The Truth About the Economy

[onmyknees]

What is sad is anyone who would believe anything they read or hear without fact checking it. Take this guys points one by one and you see its distorted, disingenuous, or factually inaccurate.

The National average wage index for the last 10 years has increased by 50%. Thats barely increasing? Thats 26% growth in 10 years after inflationary adjustments.

Capitol gains is only taxed at 15%? Maybe he should have included the fact that that is ONLY long-term CGT. The current rate on short-term CGT is 33%. Small fact to leave out.

As Ronaldo Maximus famously said...."There you go again" Stop with the facts already Faldur...will ya? This isn't about facts....it's about hope and change.

[BluegrassCat]

What is sad is anyone who would believe anything they read or hear without fact checking it. Take this guys points one by one and you see its distorted, disingenuous, or factually inaccurate.

The National average wage index for the last 10 years has increased by 50%. Thats barely increasing? Thats 26% growth in 10 years after inflationary adjustments.

I know it shouldn't surprise me anymore to see a conservative take some factual presentation, accuse the presenter of being disingenuous and then proceed to make his own grossly inaccurate and misleading statements but it still irks me.
So this big 50% growth over the past 10 years "after inflation" you're slamming Reich for failing to mention would be quite damning...if it was true. But in fact, these numbers have NOT been adjusted for inflation. This increase IS the inflation adjustment! You're looking at inflation adjustments and calling them wage gains.
And median wages (the much more useful measure if you care about how most Americans are doing) actually dropped (after inflation) from 1998 to 2008, the first decade we've failed to see wage growth since the 1930's.

[trish]

As Ronaldo Maximus famously said...."There you go again" Stop with the facts already Faldur...will ya? This isn't about facts....it's about hope and change.

Funny picture. You and Faldur don't deal in facts. You two are always and forever being takin' in and attempting to take others in with cartoons and buffoonery. To any one new here your latest woul be very informative. It informs us that you're an extremely biased clown whose claim to the "facts" can't be taken at his word. But we already knew that.

[joeninety]

Got to say i had a look at some of those figures and they are not really conclusive as they may say what is taxable and who is taxed at what rate but lets not kid ourselves here the super rich individuals and companies who hold the majority of the wealth are very good at tax avoidance no sorry tax break schemes.

So in essence most of the figures are not a true representation, and you tell me who really knows the whole picture anyway, its impossible to know, the indicator of societies wealth and well being is to look in its streets, not some hotch potched books with some crappy figures that do not reflect/mirror what is going on in the real world, if there is all this growth how does that tally with people struggling and not spending

[Faldur]

proceed to make his own grossly inaccurate and misleading statements but it still irks me.
So this big 50% growth over the past 10 years "after inflation" you're slamming Reich for failing to mention would be quite damning...if it was true. But in fact, these numbers have NOT been adjusted for inflation. This increase IS the inflation adjustment! You're looking at inflation adjustments and calling them wage gains.

Are you people unable to fact check, or do you know the facts and avoid them like the plague?

Total inflation for the period of 1998 - 2008 was 23.11%. That leaves a wage increase for the 10 year period of 26.89%, after inflationary adjustments. If you cannot understand that I am sorry. But thats wage growth of 2.69% per year above inflation, I do not consider that "barely increased" as mr. reichhhhhhhhhhhhh so stated.

Facts people, they are your friend!
Inflation data by year

[joeninety]

Are you people unable to fact check, or do you know the facts and avoid them like the plague?

Total inflation for the period of 1998 - 2008 was 23.11%. That leaves a waged increase for the 10 year period of 26.89%, after inflationary adjustments. If you cannot understand that I am sorry. But thats wage growth of 2.69% above inflation, I do not consider that "barely increased" as mr. reichhhhhhhhhhhhh so stated.

Facts people, they are your friend!
Inflation data by year

Maybe it is you that fails to understand, you say these are facts but how do you know that???? You simply cannot calculate the whole picture, They come up with these supposed facts of growth in our country but look around and people and busineses are still failing and growth is non existent where as cutbacks are king.

Yes they say unemployment has fallen but that is another fallacy all they have done is moved people onto schemes that won't even get them employment when they have finished, again another way of cooking the figures, and if you are foolish enough to take those figures at face value then in your world everything would be dandy but in reality it is not.

Simply put things are fucked but to say its so would spread panic and worsen what is already a bad situation, so they inflate the figures, but like i say societies streets and businesses tell a very different story, figures can be manipulated and are worthless when they do not match the reality of the situation, there are fairly obvious answers as to why this is done something you fail to note..............

[Faldur]

Maybe it is you that fails to understand, you say these are facts but how do you know that???? You simply cannot calculate the whole picture, They come up with these supposed facts of growth in our country but look around and people and busineses are still failing and growth is non existent where as cutbacks are king.

Yes they say unemployment has fallen but that is another fallacy all they have done is moved people onto schemes that won't even get them employment when they have finished, again another way of cooking the figures, and if you are foolish enough to take those figures at face value then in your world everything would be dandy but in reality it is not.

Simply put things are fucked but to say its so would spread panic and worsen what is already a bad situation, so they inflate the figures, but like i say societies streets and businesses tell a very different story, figures can be manipulated and are worthless when they do not match the reality of the situation, there are fairly obvious answers as to why this is done something you fail to note..............

Ok you seem to have a couple issues going here. I was taking on mr. reich's point that wages have "barely increased" in the last 10 years. I believe I have proven him wrong on that.

Your points about our current economic situation are spot on, "things are fucked". I think that pretty well sums up today's economic situation. There are endless threads here that discuss why that is, I won't begin to start that here. This thread began with his video on the truth about the economy, I am just pointing out his points are inaccurate. Wages have grown at a strong rate over the last 10 years, just as his statement about education is disingenuous. If we have a education issue it is not from spending cuts, the expenditures on education have grown at 3x the inflationary rate. Our problem in education is not the amount of money we are spending, in my opinion it is we are not means testing what we are spending. You cannot just throw money at a problem and think it will go away, hello war on poverty.

[trish]

I know it shouldn't surprise me anymore to see a conservative take some factual presentation, accuse the presenter of being disingenuous and then proceed to make his own grossly inaccurate and misleading statements but it still irks me.
So this big 50% growth over the past 10 years "after inflation" you're slamming Reich for failing to mention would be quite damning...if it was true. But in fact, these numbers have NOT been adjusted for inflation. This increase IS the inflation adjustment! You're looking at inflation adjustments and calling them wage gains.
And median wages (the much more useful measure if you care about how most Americans are doing) actually dropped (after inflation) from 1998 to 2008, the first decade we've failed to see wage growth since the 1930's.

says it like it is

[Faldur]

Its just amazing, when confronted with facts you resort either to name calling or cheering each others made up figures.

US Inflation Stats

Misery Index

Inflation Calculator

So Bluegrass please enlighten me to your methods, how does an accumulated 26% inflation, (and I'm using the highest figures I could find to get you another 2.5%), over a 10 year period become greater than a 50% increase in wage? It doesn't does it? 2.6% wage increase average per year after inflationary adjustments is pretty robust growth. Hardly "barely increased" as was indicated by mr. reiccccchhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

So go ahead let the name calling begin... your out of bullets.

[BluegrassCat]

Its just amazing, when confronted with facts you resort either to name calling or cheering each others made up figures.
accumulated 26% inflation, (and I'm using the highest figures I could find to get you another 2.5%), over a 10 year period become greater than a 50% increase in wage? It doesn't does it? 2.6% wage increase average per year after inflationary adjustments is pretty robust growth. Hardly "barely increased" as was indicated by mr. reiccccchhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

So go ahead let the name calling begin... your out of bullets.

The numbers I'm using come from ssa.gov, the people who calculate and publish the national wage index or AWI.* They provide a nice chart of the averages by year and we can see that in 1998 the AWI was 28,861.44 and in 2008 the AWI was 41,334.97.* Obviously these numbers have NOT been adjusted for inflation unless you think the average wage in 1998 was 28K in today's dollars, which, of course, you might if you had an ideological axe to grind and nothing but contempt for the facts.* But let's adjust the 1998 AWI for inflation provided by the by Consumer Price Index or CPI (which tracks purchasing power) into 2008 dollars. So now the adjusted AWI for 1998 is 38,122.42 compared to 41,334.97.* This is an increase of 8.4%, not 50% and not 24%...8.4%.* So much for the Bush boom.
But wait, remember how median wages actually DECREASED over this same decade? How could median wages drop but average wages increase?* As anyone who has taken statistics could tell you, this is the sign of a skewed distribution, meaning the very wealthy have seen increases in their incomes while the vast majority of Americans' incomes stagnated or deteriorated.* And wasn't that exactly what Reich said in his quite-accurate presentation? Yes, I believe it was.