Whoa...This shit is serious! Tranny*****$10,000 REWARD***** - t4m - 36 (costa mesa)

[btmmale4toptg]

Come on Trish..that on it's face value sounds more like rhetoric that realism.
Just because one reaches a point to be considered "passing" still shouldn't transcend the facts that they are Transexual and should be proud of it. The very premise of being happy starts with embracing what and who you are.

Maybe because of my point that, today, too many trans women (more the norm than the exception) end up living lifestyles, for many reasons that I do understand, that don't shine a positive light on the TG community as a whole. That in turn makes the trans women Trish speaks of not want to be associated with that part of the trans world (Escorts, porn stars, bar girls).

Trish, I do know there are many trans women living normal everyday lives (I do know many, contrary to what you may assume about me). Even a decade ago, it was much easier to find an actual "date" than it is today. So *maybe* your thinking and viewpoint is a tad bit outdated.

Currently, the general perception of "transsexuals" today has highly negative tones because exactly what you say. There are many trans women who do lead normal lives, but the positive in that is downed out by the negatives of that general perception and many of your trans sisters who do opt to do porn, escort, and live the party lifestyle.

So where are the voices of the "normal" trans woman to offset the negative perceptions and stereotypes?

[trish]

Maybe because of my point that, today, too many trans women (more the norm than the exception) end up living lifestyles, for many reasons that I do understand, that don't shine a positive light on the TG community as a whole. That in turn makes the trans women Trish speaks of not want to be associated with that part of the trans world (Escorts, porn stars, bar girls).

Bullshit. Now besides calling them thieves you think you know what motivates their desire to pass; i.e. you're now claiming transsexual women desire to pass unclocked so as not to be confused with models, escorts and porn stars. Yeah, right. You should write that up in the New England Journal of Medicine. The majority of transsexual women are invisible because they want to pass as women in normal society.

I do know there are many trans women living normal everyday lives (...). Even a decade ago, it was much easier to find ...

So maybe your thinking and viewpoint are just a tad bit dated.

Currently, the general perception of "transsexuals" today has highly negative tones because exactly what you say. There are many trans women who do lead normal lives, but the positive in that is downed out by the negatives of that general perception and many of your trans sisters who do opt to do porn, escort, and live the party lifestyle.

A dim light begins to dawn in a tiny brain. Now apply that to your own perception. (BTW, I concede to the general perception of escorts etc., but not to its veracity).

So where are the voices of the "normal" trans woman to offset the negative perceptions and stereotypes?

Doesn't matter. Thanks to modern medical advances we're passing and my point is made. Your sample is skewed. Your conclusions are biased. You've no warrant to general claims concerning the virtues or vices of transsexual women in general.

[trish]

Yeah , Trish!
William S Burroughs readings and Laurie Andersons' music...what a great collaboration that was!

"Sun's going down ,like a big bald head
Behind the boulevard
It's Sharkey's Night.
Yes
It's Sharkey's Night tonight!"

Excellent piece. And can you believe two uncivilized louts gave Burroughs and Anderson thumbs down! Amazing.

[btmmale4toptg]

Your sample is skewed. Your conclusions are biased. You've no warrant to general claims concerning the virtues or vices of transsexual women in general.

Your thinking isn't a bit skewed too? And your conclusions aren't biased as well?

Also, you discount anything I have to say simply because I myself am not trans, hence you discount anything anyone else says about the trans community since they aren't trans either, regardless of our own personal experiences within the trans community. That is just closed minded and insulting.

You also insult the many men like me who have spent a lifetime with trans women as our partners.

I guess the saying holds true, "Opinions are like assholes, EVERYONE has one!"

Just because you're trans doesn't make you the almighty authority on trans issues and it is simply your "opinion".

[trish]

you discount anything I have to say simply because I myself am not trans

Okay. Show me the link where I argue from the premise that you're not a trans. I dare you to find it. I argued from premise that most transsexual women are hidden from your view and you therefore have to warrant to draw conclusions about all or most transsexuals. When you couldn't find a way around that argument to cried about how come transsexual women are vocal, why don't we stand up for our "cause." Well it doesn't matter because by making that complaint you just conceded my point.

You also insult the many men like me who have spent a lifetime with trans women as our partners.

Please go back and see who slung the first insult. No, better yet, let's just look at your main premise which is essentially most transsexual women are bad-apples, not much unlike that thief that you open this thread with. They're untrustworthy verging on the criminal. According to you it's just the norm for all transsexual women. That's not an insult?! An insult to all of us?! And you have the gall to whine like a little bitch that I retaliated in kind?! Grow a fuckin' pair.

[runningdownthatdream]

Okay. Show me the link where I argue from the premise that you're not a trans. I dare you to find it. I argued from premise that most transsexual women are hidden from your view and you therefore have to warrant to draw conclusions about all or most transsexuals. When you couldn't find a way around that argument to cried about how come transsexual women are vocal, why don't we stand up for our "cause." Well it doesn't matter because by making that complaint you just conceded my point.

Please go back and see who slung the first insult. No, better yet, let's just look at your main premise which is essentially most transsexual women are bad-apples, not much unlike that thief that you open this thread with. They're untrustworthy verging on the criminal. According to you it's just the norm for all transsexual women. That's not an insult?! An insult to all of us?! And you have the gall to whine like a little bitch that I retaliated in kind?! Grow a fuckin' pair.

You beat me to it - his moniker Bottom Male seems apt.

At the root of his whining seems to be his belief that he knows transsexual women better than they know themselves and this because he's dated them exclusively. It's a similar situation with those white women who exclusively date black men or white men who exclusively date oriental women, etc. Familiarity does breed contempt especially when that familiarity is with person or persons unlike our own personal concept of 'the norm'. In his view he's somehow special for 'accepting' transsexuals and more so because he dates them exclusively!

[trish]

You beat me to it - his moniker Bottom Male seems apt.

At the root of his whining seems to be his belief that he knows transsexual women better than they know themselves and this because he's dated them exclusively. It's a similar situation with those white women who exclusively date black men or white men who exclusively date oriental women, etc. Familiarity does breed contempt especially when that familiarity is with person or persons unlike our own personal concept of 'the norm'. In his view he's somehow special for 'accepting' transsexuals and more so because he dates them exclusively!

Thanks for the support.

[trish]

Let me take the opportunity to correct my typos in the first half of above post.

Okay. Show me the link where I argue from the premise that you're not a trans. I dare you to find it. I argued from [the] premise that most transsexual women are hidden from your view and you therefore have [no] warrant to draw conclusions about all or most transsexuals. When you couldn't find a way around that argument to cried about how come transsexual women [aren't] vocal [and] why don't we stand up for our "cause." Well it doesn't matter because by making that complaint you just conceded my point.

[Edits in square brackets]

[Stavros]

Currently, the general perception of "transsexuals" today has highly negative tones because exactly what you say. There are many trans women who do lead normal lives, but the positive in that is downed out by the negatives of that general perception and many of your trans sisters who do opt to do porn, escort, and live the party lifestyle.

So where are the voices of the "normal" trans woman to offset the negative perceptions and stereotypes?

I find it hard to believe that decades after Stonewall this rubbish masquerading as fact is even being discussed -there have always been transexual prostitutes -you can read about them in the Autobiography of Benvenuto Cellini, composed between 1558 and 1563-; the composer Schubert was alleged to have a fascination with transexuals in Vienna in the early 19th century; Salvador Dali jacked off to shemales most of his life, and so on and so on. And if some transexuals are forced to live on the margins of society -as many of those involved at Stonewall were- then you can add dope and booze into the mix. Lots of young people snort a line, pop pills and turn tricks -they usually move on to other things some time later.

Transexuals since Stonewall have become established characters in soap operas (eg, Corononation St); they have appeared in films and tv ads, hold positions of academic respectability in universities, have been elected to political office, have written over 50 books and received awards and recognition from across the world (eg Jan Morris) but all you can think of is some scantily clad hooker with a drug habit lowering the tone of the neighborhood. And since most transexuals wouldn't really look good in white boots and mini-skirt, its probably just as well they carry on leading their lives on a day to day basis without being stereotyped because of the assumed visibility of a minority. But then you wouldn't say all those Black American men and Latinos in prison are giving their fellow Americans an image problem, now, would you?

[kj312]

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