TARP Circulation

[hippifried]

I can't get into all the economic doom & gloom. I just refuse to be a defeatist, & I'm really sick & tired of ideologues from all angles promoting policies that have already proven ineffective. The problem I see is that while everybody's talking about not wanting to be Herbert Hoover, it would seem that the Hoover doctrine is still in effect. Nobody want's a direct infusion of cash into the system. Why?

I don't have a problem with the stimulous. All this stuff needs to be done anyway. I'm sure the President would rather have been able to take his time, but it looks we're going to have to do a major catchup all at once just to stave off the results of stupidity. It'd be nice if there weren't so many skimming hands between the feds & the folks who are expected to sp0end the cash. The problem with the stimulous is the time lag. Things are going to get continuously worse until money actually gets flowing into the system. The TARP can bridge the lag.

It's apparent that we're not going to be able to bribe the banking industry into doing their job. They're just going to sit on their thumbs & wait for the second half of their welfare check so they can start making more demands. Time to step away from the conventional BS. The TARP is already allocated, with a wide discretionary range of how to use it. Give it to the American people as a dividend. Not a tax rebate. No griping about who deserves what. No sliding scale. No strings. No attachments. No addendums. No targets. No income tax on it. No social security or medicare payments. No requirement to claim it as income. No skimming by middlemen. No sting operations allowed. No interference with the capital markets. No messing around with the free market at all. A share dividend just for having a social security number. There's enough money left in the TARP to put $1000 in the hands of every man, woman, & child in the US. Got a number, here's a check. Just like that. Young, old, rich, poor, regardless. It could be over 90% distributed in 2 to 4 weeks. It can all be done through the treasury, & I don't see why it would require another Act of Congress. Consumer spending accounts for over 70% of GDP. This would be an immediate shot in the arm where it does the most good.

Now I know there's going to be somebody coming up with potential snags, but even snags won't create delays so long that it would alter the effectiveness. I don't see a downside.

Age issue? I understand that you can't just give $1000 to little kid. Just put on an arbitrary number. I favor a sliding number. Under 13, parents get full control of the payout. 13 & 14 year olds get a third with 2/3 to the parents. 15 & 16 year olds get 2/3. 17 & up gets the full amount. Sucks to be a kid sometimes, but oh well, problem solved.

Inflation? Got that. Got inflation happening in the middle of a nasty recession. I keep hearing about this phantom expanded money supply. So where is it? It's certainly not in the hands of the consumers & businesses that actually produce this country's wealth. I think we've had about enough of theoretical doom & gloom scenarios justifying the Hoover doctrine. Money needs to circulate. If the professional circulators can't do it or refuse to do it, then get somebody else to do it. The American people are ready willing & able to take on the task. Show me someone who would say "Oh no, that's theoretically wrong & I won't take the money.". The theories aren't working & it's our money. Anybody got a better idea?

Oh noooooo... It's a commie idea! Bullshit! What's more capitalist than paying out a dividend to shareholders? This is a democratic republic. Everybody owns an equal share.

As for the banks: I'm all out of sympathy. Their problems are of their own doing. Nobody forced these "financial institutions" to leverage themselves to the point where they could never get out from under it. They can sink or swim.

[thx1138]

Banks won't lend to people who have no chance of repaying the loan. The Banks can't lend to people who don't want to borrow. The economy will turn around when employers run out of people to lay off.

[thx1138]

U.S. heading for Japan style two decade long economic depression: http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article8541.html

[hippifried]

Banks won't lend to people who have no chance of repaying the loan. The Banks can't lend to people who don't want to borrow. The economy will turn around when employers run out of people to lay off.

Hmmmm... Well that's nicely cynical & all, but I still have no clue where you stand on my TARP proposal. That tells me it's something that Alex Jones hasn't been confronted with yet. Ergo, no preboxed talking points to memorize. So why don't you try to give me a thx1138 viewpoint on the topic?

[chefmike]

Banks won't lend to people who have no chance of repaying the loan. The Banks can't lend to people who don't want to borrow. The economy will turn around when employers run out of people to lay off.

Hmmmm... Well that's nicely cynical & all, but I still have no clue where you stand on my TARP proposal. That tells me it's something that Alex Jones hasn't been confronted with yet. Ergo, no preboxed talking points to memorize. So why don't you try to give me a thx1138 viewpoint on the topic?

LMAO...he'll get back to you...I brought up this idea in a semi-serious thread in the general section when the bailout started...why not?...at this point all the "economic experts" are doing is throwing shit against the wall and seeing if it sticks...

BTW...that's NOT how you tell if your pasta is done...

[hippifried]

I brought up this idea in a semi-serious thread in the general section when the bailout started...why not?...at this point all the "economic experts" are doing is throwing shit against the wall and seeing if it sticks...

Sorry I missed that. I knew I couldn't be the only one thinking this way. I've posed this in a few other forums around the net & gotten both positive & negative reactions from all over & through the political sphere. Mostly though, I've gotten silence, or simplistic derision & hyperbole that has nothing to do with the topic.

BTW...that's NOT how you tell if your pasta is done...

Speak for yourself.
Well... I guess it all depends on who has to clean it up.

[chefmike]

But we both know that ain't gonna happen, so as far as the actual stimulous bill itself goes, I'd like to see a lot more spending on infrastructure than the amounts I've heard mentioned.

[hippifried]

Yeah me too. But republicans are locksteppers (see the house vote) & there isn't enough votes to break a filibuster. If it works even a little bit, more can be added & the republicans won't have a leg to stand on.

I just wish everybody'd stop screwing with the tax codes for a while. You need a bank of lawyers to keep up with the constant changes. Give it a 2 year rest.

[trish]

James K. Galbraith recently wrote an article in Mother Jones. Thought some people here might appreciate the accompanying chart indicating our economic return on the type of dollar spent

[chefmike]

That's a pretty neat chart, trish. Very informative. I emailed it to a couple of folks.