Gay man has a cruch on you,publically tells you & you kill him

[natina]

Jonathan Schmitz
When/where: 1996, Lake Orion, Mich. (http://www.bing.com/maps/default.aspx?q=Lake+Orion%2c+Mich.+++&mkt=en&FORM=msnhal)

The charges: Schmitz was charged with first-degree murder and assault with a firearm after killing Scott Amedure (http://www.bing.com/search?q=Scott+Amedure&go=&qs=n&form=msnhal). Amedure revealed his crush for Schmitz on a taping for this The Jenny Jones Show.

His insanity defense: Schmitz had a history of mental illness, and defense attorneys tried to use gay panic defense considering the nature of the case.

jonathan schmitz guilty of second-degree murder


The gay panic defense[1] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gay_panic_defense#cite_note-0) is a legal defense against charges of Assault - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assault) or Murder - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder). A defendant using the gay panic defense claims that he or she acted in a state of violent Insanity defense - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insanity_defense) because of a little-known psychiatric condition called Homosexual panic - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexual_panic).[2] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gay_panic_defense#cite_note-1) Trans panic is a similar defense applied towards cases where the victim is a Transgender - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgender) or Intersex - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intersex) person. This defense often fails, and has been ruled inadmissible in many jurisdictions [3] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gay_panic_defense#cite_note-2) because of a complete lack of scientific research to support it.


http://blu.stb.s-msn.com/i/19/91A53DA2234515C50EEA0FA9DC6E6.jpg

http://specials.msn.com/a-list/lifestyle/famous-insanity-cases-slideshow-ss?imageindex=11&cp-searchtext=Jonathan%20Schmitz

[FreddieGomez]

Gay dudes don't bother me. My godfather is gay.

I'm flattered if they think I'm hot, but sexually it won't happen.

I'm not gonna kill someone over it.

[giovanni_hotel]

Defense attorneys are the biggest bullshit artists walking the planet.

[Willie Escalade]

Gay dudes don't bother me.

I'm flattered if they think I'm hot, but sexually it won't happen.

I'm not gonna kill someone over it.

Ditto.

[Merkurie]

Defense attorneys are the biggest bullshit artists walking the planet.

Juries only fall for bullshit when they want to.

[txsam]

Gay dudes don't bother me. My godfather is gay.

I'm flattered if they think I'm hot, but sexually it won't happen.

I'm not gonna kill someone over it.

same here, if you dig me, so what.. Join the club lol j/k, but really, it's just half a chromosome for Gods sake.. If girls killed every guy that showed them unwanted attention there would be no guys left on earth..

[txsam]

Btw willie escalade, love your sig:)

Maybe people use the term "tranny" cause ts women are so very intricate,and few guys are intelligent and self confident enough to get to understand them;)

[Ryz]

Gay dudes don't bother me. My godfather is gay.

I'm flattered if they think I'm hot, but sexually it won't happen.

I'm not gonna kill someone over it.

Homo

[buckjohnson]

Gay cats come on to me, even at the gym, which I thought was a non no, until i really, really, really, listen to the the words of YMCA. And not that I judge men, but it always the cute chubby guys that come on to me, or the old guys. Younger, I might have reacted differently, but now I just say ok and move on.

[Prospero]

If a Gay Man came on to me I'd simply tell him I'm not interested. No big deal. Hasn't happened.

[natina]

what if he touch you and like squeezed your buttocks,pulled your hand towards his penis forcibly or grabbed your crotch?

how would you react?

[Prospero]

Resist, tell him to f*** off.... and in the final resolve, if all else failed, punch him.

[natina]

so an aggressive gay man would get a violent reaction!

[Merkurie]

What if he invited you to a Miami Heat game and picked up the tab at McCormick & Schmicks?

[Prospero]

What if he invited you to a Miami Heat game and picked up the tab at McCormick & Schmicks?

I wouldn't have the slightest clue what he was talking about....

[Willie Escalade]

what if he touch you and like squeezed your buttocks,pulled your hand towards his penis forcibly or grabbed your crotch?

how would you react?

I know of someone who actually did something like that. They later transitioned into one of the most gorgeous girls out there.

[bat1]

if we click so be it!

I'm game

[Baileyluv]

you befriend the guy, go out and have a good time, whats the big fucking deal. People are so hung up on what others think, just ewwwww. If someone irks someone that bad, maybe they should go kill themselves, obviously they have way too many hang ups and no community coping skills.

[brickcitybrother]

What's the point? Gay man likes you - unless you into him or that its going nowhere. I woman could like you - but if you're not into them its going nowhere. What's the difference?

[FreddieGomez]

them dudes aint that ballsy to come at me like that

[Merkurie]

them dudes aint that ballsy to come at me like that

"I likes ya an I wants ya. So we can do this the easy way or the hard way. The choice is yours"
-Fleece Johnson
Lock-Up_ RAW Booty Warrior FLEECE JOHNSON - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9WClv4U5B8)

[onmyknees]

so an aggressive gay man would get a violent reaction!


So what are you asking? Is it the sexuality of the aggressor that has you so inquisitive....or the fact that they are an aggressor ? The point is would an aggressive guy groping a women on the street get a different reaction? He shouldn't . You cross that line, and you'd better expect a reaction.

[Willie Escalade]

"I likes ya an I wants ya. So we can do this the easy way or the hard way. The choice is yours"
-Fleece Johnson
Lock-Up_ RAW Booty Warrior FLEECE JOHNSON - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9WClv4U5B8)

LMFAO!!

When I saw that caricature of this dude on The Boondocks, I was rollin'. Then to find out this dude is real? Priceless!

[Merkurie]

Boondocks rules.

[natina]

Thats some sick jail house shit!

[sunairco]

This happened to me back during the 80's. I'm not sure what I did to attract the attention, but when I got in grad school, I lost a lot of weight putting in 16 hr days and got so skinny without really trying. Just lots of moving and not eating. I got heavily into the academic crowd with a full beard, wearing flannel shirts over T's and jeans and smoking a pipe. Nothing in the way of jewelry or anything brand name. Outside of wearing aviator's that were typical of the time for wire frames and getting my old pair tinted, there wasn't anything I wore or did different. Oh, I started to carry a military surplus gas mask canvas green bag that my girlfriend with a web strap over my shoulder more as a camera and note bag b/c I used to bike to the university. It seemed that out of nowhere, guys were either giving me a wink or trying to pick me up. Hell, it didn't bother me, I was actually flattered. I never had a homophobic bone in me anyways. It sure bugged my girlfriend and my mom though. It was more fun to tell them, even make up a story or two just to get the reaction from them. It always amused me that they reacted so strongly to it. My dad would go off on how he'd beat the shit of any guy that did that. They seemed to have a problem with me not reacting the same way. Nobody ever touched me. I don't think that I'd have reacted if it was just a benign pat on the butt or touch. I certainly would have reacted if the overture was physical like a crotch grab or physical accostment, but I'd do that to anyone under any circumstances.

[slammer]

Gay dudes don't bother me. My godfather is gay.

I'm flattered if they think I'm hot, but sexually it won't happen.

I'm not gonna kill someone over it.
well said if some one kills another because a guy hit on you then you should be shot whats the big deal gay guys try and hit on me all the time but its never gonna happen

[slammer]

"I likes ya an I wants ya. So we can do this the easy way or the hard way. The choice is yours"
-Fleece Johnson
Lock-Up_ RAW Booty Warrior FLEECE JOHNSON - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9WClv4U5B8)
disgusting i would introduce this sum bag to my .45 these animals shot be shot in the head and we shouldnt be paying for them to be kept alive

[bimale69]

I think anyone who uses the "gay panic" defense after commiting a homo/transphobic hate crime is a bigoted coward.

[Faith_CD]

so this gay guy brought a straight guy on a national TV show to tell him he had a crush on him? ok while not deserving death, this guy is a nut. what did he expect this person's reaction to be?
it's one thing to go up to someone in public it's another to bark up the wrong tree on a national TV show.

[Merkurie]

so this gay guy brought a straight guy on a national TV show to tell him he had a crush on him? ok while not deserving death, this guy is a nut. what did he expect this person's reaction to be?
it's one thing to go up to someone in public it's another to bark up the wrong tree on a national TV show.

Why should anyone have to fear telling another person that they have a crush on them?

[Quiet Reflections]

Why should anyone have to fear telling another person that they have a crush on them?
they shouldn't. What people should fear is living their life and never hearing it at all.

[Merkurie]

they shouldn't. What people should fear is living their life and never hearing it at all.
True.

[danthepoetman]

You always think you’ve seen everything. Someone who kills another person because that person has a crush on him? He took a gun and just killed him. That’s so vile and disgusting it’s beyond expression. You make a whole world disappear because you don’t like that person’s attraction for you? That’s just unspeakable.
I’m not gay, but I do feel flattered when someone, anyone, tell me he or she is attracted to me. Why wouldn’t something like that be pleasing to hear? It is twisted to turn that into violence, but certainly not insane in any way, on the contrary: it reveals someone with cold, violent, fucked up values…

[Faith_CD]

Why should anyone have to fear telling another person that they have a crush on them?

i didn't say they should have to fear it but really what was this guys end game? he took a straight man onto the Jenny Jones show, which was broadcast nation wide, to tell him he had a crush on him. what exactly did he think was going to happen?

again what happened was totally unacceptable but i'm just wondering what was up with the gay man who went way out of his way to get what was going to be an almost certain bad reaction.

[Merkurie]

Did it have to be a bad reaction?

What about that show "There is something about Miriam? That was bound to end badly too. But I got the clear impression that the guy who Miriam chose was truly attracted to her and into her. Her Trans status and the way it was revealed at the climax of the program doomed the whole thing. But did it really have to?

How is someone who is not "straight" supposed to "safely" find a mate? Wear appropriately colored hankies? Stick to queer spaces? or take their lives into their own hands?

To hell with people's precious straightness.

[danthepoetman]

i didn't say they should have to fear it but really what was this guys end game? he took a straight man onto the Jenny Jones show, which was broadcast nation wide, to tell him he had a crush on him. what exactly did he think was going to happen?

again what happened was totally unacceptable but i'm just wondering what was up with the gay man who went way out of his way to get what was going to be an almost certain bad reaction.

So, Faith, what would be the bottom line here? He shouldn’t reveal his crush in front of what? 5 persons? no: 3? then again no: only one, only to the person whom he has a crush on, right? Then what if it was to come to someone else’s ears? should the other guy be then entitled to be so mad in such circumstances?
I don’t understand that logic, but not one bit! What does it do to someone to be attractive to someone gay? Soil him? Does it disgrace him? Does it diminish him? Tell me, because I can’t fathom this one! Why is it an attenuating circumstance to you that this crush was revealed on tv?
That someone would think: “Because you, the gay, told everyone you were attracted to me, I’m going to kill you”? that, to you, is a normal reaction? I just can’t get this!
Come on! Faith, that doesn't make sense... Every one of us should have the right to his desire and his attraction when it is between adults, and no one deserves to be treated like that for such a reason. We all should have the right to express ourselves without risking to be attacked.

[natina]

ow let talk about aggressive gay men who grab forcibly and or aggressively

forward,whats your take on on response then?

what if a guy does or say for instance a
guy is really religious and has in his belief that he will go to hell for relationship with a TS but the ts tricks him into marriage and its not discovered until some one tells or goes digging.

this has already happen in either te U.K. OR LONDON


what if he touch you and like squeezed your buttocks,pulled your hand towards his penis forcibly or grabbed your crotch?

how would you react?


so an aggressive gay man would get a violent reaction!


So what are you asking? Is it the sexuality of the aggressor that has you so inquisitive....or the fact that they are an aggressor ? The point is would an aggressive guy groping a women on the street get a different reaction? He shouldn't . You cross that line, and you'd better expect a reaction.


i didn't say they should have to fear it but really what was this guys end game? he took a straight man onto the Jenny Jones show, which was broadcast nation wide, to tell him he had a crush on him. what exactly did he think was going to happen?

again what happened was totally unacceptable but i'm just wondering what was up with the gay man who went way out of his way to get what was going to be an almost certain bad reaction.

[danthepoetman]

Natina, we’re talking about someone who reveals a crush on someone; not a prison rape committed by someone who’s in there for life. All the cases you’re talking about are different. Yet I’ll tell you something, ever since I started reading the paper a long, long time ago, what I see is people who are getting beaten up to a pulp and killed for absolutely no other reason than their sexual orientation; what little of the opposite you see (outside prison stories), is so meager it’s practically nonexistent. I think we should remain on the subject…

[onmyknees]

So, Faith, what would be the bottom line here? He shouldn’t reveal his crush in front of what? 5 persons? no: 3? then again no: only one, only to the person whom he has a crush on, right? Then what if it was to come to someone else’s ears? should the other guy be then entitled to be so mad in such circumstances?
I don’t understand that logic, but not one bit! What does it do to someone to be attractive to someone gay? Soil him? Does it disgrace him? Does it diminish him? Tell me, because I can’t fathom this one! Why is it an attenuating circumstance to you that this crush was revealed on tv?
That someone would think: “Because you, the gay, told everyone you were attracted to me, I’m going to kill you”? that, to you, is a normal reaction? I just can’t get this!
Come on! Faith, that doesn't make sense... Every one of us should have the right to his desire and his attraction when it is between adults, and no one deserves to be treated like that for such a reason. We all should have the right to express ourselves without risking to be attacked.


You seem like a reasonable and decent guy, but you're living in a utopian dream world. When are you returning to this one? You seem to be hung up on what "should be " permissable or acceptable. That's nice, but you're presuming everyone has your skill set and disposition. Bad assumption. There are certain things we know instinctively that are just not advisable. You don't walk down a dark alley in a bad neighborhood at 2 AM, and the person that's foolish enough to say " I should be able to walk anywhere in my city" is not wrong...he's just going to get hurt. You don't drive by a group of Hells Angels and flip them the bird because you think their exhaust is to loud to hear your radio. You don't stare at some Navy Seal's dick in the shower at your local gym...newsflash....he's not feeling the love you might have ! You don't confront someone like that on national TV with such a controversial admission. You leave him a voice mail, write him a letter, or tell him privately.
I'm not blaming the victim, but nothing good was bound to happen when one person is so publicly intimidated and embarrassed. I'm actually surprised it doesn't happen more often. It's not about how you'd feel and react in the same situation, it's about how he reacted.

[danthepoetman]

What do you mean by “someone like that”? a regular guy? How should you know he’s a psychotic maniac? Is there something I missed, here? What does it have to do with Hells Angels or Navy Seals, or even with walking around at night in a “bad neighbohood”? Who’s in another world, here? What the fuck are you talking about? He should have to reveal his feeling only by voice mail or letter or be subjected to violence? Once again, man, what the fuck are you talking about? People should get killed because they are gay in your “realistic” world? You find that type of act to be normal? You don’t think as I do that there is something really, really fucked up about this? Really? Jesus!

[Faith_CD]

What do you mean by “someone like that”? a regular guy? How should you know he’s a psychotic maniac? Is there something I missed, here? What does it have to do with Hells Angels or Navy Seals, or even with walking around at night in a “bad neighbohood”? Who’s in another world, here? What the fuck are you talking about? He should have to reveal his feeling only by voice mail or letter or be subjected to violence? Once again, man, what the fuck are you talking about? People should get killed because they are gay in your “realistic” world? You find that type of act to be normal? You don’t think as I do that there is something really, really fucked up about this? Really? Jesus!


really?? are you even reading what is being said at all or just seeing words and putting them in the place that makes your argument hold water? lol

NOBODY said that his reaction, to kill or even harm this other person, was right, justified, or anything but horrible. unfortunately life isn't a sugar coated cookie. this gay man took a straight man on a NATIONAL TV SHOW to tell him he had a crush on him. the BEST CASE scenario, the straight man feels awkward and the gay man doesnt go home with his crush because he is straight.
another thing to keep in mind The jenny Jones Show went off the air in 2003 and the view of gay people has changed quite a bit in 10 years. it was much more common to hear about "gay bashing" and people getting beaten up or killed for being gay then.

you bring up the Miriam show and that is an example of something that could have ended VERY badly. i can promise you that on that final episode there was a ton of security because as much as the moral of the story is "hey you find out this person isn't exactly what you think they are it didnt keep you from having strong feelings for them" these people are also being deceived for entertainment purposes and in that heat of the moment they might go crazy and get violent.

ok and to put it in a better context for you maybe, you go on jenny Jones to tell a lesbian that you have a crush on her. then what? she is so flattered that she decides to go straight?
when you put people in weird situations sometimes you get adverse reactions and to somehow think that putting a straight male on a tv show to tell him you have a gay crush on him you have to understand he might not react well to that. to think otherwise is being unreasonable.

and again his reaction was wrong, terrible, unacceptable and he should have gotten murder 1. but if my friend told me "hey I'm going to bring straight guy Bob on tv and tell him I have a crush on him" i would ask them if they were high and why they would think of such a stupid idea.

[danthepoetman]

What are you argumenting against, here, and who are you talking to: me? Merkurie? And what is your point? To say you’re wrong but I think the same thing you do, except that reality is not all nice?

That someone would have a violent reaction just because he is told someone else has a crush on him is absurd and disgusting even if that person is gay. What part of that point don’t you understand? Moreover, to imply that the victim was stupid to make such a revelation publically is following the killer’s logic, which is that there is something humiliating to be liked by a homo… You’re justifying him to a certain extent, you adopt the same damn logic. If it is stupid to make that revelation publically, well then you necessarily intend that indeed, there was some reason for the aggressor to be violent. It’s very simple logic. And there is no way around it.
What part of that makes me a utopian, in onmyknee’s words? You accuse me of not reading but you can’t even be clear on what precisely you address.
You present yourself as being Faith CD: how can you not understand what I’m saying, here? You think it’s ok to beat up on someone because of gay desires? or because these desires were not expressed in the right manner or at the right place?
I sugar coat reality to think it’s disgusting and should not happen? or that we should denounce it clearly and loudly?

[Faith_CD]

What are you argumenting against, here, and who are you talking to: me? Merkurie? And what is your point? To say you’re wrong but I think the same thing you do, except that reality is not all nice?

That someone would have a violent reaction just because he is told someone else has a crush on him is absurd and disgusting even if that person is gay. What part of that point don’t you understand? Moreover, to imply that the victim was stupid to make such a revelation publically is following the killer’s logic, which is that there is something humiliating to be liked by a homo… You’re justifying him to a certain extent, you adopt the same damn logic. If it is stupid to make that revelation publically, well then you necessarily intend that indeed, there was some reason for the aggressor to be violent. It’s very simple logic. And there is no way around it.
What part of that makes me a utopian, in onmyknee’s words? You accuse me of not reading but you can’t even be clear on what precisely you address.
You present yourself as being Faith CD: how can you not understand what I’m saying, here? You think it’s ok to beat up on someone because of gay desires? or because these desires were not expressed in the right manner or at the right place?
I sugar coat reality to think it’s disgusting and should not happen? or that we should denounce it clearly and loudly?

again you aren't reading what people are saying, you're just rearranging the words to suit your ideas so I'm going to do this one more time and then i'll stop feeding the troll...

1. I am talking to you Danthepoetman, thus it is why i quoted your statement in reply. not really sure how you got confused about that.

2. I didnt say "you’re wrong but I think the same thing you do, except that reality is not all nice". i said that the guy who killed the other guy is wrong for killing him bottom line. however he put himself into a situation were a violent act could happen and that was beyond foolish on his part. this was not a gay guy who hit on a straight guy at a club, at a business, at a restaurant, ect. he took him a tv show. i can see how this could be very embarrassing for a straight guy to be brought on tv and have a guy express a crush on you. keep in mind this show likely happend in the late 90s early 2000s when being gay was even less accepted then it is now. not condoning the violence that happend because of it but you are super naive if you cant see how he was putting himself into a bad situation.

3. what your issue is is that just because you feel it is wrong, you then cannot understand it. it's awesome that you are super open minded and understanding however not everyone is. yea the world would be a better place if everyone was but the world isn't and we have to deal with it like adults.
an example, I am a cross dresser and there are certain places I feel comfortable going out while dressed and some that I am not. I will not be going to the local biker bar because it's a bit of a rough crowd and while in a perfect world they should accept me (or at the very least sya live and let live and just ignore me) it only takes ONE person there to put me into a bad situation.
this gay man put himself into a bad situation. what he did was stupid. he's a dummy pure and simple. he didnt deserve to be killed or beat up but he voluntarily put himself into a situation were there was a good chance it could be bad times.

4. again i will ask, what was the point of him even bringing up the crush? he is gay, the man he has a crush on is straight. why even do this? besides it bringing him into a bad situation its totally pointless to even bring up. the straight man isnt going to say "wow well since you have a crush on me maybe i will go out with you and see what it's like".

5. "Moreover, to imply that the victim was stupid to make such a revelation publically is following the killer’s logic, which is that there is something humiliating to be liked by a homo…" have you heard how straight males talk to each other? being called "gay" or "homo' or whatever else is looked at a put down. again yay for you for being super open minded and accepting but to be blind to what is happening in the real world is foolish. straight men generally do not want to be viewed as gay and the younger they are the more prone they are to act violently if thought to be or called gay if they arent. again, its reality and we have to accept that currently this is whats going on in the world.

6. "If it is stupid to make that revelation publically, well then you necessarily intend that indeed, there was some reason for the aggressor to be violent. It’s very simple logic. And there is no way around it."
you are talking in black and white and i'm talking in gray. if he REALLY felt that his life wouldnt be complete without letting this person know he had a crush on him then why not tell him 1-on-1? over the phone? in a letter/email? why did he do it on a national tv show??!! thats the dumbest thing i've ever heard of and totally pointless.
i contend had he brought this up in a much more private setting it would not have escalated to violence. if its a private conversation it ends right there no harm no foul. all that straight guy needed was for 1 friend, 1 co-worker, to see that show and the hounding and mocking starts and the guy goes off the deep end.

7. "You think it’s ok to beat up on someone because of gay desires? or because these desires were not expressed in the right manner or at the right place?"
its never ok to be assaulted for being gay, period. the gay man put himself where the best possible ending was that nothing changed, and there was a pretty good chance that something negative would happen due to bringing a huge audience in on what should have been a private discussion.


8. "I sugar coat reality to think it’s disgusting and should not happen? or that we should denounce it clearly and loudly?"
you're sugar coating life by somehow expecting this to be unthinkable when in fact it really isn't a HUGE stretch given how some people feel about gays. Not saying it's right, I'm saying it is reality and while things are changing for the bestter it's foolish to put yourself in harms way and expect everything to be totally fine.

[danthepoetman]

Garota de Ipanema - Joao Gilberto - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6tNV3DyaFU)

[Faith_CD]

that song is lame, here's a much better one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTgKRCXybSM

[natina]

Forced Feminization in Prison - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TFN8dYgSRBk&feature=related)



"I likes ya an I wants ya. So we can do this the easy way or the hard way. The choice is yours"
-Fleece Johnson
Lock-Up_ RAW Booty Warrior FLEECE JOHNSON - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9WClv4U5B8)

[natina]

bump this thread because its needed

[GroobySteven]

bump this thread because its needed


No it's not - don't do that again.