Islam, The Religion of Peace, will stone you DEAD!

[PomonaCA]

Gosh, you'd think it was 11 AD not 2011AD. For all you who celebrate diversity, here's some diversity for you-


Islamic Taliban Executes Couple By Stoning

LiveLeak.com - Taliban Executes Couple By Stoning - With Story (comments enabled) (http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=447_1292780555)

[drock]

Can we just drop a fucking bomb on all those towel heads already and end this.

[PomonaCA]

Can we just drop a fucking bomb on all those towel heads already and end this.


You're going to get flamed for saying that. Don't you know that we just need to establish a dialogue with them so that we can understand each others points of view? LOL

[drock]

You're going to get flamed for saying that. Don't you know that we just need to establish a dialogue with them so that we can understand each others points of view? LOL

Awe yeah right.. LOL.

[rockabilly]

Infidel!!

[tskitana]

thats sickening...and sad. :(

[BellaBellucci]

SILENCE! I KILL YOU!

http://www.newquest.fr/blog/public/images/capturaecra-achmed-the-dead-terrorist-tiagofarrajotacom-o-weblog-mozilla-firefox.png

~BB~

[PomonaCA]

thats sickening...and sad. :(


Right? Can you believe these guys? Stoning a young lady to death and only because she wanted to get her meatflower wrecked by someone else? Horrible.

[tskitana]

Right? Can you believe these guys? Stoning a young lady to death and only because she wanted to get her meatflower wrecked by someone else? Horrible.

stoning to death is just brutal. i wouldve voted for whip lashes.
or a quick painless death. Even if she did wrong... someone should
not be sentenced to death like that. sighh. And the sickening part is
those men who are throwing the stones seems to enjoy it. :(

[dc_guy_75]

Islam is for morons.

PS- Muslims will get you stoned!

[oak]

Just to play devils advocate.... I've been to several islamic countries. I've certainly seen the backwards side of islam. I had a translator who was shia in a sunni country. He was very devote in his religion. He was also very open minded. We had many discussions about religion. Everytime we entered a building or went to check out an ied he was by my side. He helped me pull a christian out of a vehicle. He had more to lose and less to gain than me yet he risked more than i. Certainly this forum would respect/cherish individuality and freedoms no?

Edit-i just read all replies in the forum. My comment wasnt direct towards the stoning video from the cowards who "represent" islam but towards those who would make blanket statements. Besides, everyone knows drawn and quartered is the only way to properly execute a motherfucka.

[D'yer Mak'er]

just to play devils advocate.... I've been to several islamic countries. I've certainly seen the backwards side of islam. I had a translator who was shia in a sunni country. He was very devote in his religion. He was also very open minded. We had many discussions about religion. Everytime we entered a building or went to check out an ied he was by my side. He helped me pull a christian out of a vehicle. He had more to lose and less to gain than me yet he risked more than i. Certainly this forum would respect/cherish individuality and freedoms no?

but... Muslims are teh evil.

[PomonaCA]

Just to play devils advocate.... I've been to several islamic countries. I've certainly seen the backwards side of islam. I had a translator who was shia in a sunni country. He was very devote in his religion. He was also very open minded. We had many discussions about religion. Everytime we entered a building or went to check out an ied he was by my side. He helped me pull a christian out of a vehicle. He had more to lose and less to gain than me yet he risked more than i. Certainly this forum would respect/cherish individuality and freedoms no?

Not the same way Islam does, obviously.

[oak]

That's my point. Those arent muslims. Those are fools.

[seamonkey]

Gosh, you'd think it was 11 AD not 2011AD...


Islam did not exist in 11 AD. It wasn't founded until the 7th century.

[PomonaCA]

That's my point. Those arent muslims. Those are fools.


They were Muslims.

[Dino Velvet]

Can we just drop a fucking bomb on all those towel heads already and end this.

As the civilized world becomes more and more tired of radical Islam's shenanigans your wish might actually come true and be witnessed on live TV. Have some friends over and start a drinking game. Whenever some Hajii scumbag holds up a baby or hides behind a woman to keep from getting killed, take a drink. Before you know it, you'll have people throwing up and passing out all over your house. I wish the Koran came in 2-ply for when I run out of Charmin and am too lazy to go to the store.

http://sheikyermami.com/wp-content/uploads/koran_wipes112.jpg

[TsJennifer]

Stoning is very real and sad. You should see the movie the The Stoning of Soraya! AMAZING MOVIE!

YouTube - Trailer: The Stoning of Soraya M (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWbdn5YfMJs)

[scroller]

Can we just drop a fucking bomb on all those towel heads already and end this.

Christianity, The Religion of Peace, will fucking bomb you DEAD!

[tambor]

Ugly video, but informative. Folks this is the religion of peace at its most extreme. Its barbaric and sicking to the " enlightend " west but let us remember that we ( being western society) have done similar things even in the last century or perhaps this century.

The Inquisition, concentration camps; interment camps; manifest destiny and the whole sale extermination of the American Indian Tribes; Lynchings; Executions by hanging; firing squads; electrocution. Western history is riddled with similar barbaric behaviors. We try to over come it and as we mature we try to find other alternatives to senseless waste and barbarism.

There are no easy answers here.

Sharia Law is offensive to us westerners we find it ruthless and evil, to the 1 billion or so people that practice Islam and the fewer more extreme fundamentalists to them this is just following God's law.

Honestly I am for just walling it off and isolate them let them live their lives and hope for the inevitable revolutions to come and inflict change on them. Espousing wholesale slaughter or out and out extermination makes us no better than the NAZI's or Stalin or them for that matter.

[alyssaluxor]

so DISTURBING and SICK! i just cant watch it :(

[CORVETTEDUDE]

Fanatics are fanatics, regardless the religion. Baptists believe dancing to be againt the teachings of the Bible...but you don't get stonerd for it. How about the witch burnings or the torture of the Spanish Inquisition. The point being, there are fanatics in every religion. Unfortunately, they seem to amass alot of power. Of course, it's easy to incite a mob, with the majority of people being nothing more than sheep anyway. They aren't just morons, they are dangerous morons.

[thombergeron]

To the best of my knowledge, we are already at war with the Taliban. So yeah, they're nasty dudes, and we're dropping bombs on them. Not sure what else you're looking for... validation of some kind?

Nice work, Pomona! You are a marginally better person than the Taliban. Hold that head high!

[LibertyHarkness]

cant we just cleanse all these heretics ... For the Emperor :)

[95racer]

Backward fucks. I got a ton of them living in my area.

[russtafa]

This is a religion that has not modernized since the middle ages and is now been exposed to the world so you can't blame them

[thombergeron]

Seems like you guys enjoy gory videos of religious extremists. Here's a good one:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/8587305.stm

[thombergeron]

Oooh... you guys will LOVE this one. Some backwards religious fundamentalists cut the lips off of a little boy:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/8656634.stm

[Etranger]

This is a religion that has not modernized since the middle ages and is now been exposed to the world so you can't blame them
In fact Islam has been through many different phases since the 7thc nobody here asks why a more violent interpretation of the religion has emerged in the last 40 years when it was less in years before that? Yes, there is a crisis in the religion itself, and yes there are extreme elements who believe stoning and other mutilations are automatic punishments even though this isn't always what the Quran says -the vast majority of Muslims loathe this kind of behaviour, and you can't lard them all with tar -as for 'cleansing' dropping bombs -isnt that just another kind of murder? In other words, if you support that you dont disapprove of mass murder -just as long as you get to select the victims...same argument that is used to kill transgendered people! For heaven's sake people, there are alternatives...

[nsagent]

SILENCE! I KILL YOU!

http://www.newquest.fr/blog/public/images/capturaecra-achmed-the-dead-terrorist-tiagofarrajotacom-o-weblog-mozilla-firefox.png

~BB~

I loved that bit, hilarity at its finest

[CORVETTEDUDE]

SILENCE! I KILL YOU!

http://www.newquest.fr/blog/public/images/capturaecra-achmed-the-dead-terrorist-tiagofarrajotacom-o-weblog-mozilla-firefox.png

~BB~

Priceless!!!!

[seamonkey]

Anyone who doesn't believe that the right wing Christians in the U.S. and other countries wouldn't resort to the same kinds of behaviors if allowed is incredibly naive.

I strongly recommend the following for information on right wing authoritarianism: http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~altemey/.

Altemeyer has only studied this in the U.S. and Canada, which are predominantly Christian, but the observations and conclusions are just as applicable to authoritarians among other religions. It's more about psychology than religion.

Has anyone ever considered the fact that Buddhism is the only major religion that has never had a holy war? It is 2500 years old. Not that Asians haven't conducted wars and committed atrocities, or that there aren't authoritarians in Asia, just that there have never been any made in the name of Buddhism as far as I know (and I study a lot of history).

[magicman]

Islam is for morons.

PS- Muslims will get you stoned!

What a dumb, naive person you are for bashing any religion.

[BellaBellucci]

What a dumb, naive person you are for bashing any religion.

Who gives a shit? They all suck! :lol:

Religion is a crutch for the weak and a tool of control for the oligarchy.

~BB~

[magicman]

Who gives a shit? They all suck! :lol:

Religion is a crutch for the weak and a tool of control for the oligarchy.

~BB~

Keep your opinion to yourself. Do not tarnish the essence of any religion.

[JackBeLittle]

Keep your opinions to yourself. Do not tarnish the essence of an religion.
I agree with Bella and the others - religion (all of them) suck horribly. They corral the weak minded and desperate to push their own agendas. And, further "magicman" this is a forum and the sharing of opinions is to be encouraged. If you don't like that, then quit the forum.

[BLKGSXR]

Keep your opinion to yourself. Do not tarnish the essence of any religion.
finally someone who has some sort of education...Just because the religion isnt yours doesnt mean kill its name.

[LibertyHarkness]

one day all religion will be abolished, most likely half of the human race will perish in this act , but at this point the human race will indeed gel as one as the species will be united as a singular species .. push onward to establish itself as the commanding species in the universe ....instead of exterminating itself ..






well thast what happens in warhammer 40k, when the god emperor comes and to our salvation sounds a winner to me :)

[BellaBellucci]

Keep your opinion to yourself. Do not tarnish the essence of any religion.

Hey, if you don't want to hear it from me, maybe you'd like to hear it from this guy:

YouTube - Richard Dawkins -- The God Delusion (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMqTEfeqvmM)

or this one:

YouTube - Bill Maher's 'Religulous' (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHH2JItePlc)

Fuck religion and fuck people who defend religion to the detriment of reason. Consider yourself 'tarnished,' my religulous friend. :geek:

~BB~

[russtafa]

The religions of the world have a lot to answer for.persecution of gays ,the over population of our planet,religious wars,oppression of women, keeping their populations in ignorance

[runningdownthatdream]

Keep your opinion to yourself. Do not tarnish the essence of any religion.

For someone who elected to use their freedom of speech to voice their own opinion, your comment seems rather obtuse.

Religion has outlived it's usefulness much like communism and fascism, let's move on already!

[onmyknees]

Hey, if you don't want to hear it from me, maybe you'd like to hear it from this guy:

YouTube - Richard Dawkins -- The God Delusion (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMqTEfeqvmM)

or this one:

YouTube - Bill Maher's 'Religulous' (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHH2JItePlc)

Fuck religion and fuck people who defend religion to the detriment of reason. Consider yourself 'tarnished,' my religulous friend. :geek:

~BB~

Bella , ... you're way outta line, not because that's your opinion, you're certainly entitled to it, but because of the way you express it. You sound hateful, bitter and mean...Wanna be an atheist? Fine by me...Pray to the porcelain goddess if that's what you choose,
but don't throw acid at 70% of the country who choose some sort of religion because you got a hair up your ass about it.
And you don't bolster your case by using Bill Maher. Besides not being funny in a decade, the guys arrogance is only exceeded by his ignorance.
To consider someone "tarnished" because they might just believe in some higher being , or maybe even a tree, strikes me as incredibly intolerant. Shame on you...your penance for such intolerance is ten hail mary's ! LMAO

[PomonaCA]

There are clearly many retards on this forum so let me give a little history lesson.

Human beings were killing each other LONG before Christ, Mohammed or that fatass with an eating disorder, Buddha.

Even by the teachings of the liberal god which is science, we humans were destroying each other since the great nothing in the sky invented us out of nothing. In other words, hatred and murder are in us. Hatred and murder have nothing to do with this God that you do not believe in.

[BellaBellucci]

Bella , ... you're way outta line, not because that's your opinion, you're certainly entitled to it, but because of the way you express it. You sound hateful, bitter and mean...Wanna be an atheist? Fine by me...Pray to the porcelain goddess if that's what you choose,
but don't throw acid at 70% of the country who choose some sort of religion because you got a hair up your ass about it.
And you don't bolster your case by using Bill Maher. Besides not being funny in a decade, the guys arrogance is only exceeded by his ignorance.
To consider someone "tarnished" because they might just believe in some higher being , or maybe even a tree, strikes me as incredibly intolerant. Shame on you...your penance for such intolerance is ten hail mary's ! LMAO

I was merely reacting to what I viewed as not only an intolerant opinion of atheists, but a demand that I 'keep my opinion to (my)self.' And I also qualified my statement by stating that I was talking about those who defend religion 'to the detriment of reason,' which was an intentionally specific phrasing.


There are clearly many retards on this forum so let me give a little history lesson.

Human beings were killing each other LONG before Christ, Mohammed or that fatass with an eating disorder, Buddha.

Even by the teachings of the liberal god which is science, we humans were destroying each other since the great nothing in the sky invented us out of nothing. In other words, hatred and murder are in us. Hatred and murder have nothing to do with this God that you do not believe in.

That's a good point, but at this individual moment in time, not only is that hatred and murder currently justified by religion, but it's the very religions involved that also want to preach peace and tolerance... except for <insert scapegoated demographic here>.

~BB~

[PomonaCA]

I was merely reacting to what I viewed as not only an intolerant opinion of atheists, but a demand that I 'keep my opinion to (my)self.' And I also qualified my statement by stating that I was talking about those who defend religion 'to the detriment of reason,' which was an intentionally specific phrasing.



That's a good point, but at this individual moment in time, not only is that hatred and murder currently justified by religion, but it's the very religions involved that also want to preach peace and tolerance... except for <insert scapegoated demographic here>.

~BB~

Please, people are killing each other over fanboy bullshit like Ipods and which tranny has the best makeup. Negros kill each other over colors and rappers over which coast is better.

You take away religion, people will fight over colors. Take away race and people will fight over language. Take away language and people will fight over culture.

It's mankind that is hopelessly wicked.

[BellaBellucci]

Please, people are killing each other over fanboy bullshit like Ipods and which tranny has the best makeup. Negros kill each other over colors and rappers over which coast is better.

You take away religion, people will fight over colors. Take away race and people will fight over language. Take away language and people will fight over culture.

It's mankind that is hopelessly wicked.

That argument only holds weight with groups of people who kill their enemies. Right now, Islam is killing civilians and Christianity just marginalizes people instead. And unlike gangbangers who don't care about right and wrong, the people who follow these religions and their followers think that they're right to the point that discriminating against those that are different (as opposed to an individual opposition or enemy) is a behavior that is actually rewarded and more widescale. I agree with what you're saying to an extent, but I think religion is the world's worst amplifier/justifier of such behavior.

~BB~

[PomonaCA]

That argument only holds weight with groups of people who kill their enemies. Right now, Islam is killing civilians and Christianity just marginalizes people instead. And unlike gangbangers who don't care about right and wrong, the people who follow these religions and they're followers think that they're right to the point that discriminating against those that are different (as opposed to an individual opposition or enemy) is a behavior that is actually rewarded and more widescale. I agree with what you're saying to an extent, but I think religion is the world's worst amplifier/justifier of such behavior.

~BB~

Now you're marginalizing murder, nice. You missed the point entirely. The point was that people are killing each other with or without religion and were killing each other LONG before religions.

This is no truer than from an evolutionary perspective. Back during a time that you evolution believers think that we were all apes and animals, we were still killing each other. The problem is the heart of man, end of story.

[BellaBellucci]

Now you're marginalizing murder, nice.

I can agree to disagree (and again only to a point) with the rest of what you said, but 'marginalizing murder?' Huh?! :confused: :lol:

~BB~

[CORVETTEDUDE]

Keep your opinion to yourself. Do not tarnish the essence of any religion.


Who the fuck died and put you in charge??? :fu::fu:

[lisaparadise]

For someone who elected to use their freedom of speech to voice their own opinion, your comment seems rather obtuse.

Religion has outlived it's usefulness much like communism and fascism, let's move on already!oh very well said

[lisaparadise]

Can we just drop a fucking bomb on all those towel heads already and end this.marry me lol

[lisaparadise]

Who gives a shit? They all suck! :lol:

Religion is a crutch for the weak and a tool of control for the oligarchy.

~BB~exactly,weak minds that got brainwashed over time.

[thombergeron]

Nonetheless, Pomona, from a rationalist perspective, it’s the same thing: worshipping the right god or wearing the right color t-shirt or hanging with the right Stone Age chieftain. Religion is just tribalism masked in tradition and ceremony.

Plainly, that’s the purpose it serves for you. That’s the reason you started this thread: that religion is nasty but my religion teh awesome. But in order to believe that, you have to intentionally ignore the fact that your religion still inspires people to cut the lips off of little kids’ faces and to rape and murder women.

So yes, there has always been always killing and hatred between the tribes, before the church and then intimately bound up with the church. Personally, I think it’s immoral to ascribe this to “human nature,” and just let the church off the hook. But apparently the church told you different, so you go with your bad self.

Fortunately, thanks to rational discourse, critical thinking, and human progress, there are fewer and fewer people like you all the time. Someday everyone like you will be gone, and we’ll see a lot less killing and hatred.

[spankrod]

Not to be ... well, out in left-field ... but is it wrong of me that I kept watching and watching in the vain hope that a couple of them would bring over a giant boulder like the one from Monty Python's Life of Brian?

[catherinefan]

Please, people are killing each other over fanboy bullshit like Ipods and which tranny has the best makeup. Negros kill each other over colors and rappers over which coast is better.

You take away religion, people will fight over colors. Take away race and people will fight over language. Take away language and people will fight over culture.

It's mankind that is hopelessly wicked.

You are quite right and that is what's causing me to believe that there is no God.

Let's face it, PomonaCA. If you were God, wouldn't you have created beings that can live together peacefully?

By the way.....anyone know how many people in Africa the catholic church is killing by not allowing the use of condoms?

[PomonaCA]

You are quite right and that is what's causing me to believe that there is no God.

Let's face it, PomonaCA. If you were God, wouldn't you have created beings that can live together peacefully?

By the way.....anyone know how many people in Africa the catholic church is killing by not allowing the use of condoms?


Oh right, I getcha. Much like Budweiser is responsible for all those people driving drunk. OK.

[iamdrgonzo]

All religons are shams, a means by which to control the masses through superstition, allowing the ignorant to supplant their fears of the unknown with myth.

Blah, a pox upon all of your false deities and the pain and suffering that has been collectively forced upon human-kind for several millennia by those in need of power.

[catherinefan]

Oh right, I getcha. Much like Budweiser is responsible for all those people driving drunk. OK.

No, not at all like Budweiser.
Budweiser allows people a choice.
The catholic church does not.

[Stavros]

Those of you calling for or supporting the extermination of Muslims could just as well swap the word for David Kato, the process is the same, and SHAME ON YOU!!
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/jan/28/gay-activist-david-kato-funeral

[PomonaCA]

No, not at all like Budweiser.
Budweiser allows people a choice.
The catholic church does not.


There is quite a large ex-catholic movement in the world, but hey, don't let the facts get in your way.

[russtafa]

religions are to blame for the worlds over population

[BLKGSXR]

religions are to blame for the worlds over population
you dont blame the kids who fuck without condoms or rapists...goootcha! :whistle:

[MrsKellyPierce]

lol lol

[PomonaCA]

religions are to blame for the worlds over population

The world is overpopulated? LOL! Do tell!

I always get a kick out of this shit.

[russtafa]

No i blame the worlds religions for still banning the use of contraception and encouraging their followers to keep breeding even when they live in poverty

[PomonaCA]

No i blame the worlds religions for still banning the use of contraception and encouraging their followers to keep breeding even when they live in poverty

So now you're the breeding police? LOL Is that how you're combating the alleged 'over population'?

[russtafa]

So what ,would you do leave it up to the churches and mosque's to control the level of population.They have done such a great job so far lol

[scroller]

Fortunately, thanks to rational discourse, critical thinking, and human progress, there are fewer and fewer people like you all the time. Someday everyone like you will be gone, and we’ll see a lot less killing and hatred.

Possibly. Or then again (from today's PhysOrg.com)...


Rowthorn has developed a model that shows that the genetic components that predispose a person toward religion are currently “hitchhiking” on the back of the religious cultural practice of high fertility rates. Even if some of the people who are born to religious parents defect from religion and become secular, the religious genes they carry (which encompass other personality traits, such as obedience and conservativism) will still spread throughout society, according to the model’s numerical simulations.

“Provided the fertility of religious people remains on average higher than that of secular people, the genes that predispose people towards religion will spread,” Rowthorn told PhysOrg.com. “The bigger the fertility differential between religious and secular people, the faster this genetic transformation will occur... ”And on religious birth rates:


The model’s assumptions are based on data from previous research. Studies have shown that, even controlling for income and education, people who are more religious have more children, on average, than people who are secular (defined here as having a religious indifference). According to the World Values Survey for 82 countries, adults attending religious services more than once per week averaged 2.5 children, those attending once per month averaged 2.01 children, and those never attending averaged 1.67 children. The more orthodox the religious sect, the higher the fertility rate, with sects such as the Amish, the Hutterites, and Haredi having up to four times as many children as the secular average. Studies have found that the high fertility rates stem from cultural and social influences by religious organizations rather than biological factors.

http://www.physorg.com/news/2011-01-religiosity-gene-dominate-society.html

[BellaBellucci]

This has become an exceptionally great thread. The arguments have been largely logical and respectful. If only all arguments on this board could be that way, I'd be in heaven. There's nothing wrong with a good debate as long a people don't get personal with it. *sigh*

~BB~

[russtafa]

In other words the idiots breed like rabbit's

[BellaBellucci]

In other words the idiots breed like rabbit's

Ok... why do I always speak 30 seconds too soon? :lol:

~BB~

[catherinefan]

The world is overpopulated? LOL! Do tell!

I always get a kick out of this shit.

So, you think it's all a big joke?

* Fish populations in our oceans are declining rapidly.
* Most of our forests have been destroyed in order to feed us.
* Many animal species face extinction thanks to us.
* We are destroying our atmosphere with poisonous gases.

And still there people who feel that our planet can easily support another 6 billion human beings.
Will they ever see the light?

[NYTSJulie]

That whole part of the world is just so fucked up and evil. I say bomb Sand Land and wipe it off the earth.

[PomonaCA]

So, you think it's all a big joke?

* Fish populations in our oceans are declining rapidly.
* Most of our forests have been destroyed in order to feed us.
* Many animal species face extinction thanks to us.
* We are destroying our atmosphere with poisonous gases.

And still there people who feel that our planet can easily support another 6 billion human beings.
Will they ever see the light?

Fish farming

And how is that the fault of human reproduction? That sounds like a problem with irresponsible forest management

And the next one is a problem with liberal fascination with species preservation. More species have become extinct due to non-man related extinction, FAR FAR FAR more.

The only poisonous gas around here is all the hot air coming from you. And yes, the planet can easily handle another 6 billion. The fact that that's the best evidence of overpopulation you have proves that there really is no problem at all.

But hey, if you feel the world is overpopulated then kill yourself and you'll be doing your part to be part of the solution. I'm serious, too. Kill yourself. We don't need any weak minded, gullible fools who believe in pseudoscience.

[russtafa]

Most of Australia is dry salted land which can't sustain a population and so go's for a lot of the world's land mass,90% of Australian's live on the coast lol

[BellaBellucci]

Most of Australia is dry salted land which can't sustain a population and so go's for a lot of the world's land mass,90% of Australian's live on the coast lol

Those Brits really knew how to choose a prison land, didn't they? :lol:

~BB~

[russtafa]

So you think this population problem is a joke

[catherinefan]

Fish farming

And how is that the fault of human reproduction? That sounds like a problem with irresponsible forest management

And the next one is a problem with liberal fascination with species preservation. More species have become extinct due to non-man related extinction, FAR FAR FAR more.

The only poisonous gas around here is all the hot air coming from you. And yes, the planet can easily handle another 6 billion. The fact that that's the best evidence of overpopulation you have proves that there really is no problem at all.

But hey, if you feel the world is overpopulated then kill yourself and you'll be doing your part to be part of the solution. I'm serious, too. Kill yourself. We don't need any weak minded, gullible fools who believe in pseudoscience.

How sad that you have to resort to abuse in order to support your silly statements.

One thing is certain....you won't ever see the light.

[PomonaCA]

How sad that you have to resort to abuse in order to support your silly statements.

One thing is certain....you won't ever see the light.


You must be used to getting abused lol. You seem to have your victim rhetoric down pat. Dad used to kick your ass and beat your mother, huh? lol

[scroller]

That whole part of the world is just so fucked up and evil. I say bomb Sand Land and wipe it off the earth.

Ah, sweet, sweet genocide. Stops evil dead.

[catherinefan]

You must be used to getting abused lol. You seem to have your victim rhetoric down pat. Dad used to kick your ass and beat your mother, huh? lol

Yes, Dad tried to kick my ass when I didn't go the church, but I dumped the superstitious nonsense anyway. lol
This way, my kids don't have to suffer the abuse your so-called holy man are 'famous' for today. lol

Since you're having so much fun, I decided to add a few lol's myself.

[loren]

I wish the Koran came in 2-ply for when I run out of Charmin and am too lazy to go to the store.

http://sheikyermami.com/wp-content/uploads/koran_wipes112.jpg
:lol:clasic:kiss:

[trish]

Lev. xxiv. 16 recommends stoning blasphemers.
Lev. xx. 9 would have you stone those who curse.
Deut. xvii. 2–7 demands death to idolators.
Deut. xxi. 18–21 demands children who rebel against their parents be stoned.

Stoning is simply what God sometimes tells Jews, Christians and Muslims to do.

Children born into these religions are taught from day one that there's a magical sky-man who can see everything you do and he's very very concerned to make sure you praise him every night, that you do not masturbate and that you believe he's the best sky-man there is and there are no other sky-men who are better. If you weren't born into that shit, you'd never on your life believe it, except for the stoning part...'cause hating people who make you feel insecure is fun.

[PomonaCA]

Lev. xxiv. 16 recommends stoning blasphemers.
Lev. xx. 9 would have you stone those who curse.
Deut. xvii. 2–7 demands death to idolators.
Deut. xxi. 18–21 demands children who rebel against their parents be stoned.

Stoning is simply what God sometimes tells Jews, Christians and Muslims to do.

Children born into these religions are taught from day one that there's a magical sky-man who can see everything you do and he's very very concerned to make sure you praise him every night, that you do not masturbate and that you believe he's the best sky-man there is and there are no other sky-men who are better. If you weren't born into that shit, you'd never on your life believe it, except for the stoning part...'cause hating people who make you feel insecure is fun.

Idiots are always good for a laugh and your post is proof of that.

We are called CHRISTIANS because we worship Christ and it was Jesus Christ who refuted and dispelled all that barbaric, eye for an eye bullshit.

But thanks for ignoring the obvious.

Remember, the old testament and the new testament. 2 separate things.

[dan_drade]

LALALALALALALALALALALALALALALALALALALA

Praise Allah LOL.

[magicman]

:lol:clasic:kiss:

Lame.

[PomonaCA]

Yes, Dad tried to kick my ass when I didn't go the church, but I dumped the superstitious nonsense anyway. lol
This way, my kids don't have to suffer the abuse your so-called holy man are 'famous' for today. lol


You needed to tell us that your dad kicked your ass, huh?


This is whats happening. Your dad was religious and since you reject everything about your dad, but have observed his behavior, you are doomed to become your dad.

You're a lovely individual and did I mention that you are also educated? lol

[catherinefan]

You needed to tell us that your dad kicked your ass, huh?


This is whats happening. Your dad was religious and since you reject everything about your dad, but have observed his behavior, you are doomed to become your dad.

You're a lovely individual and did I mention that you are also educated? lol


So, just because I did not adopt his religion, you assume that I reject everything about my Dad.
Can't wait to hear how you came to that conclusion.

[trish]

Lev. xxiv. 16 recommends stoning blasphemers.
Lev. xx. 9 would have you stone those who curse.
Deut. xvii. 2–7 demands death to idolators.
Deut. xxi. 18–21 demands children who rebel against their parents be stoned.

Stoning is simply what God sometimes tells Jews, Christians and Muslims to do.

Children born into these religions are taught from day one that there's a magical sky-man who can see everything you do and he's very very concerned to make sure you praise him every night, that you do not masturbate and that you believe he's the best sky-man there is and there are no other sky-men who are better. If you weren't born into that shit, you'd never on your life believe it, except for the stoning part...'cause hating people who make you feel insecure is fun.


Idiots are always good for a laugh and your post is proof of that.

We are called CHRISTIANS because we worship Christ and it was Jesus Christ who refuted and dispelled all that barbaric, eye for an eye bullshit.

But thanks for ignoring the obvious.

Remember, the old testament and the new testament. 2 separate things.
Well that's nice to know. It would be even nicer if you Christians were explicit about which books and verses of the old testament are no longer applicable and which are. Is it okay now to place other gods above God? Is Genesis no longer an argument against evolution? It seems like whenever conservative Christians are asked why they're against same sex marriage they eventually quote Leviticus or Deuteronomy. It seems it's Christians and never Jews or Muslims who want to plaster the Ten Commandments over our public spaces. But hey, thanks for setting me straight on how modern and enlightened Christianity is.

[Silcc69]

Now I can't speak for the way it is in other countries but since when did American Muslims start stoning people in America? I can recall WHITE CHRISTIANS hanging BLACK CHRISTIANS in America.

[onmyknees]

Lev. xxiv. 16 recommends stoning blasphemers.
Lev. xx. 9 would have you stone those who curse.
Deut. xvii. 2–7 demands death to idolators.
Deut. xxi. 18–21 demands children who rebel against their parents be stoned.

Stoning is simply what God sometimes tells Jews, Christians and Muslims to do.

Children born into these religions are taught from day one that there's a magical sky-man who can see everything you do and he's very very concerned to make sure you praise him every night, that you do not masturbate and that you believe he's the best sky-man there is and there are no other sky-men who are better. If you weren't born into that shit, you'd never on your life believe it, except for the stoning part...'cause hating people who make you feel insecure is fun.


"Stoning is simply what God sometimes tells Jews, Christians and Muslims to do."

Yea...in the first century !!! Some have progressed a bit since then, some haven't ! LMAO

You don't wanna believe...then don't, but it sounds like you're a bit zealous in your " absolute certainty" there is nothing to fear. I wonder sometimes about people like you Trish....are you trying to convince us....or yourself ?? You're never in 2 lifetimes going to convice a believer not to believe, and you're not suddenly going to have a come to jesus moment !!! LMAO....so the whole exercise seems rather wasteful to me.

[love2pay]

I find anyone who does not beliv ein God or simple basic relgious belifs to be stupid.

When all top people in postions, education and other things of or lets say things you would aspire to be belive. then why dont you?

the reason behind me saying this... is

they aint stupid to be there? and you wanna be stupid?

Rich or the famous or what ever, who ever is your icon... makes no difference.

AND THEN RETARDS READ about why stone. why kill and why this and that.

SEE the meida twist?

think you idiots.

what has iran done to USA now?

NOTHING

yet the population is being prepped for war with iran already!!!!!

So yes.... 16 yr old girl hanging you will hear about stoning etc.

when russia attacked recnelty against.... that small country or what ever.

did usa say we trained there troops few weeks b4?
did usa say we proved them anit tank weapons?
did the jews come forward and say...... we sent out top trainers there...

no! but russia is abd..... but every WAR amereican in involeed.

every conflict has amereica in the center....

ever terriost. thats IRA ETA TAMILS + so called muslim terriosts balme usa.

WTF... grow up....

everything is distorted to look good for few!

Would u call 1 billion crisitains stupid?
1 billion muslimes?

they all stupid to belive?

stfu who ever said "magical God"

David x

[lisaparadise]

I find anyone who does not beliv ein God or simple basic relgious belifs to be stupid.
your a fuckin brainwashed idiot period,there are over 20 million in the U.S. alone who dont believe, what makes you an idiot and people who are like you is you base your life around something that has no proof not now not ever will there be any proof cause its a myth it doesnt exit wake the fuck up.

[fred41]

...you base your life around something that has no proof not now not ever will there be any proof cause its a myth it doesnt exit wake the fuck up.

...Goddammit I knew it...I fuckin' knew it!!! Why didn't you tell me this earlier Lisa....and I just got one of those Jesus face tattoos....now I'm gonna have to tell everyone I had a thing for Jeffrey Hunter...damn.

[trish]

Yea...in the first century !!! Some have progressed a bit since then, some haven't ! LMAOI think I addressed this in post#89. Perhaps you could help the rest of us and explicitly delineate exactly what the Bible got wrong and what it got right. Evidently God got the stoning part all wrong but he got the "I'm a jealous God" right.


I wonder sometimes about people like you Trish...are you trying to convince us....or yourself ??There you go again; instead of just responding to what people say you like to respond to what you imagine their motivations might be. Do I question the strength or the psychological motivations behind your personal faith, Onmyknees? Have I ever? No, I question the reasons and the evidence for the claims that are made by believers. I expect the same courtesy from you. If you question a claim that I've made, fine; but I will not be psychoanalyzed. I didn't start this thread, the purpose of which is to encourage hatred and distrust of Muslims. As far as I'm concerned you can believe whatever you want as long you don't insist government disallow the building of Mosques where Churches would be allowed, or you don't insist the law follow Biblical prohibitions against woman's rights, or you don't insist the law prevent marriage between persons of the same sex because it's against Leviticus, etc. I think you're a bit mixed up on who it is exactly who is attempting to enforce a world view on the rest of us.

BTW: Here's your ass, you dropped it a few posts back.

[catherinefan]

I find anyone who does not beliv ein God or simple basic relgious belifs to be stupid.

Would u call 1 billion crisitains stupid?
1 billion muslimes?

they all stupid to belive?

No, we wouldn't dare calling em that.
It's us non believers that are stupid.
You just said so yourself, didn't you?

[envivision]

The feminist regime in this country is as backward as the thirld world countries.

[CORVETTEDUDE]

I find anyone who does not beliv ein God or simple basic relgious belifs to be stupid.
David x


Yep!!! That's me...Just call me STUPID!!!:dancing::dancing::dancing:

[lisaparadise]

...Goddammit I knew it...I fuckin' knew it!!! Why didn't you tell me this earlier Lisa....and I just got one of those Jesus face tattoos....now I'm gonna have to tell everyone I had a thing for Jeffrey Hunter...damn.roflmfao

[Ben]

The initial video is disturbing. And most of the comments are disturbing. And Bill O'Reilly is disturbed -- :)

YouTube - Bill O'Reilly Flips Out (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tJjNVVwRCY)

[fred41]

And what's the deal with John Bone-er:


lol...it's pronounced Bayner (but you knew that :))

...BTW Jessica Simpson is absolutely adorable in that picture...absolutely.

[PomonaCA]

Well that's nice to know. It would be even nicer if you Christians were explicit about which books and verses of the old testament are no longer applicable and which are. Is it okay now to place other gods above God? Is Genesis no longer an argument against evolution? It seems like whenever conservative Christians are asked why they're against same sex marriage they eventually quote Leviticus or Deuteronomy. It seems it's Christians and never Jews or Muslims who want to plaster the Ten Commandments over our public spaces. But hey, thanks for setting me straight on how modern and enlightened Christianity is.


You'd know if you weren't such a closed mind. The old and new testament are relevant and are what Western Civilization is built upon. You can't have the new without understanding the old.

[Ben]

lol...it's pronounced Bayner (but you knew that :))

...BTW Jessica Simpson is absolutely adorable in that picture...absolutely.

Here's a YT clip of Bone-er voting for the bailout. (The columnist David Sirota described Bone-er as a mere corporation. Not a person. Ya know, when you invest in a corporation you expect a return on your investment.
So, when you invest in Bone-er you expect a return on your investment.) I seriously doubt the Tea Party movement are fond of Bone-er.

YouTube - THE BAILOUT: GOP Leader John Boehner - Put Country First - Vote Yes (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVOS1CC6V5I&feature=channel)

[trish]

You'd know if you weren't such a closed mind. The old and new testament are relevant and are what Western Civilization is built upon. You can't have the new without understanding the old. So tell me, How do you know when to obey God's words in Leviticus and when not to obey them? Is there a place in the New Testament which says, "Thou should definitely not obey my Father's commands about stoning your adulterous wife, but when He, My Father, says, 'Thou shall not lie with a man as with a woman,' you better listen and obey." An open mind just wants to know.

BTW The assertion that Western civilization is built upon the values found in two Middle Eastern religions doesn't ring quite true. Courses in Western Civilization usually start with the contributions of Greeks and their discovery of the human capacity for reason, mathematics and the arts; then pass onto the contributions of the later Greco-Roman Civilization and their achievements in architecture, engineering, law and literature. The introduction of the Middle Eastern religions (especially Christianity) marks a quite clear, if fortunately temporary, decline in Western Civilization.

[muhmuh]

The introduction of the Middle Eastern religions (especially Christianity) marks a quite clear, if fortunately temporary, decline in Western Civilization.

exactly
if anything western civilisation is founded on the enlightenment and any other collective movement towards science and philosophy and away from religion

[lisaparadise]

The initial video is disturbing. And most of the comments are disturbing. And Bill O'Reilly is disturbed -- :)

YouTube - Bill O'Reilly Flips Out (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tJjNVVwRCY)


oh my god i love that vid

[Ben]

To quote Karen Kwiatkowski, a retired USAF lieutenant colonel, "Today, Americans choose their news like we choose our comfort foods. We are predictably uninterested in the global empire we fund and pursue. We are predictably unaware of the unfree, economically shriveled, and conflict-ridden world that the US reaction to 9/11 has helped foster and grow. We are predictably unsympathetic to desperately poor people, particularly if they are Muslim, and frankly don’t give a damn if they were slapped in the face by a state authority."

[PomonaCA]

So tell me, How do you know when to obey God's words in Leviticus and when not to obey them? Is there a place in the New Testament which says, "Thou should definitely not obey my Father's commands about stoning your adulterous wife, but when He, My Father, says, 'Thou shall not lie with a man as with a woman,' you better listen and obey." An open mind just wants to know.

BTW The assertion that Western civilization is built upon the values found in two Middle Eastern religions doesn't ring quite true. Courses in Western Civilization usually start with the contributions of Greeks and their discovery of the human capacity for reason, mathematics and the arts; then pass onto the contributions of the later Greco-Roman Civilization and their achievements in architecture, engineering, law and literature. The introduction of the Middle Eastern religions (especially Christianity) marks a quite clear, if fortunately temporary, decline in Western Civilization.


The same Greeks who were the first to go belly up and can't pay the bills?

Oh enlightened ones! Show us the way!

[trish]

The same Greeks who were the first to go belly up and can't pay the bills?Yes, and also the descendants of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John...as if any of that is relevant to the issue.

[PomonaCA]

Yes, and also the descendants of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John...as if any of that is relevant to the issue.

It seems as if non-religious 'enlightenment' doesn't enlighten the ability to pay bills.

[trish]

The current Greeks are the descendants of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. They're quite spiritually enlightened. The classical Greeks, on the other hand (i.e. those who discovered geometry) were the wealthiest people in the Mediterranean world at the time. It seems you're drawing incorrect conclusions again.

[PomonaCA]

The current Greeks are the descendants of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. They're quite spiritually enlightened. The classical Greeks, on the other hand (i.e. those who discovered geometry) were the wealthiest people in the Mediterranean world at the time. It seems you're drawing incorrect conclusions again.


Well then it seems as if your enlightenment is but paltry voodoo in the face of Christianity.

[trish]

Well then it seems as if your enlightenment is but paltry voodoo in the face of Christianity.You're going to have to explain that one; it's the current Christian Greeks who, as you put it, can't pay their bills. Personally, I refrain from drawing any conclusions here, since the direction of religion to its followers is generally (though not always) to efface material wealth.

[catherinefan]

The same Greeks who were the first to go belly up and can't pay the bills?

It seems hardly worthwhile to respond to idiotic nonsense such as this.
But then again......this is just too good to pass by. lol

Wasn't the state of California belly up long before the Greeks got into trouble?
And doesn't this happen to be your very own state?

[scroller]

I find anyone who does not beliv ein God or simple basic relgious belifs to be stupid

When all top people in postions, education and other things of or lets say things you would aspire to be belive. then why dont you?...

Would u call 1 billion crisitains stupid?
1 billion muslimes?

they all stupid to belive?


Yes, a compelling argument, and I'm convinced.

As Machiavelli wrote in The Prince: "There is nothing more important than appearing to be religious."

[PomonaCA]

It seems hardly worthwhile to respond to idiotic nonsense such as this.
But then again......this is just too good to pass by. lol

Wasn't the state of California belly up long before the Greeks got into trouble? And doesn't this happen to be your very own state?


The IMF had to bail out California? LOL Oh no, that was Greece lol

[trish]

I'd still like an answer to my questions, PomonaCA. How do you know when to obey God's words in Leviticus and when not to obey them? Is there a place in the New Testament which says, "Thou should definitely not obey my Father's commands about stoning your adulterous wife, but when He, My Father, says, 'Thou shall not lie with a man as with a woman,' you better listen and obey." An open mind just wants to know. The next time someone quotes Leviticus at me, I want to know whether the New Testament sanctions the quote or not, and why or why not.

[scroller]

News story from the AP today:


Man arrested with explosives at Michigan mosque

DETROIT – A 63-year-old Southern California man who had explosives in his vehicle was arrested outside one of the nation's largest mosques in the Detroit suburb of Dearborn, authorities in Michigan said.

Dearborn police said Roger Stockham was arraigned Wednesday on one count of making a false report or threat of terrorism and one count of possessing explosives with an unlawful intent. Stockham had a large but undisclosed quantity of class-C fireworks including M-80s, which are outlawed in Michigan, Chief Ronald Haddad said...

Haddad said Stockham was arrested Monday evening without incident in the parking lot of Islamic Center of America, while a large group was gathered inside. He said police received a 911 call from a resident.http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110130/ap_on_re_us/us_mosque_terrorist_threat

[trish]

Personally, I don’t have anything against religion as long it doesn’t make false claims or cause harm. The vast majority of religious practitioners find elation, solace, strength and fortitude in their beliefs and their communities. I don’t doubt there are people participating in this forum who have healthy religious experiences. I confess, I don’t have any religious experiences. I won’t deny that some of you do. But if your religion is telling you to hate "towel-heads"; if it’s telling you to deny Muslims the rights to build a Mosque where a Church would not be so denied, or worse if your religion condones the destruction of Mosques, or Churches or Synagogues; if your religion is telling you to deny gays their rights, or women their rights; or if your religion insists that public schools teach the Earth is just a few thousand years old, or that Methuselah rode dinosaurs to work everyday like Barney Rubble, then your religion is not only obviously and clearly wrong, but also seriously fucked up.

[onmyknees]

Personally, I don’t have anything against religion as long it doesn’t make false claims or cause harm. The vast majority of religious practitioners find elation, solace, strength and fortitude in their beliefs and their communities. I don’t doubt there are people participating in this forum who have healthy religious experiences. I confess, I don’t have any religious experiences. I won’t deny that some of you do. But if your religion is telling you to hate "towel-heads"; if it’s telling you to deny Muslims the rights to build a Mosque where a Church would not be so denied, or worse if your religion condones the destruction of Mosques, or Churches or Synagogues; if your religion is telling you to deny gays their rights, or women their rights; or if your religion insists that public schools teach the Earth is just a few thousand years old, or that Methuselah rode dinosaurs to work everyday like Barney Rubble, then your religion is not only obviously and clearly wrong, but also seriously fucked up.

You had me with a quite sensible, reasonable, tolorant response until you went off the rails ( as you're inclined to do) about the Mosque at ground zero. I knew you'd take this where no one else cared to go. If you can't see the difference between a church or a synagogue and a Mosque being built there, then there's really no point in engaging. Your politics are clouding your judgement. Besides being a public relations diaster because of who, and how it was handled, they don't have the funding, probably never will...so if you're so keen on putting a mosque there Trish, better get your checkbook out. You make more hyperbolic hypothesis than most. Just for the clarification of those who may not be up to speed on this...no one is denying the right to build a mosque in lower Manhattan despte what Trish would have you believe. I think it's safe to say you won't be finding religion anytime soon, but how about accuracy? LOL

[trish]

If you can't see the difference between a church or a synagogue and a Mosque being built there, then there's really no point in engaging.Then don't engage. I can see the difference. The law should not.

Your politics are clouding your judgement.No, it's a little thing called the establishment clause of the U.S. Constitution. If zoning allows Churches, it should allow Mosques. But there you go again, assuming I'm talking specially about the proposed Mosque to be built several blocks from Ground Zero, instead of generally including the Mosque that was proposed in Murfreesboro , TN. and others that were opposed in Texas and California. You gotta stop pretending you know people's intentions and directly address the claims they make in their posts.

[lisaparadise]

Then don't engage. I can see the difference. The law should not.
No, it's a little thing called the establishment clause of the U.S. Constitution. If zoning allows Churches, it should allow Mosques. But there you go again, assuming I'm talking specially about the proposed Mosque to be built several blocks from Ground Zero, instead of generally including the Mosque that was proposed in Murfreesboro , TN. and others that were opposed in Texas and California. You gotta stop pretending you know people's intentions and directly address the claims they make in their posts.build the mosque so the rednecks can burn it down sounds good to me.

[arnie666]

The muslims can fuck off.Iam sick of hearing about them ,their religion and them blowing themselves up.

The left mollycoddling them is so funny,because if they get their way, and we end up all living in islamic fascist societies, that lot will be the first getting their throats slit and stoned to death. Someone like me with my conservative views on drink ,drugs, abortion , crime and punishment etc etc , they'd probably try and convert me,thinking Iam not a lost cause. Maybe even leave me alone and not bother converting me , if I keep my mouth shut. The left, they hate you lot more than they hate people like me.

In fact I hate all religions , I think they are all hypocrites with their texts written by men to keep a social order. My conservatism stems from history and dismay at what a dirty morally corrupt uncaring shit hole of a society we have become , ,not any religious dogma. Worshipping plastic celebritiies, obessed with sex and a cheap thrill. Little backbone. I could go on.

Just right now it's muslims exploding themselves, if christians were doing it ,I'd be wanting them all rounded up and put in internment camps . So it's not really a racial thing. I just get sick of all the bollocks.

[trish]

build the mosque so the rednecks can burn it down sounds good to me.I hear rednecks burn Churches too.

[onmyknees]

Then don't engage. I can see the difference. The law should not.
No, it's a little thing called the establishment clause of the U.S. Constitution. If zoning allows Churches, it should allow Mosques. But there you go again, assuming I'm talking specially about the proposed Mosque to be built several blocks from Ground Zero, instead of generally including the Mosque that was proposed in Murfreesboro , TN. and others that were opposed in Texas and California. You gotta stop pretending you know people's intentions and directly address the claims they make in their posts.


Of course you were referring to the Mosque in NYC...let's not be coy !!

You must enjoy arguing with yourself...or go off on these constitutional rants. Because no one I know is making this an argument about the right to build anything. And YOU have tostop pretending The first world trade center bombing, 911, Ft. Hood, The Shoe Bomber, The Times Square Bomber, Honor Killings, Lockerbie, All the Embassy bombings, The USS Cole, and countless others that our government has kept from us, never happened.

I quoted the head of the CIA Bin Laden group, Michael Schoer who unequivocally state that a mosque that size overlooking the site of Radical Islam's greatest conquest would be seen as a monument in the World of Jihad. Argue with him...or play hide and seek with reality.
From the Group "American Muslim Perspective" comes this..."

The number of mosques and mosque attendants are witnessing a tremendous increase in recent years in America. About two million Muslims are associated with the mosques as the number of attendants increases to more than 75% during the last five years."

So it would seem Trish despite your contentions, Muslims are doing quite well and enjoying the freedom to worship they are afforded in America. Many are simply asking ...find an alternate location for this particular
mosque, and pray till your hearts content. That's not the picture you'd have us believe .

[trish]

Of course you were referring to the Mosque in NYC...let's not be coy !!No, you simply hear what you wish to hear, as you always do. You don't speak for me, I do. If you want to address my points fine. My points were very general, so that they will cover the specific. If you read my post you will find it makes no exceptions for those who would stand against Churches and Synagogues as well.


Because no one I know is making this an argument about the right to build anything.No one you know. Yet the establishment clause is most apt in this regard. Do you actually want to claim the law is allowed to distinguish between religions when handing out zoning privileges?


And YOU have tostop pretending The first world trade center bombing, 911, Ft. Hood, The Shoe Bomber, The Times Square Bomber, Honor Killings, Lockerbie, All the Embassy bombings, The USS Cole, and countless others that our government has kept from us, never happened. So not mentioning the first trade center bombing, 911 etc. is pretending they never happened? There you go again, making deductions about my pretense. Forget pretense. I mean what I post and nothing else. If you think those events are relevant and justify a general hatred of Islam, then make your case. I'll listen. I remember those events and I will know them when you refer to them. Indeed it would be rather awkward to "pretend" not to know they happened.


The number of mosques and mosque attendants are witnessing a tremendous increase in recent years in America. About two million Muslims are associated with the mosques as the number of attendants increases to more than 75% during the last five years." Be afraid. Be very afraid. OOOOOoooooOOOooooooo. Look, I don't much care to see any religion spread. But I would've thought someone of a more spiritual nature would be happy to see the growth of spirituality in any guise.

But I think we've gone conveniently astray from the questions I put to you back in post #95. Did you forget, or were you avoiding them on purpose? I referred to a few of God's instructions in Leviticus to remind us that God sanctions stoning. You of course reminded me that Christians no longer obey all of God's commands, like many of those found in the Old Testament. This leaves us non-religious folk in a quandary. Every time I have a discussion with a Christian who's against homosexuality, or masturbation, or against birth control they inevitably quote Leviticus and Deuteronomy at me. Now obviously some of what God said in Leviticus and Deuteronomy is no longer thought by Christians to be worthy of anything but historical attention. But some other things He said in Leviticus and Deuteronomy are of the utmost relevance today. How are we to know which is which? Could you guys publish a Bible that highlights the commands of God that we're supposed to obey, and maybe just leaves out or diminishes the typeface of those of God's commands we're not supposed to follow?

[catherinefan]

You had me with a quite sensible, reasonable, tolorant response until you went off the rails ( as you're inclined to do) about the Mosque at ground zero. I knew you'd take this where no one else cared to go. If you can't see the difference between a church or a synagogue and a Mosque being built there, then there's really no point in engaging.

Ah yes, that mosque at ground zero! To my knowledge, it wasn't actually a mosque that was being proposed. And secondly, the proposed site was several blocks away from ground zero. So, how far away from ground zero would it have to be?

Let me ask you a question. If christians would have been responsible for 9/11, would there have the same opposition to the building of a church on that very same site?

I think we all know the answer to that.

[lisaparadise]

Ah yes, that mosque at ground zero! To my knowledge, it wasn't actually a mosque that was being proposed. And secondly, the proposed site was several blocks away from ground zero. So, how far away from ground zero would it have to be?

Let me ask you a question. If christians would have been responsible for 9/11, would there have the same opposition to the building of a church on that very same site?

I think we all know the answer to that.last time i checked it was muslim extremest who drove the plains into our buildings in the name of god.

[catherinefan]

last time i checked it was muslim extremest who drove the plains into our buildings in the name of god.

Now that is just what I mean. Would it have been christians, you wouldn't even have been informed of that particular detail. It would simply be classified as irrelevant.

[lisaparadise]

Now that is just what I mean. Would it have been christians, you wouldn't even have been informed of that particular detail. It would simply be classified as irrelevant.seriously?

[fastingforlife]

There have been nearly 17,000 instances of non-combat related muslim initiated acts of terror since 9/11. During that same period of time I do not believe there was even one instance of Christian terrorism.

If Christians were behind 9/11, all Christians would band together to root out this evil. In stark contrast to the over 1 billion muslims who remain silent, never daring to criticize one of their own.

[scroller]

There have been nearly 17,000 instances of non-combat related muslim initiated acts of terror since 9/11. During that same period of time I do not believe there was even one instance of Christian terrorism.

Total counterfactual bullshit. Here's a short list of recent Christian-on-Muslim terrorist acts:

A Mosque Shooting in Australia (http://muslim-responses.com/A_Mosque_Shooting_/A_Mosque_Shooting_)
English White Youth's Beat Muslim Father to Death (http://muslim-responses.com/White_Youths_Beat_Muslim_to_Death/White_Youths_Beat_Muslim_to_Death_)
Christian Mobs Murder Muslims (http://muslim-responses.com/Christian_Mob/Christian_Mob_)
Eric Rudolph - The Christian bomber (http://muslim-responses.com/Eric_Rudolph/Eric_Rudolph_)
Christian Terrorists Massacre Eight Hindu Civilians in India (http://www.stephen-knapp.com/christian_terrorists_massacre_eight_hindus.htm)
Christian Terrorists Kill 44, Wound 118 in Attacks in Northeast India (http://www.stephen-knapp.com/christian_terrorists_kill_44.htm)
Baptist Church Backs Terrorism in North-East India (http://www.stephen-knapp.com/baptist_church_backs_terrorism.htm)
Terrorists in North-East India get American Support (http://www.stephen-knapp.com/terrorists_in_northeast_india_get_american_support .htm)
Christian Terrorist Cells in the USA (http://www.commonplacebook.com/current_events/politics/christian_terro.shtm)
Good Old Christian Terrorism (http://think.dumblaws.com/2006/10/good-old-christian-terrorism/)



And of course, you ignored the most recent one Saturday in Detroit:

Man Arrested for Alleged Plot to Attack a Detroit Mosque (http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2011/01/mosque_1.html?f=most-commented-24h-5)

[catherinefan]

There have been nearly 17,000 instances of non-combat related muslim initiated acts of terror since 9/11.

We (the so-called free west) occupied two large moslim nations since then and have caused many to die in these countries.

Could that perhaps have anything to do with it?

Wake up! We are very clearly inviting these acts of terror.

[muhmuh]

During that same period of time I do not believe there was even one instance of Christian terrorism.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-abortion_violence

[onmyknees]

Ah yes, that mosque at ground zero! To my knowledge, it wasn't actually a mosque that was being proposed. And secondly, the proposed site was several blocks away from ground zero. So, how far away from ground zero would it have to be?

Let me ask you a question. If christians would have been responsible for 9/11, would there have the same opposition to the building of a church on that very same site?

I think we all know the answer to that.

Dumb question really....with all due respect. It's hard to imagine any situation similar to 911. It stands on it's own, so therefore I can't answer a complete wild hypothetical.

With respect to how far it should be...there are mosques all over Manhattan . So mosques are not the issue...this mosque is. If the Muslims backing this took the time to sit down with the survivors of this horror , I'm sure they would come away with an understanding of just how far is far enough, but thier ignorance and arrogrance prevented them from doing that. That was inconceivably disrespectful and insensitive, and simply served to harden opinions.

[thombergeron]

But what about Leviticus....?

[onmyknees]

No, you simply hear what you wish to hear, as you always do. You don't speak for me, I do. If you want to address my points fine. My points were very general, so that they will cover the specific. If you read my post you will find it makes no exceptions for those who would stand against Churches and Synagogues as well.

No one you know. Yet the establishment clause is most apt in this regard. Do you actually want to claim the law is allowed to distinguish between religions when handing out zoning privileges?

So not mentioning the first trade center bombing, 911 etc. is pretending they never happened? There you go again, making deductions about my pretense. Forget pretense. I mean what I post and nothing else. If you think those events are relevant and justify a general hatred of Islam, then make your case. I'll listen. I remember those events and I will know them when you refer to them. Indeed it would be rather awkward to "pretend" not to know they happened.

Be afraid. Be very afraid. OOOOOoooooOOOooooooo. Look, I don't much care to see any religion spread. But I would've thought someone of a more spiritual nature would be happy to see the growth of spirituality in any guise.

But I think we've gone conveniently astray from the questions I put to you back in post #95. Did you forget, or were you avoiding them on purpose? I referred to a few of God's instructions in Leviticus to remind us that God sanctions stoning. You of course reminded me that Christians no longer obey all of God's commands, like many of those found in the Old Testament. This leaves us non-religious folk in a quandary. Every time I have a discussion with a Christian who's against homosexuality, or masturbation, or against birth control they inevitably quote Leviticus and Deuteronomy at me. Now obviously some of what God said in Leviticus and Deuteronomy is no longer thought by Christians to be worthy of anything but historical attention. But some other things He said in Leviticus and Deuteronomy are of the utmost relevance today. How are we to know which is which? Could you guys publish a Bible that highlights the commands of God that we're supposed to obey, and maybe just leaves out or diminishes the typeface of those of God's commands we're not supposed to follow?

So not mentioning the first trade center bombing, 911 etc. is pretending they never happened? There you go again, making deductions about my pretense. Forget pretense. I mean what I post and nothing else. If you think those events are relevant and justify a general hatred of Islam, then make your case. I'll listen. I remember those events and I will know them when you refer to them. Indeed it would be rather awkward to "pretend" not to know they happened.

There you go again...it's a habit of yours...you weave together assumptions, actions, thoughts and sprinkle in some facts then pose a quetion to me as if it's assumed I hate Muslims. It's disengenuious, and more than that.......annoying. It's a common tactic similar to what those on the left do when they toss out the race card, assuming that someone has to stall his argument and defend himself against the charge, and dedicates so much time and energy doing that, his larger point is never made. I read rules for radicals too Trish !! So I won't make my case about how those events are reason to hate Islam because I never made that case...Play word games on someone else !

"No one you know. Yet the establishment clause is most apt in this regard. Do you actually want to claim the law is allowed to distinguish between religions when handing out zoning privileges? "

Again...perhaps it's the internet, but you your asking questions totally unrelated to the positions I've explained. It may be nice to share your knowledge of the establishment clause, but my position was made with the full awareness of what the law is. It's not a legal argument, but surely you knew that.

"Look, I don't much care to see any religion spread. But I would've thought someone of a more spiritual nature would be happy to see the growth of spirituality in any guise."

I'd be fine with any expansion of spiritually, but I'm actually agnostic about it.....although I would certainly ask more questions if a mosque was proposed in my neighboorhood than a chapel or synagogue....espicially if the spokespeople and backers had dubious pasts. Do I need to explain the reasons why? I swear Trish...you act like the Brits and French don't have a huge problem on thier hands because like you...they turned a blind eye to the expansion of radical Islam. Look...this is a different world than it was 20 years ago, and Juan Williams had it right...so stone us for being apprehensive about the fact some Muslims want to kill us ! Forgive me if that doesn't fit into your purest view of the establishment clause, but I'm a realist. Not too many Methodists are stapping explosives on themselves or preaching Jihad out of thier churches. Trish , arguing with you reminds me of being in a courtroom and listening to a defense attorney make
brillient constitutional arguments that have little to do with the case before the jury. He soon tries to convince the eye witness he really didn't see his client shoot the store clerk, he actually just thought he saw it, or that he saw something else.... It's all perfectly legal, but not practical or nearly believable.

Maybe the reason you have difficulty understanding where I'm coming from with respect to some of these issues is because I view the Untied States at war and our homeland under constant threat of attack and believe the government must take certain temporary steps to fight that war. Perhaps you don't believe that.

[trish]

There you go again...it's a habit of yours...you weave together assumptions, actions, thoughts and sprinkle in some facts then pose a quetion to me as if it's assumed I hate Muslims.Note: a question is not an assumption. So as not to be mistaken for making an accusation, I emphasized the "If" with boldface. There's a lot of hatred for Muslims displayed in this thread which I've been speaking against. You complained that I'm not taking into consideration 9/11 etc. etc. So are you using those considerations to justify the poison in this thread or are you not? Just what case are you making?


It's not a legal argument, but surely you knew that. I take it then that you concede no government body can Constitutionally intervene with the building of the specific Mosque in NYC which you oppose. I also take it that you merely wish to persuade the Muslims themselves from building the Mosque. The above two statements are more questions than declarative assertions.


I'd be fine with any expansion of spiritually,...So what was your point in noting [the] general increase in devotees to the Islamic tradition?


Not too many Methodists are stapping explosives on themselves or preaching Jihad out of thier churches.No, but there are fundamentalist Christians who are assassinating family planning doctors, threatening their families and bombing their clinics...to the point where there are very few doctors left in the nation willing to provide abortion and family planning services. We also have white supremacists who drag people behinds trucks until dead and blow up black baptist churches. We have terrorists who blow up government buildings as in Oklahoma, we have ideologues who fly small planes into IRS buildings, lunatics who shoot Congress women and people who [enable] them.

Yet if someone wants to build a Church down the road from me, or a Synagogue or a Mosque it's fine by me. This is America. We're not about abstract high falutin' lawyerly arguments or some purist form of the First Amendment. But if we're about anything, we're about the freedom to worship.


I view the Untied States at warYes, we're in two undeclared wars. Oh and also a metaphorical war against drugs, a metaphorical war against terrorism and a host of other metaphorical wars.


our homeland under constant threat of attack and believe the government must take certain temporary steps to fight that war. Agreed [as long as you put "war" in quotes and mean it metaphorically]. But we probably disagree about which liberties we're free to sacrifice. Even though I'm an atheist, I will not give up your freedom to worship...nor will I yield the government the power to directly or effectively establish one religion over another.

But again, I think we've gone conveniently astray from the questions I put to you back in post #95. Did you forget, or were you avoiding them on purpose? I referred to a few of God's instructions in Leviticus to remind us that God Himself sanctions stoning. You of course reminded me that Christians no longer obey all of God's commands, like many of those found in the Old Testament. This leaves us non-religious folk in a quandary. Every time I have a discussion with a Christian who's against homosexuality, or masturbation, or against birth control they inevitably quote Leviticus and Deuteronomy at me. Now obviously some of what God said in Leviticus and Deuteronomy is no longer thought by Christians to be worthy of anything but historical attention. But some other things He said in Leviticus and Deuteronomy are of the utmost relevance today. How are we to know which is which? Could you guys publish a Bible that highlights the commands of God that we're supposed to obey, and maybe just leaves out or diminishes the typeface of those of God's commands we're not supposed to follow?

[muhmuh]

I view the Untied States at war and our homeland under constant threat of attack

well youre not
im not at all surprised you believe that seeing as i was being blasted with threat level warnings evers 5 seconds while i was in us airports but its simply not true

[yosi]

[QUOTE=PomonaCA;870806]

We are called CHRISTIANS because we worship Christ and it was Jesus Christ who refuted and dispelled all that barbaric, eye for an eye bullshit.

QUOTE]

YouTube - Mel Brooks´ Spanish Inquisition (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CqgZnvfJ9Jg)

[russtafa]

The state should be the peoples only religion

[catherinefan]

I view the Untied States at war and our homeland under constant threat of attack.....

Hey, that's good! Now you know how all these innocent people in Irak and Afganistan must feel.

[muhmuh]

The state should be the peoples only religion

yes great lets make tribalism our religion
and here i was thinking we had evolved socially in the last 60000 years

[onmyknees]

Hey, that's good! Now you know how all these innocent people in Irak and Afganistan must feel.


Dumb...False equivalency...FAIL. At the risk of being tedious, I'll explain it to you. Regardless of what your opinion of either war is, there is no question that the rules of engagement that our military is under are designed to have minimum civilian casualties, even to their own determent. Anyone who understands our operation there will tell you that. Were civilians killed...unquestionably, but even as the US begins withdraw and stand down in Iraq, civilians continue to be killed at the hands of other Arabs factions and suicide bombers. You seem to be naive in thinking there wasn't mass murders of civilians before the first US Combat troop set foot on Iraqi soil. Sometime next summer all combat troops will be shiped out from Iraq, and they will have the last best chance as some sort of peaceful participatory government. Will it have been worth it? Certainly that will need to be answered in the fullness of time. Just imagine for a moment if your obvious ideology allows you, what the world might look like if Saddam was still in power. With the instability in Tunisia, Jordan, Egypt, and Iran's nuclear ambitions imagine throwing Saddam Hussien into toxic that mix? A fragile world economy might be pushed over the brink with even more instability in the Mid East because of the price of oil and other geo-political factors. Imagine Iran with a nuclear weapon and Iraq as their age centuries enemy struggling to obtain one? Imagine a fully funded Hamas threatening Israel ? But of course you can't imagine that because you're too shortsighted. You speak in short slogans when international politics are a delicate, complicated matter.

[catherinefan]

Dumb...False equivalency...FAIL. At the risk of being tedious, I'll explain it to you. Regardless of what your opinion of either war is, there is no question that the rules of engagement that our military is under are designed to have minimum civilian casualties, even to their own determent. Anyone who understands our operation there will tell you that. Were civilians killed...unquestionably, but even as the US begins withdraw and stand down in Iraq, civilians continue to be killed at the hands of other Arabs factions and suicide bombers. You seem to be naive in thinking there wasn't mass murders of civilians before the first US Combat troop set foot on Iraqi soil. Sometime next summer all combat troops will be shiped out from Iraq, and they will have the last best chance as some sort of peaceful participatory government. Will it have been worth it? Certainly that will need to be answered in the fullness of time. Just imagine for a moment if your obvious ideology allows you, what the world might look like if Saddam was still in power. With the instability in Tunisia, Jordan, Egypt, and Iran's nuclear ambitions imagine throwing Saddam Hussien into toxic that mix? A fragile world economy might be pushed over the brink with even more instability in the Mid East because of the price of oil and other geo-political factors. Imagine Iran with a nuclear weapon and Iraq as their age centuries enemy struggling to obtain one? Imagine a fully funded Hamas threatening Israel ? But of course you can't imagine that because you're too shortsighted. You speak in short slogans when international politics are a delicate, complicated matter.

Yes, of course....everyone is dumb except you. Well you may not be dumb, but if you need time to tell whether the war in Irak was worth it, you must have your eyes closed most of the time.
It is of course far worth off than it ever was under Saddam. Want some examples? Well, those Arab factions and suicide bombers that keep on killing day in day out didn't get a chance under Saddam. Irak was the only Arab country in the Middle East where women were treated as equal and girls could go to school just like boys. Well.....not any more!
Even experts in the US agree on the fact that Saddam wasn't a thread to peace in the Middle East nor the world. Tell me, why on earth would the Bush administration have invented all those lies to justify this war?
Irak was invaded simply because Saddam was anti American. Would he have been pro American, he could have killed millions and we wouldn't have bothered.
Remember that South East Asian dictator that died a few years ago? He is said to have killed between one and three million people and yet, not one western leader ever lifted a finger to stop him. Why? Simply because he was pro American.

[trish]

I view the Untied States at war and our homeland under constant threat of attack...


Hey, that's good! Now you know how all these innocent people in Irak and Afganistan must feel.


Dumb...False equivalency...FAIL.

I have to agree. Very few Americans know what the innocent in Afghanistan and Iraq must feel like to have seen their governments toppled, their infrastructure destroyed and their lives disrupted by ten years of unrelenting violence brought on by the meddling interference of rich and powerful outsiders who were ignorant [of the] political realities and acting out of revenge and opportunism. Certainly the threats to the U.S. pale in comparison.

Americans have certainly experienced dire grief at the hands of Middle Eastern terrorists. Everyone is aware of 9/11, the Cole, the 1983 bombing of the U.S. barracks in Beirut. We're also all aware of various recent attempts to bring down passenger planes (e.g. the shoe bomber etc.).

But onmyknees says that for him the comparison is a FAIL and with respect and deference to those who lost family on 9/11, on the Cole etc. I tend to agree that there is a difference of degree.

[thombergeron]

Had an interesting conversation with God last night. According to God, the Bible is a tool of the Devil and the Church is an abomination. God was very clear about this: God does not want you to read the Bible, God does not want you to go to Church, and God really doesn't want you to listen to the Clergy.

God told me to tell you that if you have any questions for God, just ask God.

[russtafa]

All religions can be used as tools of oppression.The true god lies in each and every one's heart, or another words inner peace