Donald Trump Presidency-Day One

[buttslinger]

Yeah, it doesn't even matter much that we're on the same page, or that Trump is a liar, or even the truth, it comes down to what Mueller can find out and prove. Even if Sessions and Rosenstein and Mueller are fired, they've basically already said they'd all be on Rachel Maddow that evening. The Truth is just a commodity these days, if you can't make any money off it, many consider it worthless.

[Stavros]

Apparently Mueller is now 'meddling' in the Mid-Term Elections along with a Cabal of crooked Democrats. So if the Republicans lose a lot of seats it will be due to vote rigging, not because the voters rejected the President and his party, because he never loses, right?

[Stavros]

@Stavros Thanks so much for your post! I agree with you, about the thing being a continuation of the original Civil War. One thing i see is that the movement, is fueled by negativity. I actually do not mind honoring Confederate war heroes. It's the negativity that grows, into negative consequences. The left is using similar tactic, but it does not run that deep, in my book. But speaking of negativity, it blew my mind, reading about a poll taken, that found that 55% of white americans, feel they are oppressed! And it does not seem like it is the super rich, and corporate elite, as it is minorities, and the government. Here we are having been previously told, we are the richest, and most powerful nation in the world, (american exceptionalism), to now being oppressed?

I think the point about the legacy of the Civil War is that if there are a proportion of Americans who no longer feel their country 'belongs to them' then Steve Bannon is attempting to re-define American Nationalism to meet their criteria that being American means being White, Christian and Heterosexual, with the as yet unstated claim that if they cannot rescue their country from the effects of Globalization, then they will repudiate the authority of the Federal government and create their own Republic based on their values.

Can Anyone be an American? That is the question.

I am not really sure how far Bannon thinks this can go, as he makes claims that are based on a distortion of historical fact, he is even in a weak position himself as a Roman Catholic, which historically was looked upon with suspicion in the US and has little pedigree if you want to take Jamestown and the Mayflower as nodal moments in the development of an American identity.

The demography of the USA is changing, and appears to cast that 'old' America into the shadows as the 'new' America which is ethnically and religiously diverse asserts itself, and grows. The irony for a lot of people is that America has always been at its best when it embraces diversity, not at its weakest, while those who have benefited most from American's economic history, whether it was isolationist or globalist, continue to share the largest proportion of wealth, and indeed, owe a good deal of their security to the very same 'liberal' President they did so much to smear, and whose eclipse has been greeted with almost religious ecstasy. Because they never could accept the fact that a Black man walked into the White House as President, and yes, it is as crude as that.

[KelliBlueEyes]

Yeah, it doesn't even matter much that we're on the same page, or that Trump is a liar, or even the truth, it comes down to what Mueller can find out and prove. Even if Sessions and Rosenstein and Mueller are fired, they've basically already said they'd all be on Rachel Maddow that evening. The Truth is just a commodity these days, if you can't make any money off it, many consider it worthless.

Truth has no value, UNLESS you tell a lie. Then the truth becomes a secret, and secrets have value.

[buttslinger]

Truth has no value, UNLESS you tell a lie. Then the truth becomes a secret, and secrets have value.

Whew, that sounds scary when you say it......

[trish]

Truth has value because it corresponds to the way things are in the world. Knowing the truth about science, medicine etc. (regardless of whether it's known to others or not) allows you effectively navigate the world, avoid some of its dangers and enhance some of its pleasures. Truth has value in and of itself. The trick is establishing you've got hold of the real thing rather than falling for a cheap bauble. Donald's babble is generally pure bauble. Has he ever not reneged on a deal?

[buttslinger]

Truth has value because it corresponds to the way things are in the world. Knowing the truth about science, medicine etc. (regardless of whether it's known to others or not) allows you effectively navigate the world, avoid some of its dangers and enhance some of its pleasures. Truth has value in and of itself. The trick is establishing you've got hold of the real thing rather than falling for a cheap bauble. Donald's babble is generally pure bauble. Has he ever not reneged on a deal?

That sounds so scientific when you say it.

[Stavros]

Truth has no value, UNLESS you tell a lie. Then the truth becomes a secret, and secrets have value.

A post that has me thinking. Thus:

Roseanne Barr posts tweets that insult black people and Jews...and then apologises when there is a shower of public anger in response....and has now quit Twitter. But which of her statements is true and which is a lie?

The Tweet that claimed George Soros was a nazi who turned in his fellow Jews 2 be murdered in German concentration camps & stole their wealth or
I apologize to Valerie Jarrett and to all Americans. I am truly sorry for making a bad joke about her politics and her looks. I should have known better. Forgive me – my joke was in bad taste.

When is a joke not a statement or a statement not a joke? Is Twitter a form of entertainment, like her stand-up routine, or Roseanne saying what she thinks?

A lie has no value, UNTIL you tell truth. Then the lie becomes a secret, and secrets have value -and the secret or not so secret admirers of someone who shares her 'truth'?

https://www.theguardian.com/culture/...-racist-tweets

https://www.theguardian.com/culture/...ie-jarrett-ape

[broncofan]

It's hard to come to terms with the fact that there are some people on the right trying to justify this. You cannot get much more openly racist than Roseanne Barr and it has been obvious for some time. She said essentially the same thing about Susan Rice in 2013...it is pathetic that anyone could pretend there's some sort of parallel between her using "ape" as a dehumanizing racist slur and someone calling Trump an orangutan. Orangutan has no history as a racial slur for descendants of European immigrants, but I'm sure they know that.

She is also a pizzagater, a Soros conspiracy theorist, and someone who decent people shouldn't associate with. ABC should be doing some soul-searching right now. They obviously don't deserve credit for pulling the plug on her show when her depravity has been on display for a while and they never should have put it on the air in the first place.

The concept of a show featuring a family whose members are bitterly split on political issues rings true for a lot of people. It would be nice to be able to put aside political differences to find common ground and laugh together. Obviously, we can't bond with many Trump supporters, who are open racists and doing less and less to hide it.

[Stavros]

It's hard to come to terms with the fact that there are some people on the right trying to justify this. You cannot get much more openly racist than Roseanne Barr and it has been obvious for some time. She said essentially the same thing about Susan Rice in 2013...it is pathetic that anyone could pretend there's some sort of parallel between her using "ape" as a dehumanizing racist slur and someone calling Trump an orangutan. Orangutan has no history as a racial slur for descendants of European immigrants, but I'm sure they know that.

She is also a pizzagater, a Soros conspiracy theorist, and someone who decent people shouldn't associate with. ABC should be doing some soul-searching right now. They obviously don't deserve credit for pulling the plug on her show when her depravity has been on display for a while and they never should have put it on the air in the first place.

The concept of a show featuring a family whose members are bitterly split on political issues rings true for a lot of people. It would be nice to be able to put aside political differences to find common ground and laugh together. Obviously, we can't bond with many Trump supporters, who are open racists and doing less and less to hide it.

All good points.

I appreciate KelliBlueEyes contrast between truth and lies as a dialectical relationship, although I don't think the truth becomes a secret when it is contrasted with lies, when lies are locked into a conspiracy that insists the lie is the truth, whereupon the 'secret' is that you were lied to all along, reversing the dialectic.

As for Roseanne Barr, I find it frankly pathetic that she now says it was the pills what did it. Does a sleeping pill really make a person relate Valerie Jarrett to Planet of the Apes rather than, say, The Sound of Music, Mary Poppins or Star Wars? Why, when referring to George Soros is the automatic thought not about money, his hair-style, his clothes, or his Open Society programme, but about Jews and Nazis?