America gave Us the simpsons, McDonalds and this?!?!

[macjay18]

Ok, I think the states gave us heaps of great things but this is one thing that may be a bit unexpected.
Hip hop/Rap and the associated Gang culture is huuge 'Down Under' especially New Zealand. Young boys as young as 10 are selling drugs on the street or working as prospects for older kids (doing their dirty work) as they get older they might join a gang like the killer bees, the bloods or the cryps (yes thats right- the bloods and the cryps). The young maori and Pac Islander kids of New Zealand dress in the clothes that you would expect to see on 50cent or Eminem- brands such as rocawear, Karl Kani, Kappa, Converse and any white teeshirts that are hideously oversized along with jeans that are similarly sized. Some of the young boys dream of getting out of the slums (housing corp areas of New Zealand) by becoming famous rappers and practice their beatboxing and freestyling skills with their friends at playgrounds etc.

Why do they try to be like these American rappers? Well they dont try to be like them- according to some of the young 'gangsters' in this clip. To the young kids of this country 11 hours away from the USA the lyrics and lives of these rappers can be appreciated by these young kids who also may have been bought up on Welfare benefits, who witnessed gang fights, drug dealing and other shit associated with this lifestyle.

check this clip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJhrB6j2BH0

[Quiet Reflections]

gangs were around long before rap and hip hop

[2009AD]

Hey, wadda ya gonna do? Italy gave us pasta, great wine, and the Sicilian mafia. C'est la vie. :shrug

But in all seriousness, even without the influence of rap culture, those kids would have been petty criminals. In America, some of the earliest urban youth gangs were made up of Jewish, Irish and Italian kids.

New Zealand has dozens of criminal biker gangs: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OsEdTlxn_TQ&feature=related

Can't blame that on 50Cent!

[BLKGSXR]

gangs were around long before rap and hip hopI think to be honest that gangs in the United States Of America were truly Introduced by caucasian men, KKK for instance racist pricks killing people over skin pigment...Sounds like a gang to me.

[luv2playwithTgirls]

Blaming hip hop as the cause of gang violence is absolutely retarded. Give those kids hope and a future and you'll solve the reason that they join gangs, be they crips, hells angels, or neo-nazi. Social justice is an amazing force.

[Dino Velvet]

We gave England Madonna. You guys can have Janeane Garofalo if you want her. We'll even throw in Sean Penn.

http://angrywhitedude.com/wp-content/uploads2/2009/04/janeane_garofalo_3-200x300.jpg http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e215/RileyNotOReilly/seanpenn.jpg

[Jericho]

Don't forget, they gave us Syphilis and Wagon Wheels as well!

[tstv_lover]

Blaming hip hop as the cause of gang violence is absolutely retarded. Give those kids hope and a future and you'll solve the reason that they join gangs, be they crips, hells angels, or neo-nazi. Social justice is an amazing force.

Good comment.

New Zealand does have a problem with gangs and is struggling to find a solution. Bear in mind that the gang names and badges are associated with different ethnic origins. Tongans vs Samoans vs Maori has been a continual cause of violence. Now these groups have new titles and heavily into P and other drug distribution.

Can't really blame the US for our own problems.

[SarahG]

Hey, wadda ya gonna do? Italy gave us pasta, great wine, and the Sicilian mafia. C'est la vie. :shrug

But in all seriousness, even without the influence of rap culture, those kids would have been petty criminals. In America, some of the earliest urban youth gangs were made up of Jewish, Irish and Italian kids.

New Zealand has dozens of criminal biker gangs: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OsEdTlxn_TQ&feature=related

Can't blame that on 50Cent!

I was kinda expecting the link to be this,
http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=5111190

Joking aside, if we're going to blame their gang problems on our rap, why not also blame their gang problems on our motorcycle culture? :roll:

[FREEFALLL666]

Rap/HipHop should be considered as poetry. NOT MUSIC. seriously the guys who make the Musak for elevators have more imagination and artistry. You want a break beat? Well apply it to a tune not the same eight bars like an 94 mobile phone ring tone..

[BLKGSXR]

Rap/HipHop should be considered as poetry. NOT MUSIC. seriously the guys who make the Musak for elevators have more imagination and artistry. You want a break beat? Well apply it to a tune not the same eight bars like an 94 mobile phone ring tone..said by the UK guy...ok so it doesnt count because the blackest person there is?
O fuck there isnt any black people in that country :shock: heh heh...Troll move but wtf kind of rebuttal is Rap/HipHop should be considered poetrybut not music....Rhyming that alone makes it poetry-Poetry is the base to music.

[SarahG]

Rap/HipHop should be considered as poetry. NOT MUSIC. seriously the guys who make the Musak for elevators have more imagination and artistry. You want a break beat? Well apply it to a tune not the same eight bars like an 94 mobile phone ring tone..said by the UK guy...ok so it doesnt count because the blackest person there is?
O fuck there isnt any black people in that country :shock: heh heh...Troll move but wtf kind of rebuttal is Rap/HipHop should not be considered poetry...Rhyming that alone makes it poetry.

I had a professor once who insisted that all music lyrics are poetry when read without instruments, and poetry is always music when it's accompanied by instruments.

[macjay18]

Gangs have always been there in New Zealand. The Mongrel rob has been around since the late 1960s. I know you cant blame Rap music etc from the states for the problem but you can def blame it for the new image....these kids idolise alot of these afro american rappers, want to dress like them, rap like them, drive cars like them (pimped up cars is real popular there). So I dont think gang violence can be blamed on american gangs but the lifestyle/image etc is imitated frequently.

[MacShreach]

We gave England Madonna.

That I don't mind. Giving her to us as well was just mean.

[MacShreach]

This book gives a great insight into the nature of gang culture (as well as being a riveting read.) It also shows that this is not an new issue, being set in the 1935 amongst the "Razor Gangs" of Glasgow.



No Mean City (Paperback)

by Alexander McArthur (Author), H.Kingsley Long (Author)

# ISBN-10: 0552075833
# ISBN-13: 978-0552075831

[2009AD]

Gangs have always been there in New Zealand. The Mongrel rob has been around since the late 1960s. I know you cant blame Rap music etc from the states for the problem but you can def blame it for the new image....these kids idolise alot of these afro american rappers, want to dress like them, rap like them, drive cars like them (pimped up cars is real popular there). So I dont think gang violence can be blamed on american gangs but the lifestyle/image etc is imitated frequently.

Teens and young adults all over the world have adopted the dress, lingo, and manerisms of hip hop artists, so what? Most of these young people do not take part in criminal activities. What's your point?

[cookiepuss]

Rap/HipHop should be considered as poetry. NOT MUSIC. seriously the guys who make the Musak for elevators have more imagination and artistry. You want a break beat? Well apply it to a tune not the same eight bars like an 94 mobile phone ring tone..said by the UK guy...ok so it doesnt count because the blackest person there is?
O fuck there isnt any black people in that country :shock: heh heh...Troll move but wtf kind of rebuttal is Rap/HipHop should be considered poetrybut not music....Rhyming that alone makes it poetry-Poetry is the base to music.

No Black people in the U.K.? You've never been obviously! Many Indian and Middle Eastern as well.
Since you bring up the "race Card" I'll go along on that theme.
To me HipHop/Rap is now just rhymes with sampling. Kind of boring now. Interesting in the day though!!!

You see, it's not about attacking race. Rock and roll (Robert Johnson etc.) was started by the blackman and ripped off by Elvis. And most all other music by "Black" artist is awesome..'60's, '70's '80's Marvin Gaye, Parliment, Kool ATG! Ohio Players, George Benson.........you get my point. That shit was TALENT!!!

The OP said AMERICA gave us.......It's not about race my friend!

"Kids" wearing oversized clothes looks foolish to me. BUT!,, When I had a mohawk in the early '80's I'm sure I looked the same to an adult.
Remember all the Madonna girls in the '80's........

To me, criticizing HipHop is not criticizing the Black race. Aren't they much more than that?

[MacShreach]

O fuck there isnt any black people in that country :shock: heh heh...Troll move

Really? 1.9 million in 2006, or 3% of the population. (As opposed to 12.9% in the US)

I'm sure they're really pleased to have been written out of existence by you.

Oh, dear, oh dear, your credibility....what did you do to it? Is that the Dubbya effect? You know, you don't know what the fuck you're talking about but you'll assume you're right anyway? Thought those days were over.....

(BTW that number is for black people of African or Afro-Caribbean descent, not Asians. Just in case you wanted to try that comeback. :wink: )

[macjay18]

I didnt say that wearing these clothes and adopting this attitude means your a gangsta. My title was about America giving us this hip hop/Rap culture thats in New Zealand- along with the offshots of American gangs like bloods and cryps. This is an observation, saying that they are criminal hoods is an accusation. I will stick to it just been an observation.

[cookiepuss]

I didnt say that wearing these clothes and adopting this attitude means your a gangsta. My title was about America giving us this hip hop/Rap culture thats in New Zealand- along with the offshots of American gangs like bloods and cryps. This is an observation, saying that they are criminal hoods is an accusation. I will stick to it just been an observation.

I agree with your post. It's all over Europe as well. Started by American thugs. At least the mafia dresses nice :D

[SarahG]

O fuck there isnt any black people in that country :shock: heh heh...Troll move

Really? 1.9 million in 2006, or 3% of the population. (As opposed to 12.9% in the US)

I'm sure they're really pleased to have been written out of existence by you.

Oh, dear, oh dear, your credibility....what did you do to it? Is that the Dubbya effect? You know, you don't know what the fuck you're talking about but you'll assume you're right anyway? Thought those days were over.....

(BTW that number is for black people of African or Afro-Caribbean descent, not Asians. Just in case you wanted to try that comeback. :wink: )

You're taking BLKGSXR too seriously. He's just mad that OEM is going to NYC and not taking him with him.

[cookiepuss]

O fuck there isnt any black people in that country :shock: heh heh...Troll move

Really? 1.9 million in 2006, or 3% of the population. (As opposed to 12.9% in the US)

I'm sure they're really pleased to have been written out of existence by you.

Oh, dear, oh dear, your credibility....what did you do to it? Is that the Dubbya effect? You know, you don't know what the fuck you're talking about but you'll assume you're right anyway? Thought those days were over.....

(BTW that number is for black people of African or Afro-Caribbean descent, not Asians. Just in case you wanted to try that comeback. :wink: )

You're taking BLKGSXR too seriously. He's just mad that OEM is going to NYC and not taking him with him.


ok, he/she is just a dumb N(word). :o :violin

[idiot savant]

ok,fine if want to blame rap,so be it. oh if they start drinking ,smoking and driving pick ups,blame country.if start taking x and dye they hair red,blame techno. I got a million stereotypes you can blame on different music genres. the point here is this,we have become a society of scapegoats. what happen to personal responsibility. I listen to rap/hip hop all the time, I 'm perfectly fine.

[macjay18]

haha interesting- I started this thread as a simple observation that i thought might have startled some Americans (ie. not .that this scene was so big in NZ). Anyways I like rap/hip hop etc and Im not a criminal or anything. A heap of basketballers i know get amped for games listening to Tupac, Xzibit, DMX etc before playing rather than live, limp biscuit etc guess it is just the people you know and the things you are into.
When we were younger and playing outdoor pickup games we would get the old ghetto blaster out and crank out the tunes while playing...good times.

[SarahG]

ok,fine if want to blame rap,so be it. oh if they start drinking ,smoking and driving pick ups,blame country.if start taking x and dye they hair red,blame techno. I got a million stereotypes you can blame on different music genres. the point here is this,we have become a society of scapegoats. what happen to personal responsibility. I listen to rap/hip hop all the time, I 'm perfectly fine.

You know what this means?

We didn't just give them rap- we gave them our American practice of attributing crime to unrelated cultural characteristics.

The next time they have a school shooting, I will be anticipating the "It's all marilyn manson's fault!" thread.

[BLKGSXR]

O fuck there isnt any black people in that country :shock: heh heh...Troll move

Really? 1.9 million in 2006, or 3% of the population. (As opposed to 12.9% in the US)

I'm sure they're really pleased to have been written out of existence by you.

Oh, dear, oh dear, your credibility....what did you do to it? Is that the Dubbya effect? You know, you don't know what the fuck you're talking about but you'll assume you're right anyway? Thought those days were over.....

(BTW that number is for black people of African or Afro-Caribbean descent, not Asians. Just in case you wanted to try that comeback. :wink: )

You're taking BLKGSXR too seriously. He's just mad that OEM is going to NYC and not taking him with him.


ok, he/she is just a dumb N(word). :o :violinFirstly MACCRYALOT your a nobody to me. so whatever you say is brushed away...My post was a sarcastic Rebuttal to a Bigot.... Lol@ sarah mad not going to NYC lol Shes just mad because she wants nutz lol Jk...Ok back to bizz..... Bigots gtfo nubs. this has been a daily announcement by your truly :D.
cookie puss Racism or references to racism are just ignorant crys of insecurity.

[russtafa]

a bullet would sove the problem but western society is to soft and gutless to deal with the problem=instant death.iran has many problems but law and order is not one of them

[russtafa]

most no western cultures dont have these youth gang problems becawse they would cure it straight away,no monge mob,killer bees,blackpower, ect

[tstv_lover]

Important to keep all of this in perspective. The video shows a small group of youths in a small suburb in the south of Auckland. I live in Auckland and have never personally encountered these gangs. The rest of New Zealand doesn't have these groups either.

The biggest problem for youths in New Zealand is boredom. If a cat breaks wind it will appear on the news!

Don't cancel your vacation to New Zealand.

OK, I'm finished with my NZ Tourism bit :)

[tstv_lover]

One other thing, remember that transsexuals are very much part of New Zealand's modern culture. We had the first transsexual Mayor and first transsexual Member of Parliament.

Prostitution was legalised in New Zealand about 4 years ago, so things are pretty much out in the open for those interested.

[jjhill]

haha interesting- I started this thread as a simple observation that i thought might have startled some Americans (ie. not .that this scene was so big in NZ). Anyways I like rap/hip hop etc and Im not a criminal or anything. A heap of basketballers i know get amped for games listening to Tupac, Xzibit, DMX etc before playing rather than live, limp biscuit etc guess it is just the people you know and the things you are into.
When we were younger and playing outdoor pickup games we would get the old ghetto blaster out and crank out the tunes while playing...good times.

:shock:

[macjay18]

Turned out to be an interesting forum, some good reading haha, keep it coming. I dont live in nZ anymore but in day to day life (I guess depending on where you live) you dont come across gangs. If you lived in Wairoa or South Aucks maybe it would be a different story but even then if you keep to yourself they wont bother you

[russtafa]

what a lot of b/s if they come a cross you then its your nightmare i grew up with those guys and they are real bad barstards.they done some truly horrorfying stuff for kicks

[russtafa]

if you lock yourself away and never never go out you will be safe god what a turtle

[russtafa]

if you lock yourself away and never never go out you will be safe god what a turtle