David Suzuki's Warnning: Bye Bye Japan? (Fukushima)

[Kevin Dong]

Scary stuff!

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2013/11/04/david-suzuki-fukushima-warning_n_4213061.html

David Suzuki has issued a scary warning about Japan's Fukushima nuclear plant, saying that if it falls in a future earthquake, it's "bye bye Japan" and the entire west coast of North America should be evacuated.

The "Nature of Things" host made the comments in a talk posted to YouTube after he joined Dr. David Schindler for "Letting in the Light," a symposium on water ecology held at the University of Alberta on Oct. 30 and 31.

An excerpt of the talk shows Suzuki outlining a frightening scenario that would result from the destruction of the nuclear plant.

"Fukushima is the most terrifying situation I can imagine," he said.

"Three out of the four plants were destroyed in the earthquake and in the tsunami. The fourth one has been so badly damaged that the fear is, if there's another earthquake of a seven or above that, that building will go and then all hell breaks loose.

"And the probability of a seven or above earthquake in the next three years is over 95 per cent."

Suzuki said that an international team of experts needs to go into the Fukushima plant and help fix the problem, but said the Japanese government has "too much pride to admit that."

"I have seen a paper which says that if in fact the fourth plant goes under in an earthquake and those rods are exposed, it's bye bye Japan and everybody on the west coast of North America should evacuate," he said.

"If that isn't terrifying, I don't know what is."

Suzuki's warning came as radiation from the Fukushima plant has been detected in northern Alaska and along the west coast, CBC News reported.

Radiation in Alaskan waters could reach Cold War levels, said Douglas Dasher, a researcher at the University of Alaska Fairbanks, although John Kelley, a professor emeritus at the same university, doesn't seem as certain that it will reach dangerous levels for humans.

"The data they will need is not only past data but current data, and if no one is sampling anything then we won't really know it, will we," he told the network.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTqzqoKMLEg#t=39

[bluesoul]

even if it doesn't fall in a future earthquake, how much damage has it done to marine life already?

[Prospero]

How credible is Suzuki? Any scientists on HA want to comment?

[iagodelgado]

Hydrogen bombs. N Carolina. 1961.

When the US nearly nuked its own entire E Coast.

[bluesoul]

How credible is Suzuki? Any scientists on HA want to comment?

hahaha you can't be serious

[gaysian71]

I call bullshit on this one.

[dderek123]

How credible is Suzuki? Any scientists on HA want to comment?


hahaha you can't be serious

He's a goofball hippy that is popular in the media. He's nearly as nutty as a vegan PETA grand wizard that is riding their old-timey bicycle to their organic fair trade farm in Portland.

From one of my google searches:

"A piece of footage doing the rounds of social media this week shows a young Suzuki in 1972 describing humans as "maggots" that "defecate all over the environment".

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/opinion/david-suzuki-drives-me-crazy/story-fni0cwl5-1226726460558

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsLOcZQheoE

It's not too shocking but still goofy. He's more a 'pop' scientist than a credible scientist.

[dderek123]

Here he is 'beclowning' himself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0nWrItaY1g

[Crossover1]

You call bullshit, do you? Attack Suzuki's character on what is a horrifyingly real scenario he himself is not alone in noting. Some of you should actually do a little more work on research rather than attacking an honourable guy.

[Jackal]

I had the pleasure of spending a week in Japan once. It is such an incredible place with so many wonderful sights to see. It was so sad to see the damage take place there.

[dderek123]

You call bullshit, do you? Attack Suzuki's character on what is a horrifyingly real scenario he himself is not alone in noting. Some of you should actually do a little more work on research rather than attacking an honourable guy.

Awww muffin

[trish]

David Suzuki is a biologist by training. He has doctorate in Zoology from the University of Chicago. Apparently his interest was genetics and like many before him he utilized fruit flies in his experimental studies. He taught at the University of British Columbia. He has broken into popular culture with a series of books for layman, television series, environmental activism and the establishment of a foundation named for himself.

Though radiation is often used in fruit fly experiments, geneticists have no particular expertise in the engineering assessment of nuclear facilities. I would expect him to have some expertise in the effects of ionizing radiation on biota. However, he is not reporting on his own calculations. He is rather bring his noteriety to bear in what many see as a dangerous and unstable situation. In the HuffPo link he says

"I have seen a paper which says that if in fact the fourth plant goes under in an earthquake and those rods are exposed, it's bye bye Japan and everybody on the west coast of North America should evacuate,"

Too bad HuffPo didn’t ask, “What paper?” The relevant question is “What’s the reliability of this uncited source?”

BTW, my goal in life has just mutated. I now want to be a tenth level maggot.

[EvaCassini]

The North Carolina indecent with an accidentally dropped hydrogen bomb is true.

[nysprod]

I'm not a scientist but the one thing I do know is that the nuclear core is now burning uncontrolled, meaning there is no way to shut it down...the only thing they can do at this time is cool the reactor core with water, which of course means millions upon millions of radioactive gallons of water needs to be stored...however much doesn't leak out, that is.

[GroobySteven]

I've been tweeting and Facebooking about this for months. While the US gov. was more concerned with Syria there is a bigger threat to Americans happening in Japan. The Japanese lied or avoiding saying how bad the leaks were and how they've failed to contain it. They waffled around for months and refused international (better) help.
The environmental issues are far reaching and long lasting - and the health on people bordering the pacific could be catastrophic.
Google it and you'll find some pretty serious reports from genuine news sources. It's just doesn't sell papers as well as war.

Californians/Hawaiian's - pass on Pacific fish.

[fred41]

BTW, my goal in life has just mutated. I now want to be a tenth level maggot.

When that happens, I'd be happy to have you feast upon my rotting flesh.

Beats flowers and a movie I'd say.

[trish]

Indeed we did drop the bomb on ourselves. But it was when we were still homophobes so God stepped in and saved us.
http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2013/09/20/goldsboro_nuclear_accident_declassified_document_u _s_nearly_nuked_north.html

An aside on the dderick's anti-suzuki vid. I'm no big fan of Suzuki as you can already tell. But the vid is as full as shit as it claims suzuki is. E.g. averaged over ten year periods, there is no hiatus in global warming...see for example http://www.slate.com/blogs/bad_astronomy/2013/11/05/climate_pause_nope.html

[trish]

When that happens, I'd be happy to have you feast upon my rotting flesh.

Beats flowers and a movie I'd say.num num nums

[TSLoverIB]

I had the pleasure of spending a week in Japan once. It is such an incredible place with so many wonderful sights to see. It was so sad to see the damage take place there.

I agree, overall honorable people, in some ways much to honorable, as their population is declining.

[GroobySteven]

I agree, overall honorable people, in some ways much to honorable, as their population is declining.

Honorable to themselves, not so good for honoring anyone else.

[surf4490]

It's not just Suzuki

http://naturalsociety.com/breaking-fukushima-15000-times-worse-hiroshima-removal-fuel-rods/

[Stavros]

A pity that Suzuki has side-tracked the core issues, which were the lack of co-ordination among agencies in Japan at the time which meant people were on one occasion evacuated from one place to another which was at risk. In addition, the Japanese then and since have not been as honest about the leaks which has meant that assessments of the impact while reasonable, may need to be revised one way or another. On the one side you have the concerns in this round-up from October:
http://enenews.com/nytimes-experts-fukushima-is-having-bigger-effect-on-environment-than-we-expected-we-dont-know-whats-happening-huge-spike-in-radioactive-releases-during-2013-areas-blanketed-in-new-conta

On the other the more sober assessments, albeit over a year old now which limit their data analysis to the Japanese environment suggest the initial leaks into the sea were not as damaging as some might think, as is also the case with the second link. I am not an expert in this area and cannot assess which of the arguments is true, there is still some debate about the short and long-term impact of Chernobyl.
http://www.theworldisyourocean.net/papers/2012bams.pdf

http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2013/05/30/1221834110.full.pdf

Perhaps the long term issue is how a country with an energy resource deficit such as Japan meets its needs; on the one hand Fukushima has had a negative impact on the nuclear option (notwithstanding the recent UK decision to build a new reactor) but on the other it does not help plan the energy needs of the populations that, we assume will be alive in 100 years time if the currently available supplies of oil and gas cannot meet human needs.

[thx1138]

No more seafood for you http://beforeitsnews.com/self-sufficiency/2013/11/no-more-seafood-for-you-fukushima-must-see-video-2466146.html see video. No Suzuki

[thx1138]

Government coverup, cancer cases are on the rise: http://enenews.com/abc-radio-cancer-cases-in-fukushima-emerging-faster-than-expected-japan-surgeon-im-very-angry-its-very-strange-officials-wont-release-basic-data-audio

[thx1138]

Starfish are ripping themselves to pieces, humans next? http://enenews.com/my-sea-star-began-ripping-itself-into-pieces-scenes-from-a-horror-movie-ap-deaths-from-alaska-to-s-california-biologist-perhaps-most-concerning-is-how-many-species-seem-to-be-aff

[Ananke]

I agree with the maggot metaphor.
I fact, if we were not talking about humans, the world could be described as suffering from severe infestation! We are victims of our own success and now we just spend our time trying yo fix problems we created in the first place!

[samlord]

If you really want to know who the "real" David Suzuki is read this very informative article from The Toronto Sun, one of Canada's major daily newspapers

http://www.torontosun.com/2013/10/11/the-two-suzukis-theres-saint-suzuki-the-one-you-see-on-cbc-and-secret-suzuki-the-capitalist-millionaire

[dderek123]

If you really want to know who the "real" David Suzuki is read this very informative article from The Toronto Sun, one of Canada's major daily newspapers

http://www.torontosun.com/2013/10/11/the-two-suzukis-theres-saint-suzuki-the-one-you-see-on-cbc-and-secret-suzuki-the-capitalist-millionaire

Ahh so he is a capitalistic old goofball hippy. Well that's quite something right there.

[dderek123]

This is a bit off topic but still a bit interesting.

http://www.sheffield.ac.uk/news/nr/nuclear-research-sheffield-university-fukushima-1.324913

Volume of nuclear waste could be reduced by 90 per cent says new research

Engineers from the University of Sheffield have developed a way to significantly reduce the volume of some higher activity wastes, which will reduce the cost of interim storage and final disposal.

[trish]

It’s been over two years since the Fukushima Daiichi failure. According to Physics Today (a publication of the American Physics Society) 400 tons of ground water pours into the site and is contaminated every day. The Japanese cannot pump it out and store it fast enough. There is a 1000 tank, on-site storage farm that is expanding at a rate of two tanks per day. What can’t be pumped out and stored leaks into the Pacific. Being on the coast makes this disaster much more complex than Three Mile Island or Chernobyl. Currently the Tokyo Electric Power Company is attempting to dam the ground water flow into the contaminated site with a cryogenic barrier. The strategy has met with considerable criticism from professionals around the globe. Suzuki is no more an expert in nuclear engineering than the average HA member. But he is using his popularity and reputation among the Japanese to pressure politicians there to consult with and accept the assistance of worldwide experts.

The world population stands at around 7 billion. We all want power. The use of fossil fuels has not only created a climatic heat imbalance, but is also a finite resource. The question remains, “Can nuclear ever offer us a clean, ecologically safe source of power to supplement gravity, wind, solar and geothermal? One thing I think we need to remember is this: whatever the source, if a given plant is providing enough power to sustain a city, the consequences of an accident can be catastrophic.

[iagodelgado]

The question remains, “Can nuclear ever offer us a clean, ecologically safe source of power to supplement gravity, wind, solar and geothermal? One thing I think we need to remember is this: whatever the source, if a given plant is providing enough power to sustain a city, the consequences of an accident can be catastrophic.

Both points are valid. I lived through the period when most power in the UK was generated by coal, and the miners decided to strike for winter and block delivery of coal to generation stations.

I'm in favour of balanced rather than monopoly.

[Crossover1]

Indeed we did drop the bomb on ourselves. But it was when we were still homophobes so God stepped in and saved us.
http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2013/09/20/goldsboro_nuclear_accident_declassified_document_u _s_nearly_nuked_north.html

An aside on the dderick's anti-suzuki vid. I'm no big fan of Suzuki as you can already tell. But the vid is as full as shit as it claims suzuki is. E.g. averaged over ten year periods, there is no hiatus in global warming...see for example http://www.slate.com/blogs/bad_astronomy/2013/11/05/climate_pause_nope.html

You're truly an idiot, arguing about whether the Japan reactor isn't profoundly dangerous by character assasination and global warming comparisons?

You can be an anonymous shit juggler, but there are dozens of experts who have and continue to warn about the dangers of Fukishima. Take your head out of your ass.

[trish]

I may be truly an idiot, but I didn't claim and am not claiming the Fukushima Daiichi plant "isn't profoundly dangerous." I am more inclined to agree with Dr. Mycle Schneider and Suzuki than with TEPCO on this specific issue. See for example my most recent post #30.

What idiot who composed that post (#30) does question is whether there isn't a place (perhaps a necessary one) in our future for nuclear power in one form or another.

[trish]

One proof of my idiocy is leaving out the article "the" in to front of the second "idiot" in my last post. But perhaps more damning is that I didn't take a stand one way or the other on the Fukushima plant until rather late in the thread. Partly because, even though the dangers posed to Japan's ground water and their coastal towns and industries is horribly clear, the risk of contamination for further away neighbors like California, to me, is not nearly as clear. But I do not think the anxiety over such possible risks is laughable or misplaced and I'm sorry if I gave that impression.

[BBaggins06]

Trish? Don't feed the trolls. :) He blasts you for character assassination while simultaneously doing the exact same thing to you. That's pretty much the definition of a troll and a hypocrite ...