Is Tgirl a better word - and should that become the norm?

[crystalsopen]

We are human.
We both live on Earth.
We both breath oxygen.
We both have hearts.
We both have feelings.
We both have minds.
We both face fears.
We both face insecurities.
We both have dreams.
We both have hopes.
We both desire love.
We both desire to be loved.

Do I need to go on?

...

I will state this plainly - ANY Trans-Activism that does not start with the premise that we are all human and equally deserving of respect is doomed to fail because there is no argument that I've come across to make a valid point for Trans-equality otherwise.

This is purely a numbers game for me. Transsexuals lack the votes and numbers to accomplish anything. Period. That is just simple math. They must get some fucking humility and ask for help. This is the way the Transgender community (and all other communities) can help the Transsexual one and why the two must unify.

I agree that appealing to our shared humanity is the most effective form of advocacy. I and think that showing are selves as people has made things better in recent years. I also agree that the decision to or not to transition is a personal and complicated one. I am not a "professional advocate", but I have helped one of my friends who is more politically active try to get slightly better services for homeless gender non-conforming people, after one of our friends was severely beaten outside a shelter. I have many friends who have detransitioned (temporarily or permanently) mostly for economic reasons, related to employment discrimination. And others who live and work as male for only those reasons. I have no issues people who choose not to transition. Its a hard road that is not right for everyone. People who have not gone down that road, in my opinion do not have the experience to lead others though it, but they can be great advocates and allies.

I hope I bring a little more light and little less heat here,
Crystal

[MrsKellyPierce]

Most crossdressers don't want to help us..they vote Republican and are Republican.

So not quite sure of the UNITY there lol

[GroobyKrissy]

Edited by me.

You know what I'm fine with that. Do you wanna know why?? You didn't say mock, disparage etc..

Kelly,

I'm not worked up. We're still having a discussion. I'm not angry. I'm not mad. I've cursed once for emphasis and it wasn't at you. I still respect you as an individual. I'm not anything but trying to make some points.

Maybe I have a very, VERY basic misunderstanding of your personal goals here so let me ask this:

Do you think (MtF obviously) Transsexuals are women?
Do you think that there should be men, women, and Transsexuals or that there should just be "men" and "women"?

Because it kinda seems like you're not really sure... which I think is pretty much the entirety of the fight Transsexuals want. Treat them like women. They are women. Don't label them as "other" since they are women.

[GroobyKrissy]

Most crossdressers don't want to help us..they vote Republican and are Republican.

So not quite sure of the UNITY there lol

Can I have your data to back up that claim?

If you don't have any... retract the statement.

[MrsKellyPierce]

Can I have your data to back up that claim?

If you don't have any... retract the statement.

All the crossdressers I have met at parties or interacted with online have been Republican..

A big portion of my fan base are crossdressers TBH, because most of my earlier roles were as a top. They want the sissification etc.

I get crossdressers yelling at me constantly for my views and are PURE REPUBLICANS..

And all the ones I met at rallies, support groups, and conventions were also REPUBLICAN..

I don't think voting Republican does the TRANS-COMMUNITY any service and I even had crossdressers tell us transsexuals to shut up and don't ruffle feathers.

The list goes on...

Krissy you are just trying to argue to argue now..

[MrsKellyPierce]

Edited by me.



Kelly,

I'm not worked up. We're still having a discussion. I'm not angry. I'm not mad. I've cursed once for emphasis and it wasn't at you. I still respect you as an individual. I'm not anything but trying to make some points.

Maybe I have a very, VERY basic misunderstanding of your personal goals here so let me ask this:

Do you think (MtF obviously) Transsexuals are women?
Do you think that there should be men, women, and Transsexuals or that there should just be "men" and "women"?

Because it kinda seems like you're not really sure... which I think is pretty much the entirety of the fight Transsexuals want. Treat them like women. They are women. Don't label them as "other" since they are women.

I feel we are women, but I think we are TRANS-Women.

We are a different type of woman, because our femininity happens up stairs the outside is a plus.

Where as a CIS woman are women by society standards and scientific standards.

I think society puts too much emphasis on body and private parts to be honest.

Which I feel is what you are doing, because you are adamant in saying we relate to one another.

We only relate to one another by being born genetically male..the rest ends there...as far as gender identity goes.

[msbhaven]

Look Krissy the simple fact is you don't get it. And the reason you don't get it is that you aren't a transsexual. It's OK honey really. I didn't get it too well either before I transitioned.

From the other side of the fence I look back and wonder how I could have been so blind about it despite the fact that I WAS transsexual even though I hadn't transitioned yet. The answer is that I simply lacked the life experience living as my true self to fully comprehend what that would mean. At the time I had also not spent years on HRT, and I promise you that hormones WILL change your brain. But beyond that I had not given up the privileges and security that are part and parcel of being an outwardly hetero male in this society. I hadn't gone through the struggles of a legal name change, hadn't dealt with the misogynist behavior of men towards women, hadn't dealt with the mess that medical care becomes when you are born with male genitalia but live your life as a woman. In short I had no concept of what it was to live my life as a woman or as transitioned transsexual until I actually lived it. Because of that I was completely unqualified to determine questions like, "Is the word tranny offensive?" And I was utterly unsuited to speak for the experience of transsexual women.

I don't think transvestites or cross dressers are less then what I am I just think that they are different from what I am. They have a different life experience and are better able to advocate for their group then I would ever hope to be. I certainly believe that some of them really are transsexuals and that one day they may transition, but until they start that journey they have no place speaking for me or any other transsexual.

You are not less then or inferior to me or to Kelly or Bella or any other transsexual woman, you are simply different from us.

[GroobyKrissy]

Edited by me. Context is not changed.

Do I feel a transsexual can be crossdresser?? No...I don't..

Do I feel a transsexual can be a drag queen? Yes, I do..because it's a job..female impersonation is a job..Do I feel more transsexuals would be pageant girls and/or strippers if they could make a living that way? YES, I feel that drag is an outlet for them.

A transsexual is someone that identifies as the OPPOSITE SEX they were BORN..

Good grief.

Kelly... surely you MUST realize how insanely irrational this is.

A crossdresser cannot be Transsexual but a Drag Queen CAN? WTF???

I suppose the next questions would logically be:

Can a Crossdresser be a Drag Queen? To which you would logically, in fact HAVE to answer "NO" (because then crossdressers could indeed be Transsexual)

Likewise I could also ask, "Well then, can a Drag Queen be a crossdresser?" Which again, you would have to answer "NO" (for the same reason).

Both of those answer are pure silliness. Crossdressers and Drag Queens overlap all the time. I think that is indisputable.

Simply put, you, in fact, having already stated in writing that you were once a Drag Queen, must include them as being possibly Transsexual since you now claim the title yourself. It's not hard to see what you're doing. You're unwilling to admit you were ever a crossdresser so you substitute Drag Queen for the title... which really, and I mean this with all due respect, is utterly laughable. Just be honest and say, "Yes, I was once lived my life as a male and wore women's clothing. In that respect I am like you. Please add that to the list of things that make us similar even though I am not willing to publicly admit it."

This is insanity and I don't really feel we can continue a conversation if this is your point of view because you're not being honest and / or rational.

Anyway, like I said, I'm not mad. I think you have a good heart. Confused on some issues, but you have taken the time to write and I think that is worth something.

Thanks for the discussion, which I have enjoyed, and I wish you a good rest of your day and good luck with your book.

[MrsKellyPierce]

Look Krissy the simple fact is you don't get it. And the reason you don't get it is that you aren't a transsexual. It's OK honey really. I didn't get it too well either before I transitioned.

From the other side of the fence I look back and wonder how I could have been so blind about it despite the fact that I WAS transsexual even though I hadn't transitioned yet. The answer is that I simply lacked the life experience living as my true self to fully comprehend what that would mean. At the time I had also not spent years on HRT, and I promise you that hormones WILL change your brain. But beyond that I had not given up the privileges and security that are part and parcel of being an outwardly hetero male in this society. I hadn't gone through the struggles of a legal name change, hadn't dealt with the misogynist behavior of men towards women, hadn't dealt with the mess that medical care becomes when you are born with male genitalia but live your life as a woman. In short I had no concept of what it was to live my life as a woman or as transitioned transsexual until I actually lived it. Because of that I was completely unqualified to determine questions like, "Is the word tranny offensive?" And I was utterly unsuited to speak for the experience of transsexual women.

I don't think transvestites or cross dressers are less then what I am I just think that they are different from what I am. They have a different life experience and are better able to advocate for their group then I would ever hope to be. I certainly believe that some of them really are transsexuals and that one day they may transition, but until they start that journey they have no place speaking for me or any other transsexual.

You are not less then or inferior to me or to Kelly or Bella or any other transsexual woman, you are simply different from us.

Well said hon

[msbhaven]

Edited by me. Context is not changed.



Good grief.

Kelly... surely you MUST realize how insanely irrational this is.

A crossdresser cannot be Transsexual but a Drag Queen CAN? WTF???

I suppose the next questions would logically be:

Can a Crossdresser be a Drag Queen? To which you would logically, in fact HAVE to answer "NO" (because then crossdressers could indeed be Transsexual)

Likewise I could also ask, "Well then, can a Drag Queen be a crossdresser?" Which again, you would have to answer "NO" (for the same reason).

Both of those answer are pure silliness. Crossdressers and Drag Queens overlap all the time. I think that is indisputable.

Simply put, you, in fact, having already stated in writing that you were once a Drag Queen, must include them as being possibly Transsexual since you claim the title yourself. It's not hard to see what you're doing. You're unwilling to admit you were ever a crossdresser so you substitute Drag Queen for the title... which really, and I mean this with all due respect, is utterly laughable.

This is insanity and I don't really feel we can continue a conversation if this is your point of view.

Anyway, like I said, I'm not mad. I think you have a good heart. Confused on some issues but you have taken the time to write and I think that is worth something.

Thanks for the discussion and I wish you a good rest of your day.

Drag Queen is a job.

Cross Dressing is a fetish.

Transsexual is a state of mind.

A transsexual can start out as a part time cross dresser, get work as a Drag Queen and eventually transition to full time as a fully accepted transsexual female (that's my term of course not a society one).

Cross dressers can be drag queens but a TRUE cross dresser is not a transsexual and will never transition to full time status.

Transsexuals can work as drag queens but are not defined by their job title.

Hope this helps your understanding.

BTW these are my opinions only and may differ from those of Kelly or other transsexuals