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  1. #21
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    Default Re: The Balfour Declaration -a different view

    Quote Originally Posted by DaphneCruz View Post
    Point proven.
    I would seriously love to give my point and my case (something I have studied intently for more than 4 years and have devoted my life to it) but what is the point. it will go nowhere. I have fought this battle. it goes nowhere. It has already gone nowhere. Its impossible. So why do you pretend like youre open minded?
    learn history. that is all. I have no agenda.
    You have proved nothing. The thread is about the Balfour Declaration, you want it to be about the state of Israel, and there is nothing to stop you from creating one, though the comment you made on Hitler in another thread suggests your views might be tainted, but only you can prove that one way or the other. Someone else could as easily have said the Balfour Declaration was a betrayal of promises made to the Arabs and defended their rights, or ridiculed their historical record in politics which, in the case of the Palestinians leaves a lot to be desired. You may have 'studied' 'it' for more than 4 years, I have been doing it for more than 40, but that doesn't make me an authority, as those of us who have lived in the region as well as written about it know only too well how the ladder taking you up suddenly turns upside down and leaves you where you started, and often bruised and shaken. You also need to manage more than a sentence of two to be taken seriously.


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  2. #22
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    Default Re: The Balfour Declaration -a different view

    Of course I have proven nothing. I havent said anything. Again, it would be fruitless.

    And do you think we can talk about the Balfour Declaration without talking about the state of Israel? lol Thats why I know this thread is pointless and will get shut down the second someone brings up jews.

    and wait, you have been studying 'it' for 40 years?! holy shit... what books have you been reading? Do you train at the institute of public school? lol


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    Last edited by DaphneCruz; 03-12-2018 at 07:34 PM.

  3. #23
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    Default Re: The Balfour Declaration -a different view

    Quote Originally Posted by DaphneCruz View Post
    And do you think we can talk about the Balfour Declaration without talking about the state of Israel? lol Thats why I know this thread is pointless and will get shut down the second someone brings up jews.
    The history of this forum says otherwise. People are given wide latitude to express themselves (there have been a couple threads about Jews, the premises of which were straightforwardly anti-semitic and they were not shut down) but you cannot control what people say in response to you. Unlike you, Stavros writes intelligently on a number of subjects and in good faith. If you disagree with him, why don't you say why and where?

    You, on the other hand, have been asked to contribute to the topic and have written six posts where you admittedly say nothing. Why would write six times to say nothing and then act persecuted when people point it out?

    And I can tell you as someone with decades on this planet as a Jew, I have never met a person who praises Hitler as having a great legacy and talks as cryptically as you do who is not an anti-semite. To me this is what the dialogue looked like:

    You: you cannot write about this topic without being called anti-semitic
    Me: Please say what you mean instead of repeating this. I don't want this to end up being a self-fulfilling prophecy.
    You: Hitler had a great legacy and neo-nazis are embarrassments but only because they don't capture the real essence of Hitler.
    Me: Okay, you are an anti-semite.
    You: Point proven.


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  4. #24
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    Default Re: The Balfour Declaration -a different view

    I forgot what I said about not responding. I'm definitely done responding to this guy. Apologies.



  5. #25
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    Default Re: The Balfour Declaration -a different view

    Quote Originally Posted by DaphneCruz View Post
    ....I would seriously love to give my point and my case (something I have studied intently for more than 4 years and have devoted my life to it) but what is the point. it will go nowhere....
    Maybe you should have spent your 4 years getting a GED, or better still a certificate in plumbing, or HAC. Then you could be a bigot and make pretty good money as well.


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    World Class Asshole

  6. #26
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    Default Re: The Balfour Declaration -a different view

    Quote Originally Posted by DaphneCruz View Post
    Of course I have proven nothing. I havent said anything. Again, it would be fruitless.
    And do you think we can talk about the Balfour Declaration without talking about the state of Israel? lol Thats why I know this thread is pointless and will get shut down the second someone brings up jews.
    and wait, you have been studying 'it' for 40 years?! holy shit... what books have you been reading? Do you train at the institute of public school? lol
    If you admit you have said nothing, then what is the purpose of your posts? Maybe you should say what it is that you want to say.

    To repeat, the point I was making about the Balfour Declaration is that it expressed selfish motives for the British Empire which were considered more important than the desires, let alone the rights of Arabs and Jews at the time, that was my core point. The extent to which the British facilitated -or blocked- Jewish immigration into Palestine has become one of the contentious issues of the Mandate period; you will find that someone like Netanyahu is happy to visit London to celebrate the Balfour Declaration even though his political movement fought a murderous campaign against the British on the basis that the Jews were not given what the British promised - but that is what the Arabs have been arguing too. So why just Israel? Given the content of your posts in another thread, it should come as no surprise if you single out Israel without declaring your purpose and that this raises doubts in some minds about what it is that you want to say.



  7. #27
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    Default Re: The Balfour Declaration -a different view

    Stavros is handling himself very well. Broncofan has already called me a bigot.

    Lets contribute. The Balfour declaration was bad for jews and arabs. Because it gave away land that didn't belong to the ones giving it away. Is that okay? Are we cool? I dont want to offend anyone. Apparently I am a bigot.


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  8. #28
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    Default Re: The Balfour Declaration -a different view

    Quote Originally Posted by DaphneCruz View Post

    Lets contribute. The Balfour declaration was bad for jews and arabs. Because it gave away land that didn't belong to the ones giving it away. Is that okay? Are we cool? I dont want to offend anyone. Apparently I am a bigot.
    My point was that the Balfour Declaration was made to suit the interests of the British Empire, but as managers of the League of Nations Mandate, the British then found themselves in the middle of a confrontation they created for themselves and to which they added themselves as victims -vide the British officials and soldiers murdered by Jews and Arabs.

    If the British had stayed at home, and if the Balfour Declaration had never been written, a conflict over land might have followed the collapse of Ottoman Rule, but for even more complex reasons, mostly related to the Land Reform programme that the Ottomans began to implement across their Arab territories in the Tanzimat administration of the late 19th century. Squabbles over land became violent in what is now Syria and Iraq, even in what is now Jordan the Ottoman army had to move in the fight the Bedouin over land rights on what is now the capital city, Amman. The Bedouin eventually conceded and agreed to sign title deeds, the irony being this gave them ownership of Amman with the result their descendants are now millionaires. The first and second Aliyah to what was then the Vilayet of Jerusalem were an additional sign that land -and immigration- was going to become an arena of confrontation. The last thing the people needed were two Imperial powers re-organizing their politics and their daily lives without taking their interests into consideration, but that is what happened, and we -and they- live with the consequences.

    Tolstoy once wrote a parable, How Much Land Does a Man Require? in which an ignorant peasant given the chance to become a land-owner if he can walk around the land he wants, gets up at dawn and walks until dusk to acquire as much land as he can, but then drops dead from exhaustion. How much land does a man require? 6x6x3.


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