So when he saw Trayvon Martin he decided that this one wasn't going to get away? That's the clear implication behind your words.Quote:
Originally Posted by mildcigar_2001
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So when he saw Trayvon Martin he decided that this one wasn't going to get away? That's the clear implication behind your words.Quote:
Originally Posted by mildcigar_2001
I think that even in the USA, people are innocent until proven guilty, somehow I get the impression you are not bothered either way. You don't know what I have or have not done in her defence -or for that matter, what I am capable of doing- but the mere fact that her situation is being debated is itself a form of action.Quote:
Originally Posted by mildcigar_2001
If you want to write about the national debt and the tea party there have been threads in the Politics & Religion where it has been and probably will continue to be discussed, often by people who share your views: you prefer to hi-jack these threads for your own publicity, so I don't intend to shut up, because human rights belong to everyone, I even think they are worth shouting about. The issue of solitary confinement seems to confuse you, its not a privilege; and it can be psychologically damaging; and why is she even in gaol anyway? Is Zimmerman in gaol?
She's black, she's transsexual, two reasons why she's in jail and Zimmerman isn't. Nobody important enough cares.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stavros
However, at one level I agree with mildcigar - yep, you read it correctly!
The collective outrage here on Cece's behalf is just so much wasted hot air unless there's a constructive effort to make a positive change to the situation to help the girl. Talk and internet outrage are cheap and easy.
[QUOTE=Stavros;1134521]You don't know what I have or have not done in her defence -or for that matter, what I am capable of doing- but the mere fact that her situation is being debated is itself a form of action.QUOTE]
I think the above post underscores may point about liberals mistaking blather for action.
I have no idea if CeCe is guilty or innocent. I quite simply don't know enough of the facts about the case. However it is my suspicion that if she has been in jail a year pending trial that the facts don't weigh heavily in her favor. As a general rule (and granted there are noted exceptions) most prosecutors don't bring meritless cases.
I worked as a prosecutor and defense counsel in the armed forces for several years around the time of the first gulf war, and we were out for justice (We didn't care if the accused was black, brown or green). If there was a poor case then charges were not brought. I know it is a popular myth based on Perry Mason and LA Law type shows, but the vast majority of persons accused of crimes are guilty. I've worked both sides of the street on criminal cases and generally things are fairly cut and dried (often times the accused has been very helpful to the prosecution and provides a detailed confession):dancing:.
For what it's worth...it seems she made bail at some point ...but a judge deemed she violated it when something happened to her leg monitor (which may have been an electronic error) and she tested positive for THC...
...so she was out for a couple of months of that time.
[quote=mildcigar_2001;1134550]1) I am not a liberal, and its comical that you decide to fit me into the slot that suits your argument;Quote:
Originally Posted by Stavros
2) Since it is a fact that you do not know what I have done in the past to help people and what my position is today (and that's all there is to say on it because this isn't a thread about me), you cannot in fact dismiss my vocality as 'blather' rather than action. Reasoned argument is also a tool which freedom can deploy in its combat with prejudice;
3) the USA has a woeful history of trials in which the accused was nowhere near the scene of the crime, or was a victim of mistaken identity, etc -'meritless' cases are thus more common than you are willing to admit;
4) Your personal history does not give you an edge over anyone else on this forum; members of HA know perfectly well the sort of scrapes transexuals get into of their own volition, and also of the way in which some intolerant members of the public will vent their hate on transgendered people, sometimes with disastrous consequences.
5) The core issue is that CeCe has a right to a fair trial, as does Zimmerman, she certainly deserves better than your assumption of guilt with no mitigating circumstances; I return to the vexing issue of solitary confinement, because in some cases it can be psychologically damaging, and could affect the way she presents herself in court.
My thanks to Fred for the details on the accused and bail; one only hopes that justice of some quality is delivered in this case.
[QUOTE=Stavros;...she certainly deserves better than your assumption of guilt with no mitigating circumstances; I return to the vexing issue of solitary confinement, because in some cases it can be psychologically damaging, and could affect the way she presents herself in court.[/quote]
I assume in the midst of your tired and generally untrue handwringing on the criminal justice system that this portion of my post confused you:
"I have no idea if CeCe is guilty or innocent. I quite simply don't know enough of the facts about the case."
If CeCe did not want to be in confinement then perhaps she should have complied with the terms of her bail.
It in a way always amazed me (in my prior practice), that when the Judge would set out a fairly simple set of rules such as "don't use marijuana or wear an electronic monitoring device" that the alleged criminals can't follow these simple rules and end up back in jail.
Your belief that people who live what others call dysfunctional lives will automatically obey all the instructions that law enforcement/courts hand down could be charming if it were not so naive. As to your ability to edit your own statements, this is what you said:
I have no idea if CeCe is guilty or innocent. I quite simply don't know enough of the facts about the case. However it is my suspicion that if she has been in jail a year pending trial that the facts don't weigh heavily in her favor. As a general rule (and granted there are noted exceptions) most prosecutors don't bring meritless cases.
Yes, but.
Anyway until such time as this case comes to court, it might be best not to extend the debate on it.
I've researched this story. She does have a criminal record for writing hot checks.Quote:
Originally Posted by TS CANDY NY
Come on people. I’m empathetic to CeCe here, but she screwed up big time. I’m white and live in Texas, and we have the Castle Doctrine law, and I would have been arrested for this and charged with murder too. If you stop buying into all the bs people post online, you can clearly see why she got herself in the legal mess she’s in.
A woman in the group threw the bottle at CeCe, striking and lacerating her face. Okay, that woman committed assault against CeCe. Then CeCe runs up and stabs Dean in the chest? CeCe retaliated against Dean and is why she’s in the trouble she is. You can’t fly off the handle and stab someone for offending you. If she had stabbed the woman who threw the bottle at her, then it could be argued as self-defense and the case dropped. That’s why her lawyer is settling for a plea deal from the prosecutor, because CeCe flipped out and stabbed Dean for running his mouth and for starting the altercation, and her lawyer can’t defend it. If he could, he would and the charges would have been dropped or never filed in the first place.
If this kind of behavior is allowed by law, then it sets a precedent for others to the same. Hell you’ll have people stabbing and shooting each other in mass. Example: You’re a Wall Street employee going to work. An OWS demonstrator starts yelling, “Criminal! You should be arrested!” and blah blah blah. The Wall Street employee engages in the confrontation. Another OWS demonstrator hits him with a bottle. The Wall Street guy stabs and kills the guy who started the confrontation. That’s not self-defense. That is a retaliatory attack and murder.
But in fairness to CeCe, good riddens to that white-trash bastard Dean. He got himself killed for being a racist homophobic dumbass, and he asked for it. All CeCe had to do was run and call the police and she wouldn’t be sitting in jail. Or, if CeCe lived here in Texas, which many transgendered people do, she could have legally drew a firearm on them if they started approaching her and they would have all shut up and politely backed away.
And for that matter, CeCe could have gotten herself killed by running in there and swatting the hornet’s nest like she did. When she attacked Dean with those scissors, had she missed … I can only imagine what Dean would have done to her. And you know what? They would have let him go for self-defense. This is all around wrong, and just another example of both parties not using their heads.
That’s why she’s in the mess she’s in.
I’ll hand it to CeCe though. She whooped his ass proper, and Dean can push daisies for all I care for acting like a complete asshole to her. Talking shit and got his ass handed to him by a tranny. I bet his racist homophobic ass never pondered that ending to his pathetic life.
That does not make it legal though. And now CeCe fucked up her record for the rest of her life. She should have just backed off and called the police. She’s lucky they reduced it to manslaughter.