Fuck the Police State

[TempestTS]

The politicians ARE listening. What they're hearing is people want more police, more guards, more prisons and tougher policies. Instead of advocating revolution, I'm suggesting we change our collective attitude. Don't vote for these policies and the numbskulls who advocate them. Currently that would mean voting against the prevailing culture. But hey, you're a rebel; you can do it. But not voting isn't enough. You also have to vote. You got to find your local candidates who support sane policies and support them.

Currently - you mean like the culture of fear we have had for the last 100+ years?

Do you think I dont vote? what gave you that idea?

I just dont believe its capable of doing a damn thing but for the one in a billion chance that it might I trot myself out and go through the motions regardless of my personal lack of faith in the system and I encourage everyone to do the same - I actually did a public service message for one of the Indi TV stations that does a Music video show last election - kinda a rock the vote type thing

[trish]

Sorry you didn't like the dog & pony show, teach...but your lesson is getting so fucking boring. The police are out of control, not in control. We live in a dysfunctional democratic-republic, not a police state. Gun manufacturers profit from weapons intensive public policies, so of course they'll support and lobby for those policies; but politicians still have to be elected to office on a regular basis. The electorate just happens to love policies that you and I both know will lead to police misconduct. But that one feature alone doesn't make it a police state. And banks...well banks will profit regardless.

[TempestTS]

Sorry you didn't like the dog & pony show, teach...but your lesson is getting so fucking boring. The police are out of control, not in control. We live in a dysfunctional democratic-republic, not a police state. Gun manufacturers profit from weapons intensive public policies, so of course they'll support and lobby for those policies; but politicians still have to be elected to office on a regular basis. The electorate just happens to love policies that you and I both know will lead to police misconduct. But that one feature alone doesn't make it a police state. And banks...well banks will profit regardless.

And yet apparently you have learned nothing

In order for something to be continually out of control those in control must allow it - and that entity isn't the public.

The public does not in any way shape or form "Love the Polices" that lead to police misconduct - they FEAR the alternative...

And that my dear is a Huge difference.

[my my my!]

I keep saying , that the USA is Indeed in the beginning stages of becoming a police state. Will it ever become a full fledged true to wikipedia definition of Police State, Police State? Perhaps.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/1...-Police-State#

is it Nazi era Germany already? fuck no, even suggesting that is truly ludicrous.

can the rise of police brutality , erosion of liberties, objectionable foreign and domestic policies , and not evaluating, assessing, and adjusting to these lead to a police state? Yes.

[TempestTS]

I keep saying , that the USA is Indeed in the beginning stages of becoming a police state. Will it ever become a full fledged true to wikipedia definition of Police State, Police State? Perhaps.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/1...-Police-State#

is it Nazi era Germany already? fuck no, even suggesting that is truly ludicrous.

can the rise of police brutality , erosion of liberties, objectionable foreign and domestic policies , and not evaluating, assessing, and adjusting to these lead to a police state? Yes.

Thanks for the link - great read

[TempestTS]

another little tidd bit - the number of Americans killed by cops now out numbers the number of American soldiers killed during the Iraq War during virtually the same time span

http://thefreethoughtproject.com/ame...lled-iraq-war/

[trish]

Throughout this thread I often thought, “What the fuck! This disagreement simply hinges on the definition of “police state. Why don’t I just agree to the non-standard use which you’re applying and get on with a discussion of the root causes of increased police misconduct in the U.S.?”

The problem is that ultimately the disagreement is not semantic. I think the root causes lie with the electorate and American culture. I see the profiteering of banks and arms manufacturers as a synergistic, not as primary or first causes. Tempest, I believe, portrays the gun manufacturers and the bankers not only as primary causative agents of police misconduct, but as deliberately acting via that misconduct to control our political beliefs.

To me that’s just loony. But if that were the only bone of contention, I could leave the argument as is and agree to disagree. But the one facet of Tempest’s point of view that I cannot abide is her contention that the only solution to the current spate of misconduct is to go outside the law. She claims this cannot be fixed with ink on paper. We need to (if I read her correctly) sidestep democratic procedure (perhaps peacefully through general strikes as in Iceland, or perhaps otherwise) and force the government to “resign.” Only then can we set up a government that writes the banks out of power and only then can we reboot the nation.

To me this unconstitutional action sounds not only unnecessary, but like the utmost folly. Unnecessary because it can be fixed with appropriate legislation and oversight. Folly, because of all the people it will destroy who depend on government services, safety nets and jobs. Folly because it’ll never happen. Folly because should it happen that we shut the government and force all our representatives to resign, it would likely result in an actual police state. It’s like firing the government before we get a chance to elect a Hitler to office...like there won’t be any powers (say within our own military) willing to sweep in to fill the vacuum.

We could continue this thread by discussing what are the real root causes of police misconduct, the roots causes of crime and why we think we need so many enforcement agencies and police. But we’re not going to go there because we’ll always come back to the fantasy that our minds are being controlled and manipulated by mass media who in turn are bought by Wall Street bankers and the only way to defeat those mind controlling Wall Street bankers is to overturn the Government.

And so we find ourselves at an impasse.

[TempestTS]

Throughout this thread I often thought, “What the fuck! This disagreement simply hinges on the definition of “police state. Why don’t I just agree to the non-standard use which you’re applying and get on with a discussion of the root causes of increased police misconduct in the U.S.?”

The problem is that ultimately the disagreement is not semantic. I think the root causes lie with the electorate and American culture. I see the profiteering of banks and arms manufacturers as a synergistic, not as primary or first causes. Tempest, I believe, portrays the gun manufacturers and the bankers not only as primary causative agents of police misconduct, but as deliberately acting via that misconduct to control our political beliefs.

To me that’s just loony. But if that were the only bone of contention, I could leave the argument as is and agree to disagree. But the one facet of Tempest’s point of view that I cannot abide is her contention that the only solution to the current spate of misconduct is to go outside the law. She claims this cannot be fixed with ink on paper. We need to (if I read her correctly) sidestep democratic procedure (perhaps peacefully through general strikes as in Iceland, or perhaps otherwise) and force the government to “resign.” Only then can we set up a government that writes the banks out of power and only then can we reboot the nation.

To me this unconstitutional action sounds not only unnecessary, but like the utmost folly. Unnecessary because it can be fixed with appropriate legislation and oversight. Folly, because of all the people it will destroy who depend on government services, safety nets and jobs. Folly because it’ll never happen. Folly because should it happen that we shut the government and force all our representatives to resign, it would likely result in an actual police state. It’s like firing the government before we get a chance to elect a Hitler to office...like there won’t be any powers (say within our own military) willing to sweep in to fill the vacuum.

We could continue this thread by discussing what are the real root causes of police misconduct, the roots causes of crime and why we think we need so many enforcement agencies and police. But we’re not going to go there because we’ll always come back to the fantasy that our minds are being controlled and manipulated by mass media who in turn are bought by Wall Street bankers and the only way to defeat those mind controlling Wall Street bankers is to overturn the Government.

And so we find ourselves at an impasse.

"To me this unconstitutional action sounds not only unnecessary, but like the utmost folly."

You DO realize that the action your describing is exactly how this country was founded...

Irony... do you taste it?

[TempestTS]

http://www.ctpost.com/local/article/...sh-5626425.php



BRIDGEPORT -- A state trooper, caught on his own dashboard camera stealing a dying motorcyclist's cash and gold crucifix, is facing up to a year and a half in prison.
Aaron "AJ" Huntsman, a 19-year veteran of the State Police, pleaded guilty Wednesday afternoon under the Alford Doctrine to third-degree larceny and tampering with evidence -- both felonies.
Although Huntsman, 45, could have faced up to 10 years in prison on the two charges, Superior Court Judge Robert Devlin said he would impose a term in prison of 16 months, followed by five years of probation.
Huntsman's lawyer, Ryan McGuigan, does have the right to argue for a lesser term when Huntsman is sentenced Oct. 3.


Huntsman walked out of the courtroom with a big smile on his face following the hearing. He declined comment.




---
Here's the kicker TWO felonies - guilty - and only gets 16 months PLUS he gets to plead for a lesser penalty during sentencing -


No wonder he's smiling - he's getting a better deal than anyone else could possibly hope for.
The system Does NOT correct itself - this is barely a slap on the wrist and the ONLY reason its happening at all is because he's caught completely on video... otherwise it would never have even been investigated - civilians who question cops actions are completely ignored unless there is so much evidence that it gains public outcry then they do their little judicial dance like this one and make it quietly go away for with as minor of a sentence as possible

[TempestTS]

Meanwhile in America