...and the land of the freeeeeeeeee." - Not.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Friedrich_Nietzsche

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hondarobot

We're still, at least in theory, a democratic republic, or whatever we've morphed into.

The problem is the majority of people who vote are pretty dumb, at least lately.

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That is a problem in every country, believe me....

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Yes but to say we are a free country is foolish when so many of our basic rights are being taken.

The massive majority of the ignorant American public are under the impression it's free... And more "safe" with more laws that take away from our human rights (not specifically reffering to the bar incidents).

It's a shame that the majority of Americans are overweight, overworked, unhealthy, TV zombies, who believe whatever they are told, and interestingly enough are overfed yet malnourished and dehydrated because they can't seem to eat the right thing or drink water.

I get disgusted everytime I hear an obese yellow teeth bearing individual say "I hate water" or "Everything that's healthy is gross" or refer to anything cultural or different as "just plaaainnn weird".

And they all have this strange brainwashed idea that the more they work the more they will acheive this "American Dream" however most end up riddled with health problems because of the quality of the food and environment, the fact that they have the constant urge to acheive (work and work and never stop), and mentally suffering from a lack of relaxation and natural presence in their plastic world.

I guess I am opening an entirely new can of worms but the whole situation really dissapoints and depresses me, and I really belong somewhere else. I am very happy to be in the line of business I am in, so that I am contributing as little as I possibly can to "big brother" and I make enough money to buy my freedom which is what is necessary if you want this so called "freedom" :evil:

-End of Rant-

The (old) picture: Features me in a tiny mini skirt I made from denim, featuring one side made of burnt, and shred American flag, revealing my ass, and an upside down sequined American flag. My feathers represent a memorial of the Native Americans which are near extinction and their reservations have been turned into casinos to feed our greedy pigs.

Bet you all did not know I was such a political and punky little tranny, oi?

XoXoX,
Your Americunt Sweetheart, Princessa Gianna
http://princessgianna.zoomshare.com

Quote:

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Originally Posted by marquis999

OK. These are all stupid in order to point out that the law is stupid. Isn't Texas the only state that still allows open containers in cars? I lived in NC when they outlawed that in 2001.

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They outlawed open containers in Texas quite some time ago.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PrincessaGianna

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Friedrich_Nietzsche

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hondarobot

We're still, at least in theory, a democratic republic, or whatever we've morphed into.

The problem is the majority of people who vote are pretty dumb, at least lately.

---

That is a problem in every country, believe me....

---

Yes but to say we are a free country is foolish when so many of our basic rights are being taken.

The massive majority of the ignorant American public are under the impression it's free... And more "safe" with more laws that take away from our human rights (not specifically reffering to the bar incidents).

It's a shame that the majority of Americans are overweight, overworked, unhealthy, TV zombies, who believe whatever they are told, and interestingly enough are overfed yet malnourished and dehydrated because they can't seem to eat the right thing or drink water.

I get disgusted everytime I hear an obese yellow teeth bearing individual say "I hate water" or "Everything that's healthy is gross" or refer to anything cultural or different as "just plaaainnn weird".

And they all have this strange brainwashed idea that the more they work the more they will acheive this "American Dream" however most end up riddled with health problems because of the quality of the food and environment, the fact that they have the constant urge to acheive (work and work and never stop), and mentally suffering from a lack of relaxation and natural presence in their plastic world.

I guess I am opening an entirely new can of worms but the whole situation really dissapoints and depresses me, and I really belong somewhere else. I am very happy to be in the line of business I am in, so that I am contributing as little as I possibly can to "big brother" and I make enough money to buy my freedom which is what is necessary if you want this so called "freedom" :evil:

-End of Rant-

The (old) picture: Features me in a tiny mini skirt I made from denim, featuring one side made of burnt, and shred American flag, revealing my ass, and an upside down sequined American flag. My feathers represent a memorial of the Native Americans which are near extinction and their reservations have been turned into casinos to feed our greedy pigs.

Bet you all did not know I was such a political and punky little tranny, oi?

XoXoX,
Your Americunt Sweetheart, Princessa Gianna
http://princessgianna.zoomshare.com

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Very well said, Princessa
I tottaly agree.

Let me add something...

It is an individual's obligation to raise his/her spirit and make the difference. The problems's source is not political or economical, but cultural and social.
Everybody should try hard to keep up his own qualities and beliefs, should fight for them and should not find comfort in saying 'its not my fault, i found this situation excisting'.
Otherwise, due to my opinion, one is simply wasting other people's oxygen and is a total waste for the community.
On the other hand, history teaches us that there were too few individuals that managed to make the difference, from the ancient years till now.
Fortunately, there were enough, otherwise we would walk on four and live on the trees..
History will judge us all...

Giana, no bullshit, you are a real princess.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PrincessaGianna

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Friedrich_Nietzsche

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hondarobot

We're still, at least in theory, a democratic republic, or whatever we've morphed into.

The problem is the majority of people who vote are pretty dumb, at least lately.

---

That is a problem in every country, believe me....

---

Yes but to say we are a free country is foolish when so many of our basic rights are being taken.

The massive majority of the ignorant American public are under the impression it's free... And more "safe" with more laws that take away from our human rights (not specifically reffering to the bar incidents).

It's a shame that the majority of Americans are overweight, overworked, unhealthy, TV zombies, who believe whatever they are told, and interestingly enough are overfed yet malnourished and dehydrated because they can't seem to eat the right thing or drink water.

I get disgusted everytime I hear an obese yellow teeth bearing individual say "I hate water" or "Everything that's healthy is gross" or refer to anything cultural or different as "just plaaainnn weird".

And they all have this strange brainwashed idea that the more they work the more they will acheive this "American Dream" however most end up riddled with health problems because of the quality of the food and environment, the fact that they have the constant urge to acheive (work and work and never stop), and mentally suffering from a lack of relaxation and natural presence in their plastic world.

I guess I am opening an entirely new can of worms but the whole situation really dissapoints and depresses me, and I really belong somewhere else. I am very happy to be in the line of business I am in, so that I am contributing as little as I possibly can to "big brother" and I make enough money to buy my freedom which is what is necessary if you want this so called "freedom" :evil:

-End of Rant-

The (old) picture: Features me in a tiny mini skirt I made from denim, featuring one side made of burnt, and shred American flag, revealing my ass, and an upside down sequined American flag. My feathers represent a memorial of the Native Americans which are near extinction and their reservations have been turned into casinos to feed our greedy pigs.

Bet you all did not know I was such a political and punky little tranny, oi?

XoXoX,
Your Americunt Sweetheart, Princessa Gianna
http://princessgianna.zoomshare.com

---

Excellent post there. :D Good to see I'm not the only one who thinks this way. When rights are taken away for more protections, most people go, "Well, if I got nothing to hide, I got nothing to worry about!" That annoys me so much, I don't like the idea of someone being able to go through my stuff or informations, just cause some redneck in congress pissed on the constitution. How'd you like it if someone came over to your house, without warrent, and started telling you what do to? Hell, a cop wanted to park on our driveway, I kicked him out cause I got a no trespassing sign, I am glad he obliged, but I am sure there are guys who would not care about the signs and such. We Americans ARE oveworked, underpaid, out of shape workaholics who end up getting sicker from the lifestyle we created......most people call it "Efficiency", but I call it a form of strangulation. I mean working all day long to get: A house, a spouce, 2.3 kids, a 30 year mortgage, an SUV and a minivan and moving to Florida. If after constantly killing yourself for some rich guy in a suit, all you have is a health problems, a big belly, no hair, over expensive medicactions ( which don't even work most of the time or they MAKE you sicker ) and spending your declining years withering away in an old age home or something, where society pretty much tell you, "you are no longer productive and efficient....go home and DIE, and soon."

And good bit on the water thing.....when people see me drink water, they look at me as if I am drinking poison or something :lol:

It's sad that one needs to buy ones freedoms these days. People lately seem to content if they can watch The Apprentice ( Trump's a an attention whore douche'bag, why is this guy some kinda cultural icon now?), while strapping on a feed-bag of buttered popcorn and several cans of beer, and a ew greenbacks, who cares about what you can and can't do nowadays,

Love the Picture, Gianna.

I got a painting my mom made of a native american, with the flag behind him, but the red lines acting as jail bars for him. Sends a pretty easy message if one has the brainpower to digest it. I'll see if I can find it if you'd like to see it. :) I bet America was a pretty nice place till the whities set foot on it, I tell you. :idea:

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Originally Posted by lolozack

Giana, no bullshit, you are a real princess.

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::courtesy: Why thank you! :wink:

Thing that occurs to me is this: when it becomes "Normal" for government to take care of the "consequences" of a behaviour, it soon follows that said government is going to become really, REALLY obsessed with preventing it.
You hand over the consequences to the State, the damn State is going to take your freedom to risk those consequences away.

Freedoms are almost impossible to get back, once they've been taken in that fashion-even if the government then abrogates its "Responsibility" for the consequences.

People think they have a Right to be "Kept Safe". They don't think about what that means. We saw this all through the 1970's, 1980's, 1990's, and now, the 2000's. Instead of letting druggies and drunks kill themselves, we have state-financed "Treatment" (and it's every state that has it, too. don't kid yourself-how much is the only difference).

If you live in a "blue state" they pass laws to protect you from yourself-just like in "red States". What do you think the outcome of this is?
If you aren't responsible for yourself, someone else gets to decide what you can do to yourself.

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Originally Posted by Felicia Katt

Inhouston, the whole point was, how is someone who is drunk in a bar a danger to himself or to others, when the whole point of having bars is to have a safe, legal place to get intoxicated?
If the police were to set up outside a bar and arrest them as they fumbled for their car key, or stumbled off the sidewalk, that would be one thing. If the management called the police because they were a disturbance in the bar, that would be another thing. But they are arresting them in the bar, before they do anything other than become intoxicated. Thats a very different and wrong thing, entirely. Someone should have to do some overtly criminal act and being arrested should not be subject to the whim or arbitrary caprice of the officer.

FK

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I see your point, but I'm simply stating what the law is in this state. Texas law considers bars to be public (not private) establishments, and therefore you can be arrested for public intoxication inside the bar you're drinking in. Now, before you think that may be absurd, there are good reasons for this law (to keep the establishment civil). For the most part, such a law is in place to foster the exact environment you're referring to Felicia; a safe place to get intoxicated.

When there is a problem with a drunken patron in a bar (and I’ve seen it many times before), the police can use the PI law to easily remove the patron from the bar or arrest them. Usually there are police officers floating in and around bars quite often, and I've walked by and talked with them myself while lit up pretty good. I never had a problem with them. One day while at a biker bar on my bike, there was a group of Hell’s Angels that showed up. Someone obviously got nervous and tipped off the police. A cop showed up and just stood in the door casing the place. One by one, every Hell’s Angel went out the back door and took off, and we were all happier customers as a result. They knew that the cop could nab every one of them merely for ‘Public Intoxication’, and the majority of them were probably on parole. They wanted no part of that and moved on.

It’s not a bad law at all, and the stings are happening to get people to stop getting so sloshed in the bars for right now. Knowing these stings are happening, I would probably just drink three or four beers rather than six or twelve to avoid getting in trouble with the police till the stings stop. That’s nothing but good for me and everyone else.

Besides, in a month or so, the stings will stop.

I read the law. I even quoted it in my post. A person is only supposed to be subject to arrest if they are a danger to themselves or others, but the police are arresting people in the bars before they place anyone in danger. Its not supposed to be about civility, but safety. A bar's management might be concerned with the atmosphere and has the right to control to whom and how much liquor it serves, but that isn't and shouldn't be the role of the police. Law and order isn't about ordering drinks, and protect and serve isn't about serving them.

Inhouston, I only assume I know your politics as Republican ones, but that party is supposed to be against Big Government, and for personal responsibility, and spending scarce tax dollars and police resources on temperance enforcement is not inline at all with those principles. Lots of things may ultimately be good for us, but we don't want our government deciding them for us, do we?

FK

I know, I thought Republicans were supossed to be about less government, sometimes I feel like i'm the conservatives, despite many people calling me a hippie liberal, which i am none of these :lol:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Felicia Katt

I read the law. I even quoted it in my post. A person is only supposed to be subject to arrest if they are a danger to themselves or others, but the police are arresting people in the bars before they place anyone in danger. Its not supposed to be about civility, but safety. A bar's management might be concerned with the atmosphere and has the right to control to whom and how much liquor it serves, but that isn't and shouldn't be the role of the police. Law and order isn't about ordering drinks, and protect and serve isn't about serving them.

Inhouston, I only assume I know your politics as Republican ones, but that party is supposed to be against Big Government, and for personal responsibility, and spending scarce tax dollars and police resources on temperance enforcement is not inline at all with those principles. Lots of things may ultimately be good for us, but we don't want our government deciding them for us, do we?

FK

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Yes the law states they are committing an offense if they pose a danger to others or themselves … or … or … “having an alcohol concentration of 0.08 or more”. If you’re .081 and in public, you’re breaking the law in Texas. In all my years, I’ve only seen people get arrested for Public Intoxication (other than these stings) for getting mouthy with the police, or causing a disturbance.

Exceeding the legal limit of .08 is the grounds for the arrests they are doing. Now, for the most part, you can’t really tell if someone has been drinking when they’re hovering around .08. The police for the most part are targeting people who are visibly intoxicated beyond the .08 limit. However, if someone is say .10, and starts yapping to the police about how their rights are being violated, then the police will graciously take them to jail as well. Do I think this is a bad idea? No. Do I think it’s a good idea? Sure, as it’s not hurting anyone and helps to keep the community safer. Do I think it’s a great idea? Not really, because it will have no long-term benefit, and the police cannot commit the resources to keep these stings up.

As far as my politics, I am neither Republican nor Democrat. I agree and disagree with various issues stemming from both parties.

Facist agenda - make a law and the sheep abide.
seanchai

Here's my little overall political rant.............

Well, consdering that Dubya's approval rating is at an all time low and lowest since Nixon, that tells me he's not doing right.

And I do find it funny that if the leader of another country did what we did to Iraq, there would be real big hell. But since it's America, it's all ok :crap It's also ironic that we're trying to help a country escape its fanatical religious regime, despite the fact the religious right are making themselves heard quite a bit over here in the states, be it the FCC's witch hunt on indecentcy, aborition rights, advances in science ( such as stem cell research and so on ), marriage rights & benefits or denial of them' depending on who you sleep with; and so on.

Anyhow, the best kinda polticians we need are ones not with any sort of ties to corporations, the pharmacutical companies, the church, etc. Only then can things get better socially and economically. And keeps the jobs in America IN America......I am just wondering how long it is till my job gets taken away and given to some Indian in New Deli who can't even speak English well.

Also, the 2 party system just does not work the way we want it. There needs to be more, and actually be given a chance to get choosen, not where today if you vote for a thrid party, you are pretty much throwing your vote away. Cause Each party has its problems:

Democrat: You might get more freedoms, but it's a crunch on the wallet.
Republican: You might get more money, but you'll be ruled like a king, and religion is gonna play a role in everything.

Though nowadays, you don't know what one side is going to do, since election time is nothing but name calling, finger pointing, and $#!& throwing.

Remove the electoral college, and simply use the people's vote.

And for god's sake, don't let the pharmacudical industry or other big business tell a politician what to do on the way to the can and the drinking fountain. And don't give big corporations a get out of jail free card.......because for every Enron, Microsoft, Worldcom, Phizer, and Martha Stewart out there that's been caught redhanded, there's thousands more that did not get caught.

And here's something to remember.......when politicians $#!& up, you have everyright to take action and have them kicked out. Nowadays, apart from weather forecasters, politicians seem to be those people who can't get fired it seems. But remember this......WE are their bosses, not vice versa...it's amazing how many people forget this, or gasp in shock upon hearing it. You can have someone kicked out of there if you choose so, but if you actually grow a pair first and get up and do it.

And remember that famous quote, "He who gives up his freedoms for protection deserves neither freedom nor protection." And that pretty much applys to people who say, "Well if you got nothing to hide, you have nothing to worry about." They love that way if thinking in China, Cuba and parts of the Middle East. When you let that happen, Osama will be laughing in his cave, seeing the people he hates doing all his work for him, and not needing to get his hands dirty at all.

Feel free to send me any angry PM's that you wish to make now. *leaps off the soap box*


This rant has been brought to you by the Campaign for Trogdor for President 2012 & 2016 foundation. :rock2 :grouphug :peanutbutter :mrgreen: :moon

DEATH TO THE SMOKERS!!
DEATH TO THE DRINKERS!!!!
DEATH TO THE DRUG USERS!!!!
DEATH TO THE SEX ABUSERS!!
DEATH TO THE RELIGOUS!!!!!
DEATH TO THE ATHEISTS!!!!
DEATH TO YOUR MOTHER,
YOUR FATHER, YOUR FAMILY,
YOUR TOWN, YOUR STATE,
AND YOUR NATION!!!!!!
BURNING METORS OF DEATH
FROM THE SKY TO EVERYONE!!!
KILL THEM ALL AND LET GOD
SORT THEM OUT!!!!
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FriendlyFriend

DEATH TO THE SMOKERS!!
DEATH TO THE DRINKERS!!!!
DEATH TO THE DRUG USERS!!!!
DEATH TO THE SEX ABUSERS!!
DEATH TO THE RELIGOUS!!!!!
DEATH TO THE ATHEISTS!!!!
DEATH TO YOUR MOTHER,
YOUR FATHER, YOUR FAMILY,
YOUR TOWN, YOUR STATE,
AND YOUR NATION!!!!!!
BURNING METORS OF DEATH
FROM THE SKY TO EVERYONE!!!
KILL THEM ALL AND LET GOD
SORT THEM OUT!!!!
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
!

---

<Mr. Lucas voice> Glass of water for FriendlyFriend.

Arresting people in bars seems like a stupid thing to do, as I watched a TV news story that showed half a dozen police officers engaged in this activity in what appeared to be a local bar. (I wonder how many of these raids occur at the country clubs frequented by lawyers and politicians.) In the meantime, there were probably any number of people driving away drunk from bars in the same neighborhood.

If there is a rise in DUI's in Texas, I'll bet there are many repeat offenders in this group and it might be more useful to prevent them from driving, as they are likely to be irresponsible alcoholics who have no intention of seeking treatment for themselves. How many times do you hear about a tragic accident committed by a repeat offender?

I just don’t see the point in arresting people who are not harming others, while stretching police resources that could be better put to use going after people who are clearly a danger to others. If someone is caught driving under the influence more than one time, their judgment is obviously impaired and they will have shown themselves to be incapable of controlling this hazardous behavior.

If the person is responsible for caring for others, or needs a car to keep a job (with no other forms of transportation available), they should simply be limited to using their car only for these kinds of activities and pay for some kind of electronic monitoring for a year as an option for license suspension. There should not be too many steps from denied driving privileges in all 50 states if this behavior continues.

... some kind of electronic monitoring...

How strange, the word m-o-n-i-t-o-r-i-n-g cannot be posted...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by InHouston

Yes the law states they are committing an offense if they pose a danger to others or themselves … or … or … “having an alcohol concentration of 0.08 or more”. If you’re .081 and in public, you’re breaking the law in Texas. In all my years, I’ve only seen people get arrested for Public Intoxication (other than these stings) for getting mouthy with the police, or causing a disturbance.
Exceeding the legal limit of .08 is the grounds for the arrests they are doing. Now, for the most part, you can’t really tell if someone has been drinking when they’re hovering around .08. The police for the most part are targeting people who are visibly intoxicated beyond the .08 limit. However, if someone is say .10, and starts yapping to the police about how their rights are being violated, then the police will graciously take them to jail as well. Do I think this is a bad idea? No. Do I think it’s a good idea? Sure, as it’s not hurting anyone and helps to keep the community safer. Do I think it’s a great idea? Not really, because it will have no long-term benefit, and the police cannot commit the resources to keep these stings up.
As far as my politics, I am neither Republican nor Democrat. I agree and disagree with various issues stemming from both parties.

---

Inhouston, either you misread or misunderstood the statute
here is what it says: "Public Intoxication" means:
A person commits an offense if the person appears in a public place while intoxicated to the degree that the person may endanger the person or another.
"Intoxicated" is defined as:
not having the normal use of mental or physical faculties by reason of the introduction of alcohol, controlled substance, a drug, a dangerous drug, a combination of two or more of those substances, or any other substance into the body; or having an alcohol concentration of 0.08 or more.
They have to be a danger to themselves or others while intoxicated. The statute defines intoxication two ways: not having normal use of their facilities due to a substance or substances, or a .08 alcohol concentration. Just being intoxicated is not enough. Whatever your political stripe may be, its hard for me to beleive you really would think that no one is hurt if they are hauled off to jail just for expressing a well lubricated opinion to the police.

FK

Quote:

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Originally Posted by seanchai

Facist agenda - make a law and the sheep abide.
seanchai

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Seanchai, there is such a thing as a 'good law'. Thanks to the public intoxication law in Texas, you don't have people passed out at the bar, passed out on park benches, and people puking and pissing in public around every corner. Those conditions (that are prevalent in other countries I'm sure you've frequented) are what the public intoxication laws prevent.

Now in all fairness, I know you're sounding an alarm where civil liberties are concerned, but this matter is not something to be alarmed about. It’s been on the books for a long long time and serves the public well.

Now here's an example of a bad law in Texas.

http://www.sodomylaws.org/usa/texas/txnews40.htm

Personally mate, I'd prefer to see someone passed out in a British pub - asleep on a bench in a park or puking up on his way back from the pub after a kebab than the police arresting people for this....oh wait, I would have been in jail now if I'd lived in Texas.
It's bollocks - pure and simple bollocks.
Of course there are good laws - but this is just crazy.
seanchai

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Felicia Katt

Quote:

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Originally Posted by InHouston

Yes the law states they are committing an offense if they pose a danger to others or themselves … or … or … “having an alcohol concentration of 0.08 or more”. If you’re .081 and in public, you’re breaking the law in Texas. In all my years, I’ve only seen people get arrested for Public Intoxication (other than these stings) for getting mouthy with the police, or causing a disturbance.
Exceeding the legal limit of .08 is the grounds for the arrests they are doing. Now, for the most part, you can’t really tell if someone has been drinking when they’re hovering around .08. The police for the most part are targeting people who are visibly intoxicated beyond the .08 limit. However, if someone is say .10, and starts yapping to the police about how their rights are being violated, then the police will graciously take them to jail as well. Do I think this is a bad idea? No. Do I think it’s a good idea? Sure, as it’s not hurting anyone and helps to keep the community safer. Do I think it’s a great idea? Not really, because it will have no long-term benefit, and the police cannot commit the resources to keep these stings up.
As far as my politics, I am neither Republican nor Democrat. I agree and disagree with various issues stemming from both parties.

---

Inhouston, either you misread or misunderstood the statute
here is what it says: "Public Intoxication" means:
A person commits an offense if the person appears in a public place while intoxicated to the degree that the person may endanger the person or another.
"Intoxicated" is defined as:
not having the normal use of mental or physical faculties by reason of the introduction of alcohol, controlled substance, a drug, a dangerous drug, a combination of two or more of those substances, or any other substance into the body; or having an alcohol concentration of 0.08 or more.
They have to be a danger to themselves or others while intoxicated. The statute defines intoxication two ways: not having normal use of their facilities due to a substance or substances, or a .08 alcohol concentration. Just being intoxicated is not enough. Whatever your political stripe may be, its hard for me to beleive you really would think that no one is hurt if they are hauled off to jail just for expressing a well lubricated opinion to the police.

FK

---

:shrug Sweety I've live here all my life. Having an alcohol concentration of 0.08 or more, coupled with a "well-lubricated opinion" to the police, will land you in the drunk tank every single time in Texas, and you will stand tall before the 'man' in the morning. Now on the flipside, I was pulled over one night after having several rum and cokes. I’m sure he could smell it, but I was as courteous and cooperative as I could be. I even turned on my dome lights and put my hands on the steering wheel when he approached my vehicle. I got a ticket, and just before he turned to return to his patrol car he said, “By the way, I really appreciate your courtesy and cooperation, but drinking and driving don’t mix. Now don’t let me see you on the road again tonight.” I replied “Fair enough and thank you too.” Whew.

Another example of tolerance by the police: One night my girlfriend and I were pretty drunk and two cops were standing right outside the door of the bar we were leaving. Now we’re both guilty of public intoxication and we knew it. I decided to have a little fun and we approached these two cops. I asked, “Excuse me officers but is this illegal?”, and I yanked her shirt up and showed them her tits. One redneck deputy belted out “Gosh dang look er there!” The other said “That’s not illegal in my book.” I asked “Wanna touch em?” He laughed and said, “I’d love to, but that is highly illegal for me.” Pretty funny.

There are bad cops out there, but for the most part they’re just people like you and I. You show them respect and treat them as people, and they’ll generally be tolerant unless you’ve committed a serious offense. Now, if you approach them with your feathers ruffled, in their head they’ll think “Okay what can I charge this bastard with.” Anyone who is willing to take a bullet on their job has my respect.

And we’re not sheep here in Texas as Seanchai would have it. One day an asshole (major asshole!) patrolman tailgated me for a mile because I wouldn’t get out of the fast lane on the freeway. I thought, “Fuck him” and I stayed put. He pulled me over pissed off to high heaven. He yelled and ranted and I stood my ground insisting very austerely “On what charge? On what charge? On what charge? ” I wasn’t speeding or anything. He said “Keep it up and you’re gonna go to jail.” I said “Keep what up? You lay one hand on me without probable cause and I’ll have a lawsuit on your ass Ajax won’t scrub off.” He got one inch in my face and yelled “Fuck you!!!!”, stormed to his patrol car, burned rubber, and I flipped him the bird as he screeched by. He knew he had one foot in the door at the Houston Police Department’s Internal Affairs Division, and decided to terminate his little traffic stop for his own good.

The police may have 0.08 as leverage, but we citizens also have that key phrase “probable cause” on our side. A civil rights violation goes all the way up to the mayor and sometimes ends up in the national media, and he wanted no part of that.

I’m all for the public intoxication laws here in Texas. I worry more about the citizens in this state than I do the police. Many citizens in this state are bigger assholes than the 99% of the police out there just trying to do their job, and that is a fact.

Just my two cents.

Why were you driving in the fast lane and wouldn't get out of the way? I'll never understand that about driving in US how clearly the inside lane is the fast one but if someone is doing the speed limit "it's their goddam right to cruise along a that speed" - would never happen in Europe.
Texas on the whole is pretty good for that though, was most impressed by drivers on smaller roads in SE Texas who pull onto shoulder if a car is coming behind them faster to let past.

You think being drunk and your girlfriend acting like a slut in front of an officer is funny? I just don't get it, where is the humour in that?

I've been pulled up a dozen times - never for DUI as I don't do that but for speeding which I do way too much - I act courteous and 9/10 have had courteous cops, I don't have an issue with police or authority, I have an issue with a law that takes your freedoms away but hey, if you're happy demeaning your girlfriend in public and cruising in the fast lane needlessly, your liberties and your value of what those liberties mean to you are obviously different to mine and seem to work in your favour!
:?

seanchai

Quote:

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Originally Posted by seanchai

Personally mate, I'd prefer to see someone passed out in a British pub - asleep on a bench in a park or puking up on his way back from the pub after a kebab than the police arresting people for this....oh wait, I would have been in jail now if I'd lived in Texas.
It's bollocks - pure and simple bollocks.
Of course there are good laws - but this is just crazy.
seanchai

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Well ... not crazy. While the stings are legal, they are 'over the top', but for the following reasons. This is America, and there are a lot of jerks that become bigger jerks when they start drinking. While I’ve never been there, I’m sure the bars in Europe avail a more jolly and gregarious environment, but you have to be cautious in American bars. People get drunk here and they like to start talking shit. Now … one night I was in a Bennigan's restaurant, and there were two gang-bangers at the bar loud, mouthy, and saying things like “Man I’ll shoot a mutha fucka any time any day. I don’t give a fuck. Yeah nigga!!!” and all this hoopla ghetto bullshit. This went on for some time and while waiting for my meal I kept thinking “Great … just fucking great.” Now they were talking to themselves and not directly to anyone else. So they weren’t a threat according to the law, but were obviously above 0.08 given the number of empty glasses at their table. The rest of the patrons (including me) were getting nervous by their demeanor. It was all pretentious bravado, but very unsettling at the same time in their presence. Twenty minutes later myself and other patrons laughed as two uniformed officers approached them at the bar. One of them decided to educate the officers and said, “We ain’t breakin da law” and beat his chest saying “You aint got nuthin on me.” BAM! They slammed them both against the bar, jacked them up, and booked them both for Public Intoxication RIGHT AT THE BAR. The cops didn’t even look twice at the other drunken patrons at the bar who were just there to have a good time. Everyone had a look of relief on their faces and I turned to one patron and said “Thank fucking God.” He said “I know … get them the fuck out of here.” Everything was nice and comfy after that.

You can either look at this as a violation of their civil rights, which is not the case. Or you can look at it for what it really is. The police intelligently utilized the legal limit of 0.08 where the public intoxication law is concerned to diffuse a potentially volatile situation. I for one, was very appreciative of that law that evening. I was actually getting so unsettled by their behavior that I was rushing through my meal to get out of there. No one should be in that position as a paying customer, and this is why the bars are not considered to be private establishments, so the police can step in and keep things safe. That is fine for me.

In Europe, probably the most eventful thing would be everyone raising their mugs and chanting “Ziggy Zoggy Ziggy Zoggy oy oy oy!!!” You don’t need a public intoxication law in that kind of an environment. What you need in there are naked mud wrestlers.

Cheerio!

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Originally Posted by FriendlyFriend

DEATH TO THE SMOKERS!!
DEATH TO THE DRINKERS!!!!
DEATH TO THE DRUG USERS!!!!
DEATH TO THE SEX ABUSERS!!
DEATH TO THE RELIGOUS!!!!!
DEATH TO THE ATHEISTS!!!!
DEATH TO YOUR MOTHER,
YOUR FATHER, YOUR FAMILY,
YOUR TOWN, YOUR STATE,
AND YOUR NATION!!!!!!
BURNING METORS OF DEATH
FROM THE SKY TO EVERYONE!!!
KILL THEM ALL AND LET GOD
SORT THEM OUT!!!!
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
!

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:what And your point is?

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Originally Posted by justin

I wonder how many of these raids occur at the country clubs frequented by lawyers and politicians.

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Good point! Probably none.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by seanchai

Why were you driving in the fast lane and wouldn't get out of the way?

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It was early in the morning, no traffic, and just happened to be in the fast lane about 10 mph above the speed limit. With four other empty lanes, he comes flying up behind me and gets right on my ass. I thought he was about to pull me over so I slowed down to 55. Then he started nodding his head and yelling at me over the P.A. to get out of the way. I thought “Fuck him.” Now that is wrong and very unprofessional.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by seanchai

You think being drunk and your girlfriend acting like a slut in front of an officer is funny? I just don't get it, where is the humour in that?

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Actually it was an altruistic gesture on my part. They were kind of old, fat, and struck me as ‘lacking’ where women are concerned. So, thought I would treat them to a little eye candy. They understood and were appreciative.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by seanchai

I've been pulled up a dozen times - never for DUI as I don't do that but for speeding which I do way too much - I act courteous and 9/10 have had courteous cops, I don't have an issue with police or authority, I have an issue with a law that takes your freedoms away but hey, if you're happy demeaning your girlfriend in public and cruising in the fast lane needlessly, your liberties and your value of what those liberties mean to you are obviously different to mine and seem to work in your favour!

---

Well, that girlfriend at the time was a good sport about things like that and loved every minute of it. She had a nice boob job and was very proud of them. As we walked away she said “Oh my god that was s-o-o fun.” She was cool, but not marriage material by any stretch of the imagination.

Texas is gonna lose a lot of fucking money from this. Very dumb. Obvious a half thinking retard approcved that. The sad part is everyone else must eiother be stupid or too much of a coward to speak up. What should have happened? Before going to that extreme they should have atleast watched those drunks and see oif they attempted tp get behind the wheel. Then move in for the arrest. That's common sense. Arresting people in bars is just idiotic.

Smoking kills people, second hand smoke is deadly if an establishment wants to ban smoking mor epower to them. If the city wants to ban smoking in public places, good. If an establishment wants to allow smoking though it should be up to the individual to decide if he wants to frequent that place.

Nice retorts, InHouston!
Now get out of the fast lane!!
seanchai

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Originally Posted by seanchai

Nice retorts, InHouston!
Now get out of the fast lane!!
seanchai

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Now I drive an S.U.V., and am rarely in the fast lane and mostly on cruise control.

Ziggy Zoggy

Inhouston, the stated purpose of the stings was to cut down on drunk driving, or people doing stupid things. You are pulled over while driving drunk on one occasion and you respond to police outside a bar on another one by exposing a girl's boobs and you do not get in any legal trouble. But some African American do nothing more than be loud and annoying and make some white folks nervous and they are hauled off to jail. You don't see the inequity in that??

If it had been a bunch of obnoxious Enron traders in the same Bennigans, shouting about the killing they made that day in the market, or how they had raped this Public Utility or that one, equally boisterous and equally obnoxious, they would never get arrested. When a law is so vague that it gives the police discretion that they exercise in race-based ways, its just wrong, and the clearest form of civil rights violation.

Of all injustice, that is the greatest which goes under the name of law; and of all sorts of tyranny the forcing of the letter of the law against the equity, is the most insupportable”
L. Estrange


FK

Hehe. I've been running across these InHouston posts more often lately, kinda funny. He seems like an intelligent, at least articulate guy, but I just can't climb on board with his dream of a sanitized, "safe for the white man" world.

Black guys were getting loud and talking shit at Bennigans? Holy Crap, who let "those people" into Bennigans!? How can anyone enjoy their shrimp scampi with people like that around? Loud talking is obviously a precursor to shooting the place up.

On a serious note, loud "trash talking" is annoying in most settings. They should be told to calm down and there is no argument there. But calling the cops? That's just knee jerk "them black folk are acting up!" sort of bullshit.

I've seen all kinds of scary bar situations. Violent fights, beat downs, knives or guns pulled out, people kicked in the head, blood spewing all over the place, you name it. The majority of stupid violence (vs just talking shit) has always been at the hands of drunk white jocks, rednecks, or skinheads. I have seen people who are not white commit stupid, violent acts, but white people seem to be the worst in most cases, they just tend to get away with it more often.

Admittedly, this is coming from a guy in white bread Minneapolis, but that's just things as far as I've seen 'em.

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Originally Posted by hondarobot

... "safe for the white man" world.

Black guys were getting loud and talking shit at Bennigans? Holy Crap, who let "those people" into Bennigans!? How can anyone enjoy their shrimp scampi with people like that around?

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I have four good friends in my life, two of which I spend the most time with who are black, and one who is hispanic, and the last I spend the least time with is white. So you can put your race card back in your deck.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hondarobot

Loud talking is obviously a precursor to shooting the place up.

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Loud talking is not necessarily a precursor to shooting up the place. However, when two gangsters are pointing to myself and other patrons loudly boasting "I'll shoot dat mutha fucka, him, her ... I don't give a fuck", then yes there is the possibility that a violent confrontation could ensue. There were men, women, and children in there. All that was needed was for some concerned parent to ask them to refrain from using vulgarity around their children, and all hell would have probably been unleashed in there. This occurred in a downtown Bennigan’s and half the patrons in there were black. After they were removed, one black guy at the bar said out loud “Damn them drive-by niggas had me scared too.”

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Felicia Katt

Inhouston, the stated purpose of the stings was to cut down on drunk driving, or people doing stupid things. You are pulled over while driving drunk on one occasion and you respond to police outside a bar on another one by exposing a girl's boobs and you do not get in any legal trouble. But some African American do nothing more than be loud and annoying and make some white folks nervous and they are hauled off to jail. You don't see the inequity in that??

If it had been a bunch of obnoxious Enron traders in the same Bennigans, shouting about the killing they made that day in the market, or how they had raped this Public Utility or that one, equally boisterous and equally obnoxious, they would never get arrested. When a law is so vague that it gives the police discretion that they exercise in race-based ways, its just wrong, and the clearest form of civil rights violation.

Of all injustice, that is the greatest which goes under the name of law; and of all sorts of tyranny the forcing of the letter of the law against the equity, is the most insupportable”
L. Estrange


FK

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I see your point, but this wasn't a racial matter, it was a criminal matter. Half the patrons in that downtown Bennigan’s were African American and everyone was relieved when they were removed. Now the restaurant can refuse service to any patron, and I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that the manager possibly called the police. He probably didn’t want to confront these two individuals, as none of us would have wanted to either. I do recall the police initially talking quietly to the two individuals, suggesting they ratchet down the talk or leave. Then one of them jumped up and challenged the police officer’s legal premise on confronting them, and it was shortly over for both of them after that.

Call it what you will, but I saw it for what it was. With the Public Intoxication laws in Texas, one shouldn’t sit in a bar intoxicated loudly touting their propensity for violent tactics against innocent citizens lest they end up in the drunk-tank downtown.

I agree that, if you and others felt honestly threatened in that situation, then it would be appropriate to call the police. Not a racial matter at all, just common sense.

Soooo. . . .

Why did you bring up the fact that they were black at all? I guess it is part of the story, but it certainly doesn't help you argument that race wasn't a factor in how you viewed things at the time. You could have left race out of it entirely, just "two loud, violent guys", but you chose to include those descriptive details.

Evidence, although admittedly not proof, that race is indeed a factor for you.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hondarobot

I agree that, if you and others felt honestly threatened in that situation, then it would be appropriate to call the police. Not a racial matter at all, just common sense.

Soooo. . . .

Why did you bring up the fact that they were black at all? I guess it is part of the story, but it certainly doesn't help you argument that race wasn't a factor in how you viewed things at the time. You could have left race out of it entirely, just "two loud, violent guys", but you chose to include those descriptive details.

Evidence, although admittedly not proof, that race is indeed a factor for you.

---

A couple of earlier posts from otheres suggested that racism played a factor in this.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by InHouston

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hondarobot

... "safe for the white man" world.

Black guys were getting loud and talking shit at Bennigans? Holy Crap, who let "those people" into Bennigans!? How can anyone enjoy their shrimp scampi with people like that around?

---

I have four good friends in my life, two of which I spend the most time with who are black, and one who is hispanic, and the last I spend the least time with is white. So you can put your race card back in your deck.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hondarobot

Loud talking is obviously a precursor to shooting the place up.

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Loud talking is not necessarily a precursor to shooting up the place. However, when two gangsters are pointing to myself and other patrons loudly boasting "I'll shoot dat mutha fucka, him, her ... I don't give a fuck", then yes there is the possibility that a violent confrontation could ensue. There were men, women, and children in there. All that was needed was for some concerned parent to ask them to refrain from using vulgarity around their children, and all hell would have probably been unleashed in there. This occurred in a downtown Bennigan’s and half the patrons in there were black. After they were removed, one black guy at the bar said out loud “Damn them drive-by niggas had me scared too.”

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LOL. Sounds like the old "some of my best friends are jews" line.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hondarobot

I agree that, if you and others felt honestly threatened in that situation, then it would be appropriate to call the police. Not a racial matter at all, just common sense.

Soooo. . . .

Why did you bring up the fact that they were black at all? I guess it is part of the story, but it certainly doesn't help you argument that race wasn't a factor in how you viewed things at the time. You could have left race out of it entirely, just "two loud, violent guys", but you chose to include those descriptive details.

Evidence, although admittedly not proof, that race is indeed a factor for you.

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Without looking to comment on the entire breadth of this debate, I do want to note something about one specific point. So far as InHouston's use of race as a descriptive in his recounting of the event is concerned, I think the criticism is a bit unfair. How often does someone just say something like "two guys were acting a certain way"? To include a description of race, age, gender, height, size or whatever does not seem, in and of itself, to be indicative of bias.

-Quinn

Fair enough, Quinn. I can't judge InHouston to be a racist (although I never said I did, exactly) based solely on something he posts on HA and/or how he words it. I just got a bad feel for him after reading a few other posts. I won't give any examples, as others can make their own conclusions. Also, I may not agree with his views on things, but that's my issue, not his.

I also find it hard to believe that anyone would think two stone cold killahs rolled into. . .Bennigans, prepared to shoot the place up or commit other acts of violence. I guess it happens, but I don't think Bennigans is a place too many people have to worry about a bullet spree breaking out. Agreed, it could happen and even happens at McDonalds, but it seemed like a bit of an over reaction to call the cops on account of two loud drunks.

The staff or management should have handled it, that's part of the job.

All I'm gonna say is I was left with the impression of that guy in 12 Angry Men. "I mean, you know how these people are, how they live! I mean, some of 'em are OK, but you just can't trust 'em!"

Or, as Scipio said. . .

Just to give my two cent on the original point of this thread...

What a load of nonsense. Here in Ireland we have banned smoking in pubs and clubs for a couple of years now and it was a great move. Your clothes don't smell like crap whenyou get home, and the development of outdoor smoking shelters has given us a new way to chat up women.

But banning drunkeness in bars?

I am glad to say that would never happen here, but if it did you might as well close the whoe country down. If this is their solution for drink driving they might as well ban driving on roads!!!