Question/Idea For Seanchai

[Johnny.Blaze]

Hey there Seanchai,

I was looking around the web today. And I had this idea for a website that perhaps Grooby could consider. Have you ever thought about creating a Trap/Femboy website? No shemales, or Twinks, or anything like that. But just very attractive, young 18-25, Traps/Femboys. I don't think there is one site out there that's like that. I know there are twink sites and those Emo boys sites out there but really nothing catering solely to Traps.

I mean for example just look at the popularity of the Trap thread here at HA.
I see these Tumblr sites that are just massive with Traps posting there pictures and also posting their videos on sites like xhamster or xtube.
I honestly think it could be a very popular and lucrative site. I know I'd join.

So what's your thought on it?
And does anyone else here think that would make for a good site?

[LilyRox]

I was going to do something like this xD

[GroobySteven]

Hmmm ... seems like someone's been talking!

[jimlovests]

www.trappy-yum.com would make for an awesome site! so many gorgeous girls out there that drive men crazy!

[Johnny.Blaze]

Hmmm ... seems like someone's been talking!

What do you mean? someone's been talking? I haven't talked with anyone. This idea just came to me. And I thought I'd share it. Is there like some secret plan in the works or something - lol

[LilyRox]

What do you mean? someone's been talking? I haven't talked with anyone. This idea just came to me. And I thought I'd share it. Is there like some secret plan in the works or something - lol

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m0w1w0E7vK1qcf1bgo1_400.gif

[Johnny.Blaze]

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m0w1w0E7vK1qcf1bgo1_400.gif

Cat's out of the bag - LMAO

[EvaCassini]

Thats one of the CUTEST gifs EVER!

[Wendy Summers]

Hmmm ... seems like someone's been talking!

The only thing holding this industry together is gossip lol

[Quiet Reflections]

Hey there Seanchai,

I was looking around the web today. And I had this idea for a website that perhaps Grooby could consider. Have you ever thought about creating a Trap/Femboy website? No shemales, or Twinks, or anything like that. But just very attractive, young 18-25, Traps/Femboys. I don't think there is one site out there that's like that. I know there are twink sites and those Emo boys sites out there but really nothing catering solely to Traps.

I mean for example just look at the popularity of the Trap thread here at HA.
I see these Tumblr sites that are just massive with Traps posting there pictures and also posting their videos on sites like xhamster or xtube.
I honestly think it could be a very popular and lucrative site. I know I'd join.

So what's your thought on it?
And does anyone else here think that would make for a good site?
Aren't traps just young, really "passable" CD's or early transition TS. While femboys(the gay ones anyway) are actually twinks as most of them never plan to transition or dress as women? I wonder if a girl early in transition that might be considered a trap would be offended by being called a femboy. The term just seems almost pejorative when talking about anyone even one day into their transition. I could be wrong....I often am.

[Johnny.Blaze]

Aren't traps just young, really "passable" CD's or early transition TS. While femboys(the gay ones anyway) are actually twinks as most of them never plan to transition or dress as women? I wonder if a girl early in transition that might be considered a trap would be offended by being called a femboy. The term just seems almost pejorative when talking about anyone even one day into their transition. I could be wrong....I often am.

I certainly don't want to get into a long debate on what a femboy or trap is.
My point was that I thought it was just a cool idea to have a site dedicated to Traps. Many traps that you see on Tumblr or Xtube and such, relate to being called either trap or femboy. Actual I see the word femboi used allot.
Whether you wanna see them as CD's or whatever is not the point here. The whole point is to have a site that has young models who haven't had surgery or anything like that. But possess that real feminine quality. I don't think it takes a genius to figure out what I mean.

[Quiet Reflections]

I certainly don't want to get into a long debate on what a femboy or trap is.
My point was that I thought it was just a cool idea to have a site dedicated to Traps. Many traps that you see on Tumblr or Xtube and such, relate to being called either trap or femboy. Actual I see the word femboi used allot.
Whether you wanna see them as CD's or whatever is not the point here. The whole point is to have a site that has young models who haven't had surgery or anything like that. But possess that real feminine quality. I don't think it takes a genius to figure out what I mean.
It is a good idea, Hell it's a great idea and please don't be offended by my questions I was just asking because if you are going to have a website based on a specific group of people then there must be a qualification process to see if the models fit into that category. And since you brought up not wanting shemales and/or twinks even though traps and femboys can(not always) fall into each of those categories, I though you might have some insight into how one would go about choosing models.

[Johnny.Blaze]

It is a good idea, Hell it's a great idea and please don't be offended by my questions I was just asking because if you are going to have a website based on a specific group of people then there must be a qualification process to see if the models fit into that category. And since you brought up not wanting shemales and/or twinks even though traps and femboys can(not always) fall into each of those categories, I though you might have some insight into how one would go about choosing models.

Well you just have to go to the many Trap tumblr sites that are out there and basically you could find all the models you would need. Or even look up the thread that I've posted on here regarding Traps and the models I've posted and you can see examples also.
In my eyes a "Trap" is a male that has taken either no hormones or is at the most, just started taking them. Is young between the ages of 18-25. But mainly 18-20. Is very passable. Has no breast enhancements or implants of any kind. Whether they dress feminine full time or part time, really doesn't matter. At least to me. Now one could put this in a cross-dresser category but the cross dresser can really be any age. Traps are more known for being young and very passable. The Trap community knows the difference. I'm sure Lily could help me out here in explaining - lol

[LilyRox]

The Trap community knows the difference. I'm sure Lily could help me out here in explaining - lol

Thanks lol ;P you think I'm Trap material? http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/attachment.php?attachmentid=610215&stc=1&d=1375968840



In my eyes a "Trap" is a male that has taken either no hormones or is at the most, just started taking them. Is young between the ages of 18-25. But mainly 18-20. Is very passable. Has no breast enhancements or implants of any kind.

Yeah you are somewhat right. A Trap isn't a male though, they are transgender. Most are actually transsexual's (believe they were born in the wrong body) too and not crossdressers. A lot of Traps aren't on surgery or hormones yet just because of their financial situation or real world issues.

A femboy is something completely different. Femboy's are often confused with crossdressers. Femboy's are males who just have feminine attributes about themselves. They do not associate themselves with transgender people and are their birth gender. Femboy's are often petite, wear makeup, and have feminine mannerisms. I believe most femboy's are bisexual. Femboy's are similar to twinks, but are not always gay and have more feminine qualities than twinks like wearing feminine makeup.

The best example I can give you of a femboy is Gerard Way from My Chemical Romance. As you can see he has very feminine features, but he is in no way trying to be a woman.

http://static.becomegorgeous.com/img/arts/2009/Oct/23/1415/gerard_way.jpg



Twink's typically have more subtle masculine features about them like having abs (mainly because they're gay and like to show their masculine side a little.)

[Johnny.Blaze]

Thanks lol ;P you think I'm Trap material? http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/attachment.php?attachmentid=610215&stc=1&d=1375968840




Yeah you are somewhat right. A Trap isn't a male though, they are transgender. Most are actually transsexual's (believe they were born in the wrong body) too and not crossdressers. A lot of Traps aren't on surgery or hormones yet just because of their financial situation or real world issues.

A femboy is something completely different. Femboy's are often confused with crossdressers. Femboy's are males who just have feminine attributes about themselves. They do not associate themselves with transgender people and are their birth gender. Femboy's are often petite, wear makeup, and have feminine mannerisms. I believe most femboy's are bisexual. Femboy's are similar to twinks, but are not always gay and have more feminine qualities than twinks like wearing feminine makeup.

The best example I can give you of a femboy is Gerard Way from My Chemical Romance. As you can see he has very feminine features, but he is in no way trying to be a woman.

http://static.becomegorgeous.com/img/arts/2009/Oct/23/1415/gerard_way.jpg

Twink's typically have more subtle masculine features about them like having abs (mainly because they're gay and like to show their masculine side a little.)

A good way of explaining it you did. And I would definitely place you in the "Trap" category Lily. You're young, have great looks, and a killer body. And are also very fem in your mannerisms.

[christianxxx]

i don't think Seanchai is going to start a site like this. I recommended a smoking hot fem boy and he passed - and this was a month ago.

[Johnny.Blaze]

i don't think Seanchai is going to start a site like this. I recommended a smoking hot fem boy and he passed - and this was a month ago.

If I had the connections that you guys do. I'd create one myself....

[christianxxx]

you would just waste your time, lose tons of money, and get bitter and pissed off about it. the ability to open a new site that is profitable has become beyond the ability of the small singular person. Making 1-3 joins a day is nice, but ultimately it would make you 1000-2000 dollars a month tops. And that's if you spend 12 hours a day trying to make the site work....7 days a week.

It would be an exercise in futility

[Johnny.Blaze]

you would just waste your time, lose tons of money, and get bitter and pissed off about it. the ability to open a new site that is profitable has become beyond the ability of the small singular person. Making 1-3 joins a day is nice, but ultimately it would make you 1000-2000 dollars a month tops. And that's if you spend 12 hours a day trying to make the site work....7 days a week.

It would be an exercise in futility

You're wrong Christian. How do you know it would fail? It's never been done yet, as far as I have seen. All one needs are the models, site design, and someone to update the site. That's it. Credit card processors handle all the signups, logins and income payouts. All you really need to know, is how to design a website (html etc. knowledge) Have ability to find and shoot models (pay them of course) and update it regularly. It doesn't take a genius to do that. Sure it helps if you have a couple people working with you, photographers etc. But it certainly doesn't take a huge company to make a profitable website. It takes good promotion to get the surfers to the site, and then once there, the content should speak for itself. And I honestly believe there is a big market out there for "Trap" orientated website.

[christianxxx]

lol okay man, i guess you know more than me about my own industry that I have been in for over 10 years.

[LilyRox]

you would just waste your time, lose tons of money, and get bitter and pissed off about it. the ability to open a new site that is profitable has become beyond the ability of the small singular person. Making 1-3 joins a day is nice, but ultimately it would make you 1000-2000 dollars a month tops. And that's if you spend 12 hours a day trying to make the site work....7 days a week.

It would be an exercise in futility

Yeah, I'd have to disagree. Web design is becoming easier and easier each year. To be honest with site's they have to build websites for a small fee you really don't have to even know code to create a nice website as long as you have extensive knowledge of how computers work. With the right domain name, marketing, and professional site set up I think one person or a couple people could set up a booming site. You also have to remember there is no other competition either. There really is no mainstream "trap" sites, so I don't see how a small team of intelligent people couldn't make an amazing website. Just remember Google started out with 2 people when there was already multiple search engines out at the time. You could probably do it alone if you know the right stuff or pay a web designer.

[christianxxx]

1. neither of you actually own your own website....i do
2. neither of you speak to the owners of large networks on a daily basis....i do
3. neither of you are affiliates of any sites, networks, or know the first thing about how to get joins....i do
4. neither of you are actually in the industry and know the first thing about finding and shooting the amount of content necessary to start and maintain a site that gets new and retains members.....i do

honestly I could run this list up to about 20, but again....you guys clearly know better than I do. lol

[LilyRox]

1. neither of you actually own your own website....i do
2. neither of you speak to the owners of large networks on a daily basis....i do
3. neither of you are affiliates of any sites, networks, or know the first thing about how to get joins....i do
4. neither of you are actually in the industry and know the first thing about finding and shooting the amount of content necessary to start and maintain a site that gets new and retains members.....i do

honestly I could run this list up to about 20, but again....you guys clearly know better than I do. lol

Give me thousands of dollars and I guarantee I can start a trap site. Right now I have $210 to my name.

[christianxxx]

anyone can start anything.....but you couldn't make it profitable enough to live off of by yourself. its not possible

and that's not even going into getting the models/talent/director/editor/webdesigner/dataentry/affiliatemanager you would need either

[TSMichelleAustin]

You need more Money than that!!! Talent alone is going to bring that budget high! 2nd there are so many fembois and traps on tube site that peep don't need to pay for it!

[LilyRox]

anyone can start anything.....but you couldn't make it profitable enough to live off of by yourself. its not possible

and that's not even going into getting the models/talent/director/editor/webdesigner/dataentry/affiliatemanager you would need either

Well yeah that goes with any big business at the start. I thought we were just talking about creating a site in general. What I was thinking of was a more along the lines of a amateur trap site that features selected girls that do shows, recordings, photography and paid while members join for a fee. All featured online via webcam or whatever and no photographers and all that. Amateur trap stuff in home is the way to go.

[Johnny.Blaze]

1. neither of you actually own your own website....i do
2. neither of you speak to the owners of large networks on a daily basis....i do
3. neither of you are affiliates of any sites, networks, or know the first thing about how to get joins....i do
4. neither of you are actually in the industry and know the first thing about finding and shooting the amount of content necessary to start and maintain a site that gets new and retains members.....i do

honestly I could run this list up to about 20, but again....you guys clearly know better than I do. lol

Hence why I brought it up to Seanchai in the first place Mr. Clean....

[GroobySteven]

Yeah, I'd have to disagree. Web design is becoming easier and easier each year. To be honest with site's they have to build websites for a small fee you really don't have to even know code to create a nice website as long as you have extensive knowledge of how computers work. With the right domain name, marketing, and professional site set up I think one person or a couple people could set up a booming site. You also have to remember there is no other competition either. There really is no mainstream "trap" sites, so I don't see how a small team of intelligent people couldn't make an amazing website. Just remember Google started out with 2 people when there was already multiple search engines out at the time. You could probably do it alone if you know the right stuff or pay a web designer.


Anybody can get a website online without hardly any knowledge at all but getting a pay site online takes a lot more work and costs. Getting the site up and running is the easiest part.
A site starting with 15 girls, even with the producer/photographer as the owner would cost between $10,000-$15,000 just to get launched - with weekly updates due before you start making any income. An average Grooby site costs over $50,000 just to get to launch.

Then the hardest part is bringing in qualified traffic. That is potential customers who may wish to purchase. You may think given Twitter, Facebook and other social media this would be easy to do - it isn't. Many existing avenues for a solo girl site, like Hungangels would not be available to you (or if it did, it would be at a cost) and trying to get highly ranked on the search engines is expensive and does not come with guarantees.

If you're selling the site at say $24.99 for a months access, with only one update a week you'd have running costs of $2000-$3000 a month - but ask yourself, would people pay for one update a week of solo content? YES if the content is exclusive enough or niched enough (they'd pay anything) but the second question is, "Are there enough people interested in this niche to join?". You may think there are - but even on a worldwide scale it's rarely so.

So your $24.99 a month per member. Do you have affiliates (one of the cheapest and best ways to get new members fast, most sites fail without that - so probably yes). Take the assumption that 50% of your membership is affiliate driven - and 50% you've found yourself through marketing, social networking, etc.

Affiliate sale : = $24.99 - $2.50 (bank) = $22.49 - 50% to affiliate = $11.25 per sale.

Direct sale : $24.99 - $2.50 (bank) = $22.49 per sale.

So you get 100 sales in your first month based on above 50/50 affiliate/direct leaves you with = $1686.50

If your original budget was $12,500 + first month $2500 = $15,000 you're not at a deficit of $13,313 (more than your initial budget).

Break-even on $2500 a month budget would be about 142 sales split this way - how many months does it take to reach 142 sales per month?
How long do you have to be in debt for and can put in your own money before the site pays for itself?
Are people rejoining and staying members?

This is based on a very low-ball. Most of our sites can run over $100k before they break-even and start paying the company back. Some never work and we never get the money back. Most are in debt for years before we get the full amount back.

It's easy to start and adult site. It's extremely hard to make one profitable.

[Johnny.Blaze]

You need more Money than that!!! Talent alone is going to bring that budget high! 2nd there are so many fembois and traps on tube site that peep don't need to pay for it!

Are you kidding me with what you just said? There are so many on tube sites that peep don't need to buy?
You go find me some high quality Trap content on tube sites? I'm not talking about low ass grainy flash quality. Or video of some bro with a wig filming himself in his mothers panties. I've searched the net for years to see if this sort of content was out there. In high quality form. Not some bullshit low grade crap that's on a tube site. And there isn't nada.

I get Christian on here basically putting my idea down, for what reason I have no clue. Like I wanna compete with him fucking some fat chick on a couch, or some old lady on his site. That was pretty uncalled for to just shoot it down like that. You don't know me, or Lily or many of the people on this board. You don't know that I don't have connections, or know people in the know so to say. You have no idea how good a photographer/Director I am, when it comes to modeling. Just because you've banged mostly every girl on the block, that does not make you a genius in the web world.
And your so called advertising skills arent as hard as you make them out to be..Anyone can jump on a site like HA and post an update and link. And the same thing goes for twitter. I've seen your promotion on twitter for your site. Seriously, nothing hard to do...But thanks anyway for your most knowledgeable advice...

[GroobySteven]

You don't know that I don't have connections, or know people in the know so to say. You have no idea how good a photographer/Director I am, when it comes to modeling. Just because you've banged mostly every girl on the block, that does not make you a genius in the web world.
And your so called advertising skills arent as hard as you make them out to be..Anyone can jump on a site like HA and post an update and link. And the same thing goes for twitter. I've seen your promotion on twitter for your site. Seriously, nothing hard to do...But thanks anyway for your most knowledgeable advice...

Respectfully - we don't know how many connections or what experience you have and that goes a long way but your level of photography/production isn't really that relevant and your assumption on the marketing/advertising is the trap that most people fall into.
You wouldn't get a link on HA - I'd block it (or at least take a percentage) and the same goes for our other networks BUT even good advertising on a site like this which is a great source for traffic may only help with a few dozen members. Twitter is massively over-rated when it comes to direct sales and you have to have a following (I'm nearly up to 3000 followers on my @groobysteven ... whilst girls can get vastly more followers ... yet sales are still hard to make.

10 yrs ago, any monkey could throw up a site and make it profitable, today even the gorillas have difficulty.

[nysprod]

Seanchai has given an excellent analysis on the economic realities of running a site...like any new start-up, one of (if not the biggest) issue is capitalization...most new businesses fail simply because they do not have the money to keep running until a profit is made.

Think about where FB or Twitter would be without investors throwing money into them years before any profit is made, if there ever is any to begin with...and even if FB looks like the greatest thing right now, remember there used to be a day when AOL and Myspace ruled the world.

One question I do have is about running a site where the owner is the main talent e.g. Bailey Jay...I would think those have more potential to be profitable.

[GroobySteven]

One question I do have is about running a site where the owner is the main talent e.g. Bailey Jay...I would think those have more potential to be profitable.

You certainly cut out some of the costs - but then you'd have to hire a photographer so there would be extra costs there. My initial budgets assumed that the producer would also photoshop the images and edit the videos as well as webmaster the website. If they can't do that (or if the model/owner can't) then you can throw another $500-$1000 onto the budget a month.

With "e.g. Bailey Jay" therein lies the key - there is only one Bailey Jay and she's had massive exposure even before she first modeling for Grooby as Linetrap/Harley Quinn. Solo girls can make their sites work but they take a massive amount of work and dedication as well as time (and realistic expectations) for what is often a fairly low return.

[nysprod]

Solo girls can make their sites work but they take a massive amount of work and dedication as well as time (and realistic expectations) for what is often a fairly low return.



The exact same can be said about running any business...it's one thing to have an idea and dream about easy money, but the reality is that as a business owner you'd better be prepared to put in plenty of sweat equity in addition to your cash.

One the other hand, running a business is the dream of many...and if you're a person who places value on working for yourself and making your own way in the world, that in itself makes it worthwhile.

Just go into something like this with your eyes open.

[christianxxx]

Are you kidding me with what you just said? There are so many on tube sites that peep don't need to buy?
You go find me some high quality Trap content on tube sites? I'm not talking about low ass grainy flash quality. Or video of some bro with a wig filming himself in his mothers panties. I've searched the net for years to see if this sort of content was out there. In high quality form. Not some bullshit low grade crap that's on a tube site. And there isn't nada.

I get Christian on here basically putting my idea down, for what reason I have no clue. Like I wanna compete with him fucking some fat chick on a couch, or some old lady on his site. That was pretty uncalled for to just shoot it down like that. You don't know me, or Lily or many of the people on this board. You don't know that I don't have connections, or know people in the know so to say. You have no idea how good a photographer/Director I am, when it comes to modeling. Just because you've banged mostly every girl on the block, that does not make you a genius in the web world.
And your so called advertising skills arent as hard as you make them out to be..Anyone can jump on a site like HA and post an update and link. And the same thing goes for twitter. I've seen your promotion on twitter for your site. Seriously, nothing hard to do...But thanks anyway for your most knowledgeable advice...

hahahaaha - someone call the wambulance. don't cry bro seriously. I just gave you the truth about your idea which the owner of one of the largest networks in the world then completely backed up with numbers. if you don't believe me, than believe him.

second, you think my website makes money? lol - i make less than 2000 a month off my site and that's with me doing everything in my power to get joins and with my content being free.

third, I completely know that you and Lily don't have connections or know people in the know. Get serious, don't confuse being a fan with being in the industry. lol

[bluesoul]

I get Christian on here basically putting my idea down, for what reason I have no clue. Like I wanna compete with him fucking some fat chick on a couch, or some old lady on his site. That was pretty uncalled for to just shoot it down like that. You don't know me, or Lily or many of the people on this board. You don't know that I don't have connections, or know people in the know so to say. You have no idea how good a photographer/Director I am, when it comes to modeling. Just because you've banged mostly every girl on the block, that does not make you a genius in the web world.
And your so called advertising skills arent as hard as you make them out to be..Anyone can jump on a site like HA and post an update and link. And the same thing goes for twitter. I've seen your promotion on twitter for your site. Seriously, nothing hard to do...But thanks anyway for your most knowledgeable advice...

http://24.media.tumblr.com/1bc37ebdf127b27786b4d8fb90554db2/tumblr_mmwfilwlol1s8tujfo1_400.gif

[Ms.Stepford]

I don't think the talent base is sufficient to supply this niche, unless you want to release a bunch of shots of models cut off at the neck. Most of these kids seem to be anonymous boys who don't want to show their faces.

Not that there aren't a good handful of really viable models, but only a handful of them will want to get into the industry, and if they don't live around each other, travel costs are going to run you dry while you overshoot them.

[runningdownthatdream]

Are you kidding me with what you just said? There are so many on tube sites that peep don't need to buy?
You go find me some high quality Trap content on tube sites? I'm not talking about low ass grainy flash quality. Or video of some bro with a wig filming himself in his mothers panties. I've searched the net for years to see if this sort of content was out there. In high quality form. Not some bullshit low grade crap that's on a tube site. And there isn't nada.

I get Christian on here basically putting my idea down, for what reason I have no clue. Like I wanna compete with him fucking some fat chick on a couch, or some old lady on his site. That was pretty uncalled for to just shoot it down like that. You don't know me, or Lily or many of the people on this board. You don't know that I don't have connections, or know people in the know so to say. You have no idea how good a photographer/Director I am, when it comes to modeling. Just because you've banged mostly every girl on the block, that does not make you a genius in the web world.
And your so called advertising skills arent as hard as you make them out to be..Anyone can jump on a site like HA and post an update and link. And the same thing goes for twitter. I've seen your promotion on twitter for your site. Seriously, nothing hard to do...But thanks anyway for your most knowledgeable advice...

There's a reason why you're living in Buffalo wearing that tinfoil shirt - you don't know jack shit about making money. All of Christian's points are valid. You should try to win him over to your side by presenting valid ideas on how to succeed in online porn. That way you'd have a knowledgeable partner supporting you instead of a 20yr kid with 0 business experience whom you're in lust with. You come along with your trapsite idea 20 years after the internet became a phenomenon and you think you're the first guy to think about it? Worse you're whining like a a little bitch about the wholly useful information he gave you? Most people would have to pay a consultant to get the info he just provided to you for free.

Stay in Buffalo - you deserve each other.

[EvaCassini]

http://24.media.tumblr.com/1bc37ebdf127b27786b4d8fb90554db2/tumblr_mmwfilwlol1s8tujfo1_400.gif

OMG I love Wilf!!!! :D

[LilyRox]

That way you'd have a knowledgeable partner supporting you instead of a 20yr kid with 0 business experience whom you're in lust with.

This statement is invalid. Maybe you should learn about people before posting senseless accusations about them.

[runningdownthatdream]

This statement is invalid. Maybe you should learn about people before posting senseless accusations about them.

Well you haven't demonstrated any business knowledge here but for the sake of being polite how does "little to no business experience" work? Likewise maybe you can help yourself out tremendously by acknowledging you're damn young and haven't had time to gain the experience that others have had and who may actually be able to help you.

[maddygirl]

I honestly find it hard to believe there aren't sites of feminine guys dressing up. Or just crossdressing sites... ? I don't see how this is a new idea, honestly.

[LilyRox]

Well you haven't demonstrated any business knowledge here but for the sake of being polite how does "little to no business experience" work? Likewise maybe you can help yourself out tremendously by acknowledging you're damn young and haven't had time to gain the experience that others have had and who may actually be able to help you.

It's so easy to hide behind a computer and not post any information about yourself to cyber BULLY other people down. I'm the one with the BALLS to post information out there about myself standing in a line of fire. Actually I helped co-found a business when I was 17 and backed out a couple years later to move onto transitioning. I had to get away from it, all of it. None of my friends knew where I went or that I changed. I just couldn't deal with all the stress of transitioning at the same time. Every once in a while I'll go back to the site and see how it's doing and wish I was still apart of it as I watch it grow. But no I'm just a "20 year old" whoring myself out that doesn't know anything right? I'm stupid, I have no skills, no brain power, just a human fuck doll for your amusement.

[runningdownthatdream]

It's so easy to hide behind a computer and not post any information about yourself to cyber BULLY other people down. I'm the one with the BALLS to post information out there about myself standing in a line of fire. Actually I helped co-found a business when I was 17 and backed out a couple years later to move onto transitioning. I had to get away from it, all of it. None of my friends knew where I went or that I changed. I just couldn't deal with all the stress of transitioning at the same time. Every once in a while I'll go back to the site and see how it's doing and wish I was still apart of it as I watch it grow. But no I'm just a "20 year old" whoring myself out that doesn't know anything right? I'm stupid, I have no skills, no brain power, just a human fuck doll for your amusement.

Whoa slow down.........seems you're part of the new generation that resorts to crying 'BULLY' whenever they scent criticism of their half-baked ideas. FYI just because a lot of other weevils crawled out of the woodwork to encourage you to 'whore yourself' don't think I'm one of them. You seem smart if naive and inexperienced but that's due to youth. As an example of that naivete I'll ask you to recall a post you made some weeks ago basically saying that no-one pays for porn anymore because they can get all the free porn they want on tubesites - remember that?

It's rather ironic that you now believe you can charge people for same said porn which you say we can all get for free.

[Jamie French]

There's a bit of an elephant in the room that no one is willing to talk about, (on the fan side.)

A LOT of these 'traps' are appealing to their particular audience because of their age. The semi anonymous posts, candid shots and webcam screen-caps that make up the majority of this kind of 'content' are largely coming from 15-19 year old, holed up in their bedrooms. These are just kids expressing a newly found sexuality in themselves at the height of puberty.

What guys seem to like about them is precisely the thing that will make it impossible for this phenomenon from ever becoming a certified porn niche. By which I mean, the guys like the youth and the natural femininity but with the progress of age comes the need for things like surgery and HRT. Those facial features that they adore now become hard and angular at the exact point when a responsible adult with the proper inclination would be expected to pursue a career in the adult entertainment industry.

It's a catch 22 for trap fans. They can enjoy the quasi-illegal fruit of online trap culture, but when the 'talent' is legal to pursue an actual career everything about their profitability as a trap goes away.

For you fans out there, just be grateful you have any of this trap stuff at all... no one is forcing these kids to post pictures and videos and you have no credit card paperwork that tracks back to you when you're jerkin off to 'em so consider it a wash and cool your jet's about 'official' trap sites.

[christianxxx]

Jamie, those guys all just fly to Thailand these days lol

[GroobySteven]

It's so easy to hide behind a computer and not post any information about yourself to cyber BULLY other people down. I'm the one with the BALLS to post information out there about myself standing in a line of fire. Actually I helped co-found a business when I was 17 and backed out a couple years later to move onto transitioning. I had to get away from it, all of it. None of my friends knew where I went or that I changed. I just couldn't deal with all the stress of transitioning at the same time. Every once in a while I'll go back to the site and see how it's doing and wish I was still apart of it as I watch it grow. But no I'm just a "20 year old" whoring myself out that doesn't know anything right? I'm stupid, I have no skills, no brain power, just a human fuck doll for your amusement.


Agreed. Lily may be right or she may be wrong on somethings but she's the only one of you that I've seen putting herself out there and giving personal information and photos.
Putting up (and re-posting) that photo, was bullying. Enough girls have been needlessly chased off this board by anonymous bullying or trolling (or just tired of seeing it). While you both may have valid points your escalation of a rather simply topic into personal attacks isn't acceptable in this topic.

[TSMichelleAustin]

Are you kidding me with what you just said? There are so many on tube sites that peep don't need to buy?
You go find me some high quality Trap content on tube sites? I'm not talking about low ass grainy flash quality. Or video of some bro with a wig filming himself in his mothers panties. I've searched the net for years to see if this sort of content was out there. In high quality form. Not some bullshit low grade crap that's on a tube site. And there isn't nada.

I get Christian on here basically putting my idea down, for what reason I have no clue. Like I wanna compete with him fucking some fat chick on a couch, or some old lady on his site. That was pretty uncalled for to just shoot it down like that. You don't know me, or Lily or many of the people on this board. You don't know that I don't have connections, or know people in the know so to say. You have no idea how good a photographer/Director I am, when it comes to modeling. Just because you've banged mostly every girl on the block, that does not make you a genius in the web world.
And your so called advertising skills arent as hard as you make them out to be..Anyone can jump on a site like HA and post an update and link. And the same thing goes for twitter. I've seen your promotion on twitter for your site. Seriously, nothing hard to do...But thanks anyway for your most knowledgeable advice...

I'm telling u from experience. Someone who has a niche site. It's not easy as u make it. And more peep rather find free shit on tube sites then pay!

[broncofan]

I don't want to re-iterate what Seanchai and Christian have said because they're very valid points that anyone starting a business should think about and seriously map out. Since they are in the business, their details are invaluable to you and you should take them at face value.

I do want to re-iterate Jamie French's point (just in case you missed it), which explains why even someone who is well established might find it a hard niche to support.

You have to choose between an age range that is barely legal and not having strong male secondary characteristics (and who hasn't transitioned right?). This limits your talent pool immediately, and of those who fit, they might not for long.

I've watched videos of some of the best looking ts' for over 10 years. Some have been shooting for well over 15 years. You're not going to have anything like that unless my understanding of trap is incorrect in which case correct me.

[LilyRox]

I don't want to re-iterate what Seanchai and Christian have said because they're very valid points that anyone starting a business should think about and seriously map out. Since they are in the business, their details are invaluable to you and you should take them at face value.

I do want to re-iterate Jamie French's point (just in case you missed it), which explains why even someone who is well established might find it a hard niche to support.

You have to choose between an age range that is barely legal and not having strong male secondary characteristics (and who hasn't transitioned right?). This limits your talent pool immediately, and of those who fit, they might not for long.

I've watched videos of some of the best looking ts' for over 10 years. Some have been shooting for well over 15 years. You're not going to have anything like that unless my understanding of trap is incorrect in which case correct me.

Yes, "traps" come and go quickly. There does to seem to be tons of them though.

[TSMichelleAustin]

And if these traps lie about their age... I know the young generation because I have a 13 yr old sister who lies to men online about her age all the time. I found her on dating sites and god knows where else. So Jamie is right most of these traps would never be able to shoot for a site because they are not legal, even though they say they are!

[broncofan]

Yes, "traps" come and go quickly. There does to seem to be tons of them though.
I don't mean to be condescending as I do have a little bit of experience in starting a business.

The hardest part of figuring out whether to start a business? Getting the kind of numbers Seanchai provided you with a couple pages back. If you're really interested in such a site, you need to take all of these numbers, make conservative estimates about what you can do and think about whether you have the money, the patience, and the time to make it work.

Can you withstand years of debt to make it work? If so, who's going to lend you working capital if you don't generate it? At what point do you decide that months of negative operating income is too much to bear? Is this going to be your sole source of income? If not then how are you going to work and run the site? If so, then how do you manage in the interim?

It's very frustrating when you have a good idea and then you find out it's not feasible. That's life though. I've been discouraged out of many "good ideas" once people gave me enough information to figure out I couldn't make it work. They're doing you a favor, though it doesn't seem like it at the time.

[LilyRox]

I don't mean to be condescending as I do have a little bit of experience in starting a business.

The hardest part of figuring out whether to start a business? Getting the kind of numbers Seanchai provided you with a couple pages back. If you're really interested in such a site, you need to take all of these numbers, make conservative estimates about what you can do and think about whether you have the money, the patience, and the time to make it work.

Can you withstand years of debt to make it work? If so, who's going to lend you working capital if you don't generate it? At what point do you decide that months of negative operating income is too much to bear? Is this going to be your sole source of income? If not then how are you going to work and run the site? If so, then how do you manage in the interim?

It's very frustrating when you have a good idea and then you find out it's not feasible. That's life though. I've been discouraged out of many "good ideas" once people gave me enough information to figure out I couldn't make it work. They're doing you a favor, though it doesn't seem like it at the time.

Lol I'm not creating a site like this. I wasn't even considering it. I don't have the resources.

[broncofan]

I guess I really meant that for Johnny Blaze but was going through you in case he got a little touchy over it;).