Just what is Religion?

[Quinfeldt]

RELIGION

Definitions
To effect a vital adjustment (even if tentative and/or incomplete) to whatever is worthy of serious and ulterior concern.

Recognizing that all things are manifestations of a Power that transcends our knowledge.

Ethics heightened, enkindled, and lit up by feeling.

Pure, reverential disposition… ‘piety.’


Characteristics
Supernatural beings (gods) exist.

Ability to distinguish between sacred and profane objects.

Ritual acts with sacred objects.

Feelings of awe, mystery, guilt, adoration that arises from ritual acts with sacred objects.

Morality approved by the gods.

Prayer or other communicative forms with gods.

Global view of purposeful existence and its relevance therein.

Individual organization based on global view.

A social group bound together by all or most of the above.


Types;
1) Location of the divine;
Sacramental; inanimate physical things, living things
Prophetic; Human history events, historical figures
Mystical; indivisible unity with no awareness to words, nature, or self

2) Response to the divine;
Sacramental; ritual preoccupation
Prophetic; acceptance of the message (ethics)
Mystical; self-torture to empty the soul and make it receptive for divine influence

3) Place of doctrine;
Sacramental; sacred objects and ritual
Prophetic; belief and morality
Mystical; immediate experience and feeling

4) Concrete application;
Sacramental; Hinduism religion
Prophetic; Judaism, Islam, Christianity and Confucianism religions
Mystical; Buddhism religion, philosophical Hinduism

Buddhism:
Founder = Siddhartha Gautama (aka Sakyamuni, Tathagata, or Jina)
Founding location = India (Buddhism exists marginally in present day India)
Time of first development = ~ 525 B. C.

The Four Noble Truths:

1) Existence is suffering.

2) The origin of suffering lies in craving and attachment.

3) The cessation of suffering is possible through the cessation of craving.

4) The way to total transcendence is the Noble Eightfold Path:

Preliminary frame of mind of the aspirant;
1) Right views
2) Right aspirations
Ethical requirements;
3) Right speech
4) Right conduct
5) Right livelihood
Meditative training required to obtain serene knowledge;
6) Right effort
7) Right mindfulness
8 )Right contemplation

Cause and effect; dependent origination (praytityasamutpada)
a - Ignorance e - Senses i – Becoming

b - Predisposition f - Contact j - Birth
c - Consciousness g - Craving k - Old-age
d - Name-form h - Grasping l – Death……..repeat a through l

The release of this cycle is the total transcendence called nirvana.



Characteristics of the individual;

1) Suffering

2) Absence of self and soul – In the skandhas of Experience, no self or soul is found.

Experience forms; 1) rupa – material existence
2) vedena - sensations
3) samjna - perceptions
4) samskara – psychic constructs
5) vijana – consciousness

3) Impermanence – All entity types can be analyzed as a series of transitory states.

The three main schools of Buddhism;

1) Theravada(Doctrine of the Elders)
Location – Ceylon, Burma and Southeast Asia

2) Mahayana(Great Vehicle)
Location – China, Korea and Japan

3) Vajrayana (Diamond Vehicle)
Location – Tibet and Japan

These are just some basics. As in the ‘Religion’ summary, variations exist. Neither summary is designed to be complete, but rather, the most prevailing and fundamental attributes are noted.

[filghy2]

I think religion boils down to two things: some explanation for the purpose of our existence and a set of rules for how we should live. All the rest is just trappings to make the followers of a religion feel special relative to others. There's nothing wrong with that in itself - the problems arise when people try to impose their beliefs on others and persecute those who won't conform.

[broncofan]

I notice that the first post discusses religion in general but then focuses on Buddhism in particular. This is interesting because as Filghy points out religion tends to involve both a purpose for our existence AND a set of rules to live by. Buddhism is a religion but a lot of people in the west practice a secularized version of it. I'm not familiar enough with what they choose to disregard, but I imagine they disregard those elements that relate to divinity or the supernatural and are more focused on it as a personal philosophy.

From the little I've read about Buddhist philosophy I've found a lot of it insightful and useful. I have also been practicing a form of vipassana meditation for about a month and have found I feel better after I do it. Some of the reasons people choose to meditate are consistent with the Buddhist worldview, but one doesn't need to have delved too deeply into the philosophy to derive benefits from meditation.

I am an atheist in the sense that I don't believe in a supreme being and don't believe human beings have a special purpose or destiny. But I would like to investigate Buddhist teachings a little bit more.

I took this sentence from Wikipedia. I'm curious to hear people's reaction to it since I'm not sure what direction this thread would take otherwise:

The Four Truths express the basic orientation of Buddhism: we

crave and cling

to

impermanent states and things

, which is dukkha, "incapable of satisfying" and painful.

There's a lot in Buddhism I don't agree with but I think this observation of dukkha is a good one. Our strong desire to acquire things in the vain hope acquisition will make us happy is a source of a lot of pain I think. Thanks for the thread!

[trish]

I’m not so sure I’m opposed to the idea of taking joy in impermanence, for we ourselves are impermanent: we live, we change, we love, we die. Laughter itself lives for a convulsive moment and then dies away with a few murmurs and hiccups. Still I wouldn’t advise anyone to avoid laughter, or pleasure, or love, or life on the basis that they’re impermanent. Just don’t seek those pleasures selfishly at the expense of others. The universe itself it impermanent. What we know of it had a beginning, and it’s been expanding and changing ever since. Perhaps the expansion itself is eternal. One can seek to understand it intellectually, but it’s too far too big and far too impersonal a thing to seek and become one with. Our lives are here, loud and vibrant right now - and we will be nothing but diminishing chords and echos in the tomorrows to come.

[holzz]

religion is jjust some priest or government mandating what God says is real.

Name any major world religion that doesn't have splits, based on what some group's interpretation of their holy book, or teachings?

Christianity has Catholics and Protestants.
Islam has Sunni and Shi'a.
Hinduism has Sanatan, and even atheist Hindus.

If there is a God, it's not what some priest, minister, imam, or what have you says.

[Ben in LA]

religion is jjust some priest or government mandating what god says is real.

Name any major world religion that doesn't have splits, based on what some group's interpretation of their holy book, or teachings?

Christianity has catholics and protestants.
Islam has sunni and shi'a.
Hinduism has sanatan, and even atheist hindus.

If there is a god, it's not what some priest, minister, imam, or what have you says.

I fully AGREE

[trish]

religion is jjust some priest or government mandating what God says is real.

This claim already concedes there’s a “God” who says things and merely maintains that priests and governments confirm that what He say is “real.”

Most of us experience religion at a very early age through the semi-formal teachings passed on to us by priests, reverends, ministers, bishops, rabbis or imams in synagogs, churches, mosques or other places of worship. Our experience is of an already long established hierarchy of teachers and leaders, with lawyers and accountants. But the actual origins of religion ( or of any given religion) is something different. The origin of Mormonism and many other religions revolve around charismatic cult leaders who are in some cases serious in their pursuit of enlightenment and in other cases more serious about their pursuit of power and profit. But I imagine some religions are simply the result of stories passed on from one generation to the next around communal campfires: stories that preserved tribal behaviors, ways and understandings, only later to be codified and worked into more formal settings of worship by teachers and priests either appointed or self-appointed.

What I don’t understand is the apparent propensity of vast numbers of humankind toward worship. I understand humility. I understand incomprehension. I understand what it’s like to be awestruck. But I don’t understand the impulse to bow down and worship. I suspect its origin is in a deep and ancient fear; fear of death and an inability to conceive one’s personal end - fear kept alive with promises of eternal life and warnings of perdition and brimstone.

If one can manage to put aside these silly metaphysical distractions, religion I think - can offer moral guidance and encouragement to live life bravely and with purpose. Yet, being an atheist myself, I can confirm there are other ways toward those ends. However we find our way - I hope we manage to do it without causing hurt and harm to ourselves and each other.

[holzz]

the bible isn't 100% true. nor is any other holy book. so then when did God tell these priests what his word is?

[broncofan]

Curious people are reasonable to object to any religion that tells its followers that there’s a deity and an immutable set of rules handed down by revelation. Even where the rules seem to have a practical purpose, the appeal to authority and the failure of the scripture to provide reasons for its rules should make people skeptical.

I think one reason you find that there are a decent number of people in the scientific community who have flirted with some Buddhist ideas is that one is able to divorce its supernatural elements from the philosophy, which is often fully explicated and reveals certain truths about human existence.

The big takeaway I’ve gotten from Buddhist philosophy is that people, myself included, tend to measure happiness by objective metrics. We assume there are prerequisites to being happy, such as the esteem of others, material things that signify prestige, achievement that brings accolades, but are reluctant to consider the subjective component of it. I’m not saying objective things can’t place constraints on us that make it hard to be happy or hard not to be miserable, but our orientation towards what we think, feel, and observe also matters.

I recently read a book by Evolutionary Psychologist Robert Wright called Why Buddhism Is True. It’s not the best writing on Buddhism, nor the best science writing, but was a bit of a personal story about how he became acquainted with some Buddhist practices. His observation was that the evolutionary imperative favors traits that improve our chances of surviving, but isn’t concerned solely with our happiness, nor with helping us see things as they are. In some cases delusion may provide a survival advantage. He said that he saw meditation as a way to escape some of these delusions.

Another reason I like the idea of meditation is that it provides the possibility of personal transformation. I don’t believe people have free will because we cannot will our thoughts into being. Nobody wants to believe they are passive victim to automatic patterns of thought they cannot escape but then what is their alternate narrative? The first thing you are taught when you meditate is that no matter how hard you focus on the meditation object, often the breath, you cannot really stop the flow of thoughts that pull your attention from it. But you can recognize them and observe them. You cannot negate your hard wired tendencies to have thoughts motivated by greed or selfishness, but you can change your orientation to these thoughts.

Anyhow, I thought I'd at least propose that there are a few decent ideas mixed with some of the dangerous or bad ones.

[holzz]

The government has some "good rules" - don't steal, don't kill. Doesnt mean the government should be worshipped as gods.