The right way to transition after 25 - Vicki Opinion

[SarahG]

Oh, whatever. I still think that old guy should give me some gold.

Good night.

Why, what are you willing to do to get it?

[TrueBeauty TS]

However, that is the kind of press we, as transsexuals, need for acceptance. Whether we like it or not, Hollywood is America's royalty. Having someone who millions admire marry a TS woman, particularly a beautiful TS woman, would change a lot of perceptions.

I do know of a couple like that. He has some fame & money and he is married to a beautiful post-op, but they are also stealth about it. So it does happen, but until people are willing to come "out" about it, it does no good.



.

[youcancallmeclaire]

That is why I made sure to say my "opinion" right in the topic header. Yes people can do whatever they want to do. However, there are more rational ways of progressing.

I don't think your analogy works all that well because there are GG's who do porn and there are guys who do. If anything, I feel porn actually is a controlling function over people's perceptions. This is a good thing. Guys are recognizing that TS women can look just as good and natural as GG's. This wouldn't have happened without porn.

Just the same, it would really move us forward a lot more if most of the attractive TS weren't hookers and sex workers. I can almost guarantee that some TS would be famous and married to someone famous in Hollywood if she was beautiful and not a sex worker. We need that here.

Anyway, it is my opinion, that girls in training would do well to follow my very good advice.

This is spot on. I always got flamed for suggesting the reason for our discrimination was all the media exposure that ugly cd-looking, clown-makeup trannies get. But somehow I don't think this is the type of forum who would be all up in arms over those kinds of comments.

This must be like my 300th post by now... Crazy.

[RangeHova]

If this person is happy and feels whole as a person, I don't feel anyone has the right to tell them that what they are doing is wrong. Who is it wrong for? You?

I think a part of it is just that. Girls who feel that they are above these 'hags' and don't want society to lump them into the same category. God forbid that the 'guy in dress' who mentall is just as transexual as the girl who transitioned at 14 and passes well be both seen as TS. I have heard many say that they should not even be labeld with the same terminology because of how they look. It is like they remind or slidify the the outside world's prejudgeing nature that that gorgeous girl really is a man.

I have seen far too many lines drawn between transwomen based on who transitioned when, tops vs bottoms, bisexual vs heterosexuals, those that live fulltime vs part timers, those that have had work done, those that do drag, those that escort or do porn, those that have had SRS, those that stunt... When in reality if you were born male but you genuine feel that you are a female then you, no matter how you look,dress or act are a transsexual.

I'm not saying that you have to befriend every trans girl in dress. I know that many girls that I know are careful not to introduce girls too deep in thier lives that don't pass because they end up getting them read in by association. Even with myself, I don't date girls that don't pass. So I get why some girls are standoffish to those girls that look 'bad' or unfeminine. It is not about taking them in and being BFFs or letting them teach you or run your life, just general respect for them having the courage to be who they feel they are. Just basic human respect.

I just can't allow myself to down them or to demean them and to tell them that they are wrong for living life how they feel they need to live thier live. I can't support them being fired for how they look, especially in a job like driving a truck.

I personaly think it is a shame that we, on this board of all places, are so quick to down a girl who may not pass. Some of those people are fine with that and have accepted that. If they can deal with it so be it. Society as a whole would be so qiuck to down most everyone here for either being transgendered or admirering those that are and here we are doing that same thing to others for not fitting a certain criteria.

So if a person waits until they are a ceratain older age they should just suffer? Who is to say what the cut off age should be? What about young girls that don't quite pass so well? Do they lose the right to live how they choose?

I'm with TrueBeauty TS when she said;

"My guard goes up whenever there is a 'Everyone should do it/be like me and this would be a great world.' "

and

"In a perfect world, we would all be smart & beautiful (like Vicki & I ) but it's not, and we can't live other peoples' lives for them or make their choices for them, even if they are good choices."

[Felicia Katt]

If this person is happy and feels whole as a person, I don't feel anyone has the right to tell them that what they are doing is wrong. Who is it wrong for? You?

I think a part of it is just that. Girls who feel that they are above these 'hags' and don't want society to lump them into the same category. God forbid that the 'guy in dress' who mentall is just as transexual as the girl who transitioned at 14 and passes well be both seen as TS. I have heard many say that they should not even be labeld with the same terminology because of how they look. It is like they remind or slidify the the outside world's prejudgeing nature that that gorgeous girl really is a man.

I have seen far too many lines drawn between transwomen based on who transitioned when, tops vs bottoms, bisexual vs heterosexuals, those that live fulltime vs part timers, those that have had work done, those that do drag, those that escort or do porn, those that have had SRS, those that stunt... When in reality if you were born male but you genuine feel that you are a female then you, no matter how you look,dress or act are a transsexual.

I'm not saying that you have to befriend every trans girl in dress. I know that many girls that I know are careful not to introduce girls too deep in thier lives that don't pass because they end up getting them read in by association. Even with myself, I don't date girls that don't pass. So I get why some girls are standoffish to those girls that look 'bad' or unfeminine. It is not about taking them in and being BFFs or letting them teach you or run your life, just general respect for them having the courage to be who they feel they are. Just basic human respect.

I just can't allow myself to down them or to demean them and to tell them that they are wrong for living life how they feel they need to live thier live. I can't support them being fired for how they look, especially in a job like driving a truck.

I personaly think it is a shame that we, on this board of all places, are so quick to down a girl who may not pass. Some of those people are fine with that and have accepted that. If they can deal with it so be it. Society as a whole would be so qiuck to down most everyone here for either being transgendered or admirering those that are and here we are doing that same thing to others for not fitting a certain criteria.

So if a person waits until they are a ceratain older age they should just suffer? Who is to say what the cut off age should be? What about young girls that don't quite pass so well? Do they lose the right to live how they choose?

I'm with TrueBeauty TS when she said;

"My guard goes up whenever there is a 'Everyone should do it/be like me and this would be a great world.' "

and

"In a perfect world, we would all be smart & beautiful (like Vicki & I ) but it's not, and we can't live other peoples' lives for them or make their choices for them, even if they are good choices."

[SarahG]

If this person is happy and feels whole as a person, I don't feel anyone has the right to tell them that what they are doing is wrong. Who is it wrong for? You?

I think a part of it is just that. Girls who feel that they are above these 'hags' and don't want society to lump them into the same category. God forbid that the 'guy in dress' who mentall is just as transexual as the girl who transitioned at 14 and passes well be both seen as TS. I have heard many say that they should not even be labeld with the same terminology because of how they look. It is like they remind or slidify the the outside world's prejudgeing nature that that gorgeous girl really is a man.

I have seen far too many lines drawn between transwomen based on who transitioned when, tops vs bottoms, bisexual vs heterosexuals, those that live fulltime vs part timers, those that have had work done, those that do drag, those that escort or do porn, those that have had SRS, those that stunt... When in reality if you were born male but you genuine feel that you are a female then you, no matter how you look,dress or act are a transsexual.

I'm not saying that you have to befriend every trans girl in dress. I know that many girls that I know are careful not to introduce girls too deep in thier lives that don't pass because they end up getting them read in by association. Even with myself, I don't date girls that don't pass. So I get why some girls are standoffish to those girls that look 'bad' or unfeminine. It is not about taking them in and being BFFs or letting them teach you or run your life, just general respect for them having the courage to be who they feel they are. Just basic human respect.

I just can't allow myself to down them or to demean them and to tell them that they are wrong for living life how they feel they need to live thier live. I can't support them being fired for how they look, especially in a job like driving a truck.

I personaly think it is a shame that we, on this board of all places, are so quick to down a girl who may not pass. Some of those people are fine with that and have accepted that. If they can deal with it so be it. Society as a whole would be so qiuck to down most everyone here for either being transgendered or admirering those that are and here we are doing that same thing to others for not fitting a certain criteria.

So if a person waits until they are a ceratain older age they should just suffer? Who is to say what the cut off age should be? What about young girls that don't quite pass so well? Do they lose the right to live how they choose?

I'm with TrueBeauty TS when she said;

"My guard goes up whenever there is a 'Everyone should do it/be like me and this would be a great world.' "

and

"In a perfect world, we would all be smart & beautiful (like Vicki & I ) but it's not, and we can't live other peoples' lives for them or make their choices for them, even if they are good choices."

Part of the issue, I suspect, is a division in terms of personal philosophies... there are realists and then there are the idealists.

Sure, it would be nice if it was as simple as what one's mental state of existance is. It would be nice if everyone could easily start at a young age, it would be nice if discrimination wasn't as wide spread, legal, and accepted as it is.

But the world does not- at this point in time- work that way, not yet anyway. With this taken into consideration, people need to remember beyond the idealism, social-political theories, and so on that certain things have ramifications on a microscopic personal and macroscopic societal level. As things are now- in most places- if you go and transistion late, go fulltime on top of that without doing certain things ahead of time in the process- you're going to get flak... what that flak entiles IMO is going to varry from person to person, time & place, etc- but it is unrealistic to just go fulltime over night without doing anything and expect to never encounter any discrimination, any insults, any odd looks, etc.

Looks matter because perception matters. Any minority group- no matter WHAT the demographic is, has a quality of life (legally, politically and in welfare) which is dependent upon the will- the consciousness- of the general public/the majority/etc. The black civil rights movement would never have achieved what it did, when it did without segments of the majority changing their mindsets on the issue (in America this is especially accredited to the moderate Jewish groups/segments of the general population). Before that- women's suffrage was not feasible without the men- the ones politically in control- doing what needed to be done as figures in the majority to make it happen (in the end it really doesn't matter how many old ladies take hatchets to saloons if they're ignored, stigmatized, killed, shipped away or otherwise dismissed).

The more normal the trans community is perceived to be by the majority to be, the easier it would be for acceptance, reforms, aid and other things that would make the real world more tolerable to the rest. Stereotypes regarding trans people -regardless of the validity of such stereotypes- have a major impact on the way people see us.

There have been times and places where, homosexual groups- as a case study in terms of such issues, merely took the idealistic social-political theory stances, pleading with the general public for acceptance, tolerance (note the two are different) and it most certainly did not work out in their favor in certain parts of Europe between the two world wars...

[BrendaQG]

If this person is happy and feels whole as a person, I don't feel anyone has the right to tell them that what they are doing is wrong. Who is it wrong for? You?

I think a part of it is just that. Girls who feel that they are above these 'hags' and don't want society to lump them into the same category. God forbid that the 'guy in dress' who mentall is just as transexual as the girl who transitioned at 14 and passes well be both seen as TS. I have heard many say that they should not even be labeld with the same terminology because of how they look. It is like they remind or slidify the the outside world's prejudgeing nature that that gorgeous girl really is a man.

I have seen far too many lines drawn between transwomen based on who transitioned when, tops vs bottoms, bisexual vs heterosexuals, those that live fulltime vs part timers, those that have had work done, those that do drag, those that escort or do porn, those that have had SRS, those that stunt... When in reality if you were born male but you genuine feel that you are a female then you, no matter how you look,dress or act are a transsexual.

I'm not saying that you have to befriend every trans girl in dress. I know that many girls that I know are careful not to introduce girls too deep in thier lives that don't pass because they end up getting them read in by association. Even with myself, I don't date girls that don't pass. So I get why some girls are standoffish to those girls that look 'bad' or unfeminine. It is not about taking them in and being BFFs or letting them teach you or run your life, just general respect for them having the courage to be who they feel they are. Just basic human respect.

I just can't allow myself to down them or to demean them and to tell them that they are wrong for living life how they feel they need to live thier live. I can't support them being fired for how they look, especially in a job like driving a truck.

I personaly think it is a shame that we, on this board of all places, are so quick to down a girl who may not pass. Some of those people are fine with that and have accepted that. If they can deal with it so be it. Society as a whole would be so qiuck to down most everyone here for either being transgendered or admirering those that are and here we are doing that same thing to others for not fitting a certain criteria.

So if a person waits until they are a ceratain older age they should just suffer? Who is to say what the cut off age should be? What about young girls that don't quite pass so well? Do they lose the right to live how they choose?

I'm with TrueBeauty TS when she said;

"My guard goes up whenever there is a 'Everyone should do it/be like me and this would be a great world.' "

and

"In a perfect world, we would all be smart & beautiful (like Vicki & I ) but it's not, and we can't live other peoples' lives for them or make their choices for them, even if they are good choices."

@RangeHova



WHERE THE HELL DID I SAY ANYTHING LIKE THIS PERSONS TRANSITION IS "WRONG"!? Or implied as you infered that I do that I am "above" anyone. Yeesh I eiher get one person accusing me of "ghettoizing" myself or I get this crapola.



I have said that this person could have nothing to teach me about life as a transsexual. I have said that this person should not be surprised that they were discriminated against due to how they look.

I have never said that she is less transsexual than somoen who passes and transitioned young. I have said that her advice on how to live as a transsexual would be far less valueable than the advice of a person who is her same age but has been living as a TS woman for a long time. Understand.

IF YOU MUST BREAK ME DOWN LIKE THAT DO IT FOR THE RIGHT REASONS.

[HighRise818]

Vicki for the win!