New doubts over Iraq intelligence.

[White_Male_Canada]

The Butler Report:

We conclude that, on the basis of the intelligence assessments at the time, covering both Niger and the Democratic Republic of Congo, the statements on Iraqi attempts to buy uranium from Africa in the Government's dossier, and by the Prime Minister in the House of Commons, were well-founded. By extension, we conclude also that the statement in President Bush's State of the Union Address of 28 January 2003 that: The British Government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa was well-founded.

For the reasons given above, even now it is premature to reach conclusions about Iraq's prohibited weapons. But from the evidence which has been found and de-briefing of Iraqi personnel it appears that prior to the war the Iraqi regime: a. Had the strategic intention of resuming the pursuit of prohibited weapons programmes, including if possible its nuclear weapons programme, when United Nations inspection regimes were relaxed and sanctions were eroded or lifted. b. In support of that goal, was carrying out illicit research and development, and procurement, activities. c. Was developing ballistic missiles with a range longer than permitted under relevant United Nations Security Council resolutions. d. Did not, however, have significant — if any — stocks of chemical or biological weapons in a state fit for deployment, or developed plans for using them.

Apart from J. wilson`s op-ed in WaPo where he lied, Saddam was seeking uranium in Niger in attempts to reconstitute his wmd programs.

[thombergeron]

Apart from J. wilson`s op-ed in WaPo where he lied, Saddam was seeking uranium in Niger in attempts to reconstitute his wmd programs.

As with pretty much everything else you post here, Michael, there is literally no evidence to support your contention. Literally zero.

The CIA looked (intensely) for evidence to support the Niger story and found none. The IAEA doesn't believe it's true. Even Butler has no actual evidence to support the contention that Saddam was trying to buy uranium from Niger. He bases his conclusion on simple inference: Wissam al-Zahawie made an official visit to Niger in 1999, and Niger has uranium deposits, therefore, Saddam was trying to buy uranium from Niger.

Quite inconveniently, however, the government of Niger doesn't have any uranium to sell. All Nigerien uranium is controlled by COGEMA, a mining consortium majority owned by the French government.

Keep trying, Michael. Those WMDs have got to be around here somehere.

[guyone]

"Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime ... He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation ... And now he is miscalculating America's response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction ... So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real..."
- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan. 23. 2003

"I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force -- if necessary -- to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security."
- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002

"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our bottom line."
- President Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998

"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."
- President Bill Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998

"We must stop Saddam from ever again jeopardizing the stability and security of his neighbors with weapons of mass destruction."
- Madeline Albright, Feb 1, 1998

"He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has ten times since 1983."
- Sandy Berger, Clinton National Security Adviser, Feb, 18, 1998

"[W]e urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S. Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if appropriate, air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond effectively to the threat posed by Iraq's refusal to end its weapons of mass destruction programs."
Letter to President Clinton.
- (D) Senators Carl Levin, Tom Daschle, John Kerry, others, Oct. 9, 1998

"Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process."
- Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D, CA), Dec. 16, 1998

"Hussein has ... chosen to spend his money on building weapons of mass destruction and palaces for his cronies."
- Madeline Albright, Clinton Secretary of State, Nov. 10, 1999

"We begin with the common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a threat to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandate of the United Nations and is building weapons of mass destruction and th! e means of delivering them."
- Sen. Carl Levin (D, MI), Sept. 19, 2002

"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."
- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002

"Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to deter and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power."
- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002

"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction."
- Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002

"The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October of 1998. We are confident that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons..."
- Sen. Robert Byrd (D, WV), Oct. 3, 2002

"There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working aggressively to develop nuclear weapons and will likely have nuclear weapons within the next five years ... We also should remember we have always underestimated the progress Saddam has made in development of weapons of mass destruction."
- Sen. Jay Rockefeller (D, WV), Oct 10, 2002

"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including al Qaeda members ... It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare, and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons."
- Sen. Hillary Clinton (D, NY), Oct 10, 2002

"We are in possession of what I think to be compelling evidence that Saddam Hussein has, and has had for a number of years, a developing capacity for the production and storage of weapons of mass destruction."
- Sen. Bob Graham (D, FL), Dec. 8, 2002

[Caleigh]

Ok, just because a bunch of politicians can be manipulated into believing something does not mean that it's true. This is in fact a case in point.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/11/AR2006121101390.html

Ok, just because a bunch of politicians can be manipulated into believing something does not mean that it's true. This is in fact a case in point.


You're right. Politicians can not be held to their own commitments.

They were "tricked"

LMAO!!!! LMAO LMAO LMAO!!!

LOL OMG!!! LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL!!!!!!!!!!!![/b]

[LG]

LOL OMG!!! LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL!!!!!!!!!!!![/b]
:roll:

What the fuck, laughing boy? Swallowed nerve gas or something?

[chefmike]

LOL OMG!!! LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL!!!!!!!!!!!![/b]

Pipe down, chorus boy!

Go bag some groceries, TFool.

[Caleigh]

guyone, in what way does listing quotes from politicians who were duped by the false intel support your argument?

[guyone]

They were duped and republicans lied. This is always the case. The democrats always have some convenient way of worming out of taking responsibility for their decisions while still calling out anyone on the other side of the argument.

And just because we may not have found WMD's does not mean there were none. I know 'contractors' who claimed to have seen these caches of WMDs go into syria.

It's just the whole 'holier than thou' attitude that the democrats constantly display meanwhile they're a bunch of atheists. Go figure...

"It depends on what your definition of is, is."

[Caleigh]

No-one is suggesting that the majority of Republican representatives weren't duped along with the Democrats. It was obviously a very small number of people who knew that the testimony of "Curveball" was not to be trusted.

Best reports now suggest that Saddam Hussein slowed or halted development of WMD's but didn't want anyone to know because he needed to keep Iran especially believing that he had the upper hand militarily.

I didn't know that being an atheist was a crime. I also wasn't aware that most Democrats were athiests. Where is that poll?

[thombergeron]

I know 'contractors' who claimed to have seen these caches of WMDs go into syria.

It's important to note that this is utter bullshit.

For one, I don't believe that you "know 'contractors'." You're just some silly kid who doesn't know his ass from the road to China.

Second, no one at all saw "caches of WMDs go into Syria" because these caches simply did not exist.

This has been shown time and again by numerous official and nonofficial investigations both here and abroad. To offer a lengthy list of links to these investigations' findings yet again is just boring and redundant. It's a settled issue. It's over.

If you mouthbreathers want to insist that the tooth fairy is real, that's fine, but do try to refrain from continuing to embarrass yourselves in public.

[guyone]

Hey thombergeron!

GFY!

I really could care less what you believe.

[thombergeron]

Hey thombergeron!

GFY!

I really could care less what you believe.

Another thoughtful rejoinder from guyone. You really do your cause credit.

[guyone]

You're whole existence is bs.

[thombergeron]

You're whole existence is bs.

I guess you haven't yet gotten to possessive nouns in your remedial grammar class.

Get on the stick, kiddo. You're going to have to pass that state test to get your high school diploma.

[guyone]

Blah, blah, blah...

[White_Male_Canada]

Second, no one at all saw "caches of WMDs go into Syria" because these caches simply did not exist.

This has been shown time and again by numerous official and nonofficial investigations both here and abroad. To offer a lengthy list of links to these investigations' findings yet again is just boring and redundant. It's a settled issue. It's over.



David Kay,

"we know from some of the interrogations of former Iraqi officials that a lot of material went to Syria before the war, including some components of Saddam's WMD program." Among the things left behind, Kay reported finding a "clandestine network of laboratories and safe houses," and "a prison laboratory complex... that Iraqi officials working to prepare for UN inspections were explicitly ordered not to declare to the UN."

The ISG's investigation revealed "new research on BW-applicable agents, Brucella and Congo Crimean Hemorrhagic Fever (CCHF), and continuing work on ricin and aflatoxin.”

[White_Male_Canada]

Apart from J. wilson`s op-ed in WaPo where he lied, Saddam was seeking uranium in Niger in attempts to reconstitute his wmd programs.

As with pretty much everything else you post here, Michael, there is literally no evidence to support your contention. Literally zero.

The CIA looked (intensely) for evidence to support the Niger story and found none. The IAEA doesn't believe it's true. Even Butler has no actual evidence to support the contention that Saddam was trying to buy uranium from Niger. He bases his conclusion on simple inference: Wissam al-Zahawie made an official visit to Niger in 1999, and Niger has uranium deposits, therefore, Saddam was trying to buy uranium from Niger.
Quite inconveniently, however, the government of Niger doesn't have any uranium to sell. All Nigerien uranium is controlled by COGEMA, a mining consortium majority owned by the French government.

Keep trying, Michael. Those WMDs have got to be around here somehere.

Hey look, the moron brigade`s 1st lieutenant. 8)


ISG Conclusions:

a. Had the strategic intention of resuming the pursuit of prohibited weapons programmes, including if possible its nuclear weapons programme, when United Nations inspection regimes were relaxed and sanctions were eroded or lifted.

b. In support of that goal, was carrying out illicit research and development, and procurement, activities.

c. Was developing ballistic missiles with a range longer than permitted under relevant United Nations Security Council resolutions.

d. Did not, however, have significant - if any - stocks of chemical or biological weapons in a state fit for deployment, or developed plans for using them.





The Butler Report:

We conclude that, on the basis of the intelligence assessments at the time, covering both Niger and the Democratic Republic of Congo, the statements on Iraqi attempts to buy uranium from Africa in the Government’s dossier, and by the Prime Minister in the House of Commons, were well-founded. By extension, we conclude also that the statement in President Bush’s State of the Union Address of 28 January 2003 that:

The British Government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought
significant quantities of uranium from Africa was well-founded.

From our examination of the intelligence and other material on Iraqi
attempts to buy uranium from Africa, we have concluded that:
a. It is accepted by all parties that Iraqi officials visited Niger in
1999.

b. The British Government had intelligence from several different
sources indicating that this visit was for the purpose of acquiring
uranium. Since uranium constitutes almost three-quarters of
Niger’s exports, the intelligence was credible.

c. The evidence was not conclusive that Iraq actually purchased, as
opposed to having sought, uranium and the British Government
did not claim this.

d. The forged documents were not available to the British
Government at the time its assessment was made, and so the fact
of the forgery does not undermine it.

Rolf Ekeus, Appointed by the U.N. to head the UNSCOM inspection team after the end of the first Gulf war widely recognized was the quality of his performance that, when inspections were proposed again in 2000, even Kofi Annan proposed renominating him for the task. The appointment of Ekeus was overruled by France and Russia, who insisted on Hans Blix.


Ekeus :

"When I first heard that it was Zahawie who had been to Niger, I thought well, then, that's it. Conclusive.

One of my colleagues remembers Zahawie as Iraq's delegate to the IAEA General Conference during the years 1982-84. One item on the agenda was the diplomatic and political fall-out of Israel's destruction of the Osirak reactor (a centerpiece of Iraq's nuclear weapons ambitions). . . . He was the under-secretary of the foreign ministry selected by Baghdad to represent Iraq on the most sensitive issue, the question of Iraq's nuclear weapons ambitions. His participation as leader of the Iraqi delegation to the 1995 Non-Proliferation Treaty Review Conference merely confirms his standing as Iraq's top negotiator on nuclear weapons issues."


FacCheck.org:

The famous “16 words” in President Bush’s Jan. 28, 2003 State of the Union address turn out to have a basis in fact after all, according to two recently released investigations in the US and Britain.

A British intelligence review released July 14 calls Bush’s 16 words “well founded.”

A separate report by the US Senate Intelligence Committee said July 7 that the US also had similar information from “a number of intelligence reports,” a fact that was classified at the time Bush spoke.

Ironically, former Ambassador Joseph Wilson, who later called Bush’s 16 words a “lie”, supplied information that the Central Intelligence Agency took as confirmation that Iraq may indeed have been seeking uranium from Niger .

Both the US and British investigations make clear that some forged Italian documents, exposed as fakes soon after Bush spoke, were not the basis for the British intelligence Bush cited, or the CIA's conclusion that Iraq was trying to get uranium.

[chefmike]

:P

[White_Male_Canada]

:P


What ? Oh ! Ohhhh. This is inconvenient:

- June 9th, the UN Monitoring, Verification and Inspection Commission briefed the Security Council about the export of Iraqi WMD, missile and nuclear components shipped out of Iraq before, during and after the invasion

UNMOVIC acting executive chairman Demetrius Perricos told the Council, "The removal of these materials from Iraq raises concerns with regard to proliferation risks."

- Air Force Lt. Gen. James Clapper,National Imagery and Mapping Agency stated vehicle traffic photographed by U.S. spy satellites indicated that material and documents related to the arms programs were shipped to Syria.

- Charles Duelfer, who succeeded David Kay as head of the Iraq Survey Group, said he couldn't rule out a transfer of WMD from Iraq to Syria.

"There was evidence of a discussion of possible WMD collaboration initiated by a Syrian security officer, and ISG received information about movement of material out of Iraq, including the possibility that WMD was involved. In the judgment of the working group, these reports were sufficiently credible to merit further investigation,"

- Lt. Gen. Michael DeLong, deputy commander of Central Command Operation Iraqi Freedom, " I do know for a fact that some of those weapons went into Syria, Lebanon and Iran."

- John A. Shaw, former U.S. deputy undersecretary of defense for international technology security, " I received information from several sources naming the exact Russian units, what they took and where they took both WMD materials and conventional explosives."