No, I Don't Have To Tell You I'm Trans Before Dating You

I had a friend in college who was infertile due to developmental disorder. She was very pretty, sexually active and, as many girls her age, was looking for Mr. Right. Did she immediately tell every man she went out on a date with about her issue? Of course not. Is there any point if it becomes clear the relationship won’t make it past two or three dates? The question for her was, how serious could she allow the relationship to go before she informed the man of her condition?

I always felt a special empathy for her because my situation was not dissimilar to hers. Suppose a man is interested in you. He strikes up a conversation. You find you have similar interests. You can easily rift and opine on each others stories. You find you are attracted to each. So after an hour or so the man says, “Would you like to have diner this evening?” How do you respond? “Sure but you should know I’m transgender,”? This was at a time in my life when passing was everything. I didn’t (and still don’t) want to reveal to every stranger my more intimate secrets; and although we got along and liked each other for the last hour this man is still a stranger - at this stage could I trust him to keep the things I tell him about myself to himself? Of course not.

Of course I have a dick and my friend has a vagina. She could probably have married a guy without him knowing about her condition. That (imo) would’ve been unethical. (She didn’t btw). A transgender woman with vaginoplasty could perhaps do the same - again unethical. There’s a point when you need to tell, but when?
For me the question wasn’t about marriage or children. It was just about sex. It would be pretty rude of me spring my boner on a unsuspecting guy two minutes before we about to tumble into the sack. The question is still, “How serious do I let the relationship get before I tell him?” The answer is probably before we have sex, but how do I know when that’s going to happen - nobody sets a date for that. So sometimes accidents happen. Rarely for me, but were times when it was just to late and the moment arrived. Once the guy was very polite, made his excuses, apologized and left. Once the guy screamed at me, and punched me the stomach.

There was another time when I got cut. I told this story in a thread on HA ages ago. I was out with some girlfriends one evening we decided to go a bar - there was only one and it was a dive. We all got a bit tipsy and some guys came over to our table to chat us up. There was a juke box and they wanted to dance. I saw no harm in that. However, my partner turned out to be an octopus. I kept pulling his hands off me. “This is definitely going the last dance,” I thought when suddenly I felt his hand grab me where only reality-tv-hosts get to grab. At first we were both in shock. Then he started shouting to the whole joint that I was a man. Before I knew it he had knife in his hand and arm had been opened up (required stitches but nothing serious). The bouncer and the bartender intervened and my friends got me out of there. So are you obligated to tell someone you're transgender before accepting a dance? Of course not.

People have got to learn to be civil even as we all have to be wary that some people are just unreasonable, ignorant jerks.

The targets of violence are not responsible for the violence done to them. It is not our duty to deflect it by adding even more tedium to our lives. “Is my dress too provocative?” “Should I tell I’m transgender before he buys me that coffee?” Those of us who claim we live in a civilized society have a duty to support civilized norms. We can start by blaming the perpetrators of violence and not the people they violate.

The subject of when to tell is very tricky.
I go out clubbing very often with a group of trans friends including my partner. We are into swinging and it is not uncommon for the girls to hook up with guys while clubbing for some fun.
Guys come over and start chatting and dancing with the girls and if they get particularly clingy then the girls come over to me and make it clear we are a group. I can then instigate a conversation with the guy and let him know the situation.

Interestingly about a third of guys say thanks for telling me but it's not for me and clear off sharpish. About a third are amazed, say it's not for them but still want to dance and buy the girls drinks, get there pics taken with them etc. The remaining third are are fine with it and are up for fun. I was amazed how many young guys are cool with it.
We have only ever had a couple of bad reactions from guys who kicked off at being told and I put that down to their own insecurities.

I'm not a fan of violence against anybody, really, but it always comes down to what that ol' dapper Nietzsche wrote - something along the lines of, "Beware that, when fighting monsters, you yourself do not become a monster... for when you gaze long into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you."

Interpret that how you wish (and in no way am I calling transsexuals "monsters"), but I like to think that among everything else, maybe he was simply talking about the nature of chaos. There are seven billion people inhabiting this planet, retroboy. And every single one is different. Now laws state that it's illegal (and, of course, immoral) to maim and/or kill a person because one feels "tricked", but there are simply some people who share this planet with us, whose thought-process takes into account neither law, morals, ethics or even logic. People whose proverbial engines run purely on the nature of the self, and how actions and reactions apply to them. That's simply the nature of chaos.

If it's your wish to continue "gazing into the abyss" and testing your luck when encountering such individuals that you have not told of your secret, then know that in no way am I judging you for it. Just remember that the abyss also gazes back.

You can keep playing around if you want... just keep on gambling I guess the pay off is worth it!

I kill them!

Oh and recording people who anonymously dare transsexuals is Wire Tapping a crime that Eva a transsexual and a few others learned about the hard way.

Look I'm a guy and I like chicks. If I like a chick I shouldn't care if she has pussy, dick, or both. Some guys need to step up and be men - if someone going to start shit with you for dating a transsexual you should knock him out and stand up for your girl.

Trish that sounds scary. I know girls who have had things like that happen too (trans girls). It doesn't make a difference when you tell them - some guys are assholes and they get angry that they are attracted to trans girls. They should be teaching in schools that trans is normal as gay or straight. One day it could be safe to be a trans girl.

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Originally Posted by trish

I had a friend in college who was infertile due to developmental disorder. She was very pretty, sexually active and, as many girls her age, was looking for Mr. Right. Did she immediately tell every man she went out on a date with about her issue? Of course not. Is there any point if it becomes clear the relationship won’t make it past two or three dates? The question for her was, how serious could she allow the relationship to go before she informed the man of her condition?

I always felt a special empathy for her because my situation was not dissimilar to hers. Suppose a man is interested in you. He strikes up a conversation. You find you have similar interests. You can easily rift and opine on each others stories. You find you are attracted to each. So after an hour or so the man says, “Would you like to have diner this evening?” How do you respond? “Sure but you should know I’m transgender,”? This was at a time in my life when passing was everything. I didn’t (and still don’t) want to reveal to every stranger my more intimate secrets; and although we got along and liked each other for the last hour this man is still a stranger - at this stage could I trust him to keep the things I tell him about myself to himself? Of course not.

Of course I have a dick and my friend has a vagina. She could probably have married a guy without him knowing about her condition. That (imo) would’ve been unethical. (She didn’t btw). A transgender woman with vaginoplasty could perhaps do the same - again unethical. There’s a point when you need to tell, but when?
For me the question wasn’t about marriage or children. It was just about sex. It would be pretty rude of me spring my boner on a unsuspecting guy two minutes before we about to tumble into the sack. The question is still, “How serious do I let the relationship get before I tell him?” The answer is probably before we have sex, but how do I know when that’s going to happen - nobody sets a date for that. So sometimes accidents happen. Rarely for me, but were times when it was just to late and the moment arrived. Once the guy was very polite, made his excuses, apologized and left. Once the guy screamed at me, and punched me the stomach.

There was another time when I got cut. I told this story in a thread on HA ages ago. I was out with some girlfriends one evening we decided to go a bar - there was only one and it was a dive. We all got a bit tipsy and some guys came over to our table to chat us up. There was a juke box and they wanted to dance. I saw no harm in that. However, my partner turned out to be an octopus. I kept pulling his hands off me. “This is definitely going the last dance,” I thought when suddenly I felt his hand grab me where only reality-tv-hosts get to grab. At first we were both in shock. Then he started shouting to the whole joint that I was a man. Before I knew it he had knife in his hand and arm had been opened up (required stitches but nothing serious). The bouncer and the bartender intervened and my friends got me out of there. So are you obligated to tell someone you're transgender before accepting a dance? Of course not.

People have got to learn to be civil even as we all have to be wary that some people are just unreasonable, ignorant jerks.

The targets of violence are not responsible for the violence done to them. It is not our duty to deflect it by adding even more tedium to our lives. “Is my dress too provocative?” “Should I tell I’m transgender before he buys me that coffee?” Those of us who claim we live in a civilized society have a duty to support civilized norms. We can start by blaming the perpetrators of violence and not the people they violate.

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That's an all too common and awful story. The first TS (actually intersex) person I ever met had been cut from the stomach up (and had the scar to prove it). I do suspect that most of these guys that are "shocked" know exactly what is going on, but the cultural shame is what makes them snap. There is of course a recent acceptance of "passable" transgenders (a superficial bias if you will) and it seems that millennials might be able to enjoy an acceptance that some of us will never know.

Religious beliefs make them snap, cultural norms,disgust, violation of trust and so much more..

Yes it's a duty to tell. The perfect example was given before: it's the equivalent of a person saying "I do not have to tell you i am married before dating you."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdeJWS5_Upk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=plTvB1-HSx8

To UserLunatic: It’s just a date. Duty hardly applies. I know some guys like to think every date is a prelude to romance and/or sex, but it just isn’t so. You make dates with friends and people you think you may like have as friends. Neither you nor I are obligated to reveal our martial status just to make or accept a date - perhaps if and when we sense the relationship may become romantic - but it would be presumptuous of me to suppose such a thing before you even asked me out.

I don’t need to know if you’re a virgin nor do I need to know your dick size, or whether you’ve got a STD: not until it looks like our interest in each other is becoming sexual - then I’ll want to know - and that's when I'll tell you I'm trans.

To spankrod: Nietzsche, was speaking about the monsters in your (his) own psyche, not the ones you may encounter by chance if your behavior falls short of prudent. (I'm not sure Nietzsche would always advise prudence - in the modern sense of the word.)

Once again: The targets of violence are not responsible for the violence done to them. It is not our duty to deflect it by adding even more tedium to our lives. “Is my dress too provocative?” “Should I tell I’m transgender before he buys me that coffee?” Those of us who claim we live in a civilized society have a duty to support civilized norms. We can start by blaming the perpetrators of violence and not the people they violate.

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Originally Posted by trish

Those of us who claim we live in a civilized society have a duty to support civilized norms. We can start by blaming the perpetrators of violence and not the people they violate.

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Hear, hear ... :cheers:

When you try to hide the fact you are married you are, first and foremost, violating the trust of the person you are married to. Everything else is secondary. There is usually no harm to the person who admits to being married upfront other than the possibility of the date ending. Not the same risk level as a passable transgender person disclosing her status up front.

The STD example Trish gave is a much better comparison. If a lady with a persistent case of genital herpes were to go on a date she would, of course, be obligated to bring up her status before sex...but only then. The risk to her of disclosing this information simply to share a coffee or a meal is way too high. As has been stated, way too many people confuse hookups with a simple date.

A person that stabs someone in the face 119 times or smashes a girls head into the sidewalk until it's pulp, simply because of a (not always) late reveal, is an animal that has no control of his impulses and will probably commit other acts of assault in a lifetime.

I kind of understand why a person would suggest that a lady disclose her TS status for her own protection, if that is really the worry...But the tone in some posts suggest that acts of violence other than for physical defense are still justifiable. They are not. Also people think they have an absolute right to know everything about an individual upfront...they don't. If you've lived on this planet long enough, trust me, you will eventually have something you don't want to reveal upfront simply because you agree to meeting someone at a Starbucks...unless that is your choice. Absolute sincerity about everything you do can become refreshing in life, but to a younger person - with all of life's insecurities, it can also be devastating.

http://www.tmz.com/2017/07/30/charla...ro3?adid=hero3

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lItBaZ3jc_E&t=747s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mddNgZGVTLs

They should be held accountable because they, mainly CTG, was instigating(that's what he does) and trying to get that reaction out of him. It's not like it was Lil Duval went on a long unanswered rant. Not saying something should or shouldn't happen, but they do need to own it.

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Originally Posted by natina

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdeJWS5_Upk

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No comment on this as of yet?

I think it's fairly simple - yes.

A recent survey said 20% of people have broken up with someone about their political views. So if you are getting that sort of number about something not directly related to the relationship then something as fundamental as gender and gender identity has the potential for a much greater effect.

Sure there are a lot of arguments about how a trans woman wants to just be treated as a woman and how they don't need to tell a guy till it gets serious but the arguments for telling someone up front are just so much stronger

1 - For some guys it's a deal breaker no matter what - so why should a girl date someone if it's going to end badly. If she develops feelings for someone who then outight rejects her because of her gender identity then that's adding another level of pain to something that already can be painful (a break-up)

2- The potential for violence - sadly some guys will act in a physically aggressive manner if they think they have been tricked. It's stupid but mankind as a species does a lot of stupid things.

3 - People don't like to feel deceived. So if a girl dates someone and after a period of time reveals her background the guy could feel deceived and even if it was a good relationship that perception could then sour it. A potentially successful relationship could end purely because the trust needed to maintain it is gone.

4 - Everyone tries to put their best face out there when dating and hides some of their flaws but not disclosing such a fundamental element of you is rarely going to improve the chances of dating success. If a girl is open then she's sent a few clear messages to the guy and she's going to get some clear messages back - she's sent the message that's she's comfortable with who she is and likes him enough to tell him the truth and if he is still interested in her then he's sent a message that he's comfortable with who she is and that he likes her enough to accept something others might not. The guy still might turn out to be a jerk or the relationship might fail anyway (as most do) but at least the girl has a reasonable amount of certainty that the person she's going to date is at least willing to accept her for who she is now rather than who she was at birth. There's no stress or pressure of trying to work out when to let someone know if it's already out there.

very well written alpha, up front about it , and if the guys a dousche,than its done and over with

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1 - For some guys it's a deal breaker no matter what - so why should a girl date someone if it's going to end badly. If she develops feelings for someone who then outight rejects her because of her gender identity then that's adding another level of pain to something that already can be painful (a break-up)

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If by date you mean to explore a relationship with an end toward romance or sex, then we probably agree that it's probably best for everyone to reveal their cards before things progress to far. Generally however, making a date to meet someone for a coffee or to see a movie or to take in a game isn't a prelude to sex or romance. There are many other reasons why people might enjoy each others company. It seems rather bizarre to me to decline an invitation to spend a little time with someone on the grounds it might lead to a romance and they don't know yet that I'm trans.

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2- The potential for violence - sadly some guys will act in a physically aggressive manner if they think they have been tricked. It's stupid but mankind as a species does a lot of stupid things.

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It's always wise to be prudent, but it's not an obligation or a duty to be prudent. The obligation we have to each other is to refrain from violence. It's not my fault, if a guy blows up at me, hits me, cuts me or kills me. It's his fault. “Those of us who claim we live in a civilized society have a duty to support civilized norms. We can start by blaming the perpetrators of violence and not the people they violate.”

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3 - People don't like to feel deceived. So if a girl dates someone and after a period of time reveals her background the guy could feel deceived and even if it was a good relationship that perception could then sour it. A potentially successful relationship could end purely because the trust needed to maintain it is gone.

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I think the premise of this scenario is the two “daters” have been romantically involved for some time. In that case, I would agree the time is probably ripe for the two of them to reveal to each other a little bit about their sexual pasts, their hangups, their expectations and yes to reveal whether or not one or the other is trans. However, if the two have been involved for a “period of time” (as you say) and if they haven’t already had sex, then I would think the direction of this relationship is already in question. Perhaps he’s terminally shy, or only interested in her mind :)

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4 -

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We’re back to the issue of prudence again, which I already addressed. It’s prudent to be prudent, but prudence isn’t a duty nor an obligation. Someone is not blameworthy, not even a little bit, if they were less than prudent. I understand that you’re only advising prudence, but so many people in this society twist the language of caution and take it as an invitation to deride and cast blame; e.g. “She’s was asking for it.”

We girls know all about caution. We don’t need more men telling us to be careful. We’d rather instead that you deride the violence against us than advise more caution.

Consider 5- You make a date to play pool with a friend. Later you had some drinks. The next week you called him ‘cause you had two tickets to a Reds game and you’re both fans. A few days later, by coincidence, you saw him on the links and arranged to have lunch at the clubhouse afterward. That’s when you decide to make the pool game a weekly thing - Wednesdays at 7:00PM. It’s a regular date. Should your friend tell you that he’s a FTM trans? Of course not. Not unless you both had the sense that sex was not to far down the road, or that you were becoming romantically involved with each other. Would it make any difference in this story if I made your friend a MTF trans? It shouldn’t.

I have lots of friends I do things with, men and women. Sometimes one-on-one. Somethings in groups. Some of them know I’m trans and some of them don’t. If we’re friends long enough you’ll probably find out and we’ll laugh about how surprised (or not surprised) you are. But the point is this: there are things you can do with other people (even on a one-to-one basis) besides pitch woo. Of all the friends I meet socially and do things with (go to concerts, games, and gallery openings with) only one is my lover. The rest don’t need to know anything about my sexuality. Usually a new friend will find out I have a lover before they find out I’m trans: but not because it’s my duty to tell them that I have a lover or anything else, but because that’s just the sort of thing that comes up in most casual conversations. Dates are not exclusively for lovers or potential lovers. Expand your horizons. Make time for a multitude of people.

You shouldn't have to...but the real world is what it is.

didnt dating is about honesty & trust ? what the hell u want to hide the fact u a trans to some guy who may think u a GG, this is dangerous

at this point all trans should just go on dating site where we already know they are trans

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Originally Posted by simonisthebest

dating is about honesty & trust ?

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And there you go!

You insist we reveal our deepest intimacies to a person we're just getting to know, because dating is about honesty and trust and at the same time you tell us we need to be wary of our date because we can't trust his reaction to be benign.

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Originally Posted by simonisthebest

didnt dating is about honesty & trust ?

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Originally Posted by MrFanti

And there you go!

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Yup, you're absolutely right.
So I suppose you guys and everyone on here, will immediately tell a hot GG you are on a first date with, that you have a sexual proclivity towards transsexuals.
...or worse - have fucked a few...
...or worse - have either also been occasionally fucked by them or at a minimum...sucked a few cocks.
because I think a girl might definitely want to know that.
because isn't dating about honesty?

...hell, how many people that want transgender folks to fess up immediately still haven't told anyone they know, or are fucking, about their secret?

if you like dating TS women you are a "chaser" and automatically not in the running....
but if you say you don't like to date TS women you are not wanted and she wants you to only desire her for her mind.....


this is the level of crazy GG women have and i see how it's bleeding over to TS dating.

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Originally Posted by trish

You insist we reveal our deepest intimacies to a person we're just getting to know, because dating is about honesty and trust and at the same time you tell us we need to be wary of our date because we can't trust his reaction to be benign.

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It's not too uncommon when chatting/dating online for a person to reveal their race for acceptability prior going deeper in the relationship....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMvsH4BQivw

Trish - I understand your points.

My take on the word "dating" is that it's meant for romantic purposes. Hanging out with friends is different, if you are just friends then gender is irrelevant. My advice/opinion is purely based on romantic dating. In the case of romantic dating not disclosing huge potentially deal breaking revelations fairly early in the relationship is a recipe for disaster. It's no doubt difficult for transgender people anyway - dating is hard enough for anyone without any extra "complications" (it's hard to find the right word - I don't want to make it seem like transgender is a negative - it just complicates things for some people if you know what I mean).

Do any of the guys on this forum disclose to potential GG partners of your interest in TS girls? Do you admit you've actually fucked (and have been fucked) by them?

One of the most popular tv shows here in the UK is called First Dates. It is based on a restaurant close by St Paul's Cathedral in London and while about half of the participants are heterosexual c20-30 the other half are either gay or 50+. I don't watch it much so I don't know if they have ever had a transgendered person on it, and whether or not that person was looking for a male, female or another transgendered partner, but it might help with some of the posters to this thread to see what can actually happen on that First Date (bearing in mind it is being filmed, although most of the participants don't seem to be aware of the cameras). What is interesting is that first moment when the first person walks through the door and you literally cannot tell if they are gay or straight.

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Originally Posted by Ben in LA

Do any of the guys on this forum disclose to potential GG partners of your interest in TS girls? Do you admit you've actually fucked (and have been fucked) by them?

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Well not me, when I'm dating someone I am only interested in her at that point and I am quite certain she would not like to hear about my past sexual activities. :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-L5i9PVH5II

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=29WTOyUnugE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDYviFMuLyA

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Originally Posted by Ben in LA

Do any of the guys on this forum disclose to potential GG partners of your interest in TS girls?

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Yes - In fact I have one that we have discussed transgender dating/sex/working/ etc in detail...

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Originally Posted by Ben in LA

Do any of the guys on this forum disclose to potential GG partners of your interest in TS girls? Do you admit you've actually fucked (and have been fucked) by them?

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If it comes up, yeah. They'll know that I'm only a top as well.

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Originally Posted by SanDiegoPervySage

They'll know that I'm only a top as well.

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Ditto on that - I also...

Well no, you don't...But it would save a lot of messing around! :shrug