Illegal downloads of Tgirl porn, you views please

[big_a]

This question is mainly pointed towards the girls and the produces of Tgirl material, but I know most people'll have a view on this topic. You can't help but notice that tgirl porn just about every these days via bittorrent (be it a public or private trackers) sites or on rapidshare. I know some of the guys here get some of there material from these site. I've seen links for rapidshare and I myself have posted a link for the latest upload of Mariana Cordoba clip on purTnA, but I wondered what everyone thought. So, is downloading illegal tgirl porn (doesn't have to be tgirl porn, could be any porn) undermining the adult industry or is illegal downloading expected seeing as it so readily available? Come to think of it, there's more adult based websites than anything else on the internet.

[BeardedOne]

I do some work with a dotcom as a management consultant/bookkeeper/guy Friday and they, in turn, have been exploring net porn as another avenue of business (Click below, please :D ) so it is in my best interest to encourage you to buy now and buy lots.

Go on, right now. Click away! 8)

OK, so it's not my greatest sales pitch. :lol:

Anyway, the chief technogeek at the company once pointed out that "Porn was the impetus for high-speed internet" and I know he's right because, aside from porn (And porn forums), I do very little else on this thing (Oh, there's the comics, like Misfile and Ozy & Millie, both highly recommended, and AdCritic - 'All commercials, all the time' - to add a bit of balance).

And yah, my bad, I grab shit off of RapidShare and PTnA, etc. because I am both a cheap bastard and at a very low ebb in my finances right now. When finances improve, I'll be back to ordering DVDs and joining the occasional gurl's site to support both my habit and the industry that feeds it.

I s'pose that I, and all the other pervs out there, could just download it all for free from the Napster of the titty and bum set, but eventually we'd have it all and the producers and talent will have gone off to other things. That will leave us with 'new content' like the 6'3", 300#, buck-toothed wife of the Oklahoma sheriff that is so in the news right now (People say it's disgusting because it's porn while they =really= mean it's disgusting because of the particular subject =in= the porn).

Share all you like, but support the people that put it in front of your eyeballs in the first place. Else you'll be left wankin' to reruns of Gilligan's Island instead of the hot new babes that seanchai, Allanah, DJ, Gia, Ecstatic and (In some small way) myself bring to a monitor near you.

Now go! Click forth and multiply! :peanutbutter

[JohnnyWalkerBlackLabel]

lol, the whole porn industry is illegal (in one way or another)

[GroobySteven]

lol, the whole porn industry is illegal (in one way or another)

How do you figure that one out?
seanchai

[GroobySteven]

This question is mainly pointed towards the girls and the produces of Tgirl material, but I know most people'll have a view on this topic. You can't help but notice that tgirl porn just about every these days via bittorrent (be it a public or private trackers) sites or on rapidshare. I know some of the guys here get some of there material from these site. I've seen links for rapidshare and I myself have posted a link for the latest upload of Mariana Cordoba clip on purTnA, but I wondered what everyone thought. So, is downloading illegal tgirl porn (doesn't have to be tgirl porn, could be any porn) undermining the adult industry or is illegal downloading expected seeing as it so readily available? Come to think of it, there's more adult based websites than anything else on the internet.

We all download porn for free the same as we've all downloaded music for free and probably at some point watched a pirate video. It's illegal and it hurts the industry and it sucks as an owner but nothing is going to stop it completely.
However, if everybody was doing it to all of the content out there then there simply would be no budget to shoot new material and less money would go back into the industry. My personal views, if hobbyists are swapping sets with each other then I'm not that particularly interested in tracking it down but if other websites are making money from complete sets of images/content of mine then I'm going to be pissed off. No matter which way you look at it, free sites like yahoo groups are making money from stolen adult content and sites like rapidshare are also cashing in on stolen content (I think there will be a class action at some point against sites like this but unlikely it will come from the adult industry as most people aren't prepared to work together on these sort of instances).
I've had to close down pay sites which have stolen our content and requested that sites like this show on a set amount of content (remember sites like Hung Angels survive only because of the paysites and making an affiliate sale to a site or DVD company.

I think the internet has a mass of free content on it, you have to work for it to find it sometimes but paying $25 for a good website is incredible value. A magazine is $10 (or more) for 5-8 photosets of about 20 pics, look at the amount of content updated in a month on a website!

So if you're a surfer enjoy the free porn but if you never join a site, never buy a DVD or put any money back into the industry then you're going to contribute to cheaper more generic porn and less original content with fresh girls, so consider paying every now and again.
seanchai

[blahblahblah]

Oh, no! I've got a much better idea:

Just continue to download free porn clips from the Internet, and all
that money that you are patriotically supposed to put back in the
"industry", please put it in Unicef instead. Think of all the hungry
children on this globe.

Amen.

[DJ_Asia]

This question is mainly pointed towards the girls and the produces of Tgirl material, but I know most people'll have a view on this topic. You can't help but notice that tgirl porn just about every these days via bittorrent (be it a public or private trackers) sites or on rapidshare. I know some of the guys here get some of there material from these site. I've seen links for rapidshare and I myself have posted a link for the latest upload of Mariana Cordoba clip on purTnA, but I wondered what everyone thought. So, is downloading illegal tgirl porn (doesn't have to be tgirl porn, could be any porn) undermining the adult industry or is illegal downloading expected seeing as it so readily available? Come to think of it, there's more adult based websites than anything else on the internet.

We all download porn for free the same as we've all downloaded music for free and probably at some point watched a pirate video. It's illegal and it hurts the industry and it sucks as an owner but nothing is going to stop it completely.
However, if everybody was doing it to all of the content out there then there simply would be no budget to shoot new material and less money would go back into the industry. My personal views, if hobbyists are swapping sets with each other then I'm not that particularly interested in tracking it down but if other websites are making money from complete sets of images/content of mine then I'm going to be pissed off. No matter which way you look at it, free sites like yahoo groups are making money from stolen adult content and sites like rapidshare are also cashing in on stolen content (I think there will be a class action at some point against sites like this but unlikely it will come from the adult industry as most people aren't prepared to work together on these sort of instances).
I've had to close down pay sites which have stolen our content and requested that sites like this show on a set amount of content (remember sites like Hung Angels survive only because of the paysites and making an affiliate sale to a site or DVD company.

I think the internet has a mass of free content on it, you have to work for it to find it sometimes but paying $25 for a good website is incredible value. A magazine is $10 (or more) for 5-8 photosets of about 20 pics, look at the amount of content updated in a month on a website!

So if you're a surfer enjoy the free porn but if you never join a site, never buy a DVD or put any money back into the industry then you're going to contribute to cheaper more generic porn and less original content with fresh girls, so consider paying every now and again.
seanchai

Yeah what he said...

I might also add that most guys havent a marginal clue the time,effort and cost we website owners put out each month.Now of course thats not gonna stop anybody from getting free porn,but it further illustrates the points Seanchai made.

[suckseed]

I don't really understand how Yahoo and MSN make money off of free email and groups. I've used them for years and never bought anything from their sponsors.

[GroobySteven]

I don't really understand how Yahoo and MSN make money off of free email and groups. I've used them for years and never bought anything from their sponsors.

Well that's just a silly comment.
So you don't buy anything but why do you think they post those advertisements over all of yahoo for fun or because corporations are paying them based on their amount of traffic and surfers.
Please think before you speak.
seanchai

[GroobySteven]

Oh, no! I've got a much better idea:

Just continue to download free porn clips from the Internet, and all
that money that you are patriotically supposed to put back in the
"industry", please put it in Unicef instead. Think of all the hungry
children on this globe.

Amen.

Maybe you should stop having idiotic ideas.
If you'd bothered to check my website at http://www.grooby.com you'd see the charities which we support with budgets from the money that PAYING SUBSCRIBERS send in. UNICEF which I like a lot is not one of them. Instead I choose to give money to:
ASACP - Association of Sites Advocating Child Protection.
ICRC - International Red Cross and Red Crescent Movement.
Amnesty International.
Doctors Without Borders.
ECPAT (elimination of child sex trafficking).
The Initiative Against Sexual Trafficking.

Get off your high horse and take a look at those sites from grooby.com.

There wouldn't be any free stuff to download if their weren't people who were paying for this content and helping keep the industry alive.

...and you're doing what exactly to help the "starving children"?
seanchai

[blahblahblah]

Oh, no! I've got a much better idea:

Just continue to download free porn clips from the Internet, and all
that money that you are patriotically supposed to put back in the
"industry", please put it in Unicef instead. Think of all the hungry
children on this globe.

Amen.

Maybe you should stop having idiotic ideas.
If you'd bothered to check my website at http://www.grooby.com you'd see the charities which we support with budgets from the money that PAYING SUBSCRIBERS send in. UNICEF which I like a lot is not one of them. Instead I choose to give money to:
ASACP - Association of Sites Advocating Child Protection.
ICRC - International Red Cross and Red Crescent Movement.
Amnesty International.
Doctors Without Borders.
ECPAT (elimination of child sex trafficking).
The Initiative Against Sexual Trafficking.

Get off your high horse and take a look at those sites from grooby.com.

There wouldn't be any free stuff to download if their weren't people who were paying for this content and helping keep the industry alive.

...and you're doing what exactly to help the "starving children"?
seanchai

hehe..

Sure. You probably added it to your site after my
post or something :-)

Ok, let's slightly modify my statement and say it in this way:

Just continue to download free porn clips from the Internet, and all
that money that you are patriotically supposed to put back in the
"industry", please put it in Unicef instead. Think of all the hungry
children on this globe. Your money, ALONG with the money from Senchi's dirty budget would contribute alot.....How about that? Is that better?

My horses will always be high..

[Avenged01]

I agree that is is damaging to the industry but I am currently back home with my parents at the moment so I cant just order DVD's through the post incase the wrong person accidently opens it!!

Also I don't have a credit card so I cant order stuff online.

Therefore I have to illegally download my porn at the moment.

[tgirlkaren]

As has been said by Seanchia, we are never going to stop the free downloads out there, as models and webmasters we post free pics for promo anyway, but! it does piss me off when I see full sets of my member only pics posted on other websites, wouldn't be so bad if there was a link back to my site, Ok thankfully this does not happen very often.

So guys download the free stuff , but DO SUPPORT the models who have their own websites and webmasters like Seanchia who bring you the big collections, become a member of our sites once in a while.

Karen
xx

www.alisonfaraday.com New website live next week!

[timxxx]

Like with the argument about the illegal download of music & movies, it's based on the simplistic falsehood, that if people were not illegal downloading they would be supporting the 'industry' by paying for the stuff they download. In my experice with me & my friends those of us that download the most music & movies, also BUY the most movies & music. As with a lot males l suffer from the affliction
described by Nick Hornby in his novel High Fidelity, to collect things. Therefore l have a large music, porn, games, comics & films collection (sad l know & l do have girlfriend)

I'd ague that free & illegal downloads help the industry, I used to check the free content (l don't join pay websites, l prefer my porn on DVD) on shemaleyum before they started censor it.
That helped fuelled my obsession (I’m a member HA) for Tgirls.And I’d go out & buy DVD’s. In the last five weeks this site(HA) was been directly responable for me buying two DVD’s(Buddy wood's Shemale School Girls & Wendy's wild shemale #4, I wanted to see Janira a girl that posted her picture)I’m not going to wait for someone to maybe upload it to a torrent site. In fact I don't download stuff l know I’m going to buy.

I agree with Seanchai that we should put money back in the 'industry' but not out guilt to an that 'industry' sometimes treats customs as suckers or mugs with crap content. If your DVD’s or websites are good & reasonable price enough people will pay.

p.s Could someone in the ‘industry' explain to me why a DVD that maybe cost $50,000 to make & market still cost more than a Lord Of The Rings DVD to buy.

[BeardedOne]

p.s Could someone in the ‘industry' explain to me why a DVD that maybe cost $50,000 to make & market still cost more than a Lord Of The Rings DVD to buy.

That's basic suppy side economics. If you produce a kazillion of something and distrbute it through a bazillion outlets, it naturally costs less per piece because it is making more per volume of sales.

OTOH, if you only produce a few thousand (Or hundred) of an item and it is only salable through a handful of outlets, then it will naturally cost more at the retail level.

The Wizard of Speed and Time cost $1mil to produce and distribute, but the viddie was $99 retail. At the same time, Batman cost something on the order of $30mil and the viddie cost $19.95 (Or less, on special). The one had minimal distribution of a small number of copies (I think it was only enough to recoup the production costs, which they failed to do) while the other flooded the shelves of viddie stores, Wally Mart, malls, etc.


I'd ague that free & illegal downloads help the industry, I used to check the free content

That's why some of the producers wisely allow limited (Emphasis on the 'limited') posting of images from their sites so long as the images and branding aren't modified. Whenever I got a nice image that tweaked my interest I could see the site brand in the corner and would go and check it out. This lead to the occasional site membership or viddie purchase. When I was selling comic books at shows I had a pretty lax policy as regards browsers at the booth (While other dealers would chase people away if they lingered too long) and even gave away the occasional issue if someone looked like they were undecided on a purchase of one of the bigger sets. Nine out of ten times these people did buy something and many became regular customers. I'm sure they're still reading 'free' comics at their local newsstands to this day, but I know how many books they also bought.

[GroobySteven]

Oh, no! I've got a much better idea:

Just continue to download free porn clips from the Internet, and all
that money that you are patriotically supposed to put back in the
"industry", please put it in Unicef instead. Think of all the hungry
children on this globe.

Amen.

Maybe you should stop having idiotic ideas.
If you'd bothered to check my website at http://www.grooby.com you'd see the charities which we support with budgets from the money that PAYING SUBSCRIBERS send in. UNICEF which I like a lot is not one of them. Instead I choose to give money to:
ASACP - Association of Sites Advocating Child Protection.
ICRC - International Red Cross and Red Crescent Movement.
Amnesty International.
Doctors Without Borders.
ECPAT (elimination of child sex trafficking).
The Initiative Against Sexual Trafficking.

Get off your high horse and take a look at those sites from grooby.com.

There wouldn't be any free stuff to download if their weren't people who were paying for this content and helping keep the industry alive.

...and you're doing what exactly to help the "starving children"?
seanchai

hehe..

Sure. You probably added it to your site after my
post or something :-)

Ok, let's slightly modify my statement and say it in this way:

Just continue to download free porn clips from the Internet, and all
that money that you are patriotically supposed to put back in the
"industry", please put it in Unicef instead. Think of all the hungry
children on this globe. Your money, ALONG with the money from Senchi's dirty budget would contribute alot.....How about that? Is that better?

My horses will always be high..

No it's still a retarded post which doesn't make any sense. Why don't you stop buying cable TV and give it all to charity, why don't you stop buying beer and give it all to charity, etc?
"I probably added it after your post" - don't tar me with the same brush as yourself and what you may do. A pretty low post and thing to say, as I stated, you do what to help the "starving children"? Don't bother to answer, it's moot.
seanchai

[GroobySteven]

Like with the argument about the illegal download of music & movies, it's based on the simplistic falsehood, that if people were not illegal downloading they would be supporting the 'industry' by paying for the stuff they download. In my experice with me & my friends those of us that download the most music & movies, also BUY the most movies & music. As with a lot males l suffer from the affliction
described by Nick Hornby in his novel High Fidelity, to collect things. Therefore l have a large music, porn, games, comics & films collection (sad l know & l do have girlfriend)

I'd ague that free & illegal downloads help the industry, I used to check the free content (l don't join pay websites, l prefer my porn on DVD) on shemaleyum before they started censor it.
That helped fuelled my obsession (I’m a member HA) for Tgirls.

I agree with that and it's the reason we release a lot of our content for promotion on websites like this and elsewhere which is pretty much what I stated. However, when somebody steals complete sets in order to make money, or posts them on websites that make money indirectly, then it is harmful to the industry as those sites aren't the producers so the money doesn't get back into the industry, the models or the photographers.

Why does a product which costs $50k cost more than "Lord of the Rings"? I think"bearded one" answered this fully but let me give you some numbers for the adult industry.
When all is said and done, a release like Buddy Wood's DVD costs about $17k to get out in the stores. That includes model fees, design and production of the DVD/cover but not advertising.
If a title sells through our distributor they take 30% - and often the wholesale price is $12-$15 depending on how many the retailer takes. So from that sell we only get $8-$10 a piece. This is why we try and push through http://www.shemale-video-direct.com at $24.99 as it's our own company and direct sale and through http://www.groobyvod.com.

We're not selling $100,000's of an item, it takes up to a year for a title to break even. There simply isn't enough DVD buyers of an already flooded adult market out there. A couple of years ago I was getting taken around Evil Angel's office and the manager there Jeff give me some numbers of Joey Silvera's releases ... over a lifetime of a Silvera shemale DVD they only sell numbers in the low tens of thousands - worldwide. I had no idea it would be so low and expected in to the 100,000's range.
So charging $24.99 is a matter of economics. If we sold 100,000 of the title in the first year of release, we could charge $3 a release and happily make a profit.
seanchai

[blahblahblah]

No it's still a retarded post which doesn't make any sense. Why don't you stop buying cable TV and give it all to charity, why don't you stop buying beer and give it all to charity, etc?
"I probably added it after your post" - don't tar me with the same brush as yourself and what you may do. A pretty low post and thing to say, as I stated, you do what to help the "starving children"? Don't bother to answer, it's moot.
seanchai

Take it easy, boy!

Having cable TV is a normal thing that belongs to civilised people. It's an important
source of information. But, on the other side, if you subscribe on a porn site, that
is a sign that there's something wrong with you. Besides that, it's pretty much stupid
and unneccessary nowadays, considering the amount of free sources that provide pornographic
material that is not even ilegal. More than enough for a normal human being, right?

My charity: Well, approximately $100 each month that goes somewhere to a child placed in
south america, and about as much to an african child in Darfur. I could of course subscribe
to some porn for that money, but it feels wrong to do that. Why should i make a jerk as you
more rich? It's much better to give a pure child some food, clothes and possibility to go to
school instead.

BR

[GroobySteven]

Having cable TV is a normal thing that belongs to civilised people. It's an important
source of information. You can get all the same information on the internet for free and the BBC/CNN news is available free also - buying cable you're paying for pure entertainment, the same as an adult site.




But, on the other side, if you subscribe on a porn site, that
is a sign that there's something wrong with you.

Huh? That's a pretty broad statement - most of the people who are on this site have probably subscribed to some adult site, what is wrong with them?



Besides that, it's pretty much stupid
and unneccessary nowadays, considering the amount of free sources that provide pornographic
material that is not even ilegal. More than enough for a normal human being, right?

Obviously not as many people happily pay for site memberships.



My charity: Well, approximately $100 each month that goes somewhere to a child placed in
south america, and about as much to an african child in Darfur.

Jolly good, I'm sure your mighty happy with yourself as am I - however, if you spend any money on personal entertainment then by your pre-stated values you should stop and start helping another "starving child".




I could of course subscribe
to some porn for that money, but it feels wrong to do that. Why should i make a jerk as you more rich?

Oh ok. So scrap everything you've previously said - it's not that you want to give your money to charity or think people are wrong for joining adult sites or even that news isn't for free. It's that you think I'm a jerk and you have jealousy issues about my lifestyle. That's fine, why didnt you come out and say that originally instead of making ridiculous comments and claims. So don't join my websites if you think I'm a jerk, I wouldn't pay money to a company I didn't believe provided good service either and had personal issues with the owner (although jealousy would never come into it). Please however, don't clump all website owners into the same "jerk" category as you would I, Allanah Starr, Jennifer English, Krissy, Sexy Jade, Joanna Jet, Vicki Richter, etc - there are many really nice website owners out there and they're not ALL jerks so if you can get over you inferiority complex you might want to join one of their sites and contribute back into an industry you obviously enjoy.



It's much better to give a pure child some food, clothes and possibility to go to
school instead.


I agree but unless your going to become a monk or devote every penny that you'd normally spend on something entertaining, something that pleasures you or something you simply enjoy but isn't necessary, then you are a hypocrit, as you've already shown.
You should also leave this site, it makes money from my company and helps my company make money, just by you being here is helping us both.
Take it easy, son - think before you speak, it will serve you well.

seanchai

[big_a]

Where the fuck did the idea of giving money to charity come from? All I wanted to know was if downloading tgirl porn off torrent sites and rapishare was hurting the industry and it looks as though this thread has gotten out of hand. I know forums are for people to voice their own opinion but this is stupid. Hey, without seanchai you'd not have half the models that post threads here. No allanah, No joanna Jet, No danielle foxxx, none of them.... (I'm using this star's names as a reference point, perhaps he never found any of them :))

I really ort to ask for this thread to be killed. I like discussion, but petty arguing isn't what I wanted.


On a personal note: seanchai, I buy your produces cos of there quailty. I've looked at shemaleyum for the past 9 yrs, ever since it started, and I can't fault the fantastic people that you've got working for you, the fresh faced models your guys keep find wk after wk. oh yeah and the fact that grooby is run by an ENGLISH BLOKE TOO:lol:. Lad, I'll keep buying your films and looking at your site no matter what

[blckhaze]

me myself i do alot of buying, and downloading free stuff. Alot of the time you get the free stuff because a stie has to cater to a broad taste to have as many customers as possible, but you as a consumer only want maybe 3 or 4 sets out of 10. same thing goes for music and some movies. I might liek one or two song off a new CD, but dont liek the whole cd enough to spend $10-$15 for it. I see where seanchai doesnt mind free contant as long as noone make a profit of his stuff. with out a preview or sample floatign around, you might lose a potential audience.

[greenkb]

People argue about the price of DVD's. Hey, you guys in the US, you've got it made. In the UK, you pay between £25 and £35 per film (looking up exchange rate on xe.com, thats between $46.63 and $65. 28 for each film.) for old and new releases.


When all is said and done, a release like Buddy Wood's DVD costs about $17k to get out in the stores. That includes model fees, design and production of the DVD/cover but not advertising.
If a title sells through our distributor they take 30% - and often the wholesale price is $12-$15 depending on how many the retailer takes. So from that sell we only get $8-$10 a piece. This is why we try and push through http://www.shemale-video-direct.com at $24.99 as it's our own company and direct sale and through http://www.groobyvod.com.
We're not selling $100,000's of an item, it takes up to a year for a title to break even. There simply isn't enough DVD buyers of an already flooded adult market out there. A couple of years ago I was getting taken around Evil Angel's office and the manager there Jeff give me some numbers of Joey Silvera's releases ... over a lifetime of a Silvera shemale DVD they only sell numbers in the low tens of thousands - worldwide. I had no idea it would be so low and expected in to the 100,000's range.
So charging $24.99 is a matter of economics. If we sold 100,000 of the title in the first year of release, we could charge $3 a release and happily make a profit.
seanchai
seanchai, I had no idea that it took such a long time to break even. I know its a specialised market, tgirl adult material, but thats ridiculous. If I'd got $17k to give you, I would. :) I'd better start ordering my films direct from you instead, cos I'd rather see the money be in your pocket that some fucker elses. Oh yeah, where did the whole shit about giving to charity thing come from?

[slinky]

Anyway, the chief technogeek at the company once pointed out that "Porn was the impetus for high-speed internet" and I know he's right because, aside from porn (And porn forums), I do very little else on this thing (Oh, there's the comics, like Misfile and Ozy & Millie, both highly recommended, and AdCritic - 'All commercials, all the time' - to add a bit of balance).

Not just broadband, or even the internet, but many of the technologies finding their ways into consumers hands: look at VCRs: what pushed their acceptance was the ability to watch porn at home. Of course, teh great irony is that it killed adult theaters in the process (anyone have any real Adult theaters anywhere near them? I'm not talking about peep booths).

[slinky]

If people knew where much of the money goes that they give to large charities, they might consider buying more porn with that money.

[BeardedOne]

Dammit, this thread got ahead of me. I have to call Florida (Not the whole state, just a little corner of it) I'll post more later.

[Quinn]

Why does a product which costs $50k cost more than "Lord of the Rings"? I think"bearded one" answered this fully but let me give you some numbers for the adult industry.
When all is said and done, a release like Buddy Wood's DVD costs about $17k to get out in the stores. That includes model fees, design and production of the DVD/cover but not advertising.
If a title sells through our distributor they take 30% - and often the wholesale price is $12-$15 depending on how many the retailer takes. So from that sell we only get $8-$10 a piece. This is why we try and push through http://www.shemale-video-direct.com at $24.99 as it's our own company and direct sale and through http://www.groobyvod.com.

We're not selling $100,000's of an item, it takes up to a year for a title to break even. There simply isn't enough DVD buyers of an already flooded adult market out there. A couple of years ago I was getting taken around Evil Angel's office and the manager there Jeff give me some numbers of Joey Silvera's releases ... over a lifetime of a Silvera shemale DVD they only sell numbers in the low tens of thousands - worldwide. I had no idea it would be so low and expected in to the 100,000's range.
So charging $24.99 is a matter of economics. If we sold 100,000 of the title in the first year of release, we could charge $3 a release and happily make a profit.
seanchai

Interesting stuff. I've often wondered about the economics of "shemale porn," particularly given that it, like all sectors of the porn industry, appears to be oversaturated.

-Quinn

[BeardedOne]

If people knew where much of the money goes that they give to large charities, they might consider buying more porn with that money.

That's why I give it to porn. :?

The administrative costs attached to some of the popular charities (Like UNICEF!) are more obscene than the acts that we so like to watch.


Interesting stuff. I've often wondered about the economics of "shemale porn," particularly given that it, like all sectors of the porn industry, appears to be oversaturated.

You =know= that I'm taking notes here.


Where the fuck did the idea of giving money to charity come from?

Because some people want to give money to UNICEF rather than to porn sites and DVD purchases (Not that there's anything wrong with that), and wish to take the high moral ground as a result thereof.

Personally, I do both, because I can multitask. :lol:

[timxxx]

seanchi wrote

(I think there will be a class action at some point against sites like this but unlikely it will come from the adult industry as most people aren't prepared to work together on these sort of instances).

Instead of looking to take on people on the net, which would be like pissing your money away (only your lawyers would get rich) try taking on people who retail your DVDs. I know if this anywhere else . But in the U.K there is a practice called exchaning.Where you buy an DVD £25 - £35 & watch it, then take it back and the retailer give £10 or £15 off anther DVD, which means the retailer can sell the same DVD over & over again. Which must piss off you producers

Quinn wrote

Interesting stuff. I've often wondered about the economics of "shemale porn," particularly given that it, like all sectors of the porn industry, appears to be oversaturated

oversaturated with shit! l could build a wall with the sub stranded crap that l have bought, I swear it must cost more to shoot the picture on the box covers than to make some films.


p.s I keep reading that the porn biz is a billon dollar biz bigger than Hollywood. And Shemale porn is one of the fastest growing sectors in it. So were does the money go, which of you guys are driving the Ferraris & Bentleys.

[GroobySteven]

p.s I keep reading that the porn biz is a billon dollar biz bigger than Hollywood. And Shemale porn is one of the fastest growing sectors in it. So were does the money go, which of you guys are driving the Ferraris & Bentleys.

Yeah I'd like to know who those guys are, we've got to settle with Aston Martin's and Jaguars.... :-(

seanchai

[RubyTS]

i find this topic funny, considering that BASICALLY, u guys use this site as a way to exchange stuff from PAID sites lol. I mean i guess it's cool that some people have enuf of a conscience to think about the fact that you could potentially be taking $ outta pocket from ppl by file sharing and so forth.... but thats not gonna stop ne1 lol. Shyt i wish there was a forum like this for hung males lol i'd be downloading and surfing for days without a second thought!

[blahblahblah]

Oh ok. So scrap everything you've previously said - it's not that you want to give your money to charity or think people are wrong for joining adult sites or even that news isn't for free. It's that you think I'm a jerk and you have jealousy issues about my lifestyle. That's fine, why didnt you come out and say that originally instead of making ridiculous comments and claims. So don't join my websites if you think I'm a jerk, I wouldn't pay money to a company I didn't believe provided good service either and had personal issues with the owner (although jealousy would never come into it). Please however, don't clump all website owners into the same "jerk" category as you would I, Allanah Starr, Jennifer English, Krissy, Sexy Jade, Joanna Jet, Vicki Richter, etc - there are many really nice website owners out there and they're not ALL jerks so if you can get over you inferiority complex you might want to join one of their sites and contribute back into an industry you obviously enjoy.seanchai

Hi Seanchai!

Let me just clarify one thing:

When people consider you being a jerk, most often they do not automatically have
a feeling of jealousy against you. Some people do that, but some not. That's something
you'll have to learn. Like me, for example: There is no reason in the world for me to feel
jealous toward you, especially not the economical one. I make a lot of money, money is
relatively speaking not an issue for me, and the best of all is that i do not need to do
some ass-to-mouth tricks or similar methods in order to achieve that. I use some other,
much higher and generally better human skills in order to do that.

Why i think you are a jerk (but only in this context):

Since the begining of the human kind, some people have been more skillful than other. And
in general we can classify them into 3 groups in regards to this very conversation between
us (of course, i'm speaking here about physically and mentaly relatively healthy people):

1. People that know how to use their brains in order to achieve better living and higher social status.
This kind of people are often most superior, often called the "top of the hill".

2. People that do not know how to use their brains, but who in spite of that have developed good physical skills.
This kind of people use the power of their bodies to make their living. Construction workers, cleaners,
etc.. Common people that often have many social and economical issues, but who struggle through
their lives in their ways and often succeed to make a relatively good living worth a good human being.
Quite often, they even manage to become relatively wealthy, but it takes them a lot of effort.

3. People that do not know how to use their brains, and do not have enough physical skills other than
nice looking bodies, OR (this is important) people not accepted by the society for some reasons, the
people who do not get enough economical and all other kind of help from the society in order to get rid of their
(often huge) personal problems. In order to make their living, they simply have to sell their souls and
their boides to a broad audience in a very low and miserable way. I see them as some kind of society victims,
and i personally feel sorry about this kind of people.

You, surprisingly enough, probably could be placed close to the group #1. You use your brain, you've got good web
skills and similar, but unfortunately, you make your money by exploiting the people belonging to group #3 and selling
that shit to the people who quite often belong to group #2 and very seldom to group #1. That's the reason why i think
you are a jerk here. That's all. Appart from that, you are probably a good guy.

:-)

[GroobySteven]

I'm not a good guy, I'm a great guy and I've never exploited anybody directly in my life.
In fact the closest I've came to exploitation is buying sneakers, clothes and cheap electical products that were probably made by poorly waged workers, I'm willing to bet you do the same. Why do you think I exploit people?

I'm certainly more comfortable selling adult erotica to people than many jobs which although may appear more upstanding, in my opinion, exploit people - ie; certain salespeople, certain lawyers, cosmetic surgeons, etc. You have such a distain for porn yet you are here on a porn site and contributing to it's survival and profit? Hung Angels isn't opertated for fun, it's a business.

I think you need to take a good look at your motivations for coming here and for getting into discourse by making a point that was obviously, rather pointless and stupid. You've also managed to insult pretty much every user of this forum, the girls and the guys?

seanchai

[BeardedOne]

I'm certainly more comfortable selling adult erotica to people than many jobs which although may appear more upstanding, in my opinion, exploit people - ie; certain salespeople, certain lawyers, cosmetic surgeons, etc.

EZ Loans, payday check-cashing service: APR 521 1/2 % (I shit thee not).


You've also managed to insult pretty much every user of this forum, the girls and the guys?

I know I feel like shit after reading that. Exploit me more! Where's the T, C & A?

[Phat]

I'm not a good guy, I'm a great guy and I've never exploited anybody directly in my life.
In fact the closest I've came to exploitation is buying sneakers, clothes and cheap electical products that were probably made by poorly waged workers, I'm willing to bet you do the same. Why do you think I exploit people?

I'm certainly more comfortable selling adult erotica to people than many jobs which although may appear more upstanding, in my opinion, exploit people - ie; certain salespeople, certain lawyers, cosmetic surgeons, etc. You have such a distain for porn yet you are here on a porn site and contributing to it's survival and profit? Hung Angels isn't opertated for fun, it's a business.

I think you need to take a good look at your motivations for coming here and for getting into discourse by making a point that was obviously, rather pointless and stupid. You've also managed to insult pretty much every user of this forum, the girls and the guys?

seanchai

I think he's jealous!

[BeardedOne]

I think he's jealous!

Oh, c'mon, you know he is. :lol:

[joannajet]

Hello,

As views have been requested on the subject of illegal porn, here comes mine.

Piracy of intellectual property is considered by all those who partake in it as being a soft crime, fo which a self-pardon can be justified on the grounds "I'm not hurting anyone", "everyone does it", "it's not like I am going to get busted for it" or "like they need any more money, they are obviously doing just fine".

By you know what, I don't pirate anything. I don't buy DVDs before their official release from a car boot sale, I don't download music unless I have paid my 99 cents to ITunes, shit, I don't even upload a porn pic unless I own it or have paid for it.

And before you think it, it is not because I am those assholes who can't be bothered to get it for free or worse, doesn't know how. It is because I happen to know that by partaking in an act of piracy, I actually do hurt someone, I find myself unable to justify my ethics through the actions of a majority and I consider myself as not having the right to judge upon the right to success of another.

But at the end of the day, all of the philosophy and ethics I have just imparted are already understood by the so very many who choose to pirate but it is willingly dismissed in the belief that such actions will make no difference in either their lives or in that of the victims of their piracy.

So now let me present the reality of piracy:

Even in the most conservative of estimates, I have lost, this year, at least 40 to 50 percent of my revenue from the purchase of non-original DVD copies, Internet publication without licence and stolen passwords for access to commercial web sites.
That 40-50% has denied me the funds necessary to succeed in my legal battle with the US government, which has resulted to date, in not just the indefinite release of new DVDs and hardcore content on Joannajet.com (that pirates considered as worth spending the time to download illegaly) but also in the firing of three, very talented and able, US citizens because I could not be there to offset the revenue being lost to piracy...
For fuck's sake, even the graphic design company who works on my boxcovers has had to fire someone because I am no longer releasing often enough.

Whether it be porn, movies, music, software or any other form of intangible product, those that acquire it without remunerating it's creator consider themselves as pirates and somehow that makes it OK.
Well if you are such a pirate, I doubt that you are on a ship, wear an eye patch, have scurvy, strut around on a wooden leg or sport a foul-mouthed parrot on your shoulder so let's cut out the self-indulgent glamourous name calling and face up to the fact that you nothing more than a petty thief robbing behind the anynomity of a keyboard.

So there you have it, that is my view on the download of illegal TS porn.

As you will have cleary seen, I feel very strongly on this matter but, unfortunately, it seems that only those who rely on the return from their creative efforts can truly appreciate and respect the value it deserves.

And so I close with a question...

If, when you looked at your next paycheck, you saw a smiley face and a "Fuck you" comment next to a $100 deduction, how would you feel that someone had helped themselves to your hard-earned income just because they could and that this was OK because they had judged you could do without it?

Joanna Jet
xxx

[GroobySteven]

Joanna Jet is great.
Eloquent and never afraid to put her point across succinctly.

Anyone who has any pull with the INS should look into her case, she makes jobs, pays well and is one of the most motivated and determined people in this business.

seanchai

[WendyWilliams]

Joanna when I read such comments from you it only makes me miss you more and helps me remember why I ADORE you so much.

Miss ya BOSS LADY
Wendy

[blahblahblah]

I'm not a good guy, I'm a great guy and I've never exploited anybody directly in my life.
In fact the closest I've came to exploitation is buying sneakers, clothes and cheap electical products that were probably made by poorly waged workers, I'm willing to bet you do the same. Why do you think I exploit people?

I'm certainly more comfortable selling adult erotica to people than many jobs which although may appear more upstanding, in my opinion, exploit people - ie; certain salespeople, certain lawyers, cosmetic surgeons, etc. You have such a distain for porn yet you are here on a porn site and contributing to it's survival and profit? Hung Angels isn't opertated for fun, it's a business.

I think you need to take a good look at your motivations for coming here and for getting into discourse by making a point that was obviously, rather pointless and stupid. You've also managed to insult pretty much every user of this forum, the girls and the guys?

seanchai

Tell me, would you like to see your daughter, or your son acting as a porn star? What would you think about the people who got them involved in such kind of shit, in that case? Answer that to me, but honestly.

Oh, yeah, i never insult any girls, but only guys. And that rule is very hard to break on this site, isn't it?

[GroobySteven]

I'm not a good guy, I'm a great guy and I've never exploited anybody directly in my life.
In fact the closest I've came to exploitation is buying sneakers, clothes and cheap electical products that were probably made by poorly waged workers, I'm willing to bet you do the same. Why do you think I exploit people?

I'm certainly more comfortable selling adult erotica to people than many jobs which although may appear more upstanding, in my opinion, exploit people - ie; certain salespeople, certain lawyers, cosmetic surgeons, etc. You have such a distain for porn yet you are here on a porn site and contributing to it's survival and profit? Hung Angels isn't opertated for fun, it's a business.

I think you need to take a good look at your motivations for coming here and for getting into discourse by making a point that was obviously, rather pointless and stupid. You've also managed to insult pretty much every user of this forum, the girls and the guys?

seanchai

Tell me, would you like to see your daughter, or your son acting as a porn star? What would you think about the people who got them involved in such kind of shit, in that case? Answer that to me, but honestly.

Oh, yeah, i never insult any girls, but only guys. And that rule is very hard to break on this site, isn't it?

Honestly, I wouldn't want my son or daughter to be a performer - but I wouldn't want them to do many other jobs either, I'd be more upset if they joined the military, especially now as I feel they're getting more abused than most employees by their bosses.
However, it's not for me to judge the people who do choose to go into military life or do CHOOSE to go into adult work. It's their choice. What made you so righteous that you can judge what they do for their living.
I've never exploited anybody who has worked for my company, I understand it can go on in this industry but in what industry is there no exploitation. Just because the industry doens't fit into your morals it doesn't mean it's exploitative.

I ask again, you keep failing to answer and just come up with more misguided barbs - why are you on this site and why do you feel it's ok to insult pretty much everybody in here with your self-righteous attitude?

seanchai

[RubyTS]

Hello,

As views have been requested on the subject of illegal porn, here comes mine.

Piracy of intellectual property is considered by all those who partake in it as being a soft crime, fo which a self-pardon can be justified on the grounds "I'm not hurting anyone", "everyone does it", "it's not like I am going to get busted for it" or "like they need any more money, they are obviously doing just fine".

By you know what, I don't pirate anything. I don't buy DVDs before their official release from a car boot sale, I don't download music unless I have paid my 99 cents to ITunes, shit, I don't even upload a porn pic unless I own it or have paid for it.

And before you think it, it is not because I am those assholes who can't be bothered to get it for free or worse, doesn't know how. It is because I happen to know that by partaking in an act of piracy, I actually do hurt someone, I find myself unable to justify my ethics through the actions of a majority and I consider myself as not having the right to judge upon the right to success of another.

But at the end of the day, all of the philosophy and ethics I have just imparted are already understood by the so very many who choose to pirate but it is willingly dismissed in the belief that such actions will make no difference in either their lives or in that of the victims of their piracy.

So now let me present the reality of piracy:

Even in the most conservative of estimates, I have lost, this year, at least 40 to 50 percent of my revenue from the purchase of non-original DVD copies, Internet publication without licence and stolen passwords for access to commercial web sites.
That 40-50% has denied me the funds necessary to succeed in my legal battle with the US government, which has resulted to date, in not just the indefinite release of new DVDs and hardcore content on Joannajet.com (that pirates considered as worth spending the time to download illegaly) but also in the firing of three, very talented and able, US citizens because I could not be there to offset the revenue being lost to piracy...
For fuck's sake, even the graphic design company who works on my boxcovers has had to fire someone because I am no longer releasing often enough.

Whether it be porn, movies, music, software or any other form of intangible product, those that acquire it without remunerating it's creator consider themselves as pirates and somehow that makes it OK.
Well if you are such a pirate, I doubt that you are on a ship, wear an eye patch, have scurvy, strut around on a wooden leg or sport a foul-mouthed parrot on your shoulder so let's cut out the self-indulgent glamourous name calling and face up to the fact that you nothing more than a petty thief robbing behind the anynomity of a keyboard.

So there you have it, that is my view on the download of illegal TS porn.

As you will have cleary seen, I feel very strongly on this matter but, unfortunately, it seems that only those who rely on the return from their creative efforts can truly appreciate and respect the value it deserves.

And so I close with a question...

If, when you looked at your next paycheck, you saw a smiley face and a "Fuck you" comment next to a $100 deduction, how would you feel that someone had helped themselves to your hard-earned income just because they could and that this was OK because they had judged you could do without it?

Joanna Jet
xxx

*clapping*

i dont think ANYONE realized how extreme the outcome of "stealing" porn could affect the industry as a whole until your post. Bravo. NO 1 could have said it better

[emon668]

i steal porn. tons of it. till 4 am, through crippling carpal tunnel syndrome, till my eyes are blood red, way past the point of even thinking of masturbation, and without the slightest remorse.

pornographers hate me. they think im an asshole.

sob.

my world is sad.

[RubyTS]

:thumbsdown

[blahblahblah]

Honestly, I wouldn't want my son or daughter to be a performer - but I wouldn't want them to do many other jobs either, I'd be more upset if they joined the military, especially now as I feel they're getting more abused than most employees by their bosses.
However, it's not for me to judge the people who do choose to go into military life or do CHOOSE to go into adult work. It's their choice. What made you so righteous that you can judge what they do for their living.
I've never exploited anybody who has worked for my company, I understand it can go on in this industry but in what industry is there no exploitation. Just because the industry doens't fit into your morals it doesn't mean it's exploitative.

I ask again, you keep failing to answer and just come up with more misguided barbs - why are you on this site and why do you feel it's ok to insult pretty much everybody in here with your self-righteous attitude?

seanchai

Only 2 persons know why i'm here, both 2 transsexuals. The first one "introduced" me
into this "lovely" world, and the second one got it through my "confession". I thought
she could help me to figure out some stuffs, but it went @ wrong hole. And it was mainly
my mistake.

Why do you consider my posts being misguided barbs? It's perfectly OK having freedom to choose
adult profession, but once again: I do not really think that some (actually many) people choose
to work for adult industry, but they are rather forced to do so. If they are not forced, then
they have some serious issues inside themselfs. And some other people use it. But you might be right, being in that industry and
not the millitary one makes them not killing other people.

Also, i'll tell you this: I know some people whose daughter voluntarily went into that "industry".
Believe me or not, they behave like they lost something invaluable. It's literarely impossible
to mention their daughter's name in front of them, because if you do so, you'll hit them hard,
you kind of remind them that there is a hell on the earth to be aware of. So the daughter enjoys
her own life, but at the same time she destroyed at least 2 other lives.

[suckseed]

Honestly, I wouldn't want my son or daughter to be a performer - but I wouldn't want them to do many other jobs either, I'd be more upset if they joined the military, especially now as I feel they're getting more abused than most employees by their bosses.
However, it's not for me to judge the people who do choose to go into military life or do CHOOSE to go into adult work. It's their choice. What made you so righteous that you can judge what they do for their living.
I've never exploited anybody who has worked for my company, I understand it can go on in this industry but in what industry is there no exploitation. Just because the industry doens't fit into your morals it doesn't mean it's exploitative.

I ask again, you keep failing to answer and just come up with more misguided barbs - why are you on this site and why do you feel it's ok to insult pretty much everybody in here with your self-righteous attitude?

seanchai

Only 2 persons know why i'm here, both 2 transsexuals. The first one "introduced" me
into this "lovely" world, and the second one got it through my "confession". I thought
she could help me to figure out some stuffs, but it went @ wrong hole. And it was mainly
my mistake.

Why do you consider my posts being misguided barbs? It's perfectly OK having freedom to choose
adult profession, but once again: I do not really think that some (actually many) people choose
to work for adult industry, but they are rather forced to do so. If they are not forced, then
they have some serious issues inside themselfs. And some other people use it. But you might be right, being in that industry and
not the millitary one makes them not killing other people.

Also, i'll tell you this: I know some people whose daughter voluntarily went into that "industry".
Believe me or not, they behave like they lost something invaluable. It's literarely impossible
to mention their daughter's name in front of them, because if you do so, you'll hit them hard,
you kind of remind them that there is a hell on the earth to be aware of. So the daughter enjoys
her own life, but at the same time she destroyed at least 2 other lives.

Actually, you're wrong about that, Superman. Many of us know who you are and what your agenda here is. And that you've used your company's computer to log on to porn sites. And the name of the that company. And that you have no problem hacking into sites and abusing strangers' privacy who've done nothing to you. And that you're conflicted, self-righteous and hypocritical.

[suckseed]

Since I can't delete this entirely, I'll just add this: Why patronize a business you hate? Many people spend their whole lives in an office doing something they'd rather not do in the name of security. Many people outside of sex work still hurt others or themselves with risky sexual behavior. Your porn star friend's main mistake was letting her parents find out. Brianna Banks' family still doesn't know, or so she says. My ex fiancee got us out of a financial hole in six months by becoming a dancer. Her family has no idea. I hired a female escort a few months ago who's 24 and lives with her mother. She goes to college and escorts to enable herself to finance her school, and keep the pressure off her mom. You grow up, you make your choices, and you accept the consequences. Many of the transexuals here could probably tell you that their parents were shocked or hurt, whether or not they came to terms with it.
It's neither my place nor yours to sit in judgement of them. You've fucked a transexual. You look at porn. Get over it. I'm sure the parents of a porn star would decline to change places with the parents of a dead soldier, and if they don't feel that way, shame on them.

[rvince]

What Joanna & Seanchai said!

Although I'm not producing porn material (well none of it has been released yet) I'm doing lots of free sites to promote other's paysites (grooby sites, personal shemale sites, etc...) and quite often I notice while looking in google listings that some people just steal my galleries/freesites, change the affiliate link and upload it.
That definately sucks and I send a complaint mail/email every time most without effect usually...

[suckseed]

I don't really understand how Yahoo and MSN make money off of free email and groups. I've used them for years and never bought anything from their sponsors.

Well that's just a silly comment.
So you don't buy anything but why do you think they post those advertisements over all of yahoo for fun or because corporations are paying them based on their amount of traffic and surfers.
Please think before you speak.
seanchai
I always think before I speak, Seanchai. Read my posts. I don't have a single porn movie I haven't paid full price for. Same with music and software. I paid $799 for a single cdrom of a program called Cubase six years ago, and it's still the only recording software I use. Yahoo and Hotmail usually have mortgage refinance ads, ads for match or true.com, and other services I'm not interested in. If they ever advertise something I want, I'll gladly buy it and mention the site that brought it to my attention, but I'm not going to buy something I don't want - just to support friggin' Microsoft. I was just mentioning it out of curiosity. Do you really think someone who wants to refinance their mortgage is going to go to a company called LowerMyBills.com that features annoying flash banners rather than a reputable company? Don't be so crabby! :)

[GroobySteven]

Good point Suckseed but yahoo and those sites still continue to make money from those sites/giving away or allowing people to show porn even though you don't click on their ads?

Crabby ... good word which I haven't used in a long time, rest assured it will be used on someone today!

Thanks for filling in the background on McManaman although I think he exposed himself for the bigotted, hypocrit that he is and still failed to answer the questions. I think I'll let the argument rest now as it's futile debating withg a zealot.
seanchai

[DonPA]

bit torrents are my very good friends...hehe

[Vicki Richter]

I have a few questions on piracy... I am playing the devil's advocate here as I typically do, and my opinions may not reflect the suggestive nature of the questions.

Here are some scenarios:

Members of most websites are typically entitled to download the images or movies to their hard drive for their future enjoyment. So is it still piracy if someone later downloads the same photos or videos off of some pirate site since they were previously entitled to do so because they were a member of that site. I could see this going either way. If they simply didn't have time to download that content before but they really liked it, maybe they should get another subscription so they can grab it.

Is it not piracy for the producers of content, be they musicians, web masters, or Hollywood big screen producers to make shit content and market it as something else? For example, I was at Hollywood video looking through the "new releases". As you all know, they stock heavily on various new releases that are big name movies that will draw many rentals. Well this movie called "War of the Worlds" was on the shelf and they bought like 20 copies of it to rent out. This wasn't the Tom Cruise version, it was some crappy B movie version I could barely stand to watch 15 minutes of. That is piracy too, just a legal kind. Buyer beware right?

What about competing web sites that advertise updates and then don't do any updates? I have read a lot of reviews of sites where updates just don't happen. I also know that in some shemale and straight adult sites, the webmasters, knowing that many people stay no more than 90 days, continually rotate the same content over and over making it appear that updates are happening when in fact they are just giving people the same stuff. I read about some of this on gofuckyourself (GFY.com) and found out a bit more talking to some webmasters of the pump them and dump them web sites based upon just traffic and not member retention.

I think there are two sides to everything. Obviously there are people who rip us off as webmasters, but there are also webmasters who rip off the public. We could get into the dramatic airbrushing of models on boxcovers so much that they don't even look like the same person, but that is more acceptable and standard in any segment of the entertainment industry.

I also have bought more copies of Master of Puppets than I care to admit. Two were cassettes damaged through wear and tear from being in the car, another was a CD stolen out of a car, another in a box lost during a move... Now wouldn't I be entitled to downloading those same songs for free since I already paid for them 4 or 5 times? I personally think so. Could I prove that I owned them, no. Also, how many times have people bought a CD and found that two songs on the record were good. Buy either of Ricky Martin's CD's and you will know what I mean. When musicians put out such crap as filler because they have a hit single, they own part of the pirating problem.

I think the majority of consumers know good product when they see/hear it and are more likely to not rip off people who make the better product. For example I own a DVD box set of Raiders of the Lost Ark series, Star Trek series, and Lord of the Rings series and many more. Alternatively, I'd be more likely to rent and rip a copy of UltraViolet. How do people feel about having to buy Star Wars episodes 4-6 on VHS, VHS with enhanced sound, VHS with revised footage, on DVD, on digitally remastered DVD, on HD DVD, etc... Is that fair to the consumer? Maybe, maybe not.

Personally, I think the best of both worlds is lifetime licenses documented on somebody's server somewhere. I think Itunes probably does this. I believe Napster now does this. No lost or stolen CD's or DVD's. You buy it, you own it. They need to keep the prices reasonable as well. The media companies are more likely to realize they now have a monopoly and then raise prices to $30 a copy. A downside is I am not sure that someone wants ButtBanging Shemale Sex Sluts on their owned movie history for the rest of their lives. I have no idea how to do this with website content and I don't think it fits into the same mold.

I'm also pissed off because when I was first starting out I bought several hundred dollars of content from a company and they closed shop after the big 2257 scare. I had to remove all of that legal, licensed content from my server. That was annoying. A personal thank you to the content producers out of Florida who did that.

Lastly, I don't think it is ever ethical to burn or rip copies of someone's product and then resell them. That is just completely wrong.

[GroobySteven]

I think what your talking about Vicki is more like people doing bad business through mis-advertising and failure to live up to promises, if a customer bought a mis-leading website and failed to get the updates or the content that was promised on the advertising pages then they should make a complaint to that website and if necessary take further action by demanding a refund or chargeback.
I'm happy for a paying member to download everything on one of the websites and keep it forever, in their harddrive or disk to enjoy many times - I'm not happy for that paying members to post it where it makes money for other people or detriments my business - or sells that content as if they owned it.

Customers of adult sites should complain to the websites and the billing companies if they're not getting what is in the previews and advertisements.
seanchai

[Vicki Richter]

Actually, you're wrong about that, Superman. Many of us know who you are and what your agenda here is. And that you've used your company's computer to log on to porn sites. And the name of the that company. And that you have no problem hacking into sites and abusing strangers' privacy who've done nothing to you. And that you're conflicted, self-righteous and hypocritical.

First, while Superman did hack my forums, he also told me how to fix the problem. If he wanted to, he could have done much worse. I don't approve of what he did, and he was banned from my forums because of it. He's already been punished.

I am vehemently opposed to anyone using anyone's personal information just because they have contrary opinions. That is the worst threat anyone could make Suckseed. If someone has personality flaws that you don't agree with - tell them you don't agree and why.

I'm a big girl, I can be judged by people and I can handle it. People don't know Superman's real story. It is deep and touching. While I don't agree with the things he says very often, I do understand him.

[suckseed]

He and I have discussed it privately, Vicki. McManaman understands, or should, that no one is threatening him with anything. My apologies - I don't pretend to speak for you. As I've said many times, I hate bullying behavior.

[hondarobot]

Honestly, I wouldn't want my son or daughter to be a performer - but I wouldn't want them to do many other jobs either, I'd be more upset if they joined the military, especially now as I feel they're getting more abused than most employees by their bosses.
However, it's not for me to judge the people who do choose to go into military life or do CHOOSE to go into adult work. It's their choice. What made you so righteous that you can judge what they do for their living.
I've never exploited anybody who has worked for my company, I understand it can go on in this industry but in what industry is there no exploitation. Just because the industry doens't fit into your morals it doesn't mean it's exploitative.

I ask again, you keep failing to answer and just come up with more misguided barbs - why are you on this site and why do you feel it's ok to insult pretty much everybody in here with your self-righteous attitude?

seanchai

Only 2 persons know why i'm here, both 2 transsexuals. The first one "introduced" me
into this "lovely" world, and the second one got it through my "confession". I thought
she could help me to figure out some stuffs, but it went @ wrong hole. And it was mainly
my mistake.

Why do you consider my posts being misguided barbs? It's perfectly OK having freedom to choose
adult profession, but once again: I do not really think that some (actually many) people choose
to work for adult industry, but they are rather forced to do so. If they are not forced, then
they have some serious issues inside themselfs. And some other people use it. But you might be right, being in that industry and
not the millitary one makes them not killing other people.

Also, i'll tell you this: I know some people whose daughter voluntarily went into that "industry".
Believe me or not, they behave like they lost something invaluable. It's literarely impossible
to mention their daughter's name in front of them, because if you do so, you'll hit them hard,
you kind of remind them that there is a hell on the earth to be aware of. So the daughter enjoys
her own life, but at the same time she destroyed at least 2 other lives.

Actually, you're wrong about that, Superman. Many of us know who you are and what your agenda here is. And that you've used your company's computer to log on to porn sites. And the name of the that company. And that you have no problem hacking into sites and abusing strangers' privacy who've done nothing to you. And that you're conflicted, self-righteous and hypocritical.

What the hell? McManaman is actually Superman from the VR forums? I remember that guy. I honestly dont know why someone who has so many issues with porn would be active on any porn related forums.

I honestly have nothing against the guy, but come on. . . if you didn't like porn on some level you wouldn't want anything to do with it.

It's like a witch hunter or something. "We need to flog the evil out of this girl. Strip her and I'll begin the flogging! On that beautiful naked ass. . . I dont want to do it, I feel I owe it to her."

That's just dumb.

[michneo]

Sometimes i pay MOST TIMES i pirate Oh well lotta ppls pay cuz if they didn't there wouldn't be any money to make pornos

[blahblahblah]

Actually, you're wrong about that, Superman. Many of us know who you are and what your agenda here is. And that you've used your company's computer to log on to porn sites. And the name of the that company. And that you have no problem hacking into sites and abusing strangers' privacy who've done nothing to you. And that you're conflicted, self-righteous and hypocritical.

First, while Superman did hack my forums, he also told me how to fix the problem. If he wanted to, he could have done much worse. I don't approve of what he did, and he was banned from my forums because of it. He's already been punished.

I am vehemently opposed to anyone using anyone's personal information just because they have contrary opinions. That is the worst threat anyone could make Suckseed. If someone has personality flaws that you don't agree with - tell them you don't agree and why.

I'm a big girl, I can be judged by people and I can handle it. People don't know Superman's real story. It is deep and touching. While I don't agree with the things he says very often, I do understand him.

Thanks, Vicki. I'll always be your cyber friend, no matter what.
People are probably confused since i see you from totally another perspective
compared to the rest of this crowd. That's because our cyber-relationship
is simple. Constructive questions and answers directed to each other.
We kind of learn from each other. Nothing more and nothing less then that.

P.S.

The privacy: I'm always using http proxies in this context, so don't be
supprised if you figure out that was John Cleese who was using some
pure swedish proxy (with good performance) in order to hack the White House
intranet just to impress Queen Elisabeth, or something like that,
after finishing your detective research :-)

[blahblahblah]

[quote/]

What the hell? McManaman is actually Superman from the VR forums? I remember that guy. I honestly dont know why someone who has so many issues with porn would be active on any porn related forums.

I honestly have nothing against the guy, but come on. . . if you didn't like porn on some level you wouldn't want anything to do with it.

It's like a witch hunter or something. "We need to flog the evil out of this girl. Strip her and I'll begin the flogging! On that beautiful naked ass. . . I dont want to do it, I feel I owe it to her."

That's just dumb.

:-)

You silly boy!

This forum is not only porn related. You can find some very good
and deep stuff inside it, and that's the point. In fact, some
great personalities here tend to leave this forum and consider it
boring when no other contents but pure porn related things are
presented here. For example, it was long time ago i read Felicia
Katt's posts here, and they are always worth reading. But not only she,
many other great girls show tendency to leave. And then we have
you, me and senchy left here. That's sad and pathetic..

[blahblahblah]

hmm... it seems like the forum has some performance related issues. Sometimes, my posts are submitted twice, i dont know why.. so i re-edited this double post..

[thmack]

I LOVE SHEMALE PORN

[hondarobot]

[quote/]

What the hell? McManaman is actually Superman from the VR forums? I remember that guy. I honestly dont know why someone who has so many issues with porn would be active on any porn related forums.

I honestly have nothing against the guy, but come on. . . if you didn't like porn on some level you wouldn't want anything to do with it.

It's like a witch hunter or something. "We need to flog the evil out of this girl. Strip her and I'll begin the flogging! On that beautiful naked ass. . . I dont want to do it, I feel I owe it to her."

That's just dumb.

:-)

You silly boy!

This forum is not only porn related. You can find some very good
and deep stuff inside it, and that's the point. In fact, some
great personalities here tend to leave this forum and consider it
boring when no other contents but pure porn related things are
presented here. For example, it was long time ago i read Felicia
Katt's posts here, and they are always worth reading. But not only she,
many other great girls show tendency to leave. And then we have
you, me and senchy left here. That's sad and pathetic..

Huh? Nobody ever leaves this forum, they just occasionally stop posting for awhile. I'm not sure what the connection you see between you, myself, and seanchai is (although it was amusing to see his name misspelled again, it's been awhile). Pretty much all the regular characters here post at least once a day.

Here's what I find unpleasent about you: You posted on Vicki Richters forum that you considered her a "clever boy" (or something like that) who was just being a girl for business purposes. If that was said to any girl on this forum in the real world and I was present, I would have punched you in the face.

Admittedly it may not have been a very effective punch since I'm not The Worlds Strongest Man or anything, but still it would have been warrented.

Then you went on some tirade about wanting to save Vicki from porn. The lucrative, entertaining and personally fullfilling career she has built for herself. What a hero.

I next recall you saying something about loving your wife and children. . .then proclaiming your love for Vicki (and no, I'm not pointing any fingers over that last one, heh).

Now you're going on and on about your crusade against porn and the fact that you send money to children in Sudan (or whatever). Get over it. In fact, sensing your deep compassion for the downtrodden of the world, send me some fuckin money. I can barely afford to buy drinks and hit on slinky club girls.

Where's the compassion for me?!?

[OmegaMetallicus]

Ok, I've lurked through this thread long enough. Not that a noob on the forum will carry any weight but...



I know some people whose daughter voluntarily went into that "industry". Believe me or not, they behave like they lost something invaluable. It's literarely impossible to mention their daughter's name in front of them, because if you do so, you'll hit them hard,you kind of remind them that there is a hell on the earth to be aware of. So the daughter enjoys
her own life, but at the same time she destroyed at least 2 other lives.

Yeah right... Just like my parents were destroyed when I became a full time musician in the '70s, they got over it eventually and I'm still not addicted to heroin (as was my mother's most heartfelt fear to the grave). So what then? The world should become even more overrun with miserable people who hate their own lives just to continue "doing what we're told" when we're all old enough to decide our own path?

Get off the soapbox dude... That all went the way of Ozzie and Harriet decades ago. Leave the saving of souls to the Jehovah's Witnesses that are about to knock on your door.



The privacy: I'm always using http proxies in this context, so don't be
supprised if you figure out that was John Cleese who was using some
pure swedish proxy (with good performance) in order to hack the White House intranet just to impress Queen Elisabeth, or something like that,
after finishing your detective research :-)

Honestly, I doubt that anyone who uses the word "literarely" is that smart... Literally.

[suckseed]

To be fair, it has been suggested that Mcmanaman using English as a second language. Which, if true, means he's doing pretty well. :?

[GroobySteven]

What's his first language, Scottish?
seanchai

[blahblahblah]

[quote/]
I next recall you saying something about loving your wife and children. . .then proclaiming your love for Vicki (and no, I'm not pointing any fingers over that last one, heh).

Now you're going on and on about your crusade against porn and the fact that you send money to children in Sudan (or whatever). Get over it. In fact, sensing your deep compassion for the downtrodden of the world, send me some fuckin money. I can barely afford to buy drinks and hit on slinky club girls.

Where's the compassion for me?!?

Oh, yes! This one requires a further explanation:
No, i don't have any children and wife. In fact,
i don't have any closer family at all and i really
would not like to discuss that here. That post
was more hypotetic one, i was hoping to get a picture
of a certain life scenario. Can't you "read between the
rows" at all?

Charity for you: no, dude, no money for you. If you didn't
spend all your savings on some expensive trips to a certain
desert then you would be rich today. But if you sell the Holly
Towell, that could bring in some bucks. :-)

[blahblahblah]

Ok, I've lurked through this thread long enough. Not that a noob on the forum will carry any weight but...



I know some people whose daughter voluntarily went into that "industry". Believe me or not, they behave like they lost something invaluable. It's literarely impossible to mention their daughter's name in front of them, because if you do so, you'll hit them hard,you kind of remind them that there is a hell on the earth to be aware of. So the daughter enjoys
her own life, but at the same time she destroyed at least 2 other lives.

Yeah right... Just like my parents were destroyed when I became a full time musician in the '70s, they got over it eventually and I'm still not addicted to heroin (as was my mother's most heartfelt fear to the grave). So what then? The world should become even more overrun with miserable people who hate their own lives just to continue "doing what we're told" when we're all old enough to decide our own path?

Get off the soapbox dude... That all went the way of Ozzie and Harriet decades ago. Leave the saving of souls to the Jehovah's Witnesses that are about to knock on your door.



The privacy: I'm always using http proxies in this context, so don't be
supprised if you figure out that was John Cleese who was using some
pure swedish proxy (with good performance) in order to hack the White House intranet just to impress Queen Elisabeth, or something like that,
after finishing your detective research :-)

Honestly, I doubt that anyone who uses the word "literarely" is that smart... Literally.

As i like to say it in this context: Being proud of knowing
your native language is a property of an idiot. Since english
isn't my native language, then it's natural that i make some
lingual mistakes.

But my friend, please don't let me be the reason of turning
your lurk mode off. Turn it on again for that matter..

[yosi]

I think what your talking about Vicki is more like people doing bad business through mis-advertising and failure to live up to promises, if a customer bought a mis-leading website and failed to get the updates or the content that was promised on the advertising pages then they should make a complaint to that website and if necessary take further action by demanding a refund or chargeback.
I'm happy for a paying member to download everything on one of the websites and keep it forever, in their harddrive or disk to enjoy many times - I'm not happy for that paying members to post it where it makes money for other people or detriments my business - or sells that content as if they owned it.

Customers of adult sites should complain to the websites and the billing companies if they're not getting what is in the previews and advertisements.
seanchai

these paysites don't give a damn about any complain.
all they reply is that THEIR site is the best in the business......

how many shemale paysites have their own ORIGINAL content?

20% will be a very generous .

paying for a membership for a site in which later you find out that you already have all their content from other sites make bitter customers , customers that paid but have been ripped off.

ripped off customers are most likely going to bit torrent and rapidshare to get free films instead of paying again and be ripped off again.

1 of these sites is regulary published here in hungangels............. :roll:

just my 2 cents for this subject

[slinky]

these paysites don't give a damn about any complain.
all they reply is that THEIR site is the best in the business......

That may be true about some sites, but certainly not all. As someone who personally answers emails every day from customers of our paysites, I can tell you that some of us care very much. In fact, on more than one occassion, we have produced and added content simply because ONE of our members asked for it.




how many shemale paysites have their own ORIGINAL content?

20% will be a very generous .

There are 4 things about this:

1) I'm not sure that original content is the be-all and end-all of a paysite. If someone has a collection of what a member wants, it may trump the simple fact of who made it. For example, I know there are many guys who want to see Shemale Creampies. For those guys, if there is a site that has lots of those videos, and it is updated regularly, they don't care if the site produced the content or someone else did, as long as it's good, it's what they want, and there's enough of it.,

2) A lot of sites have 2 or 3 day trials: it gives you the chance to take a look and see what's inside for $2.95 to $4.95. If you do the trial, look inside, don't see what you want, just cancel.

3) You're right that there are lots of sites (not just TS sites, but all kinds) which simply rip DVD's which "everyone" has seen before. They tend to make their money on people who are not familiar with this niche and join not having seen much of the content at all, so it's all new to those members.*

4) I don't think there's anything wrong with not having content you shot yourself, as long as you're not claiming taht you have it.




paying for a membership for a site in which later you find out that you already have all their content from other sites make bitter customers , customers that paid but have been ripped off.

Most people join a site after looking at some sort of "tour". If you looked at teh tour, and you saw everything on that tour, why would you join the site anyway? I know for a fact that most paysites don't have material on their tour which does not exist inside their site. Those which do deserve to get slammed.

But also, when you say you already have all of their content from other istes, how many guys belong to multiple Shemale paysites at the same time (unles they are in non-overlapping niches)?




ripped off customers are most likely going to bit torrent and rapidshare to get free films instead of paying again and be ripped off again.

But who is it that is posting on bit torrent and rapidshare? Do you think it's customers who feel ripped off, but stay as members anyway, but post the site's material on share systems? That doesn't make sense to me. I can tell you that a decent amount of the posting on the share sites is done for more nefarious reasons than that.

Also, in my experience, there's 2 groups of poeple: those who pay for porn, and those who make up some reason that "information wants to be free" (which is an astronomical misuse of a great phrase by people who have no idea of the original context I which it was used). The vast majority of guys who are downloading "free porn" were never "pay consumers" at all: just guys who "will never pay for porn". The ironic part is guys will pay to join a site where they can download pirated porn rather than pay the people who actually made and own it.

Now, yosi, NONE of the above should be taken to mean that there are not a very large number of absolute scumbags in the online Adult business. there are tons of sites which do not give value for money, and they fully deserve all of the shit which they get. But, unfortunately, too many times guys use the excuse that some sites are rip offs to themsleves turn arround and rip off the honest operators ("it's a dirty business, everybody does it, etc.")

[GroobySteven]

I think what your talking about Vicki is more like people doing bad business through mis-advertising and failure to live up to promises, if a customer bought a mis-leading website and failed to get the updates or the content that was promised on the advertising pages then they should make a complaint to that website and if necessary take further action by demanding a refund or chargeback.
I'm happy for a paying member to download everything on one of the websites and keep it forever, in their harddrive or disk to enjoy many times - I'm not happy for that paying members to post it where it makes money for other people or detriments my business - or sells that content as if they owned it.

Customers of adult sites should complain to the websites and the billing companies if they're not getting what is in the previews and advertisements.
seanchai

these paysites don't give a damn about any complain.
all they reply is that THEIR site is the best in the business......

how many shemale paysites have their own ORIGINAL content?

20% will be a very generous .

paying for a membership for a site in which later you find out that you already have all their content from other sites make bitter customers , customers that paid but have been ripped off.

ripped off customers are most likely going to bit torrent and rapidshare to get free films instead of paying again and be ripped off again.

1 of these sites is regulary published here in hungangels............. :roll:

just my 2 cents for this subject

All of my sites have 100% original content which is shot by individual photographers working with us whom get paid. They pay each model they shoot. We do not license or sell any content to any other site so if you see if on a Grooby site then we shot it and it belongs to us (note: we have rented a few extra feeds to provide some extra video content but it is clear that these are rented and they don't appear in our promotion, advertising or sales pitch of the sites).

If you do find a site that is that bad and doesn't give what it stated, report them to the billing company and demand your money back.
seanchai

[DJ_Asia]

I think what your talking about Vicki is more like people doing bad business through mis-advertising and failure to live up to promises, if a customer bought a mis-leading website and failed to get the updates or the content that was promised on the advertising pages then they should make a complaint to that website and if necessary take further action by demanding a refund or chargeback.
I'm happy for a paying member to download everything on one of the websites and keep it forever, in their harddrive or disk to enjoy many times - I'm not happy for that paying members to post it where it makes money for other people or detriments my business - or sells that content as if they owned it.

Customers of adult sites should complain to the websites and the billing companies if they're not getting what is in the previews and advertisements.
seanchai

these paysites don't give a damn about any complain.
all they reply is that THEIR site is the best in the business......

how many shemale paysites have their own ORIGINAL content?

20% will be a very generous .

paying for a membership for a site in which later you find out that you already have all their content from other sites make bitter customers , customers that paid but have been ripped off.

ripped off customers are most likely going to bit torrent and rapidshare to get free films instead of paying again and be ripped off again.

1 of these sites is regulary published here in hungangels............. :roll:

just my 2 cents for this subject

It seems that there are a large number of guys out there who hate us site owners.
A couple years ago when I was first starting WWS,I posted a few sample pics to a long forgotten Yahoo TS group,and within hours I had like 3 or 4 guys post comments like..."Why waste your time,with so mucg free porn out there who would pay for a site" and similar sentiments.
I guess many people think that this "free" content grows on trees,or Bill Gates uploads it magically to your computer on a daily basis.
Its like going up to Eric Clapton and saying why make more CD's when I get all your previous work for free.

WWS also has 100% original content 99.9% shot by me.And while my work has been seen on many other sites,each set I shoot and use is exclusive to the site that bought it.
And personally I do care what my members think,afterall they are the ones who keep me going.

DJ Asia

[Jennifer_English]

As someone who is very new to the scene, here is my view.

McManaman you said that porn is a business that people go into because they lack the skill to do any other job...

I went to university, have worked in the insurance industry for most of my working life and (if I chose) certainly have the intelligence to do a 'normal' job. Running a decent website with regular updates isnt something you can learn to do in a week, in fact I spent 6 months learning!!

Why have I chosen to work in the adult industry...? you show me an insurance job where I can earn enough to pay for breast augmentation, Facial surgery, eventually SRS etc etc.. Transitioning isnt cheap you know!! I know for a lot of my friends this is the reason they escort. Nothing against escorts, indeed as I said most of my friends do this and i see nothing wrong with it. It just isnt for me.

Anyway I do not wish to attack your (ill-informed) views so onto the question at hand....

YES - in my opinion illegal downloading does harm the industry... If you had ANY idea how much work I, and many others put into setting a website up and how much it annoys me when i see people posting MY pictures that I worked HARD to produce you would agree...

My business partner and I spent almost a year learning how to take decent pictures, how to get the lighting correct etc etc.. Now the website has only been running for four months and FINALLY we are starting to see some sort of return for all our hard work...

My members pay good money to see pictures on my website so why should someone else get it for free.?

If someone ripped my site and posted it as there own, most of my income would stop. That would mean I wouldnt be able to afford new outfits, studio hire, hosting fees etc. etc. and my site would close....

As for people like Seanchai etc. exploiting girls... I personally know 4 or 5 girls (including me) who have appeard on Shemale Yum - Do you think any of them felt exploited when they left with 3 or 400 pounds in their pocket.... no way!!

Anyone out there who does download illegal porn from the net.... your STEALING, dont kid yourselves and its from very real people like ME...

Kisses

Jennifer
-x-

P.s. my parents both know exactly what I do and are VERY proud of me...

[BeardedOne]

Bill Gates uploads it magically to your computer on a daily basis.

Hey, that's how I get mine. Now if I can only get it to stop crashing before the money shot. :lol: :lol: :lol:


Running a decent website with regular updates isnt something you can learn to do in a week, in fact I spent 6 months learning!!

Jennifer, I remember some of your initial pings for advice and comment. So glad to see that things are going well. :)

[peggygee]

Hello,

As views have been requested on the subject of illegal porn, here comes mine.

Piracy of intellectual property is considered by all those who partake in it as being a soft crime, fo which a self-pardon can be justified on the grounds "I'm not hurting anyone", "everyone does it", "it's not like I am going to get busted for it" or "like they need any more money, they are obviously doing just fine".

By you know what, I don't pirate anything. I don't buy DVDs before their official release from a car boot sale, I don't download music unless I have paid my 99 cents to ITunes, shit, I don't even upload a porn pic unless I own it or have paid for it.

So now let me present the reality of piracy:

Even in the most conservative of estimates, I have lost, this year, at least 40 to 50 percent of my revenue from the purchase of non-original DVD copies, Internet publication without licence and stolen passwords for access to commercial web sites.
That 40-50% has denied me the funds necessary to succeed in my legal battle with the US government, which has resulted to date, in not just the indefinite release of new DVDs and hardcore content on Joannajet.com (that pirates considered as worth spending the time to download illegaly) but also in the firing of three, very talented and able, US citizens because I could not be there to offset the revenue being lost to piracy...
For fuck's sake, even the graphic design company who works on my boxcovers has had to fire someone because I am no longer releasing often enough.

Whether it be porn, movies, music, software or any other form of intangible product, those that acquire it without remunerating it's creator consider themselves as pirates and somehow that makes it OK.
Well if you are such a pirate, I doubt that you are on a ship, wear an eye patch, have scurvy, strut around on a wooden leg or sport a foul-mouthed parrot on your shoulder so let's cut out the self-indulgent glamourous name calling and face up to the fact that you nothing more than a petty thief robbing behind the anynomity of a keyboard.


Joanna Jet
xxx

I apologize in advance for the length of this post, it is something I feel strongly about as well. Also, while it addresses all of digital copyright infringement in general, much of it is relevant to adult entertainment material.

While not trying to render a Solomon like decision, or sound like John Kerry, I will say that I understand both viewpoints, and they both have merits.

If the media industry is unable to re-coup the money it spends on producing it’s product, then obviously there will be no money to pay talent, and other related production costs.

End result to the consumer, no new, or simply shoddy product.. So, why can’t people see that it is in their best interests to stop illegally obtaining digital material.

But, ‘twere’ the problem and it’s solution so simple:

1. You can’t legislate morality, specifically in the case of, The Digital Millennium Copyright Act, (DMCA) is a United States copyright law which criminalizes production and dissemination of technology that can circumvent measures taken to protect copyrights.TheEuropeans, in May of 2001 came up with , EU Copyright Directive or EUCD, which is comparable to the DMCA.

Ever hear of it, most likely not, but one if the things is says is you could be in ‘big trouble’ for making copies of your friends cds for mixtapes.

Kinda, like Nancy Reagan, coming up, with ‘just say no’ to drugs, sounded nice on paper in a meeting but hasn’t meant much to the average person, or piracy.

2.But what about, law enforcement: The FBI kicking in warehouse doors, in Flushing, Queens, NY, with operatives from the RIAA, seizing millions of dollars worth of pirated, software, music, and movies. Surely, that must have taken a bite, out of crime. One would think so, wouldn’t one. But in every major city, that I have been to in the world, there is absolutely no problem what so ever purchasing pirated material, often for pennies on the dollar.

3.Come on, surely it can’t be as bleak as all that, aren’t there technological safeguards in place to prevent copying and mass distribution of digital material. For every encryption safeguard, for every codec put in place to prevent you from getting free stuff, there is a 13 year old kid in Finland, or Florida, cracking it, as we speak, and the crack will be on the internet and around the world in hours.

Face it folks the genie is out of the bottle, every one has or knows some one who has cd or dvd burners. Digital recording equipment, and the accompanying software is very affordable and easy to use. Technologically, it is a no – brainer to copy, just about anything byte for byte, bit for bit, in a spot on manner.

It is a very difficult problem, with seemingly no solution in sight. And one can yell, cajole, coerce, until the cows come home, or the swallows come back from where ever the hell they have flown off to, it’s not going to solve the problem.

So, what’s a viable solution, well actually it’s multi-tiered one:

A.Legislation and law enforcement are good, but put some teeth into them Now that doesn’t mean fining some teenager living in the projects of the Bronx, $1,000 per song, movie or video, he or she has illegally downloaded. Just like you wouldn’t lock the town ‘stoner’ up in a Federal prison for smoking a ‘blunt’ behind the Dairy Queen. Though you most likely would want to go up higher in the criminal food chain, and impose stiffer penalties.

B.Oh, and remember those countries that I mentioned with all the pirated stuff. Well guess what many of them are our friends, ie we trade with them, we loan them money, we keep their governments from being overthrown, you know friend stuff. And, I am not just referring to some third world impoverished countries, but so called first world as well. Counterfeiting in many counties in not done in some small, dank basement. But rather is big business. This memo from the U.S. Dept Of State http://www.state.gov/e/eb/rls/rm/30717.htm , http://www.iipi.org/topics/Arts_culture_music.asp , from the IIPI, and this additional State Department memo illustrate the point http://cryptome.org/ip-war.htm as well as this from Europe show the scope of the problem http://europa.eu.int/rapid/pressReleasesAction.do?reference=MEMO/04/255&format=HTML&aged=0&language=EN&guiLanguage=en .Somewhat boring reading, but makes the point. What is our government, doing about international counterfeiting, smacking wrists.

C.Technology, it is a game of cops and robbers, of one upsmanship. The so-called good guys come up with something to keep the bad guys from stealing their stuff, the bad guys figure it out, defeat it, rinse and repeat, ad nauseum. Gotta, pump more money, time and energy, into that process, where does that money come from, take a guess.

D.We are almost ready to wrap, this is the part where the companies come in
Memo to: CEOs, CTOs, CFOs, CIOs, et al, it’s not 1995 anymore. The way you sell product is not the same as you did back then. E-commerce folks have a grasp of this, brick and mortar folks are catching up.

Delivering a product at a competitive price point, securing your infrastructure as much as possible (don’t be cheap with IT) This includes but is not limited to the securing of passwords, credit card information, etc. are some things that can keep piracy at bay. Be creative in your marketing, it is a very competitive marketplace.

Bug the hell,out of your trade associations, have that lobbyist, bug Wagington, again think food chain

Finally. I am thinking we need to have a summit with government, media suppliers, IT people, open source folks, electronic freedom folks, consumer groups, and other interested parties, to further hash this issue out

This is not just an intellectual property problem, but a dollars and cents problem, with international consequences that hurts us all.

[BeardedOne]

Unfortunately, we (Many of us) are in America in which most latch onto as the "Land of the free" (Emphasis on "FREE").

Lazy, spoiled, many illiterate (Or bordering on it), with (What some have referred to here) an "entitlement" to get what we want, when we want it, for little or no cost.

The average American hasn't a clue, or ignores it if they do, as to where most of their entertainment comes from. Music, viddies, porn, they all drop from the sky on a whim. I want it. I want it now. I want it free.

People suck. It's genetic, hereditary, and consistant.

And that's the hill you have to climb.

:soapbox

[blahblahblah]

Jenny,

hereby i'll try to repeat myself, and please, read my sentencies more carefully this time:


3. People that do not know how to use their brains, and do not have enough physical skills other than
nice looking bodies, OR (this is important) people not accepted by the society for some reasons, the
people who do not get enough economical and all other kind of help from the society in order to get rid of their
(often huge) personal problems. In order to make their living, they simply have to sell their souls and
their boides to a broad audience in a very low and miserable way. I see them as some kind of society victims,
and i personally feel sorry about this kind of people.

And the words above perfectly explain your situation:


McManaman you said that porn is a business that people go into because they lack the skill to do any other job...

I went to university, have worked in the insurance industry for most of my working life and (if I chose) certainly have the intelligence to do a 'normal' job. Running a decent website with regular updates isnt something you can learn to do in a week, in fact I spent 6 months learning!!

Why have I chosen to work in the adult industry...? you show me an insurance job where I can earn enough to pay for breast augmentation, Facial surgery, eventually SRS etc etc.. Transitioning isnt cheap you know!! I know for a lot of my friends this is the reason they escort.

So, what do you think?

[BeardedOne]

:!:

[joannajet]

Hi everyone,

On returning to this thread since my last post, it is gratifying to see so many posts offering such considered thoughts on this topic.
The appearance, between these, of a smattering of glory posts by pirates offering disdain for the consequences of their actions shows there will always be an element able to consider selfishness as an attribute and no words will change that.

But for the remaining majority, this thread appears to be about acknowledging the worth of pausing for thought before a right-click to piracy...
And it is through this pause that piracy becomes a matter of conscience rather than opportunity.

I therefore thank the majority.


With regards,


Joanna Jet
xxx

[stillies77]

Yar!