on their PC does not inevitably equate to a loss for the artist/producer. You have yet to deal with that counterargument properly. The problem being that if one of the premises in your argument is false, then your whole argument sucketh.)

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Again where are you getting this "crime rings" from? We are going after copyright thefts which is legally wrong (morally if you are that way inclined also), what don't you get about that? If we stop some people from downloading from them then we hit them where it hurts - we've got ongoing campaigns in different areas of piracy but you are correct, to go after those people in those countries is financially unviable for us to do.

Who has pointed out that the piracy doesn't equate loss? Certainly nobody of any significance and most likely, just people who steal themselves.
Frankly, I don't care what you think - I've made my perfectly clear statements. Your agreement or disagreement with them, speaks volumes yet ultimately, is irrelevant.

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The people either running sites showing links to stolen content, or posting the stolen content themselves for download ARE running it as a business, and most of them come from countries that it's hard to take criminal action against. It's an organised full time business for them, as they get an upsell percentage on people buying download accounts. It's no bullshit. Seanchai

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Why are you crying about this when your chosen course of action is against individuals, and when your stated goal is to get money from those individuals?

At least be consistent in your thinking. If you want to actually do something about Eastern European crime rings, who are making money from your product, then go right ahead and do so.

If you want to prosecute individuals who are not making any money from your product whatsoever, in the name of loss of revenue and pour encourager les autres, then do try to provide an argument which actually supports this. So far, you have failed to do so.

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Originally Posted by Niccolo

Why are you crying about this when your chosen course of action is against individuals, and when your stated goal is to get money from those individuals?

At least be consistent in your thinking. If you want to actually do something about Eastern European crime rings, who are making money from your product, then go right ahead and do so.

If you want to prosecute individuals who are not making any money from your product whatsoever, in the name of loss of revenue and pour encourager les autres, then do try to provide an argument which actually supports this. So far, you have failed to do so.

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How have I failed to do so? Here it is AGAIN simply. If you've stolen from us, you've committed a crime and if we find you we will take legal action against you.
That's all it is.

Why are you still talking about crime rings? This has NEVER been suggested? You refuse to acknowledge I never said such a thing yet continue to bring it up, in some way to derail the points. If we can find a viable way to go after any piracy, then we will.

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Originally Posted by lisaparadise

your a moron plain and simple,its people like you who give porn a bad rep,your like the dude who takes a candybar out of a store without paying and saying cool ill have to try that again.porn is no different than any other bussiness were all in it to make money from the owners to the performers cameraman etc the leak needs to stop period.

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You're**** :wiggle: