Does a TS have an obligation to tell a potential partner her TS status?

[Winkle]

Does a TS have an obligation to tell a potential partner her TS status? I had this discussion with a TS and she said she would but felt no obligation to, which I felt was a bit of a contradiction. I said yes.

So what say you?

[GroobySteven]

I believe before it became physical, absolutely.

[Winkle]

I believe before it became physical, absolutely.

If she was a post op?

[GroobySteven]

If she was a post op?

Yep.

[Ms.Stepford]

No. Never.

Most people really don't matter. If I were post op I wouldn't tell any of my deliberate one night stands, the same way I don't tell every guy on the street who obviously wants to fuck me.

[GroobySteven]

No. Never.

Most people really don't matter. If I were post op I wouldn't tell any of my deliberate one night stands, the same way I don't tell every guy on the street who obviously wants to fuck me.

Roll the dice ... load one bullet in the chamber and spin the barrel.
It's not an excuse for people's prejudices or behavior - but it's a fact that girls who have "tricked" guys into believing they're not a trans, have ended up hurt or killed.

[bluesoul]

No. Never.

Most people really don't matter. If I were post op I wouldn't tell any of my deliberate one night stands, the same way I don't tell every guy on the street who obviously wants to fuck me.

the question said potential partner not "every guy on the street who obviously wants to fuck me". also, if you say most people really don't matter- don't you mean people that are interested in transsexuals? because those that aren't, wouldn't be in danger of being deceived.

[Ms.Stepford]

the question said potential partner not "every guy on the street who obviously wants to fuck me".

I wouldn't feel obligated to tell either, in the exact same way.

My trans status doesn't affect them at all.


also, if you say most people really don't matter- don't you mean people that are interested in transsexuals? because those that aren't, wouldn't be in danger of being deceived.


Huh? I don't really know what you're talking about. If I were post op, either would be potential fucks, and neither of them would be in danger. They thought they were getting proper laid with a woman, and that's what they got.


Roll the dice ... load one bullet in the chamber and spin the barrel.
It's not an excuse for people's prejudices or behavior - but it's a fact that girls who have "tricked" guys into believing they're not a trans, have ended up hurt or killed.

I'm absolutely willing to deal with the consequences if it turns out they're assholes.

[GroobySteven]

I'm absolutely willing to deal with the consequences if it turns out they're assholes.

You're willing to take a bullet in the head or being set on fire, just so you can get your rocks off with a guy who doesn't know you're trans? This is like the extreme opposite to extreme tranny chasers.

[Ms.Stepford]

I'm willing to take my chances. I've probably been in worse situations.

[bunzy]

No. Never.

Most people really don't matter. If I were post op I wouldn't tell any of my deliberate one night stands, the same way I don't tell every guy on the street who obviously wants to fuck me.


That just shows how deceitful some transsexuals can be!:heartbroken:

[Ms.Stepford]

I'm also never planning on having surgery, so it's all kinda silly talk...but whatevs.

[Ms.Stepford]

That just shows how deceitful transsexuals can be!:heartbroken:

Oh you poor dear.

[amberskyi]

That just shows how deceitful some transsexuals can be!:heartbroken:

I think people in general are deceitful...if you haven't learned that lesson than your are in for allot of unpleasant surprises in life

[bunzy]

Oh you poor dear.


Imagine i'm a man of good character, i fall in love with you, plan on starting a family, getting married, having kids, all that traditional stuff, do you think is fair not to tell me you are a transsexual? WHAT KIND OF PERSON ARE YOU?

[Ms.Stepford]

Imagine i'm a man of good character, i fall in love with you, plan on starting a family, getting married, having kids, all that traditional stuff, do you think is fair not to tell me you are a transsexual? WHAT KIND OF PERSON ARE YOU?

Me? I'm magic people. :)

[GroobySteven]

I'm willing to take my chances. I've probably been in worse situations.


You're willing to put yourself in those situations when clearly, you wouldn't need to?

Thankfully, I expect Darwin has already put you out of the gene pool.

It's people like you who give transsexuals a bad rap.

[bunzy]

I think people in general are deceitful...if you haven't learned that lesson than your are in for allot of unpleasant surprises in life

I believe there still good people out there, it might be hard to find them but they do exist.

[amberskyi]

I believe there still good people out there, it might be hard to find them but they do exist.

As do i, what i don't believe tho is that any one group of people are more deceitful than another

[RyderMonroe]

Does a TS have an obligation to tell a potential partner her TS status? I had this discussion with a TS and she said she would but felt no obligation to, which I felt was a bit of a contradiction. I said yes.

So what say you?

not at all.

[amberskyi]

Imagine i'm a man of good character, i fall in love with you, plan on starting a family, getting married, having kids, all that traditional stuff, do you think is fair not to tell me you are a transsexual? WHAT KIND OF PERSON ARE YOU?

Question? So does your wife know about your interest in transsexuals or if not already married do you plan on telling your future wife?
There are so many guys on this forum who aren't honest with their partners about their thing for ts girls (some even see ts escorts) but why isn't anyone bothering them for their deceitful ways??stop picking on her.

[bunzy]

As do i, what i don't believe tho is that any one group of people are more deceitful than another

Yeah, your right on that one, my generalization was not of a good taste, i'm sorry if i offended anyone, but my point in this case is that "honesty is the best policy"

[RyderMonroe]

Does a TS have an obligation to tell a potential partner her TS status? I had this discussion with a TS and she said she would but felt no obligation to, which I felt was a bit of a contradiction. I said yes.

So what say you?


not at all.

i think its probably the smart thing to do but I definitely don't think its morally wrong to not tell someone you're trans.

[GroobySteven]

Question? So does your wife know about your interest in transsexuals or if not already married do you plan on telling your future wife?
There are so many guys on this forum who aren't honest with their partners about their thing for ts girls (some even see ts escorts) but why isn't anyone bothering them for their deceitful ways??stop picking on her.

Two completely different topics Amber. That's poor argument to bring one in, to defend the other.

[Ms.Stepford]

You're willing to put yourself in those situations when clearly, you wouldn't need to?

This is all hypothetical. It's about freedom and principle. I shouldn't have to be concerned with the fact that people might be irrationally prejudiced against me.



Thankfully, I expect Darwin has already put you out of the gene pool.

Are you kidding me? My genes are quite exquisite. I'm very well adapted to any situation, obviously smart as hell -just maybe a little crazy, but it's a compelling character trait.

It's a tragedy that I won't be able to have and love natural offspring, thank you very much. That was kind of a privileged and cruel thing to say.



It's people like you who give transsexuals a bad rap.

I'm way too young for that, and as a Dionysian priestess, I'm not subject to mainstream society's "raps" anyway.

[bluesoul]

Huh? I don't really know what you're talking about. If I were post op, either would be potential fucks, and neither of them would be in danger. They thought they were getting proper laid with a woman, and that's what they got.

actually it isn't. in fact, you said yourself "they thought" they were getting laid with a woman. what someone thinks and what is indeed fact are two different things.

although to your credit, i will say on this forum there are members who say they don't see a difference between women and transsexual women and in that case, i can see how you come to this train of thought.

[GroobySteven]

i think its probably the smart thing to do but I definitely don't think its morally wrong to not tell someone you're trans.

Morally I don't give a shit about - but not knowing the reaction of the other person - or their personal history, then nobody should put them or the other person, in that position.
Also if they wanted to start a relationship, then the foundation should be honesty.

[amberskyi]

Two completely different topics Amber. That's poor argument to bring one in, to defend the other.

Deceit is deceit

[Ms.Stepford]

i think its probably the smart thing to do but I definitely don't think its morally wrong to not tell someone you're trans.

In a perfectly practical sense, this is how I feel.

[RyderMonroe]

Morally I don't give a shit about - but not knowing the reaction of the other person - or their personal history, then nobody should put them or the other person, in that position.
Also if they wanted to start a relationship, then the foundation should be honesty.

I agree. But the reason its smarter to tell them is for the girl's safety. I agree with Ms. Stepford in that she shouldn't have to be responsible for some fuck's irrational prejudices.

[GroobySteven]

This is all hypothetical. It's about freedom and principle. I shouldn't have to be concerned with the fact that people might be irrationally prejudiced against me.

It's not hypothetical, you've stated you're not concerned about it. You shouldn't be concerned about their prejudice, they are what they are but why "trick" them into thinking you're something you or not - and then suffer potential consequences when you could have simply avoided the situation.



Are you kidding me? My genes are quite exquisite. I'm very well adapted to any situation, obviously smart as hell -just maybe a little crazy, but it's a compelling character trait.

It's a tragedy that I won't be able to have and love natural offspring, thank you very much. That was kind of a privileged and cruel thing to say.
Compelling to you maybe. You're welcome. I stand by my comment.



I'm way too young for that, and as a Dionysian priestess, I'm not subject to mainstream society's "raps" anyway.
If I could be at all arsed, I'd look up what a Dionysian priestess is.

[RyderMonroe]

It's not hypothetical, you've stated you're not concerned about it. You shouldn't be concerned about their prejudice, they are what they are but why "trick" them into thinking you're something you or not - and then suffer potential consequences when you could have simply avoided the situation.


wow she's "tricking" ppl now?

[GroobySteven]

I agree. But the reason its smarter to tell them is for the girl's safety. I agree with Ms. Stepford in that she shouldn't have to be responsible for some fuck's irrational prejudices.

She shouldn't HAVE to be responsible. We all know that. That would be a wonderful world where we shouldn't be concerned that someone is going to kill us or beat the shit out of us because of their prejudices or just because they're fucked up.
We've had this conversation before, pretty much after every girl is beaten, burned, thrown out of a window, shot in the head. They shouldn't have had to be responsible for those other people's action either.

You can't always choose the situations you're put into - but when you do get that choice, then you need to take some responsibility for putting yourself in harms way.

[GroobySteven]

wow she's "tricking" ppl now?

Pretending to be something you're not, is tricking someone right?

[Ms.Stepford]

It's not hypothetical, you've stated you're not concerned about it.

It is though, because we're talking about instances where I'm post-op. Nothing could be more hypothetical.

[f-finger]

Dyonisos was the greek god of wine and festivities. An all time favorite of mine.

[Jamie French]

I'd rather be an honest person than feel all high and mighty about my dumb little gender issues. Being a decent, (i.e. honest) human being comes first... anything else I'm up to is really just a privilege and will be treated as such. I get to alter my gender, I do not get to lie whether it be outright or through omission.

[Ms.Stepford]

She shouldn't HAVE to be responsible. We all know that. That would be a wonderful world where we shouldn't be concerned that someone is going to kill us or beat the shit out of us because of their prejudices or just because they're fucked up.
We've had this conversation before, pretty much after every girl is beaten, burned, thrown out of a window, shot in the head. They shouldn't have had to be responsible for those other people's action either.

You can't always choose the situations you're put into - but when you do get that choice, then you need to take some responsibility for putting yourself in harms way.

As an adult, yes, I fully accept responsibility. Now what?

I don't see why I deserve assault on my genetics and character because of this.

[GroobySteven]

It is though, because we're talking about instances where I'm post-op. Nothing could be more hypothetical.

Again, and I'm not trying to be an asshole here - that would be lovely in a lovely world but a guy you meet finds out you're post-op and it sets him off. Why not just be honest?

[f-finger]

Why not just be honest?

Because thats the ole "validation as female/woman" game....

[RyderMonroe]

Pretending to be something you're not, is tricking someone right?

She isnt pretending to be anything..

[Ms.Stepford]

It's medical history and I could see it getting in the way of the natural flow of the relationship.

To be honest, if he were the kind of guy whom it mattered to, I'd probably have been long since been put off of him for some other personality flaw.

[GroobySteven]

As an adult, yes, I fully accept responsibility. Now what?

I don't see why I deserve assault on my genetics and character because of this.

Like I said, Darwin. Act stupidly and put yourself in the firing line, then your genes need taking out of the pool.
I've heard of and seen too many girls killed to condone someone who would happily put themselves in these sort of situations.

[RyderMonroe]

Pretending to be something you're not, is tricking someone right?

neglecting to tell someone about a past medical issue is not "pretejding to be something you arent". Unless you think trans women that "pass" are inherently tricking ppl.

[Ms.Stepford]

And let's get it clear that we are not obligated to think of ourselves in the terms that cis people have laid forth for us.

I'm not obligated to define my life by one little part of me.

[amberskyi]

Two completely different topics Amber. That's poor argument to bring one in, to defend the other.

Deceit is deceit

[GroobySteven]

She isnt pretending to be anything..

The presumption is that she is a natural born female as that's how she presents herself. Nobody needs to know otherwise, that's her business but when she puts herself in a situation with another persons emotions and psyche by starting a relationship with them, when that relationship turns physical then she should be honest and let them know. As I've stated, you don't know how it would affect someone, what prejudices they might have, what twisted past they might have.
Why put yourself in that position?

This isn't the People's Front of Judea situation - it's a very real situation where people get hurt.

[GroobySteven]

Deceit is deceit

You're repeating yourself.

[Dino Velvet]

I don't wish to meddle in anyone's affairs but please be safe, ladies. A fella in the wrong is just as deadly as the righteous one.

[TempestTS]

I dont keep my TS status a secret but neither do I tell everyone about it either - when and if there is a reason to know Ill make sure you know - till then its up to the other person to figure it out and with me and being as much of a gender activist as I am its not exactly rocket science to figure it out...

Intentionally Tricking people can only serve as some sort of psychological "Kick" at the expense of someone else and thats as much wrong as it is just plain stupid.

You should be proud of who you are - if you're not, you should find a way to make yourself into a someone you Can take pride in...

[amberskyi]

Oops Android issues lol

[RyderMonroe]

Pretending to be something you're not, is tricking someone right?


The presumption is that she is a natural born female as that's how she presents herself. Nobody needs to know otherwise, that's her business but when she puts herself in a situation with another persons emotions and psyche by starting a relationship with them, when that relationship turns physical then she should be honest and let them know. As I've stated, you don't know how it would affect someone, what prejudices they might have, what twisted past they might have.
Why put yourself in that position?

This isn't the People's Front of Judea situation - it's a very real situation where people get hurt.

She presents herself as female because she is female and thats how females present themselves.. i agree with you that not telling someone can have disastrous real life consequences but you keep saying that she is tricking ppl by basically just living her life like a normal human being. Some guy who pursues who is not owed any type of backstory on her life. You're attitude is basically, He's normal and she's weird so its her obligation to tell him that he's kissing a weirdo..

[Ms.Stepford]

I hate that moment now when a guy is making the moves and he ends up on my lips, and I always have to think "Oh shit! He doesn't know!"

I'm sick of having to think that.

Jesus fuck, I was just born.

[GroobySteven]

She presents herself as female because she is female and thats how females present themselves.. i agree with you that not telling someone can have disastrous real life consequences but you keep saying that she is tricking ppl by basically just living her life like a normal human being. Some guy who pursues who is not owed any type of backstory on her life. You're attitude is basically, He's normal and she's weird so its her obligation to tell him that he's kissing a weirdo..

That's not my attitude at all, Ryder - and you can get on the soap box as much as you want about how you're a female, that's awesome - but get real - life isn't like that and neither are the people in it.
You believe she's a female, I may believe she is a female - some other people won't or don't and when a guy who has entered a relationship see's photos of her with her cock flying around all over the internet, then he may react violently.

The only wrong in this, is that people shouldn't react violently or with distain when finding out someone is trans* or had corrective surgery and when society reaches that point it will be awesome. We're not there yet and I hope less girls rather than more, die on the way to getting there.

I do believe in today's society a transsexual needs to give some of their backstory before entering a relationship.

[RyderMonroe]

That's not my attitude at all, Ryder - and you can get on the soap box as much as you want about how you're a female, that's awesome - but get real - life isn't like that and neither are the people in it.
You believe she's a female, I may believe she is a female - some other people won't or don't and when a guy who has entered a relationship see's photos of her with her cock flying around all over the internet, then he may react violently.

The only wrong in this, is that people shouldn't react violently or with distain when finding out someone is trans* or had corrective surgery and when society reaches that point it will be awesome. We're not there yet and I hope less girls rather than more, die on the way to getting there.

I do believe in today's society a transsexual needs to give some of their backstory before entering a relationship.

.. u arent even trying to listen to me..

[Ms.Stepford]

Before entering a relationship, for sure!

But hypothetically if I were post-op and having the kind of one-night stands I like -y'know...where I really think about how I never want to see the guy again, and that's why it gets me off -I wouldn't feel obligated at all.

[Jamie French]

I'm still having a hard time understanding why anyone would think they are above honesty for any reason whatsoever. I think it's a much, much broader issue than whether or not a trans girl is being dishonest in a very specific situation... honesty is a ubiquitously cherished human trait - why would someones crotch issues play into it at all?

[GroobySteven]

.. u arent even trying to listen to me..

Touche.

[bluesoul]

She presents herself as female because she is female and thats how females present themselves..

she isn't genetically female though, she's a transsexual female.

[f-finger]

I'm still having a hard time understanding why anyone would think they are above honesty for any reason whatsoever. I think it's a much, much broader issue than whether or not a trans girl is being dishonest in a very specific situation... honesty is a ubiquitously cherished human trait - why would someones crotch issues play into it at all?

Pretty simple, because certain individuals in this thread have some troube with reality outside this "trans"bubble.

[Alice S]

Trans peoples being the oppressed and cis peoples the oppressors, a cis person hold no moral ground to tell a trans person what to do about its identity.

What's debatable, however, is to know if a trans girl should disclose her trans status to somebody for her own safety. I would argue that having one's trans status outed, no matter to who and in which way, could lead to the trans person being murdered, as we live in an hysterically transphobic society. So it's up for her to choose.

What's not debatable is some kind of moral obligation a trans girl would have to manage some cis person little dick's insecurities. And to threaten with death a trans person who would not accept to comply to this rule imposed by cis peoples display a frightening level of transphobia.

[Buddy Wood]

What the fuck???

That's just fucking nuts!! I don't think anybody on here is saying a transsexual should where a t-shirt saying "I'm a tranny" everytime she leaves the fuckin house...but if she gets involved with a guy who may not know she is a transsexual...then YES!!! She better tell that guy. Pretty fuckin quickly. It's not a political/social debate. It's not oppressing you or your gender. It's the simple fact that that guy may punch your fuckin face in or kill you when he finds out you were born genetically male. That's it. Black & white. Bottomline. In an ideal world it wouldn't matter... we don't live in that world. It's for her own safety!!!!!

Anytime I hear of a girl doing this (and it's usually a very young and naive but hot girl who can fool guys) I sit them down and tell them how many bad stories I've heard because of it. Horror stories!! It's just not a good idea.

As more thoughtful and socially conscious girls you should be examples to the more "naive" or "promiscuous" girls who would do this sort of thing. In the end it's just gonna get them hurt. Killed. Right??

Don't turn everything into a debate

Alice where do u live?? Sounds like a horrible place.

[fivekatz]

Duh. Yes.

[hippifried]

What the fuck???

That's just fucking nuts!! I don't think anybody on here is saying a transsexual should where a t-shirt saying "I'm a tranny" everytime she leaves the fuckin house...but if she gets involved with a guy who may not know she is a transsexual...then YES!!! She better tell that guy. Pretty fuckin quickly. It's not a political/social debate. It's not oppressing you or your gender. It's the simple fact that that guy may punch your fuckin face in or kill you when he finds out you were born genetically male. That's it. Black & white. Bottomline. In an ideal world it wouldn't matter... we don't live in that world. It's for her own safety!!!!!

Anytime I hear of a girl doing this (and it's usually a very young and naive but hot girl who can fool guys) I sit them down and tell them how many bad stories I've heard because of it. Horror stories!! It's just not a good idea.

As more thoughtful and socially conscious girls you should be examples to the more "naive" or "promiscuous" girls who would do this sort of thing. In the end it's just gonna get them hurt. Killed. Right??

Don't turn everything into a debate

Alice where do u live?? Sounds like a horrible place.

Yeah. There's always that angle... But the obvious first question to whomever would withhold that information has to be:
How can you possibly expect success from a "partnership" that begins with a lie?

[natina]

Belgium man discovers his Indonesian wife used to be man after 19 yrs of marriage

http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=72650


I've been tricked

http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=60780&page=2

All straight men deserve to be tricked!!!

http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=74941


tricking guys who only want GG'S and making money
http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=52597

http://ww2.trannytrouble.com/1/teaserconsole.php?nats=MTAwMDAwMjI6MTg6MzQ,0,0,0,0&videoName=carmen_trailer_300k&videoType=wmv

http://ww2.trannytrouble.com/1/?nats=MTAwMDAwMjI6MTg6MzQ,0,0,0,0


http://pinkvisualhdgalleries.com/Free-Porn/Tranny-Seducers/Juliana-Jhones/Video/01?revid=63372

DO Tgrils get kicks tricking straight guys into fucking them
http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=29642





look at this note many TS in deep stealth mode

who use this while working at a strip club,going to the ladies room and

even some with clients for there escorting or other relationships


many TS in deep stealth mode


CHECK THIS OUT

Hi doll < SONIA> 11/09 11:48


It is very painful and dangerous. You have to soak in a hot tub for about four hours and still its hard to get off.
We used that years ago when I used to work, so the guys couldn't find out.
If you did it good enough they could even eat you.

Blast from the past; Aunty SONIA

TUCKING TO MAKE GIRL PUSSY

http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/showthread.php?p=1008237

http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=50770

Fooled 6 Guys Thinking I had Pussy one found out I had cock
http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=65191

[natina]

YOU WANNA TRICK THEM AND THEN KILL YOU!


Trial Begins in Slaying of Transgender Woman

Story Highlights
Prosecutors charge man with murder in slaying of transgender woman, age 18
Suspect and victim had met online before seeing each other in person
"Hate crime" case has been closely watched by transgender-rights groups
If convicted, defendant could be sentence to life in prison with no parole

By Jim Spellman
CNN

GREELEY, Colorado (CNN) -- It started as a tryst, arranged online, in a quiet town in the shadow of the Rocky Mountains. She was an 18-year-old transgender woman. He was a 32-year-old rough-and-tumble gang member.

It ended in homicide.

Opening statments behgan Thursday in the trial of Allen Andrade, accused of murdering Justin "Angie" Zapata, .

Andrade also has been charged with a bias-motivated crime.

Zapata was 18 years old in the summer of 2008 when prosecutors say she met Andrade, then 32, on the popular online networking site MocoSpace.

According to a police affidavit, the two arranged to meet and Zapata brought Andrade to her apartment in Greeley, Colorado, where they spent two days together. During that time, according to the affidavit, Andrade says Zapata performed oral sex on him. When Zapata was out of the apartment, Andrade noticed photographs of Zapata that made him "question victim Zapata's sex."

When Zapata returned, Andrade confronted her. Zapata declared, "I am all woman." Andrade then grabbed Zapata's crotch and discovered a penis.

What happened next is gruesome.

According to the affidavit, Andrade told police he began hitting Zapata with his fists, knocking her to the ground. He then grabbed a fire extinguisher and hit her in the head two times.

He told police he thought he had "killed it," referring to Zapata, and covered her with a blanket. He then set about trying to clean up the crime scene. While doing this, he heard "gurgling" sounds coming from the victim and saw Zapata sitting up. He hit her again with the fire extinguisher.

This time Zapata was dead.

Andrade took Zapata's car and fled. Two weeks later, police discovered the car and arrested Andrade.

Calls to Andrade's public defender for comment have not been returned.

The case has become a rallying point for supporters of the transgender community who have held vigils and launched Web sites in remembrance of Zapata. They are calling for the inclusion of transgender people in hate-crime statues across the country and at the federal level. Currently 11 states and the District of Columbia recognize transgender people in their anti-hate crime laws.

Mindy Barton, legal director for the Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual and Transgender Community Center of Colorado, says this has the makings of a landmark case.

"We believe this is the first case of any hate crime law being applied in an anti-transgender murder case," Barton says. "A vicious attack such as this, with the evidence of overkill and excessive brutality, leaves the whole transgender community feeling afraid to live their daily lives."

If convicted of first-degree murder, Andrade will face a mandatory sentence of life in prison without the possibility of parole. The charge of a bias-motivated crime carries only a one- to three-year sentence, but Barton says the length of sentence isn't important.

"It is not the sentence which is important, but the fact that victims, perpetrators and law enforcement officials recognize that such bigotry and hatred will not be tolerated," she says. "That is the important message when there is a charge and a conviction under a hate-crime law."

Court officials in Greeley are preparing for possible protests outside the courthouse. The trial is expected to last about two weeks

http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=39418

[Alice S]

but if she gets involved with a guy who may not know she is a transsexual...then YES!!! She better tell that guy. Pretty fuckin quickly.

If, on the way home, she tells the guy she's trans, nothing garantee he will not immediatly proceed to beat her to death. Her take, her risk, her choice.




Anytime I hear of a girl doing this (and it's usually a very young and naive but hot girl who can fool guys) I sit them down and tell them how many bad stories I've heard because of it. Horror stories!! It's just not a good idea.

Yeah, but it's their business. Not yours, because you actually don't know. Nobody wants to kill you because you're cis.



As more thoughtful and socially conscious girls you should be examples to the more "naive" or "promiscuous" girls who would do this sort of thing.

It's what I'm doing right now.



Alice where do u live?? Sounds like a horrible place.

Another so called "developed" western country, so, yes, as a trans person, it's pretty awfull. Too bad I don't live in a democratic asian country. There's even worse, though.



How can you possibly expect success from a "partnership" that begins with a lie?

Indeed, you can't build a partnership without trust. Trust from a trans girl is something you earn. She's taking the greatest risk.

[Rusty Eldora]

OK, I am a guy that is into Tgirls. I would want a heads up that she is TS while still in public before we did the bedroom get together, certainly before kissing.

A lot of guys that have thought of it, but are not sure, might be taken aback for a second, but then they can choose with their eyes open to go forward or leave. Past that point, the guy might feel tricked, which is not good.

I wouldn't call it an obligation but it is very important for the Tgirls safety.

[natina]

some people have religious objections

some people have morale objections

some people just do not want that type of relationship

[Jamie French]

I actually just ordered two shirts from cafepress... one just says, "Tranny" and the other says "Tranny Lover". I can't wait to wear them in public. I'm proud of who and what I am. If it causes any problems, well I'm 33 - I got a purse and in that purse is a knife. I'll just handle it. I'm no ones victim.

[GroobySteven]

Trans peoples being the oppressed and cis peoples the oppressors, a cis person hold no moral ground to tell a trans person what to do about its identity.



Congratulations on the stupidest and most ill-informed first post in the history of this board.

[Alice S]

Congratulations on the stupidest and most ill-informed first post in the history of this board.

Well argued, I can't do better.

[Tyler___Durden]

It's people like you who give transsexuals a bad rap.
Tyler puts on a Trans-activist hat. http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-basic/rolleyes.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys.php)
There is a risk aspect, sure.
But there is always a risk aspect to telling a stranger in a bar that the woman they wish to buy a drink for, is a transsexual (And as a matter of fact, a woman, period). They later get a few friends who together rape-slash-murder you.
Just transitioning in the first place is a risk of increased violence.
Transsexual=transition. (The clue is in the word)
To suggest that a person WITH A TRANSSEXUAL HISTORY is forever dammed to reveal that past, {even after SRS} marginaliseas and ungenders us. And permanently consigns us to a fetish /novelty status in the wider world.
Privacy. Why would we expect to be revealing VERY PERSONAL DETAILS of our past lives, when those who offer to buy us a drink / date us / seek a relationship with us don't reveal every bullet-point detail of their own history, like the fact they used to visit a sex worker, they occasionally had recreational sex with a co worker, 10 years ago and caught gonorrhoea as a result, they were married but cheated. (The Marriage split up was for unrelated matters). They stole money from a past employer.
All those things are fundamental details of a persons past, and would influence a womans decision (be she be Trans or Bio) to interact with that man, on any level from flirt through to marriage.
I wouldn't expect this hypothetical man to be provided to me on an A-4 sheet of paper. There may be times where these details are disclosed as he feels appropriate.
Same with my trans background. ;)
The suggestion of Obligation of reveal is holding Trans women to a higher standard of ethics than the rest of society.


That's where I stand on the subject of disclosure for any trans person.
I'm pre-SRS and personally I would reveal this prior to any intimate contact.
That's really out of politeness rather than any pseudo-moral code. Plus they'd find out soon enough! :)
Weird the number of guys who want a date with me and had no idea but are still very interested, when I mention the Trans-thing.
Hands up to one occasion where I didn't do this. It was a tranny party, where a high % were CD's/TV's, and a few Ts. A Bio-woman picked me up and we got intimate. Because of the type of event, I assumed that she'd figured out I wasn't born female. All fine till she found something where a vag should have been. Awkwardness all round. Kinda killed the moment.


Oh, If I go along with the OP point of view. (coz I'm like that :))
I would expect the world to be totally understanding, when I am flirting with a Bio-woman
and I subsequently get very pissy in a loud and annoying way,
when I find out that the beautiful woman I've been chatting to all evening,
is in fact, a beautiful woman who didn't used to be a man.

[GroobySteven]

Tyler puts on a Trans-activist hat. http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-basic/rolleyes.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys.php)

There is a risk aspect, sure.
But there is always a risk aspect to telling a stranger in a bar that the woman they wish to buy a drink for, is a transsexual (And as a matter of fact, a woman, period). They later get a few friends who together rape-slash-murder you.
Just transitioning in the first place is a risk of increased violence.
Transsexual=transition. (The clue is in the word)
To suggest that a person WITH A TRANSSEXUAL HISTORY is forever dammed to reveal that past, {even after SRS} marginaliseas and ungenders us. And permanently consigns us to a fetish /novelty status in the wider world.
Privacy. Why would we expect to be revealing VERY PERSONAL DETAILS of our past lives, when those who offer to buy us a drink / date us / seek a relationship with us don't reveal every bullet-point detail of their own history, like the fact they used to visit a sex worker, they occasionally had recreational sex with a co worker, 10 years ago and caught gonorrhoea as a result, they were married but cheated. (The Marriage split up was for unrelated matters). They stole money from a past employer.
All those things are fundamental details of a persons past, and would influence a womans decision (be she be Trans or Bio) to interact with that man, on any level from flirt through to marriage.
I wouldn't expect this hypothetical man to be provided to me on an A-4 sheet of paper. There may be times where these details are disclosed as he feels appropriate.
Same with my trans background. ;)
The suggestion of Obligation of reveal is holding Trans women to a higher standard of ethics than the rest of society.



That's where I stand on the subject of disclosure for any trans person.
I'm pre-SRS and personally I would reveal this prior to any intimate contact.
That's really out of politeness rather than any pseudo-moral code. Plus they'd find out soon enough! :)
Weird the number of guys who want a date with me and had no idea but are still very interested, when I mention the Trans-thing.
Hands up to one occasion where I didn't do this. It was a tranny party, where a high % were CD's/TV's, and a few Ts. A Bio-woman picked me up and we got intimate. Because of the type of event, I assumed that she'd figured out I wasn't born female. All fine till she found something where a vag should have been. Awkwardness all round. Kinda killed the moment.


Oh, If I go along with the OP point of view. (coz I'm like that :))
I would expect the world to be totally understanding, when I am flirting with a Bio-woman
and I subsequently get very pissy in a loud and annoying way,
when I find out that the beautiful woman I've been chatting to all evening,
is in fact, a beautiful woman who didn't used to be a man.


Great post Tyler.
AGAIN my issue isn't a moral one, it's a safety one - and society isn't at the point where we can guarantee a girl not putting herself in harm's way by keeping her past secret.
Let's face it, as soon as it gets physical almost any man is going to find out whether pre- or post- op.

If we ever get to the point where the surgery would be absolutely undetectable, where the history couldn't be found out OR where everyone really didn't give a shit and guaranteed for the situation to not turn violent, then I'd be all for it.

[Tyler___Durden]

Pretending to be something you're not, is tricking someone right?
Like the men on HA who are married or in long term relationships with Bio-women
and don't disclose their sexual interest in Trans women.

Trans-women are either women, full stop.
Or they are forever stuck in some sort of half way house regardless of surgery's.
And never really women, you know in the fully accepted "Gold seal" kinda way.

If it's the latter and our decision not to reveal our past to any potential partner,
is tricking.....
Then the vast majority of men on HA are tricking too.

You can't have it both ways.
And Amberski made this point too.
It is EXACTLY the same issue. Not separate in any way.

[GroobySteven]

Like the men on HA who are married or in long term relationships with Bio-women
and don't disclose their sexual interest in Trans women.

Trans-women are either women, full stop.
Or they are forever stuck in some sort of half way house regardless of surgery's.
And never really women, you know in the fully accepted "Gold seal" kinda way.

If it's the latter and our decision not to reveal our past to any potential partner,
is tricking.....
Then the vast majority of men on HA are tricking too.

You can't have it both ways.
And Amberski made this point too.
It is EXACTLY the same issue. Not separate in any way.

Absolutely irrelevant. Two separate arguments.

Regarding this;
"Trans-women are either women, full stop.
Or they are forever stuck in some sort of half way house regardless of surgery's."

It would be nice if everyone thought that way - but in real life, they don't. So you need to continue to be an activist but be realistic about where it's at now.

[Tyler___Durden]

I'm only an activist on this thread. http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-basic/blink.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys.php) {I'm annoying like that!}
Our thoughts are influenced by our circumstances.
Mine and other women on this thread by our decisions which are potentially a matter of life and death.
Yours by your awareness of these very real issues highlighted on your website (http://www.grooby.com/fallenangels/) which pays tribute to Trans-women Performers who are lost, often through violence.

Oh, the other potential issue.
Tell a man you are trans, in the first brief conversation in a club.
He's not interested and politely goes on his way.
Has a conversation with someone
who tells another
who tells another
who...
BANG! BANG!

Sometimes a disclosure to one person is disseminated to a much wider audience,
some of whom may made their thoughts violently known.

Flip side.
A crowded hall.
Q. How do you know if there is a transsexual woman in the room.
A. She's already told everyone! http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-basic/tongue.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys.php)

[f-finger]

Question? So does your wife know about your interest in transsexuals or if not already married do you plan on telling your future wife?
There are so many guys on this forum who aren't honest with their partners about their thing for ts girls (some even see ts escorts) but why isn't anyone bothering them for their deceitful ways??stop picking on her.

There are also quite a few Ts-Prostitutes on this site who know very well of these facts, namely men cheating on their wifes/GFs with, well, TS-prostitutes.

Did any of them ever ask their johns errrr cleints, if they were married and refused to service them bc of these facts?

[amberskyi]

There are also quite a few Ts-Prostitutes on this site who know very well of these facts, namely men cheating on their wifes/GFs with, well, TS-prostitutes.

Did any of them ever ask their johns errrr cleints, if they were married and refused to service them bc of these facts?

Were not the ones trying to stand on some moral soap box pretending one deceit is worse than another or pretending its not related.
Everyone has something from their past they might want to hide.for me its a situation, for some girls their gender, for you perhaps its you like to get plowed by big breasted shemales lol.like Tyler said at what point does one fully disclose their whole past?
I personally only like to deal with guys who know I'm Trans because i don't take rejection well but I'm not going to tell another girl to whom and when she should reveal her status to.shit,i was just talking to a guy last week in which after some light conversation and flirting i told him i was ts.he thought i should of said it after hello and felt offended that he flirted with a transsexual.its completely ridiculous to think that i need to say to every person i come in contact with "hello, I'm amber and a transsexual woman".
guys i get it, you'll want to know but I'm sure if gg woman were on this board they would think revealing your into ts woman is something they would want to know out the gate as well.

[f-finger]

Were not the ones trying to stand on some moral soap box pretending one deceit is worse than another or pretending its not related.
Everyone has something from their past they might want to hide.for me its a situation, for some girls their gender, for you perhaps its you like to get plowed by big breasted shemales lol.like Tyler said at what point does one fully disclose their whole past?
I personally only like to deal with guys who know I'm Trans because i don't take rejection well but I'm not going to tell another girl to whom and when she should reveal her status to.shit,i was just talking to a guy last week in which after some light conversation and flirting i told him i was ts.he thought i should of said it after hello and felt offended that he flirted with a transsexual.its completely ridiculous to think that i need to say to every person i come in contact with "hello, I'm amber and a transsexual woman".
guys i get it, you'll want to know but I'm sure if gg woman were on this board they would think revealing your into ts woman is something they would want to know out the gate as well.

Nice write up, nevertheless you didn't answer my question(s) , so I'll try again.

A) Are you a Prostitute?

B) Do you ask your "clients" if they are married/in a relationship? Do you refuse to service them?

[giovanni_hotel]

A transwoman doesn't have to tell ME her status beforehand.lol

But there are some psychotically homophobic men out here who would have no problem becoming homicidally violent to defend their 'masculinity'.

[amberskyi]

Nice write up, nevertheless you didn't answer my question(s) , so I'll try again.

A) Are you a Prostitute?

B) Do you ask your "clients" if they are married/in a relationship? Do you refuse to service them?

What's the relevance of your questions?we're taking about decider and how it applies to relationships, not morality in general.
And if your trying to make a point about my moral scale i wasn't the one hoping on a soap box talking about how wrong and deceitful it is when ts woman doesn't disclose their status.i was making a counter argument to this argument.

[Tyler___Durden]

There are also quite a few Ts-Prostitutes on this site who know very well of these facts, namely men cheating on their wifes/GFs with, well, TS-prostitutes.
Did any of them ever ask their johns errrr cleints, if they were married and refused to service them bc of these facts?
I usually ask during the first 5 minutes, part of my ice-break.
I joke around to say that the wife rang me earlier to ask that I show her hubby a great time.
(Seriously, I do this and my delivery doesn't worry or threaten. Rather it brings a smile to the client's face)
I generally assume my client to be married.

Why would you expect any Provider to refuse a client, based upon a client's marital status?
I would never describe a married man visiting a prozzie as cheating.
This would be making huge assumptions about the nature and limitations and boundaries within said marriage.
{Which are none of the Provider's business}
It would be the height of arrogance by me, or any other Provider to pry into the private lives of a client.
The client is in part paying for this discretion.

Incidentally, I don't hold road builders responsible for the behaviour of speeding motorists....
(Just how fast were you driving on your way home tonight?)

[f-finger]

What's the relevance of your questions?we're taking about decider and how it applies to relationships, not morality in general.
And if your trying to make a point about my moral scale i wasn't the one hoping on a soap box talking about how wrong and deceitful it is when ts woman doesn't disclose their status.i was making a counter argument to this argument.

Ah I get it, no answer is indeed an answer as well.

[asianphoenixx]

No. Never.

Most people really don't matter. If I were post op I wouldn't tell any of my deliberate one night stands, the same way I don't tell every guy on the street who obviously wants to fuck me.

100% agree. why bother tell the one night stand guys, especially when we are already post op.

[Ms.Stepford]

I straight-up talk to some guys about how they don't have sex with their wives anymore, and it makes me feel like such goddamn angel of mercy bestowing upon them some of the best sexual experiences they'll ever have in their lives.

One guy said "this is why I can tolerate getting nagged about emptying the dishwasher when I go home. God bless you."

[f-finger]

Why would you expect any Provider to refuse a client, based upon a client's marital status?


I would only if the said provider would use the "but u r married and cheat with us (=TS prostitutes) behind ur back" line in order to indeed gain "morality" points. You can read that kind of "counter-argument" on these pages repeatedly.

[amberskyi]

I would only if the said provider would use the "but u r married and cheat with us (=TS prostitutes) behind ur back" line in order to indeed gain "morality" points. You can read that kind of "counter-argument" on these pages repeatedly.

again we werent trying to gain morality points but merely pointing out that deceit is deceit and that a ts woman not disclosing her status is not that different than man who doesnt tell his gg partner about his interest in ts woman (which no one gripes about on here).i do believe it was yall (you men) who tried to stand on some moral soapbox but okay cling to this week ass counter point that youve tried to come up with lol

[f-finger]

.but okay cling to this week ass counter point that youve tried to come up with lol

It's not weak ass at all, otherwise you wouldn't invest so much in replying to it.

[Prospero]

There is an awful lot of mudslinging going on in this thread - and tangled arguments.

I'd say that no one - no transgendered girl - has any form of obligation to tell anything. In terms of her own safety it might be a very sensible thing to do on some occasions. For her own sake and safety. In regards to a longer and more ongoing relationship it would be a fair and sensible thing to do. But an obligation? No. Each of us has to resolve these issues and be fair to others and to ourselves. If you're getting into a serous relationship then honesty should be part of the equation. If a post-op girl and a man are planning to be life partners she would surely want to let him know (over the child issue for instance) But that again is for the couple to work out.

But saying people are obliged to be honest and open is unrealistic. The world isn't really like that much as we'd perhaps love it to be otherwise.

[amberskyi]

It's not weak ass at all, otherwise you wouldn't invest so much in replying to it.

something to do between clients and job applications

[jennylicious]

But saying people are obliged to be honest and open is unrealistic. The world isn't really like that much as we'd perhaps love it to be otherwise.

My thoughts exactly. There are lots of sane and rational reasons why someone might tell a potential partner, but there really is no 'obligation' (unless I don't understand the word properly).

[natina]

if you do not tell a guy you are a tranny

HE KILLS YOU!


now what?

it has happen many times before

some get lucky and just get injured

some guy do not want people playing with there sexuality

MOST MEN CONSIDER MOST TRANSEXXUALS "GAY MEN"

http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=69730
http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=69730
http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=69730
http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=69730

Gay man has a cruch on you,publically tells you & you kill him
Jonathan Schmitz
When/where: 1996, Lake Orion, Mich. (http://www.bing.com/maps/default.aspx?q=Lake+Orion%2c+Mich.+++&mkt=en&FORM=msnhal)

The charges: Schmitz was charged with first-degree murder and assault with a firearm after killing Scott Amedure (http://www.bing.com/search?q=Scott+Amedure&go=&qs=n&form=msnhal). Amedure revealed his crush for Schmitz on a taping for this The Jenny Jones Show.

His insanity defense: Schmitz had a history of mental illness, and defense attorneys tried to use gay panic defense considering the nature of the case.

jonathan schmitz guilty of second-degree murder


The gay panic defense[1] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gay_panic_defense#cite_note-0) is a legal defense against charges of

defendant using the gay panic defense claims that he or she acted in a state of violent


http://specials.msn.com/a-list/lifestyle/famous-insanity-cases-slideshow-ss?imageindex=11&cp-searchtext=Jonathan%20Schmitz

[SurfSandSun]

Does a TS have an obligation to tell a potential partner her TS status? I had this discussion with a TS and she said she would but felt no obligation to, which I felt was a bit of a contradiction. I said yes.

So what say you?

Firstly, I feel it's worth note that you choose the wording "potential" partner.

For me, a potential PARTNER means a person that would be deemed potential date. It doesn't have to mean anything serious, as all relationships begin differently and become defined differently in their height.. I think it's worth separating what could be a purely physical one time thing versus getting to know a person and saying you want them around often. Eventually you have to ask yourself, can you really claim to KNOW someone and be connected to them if you weren't aware of such a thing? In this way I think a transexual would have no obligation besides coming to terms with what they feel best reflects how they feel for and respect the person they are with.

[Rusty Eldora]

I would only if the said provider would use the "but u r married and cheat with us (=TS prostitutes) behind ur back" line in order to indeed gain "morality" points. You can read that kind of "counter-argument" on these pages repeatedly.

If a provider announces to the world that she only sees single guys not in a relationship her phone would stop ringing.

I have seen postings that GG escort clients are better than 70% married and the other 30% lied.

Of course some escorts could:
- require pictures confirming the following
- be an attractive male with riveting personality
- be a real hunk without any extra weight
- have a wallet stuffed with cash
- dress for success
- be single without any girlfriends
- be ready to provide her a credit card for minor expenses
- pay $ 1,000 /hr for overnight appointments.

I am sure it happens all the time.

[Quiet Reflections]

Does a TS have an obligation to tell a potential partner her TS status? I had this discussion with a TS and she said she would but felt no obligation to, which I felt was a bit of a contradiction. I said yes.

So what say you?
yup.