How can you global warmest's not be laughing your asses off?

[hippifried]

You don't know what you're talking about, Nino.

You're just making GM & Exxon's argument for them because somebody told you to.

[El Nino]

GM and Exxon are actually pro cap & trade. Who are YOU to tell me I have no idea what I am talking about? Mighty Pretentious of ya..

Again
http://eclipptv.com/viewVideo.php?video_id=9104

[chefmike]

Who are YOU to tell me I have no idea what I am talking about?

Doesn't EVERYONE tell you that?

[hippifried]

GM and Exxon are actually pro cap & trade.

So am I. It allows the flow of money to make the necessary changes for complience with the new regulations. It's been used before & been proven to work. Cap & trade is what put the scrubbers into the American smokestack industries, brought acid rain down to tolerable levels, & saved the timber forests that were being killed across the northern tier of States & Canada. That was over 30 years ago. Anybody still bitching about acid rain? Of course not. All the same right wing whining & wimpering about how it was going to destroy America was going on then too. Didn't happen, & there's no reason to think it'll happen this time.

Cap & trade is what allows industry to come into compliance without everybody having to shut down all at once to retool. Of course GM & Exxon are pro cap & trade. But don't kid yourself. If they had their druthers, there's be no regulation at all for them to comply with, & that's what you're promoting, Nino.

Who are YOU to tell me I have no idea what I am talking about? Mighty Pretentious of ya..

No pretense. Just an honest observation based on your own words & the sources you promote. It's not an attack. You really don't know what you're talking about. You're misinformed because you give more credence than is due to other people who either don't know what they're talking about or have an agenda. Usually the same agenda that you spend so much time griping about & accusing others of having. There's no global conspiracy to turn everybody into a mindless commie tree hugger. You're being duped by the alarmists. Again: Is there really anybody, including you, who actually believes it's a good idea to keep poluting the air? That's the position you're promoting.

[El Nino]

Wow, you support it huh? Well it doesn't surprise me as you have probably not done your homework.

Cap & Trade is actually destroying the rain forest/environment and indigenous cultures. It is giving corporate industries and Financial organisations like the World Bank the impetus to fund smaller energy enterprises in third world nations; thus spreading out like a cancer, clear cutting forests, and wiping out traditional locals way's of life. This is an intentional response on their behalf, of reducing their primary source of carbon emmisions in light of the new policy; while distributing new money making skeems elswhere.

More over, the "policy makers" also are succeeding in population control/reduction (Eugenics) in underdeveloped regions by destroying local economies, raking in $ off of heavy loan interests and and monopolizing business (almost anonymously) to very high levels. This is what is going on, Hippi. Sorry, but your personal attacks make you look like an ass. Don't pick up the debating tactics of Chef! Next time, look around for better sources and stay away from mainstream media talking pieces... it'll do you better.

[El Nino]

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention that Carbon Cultists make me sick! Not unlike Bible Thumpers...

[hippifried]

Cap & Trade is actually destroying the rain forest/environment and indigenous cultures.

Oh really? Got some details to go along with that statement? How about some places, dates, names, etc... You claim that you post details. Let's see some. Give me something that isn't just some bozo on you tube or infowars shooting off their mouth.

The developing world (third world is a cold war term that's meaningless since the collapse of the USSR) is ruining their own landscape. In some parts of Africa for instance, they're deforesting to burn the wood as fuel. In the Amazon basin, the deforestation is mostly to create rangeland that can't even support grass. These people have no services. There's no economy in these places. Average lifespan is less than 40 years. They used to have a high enough infant mortality rate to keep their populations in check, but now we have doctors & whatnot going in to save those babies without helping to curb the number of births. Africa has had at least a half dozen major famines just in my adult lifetime. There's no food production. Arable land was turned to the production of cash crops like tobacco & coffee over a century ago. All of this has been going on for centuries. The IMF only dates back to the end of WWII. None of it has anything to do with cap & trade.

What? You think the developing world would rather not develop? You better think again. They're neither stupid nor ignorant. They know how the developed world lives. What are you advocating here? Do you know? It doesn't seem like it.

[evilernie]

Whether it's man-made or not, should people do something, especially if we can. What's wrong with recycling, walk to the store for a change, or perhaps avoid dumping toxic chemicals down the drain. Do you really need to be driving alone in that huge SUV? These are not huge lifestyle changes.

I think Americans just hate being wrong (right) and refuse to accept responsibility (left). We need to stop dwelling on these petty things. Being the most powerful nation in the world, we can turn this around (man-made or not). Let's just deal with the problem and stop the blame game.

The outcome (or lack thereof) of Copenhagen is the best that can ever happened. We don't need to be "forced" to comply. We should just do it willingly. I am refusing to bankroll any other country. We are doing so much of that already (albeit for other things). I bet China is taking their own initiative, because it's killing their people.

I think the US is on the right path and pace. We just have to continue doing it. It's difficult to change the minds of old farts. Our best bet is the younger generation.

[El Nino]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/6847...-Pachauri.html

[evilernie]

What's your point? There's corruption everywhere. Yes, including profiteering through the climate change message. I'm not a fan of cap and trade, but do you prefer a heavier hand approach?

Seriously, why do you deny the evidence because of a few bad eggs or opportunist? It's a free market. Didn't you complain if gas went through the roof when there is a storm in the gulf. You would expect that oil companies losing a lot of money because of shutdown. But it's the other way around. That's just capitalism.