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  1. #11
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    Default Re: The Guaranteed Basic Income

    Quote Originally Posted by fred41 View Post
    I don't like it.
    I think in reality, there's just going to have to be some sort of population limitations. I mean, are we just going to spurt out more human beings without there ever being enough jobs. What's the point? Just creating something to survive?
    That's not much of a life. Just a fucking drab existence.
    I understand what you mean. But it is strange that we become so attached to jobs that perform particular functions that they give us meaning and we identify with them.

    So, if in a far distant future, we really had all the goods and services we need w/o labor, would it be preferable to instead as a charade go through the motions to feel useful (I can think of things people already do by hand for exactly that reason)?

    I suppose part of human existence is doing something that you think serves a function...we don't want to just exist or amuse ourselves all the time.....but for thousands of years subsistence for the masses was the challenge. If that challenge is mastered because we're such an ambitious and organized species, will what enabled us to solve it annihilate our sense of meaning and purpose? I know we've taken a more abstract look at this but that is really where we're headed with this conversation. Providing all the basic needs of mankind as efficiently as possible and still having a sense of purpose once we do.


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  2. #12
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    Default Re: The Guaranteed Basic Income

    But I agree with a lot of the previous posts about its near term implementation. With relatively scarce resources, it is re-distributive and will lead to arguments about equity and fairness when there are more pressing issues to fight for politically (political energy is also scarce and so is decency these days).

    I just think people should be primed for a day when we don't think of everything in the economy as either zero sum or scarce. Automation does provide that potential...and at that point it's no longer a question of equity or shares of the pie....it's a question of why we work and what we want to do to find meaning. Is everything that is not work leisure?


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  3. #13
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    Default Re: The Guaranteed Basic Income

    Quote Originally Posted by trish View Post
    Am Amazed! If this is the trend of the future we'll all need free smart phones (with the Go App) too.
    No -because all the functions of a smart phone/computer will be contained in the personalized chip inserted into your arm at birth, which you -or someone else (but whom?)- will regularly update as your move from kindergarten to school and from work or college into marriage, your career, the family and death. Not to mention your favourite drink, your most commonly eaten foods, your dress code, your preference for Langston Hughes over Gwendolyn Brooks (I understand), your rejections and objections and supplications of politicians and tradesmen; and then, of course, your sexual desires...


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  4. #14
    5 Star Poster sukumvit boy's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Guaranteed Basic Income

    Oddly enough , both some retailers and their customers prefer the old check-out line. For grocers , although the check-out line is the most costly and labor intensive aspect of doing business ,those who tried self check-out are returning to cashiers and adding more!
    http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/sup...d-with-people/
    If you want to find the fastest check-out line , look left , look for a lady cashier and get behind the customer with the big full basket !?
    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/08/bu...rket.html?_r=0

    Although I certainly don't bemoan the fact that I haven't needed to stand in a bank teller line for 20 years and can print my own airplane ticket or travel with no paper ticket at all.
    With regard to the jobs in the future "Blade Runner" comes to mind . Perhaps jobs will be assigned tasks of equal importance in running "The Great Machine" , and than we can pop out to Sector Q after work for a little fun with a plasticine cutie.


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  5. #15
    Silver Poster fred41's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Guaranteed Basic Income

    Quote Originally Posted by broncofan View Post
    I understand what you mean. But it is strange that we become so attached to jobs that perform particular functions that they give us meaning and we identify with them.

    So, if in a far distant future, we really had all the goods and services we need w/o labor, would it be preferable to instead as a charade go through the motions to feel useful (I can think of things people already do by hand for exactly that reason)?

    I suppose part of human existence is doing something that you think serves a function...we don't want to just exist or amuse ourselves all the time.....but for thousands of years subsistence for the masses was the challenge. If that challenge is mastered because we're such an ambitious and organized species, will what enabled us to solve it annihilate our sense of meaning and purpose? I know we've taken a more abstract look at this but that is really where we're headed with this conversation. Providing all the basic needs of mankind as efficiently as possible and still having a sense of purpose once we do.
    But without labor...it just comes down to a dystopian future where you live in cubicles and plug in for most of the day. No one would even understand what 'actual' socialization meant. You'd never get to live in a real cabin in the woods (if that was your thing) because they couldn't grant that to everyone. But luckily you could live in a virtual one.
    and there's a real difference between a job and a career.
    A career is someones calling...what they enjoy. There's tons of people that never want to retire. They don't look for a life of leisure.

    One person's martini-in-hand golf club....is another person's idea of living death.



  6. #16
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    Default Re: The Guaranteed Basic Income

    Will be interesting to see how this works.
    From today's Independent-

    A Canadian province has unanimously voted in favour of trialling a universal basic income for its citiziens in partnership with the national government.

    Prince Edward Island, the smallest Canadian Province, has been described as the best choice for the pilot due to its diminutive size and clear boundaries.
    According to the successful bill, every citizen will receive a basic income in an attempt to reduce or "potentially eliminate poverty in the province".

    article is here-
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7462916.html


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  7. #17
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    Default Re: The Guaranteed Basic Income

    Will be interesting to see how this works.
    From today's Independent-

    A Canadian province has unanimously voted in favour of trialling a universal basic income for its citiziens in partnership with the national government.

    Prince Edward Island, the smallest Canadian Province, has been described as the best choice for the pilot due to its diminutive size and clear boundaries.
    According to the successful bill, every citizen will receive a basic income in an attempt to reduce or "potentially eliminate poverty in the province".

    article is here-
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7462916.html


    1 out of 1 members liked this post.

  8. #18
    Silver Poster hippifried's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Guaranteed Basic Income

    Commie shit! OMG. They'll take over without firing a shot. We need to start bombing somebody quick. Or a new TARP to keep the reds at bay. Maybe Trump will channel Reagan. ..



  9. #19
    5 Star Poster sukumvit boy's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Guaranteed Basic Income

    Quote Originally Posted by Stavros View Post
    Will be interesting to see how this works.
    From today's Independent-

    A Canadian province has unanimously voted in favour of trialling a universal basic income for its citiziens in partnership with the national government.

    Prince Edward Island, the smallest Canadian Province, has been described as the best choice for the pilot due to its diminutive size and clear boundaries.
    According to the successful bill, every citizen will receive a basic income in an attempt to reduce or "potentially eliminate poverty in the province".

    article is here-
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7462916.html
    This pilot project on Prince Edward looks interesting and worth following. I've been trying to find more details.
    http://cfccanada.ca/sites/default/fi...ckgrounder.pdf

    Elon Musk says that robots and AI will replace more workers forcing a UBI while the basic income will spark creativity.
    Losing your job could be good for you.

    http://venturebeat.com/2016/11/06/un...-good-for-you/



  10. #20
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    Default Re: The Guaranteed Basic Income

    I like the idea of a BI. It would also cause positive changes in workplace, as people will stop to let themselves being harrassed for little pay. In other words, all those bullies who have somehow ended up in a high position will suddenly be without underlings and will need to seriously rethink their attitude and strategy. People will be less afraid and will speak their mind, confronting them. That alone is worth something.


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  11. #21
    Platinum Poster natina's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Guaranteed Basic Income

    World's First Robotic Kitchen - TV Commercial






    robotic snow plow,grass cutter and raker and more

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/kevinmur...your-snow/amp/

    robot made Tshirts now possible

    http://money.cnn.com/2016/10/11/tech...wbo/index.html

    robo beer delivery

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ry-in-colorado


    Robot pizza place introduces high-tech delivery trucks


    http://money.cnn.com/2016/09/29/tech...elivery-truck/
    sewbo putting sweat shops employees out of business




    Chinese factory workers being replaced by robots - 2015


    Auto logging what a machine! There goes the jobs/trees




    These robotic arms put a five-star chef in your kitchen

    Moley Robotics is developing robotic arms that can cook recipes the way the chef intended. Using motion-capture technology, the Moley Kitchen can mimic the movements of famous chefs, allowing users to download recipes the same way you download music.



    Amazing Artificial intelligence

    http://ochen.com/googles-ai-can-now-...nslate-between


    robo chef and more....

    http://www.iflscience.com/technology...d-arrive-2017/


    http://time.com/3819525/robot-chef-moley-robotics/

    Pepper the robot lands a job at Pizza Hut


    http://www.msn.com/en-us/video/watch...hut/vi-BBttJUb


    robo chef,robo plow,robo janitor,robo....

    Robot named Otto delivery


    Last edited by natina; 01-27-2017 at 08:18 AM.

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