Very Suprised @ The Stances Taken By Some Of You Girls

[Thuggish_Intellect]

Regarding the whole knowing you have a STD/Life Threatening Disease Thing...very dissapointed.

Yes, I understand that you didn't give it to yourself, and yes it may be a hard life on you, and yes men should protect themselves at all times but, how is that helping you in the long run?

What if the guy you neglected to tell had sex with an infected person you know and then had sex with you and the condom broke or some discretion ended up infiltrating the blood supply...what that be a bit of poetic justice? An ironic twist of fate?

I think it's time to wake up and look at the human picture first before looking at the transsexual picture. What if that guy was your brother, cousin or father...

And maybe, just maybe some of the girls should try talking with the girl who may be infected. Show a bit of compassion before she kills her self and not after the fact.

Just my opinion.

A lot of the blame can be put on someone else, but when are you gonna be woman enough and take some responsibility for your actions?

[TexasTman]

amen...what a great post!

[hillbilly]

it is a great post. funny how nobody will touch it.

We can't solve any problems unless we ask honest questions.

[phungu2]

it is a great post. funny how nobody will touch it.

We can't solve any problems unless we ask honest questions.

the thread on Susan Shah & AIDS (where the stances taken by some girls that thug is talking about) should be a real wake-up call .

http://hungangels.com/board/viewtopic.php?t=1379

[hillbilly]

thanks. yeah i posted to that thread as well.

figured those people would migrate here that's what i find odd.

oh well

[Vicki Richter]

You guys are chicken shit. You same "some girls" when Allanah is the only one you are disagreeing with.

Her and I openly debate all the time. We may not like each other a lot because of it, but it's still up-front and civil. I didn't see anyone else but her and I posting in that thread. My God... if you disagree with something someone says, have a discussion with that person be it me or someone else, don't generalize and lump others into it.

All I said was prostitution should be legalized, taxed, and regulated to prevent that kind of behavior from happening. If a girl was working under the radar at that point, it would be a buyer beware type of situation.

You're argument is that HIV+ girls shouldn't escort or should be open about their status, and I agreed to that as well. Just the same, I don't know that they have other options for work. If you have recommendations, by all means share. Just because they are sick they don't deserve to become homeless street people so guys can go feel better about seeing girls for illegal sex acts. I would also be interested in seeing the percentages of HIV+ "johns" out there. Do you think it's 1 in 10? 1 in 20? Do you think any of them actively attempt to infect their providers because they are bitter?

I have no idea. I am just trying to feel out the problem a bit more.

[Johnny Cocksville]

If these guys are truly so concerned they should demand to see a recent HIV test from an escort and be prepared to show the same to her. I know Joanna Jet has done this in the past when requested.

But I seriously doubt most guys would be willing to do it.

[phungu2]

vicki

I guess I am one of the chickenshits in question.

I was talking about the attitude & stance of some girls as relayed 2nd hand by some posters (like mega I think).

p.s. I gave & give you major props for your courageous stand which won't make you popular with your peers.

[hillbilly]

yes vicki the title of the thread is much too broad and i actually realized that but don't think it was meant to include you. its always great to hear your opinion and i am an avid reader of your yahoo group. so i think this was an oversight.

anyways this is a good healthy debate which i don't think is necassarily meant to provoke any specific action such as asking a girl to show a HIV test.

its simply a conversation. we aren't pretending to be gestapo or kgb. we won't be coming into your lives and taking your civil liberties like george bush.

anywhoo. gotta do some work.

[TexasTman]

Vicki, I completely agree with you. Allanah is completely out-to-lunch ion this one.

[Vicki Richter]

Vicki, I completely agree with you. Allanah is completely out-to-lunch ion this one.

Hung Angel staff. Are Phungu, Hillbilly, and Texas all posting from the same IP?

Also, I never said that she was out to lunch. I just stated my opinion. Just because it is different doesn't make hers wrong. As a side note, regulation would make escorting safer for the girls as well. That would be a really good thing for everyone.

[phungu2]

Vicki, I completely agree with you. Allanah is completely out-to-lunch ion this one.

Hung Angel staff. Are Phungu, Hillbilly, and Texas all posting from the same IP?
.

excuse me? whats that supposed to be?

[Vicki Richter]

You guys are always posting within minutes of each other egging each other on. I just want to know if you are the same person.

[hillbilly]

haha um nope. i may have multiple personalities but i only use one name here. that would be pretty twisted.

anyhow...

i work from home and when i get bored (frequently) i check in hece my sometimes clustered rapid fire responses.

i don't imagine that we will be seeing in NY soon because of your surgery? it gives me chills when you say IP address. meow a girl with brains. sexy shit.

k back to work.

[phungu2]

You guys are always posting within minutes of each other egging each other on. I just want to know if you are the same person.

The Govt just gave a research grant to investigate a computer model to scan tru IRC chat rooms to attempt to detect cells of related parties based on repeated post time proximity.

But no, to paraphrase John Lennon, I aint he and he's not me and we arent all together. (the next line even says something about a "pornographic priestess letting her knickers down". no kidding.)

-

[AllanahStarrNYC]

Dear Texas,

Thanks for telling me I am out to lunch-
luckily my lunch WASNT with you.

Its true
U guys are pure chicken shit,
Its basically me whom you disagree with and I could care less.
The only ass I kiss is my own darling.
Vicki and I might not agree on alot of shit, but I admire her posts cause she is smart and she doesnt kiss anyones ass either.

I don't know what world many of you guys are living in but it is clearly not a real one.
In this country prostitution will never be legalized because of all the puritanical bullshit. Since they cant tax it, the cops & vice go after girls knowing damn well it is not a deterant-they go back to work right away.
If you partake in any part of the sex business, wether it be as a customer or as a worker, you should know what risks you take and take precautions.
Simple as that. Some clients will never be honest about their health and some girls as well. That is life, like it or not.
U wanna be completely safe?
Then DONT HAVE SEX.

I have read some really ridiculous things here the past few days.

Most of you guys have no clue what goes on on the day to day life of escorts and what they encounter. I have been in many parts of the world
and witnessed girls in all different types of situations- and trust me, most stories share the same common thread. That will never change.

Hunnny some of you guys love to gossip on here more than the girls do.
Get some cojones and stop talking shit behind a computer screen.

ANd by the way Hillbilly-u said that at my party I will smile and be gracious to everyone and yes that is true- because #1 I am gracious host
#2 I am polite and have manners #3 Because you don't agree with me
doesnt mean that I hate you #4 I am appreciative of all my guest

BUT
I tell it like it is and if I dont like you, trust me I am not a hypocrite.
I speak mind.

The fact is many of you have no respect for many of the girls.
Some of you think we are objects and treat us as such.
U all talked shit instantly about Susan without knowing one bit about her.
You didn't know what she went through in her life, how she behaved sexually, and what made her die such a horrible death.
To some of you she was just another hooker who died-
to some of us she was a good friend.
However, I know the kind of person that Susan was and she was not an evil person. She was one of the few girls who were trying to go somewhere and do something with her life.

[runningdownthatdream]

The fact is many of you have no respect for many of the girls.
Some of you think we are objects and treat us as such


I agree with you on this Allanah......guys have said some awfully tactless (to say the least) things about girls on here and which I have commented on in the past. For my trouble I was pissed on by Mega. At the time I challenged any of the girls to speak their mind on it but no-one spoke.....so am finally glad to hear it from you....

I'm thinking that the major issue here is that Susan Shah just DIED! And....although here in North America we seem to have lost all sense of decency, it's still customary to allow her friends and family to mourn before jumping on a shit-kicking bandwagon.

OK......maybe she had AIDS....but no-one knows how she lived and what she may have done or not done to protect herself and her clients and it is unfair to simply make assumptions. Hooray for Allanah for defending her friend...nowhere near as bad as those of you who have defended GW for going on a crusade against 1 billion muslims!

We are all adults. For those who choose to see an escort then take the proper pre-caution. If Allanah and Mega knew with certainty that someone had AIDS and was DELIBERATELY infecting others I'm sure that they would try to do something about it (am I wrong, either of you?). If they didn't that would be morally wrong. But to start throwing names around based on hearsay or assumptions would be just another Inquisition. And in this age the Inquisitors would end up being the Government.....does anyone really want that?

In the end it is up to the individual to make the correct decision and not slough off the responsibilty on someone else.....hope my rambling made sense......

[hillbilly]

oh god you Allanah are ridiculous.

the problem here is you seem to think that this is a problem only affecting the girls. this EVERYONES problem. not yours or anyone's alone.

now trust me i don't either back down from what i say either. that point is moot and useless. good for you and good for me whatever. you are sorely mistaken if you think i am here to kiss your ass. just taking some quotes from you so don't be offended. they're your words. its your tone.

my response regarding your part was to MEGA saying that i would go to your party and smile in your face blah blah blah. i said i will go and fork over my 50 because thats how it fucking works. you smile at me and i smile at you. thats it a service nothing more nothing less. maybe you need to go back and refresh you memory hunnny.

so are we suggesting that rather than voicing our opinions here that you girls and guys want to meet at a starbucks or something? do you want to go to starbucks and talk about this? what is your point.

i am not a public figure nor do i choose to be. if i choose to express my opinion here from the comfort of my couch that is my choice. if i put my face to it would that make a difference to you? why? has nothing to do with being chicken shit.

i think the person who is chicken shit is the one who supposedly has so much knowledge to share but comes on here to only talk down to us. as you say we don't know anything about your life did you consider you don't know anything about ours?

if you have read so many ridiculous things on the board in the last couple days. you know the things you say you don't care about. then rather than scolding us. why don't break them down and present your argument to us. make us understand. can you do that?

nobody talked shit about susan can you get that through your head. find me that please because i don't remember that. what would she say you should do? you are putting words in our mouths. such as:

-U all talked shit instantly about Susan without knowing one bit about her.
-she was not an evil person
-just another hooker who died

you are out there! cut that hunnny and sweetie crap too its meant to be demeaning so cut the crap and speak.

[Slither]

The attitude that it's up to the guy to find out who's clean and who isn't is just flat out ridiculous. If a girl has HIV/AIDS/whatever, knowingly, and is escorting, it's completely and totally 100% on her.

This whole "well they might be infected and they might not, but if you get infected it's your fault" is bullshit. Men are paying for a service, spending their hard earned money for an hour or whatever with that girl. It's like going to a fast food place and the worker telling you "this burger may have rat poison in it, I'm not sure, you better go get the meat tested yourself before you eat it"

[hillbilly]

haha good analogy. or maybe not telling you that we have mad cow disease.

or we cross contaminate things.

[Thuggish_Intellect]

You're argument is that HIV+ girls shouldn't escort or should be open about their status, and I agreed to that as well. Just the same, I don't know that they have other options for work. If you have recommendations, by all means share. Just because they are sick they don't deserve to become homeless street people so guys can go feel better about seeing girls for illegal sex acts. I would also be interested in seeing the percentages of HIV+ "johns" out there. Do you think it's 1 in 10? 1 in 20? Do you think any of them actively attempt to infect their providers because they are bitter?

I have no idea. I am just trying to feel out the problem a bit more.


You keep assuming that i'm saying its the girls fault. It's wrong no matter what the situation is. The fact that she did unprotected sex scenes seems a bit scary to me...Assumably under the guise that she hadn't had anything.

And there were others that advocated "keeping the whole situation on a hush" aside from Allanah.

This is a message board. I don't know any of you personally so it's not a personal attack. I'm just making the case that maybe some of you guys (those of you who "trick") need to think long and hard before trusting a transsexual (if you only see ts escorts) sex provider...

There were two black transsexual escorts in my area who just died due to HIV/AIDS and I know a lot of men who had know idea...probablly some on this board.

It's not a game.

[Thuggish_Intellect]

Dear Texas,


U guys are pure chicken shit...

The only ass I kiss is my own darling...



If you partake in any part of the sex business, wether it be as a customer or as a worker, you should know what risks you take and take precautions...


stop talking shit behind a computer screen...


How is it "chicken shit" if you post on a message board something that is not inflamatory or derogative...I merely stated my sentiment about the position some of you took about "the trick vs. the trannie" mentality. You can't seem to comprehend that.

You keep saying it's a hard world out there for transsexuals and hell, you may be right Allanah but, that's life.
It's a hard world out there for immigrants in the US making $3.00 an hour sleeping 10 to a house...It's a hard world out there for a single mother working for $8.00 an hour, feeding her child and putting herself through school...It's a hard world out there for the young dude born into poverty in a Brownsville BK project, surrounded by crack dealers, lay-a-way daddy's, crooked cops, and unconcerned teachers...Life ain't fair.

Some of your statements seem to imply that there is no way for transsexuals to make it other than "tricking"...In my opinion that mentality will always set you back. If you never try, how do you know? Have you thought about going to college, or starting a legal LLC?

I'm not knocking your hustle, I believe as humans we have to do what we have to do to survive, but when your pursuit of life comes by way of inhibitting/putting in the way of danger someone else's...that's where I draw the line.

If you want to be a sex worker cool. If you want to be a trick fine. But if you know for 10 years that you have a DEADLY disease and continue to have sex (wether you are a trick or a tranny) and not make any mention of it, then yes...that does make you a bad person, a very bad person in my eyes.

The same argument you give about "How Hard Transsexuals Have It" is the same argument anyone systematically being discriminated against can give...This is America, we know it exists but you still have to persevere.

[Vicki Richter]

These are kind of scarey statistics. This is a very good read and relative to this thread.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/latimests/20041016/ts_latimes/undertheradarhivworsens

[TexasTman]

Allanah,

boo hoo hoo, the poor escorts. we guys don't know what it is like for you escorts! boo hoo! BIG deal. It is the life that you have chosen or maybe it is the life that chose you, it doesn't make any difference. You always act like a t-girl is so limited in her choices that she has to resort to escorting. What a ridiculous premise. You choose that life because you want it for all sorts of different reasons: 1. it is easy, 2. it is easy money, 3. it is more money than you can make at a "real" job, 4. it allows you to be self-employed. I don't care about the reason. The fact remains that escorts COULD do other things.

Your wanting (demanding) that the burden of preventing the spread of STD's falls squarely on the shoulders of the trick is absolute crap. Grow up and take some responsibility.

I know that not everyone is an upstanding honest person but the majority of society is so don't stoop down, rise up to a higher moral and etical level! You probably believe that a person that smokes deserves lung cancer....after all the cigarette packages warn you of the hazards.

Get some cajones yourself. By the way I am not hiding behind anything. I am happy to reveal who and where I am anytime you want.

[TexasTman]

Allanah,

boo hoo hoo, the poor escorts. we guys don't know what it is like for you escorts! boo hoo! BIG deal. It is the life that you have chosen or maybe it is the life that chose you, it doesn't make any difference. You always act like a t-girl is so limited in her choices that she has to resort to escorting. What a ridiculous premise. You choose that life because you want it for all sorts of different reasons: 1. it is easy, 2. it is easy money, 3. it is more money than you can make at a "real" job, 4. it allows you to be self-employed. I don't care about the reason. The fact remains that escorts COULD do other things.

Your wanting (demanding) that the burden of preventing the spread of STD's falls squarely on the shoulders of the trick is absolute crap. Grow up and take some responsibility.

I know that not everyone is an upstanding honest person but the majority of society is so don't stoop down, rise up to a higher moral and etical level! You probably believe that a person that smokes deserves lung cancer....after all the cigarette packages warn you of the hazards.

Get some cajones yourself. By the way I am not hiding behind anything. I am happy to reveal who and where I am anytime you want.

[hillbilly]

shitty jobs i've held while trying to get to another point in my life. maybe you girls could try some of these but you'll have to skip the gucci, dolce, and versace. as a matter of fact walking into an old navy would probably give you tingles after making this little money.

paper boy v.1
paper boy v.2
paper boy v.3
car wash (drying cars for tips)
landscaper v.1 (mowing lawns all day everyday no end in sight)
dishwasher (nursing home sad, eye opening i was 15) v.1
landscaper v.2
ice cream man (hahaha the absolutely worst!)
greens keeper
busboy
cashier
diswasher v.2 (banquet hall)
short order cook
laborer (bleeding, hot, and pissed by 8am on the first day)
house painter v.1
warehouse worker
house painter v.2
house painter v.3
intern to artist (no pay)
waiter v.1
waiter v.2
waiter v.3
waiter v.4
scenery painter
intern (no pay to designer)

we all have to make sacrifices to get to another place in life. nobody forces you to compromise yoursef. that is your own choice.

[partlycloudy]

dam hillbilly,
what are you doing now (job)?

[Thuggish_Intellect]

shitty jobs...
paper boy v.1
paper boy v.2
paper boy v.3
car wash (drying cars for tips)
landscaper v.1 (mowing lawns all day everyday no end in sight)
dishwasher (nursing home sad, eye opening i was 15) v.1
landscaper v.2
ice cream man (hahaha the absolutely worst!)
greens keeper
busboy
cashier
diswasher v.2 (banquet hall)
short order cook
laborer (bleeding, hot, and pissed by 8am on the first day)
house painter v.1
warehouse worker
house painter v.2
house painter v.3
intern to artist (no pay)
waiter v.1
waiter v.2
waiter v.3
waiter v.4
scenery painter
intern (no pay to designer)


Sounds like me a little bit...too many shit jobs to get through undergrad...it all worked out eventually.

[hillbilly]

yeah Thuggish that was the pt i guess. it all works out.

i'm a freelance web desginer and illustrator here in NY. lucky enough to work from home and probably spend too much time on this board now as a result lol.

oh well good to hear from you guys. i'm heading out to find some fun!

later

[Thuggish_Intellect]

yeah Thuggish that was the pt i guess. it all works out.

i'm a freelance web desginer and illustrator here in NY. lucky enough to work from home and probably spend too much time on this board now as a result lol.

oh well good to hear from you guys. i'm heading out to find some fun!

later


...I envy you NY cats...

[phungu2]

dam hillbilly,
what are you doing now (job)?

he's escorting.

J/K

[hillbilly]

i wish! meow home alone :cry: haha haha. that's how it works right?

[lucx]

There are no poor escorts and no poor Johns... as i see it...
if someone do something that can cause std he can only blame himself...
not anyone else...
there's no justification...
we are in 2004 and the only time you get a std and you are not to blame is when you are raped...
if you do risky sex you know what you do...
that's all, as i see it...
you go with an escort and want unprotected sex: well.. you are the one at risk and you'll pay the conseguences...
you are an escort and want to get an extra 100 $ doing unprotected sex: same thing...

i'm open to discuss this... but i'm quite sure of what i say...

[TexasTman]

attention ding-a-lings:

Having protected sex only improves the chances that you won't get an STD. It does not ensure that you won't get one!

It is quite possible to get HIV even if you do use a condom.

[GroobySteven]

Texasman - now sure where you get your facts from but it's highly improbable of catching HIV when wearing a condom unless it breaks.
Repeat - HIGHLY IMPROBABLE.
Let's now start scare-mongering for the hell of it.
This is what I'd expect of the Christian right!
seanchai

[GroobySteven]

Texasman - now sure where you get your facts from but it's highly improbable of catching HIV when wearing a condom unless it breaks.
Repeat - HIGHLY IMPROBABLE.
Let's now start scare-mongering for the hell of it.
This is what I'd expect of the Christian right!
seanchai

[Felicia Katt]

attention ding-a-lings:

Having protected sex only improves the chances that you won't get an STD. It does not ensure that you won't get one!

It is quite possible to get HIV even if you do use a condom.

I hate for my second post to be a negative one as well, but you are positively wrong on the risks of becoming HIV positive while using a condom.

according to an expert at Columbia Univ:

"a latex condom that is used throughout sex and remains intact should provide total protection against HIV... The bottom line is that correct condom use GREATLY reduces the odds of HIV transmission. "

even if the condom were to break, or or otherwise malfunction (ie if you were to screw and screw up), that same expert had this to say:

"Exposure does not equal transmission/infection. In fact, the odds of transmission in one sexual encounter with an HIV infected person are much lower than many people expect. Studies have shown the odds (for the insertive partner) to be as low as 1% per act. "

so, you take nearly 100 per cent protection and you multiply that by the one chance in 100, and you end up with lottery style odds. something way way in excess of 10,000 to one.

In other words, it is possible, but then anything is possible. Its possible that Vicki and Allanah will knock on your door later tonite, with a pizza. But is that "quite possible" ie likely? No.



ok, claws in (again)

meow

[Thuggish_Intellect]

"a latex condom that is used throughout sex and remains intact should provide total protection against HIV..."Exposure does not equal transmission/infection...In other words, it is possible, but then anything is possible.


Condoms break...all bets are off...even the most minimal probability affects that unlucky bastard who falls in the .001% range...scaled with the likely pool of "clients" which isn't that large a number on the grand scale of things, I think those odds would change a bit.

Nonetheless...a fools solice is an oasis of ignorance...

[Felicia Katt]

Condoms break...all bets are off...

are you a betting man? the rate of condom failure is between 2 and 6 per cent. multiply that by the 1 per cent chance of infection and you get odds of 5000 to 1 or so. Russian Roulette the odds are 6 to 1. Regular Roulette 42 to 1. Odds of dying in a car crash 100 to 1. Odds of dying due to some sort of transporation accident 78 to 1 Odds of being murdered 300 to 1 Odds of dying in a fire arms accident 2500 to 1. Odds of being hit by a comet or asteroid 20,000 to 1. I don't know what the odds are for being hit by a comet in your car while driving to the firing range might be, but the point here is that the risks are relatively low. You'd come home from Vegas broke every time if you played on a roulette wheel with 100 times as many numbers.

keep in mind here also that the majority of failures are caused by human errors. so read and follow the directions on the condom packaging and pay attention to expiration dates and you can tilt the odds even more in your favor.

No one here is saying that you shouldn't use discretion in your choice of a partner. And no one here is saying that it woudn't be better if people were more forthcoming to their partners. In an ideal world, everyone is a good driver. My car will still have airbags and I'm still going to wear a seat belt and so are my passengers


Nonetheless...a fools solice is an oasis of ignorance...

claws out

maybe you didn't mean that as insult. but its hard to construe it any other way. there was nothing foolish, or ignorant about my post. I provided facts and figures . the foolish post was the one that misstated the remote as likely. an ignorant one would be one that allowed the misstatement to stand.


by the way, its solace, not solice

claws in

meow

[Vicki Richter]

Just keep in mind, you said the "insertive partner" or the top as it were. A lot of these guys are bottoms. What is the risk of the insertee partner? Come on statistics cat girl. Out with it.

[Vicki Richter]

http://www.natap.org/2000/7thcroi/16rpt2700.html

and a quote which you might not like:

"Oral sex transmission may be over-reported. However, even with strigent criteria for classification, oral risk transmission represented 6.6% of infections in our study of primary HIV. Despite lower transmission risk, oral sex may be an important mode of HIV transmission due to its frequency. "

[Vicki Richter]

OK one more.

http://www.utmb.edu/newsroom/news_briefs/AIDS_saliva.htm

It's all very informative stuff.

[Felicia Katt]

its seems the Jury is still out on the relative risks of oral sex. There are some studies, such as the ones Vicki correctly cites, that suggest oral sex is a significant part of the tranmission cycle. Other sources (see generally http://gay.com/health/safetyzone/?sernum=1869) point out some potential shortcomings ( no pun intended) of these studies. and support that the consensus is that the risk of getting HIV from oral sex is "very, very, very, very, very low".

BUT

you can still get other STDs. so, better safe than sorry. Better Latex then never :)

meow

[Felicia Katt]

Just keep in mind, you said the "insertive partner" or the top as it were. A lot of these guys are bottoms. What is the risk of the insertee partner? Come on statistics cat girl. Out with it.

Statistics aren't as much fun as a ball of yarn but the relative risks for activities can be found here:

http://hivinsite.ucsf.edu/InSite.jsp?doc=2098.4396&page=pr-04-02

to address the specific question, the receptive or bottom partners odds are less than one in 100 (.82 %)when having unprotected sex with an HIV positive partner. By my cat-culations, it works out to roughly 4 times more probable than for the insertive or top partner.

meow

[Ecstatic]

Just keep in mind, you said the "insertive partner" or the top as it were. A lot of these guys are bottoms. What is the risk of the insertee partner? Come on statistics cat girl. Out with it.

Statistics aren't as much fun as a ball of yarn but the relative risks for activities can be found here:

http://hivinsite.ucsf.edu/InSite.jsp?doc=2098.4396&page=pr-04-02

to address the specific question, the receptive or bottom partners odds are less than one in 100 (.82 %)when having unprotected sex with an HIV positive partner. By my cat-culations, it works out to roughly 4 times more probable than for the insertive or top partner.

meow
Interesting exchange of stats there, Vicki and Felicia. Here's a bit of a corrollary question: given the 4x (or so) lower risk of being the insertive partner rather than the insertee partner, coupled with the number of clients a provider sees in a week, do you think that this is a factor in the number of girls who prefer topping? (Because it reduces their risk of exposure to HIV and STDs?) Or is it simpy a matter of preference, and damn the torpedoes? (Maybe this question belongs in the top v. bottom thread, but I'm wondering in the larger sense how many providers consider the statistical evidence.)

PS: I love the quip "not as much fun as a ball of yarn." Nice one.

[AllanahStarrNYC]

Thanks Texas
For enlightening me on the reasons why I do what I do-
Very Original
Your insight is much appreciated-

And since I do not hold a "real" job, I don't own a "real" company, and I don't throw organize "real" parties
I'll just go chase the Rabbit with Alice

Quelle horreur!

[Felicia Katt]

hear hear Allahah. what is with these guys? They resent that girls are escorts but they still are on here? would they be hanging out on this board if if was the TS accountants board? or the Hung Realtors? I doubt it

meow

[TexasTman]

Felicia, your comment implies a FALSE assumption that all t-girls are escorts. That is simply not a true statement.

I personally have nothing against escorts at all. I was merely suggesting that escorts ought to take a little more responsiblity in the disclosure of any known STDs.

[Toro]

some of the posts on here are pathetic.

as far as full disclosure goes, how many of the freaked out men complaining tell your wives or next sex partner what you did with the transsexual escort you saw on your last trip wherever? yet you expect that escort to tell you her full medical history? it's so fucking hypocritical.

stop whining, wrap your dick and be true to yourself.

[Toro]

some of the posts on here are pathetic.

as far as full disclosure goes, how many of the freaked out men complaining tell your wives or next sex partner what you did with the transsexual escort you saw on your last trip wherever? yet you expect that escort to tell you her full medical history? it's so fucking hypocritical.

stop whining, wrap your dick and be true to yourself.

[Felicia Katt]

Felicia, your comment implies a FALSE assumption that all t-girls are escorts. That is simply not a true statement.

I personally have nothing against escorts at all. I was merely suggesting that escorts ought to take a little more responsiblity in the disclosure of any known STDs.

but here is what you originally wrote, and they don't jibe

Allanah,

boo hoo hoo, the poor escorts. we guys don't know what it is like for you escorts! boo hoo! BIG deal. It is the life that you have chosen or maybe it is the life that chose you, it doesn't make any difference. You always act like a t-girl is so limited in her choices that she has to resort to escorting. What a ridiculous premise. You choose that life because you want it for all sorts of different reasons: 1. it is easy, 2. it is easy money, 3. it is more money than you can make at a "real" job, 4. it allows you to be self-employed. I don't care about the reason. The fact remains that escorts COULD do other things. .

maybe its just me, but that sure suggests that you have some issues with escorting.

I know my post didn't presume all ts's are escorts. but the fact is, almost all the TS's you are talking about/with here are escorts, or have another "adult job". Its pretty hypocritical to be posting on a site like this if you think they should be doing something else. like I said, how active is the TS Tollbooth Operator's site right now. I think the Hung Cleaning Lady site domain name is wide open

you also said this :

Your wanting (demanding) that the burden of preventing the spread of STD's falls squarely on the shoulders of the trick is absolute crap. Grow up and take some responsibility.



Thats exactly what Allanah said.:

If you partake in any part of the sex business, wether it be as a customer or as a worker, you should know what risks you take and take precautions.
Simple as that. Some clients will never be honest about their health and some girls as well. That is life, like it or not.

She never said it was just the client's burden. Everyone is responsible

meow

[TexasTman]

Felicia,

I was saying that I do not feel sorry for escorts. How they make their money and what they do is their business (except when they knowingly infect or try to infect another human). I just don't want to hear all the whining.

[Thuggish_Intellect]

some of the posts on here are pathetic.

as far as full disclosure goes, how many of the freaked out men complaining tell your wives or next sex partner what you did with the transsexual escort you saw on your last trip wherever? yet you expect that escort to tell you her full medical history? it's so fucking hypocritical.

stop whining, wrap your dick and be true to yourself.


that I should be worried about going after...lol

[Toro]

some of the posts on here are pathetic.


stop whining, wrap your dick and be true to yourself.


that I should be worried about going after...lol

First of all, let me just break it down in terms you'll understand: I know you are but what am I? Second - look how defensive you got are. I think you are worrying about what you've done in the past. But did you worry the same way after you hooked up with gg's in the past? Did you get their medical histories on paper, too? Did you believe them if they just told you they were STD-free? Or are you married - and visiting escorts, taking risks that you'd kill your wife for taking on you? Like I said - stop whining and wrap your dick - it's the least you can do.

No, I am definitely not the guy you should worry about following. I'm just telling you something you probably don't want to hear. If you play in the trade, you're upping your risk of catching a disease. But considering your remark about condoms breaking and 'some discretion' getting into the blood supply, unless you test yourself after every piece of strange you get - escort or woman (or for you maybe even man) on the street - how do you know that YOU aren't the one spreading the disease into the escort community, to your wife, or whoever? That's another reason why you are a hypocrite. And it's not just HIV you need to worry about, Mr. Thuggish Ruggish Rubbish - don't forget about your old pal herpes, or Hepatitis - both of which you can get just from kissing...forget about going raw in a bottom sort of way, which you might do but I don't

Yes - the trade should be regulated and girls should have the luxury of having medical benefits and free testing monthly, like they do in Amsterdam. But it's not. So the fast food/meat analogies don't apply, or any of that BS. I am not sure what it was I said that struck the nerve in you, personally, but apparently you should be worried about your own actions. I am already comfortable with my own level of safety.

[Cobra78]

Wow. Excellent topics on here. Maybe they get a little out of hand, but democracy is never a pretty thing.

I've never been an escort, though I've known my fair share, both men, women, and transexuals so I'll keep my mouth shut (no pun intended) on the ethics of escorting and safe sex.

But I will say this: I'm sure the government has long already found a cure, or at least a vaccine for HIV, as well as cancer and a host of other diseases. If it wasn't for HMOs and the greedy f***ers in DC, all these issues would be silenced. The power to change the world may be in the hands of each and every one of us, but if the knowledge, if the TRUTH is kept from us, we truly are the blind leading the blind. The healthcare industry simpy has too much money to make off hospital visits and perscription medication to let these cures out to the public. They benefit from disease. And as long as we let these S.O.B.s stay in power nothing will ever change.

Maybe I'm just a conspiracy nut, but to me it makes no sense for the rabbit to get mad at the wolf because the rabbit got shot by the hunter. We should all come together, str8 and gay, left wing and right wing, white and black and focus our energy on the ones who are really responsible for death, pain and misery in this country...politicians.