The Impeachment Puzzle

[Stavros]

It's interesting that the people who normally argue for originalism in interpreting the Constitution have chosen to ignore evidence that the Founding Fathers intended impeachment to apply to ex-presidents.
https://www.politico.com/news/magazi...ounders-468769

A) Yes, you are right to point this out.
B) Trump could have been tried as a sitting President had McConnell not delayed the opportunity until after the 20th Jan.
C) The irony is that not only has Trump not conceded to Biden, thus suggesting HE thinks he is still President, but a QAnon theory argues he will be returned to office in March, so has not conceded for that reason. Thus-

"...as soon as Biden was inaugurated, a new conspiracy theory took hold. Trump will return as president in March, they falsely claim.The conspiracy theory is apparently rooted in the belief that an 1871 law turned the country into a corporation -- and any president elected after that is illegitimate.
The last president to be sworn in before that law passed was Ulysses S. Grant on March 4, 1869."
https://abcnews4.com/news/nation-wor...retun-in-march

Plus this-
"Social media users have been sharing posts that make various claims related to the QAnon conspiracy theory, including that Martial Law and the Insurrection Act have been invoked; power has been transferred from outgoing President Trump to the military, not President Joe Biden; there have been mass arrests; Biden is not President; and Trump will come back to power on March 4th. There is no evidence to support any of these claims, linked to the widely debunked QAnon conspiracy theory."
https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-f...-idUSKBN29R1ZA

[KnightHawk 2.0]

Not surprised at all that 57 Senators {50 Democrats 7 Republicans} voted to convict Donald Trump for the insurrection and domestic terrorist attack that took place at the US Capital on Wednesday January 6 2021,while the other 43 Republican Senators voted to acquit Trump of any wrongdoing despite the evidence against him,and gave him another free pass to do what he wants. and it also shows what the Republican Party has become over the last 4 years,a political party of conspiracy theorists,enablers,delusional and dangerous nutjobs and sympathizers who has allowed him to commit impeachable offenses and get away with them. and looked the other way and chose party over country,and don't care about the constitution and are solely responsible for creating the Demagouge And Malignant Narcissist. and right on cue Donald.D.A.M.N.Trump released a statement saying his movement has just begun. And i sure as hell don't want to hear from those enablers on why they voted to acquit him,or about being the being the party of law and order,because today they showed they're not what they say stand for. and also don't want to hear them calling for unity. because that train has already lefted the station when they chose to embrace conspiracy theories about election fraud .

[filghy2]

The message from the acquittal vote seems to be that a President can do anything they like in the final period of their term without adverse consequences. So why would a future unscrupulous President not try anything to overturn an election loss, regardless of the chances that it might succeed? Particularly when all they need to do to improve their chances is to make sure enough loyalists are installed in the right positions.

Even setting aside the issue of incitement, the failure to act after the storming of the Capitol should have been grounds enough for a guilty verdict, given the President's sworn oath is to protect the Constitution.

[filghy2]

It seems that, after toying with the idea of ditching Trump, Mitch McConnell decided to back down because he was afraid of losing his job as senate minority leader.
https://www.vox.com/22281591/trump-i...sers-acquitted

[Stavros]

It seems that, after toying with the idea of ditching Trump, Mitch McConnell decided to back down because he was afraid of losing his job as senate minority leader.
https://www.vox.com/22281591/trump-i...sers-acquitted

And as most probably now kn ow -those who have taken this Impeachment Trial seriously -McConnell's breathtaking hypocrisy was evident almost as soon as the vote ended -from an additional article in the link in filghy2's post above-

"On Saturday, Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell made a strong case for convicting former President Donald Trump of inciting insurrection — less than half an hour after voting to acquit Trump of inciting insurrection. "
https://www.vox.com/2021/2/13/222820...al-impeachment

The man has the temperament you need in a crisis...until you realise he helped create it. I think in political terms that is how a snake is defined. The reckoning for these men may come in 2022 mid-terms, but a lot now rests on how Trump himself begins to act, and in particular, how the court cases against him pan out over the next 2 years.

It is a pity there could not be more open questioning of the counsels on both sides, and indeed, questions posed by Counsels to Senators with the cameras showing who is speaking -I find it very odd how the TV presentation rarely shows what Senators are doing in their seats, in front of their kindergarden desks. What, one wonders, would Ted Cruz say if he was asked about the fate of Mike Pence on a day when he attempted to delay the Certification? Those enablers in the Senate -Cruz and Hawley in partcular, were let off by the House Managers, presumably because baiting indiviidual Senators is 'bad form'? Or risky, even though Cruz and Hawley were never going to convict anyway. But Graham, Grassley, McConnell and others ought to have been challenged directly about the manner in which Trump treated the VP on the day, and the public needed to see and hear their reactions.

I think the rules need to change so the Senate proceedings are more closely scrutinized visually, And the public can see their Senators nodding off, tweeting or reading papers when the trial is taking place. I much prefer the rough and tumble of the House of Commons, and after all the Speaker is there to impose order on the place.

[Laphroaig]

It seems that, after toying with the idea of ditching Trump, Mitch McConnell decided to back down because he was afraid of losing his job as senate minority leader.
https://www.vox.com/22281591/trump-i...sers-acquitted

I'm still trying to get over how McConnell could vote not guilty THEN come out with this speech afterwards.

https://twitter.com/RexChapman/statu...01901990465543

[broncofan]

I'm still trying to get over how McConnell could vote not guilty THEN come out with this speech afterwards.

https://twitter.com/RexChapman/statu...01901990465543

I think Mitch wanted to assure people that while he may be corrupt, partisan trash he hasn't lost touch with reality.

[KnightHawk 2.0]

I'm still trying to get over how McConnell could vote not guilty THEN come out with this speech afterwards.

https://twitter.com/RexChapman/statu...01901990465543

Because The King Of Enablers Mitch McConnell is trying too have it both ways.

[fred41]

It's interesting that the people who normally argue for originalism in interpreting the Constitution have chosen to ignore evidence that the Founding Fathers intended impeachment to apply to ex-presidents.
https://www.politico.com/news/magazi...ounders-468769

BTW, thanks for posting this article. I’ve been reading about impeachment because even constitutional scholars argue about it. For myself though, this article is a game changer.

[filghy2]

I'm still trying to get over how McConnell could vote not guilty THEN come out with this speech afterwards.

https://twitter.com/RexChapman/statu...01901990465543

And if he really believed that Trump was responsible but that an ex-President cannot be impeached then why did he insist on delaying the trial?

There has been some discussion on whether the Democrats erred in not proceeding to call witnesses. The reasoning seems to have been that it would have made no difference so why risk holding up other priorities. This misses the point that, given conviction was never likely, the real point of impeachment was to bring home to the public the full extent of the conduct most Republicans chose to excuse. Not calling witnesses and having only a perfunctory trial makes it easier for Republicans to paper what they've done in the hope that people will move on.
https://newrepublic.com/article/1613...t-donald-trump