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"I bet you watched Palin's speech last night with a 10" black butt plug in your ass. "
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
most men we come in contact with are conservative Republicans and most LOVE butt plugs!!! :lol:
(just an observation)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWAjDqZHc6s
That is probably because at the most fundamental level the two issues have a LOT of overlap.Quote:
Originally Posted by elvis_p
Trans rights cannot be separated from reproductive rights. One of the most basic issues we face is this issue of sterilization (through hrt, srs, or orchis). If we are living in an ultra conservative world where sterilization is "evil and illegal" then there is no way to access these trans medical treatments for someone who is not sterile through natural means.... just as GGs have the issue of contraceptive to worry about when politics tries to address "morality."
A lot of people will go and say that prochoice means you can chose "no to abortion" and "that's what Palin did" but that's at best a fallacy. If we are in a society which cares about freedoms when it comes to people's bodies, and their medical treatments -then the patient and the patient alone dictate what can or cannot happen to them.* Thus in a world that cares about freedom someone, like Palin's pregnant daughter (who is 18 iirc), can chose whether or not to have an abortion.... but someone like Palin can't make that choice for her threw prohibitions, government intervention, and other such civil liberty violations.
* This assumes the patient can consent to such procedures, and there are things that can prohibit someone from being able to do that- like being in a coma, being legally insane, stuff like that. However even here generally speaking age is not so much of an issue, and I'd argue most sane people will agree that a 5 year old wanting to see a doctor for physicals should not be kept away from doctors strictly because their parents are of a certain christian sect that "objects to doctors" and would "rather the kid pray for his health instead"
Even a coma is not necessarily a consent problem if the patient leaves a living will documenting what they'd want to happen in the event of various contingencies (but as it currently stands not all states will hold these documents to mean anything in the courts). We usually think of this in terms of the "right to die" debate, but a version EVERYONE should be familiar with is the organ donation programs. I have been on the DMV's organ donner list since I first got my license in 2001... when I first got on it I was 16, it did not require parental permission to get on the list- it was my consensual choice (as a minor) to do so alone. This is a separate issue than right to die, however I will say that in some situations they will try to keep parts of an organ donner's body alive on life support so it does not decay while awaiting organ removal.... which makes the issues closer than they immediately appear.
I was making my medical decisions at 10- even for deciding what be done in terms of plastic surgery (that my insurance company deemed elective and would not pay for), so I don't buy that 15 year old kids can't consent to stuff like contraceptive use when their parents disagree with the idea.
HOWEVER, there are some things that hold true cross-ideologically.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoked
I've never heard of a feminist (of any flavor) that didn't care about reproductive rights, equal pay, etc....
THUS when you get a candidate that wants to go out and solidify gender roles, and attack reproductive rights, using the gov as the tool to do so- then yes, supporting that candidate would be (among other things) anti-feminist.
But see here's the thing, the republicans stand for a lot of issues (without doubt) like their position on the separation of church & state (related but not specific to trans issues, again there is overlap), gun ownership, and a whole host of other things.... BUT the republican party has made LGBT issues (or rather... their attacks on lgbt rights) the cornerstone of their party for more than 6 years at this point.Quote:
Instead of trying to brand me as anti feminist, one would think having "conservatives" who accept and support the LGBT inside the conservative party, will only serve to educate others in the party who hold more antiquated conservative views towards your community.
THERE WAS NO ISSUE TO THEM BIGGER THAN LGBT ISSUES IN 2004. That is why 11 states, including battleground states like Ohio, got gay marriage bans. They mobilzed the christians to come out and vote, and they did it by targeting US.
My reply had nothing to do with groveling. I was writing it before I read your post.Quote:
Originally Posted by AllanahStarrNYC
You have accused me of mudslinging and reading you... but that is what you did to me. You called me an anti-feminist... so I thought about it. I even looked it up to educate myself, just what is a feminist. I posted what I found. TS Mandy and others thankfully took time to add educational value, info I had not seen. So I read more. I responded to TS Mandy in a fair, thoughtful response.
Too bad that isnt enough for you.
I actually called you MUCH more than an anti-feminist, all points you hace chosen not to address- yet I addressed yours.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoked
As part of your misinformation. my friend Shana did remind me of Verorina Fancro, whom I have over looked. She was a 16th century courtesan and poet was considered one of the first feminist.
Sex work has nothing to do with being a feminist.
Hey now... I, and my conservative brothers were just chastised for doing nothing to support the TG community... and here you are stating that most of your "contacts" are conservative republicans...Quote:
Originally Posted by sexyshana
Geeze, which is it, are we supporting you or not? And dont tell me we're in the closet any more than your liberal "contacts" At least we support you with our cash rather than looking for freebies or lip service
I ASK AGAINQuote:
Originally Posted by Stoked
What have you done for this community, except support and be part of a political party that wants policies to harm us?
Stop avoidinf the issues. Own up to your hypocritical stance.
So what are you saying... people such as myself shouldnt try to change the views of my party to support LGBT? Are you serious?Quote:
Originally Posted by SarahG
I think that for some (myself included) it does. Especially for the feminists who are part of the fight to make sex work safer, end sex trafficking, provide contraception and testing etc... it does. I believe (not speaking for everyone) that supporting independent escorts, creating legal protection for whores is feminist.Quote:
Originally Posted by AllanahStarrNYC
The fight for women to have control over their bodies is in my mind intricately linked to the right to have sex with whom we want (as long as they are consenting adults) for whatever reason we want.
As for TS not being feminist, well that is the argument that the old school lesbian separatists at the Michigan Wymmins Music Festival have used and they have been fought by a large coaliton of trans women outside the festival and lesbian GG supporters within. If the most radical element of the feminist movement (the man hating lesbian seperatist wing) is now largely comprised of trans allies, than it is safe to say than those seeking to criticize us are a dying breed.
Are there some TS that are misogynist and anti-feminist? Absolutely. Is the sex industry often in the same boat? Absolutely. Does that mean that TS sex workers as a group are not feminist? Not at all.
What I meant was that, you can be a feminist and be a sex worker-Quote:
Originally Posted by tsmandy
opposing the argument that Stoked originally posed.