The Viper Room - NO SCRUBS

[Stavros]

It's worth a try;

You first, comrade. The only other thing I know about Delaware is that one George, betraying another, was painted crossing the River by boat, albeit, historians have believed, in the wrong direction. Over to you.

[filghy2]

Wherever you are, we Americans work harder than you, longer than you, and with more diligence.

Why? Because of the uber-capitalist nature of our society. The rewards are larger, and when government is done right here, the financial safety net is smaller-to-nonexistent. Common sense - Americans HAVE to work to survive, and if they want the lifestyle that's constantly being shoved down their throats as the acceptable standard by both the media and their peers, they have to work harder and smarter. HAVE to. In other first-world countries, you have...other options. The British dole system, for example. Socialized medicine - in the USA, if you get sick or hurt, you better damn well have a job because that's probably the only way you're going to have medical insurance.

Of course liberals will try to convince you that this is an unfair system. They don't have to convince me, I KNOW it's unfair. Therein lies its strength. In the USA, we're not going to lower the common denominator to the level of the majority, we're going to keep elevating it as high as we can, and it's up to the individual to either keep up, or become a loser. We throw the word "loser" around over here with abandon, it's the worst thing you can be in the USA. Even criminals are above losers, at least they're doing something to advance their position.

Probably more important is that these are also societies that struck different compromises. The U.S. is (I think) such an anomaly for having a weak social safety net, poor healthcare system, relatively low upper income tax bracket, tons of tax avoidance strategies that aren't closed off, step up in basis on inherited property, and huge estate tax exemption that contributes to this.

The US is peculiar in that it seems to value freedom to maximise financial accumulation over virtually every other consideration. I have to say that Nick's description does not make it sound like a pleasant place. What's the point of having somewhat more money if the price is never-ending work, stress, insecurity and all the other ills of uber-capitalism. Are people who focus excessively on money and always having to be a winner actually happier?

[broncofan]

You first, comrade. The only other thing I know about Delaware is that one George, betraying another, was painted crossing the River by boat, albeit, historians have believed, in the wrong direction. Over to you.

Those are the things worth knowing though!

This is the anecdote thread so I'll share that whenever my cousin wants to cancel something that is important in his business and doesn't want the other person to claim they didn't get the message he uses four means of communicating it. He will call and leave a message. He will email (or scan and email). He will fax. And he will then send the document by mail. I asked him if he wanted carrier pigeons so he could have a fifth layer since the Pony Express doesn't operate any more.

But my point is maybe I will email Joe but also hire some skywriters.

[broncofan]

The US is peculiar in that it seems to value freedom to maximise financial accumulation over virtually every other consideration. I have to say that Nick's description does not make it sound like a pleasant place. What's the point of having somewhat more money if the price is never-ending work, stress, insecurity and all the other ills of uber-capitalism. Are people who focus excessively on money and always having to be a winner actually happier?

More anecdotes Of two self-made people I've known who are very wealthy, one was bitter and unhappy and one relatively well adjusted. The unhappy one talks like John Malkovich's character in Burn After Reading but is somewhat short and super angry. He became a partner in a corporate law firm at a young age and is a verbally abusive person who threatens to "sue the shit out of" people and thinks everyone is a loser.

The happy person is someone who has a very successful business that he's grown over twenty years. He is the type of person who has a few close friends but also has hundreds of acquaintances. He will walk into a place and just happen to know four or five people who walk by. He is philanthropic and easy-going and an incredibly shrewd business person. I'm sure he can be unpleasant if someone is trying to steal from him but not as a power trip or a flex but because it's necessary. He seems happy.

Anecdotes only go so far though but on something subjective like the happiness of rich people maybe they're okay.

The other thought I have is that when people say they love their country, there are many levels of meaning to that. Seinfeld made a joke about how when you root for your sports team and they trade everyone away pretty soon you are rooting for your team's laundry (or uniform) over another team's. While I'm not going to figure out exactly what delineates love of country from betrayal, we know it's possible to dislike things about your country without failing to be loyal to it. I think there is that ethos about the individual having freedom to pursue selfishness that I don't like and I think it extends beyond the purely economic. I keep obsessing about healthcare but that's where I hear people say things that kind of shock me. About cancer patients who need treatments they can't afford.

I'd be careful about Nick's interpretation being the definitive view but we know it's a pervasive and troubling part of the cultural milieu here. His descriptions end up sounding like a diagnosis of the problem.

[Stavros]

More anecdotes Of two self-made people I've known who are very wealthy, one was bitter and unhappy and one relatively well adjusted. The unhappy one talks like John Malkovich's character in Burn After Reading but is somewhat short and super angry. He became a partner in a corporate law firm at a young age and is a verbally abusive person who threatens to "sue the shit out of" people and thinks everyone is a loser.

The happy person is someone who has a very successful business that he's grown over twenty years. He is the type of person who has a few close friends but also has hundreds of acquaintances. He will walk into a place and just happen to know four or five people who walk by. He is philanthropic and easy-going and an incredibly shrewd business person. I'm sure he can be unpleasant if someone is trying to steal from him but not as a power trip or a flex but because it's necessary. He seems happy.

Anecdotes only go so far though but on something subjective like the happiness of rich people maybe they're okay.

The other thought I have is that when people say they love their country, there are many levels of meaning to that. Seinfeld made a joke about how when you root for your sports team and they trade everyone away pretty soon you are rooting for your team's laundry (or uniform) over another team's. While I'm not going to figure out exactly what delineates love of country from betrayal, we know it's possible to dislike things about your country without failing to be loyal to it. I think there is that ethos about the individual having freedom to pursue selfishness that I don't like and I think it extends beyond the purely economic. I keep obsessing about healthcare but that's where I hear people say things that kind of shock me. About cancer patients who need treatments they can't afford.
.

A few points -in my experience, companies function better when the employees feel they are part of a team with a sympathetic manager, rather than one who barks orders and expects instant and constant obedience, although I accept there are some workers who need 'direction'.

Maybe the point about taxes and Delaware, and indeed, patriotism, is why companies do all they can do avoid paying taxes and other costs in their state, hence Delaware as a 'Registration Destination' much as merchant ships are flagged and registered in obscure African countries to avoid liabilities. I am not sure what proportion of rich Americans shift their money into the Caribbean or other tax free bank havens, but if you wanted reform of the tax system, again it may not be the headline figures to focus on, but the layers and layers of conditions that become the bread and butter of tax lawyers whose only aim is to lift the burden, rather than supervise its payments. Indeed, if all the tax that is due from business was paid, your Federal and State Governments could probably create a nation-wide health service free at the time of need; urban transport using green energy cheaper and more efficient than cars, while going some way to dealing with issues in education and housing.

As for pigeons, they are smart birds -some from the UK were decorated for their service in time of war. They are not just fox food. Respect the Pigeon!

[broncofan]

I have nothing to add to your last post as I agree word by word and think it sums up the issues perfectly. One problem with our tax system is similar to what plagues our healthcare system which is that it's easier to pass piecemeal changes through Congress when a complete overhaul is needed. A change to the tax code might address a couple of provisions and likewise the Affordable Care Act (Obamacare) didn't replace all of the existing laws. What you get is increasing complexity but also inconsistency and all sorts of gaps. More ambitious plans face challenges to pass and even constitutional challenge so we don't end up with coherence.

I'm sure this is true with other areas of the law, though I can also think of areas of the law where augmenting an existing system doesn't create as many problems.

In other news, Mar a Lago is running into its own problems. It looks like they are having trouble following local ordinances and also there's been a Vanilla Ice sighting there.

https://apnews.com/article/mar-a-lag...6af6d3fc6e5aa1

[Nick Danger]

You guys miss Trump yet? Anyone ready to admit I was right all along?