We're Not Gay And We're Not Straight

[nysprod]

Are guys like us who are into TGirls totally straight? I say no. We are turned on by male genitalia after all (even though it's "attached" to a feminine form). Let's be real about that.

Are we gay? Again, I say no. Gay means you are sexually attracted to the male persona.

Bisexual? Not in the generally accepted meaning.

And what about those of us who are exclusively into TGirls, or those of us into GG's and TG's?

So what are we? There really isn't a word or terminology for us...not that I really care one way or the other what someone wants to label me, but I'm just saying we're in some sort of in between thing that isn't easily categorized.

Either way, I accept myself for who I am.

[tsadriana]

We are human thats what we are,not matter what we are as long as is pleasureble for the both sides.x

[f-finger]

From the moment you are in this "scene" , wether u be a tranny or a dude, the "straight" vs "gay" dogma is of no use any more.

[Ms.Stepford]

The sexual identity crises of the cisgender male when it comes to trans women are hilarious to me. You poor dears -having to figure out who you are.

[Bobzz]

The sexual identity crises of the cisgender male when it comes to trans women are hilarious to me. You poor dears -having to figure out who you are.

No ego problems on your side of the fence I see. Plenty judgmental tho.

[amberskyi]

I'm a woman point blank period and the men i deal worth are straight regardless of what we do sexually.stop over analyzing everything and go find something to do

[Ms.Stepford]

Definitely no ego problems. I don't see where I'm judgmental either.

Seriously though, the struggle for straight dudes to feel straight is funny to me because I've been a weirdo queer since as far as I can remember, and fuck I'm just glad that I can pass the process of coming to terms with oneself on, so you can find out that...surprise, you're just run-of-the-mill horny dudes who just want to get their dicks wet, and probably don't have the guts to be queer anyway.

[nysprod]

The sexual identity crises of the cisgender male when it comes to trans women are hilarious to me. You poor dears -having to figure out who you are.

Lol...condescend to me, it turns me on...BTW, nice pose, love to pound you some time...

[GroobySteven]

Do we really have to have this one again?

a) who cares.
b) you're whatever you want to be, when you want to be it.

[dderek123]

^ FYI its not much fun figuring it all out in your own head. At one point, I was really depressed and almost flunked out during my last year of uni. I went to see a therapist and he told me that I have become to masculine features so that I wasn't necessarily gay. Then he proceeded to explain that I could "un-gay" myself by focusing on my attraction to feminine women. I thought it was one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard because I love TS and I am hugely attracted to them and I didn't want to change that. I never went back, I regret nothing.

[nysprod]

I'm a woman point blank period and the men i deal worth are straight regardless of what we do sexually.stop over analyzing everything and go find something to do

See, I knew one of you were going to take it that way...and don't bust on those of us who wish to over-analyze...inquiring minds want to know...lol.

[shermanwt]

I don't usually feel the need to get into this type of debate simply because there is no 'right' or 'wrong' answer. We all are who we are--plain and simple. Notwithstanding that, though, I had a revelation of sorts a week or so ago while logging on here and seeing a picture of Buck something or other--the transman. He's a woman transitioning to a man and by all accounts looks like a man with a cunt. At seeing his picture, I shivered simply because I am not attracted to masculinity. Now, even though he's genetically a woman, there is not a damn thing feminine about him, save the hole between his legs. Then I thought, shit, if wanting to fuck a m to f transitioning person makes me gay because they are genetic men making the switch to femininity vs. wanting to fuck Buck, who is a genetic woman, it's no debate, I'd grease up some fine tranny ass and get to pounding. The irony is that I'm sure most guys who spit on the ground at the mention of banging a m to f transsexual would jump at them with their dick out if pressed to choose between them or a f to m transsexual.

[Ms.Stepford]

^ FYI its not much fun figuring it all out in your own head. At one point, I was really depressed and almost flunked out during my last year of uni. I went to see a therapist and he told me that I have become to masculine features so that I wasn't necessarily gay. Then he proceeded to explain that I could "un-gay" myself by focusing on my attraction to feminine women. I thought it was one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard because I love TS and I am hugely attracted to them and I didn't want to change that. I never went back, I regret nothing.

Yeah, I gotcha. But none of it is as heavy to figure out in your head than that you're trans when you're four.

Congrats on knowing what you want and getting it! :)

[amberskyi]

See, I knew one of you were going to take it that way...and don't bust on those of us who wish to over-analyze...inquiring minds want to know...lol.

Take it in what way, I'm just being captain obvious

[nysprod]

Do we really have to have this one again?

a) who cares.
b) you're whatever you want to be, when you want to be it.

It's a new one for me...it's catharsis...

[Bobzz]

Definitely no ego problems. I don't see where I'm judgmental either.

Seriously though, the struggle for straight dudes to feel straight is funny to me because I've been a weirdo queer since as far as I can remember, and fuck I'm just glad that I can pass the process of coming to terms with oneself on.

I get your sentiment, but not everyone evolves at the same rate, if you get my drift. Some folks suddenly find themselves neck deep in it and wonder how they got there instead of simply appreciating the fact that their horizons have become expanded (perhaps certain body parts too). :D

[Ms.Stepford]

Lol...condescend to me, it turns me on...BTW, nice pose, love to pound you some time...

Anytime!

So what's not straight about how you see the curve of my waist to my ass and want to fuck me?

[bluesoul]

Are we gay? Again, I say no. Gay means you are sexually attracted to the male persona.

i don't think gay means you are interested in male persona. there are actually many types of gay identities such as bears, twinks, effeminate/flamboyant or gay guys that look/act straight (i.e. you'd never know).

being gay means you're attracted to someone with the same sex or gender as yourself.

so as an example: if you know a butch lesbian who falls in love with a guy who in fact turns out to be a girl (but has been living as a male)- they're both gay.

[brooke3]

Many of you will find this video informative if you can sit still for 18 minutes.

Google, I O Tillet Wright: Fifty shades of gay.

[Ms.Stepford]

I get your sentiment, but not everyone evolves at the same rate, if you get my drift. Some folks suddenly find themselves neck deep in it and wonder how they got there instead of simply appreciating the fact that their horizons have become expanded (perhaps certain body parts too). :D

Those who haven't evolved to keep up with me are what I eat :D

[Tim&Erin]

The way I look at it is I gave up trying to figure it out because it really didn't matter. Those are labels. As far as I am concerned if you are with someone and you are happy then the rest doesn't matter. My gf and I have discussed this and we finally said f*** it and live our lives the way we want to without trying to figure out what I am. Her transition journey would be a much heavier trip than anything I could come up with. Just my thoughts.

[nysprod]

Anytime!

So what's not straight about how you see the curve of my waist to my ass and want to fuck me?

Nothing...but I would want to give you head first...

[bluesoul]

The way I look at it is I gave up trying to figure it out because it really didn't matter. Those are labels. As far as I am concerned if you are with someone and you are happy then the rest doesn't matter. My gf and I have discussed this and we finally said f*** it and live our lives the way we want to without trying to figure out what I am. Her transition journey would be a much heavier trip than anything I could come up with. Just my thoughts.

i think that's a great way to live, but i'm just curious: what do you write when you get forums that request your orientation? do you just write "i don't care what i am" or something like that?

[amberskyi]

So if a woman has an enlarged clitoris (like 2 to 3 inches) is going down on her gay?
If you have vaginal sex with a trans man is that heterosexual?
If your gg partner fucks you with a strap on what's that?
Or if your gg girlfriend is intersexed with a vaginia but has testicles internally?
You see how stupid shit like this is smh

[Ms.Stepford]

Nothing...but I would want to give you head first...

Nothing wrong with a gentleman making a lady happy ;)

[Tim&Erin]

Actually never had that happen. This is the only one I am on. Good question though. If they had a box for whatever I would hit that one. Lol

[nysprod]

i don't think gay means you are interested in male persona. there are actually many types of gay identities such as bears, twinks, effeminate/flamboyant or gay guys that look/act straight (i.e. you'd never know).

Yes, but they all personify as male.


being gay means you're attracted to someone with the same sex or gender as yourself.

Exactly my point...TGirls are not the same sex or gender as me (us). I (we) are unquestionably male.

[tsadriana]

We are unisex:banana:

[nysprod]

Nothing wrong with a gentleman making a lady happy ;)

Oh, don't get me wrong...I'm quite happy with myself and where I am...

[ed_jaxon]

Asked of me "Ed are ya gay?"

Me: "If you knew everything I have done you would run screaming....I am a damned sight beyond gay"

I ain't gay but I sure as hell ain't straight!

[Ms.Stepford]

Ed knows how to party!

[bluesoul]

So if a woman has an enlarged clitoris (like 2 to 3 inches) is going down on her gay?
If you have vaginal sex with a trans man is that heterosexual?
If your gg partner fucks you with a strap on what's that?
Or if your gg girlfriend is intersexed with a vaginia but has testicles internally?
You see how stupid shit like this is smh

id' say the woman with the enlarged clitoris probably someone with an engorged clit (perhaps a hereditary condition or just an embarrassing mutation of that piece of genitalia) so going down on her makes one straight (unless they're female).

i'd say having sex with a transman (if you're a male) is a hetrosexual act because this is a masculine woman. there are actually some women who look like transmen but aren't- they're just extremely masculine in appearance and (in some cases) not lesbians.

if you're girlfriend fucks you with a strap-on i'd say you're bissexual because you're replicating a homosexual act with a heterosexual partner.

if you're girlfriend is inter-sexed i'd say you're bissexual because even they have both sexes

that "shit" wasn't "stupid" at all. the thing that makes it complex is when people bring their feels/wishes/personal opinions into play- but by definition, it's smart as paint.

think of it like this: imagine if 10,000 years from now someone were to excavate a burial site and discover some buried bones in a casket. they remove the bones and just by performing carbon dating, they find that both those individuals were female. they may have lived as man and wife, or wife and wife or just lovers (you'd never know unless some record remains), but just by the bones, you'd know they were female.

a modern example would be pharaoh hatshepsut of egypt. she lived as a male pharoah despite being born female. do we acknowledge her as a male? nope.

[bluesoul]

Yes, but they all personify as male.

really? isn't this a generalization? if you want, i can screencap for you what a particular gay male said on another forum that will contradict your statement.


Exactly my point...TGirls are not the same sex or gender as me (us). I (we) are unquestionably male.

what are you going by to come to this conclusion?

let me ask you a hypothetical question: if someone were in need of medical help and the paramedics asked "please tell me the gender of this person" and you knew they were female to male transsexual- what would be your answer?

[dderek123]

Yeah, I gotcha. But none of it is as heavy to figure out in your head than that you're trans when you're four.

Congrats on knowing what you want and getting it! :)

Yeah the two paths in life can't be compared but life is short. You gotta get it right the first time around. :salad

[Ms.Stepford]

In an FtM trans man, their gender is male.

Their sex is, until we fix the broken way we talk about things, female.

Realize, this is just the way we've been taught to talk about it, by thousands of years of cissexist thought.

[tluva]

Seems this topic picked up it's own thread. Here's my 2 cents:

I don't think we need a third category here. There's straight and gay. Homosexuality by definition means attracted to the same sex.

I'm not. I'm attracted to women. Transexuals look, act, and smell like women. The fact that they have a penis is just a kinky taboo irony. I look at my cock all the time, and cock is all over porn, so it's not like I'm offended by cock. When I take in the whole sight of a transexual girl, the entire form is still very much feminine and that's what I'm attracted to.

As for being a bottom, that too is not necessarily gay in my mind.

A) Anal stimulation feels good, and it's a known fact that many straight couples practice it (on the guy)
B) I'm in touch with my feminine side (which we all have). Not so much that I'm going around all flamboyant like a stereotypical gay dude, but I do envy the pussy power, and how sexy women are, and sometimes I want to be worshiped like that too.

But at the end of the day, I'd man up and do whatever a typical straight guy does. I see myself wanting a wife, and kids, and a normal straight life and being very content with that.

Most GG girls I've dated are snobby little princesses. Not that TS girls are much better, but I hoped that since we have something more in common <cough> that it would be easier to get along with them.

Generally speaking that's been true. On this forum, not so much.

[Jericho]

So what are we? There really isn't a word or terminology for us...not that I really care one way or the other what someone wants to label me, but I'm just saying we're in some sort of in between thing that isn't easily categorized.


Headfucked!
Once you accept that, ... :shrug

[Ms.Stepford]

Most GG girls I've dated are snobby little princesses. Not that TS girls are much better, but I hoped that since we have something more in common <cough> that it would be easier to get along with them.

Generally speaking that's been true. On this forum, not so much.

That's a really stupid hope, founded in fallacy.

My cock doesn't have any bearing on how I relate to people.

[dderek123]

Headfucked!


In more ways than one!

[Jericho]

In more ways than one!

On a good day!

[dderek123]

Not that TS girls are much better, but I hoped that since we have something more in common <cough> .

Yeah like a big ole cock up the ass!

[tluva]

That's a really stupid hope, founded in fallacy.

My cock doesn't have any bearing on how I relate to people.

Sure, it's stupid to think that just because we have the same chromosomes, similar ratios of hormones (pre-modification), and the same sexual organs that we'd somehow be able to relate to one another's wiring, urges, etc.

Hun, no offense, but this constant calling me (or anyone for that matter) stupid as a general course of communicating is so unrefined. Try to acquire a little bit of tact. I can't imagine your bitchy attitude helps you advance your goals in life.

[Stavros]

It is a pity that the word 'homosexual' has been used to categorise men who not only have sexual intercourse with other men but more importantly love them -the relationship between two men that is equivalent to the relationship between a man and a woman goes beyond sex. A gay man doesn't just want sex with other men, he may also seek love and partnership (given that some people regardless of their sexuality do not want a family or relationships) -but to be gay must mean falling in love with a man, wanting to send him chocolates, flowers and poems, to walk beneath the moon hand in hand, and so on. Sucking a man's cock and/or fucking his ass is no more gay on Hungangels than it has been on ships in the middle of the ocean, during the trenches in World War 1, or in prison. I don't dream about men, I don't get hard when I see men, I don't have fantasies about male movie stars...etc...etc...in my experience most men who are attracted to transexuals are also attracted to women, and may even be married or in a relationship. At some point the language we use doesn't fit, and as most people here put it, it doesn't matter anyway.

[nysprod]

really? isn't this a generalization? if you want, i can screencap for you what a particular gay male said on another forum that will contradict your statement.

Except for a fem guy crossdressing, they will personify as male, or what society generally accepts to be male.




what are you going by to come to this conclusion?

Ok, perhaps overstated, I obviously haven't met everyone on the forum...but as far as I go...

[goku79]

It's all not that important for me...
Especially when i think about that the labels hetorosexual, bisexual, gay are labels given by a cocaine addict who lived in the 19th century named sigmund freud who also said whe all want to kill our father to fuck our mother...???!!!
The world just isnt what whe learned at school or what our parents told us.
Besides, every man likes tgirls, just not every man wants to fuck ass...
Why live by other peoples tastes?

[nysprod]

Off topic, but I've got a large position on long USD/JPY from 93 yen/dollar...I'm with George Soros (http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-04-05/soros-joins-gross-in-warning-kuroda-plan-risks-yen-rout.html) on the possible collapse of the yen...

[amberskyi]

Sure, it's stupid to think that just because we have the same chromosomes, similar ratios of hormones (pre-modification), and the same sexual organs that we'd somehow be able to relate to one another's wiring, urges, etc.

Hun, no offense, but this constant calling me (or anyone for that matter) stupid as a general course of communicating is so unrefined. Try to acquire a little bit of tact. I can't imagine your bitchy attitude helps you advance your goals in life.

Actually there's studies that are exploring the possibility that transsexuals have different brains at birth and possibly even natural hormone imbalances.if we spent our while lives feelings like woman how the hell could we relate to you and what it means to be a man.you need to get a better understanding about what transsexualism is.it's not a feeling that just appeared within us from no where but something we've dealt with since birth.
Stop trying to tell the girls that they're men.i can't wait for seanchi to ban you

[barney fife]

if you like chicks with dicks then you like chicks with dicks who cares?

[bluesoul]

Ok, perhaps overstated, I obviously haven't met everyone on the forum...but as far as I go...

how about the people who are not on the forum?

[girl]

Being gay or being straight is completely irrelevant. Being LOVED is the only thing that really matters..

[littletwink]

Stray.

(although myself I'm quite content being considered gay, straight, bi, or QUEER)

[Dino Velvet]

Label me as HORNY!!!!:fuckin:

[up_for_it]

Guys like us just aren't worried about it.

[Ms.Stepford]

Sure, it's stupid to think that just because we have the same chromosomes, similar ratios of hormones (pre-modification), and the same sexual organs that we'd somehow be able to relate to one another's wiring, urges, etc.

Hun, no offense, but this constant calling me (or anyone for that matter) stupid as a general course of communicating is so unrefined. Try to acquire a little bit of tact. I can't imagine your bitchy attitude helps you advance your goals in life.

The only people who seem to call me a bitch are morons who don't like being called out as such. To everyone else I appear in my natural form as a positive, sunshiny and fuckable young woman, and my goals in life are moving along wonderfully, thank you very much!

[EvonRose]

Transexuals are the universal gender...

Gay men can be attracted to as as well as straight men...

Gay women can be attracted to us as well as straight women...

Even other transsexuals can like other trans...

I think this is all how you view a ts and what your reasons for being with a ts is....

[gurkhabeast]

Are guys like us who are into TGirls totally straight? I say no. We are turned on by male genitalia after all (even though it's "attached" to a feminine form). Let's be real about that.

Are we gay? Again, I say no. Gay means you are sexually attracted to the male persona.

Bisexual? Not in the generally accepted meaning.

And what about those of us who are exclusively into TGirls, or those of us into GG's and TG's?

So what are we? There really isn't a word or terminology for us...not that I really care one way or the other what someone wants to label me, but I'm just saying we're in some sort of in between thing that isn't easily categorized.

Either way, I accept myself for who I am.

a tgurl friend who loved going out to S.D. 's gaslamp area to pick young white navy/marine kids but wouldn't tell hem she is a tgurl. that's what she liked str8 unknowing guys. of course we've had sex more than one occassion. and me knowing this about her i asked her how she viewed me as gay or str8. knowing that i loved tgurls & of course sucked lady cock, she gave me the best answer ever. she said, "you're not gay at all, you're open minded". hope this helps

[stan.smith]

a tgurl friend who loved going out to S.D. 's gaslamp area to pick young white navy/marine kids but wouldn't tell hem she is a tgurl. that's what she liked str8 unknowing guys. of course we've had sex more than one occassion. and me knowing this about her i asked her how she viewed me as gay or str8. knowing that i loved tgurls & of course sucked lady cock, she gave me the best answer ever. she said, "you're not gay at all, you're open minded". hope this helps

Sounds like tyra scott! she has a thing for men in uniform

[stan.smith]

Transexuals are the universal gender...

Gay men can be attracted to as as well as straight men...

Gay women can be attracted to us as well as straight women...

Even other transsexuals can like other trans...

I think this is all how you view a ts and what your reasons for being with a ts is....

this totally makes sense!

[sosed]

In my opinion more strait. Gay male is attracted to another male. It's not about cock, but about person, who relate to himself and outside as male. All other is just a taste as straigth males like different girls, like someone like blonds, someone brunettes, someone skinny, etc.

Tgirls have female brains and they relate to themselves and outside as females and with that not much attractive for gays although they have cocks. On the other hand FtM man is not attractive for straight males although he have a pussy and was born girl.

Anyway, Tgirl is not just a genital, but a whole person and human being. What matter is, that we love and accept her as equal human being.

[iagodelgado]

Gay men can be attracted to us as well as straight men...

Recently I got SLAUGHTERED for suggesting that some gay men were attracted to TSwomen.

How do you get away with the same?

OK. OK. I am merely male.

[maxpower]

This topic again?

[gurkhabeast]

The only people who seem to call me a bitch are morons who don't like being called out as such. To everyone else I appear in my natural form as a positive, sunshiny and fuckable young woman, and my goals in life are moving along wonderfully, thank you very much!

first impressions go a long way. you may be postive ray of sunshine n gum drops, but your comments on this forum/threads betray you for your view of life. it's negative n ugly. calling admires of yourself or any transgender by slurs of queer, gay, fags is insulting due to the negative image it portraits in our society. this is not the first posts i've of your's, and on most are full micro aggressive behavior and you always seems your putting someone down n exalting yourself. i'm glad ur life is moving along wonderfully, but the word of master jedi yoda, "....... Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate; hate leads to suffering. I sense much fear in you."

[EvonRose]

Recently I got SLAUGHTERED for suggesting that some gay men were attracted to TSwomen.

How do you get away with the same?

OK. OK. I am merely male.

Some gay men do like ts...

[EvonRose]

In my opinion more strait. Gay male is attracted to another male. It's not about cock, but about person, who relate to himself and outside as male. All other is just a taste as straigth males like different girls, like someone like blonds, someone brunettes, someone skinny, etc.

Tgirls have female brains and they relate to themselves and outside as females and with that not much attractive for gays although they have cocks. On the other hand FtM man is not attractive for straight males although he have a pussy and was born girl.

Anyway, Tgirl is not just a genital, but a whole person and human being. What matter is, that we love and accept her as equal human being.

There are some people who are fascinated with genitalia... Regardless of it being man or woman...

not everyone thinks the same of course, but the reason ts have the extra hype and one of the biggest porn fetish on earth is because of the fascination of the genitalia...

I wish it almost wasn't but that is the fact, and maybe your lucky to find a guy who would be into you as a person, but in general men are visual beings, they like what is in their head and go after it whatever that "thing" is.

[EvonRose]

Some gay men do like ts...

2 gay couple asked me to have a threesome with them a few months ago...

[iagodelgado]

Some gay men do like ts...

True. But I got HAMMERED for saying that "SOME gay men do like TS".

True. SOME!

You get away with saying it with no problema!

[EvonRose]

True. But I got HAMMERED for saying that "SOME gay men do like TS".

True. SOME!

You get away with saying it with no problema!

Because I have personal experience to back my theory up...

And because I am Evon Rose.. duh!!!

[ed_jaxon]

Gay men do not like trans girls.

Gay men do like Evon.

You are not exactly your typical trans individual Evon.

[EvonRose]

Gay men do not like trans girls.

Gay men do like Evon.

You are not exactly your typical trans individual Evon.

well not all gay men, I'm saying the possibility of a gay man into ts is not impossible...

I am your typical normal trans girl from san francisco... lol..

[iagodelgado]

Because I have personal experience to back my theory up...

And because I am Evon Rose.. duh!!!

Nice talking to you. My side of the Atlantic and for peeps, it is tomorrow. Time to sleep!

[sosed]

There are some people who are fascinated with genitalia... Regardless of it being man or woman...

not everyone thinks the same of course, but the reason ts have the extra hype and one of the biggest porn fetish on earth is because of the fascination of the genitalia...

I wish it almost wasn't but that is the fact, and maybe your lucky to find a guy who would be into you as a person, but in general men are visual beings, they like what is in their head and go after it whatever that "thing" is.

You are correct, when only sex is in mind, like in porn or prostitution. Then only visualization and fetish is in question, what depend on sexual taste of someone.
In relation between two people, it's not only about genitals and sex, but about two persons as a whole, that relationship could work or not.

[ed_jaxon]

I have been to San Francisco several times and you are not typical.

[EvonRose]

You are correct, when only sex is in mind, like in porn or prostitution. Then only visualization and fetish is in question, what depend on sexual taste of someone.
In relation between two people, it's not only about genitals and sex, but about two persons as a whole, that relationship could work or not.

Sex is part of relationship if your not compatible then it a huge problem.

I dont like to base relationship only in sex but it is a factor as with anything else... if you want chocolate then your going to get it and look of it, because you don't want vanilla... thats the best analogy i can make.. lol

[EvonRose]

I have been to San Francisco several times and you are not typical.

Omg San francisco is awesome, can't wait to hang with you again.

[ed_jaxon]

I might be back before I go to Burning Man in September, if I can scrounge up a ticket. If you pass through Chicago let's hang out. It's been a minute since we got the crew together.

[JudgeSchmales]

Ive never actually slept with a TS but as far as the porn goes id say its an attraction to hot feminity and cock. It is visual because lets face it, straight porn is just as much about the dick and cumshot as it is the hot slutty girl.


You cant label someones sexuality. Its not really black and white like that.

[EvonRose]

I might be back before I go to Burning Man in September, if I can scrounge up a ticket. If you pass through Chicago let's hang out. It's been a minute since we got the crew together.

yeah ill let you know...

[Miss Sex Appeal]

'Tranny-chaser' is the EXACT terminology we use for you and no need to search more and it's an particular/exclusive sexual-orientation in itself just like pediphile who is attracted only by children, zoolophile only by animals etc...

[Ms.Stepford]

first impressions go a long way. you may be postive ray of sunshine n gum drops, but your comments on this forum/threads betray you for your view of life. it's negative n ugly. calling admires of yourself or any transgender by slurs of queer, gay, fags is insulting due to the negative image it portraits in our society. this is not the first posts i've of your's, and on most are full micro aggressive behavior and you always seems your putting someone down n exalting yourself. i'm glad ur life is moving along wonderfully, but the word of master jedi yoda, "....... Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate; hate leads to suffering. I sense much fear in you."

Yeah, I never did any of those things you said, and my input on this board is very much appreciated. I think you have me confused for someone else. "Always putting someone down n exalting" myself is pretty much the least fitting way to describe me if you've read my posts. I really don't know what you're talking about.

[nysprod]

Yeah, I never did any of those things you said, and my input on this board is very much appreciated. I think you have me confused for someone else. "Always putting someone down n exalting" myself is pretty much the least fitting way to describe me if you've read my posts. I really don't know what you're talking about.

Please let me suck your cock...you can call be fag all you want, I love it, grab my hair and make me lick your balls and ass too...after that I'll pound you, and I'll smack your ass and call you a slut...

Bitch, queer, smack, fuck, slut, fag, smack...fuck more you little bitch, look how you love my cock in your ass...

[Ms.Stepford]

I...I...like those things!

[nysprod]

I...I...like those things!

Of course you do, baby...and I'm a fag and a chaZer...isn't it great??

[Ms.Stepford]

Whatever you want to call yourself! :D

[nysprod]

Whatever you want to call yourself! :D

Anything to make sex hotter...

[gaysian71]

I say gay, but who really gives two fucks about it.

[transman]

I have had sex with women, men and transgender .... trisexual perhaps? I definately prefer Transgender and dont particularly enjoy sex with men!

[dderek123]

Some of these threads on here are getting repetitive.

http://i.imgur.com/IpWMTUl.gif

[robertlouis]

Some of these threads on here are getting repetitive.

http://i.imgur.com/IpWMTUl.gif


More than that. Downright fucking boring. Can we declare a lifetime moratorium on any thread which focuses on the old "Am I Gay?" trope and shoot any poster who diverts another thread in that direction?

PLEASE?????

[Willie Escalade]

We're "Gaight" or "Stray".

[dderek123]

^ Hahaha I prefer "stray". "Gaight" still seems a little bit too gay for me.

[youngblood61]

Why does everything have to have a label? Why can't we just like Tgirls and leave it at that?:)

[nysprod]

Some of these threads on here are getting repetitive.



Well, you know how it is, you're never going to live up to anyone's expectations, so you might as well live up to your own...

Fuckin' annoying bullshit signatures...

[dderek123]

Well, you know how it is, you're never going to live up to anyone's expectations, so you might as well live up to your own...

Fuckin' annoying bullshit signatures...

http://www.esquire.com/cm/esquire/images/BI/crying-baby-0509-lg.jpg

[nysprod]

Why am I such an asshole?

IDK, but Canadian TGirls are all pasty looking...lol

[dderek123]

IDK, but Canadian TGirls are all pasty looking...lol

http://www.thebestdamnpoll.com/Portals/4/images/ForumImages/he%20mad.jpg

[nysprod]

I can't help it if I'm a dick

I guess not...

[Rusty Eldora]

Why does everything have to have a label? Why can't we just like Tgirls and leave it at that?:)

I LOVE to love Tgirls and I am OK with that.

[dderek123]

I guess not...

http://i.imgur.com/kOowASi.gif

[STARTUP999]

Why does everything have to have a label? Why can't we just like Tgirls and leave it at that?:)

EXACTLY! Your attracted to who you are attracted to.
Just enjoy being with that person and don't concern yourself with what label it gives you.
Then if your really fortunate you will find someone to love then love them and don't worry about, "if I bottom am I this or if they have implants are they that."
Who cares, just share yourself with that person and be grateful.

[Ms.Stepford]

Every time I've seen this thread title in the last hour or so I hear that "I'm not sick, but I'm not well" song that was the theme to Peep Show in my head. except with the words substituted.

[Saint_Frankenstein]

It's pretty straight-forward to me. If the transgender person you're attracted to, as a male, identifies as a woman, then it's heterosexual. Sexual orientation, in terms of attraction, is defined relative to gender identity. So if you like trans women, you're either a straight or bisexual guy or a lesbian or bisexual woman. If you like trans men, you're either a straight or bisexual woman or a gay or bisexual man. (Although there are some lesbians who date trans men, but that's an interesting topic all its own.)

So if you're involved with a transsexual woman - who is a woman, by the way - and you are questioning if you're gay or bi, that has more to do with you than with her.

[Prospero]

Why are people so obsessed with labels!!!

[Saint_Frankenstein]

Why are people so obsessed with labels!!!

Because they're what we have to identify ourselves to others, and ourselves. :(

[Prospero]

What I was getting at is the eternal debate among the guys over straight v gay as if it really matters. Of course for the transgendered it matters a lot. Asserting their rightful identity as women or I think in your case Frankenstein as a transmale? So many guys are so hung up unnecessarily

[Saint_Frankenstein]

What I was getting at is the eternal debate among the guys over straight v gay as if it really matters. Of course for the transgendered it matters a lot. Asserting their rightful identity as women or I think in your case Frankenstein as a transmale? So many guys are so hung up unnecessarily

I see your point. I feel rather bad for hetero cis men. Their sexuality is so policed by society. They have so many social restrictions on what they can do without going outside of the boundaries of the heterosexual male construct. They tend to be so fearful over it and it can lead to violence, sadly. As a queer trans guy, I feel much more free in that respect. Of course that feeling of personal freedom comes at a price of being a marginalized minority.

[nysprod]

Why are people so obsessed with labels!!!

Obsession is never a good thing but realistically, in our society, labels are inevitable...people need to identify and define who they are, and labels make socialization simpler, e.g. a photography buff can easily find like minded people in the "N.Y. Photo Club."

Catholics, Jews, ballers, bikers, movie buffs, whatever, we're all something.

[TSMichelleAustin]

Ur not gay and ur not straight..... Ur Graight! Lol

Like seanchi said, who cares! Fuck labels!!!

[BrendaQG]

So far as I am concerned the partner of a transexual or transgender woman is whatever they consider themselves to be. The partners of ts women always think say they are straight or bi, just like the partners of genetic female women.

These categories aren't really that useful when talking about transsexuals. Simply consider the case of a couple where a TS woman and a TS man are the pair. Is that gay, lesbian, straight, or bi?

If a man accepts that at least psychologically, and socially TS women are women.
If a man is attracted to the feminine physical and psychological qualities of TS women.
Then that man is straight.


PS. Considering that all TS and TG people have been some kind of queer all our lives it's a bit insulting that our non TS or TG partners fret so much over weather they are going to be thought of as gay by someone or the other. (Or if you are TS or TG but still into the opposite biological sex. Having a gay or lesbian partner worry that being with you is too straight for them. It happens )

[SunshyneMonroe]

we are all gay move on :)

[nysprod]

Ur not gay and ur not straight..... Ur Graight! Lol

Like seanchi said, who cares! Fuck labels!!!

This was also about what I said in the first post:

"Are guys like us who are into TGirls totally straight? I say no. We are turned on by male genitalia after all (even though it's "attached" to a feminine form). Let's be real about that."

I read a lot when I first joined about how guys (like me) into TGirls saw themselves as "straight"...I didn't agree with it but I was new and didn't want to come off like a know-it-all or worse, a troll. But I knew at some point I wanted to talk about it because I'm in this.

So now I've been here for a while, I've read a lot, posted, participated etc, and I figured since people were somewhat familiar with me it would be OK to talk about it in a way that was open and non-judgmental. I think I accomplished this because I didn't see one post where the person was offended by my saying that guys into TGirls are not totally straight.

I'm into TGirls...I don't believe I'm totally straight anymore...I just want to be real about it...saying it anonymously on a forum isn't much, I guess, but it's a start.

[Ms.Stepford]

I"ll just say it again...if you don't consider yourself straight for being into me, it means that you consider me a man. If I hear the slightest indication that you consider me a man, I wouldn't even get with you for money.

[f-finger]

we are all gay move on :)

I'd thorougly ransack your butt all day.


yes, I am the romantic type :dancing:

[EvonRose]

I'm gay, and live my way!

I'm gay, born this way!

I am gay, nothing to say!

I am gay, being gray!

not black nor white

Like a free bird I fly away!

no wrong or right

I will not be swept away!

My birth right!

Society's norm I will not abide

I don't feel bad

only freedom on my side

together lets be glad!

- Evon Rose....

[Fancy fancy]

EvonRose
Keeps us on our Toes

:salad:salad:salad:salad:salad:salad:salad:salad:s alad:salad:salad:salad:salad:salad:salad:salad:sal ad:salad:salad:salad:salad:salad:salad:salad:salad :salad

[amberskyi]

This was also about what I said in the first post:

"Are guys like us who are into TGirls totally straight? I say no. We are turned on by male genitalia after all (even though it's "attached" to a feminine form). Let's be real about that."

I read a lot when I first joined about how guys (like me) into TGirls saw themselves as "straight"...I didn't agree with it but I was new and didn't want to come off like a know-it-all or worse, a troll. But I knew at some point I wanted to talk about it because I'm in this.

So now I've been here for a while, I've read a lot, posted, participated etc, and I figured since people were somewhat familiar with me it would be OK to talk about it in a way that was open and non-judgmental. I think I accomplished this because I didn't see one post where the person was offended by my saying that guys into TGirls are not totally straight.

I'm into TGirls...I don't believe I'm totally straight anymore...I just want to be real about it...saying it anonymously on a forum isn't much, I guess, but it's a start.

I'm kinda offended i just see the point of having the same redundant conversations over and over again.I've been on here for three years and these threads get beyond old.

[Rusty Eldora]

Are we trying to put a 2D concept into a 1D line. As in politics:
http://freedomkeys.com/boazchart.jpg a single Left Wing - Right Wing doesn't work well. As we are talking here of a Straight - Gay line.

On politics, I see myself as an 80-80 on the chart and I think the transgender community thrives best up in that corner too. (including the admirers)

Problems with just a line -
I am straight male, no attraction to porn or cock, married to straight woman with 2.5 kids - Straight and fits.
I am a straight male but I am in a relationship with a woman that is bi - where does that fit - it doesn't
I am a gay guy doing only hunky studs - very gay and fits.
I am a lesbian that only wants lezzy women and hates guys - gay and fits.
I am bi but my woman is (straight - bi - lezzy) where does that fit.
I am attracted to CD's (either FtM or MtF) - where does that fit.
I am a transgender and I am attracted to (insert anything) - where does it fit.
I am attracted to transgender - where does that fit.

I am not sure where I am but I really enjoy the company of fem tgirls and am happy about it.


I agree this topic is beating a dead horse.

BTW Thank you Amber, EvonRose, and MsStepford for your insight. And yes I would love to be in bed with any or all of you

[my my my!]

It's pretty straight-forward to me. If the transgender person you're attracted to, as a male, identifies as a woman, then it's heterosexual. Sexual orientation, in terms of attraction, is defined relative to gender identity. So if you like trans women, you're either a straight or bisexual guy or a lesbian or bisexual woman. If you like trans men, you're either a straight or bisexual woman or a gay or bisexual man. (Although there are some lesbians who date trans men, but that's an interesting topic all its own.)

So if you're involved with a transsexual woman - who is a woman, by the way - and you are questioning if you're gay or bi, that has more to do with you than with her.

Exactly this.

The problem is , trying to convince or otherwise educate the rest of society who does not think like you. Which is sometimes in itself a futile effort.

To me a transwoman, is just a woman. The physical characteristics don't define her, what defines her, is how she perceives herself. However that might not match up to what most of society "sees". She might feel, perceive, behave, like a woman, but to some of society she will always be a man.

It's all about personal perception. Do you define yourself by society's standards or by your own?

I know people that think, when knowing a couple's genitalia (not my viewpoints):
vagina + vagina = homosexual/lesbian/gay . Of course this includes gg women that do not identify as men, although they might be "studs" or butch. This includes transmen as long as they still have a vagina. I know people that take it even further and say, that even if a transman gets the bottom surgery, they are still in fact a woman biologically.

penis + penis= homosexual/gay . They include of course the cisgender males who are attracted to other males. They include transsexual women , who have or have not had the bottom surgery, regardless if they pass 100% as a woman.

There's also people that say they are in fact a third Gender, and neither female or male, or both. How does society classify that person's relationship with a person who Identifies as their birth gender?
example: Third gender who outwardly looks female (born male) dates cis Male
some of society: might classify this as a homosexual relationship
some of society: might classify this as a heterosexual relationship
some of society: might say "there's no such thing as a third gender , you're either female or male"
some of society: might say "since she is third gender , that makes the cis male that dates her , a 3rdgendersexual (made up the word)"

Then you have the "plumbing" people. Example, Thomas Beattie being a pregnant "man" , while still having a functioning uterus and ovaries.
Some of society: says, he is in fact still a woman, because he has a uterus
some of society: might say, "thomas beattie is in fact a man who is pregnant"

Add that , to the androgynous people that blur the gender lines. Where do they and their partners fit in the whole "gay or straight" spectrum.


And of course I know (and agree with) people that say
A Man= includes transmen that identify, live as, Men.
A woman= includes transwomen that Identify, and live as women.

Can we get everyone to agree some day? Probably Not. There's people that will always believe what they believe (the tired abortion debate proves this)

So to answer the original poster's question.

I am a male (cisgendered), that is attracted to women. That makes me straight. Of course a segment of society is going to say I'm gay/homosexual/bisexual if I date and have sexual relations with a transwoman, regardless of her passability and surgery status.. Do I let that define me? No

[bluesoul]

Why are people so obsessed with labels!!!

i think it helps people understand themselves- who they are and what they like.

if you, for example, label yourself as a gay male, then you know where you fit in, what kind of options are available to you (as far as lgbt community) perhaps even entertainment. there are even education programs available to people that identify that way.

i forget the name of the person that actually pointed out that because the girl who was assaulted in new york city was a transsexual, the lgbt community would actually put more pressure on the cops to get the guys who did it.

so i believe labels are important. people only think they're not important when they don't work in their favor.

in this case, the fact that this question comes up so often obviously means it's not clearly defined. what's disturbing however is that most are so quick to dimiss being labelled as gay, yet when one requires help (or protection) the lgbt community is the first haven that is sought.

[BrendaQG]

i think it helps people understand themselves- who they are and what they like.

if you, for example, label yourself as a gay male, then you know where you fit in, what kind of options are available to you (as far as lgbt community) perhaps even entertainment. there are even education programs available to people that identify that way.

i forget the name of the person that actually pointed out that because the girl who was assaulted in new york city was a transsexual, the lgbt community would actually put more pressure on the cops to get the guys who did it.

so i believe labels are important. people only think they're not important when they don't work in their favor.

in this case, the fact that this question comes up so often obviously means it's not clearly defined. what's disturbing however is that most are so quick to dimiss being labelled as gay, yet when one requires help (or protection) the lgbt community is the first haven that is sought.


That is because we are part of the LGBT community.

Often the discrimination against us overlaps with homophobia.

[robertlouis]

I'm kinda offended i just see the point of having the same redundant conversations over and over again.I've been on here for three years and these threads get beyond old.


....but oddly comforting. I mean, what would we talk about if they weren't always here?

:joke: btw.....

[wiltthestilt]

This was also about what I said in the first post:

"Are guys like us who are into TGirls totally straight? I say no. We are turned on by male genitalia after all (even though it's "attached" to a feminine form). Let's be real about that."

I read a lot when I first joined about how guys (like me) into TGirls saw themselves as "straight"...I didn't agree with it but I was new and didn't want to come off like a know-it-all or worse, a troll. But I knew at some point I wanted to talk about it because I'm in this.

So now I've been here for a while, I've read a lot, posted, participated etc, and I figured since people were somewhat familiar with me it would be OK to talk about it in a way that was open and non-judgmental. I think I accomplished this because I didn't see one post where the person was offended by my saying that guys into TGirls are not totally straight.

I'm into TGirls...I don't believe I'm totally straight anymore...I just want to be real about it...saying it anonymously on a forum isn't much, I guess, but it's a start.

Is there such a thing as "totally straight"? How do you know your totally straight neighbor isn't watching TS porn, too? Obviously not every straight man watches TS porn as we do-although a large number of men who watch porn regularly also sometimes watch TS porn, and it's not even unusual any more.

By "being real" I assume you mean accepting that my sexuality departs in some substantial way from the norm. I don't know that this is true--so I will not accept it as it true. I think if there were no social stigma the majority of straight men would fuck Domino when they were horny. Maybe a majority would do it right now. I'm not every man, so I don't know what every man or most men would do.

I wouldn't fuck an obese woman (even when drunk, which would make it even harder to stay aroused); yet many men do it. I would think a beautiful TS like Vaniity or Eva Lin would be closer to paradigmatic image of feminine beauty than Gabourey Sidibe (actress who played "Precious")--yet, some men would fuck the latter, and claim they would never fuck the former. Whatever. Different strokes. If I am different, I at least intend to enjoy myself--which is what "being real" means to me.

[nysprod]

....but oddly comforting. I mean, what would we talk about if they weren't always here?

:joke: btw.....

Six nations rugby...

[bluesoul]

That is because we are part of the LGBT community.

Often the discrimination against us overlaps with homophobia.

i know you are- hence i was using that as an example as to why one wouldn't be straight if blah blah blah

[Jimmy W]

If I had a gun to my head and was forced to say that if I am very much attracted to Evon Rose it makes me gay..then... it makes me gay. If I had a gun to my head and was forced to say that if I am very much attracted to Evon Rose it makes me a guy who likes beautiful girls who have a penis...then ...it makes me a guy who likes beautiful girls who have a penis. Luckily, my friends with guns keep them locked up and could care less about how hot I think Evon Rose is. On the other hand, if Evon Rose ever wants to know how hot I think she is she wont need to put a gun to my head.

(supply your own penis/gun jokes as you see fit)

[Saint_Frankenstein]

Exactly this.

The problem is , trying to convince or otherwise educate the rest of society who does not think like you. Which is sometimes in itself a futile effort.

To me a transwoman, is just a woman. The physical characteristics don't define her, what defines her, is how she perceives herself. However that might not match up to what most of society "sees". She might feel, perceive, behave, like a woman, but to some of society she will always be a man.

It's all about personal perception. Do you define yourself by society's standards or by your own?

I know people that think, when knowing a couple's genitalia (not my viewpoints):
vagina + vagina = homosexual/lesbian/gay . Of course this includes gg women that do not identify as men, although they might be "studs" or butch. This includes transmen as long as they still have a vagina. I know people that take it even further and say, that even if a transman gets the bottom surgery, they are still in fact a woman biologically.

penis + penis= homosexual/gay . They include of course the cisgender males who are attracted to other males. They include transsexual women , who have or have not had the bottom surgery, regardless if they pass 100% as a woman.

There's also people that say they are in fact a third Gender, and neither female or male, or both. How does society classify that person's relationship with a person who Identifies as their birth gender?
example: Third gender who outwardly looks female (born male) dates cis Male
some of society: might classify this as a homosexual relationship
some of society: might classify this as a heterosexual relationship
some of society: might say "there's no such thing as a third gender , you're either female or male"
some of society: might say "since she is third gender , that makes the cis male that dates her , a 3rdgendersexual (made up the word)"

Then you have the "plumbing" people. Example, Thomas Beattie being a pregnant "man" , while still having a functioning uterus and ovaries.
Some of society: says, he is in fact still a woman, because he has a uterus
some of society: might say, "thomas beattie is in fact a man who is pregnant"

Add that , to the androgynous people that blur the gender lines. Where do they and their partners fit in the whole "gay or straight" spectrum.


And of course I know (and agree with) people that say
A Man= includes transmen that identify, live as, Men.
A woman= includes transwomen that Identify, and live as women.

Can we get everyone to agree some day? Probably Not. There's people that will always believe what they believe (the tired abortion debate proves this)

So to answer the original poster's question.

I am a male (cisgendered), that is attracted to women. That makes me straight. Of course a segment of society is going to say I'm gay/homosexual/bisexual if I date and have sexual relations with a transwoman, regardless of her passability and surgery status.. Do I let that define me? No

I'm really at the point where I couldn't be arsed to give into how society defines things. Only I get to define myself. The only opinion about who I am that matters is mine and I know who and what I am. We are individual units of awareness, after all. I have my own perception of self. If someone wishes to disagree or disrespect me for viewing myself as I do, that's their damn problem. I don't want those people around me anyway, if they're not willing to learn from someone who is different from them. Life's too short.

But society slowly yet surely is learning. I'd say the trans rights movement is in the same the gay rights movement was in the early '90s or so.

[EvonRose]

If I had a gun to my head and was forced to say that if I am very much attracted to Evon Rose it makes me gay..then... it makes me gay. If I had a gun to my head and was forced to say that if I am very much attracted to Evon Rose it makes me a guy who likes beautiful girls who have a penis...then ...it makes me a guy who likes beautiful girls who have a penis. Luckily, my friends with guns keep them locked up and could care less about how hot I think Evon Rose is. On the other hand, if Evon Rose ever wants to know how hot I think she is she wont need to put a gun to my head.

(supply your own penis/gun jokes as you see fit)

Awww cuddle!!!!!!!

[robertlouis]

I've always liked girls who are ultra-fem, so when I see somebody like Evon or Amber, for example, I just see a beautiful woman, full stop. Truthfully don't think about what may or may not lie between their legs. I'm attracted by their sheer femininity and will always treat them as ladies just because it's what I do.

And I couldn't give a flying fuck if that makes me gay or not. I know what I like and what I like makes me happy. Who cares if someone else wants to slap a label on that?

[Prospero]

RL might be a scot but sometimes he hits the nail on the head. I agree 100 per cent with the last sentiment. Labels are meaningless. A girl is a girl or a woman.... treat them all with respect.

[robertlouis]

"May be a Scot, but...."

WTF??? I'll nail your fuckin' head tae the wall so ah wull, ya sassenach bastart!

[Prospero]

Scratch a scot and out comes the woad covered Pictish primitive... but hey labels don't matter do they mr Pict

[robertlouis]

Scratch a scot and out comes the woad covered Pictish primitive... but hey labels don't matter do they mr Pict

Absolutely right.

English prick. :dancing:

[Prospero]

I have an Anglo-Irish prick actually.. and proud of it, ya tartan scrotum bag

[nysprod]

Truthfully don't think about what may or may not lie between their legs.



This is partially what the thread was about...the whole denial thing...

[Saint_Frankenstein]

This is partially what the thread was about...the whole denial thing...

What do you mean by denial?

[nysprod]

What do you mean by denial?

As in being in it...

[Saint_Frankenstein]

As in being in it...

Uh huh. What if he's just a guy who digs women in general?

[nysprod]

Uh huh. What if he's just a guy who digs women in general?

Not saying he isn't...I am too...

[Jericho]

Scratch a scot and out comes the woad covered Pictish primitive.

I scratched a Scot once and out came 40 proof!

[Chase_Mcthirsty]

I'm a woman point blank period and the men i deal worth are straight regardless of what we do sexually.stop over analyzing everything and go find something to do
For once we can agree.

Perhaps the OP hunts for "male genitalia" first and the female form last
but for me it's the woman in question that turns me on not just a dick.

By that logic any pair of lips would satisfy my desire for kissing as apposed to actually being attracted to a woman who owns a succulent pair of soup cooler's.

[wiltthestilt]

Where I'll agree with the OP is that if you are registered here (and not trans-woman) you are probably interested in a dick on a girl. To say you have no particular interest in that combination (girl + dick) strikes me as disingenuous. If you are truly genitalia indifferent, then why bother with TS's at all since feminine trans-women are so rare (relatively speaking)?

More than likely if you are here you are turned on by the novelty of a dick on a girl or else there is something that intrigues you about a male transforming into a female.

I don't give a shit about a lady's pussy if I'm not attracted to the rest of her; likewise, I don't give a shit about a TS's dick if I don't like how she looks with cloths on. But still, if I'm putting the work into finding a TS (through eros, at a TS party, ect.) it's because I want variety, and not because I spun the wheel and it landed on tranny.

[nysprod]

for me it's the woman in question that turns me on not just a dick.



Same for me, I'm VERY picky...but we do want a woman with a dick...




To say you have no particular interest in that combination (girl + dick) strikes me as disingenuous. But still, if I'm putting the work into finding a TS it's because I want variety, and not because I spun the wheel and it landed on tranny.



Indeed...

[BrassVillanueva]

I've been following along for a little while now, and I think it's about time I toss my two cents in...

Labels work for this topic just about as well as they do for politics. No one fits the left/right paradigm exactly. In fact, it's a false paradigm to begin with. One of the ways of overcoming that fact in the political field is to plot opinions out on the Nolan chart. It has its own flaws, but it's fairly accurate for getting a sense of your own philosophy and where and how it relates to others.

So why not come up with a version of the Nolan chart for sexual orientation? If we really want to be able to put some sort of quantifiable value to the various possibilities and where each of us stands among them, it seems to me that would be the way to go.

[nysprod]

I've been following along for a little while now, and I think it's about time I toss my two cents in...

Labels work for this topic just about as well as they do for politics. No one fits the left/right paradigm exactly. In fact, it's a false paradigm to begin with. One of the ways of overcoming that fact in the political field is to plot opinions out on the Nolan chart. It has its own flaws, but it's fairly accurate for getting a sense of your own philosophy and where and how it relates to others.

So why not come up with a version of the Nolan chart for sexual orientation? If we really want to be able to put some sort of quantifiable value to the various possibilities and where each of us stands among them, it seems to me that would be the way to go.

Appreciate the thought BV, but it's not really necessary...I think all that needed to be said has been...

[BrassVillanueva]

I agree, I just figure it'd be something to point people to when they ask "THE" question. It's not like this board hasn't been prone to floods of "am I gay?" posts :D

[giovanni_hotel]

One way I look at is like this; if you separate the two, which turns you on more?? A woman born with a pussy?? Or the thought of a raging hard cock??

Normally, or I should say previously, I was just about woman an all their variations, but a switch flipped when I first saw that perfect combo of a girl with 'special' parts.

Cocks NOT attached to TS do nothing for me.

[bluesoul]

Where I'll agree with the OP is that if you are registered here (and not trans-woman) you are probably interested in a dick on a girl.To say you have no particular interest in that combination (girl + dick) strikes me as disingenuous. If you are truly genitalia indifferent, then why bother with TS's at all since feminine trans-women are so rare (relatively speaking)?

More than likely if you are here you are turned on by the novelty of a dick on a girl or else there is something that intrigues you about a male transforming into a female.

I don't give a shit about a lady's pussy if I'm not attracted to the rest of her; likewise, I don't give a shit about a TS's dick if I don't like how she looks with cloths on. But still, if I'm putting the work into finding a TS (through eros, at a TS party, ect.) it's because I want variety, and not because I spun the wheel and it landed on tranny.

really good point.

[Dino Velvet]

Absolutely right.

English prick. :dancing:


I have an Anglo-Irish prick actually.. and proud of it, ya tartan scrotum bag


I scratched a Scot once and out came 40 proof!

Y'know I prefer this way more to the usual persnickety hen-pecking that goes on with you characters.

[nysprod]

I agree, I just figure it'd be something to point people to when they ask "THE" question. It's not like this board hasn't been prone to floods of "am I gay?" posts :D

Viva Zapata Tube!

[Rusty Eldora]

One way I look at is like this; if you separate the two, which turns you on more?? A woman born with a pussy?? Or the thought of a raging hard cock??

Normally, or I should say previously, I was just about woman an all their variations, but a switch flipped when I first saw that perfect combo of a girl with 'special' parts.

Cocks NOT attached to TS do nothing for me.

Yes they need to be attached to someone that feels, acts, and believes they are a girl. Their appearance need not be fully transitioned but their mind needs to be. Then I love to play with her cock.

Cross dressing is often part of the transition journey, but it is a common path with the TV journey - well I am not taking that journey. I don't think I can handle those early in transition where they are unsure if boy or girl.

[robertlouis]

Y'know I prefer this way more to the usual persnickety hen-pecking that goes on with you characters.

And you can go to hell too, damn colonial! The impertinence. Pshaw, sir.

[gurkhabeast]

One way I look at is like this; if you separate the two, which turns you on more?? A woman born with a pussy?? Or the thought of a raging hard cock??

Normally, or I should say previously, I was just about woman an all their variations, but a switch flipped when I first saw that perfect combo of a girl with 'special' parts.

Cocks NOT attached to TS do nothing for me.

i agree, i love hung tgurls not into penis not included tgirls. their she cock is what makes them unique n different from gg's. then again never been w/ one w/o a penis.

[BeardedOne]

Not gay.

Not straight.

Just creative. :)

[LexusFire]

Is there such a thing as "totally straight"? How do you know your totally straight neighbor isn't watching TS porn, too? Obviously not every straight man watches TS porn as we do-although a large number of men who watch porn regularly also sometimes watch TS porn, and it's not even unusual any more.

By "being real" I assume you mean accepting that my sexuality departs in some substantial way from the norm. I don't know that this is true--so I will not accept it as it true. I think if there were no social stigma the majority of straight men would fuck Domino when they were horny. Maybe a majority would do it right now. I'm not every man, so I don't know what every man or most men would do.

I wouldn't fuck an obese woman (even when drunk, which would make it even harder to stay aroused); yet many men do it. I would think a beautiful TS like Vaniity or Eva Lin would be closer to paradigmatic image of feminine beauty than Gabourey Sidibe (actress who played "Precious")--yet, some men would fuck the latter, and claim they would never fuck the former. Whatever. Different strokes. If I am different, I at least intend to enjoy myself--which is what "being real" means to me.

I quite like this way of thinking...
Too much effort on labelling who and what we are, when during the same time you could of had some fun, experimented and smiled!

I tell you what i am, and that is aroused :)

[PatrickLA]

All good points about liking cock on a gurl but tell that to your straight buddies and they will say you are GAY, GAY, GAY if you like cock. End of story. Try it. I dare any of you to tell one of your hetero guy friends at work or school or a longtime friend. See what they say.
"You suck cock? You take cock in the ass? I don't care if HE looks like the hottest girl in the world, she has a cock and you are GAY!!!!"

[CockPolisher]

I'm not gay, that's all I know.

[bluesoul]

i agree, i love hung tgurls not into penis not included tgirls. their she cock is what makes them unique n different from gg's. then again never been w/ one w/o a penis.

i'm just curious but how does that happen? did you date (or pay) hung angels in high-school and college as well?

[girl]

If you are primarily interested in cock, rather than other female attributes, there is quite a chance you ARE gay, most likely a closet case. It’s not called self-denial for no reason, and being "attracted" to transsexuals or TV/CDs could be your way of lying to yourself and excuse for staying in the closet. There is NOTHING wrong with being gay, don’t let the society dic(k)tate your true self.
If you are also bottom, or fascinated by TS tops, your chances go high. It’s up to you; Live your life or live a lie.

[CockPolisher]

If you are primarily interested in cock, rather than other female attributes, there is quite a chance you ARE gay, most likely a closet case. It’s not called self-denial for no reason, and being "attracted" to transsexuals or TV/CDs could be your way of lying to yourself and excuse for staying in the closet. There is NOTHING wrong with being gay, don’t let the society dic(k)tate your true self.
If you are also bottom, or fascinated by TS tops, your chances go high. It’s up to you; Live your life or live a lie.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I believe gay guys like masculinity and, well, men. So whether you're into tranny tops or not, I don't get why you'd pick a feminine form to get your dick if you were gay.

[girl]

Dear CockPolisher, read again what I wrote...

[CockPolisher]

Dear CockPolisher, read again what I wrote...

In regards to self denial? I'm not sure you can just choose what you're attracted to to make yourself feel better.

[Thundergasm]

Not gay.

Not straight.

Just creative. :)

This is how I view it myself. I've "evolved" over the years and I guess the denial was telling myself I didn't like shemales. Now, I don't scream it to the world, although there are a few who know. I'm comfortable in it now and that's all I really care about.

[robertlouis]

Fuck. Is this rubbish still going on? SMDH.

[sheyum]

I notice that your reading it..though



Fuck. Is this rubbish still going on? SMDH.

[STARTUP999]

hjkl

[STARTUP999]

Ur not gay and ur not straight..... Ur Graight! Lol

Like seanchi said, who cares! Fuck labels!!!

That is the best answer ever!

[Tits McButts]

I like sex. Sex is pretty keen.

That about sums it up.

[normsdad]

if you will hold one in your mouth till the swelling goes down you just as gay as I am

[LibertyHarkness]

i view it as if you have a cock and your playing with another cock , (and no i dont differentate a TS cock to a Male cock , a Cock is a fucking cock at the end of the day ) then that is a bisexual act at best .. so on that token i just deem everyone bisexual ..

But then i think all humans have the capacity to be bisexual just that the masses choose not to act on it through moral/relgious beliefs or peer pressure ..

Myself I am bisexual .

and as stated earlier by someone , who cares what you are , just enjoy .

[Fancy fancy]

I love you libby!

[Ananke]

Whatever feels right at the time!!
All different combinations of give and take: that's ok with me!
Creative ....sure!

[lifeisfiction]

Everytime there is a thread on whether you are gay or straight or bi, I wonder why people have to get all huffy about being straight or gay. I have a suspicious feeling that some men who aggressively say they are straight are really not straight. For the heck of it I put some photos of my dick on lpsg, just because I wanted to do something silly on my b-day (I hadn't sleep all night). Low and behold I actually had some "straight" men ask if I wanted to meet up. ???Wah???? I don't care what you call yourself just be honest with yourself.

[Yvonne183]

Everytime there is a thread on whether you are gay or straight or bi, I wonder why people have to get all huffy about being straight or gay. I have a suspicious feeling that some men who aggressively say they are straight are really not straight. For the heck of it I put some photos of my dick on lpsg, just because I wanted to do something silly on my b-day (I hadn't sleep all night). Low and behold I actually had some "straight" men ask if I wanted to meet up. ???Wah???? I don't care what you call yourself just be honest with yourself.

Similar thing when I was young. Guys that would come up to me/meet me would say that they are 101% straight but would make an exception for me. They thought since I had female features, face, body somewhat(I was a teenager at the time), this put it in their head that is was now OK to have sex with a male cause they refused to see the male in me, even after I told them I was a male, this didn't didn't matter,,, they had to justify having sex with me and also stay with their macho hetero being 101% straight.

Even now, I would classify myself not as a female but because they view a female then it was OK to have male to male sex and not call it gay sex. These guys are afraid of the word gay, not the actual act but just the word gay.

[lifeisfiction]

Exactly, they are afraid of being called gay, its a weird masculinity thing (possibly). Men who like transsexuals are in fear that they might be gay. I find there are two camps, men who like to have sex with men or women who turn them on. Particularly they like men but they are afraid of the stigma it would carry being called bi or gay. I have to find the clip but it was about some male model on a tv show who said he was not gay or bi but had a relationship with another man for 9 months. Then there are the other camp where they see ts as women and are attracted to them because they are women.

It further makes me laugh when men say they don't perform oral or even bottom since that makes them more of a man. I laugh because the first time I bottomed was for two bisexual women during a threesome with one woman wearing a strap-on. Does that I mean I am gay???? What lengths people go to reassure they masculinity.

[Yvonne183]

Exactly, they are afraid of being called gay, its a weird masculinity thing (possibly). Men who like transsexuals are in fear that they might be gay. I find there are two camps, men who like to have sex with men or women who turn them on. Particularly they like men but they are afraid of the stigma it would carry being called bi or gay. I have to find the clip but it was about some male model on a tv show who said he was not gay or bi but had a relationship with another man for 9 months. Then there are the other camp where they see ts as women and are attracted to them because they are women.

It further makes me laugh when men say they don't perform oral or even bottom since that makes them more of a man. I laugh because the first time I bottomed was for two bisexual women during a threesome with one woman wearing a strap-on. Does that I mean I am gay???? What lengths people go to reassure they masculinity.

I understand what you say and agree.

I would put this idea to some here:
Quite a few men here say that they have sex with a transsexual is not gay cause she has the mind set that she is a woman despite the plumbing. OK, let's say for arguments sake that this correct, then what about someone who looks like a woman but has the mindset that they are male, would that then be gay? I mean, if the person has boobs, takes hormones and looks quite pretty,, but still has the mind set that they are male, would that mean a male having sex with that person be gay? And someone who looks exactly the same, boobs, hormones and things but considers themselves a women would make that sex act straight? So the act of sex being gay or straight is just in the mind?

[lifeisfiction]

Shhhs Yvonne, your going to make guys freak out in the middle of sex. Its about the attraction for them. If a person looks like a woman, in their mind they are a woman unless they have something otherwise that would make them overlook the fact. Generally if you have breast its hard to think of a person as man when a there is breast in your face. For the situation you describe anyone looking at the person will see the person as a woman, that is the appearance that is presented to public. It would be hard for a person who wasn't aware of the situation to just say that person is a man.

[Rusty Eldora]

i view it as if you have a cock and your playing with another cock , (and no i dont differentate a TS cock to a Male cock , a Cock is a fucking cock at the end of the day ) then that is a bisexual act at best .. so on that token i just deem everyone bisexual ..

But then i think all humans have the capacity to be bisexual just that the masses choose not to act on it through moral/relgious beliefs or peer pressure ..

Myself I am bisexual .

and as stated earlier by someone , who cares what you are , just enjoy .

I'll call myself anything you want just to spend a night with you - that would be so hot. (Just a dream of mine)

Tgirls could really be bisexual, as they have attributes of both.

There isn't just 3 positions: straight - bi - gay but a range or a plane.

Each day we are at a different place - like all last week I was very naughty but straight. A week with a hot Chinese lady, including 5 duos with 2 of her hot Chinese friends. One a real spinner 4'11, 100 pounds. I must say I didn't think Tgirl all week. But now I am home and Tgirls on my mind

[scroller]

I'm somewhat surprised this thread hasn't gone full-on flamewar in the last few hours. There's a certain contingent that must be pleasantly off for the weekend.

[decastro]

we're bored.

[bluesoul]

we're bored.

gay and bored is a deadly combination

[Amy Gray]

We're not gay and we're not straight, we're GRRRRREAT!

Okay, technically it's graight but Tony the Tiger will not be denied!

[LilyRox]

I like sucking man meat, having my ass pussy fucked and fucking girls. I guess I'm bisexual. :party:

[nysprod]

I like sucking man meat, having my ass pussy fucked and fucking girls. I guess I'm bisexual. :party:

Hmmm...we have been a busy little bad girl, haven't we?

[decastro]

gay and bored is a deadly combination
eh.
i'll be honest, i only fuck girls and i've tried anal on a few of them and wasnt reely diggin it. never been attracted to dudes and dont everrr wanna get fucked by anything or anyone lol. just not my thing.
that bein said, i'm super attracted to a select few shemales. idk man, i see them as like unicorns or somethin, the first crush for me being the late great camilla decastro. i mean was she not like the angelina jolie of shemales? RIP
I consider myself a straight ally to the LBGT community and if i were gay i would fucking OWN it and be proud of it like anyone should. Ultimately though I see sexuality as being a spectrum and not set in stone. A few years ago, transvestites did nothing for me and idk maybe i got so bored watchin the same lame ass porn that seeing something out of the ordinary was the only way I could get off. Maybe by the same logic, I'll watch scat porn only someday, who knows? but for now it is what it is, and I appreciate you starting this thread because its interesting to talk about.

[LilyRox]

Hmmm...we have been a busy little bad girl, haven't we?

Mhmm

[nysprod]

Mhmm

And you do know what happens to bad girls...

[LilyRox]

They get spanked?

[nysprod]

They get spanked?

Lol...not in your case, because you like it too much...I think something more appropriate would be for you to take another one of your self pics, fully nude, and then post it here for everyone to see and enjoy.

[LilyRox]

Haha ;)

[nysprod]

Haha ;)

Lol...good thing I can take a joke.

[Ben]

Are guys like us who are into TGirls totally straight? I say no. We are turned on by male genitalia after all (even though it's "attached" to a feminine form). Let's be real about that.

Are we gay? Again, I say no. Gay means you are sexually attracted to the male persona.

Bisexual? Not in the generally accepted meaning.

And what about those of us who are exclusively into TGirls, or those of us into GG's and TG's?

So what are we? There really isn't a word or terminology for us...not that I really care one way or the other what someone wants to label me, but I'm just saying we're in some sort of in between thing that isn't easily categorized.

Either way, I accept myself for who I am.


I'm not sure if the word "we" is apt. I mean, we're all different, we're all precious snowflakes -- ha ha! :) Actually, that is the case. We are all different.
A lot of guys seem to be afraid of the word gay. Or ambivalent. I mean, the word gay isn't a curse word.
Sex is mystery. Again, sex - is - mystery.
And, too, most people, I think, are confused about their sexual orientation. Not just guys on HungAngels -- :)

[nysprod]

Yeah, which is why I said on the other thread that I told myself to stop asking me stupid questions...can we now let this thread go back to wherever it came from?

Thanks.

[francoluvtgs]

I'm TRYSEXUAL
I try everything sexual and love it !

[LibertyHarkness]

here is a fine example of one of my straight slaves :) wink wink :party::fuckin::jerkoff:salad:hide-1:

[robertlouis]

I'm not sure if the word "we" is apt. I mean, we're all different, we're all precious snowflakes -- ha ha! :) Actually, that is the case. We are all different.
A lot of guys seem to be afraid of the word gay. Or ambivalent. I mean, the word gay isn't a curse word.
Sex is mystery. Again, sex - is - mystery.
And, too, most people, I think, are confused about their sexual orientation. Not just guys on HungAngels -- :)


The word gay carries so much negative baggage in most male dominated cultures and subcultures; it's even used as a term of abuse beyond its homosexual meaning. That's why guys are terrified of applying it to themselves or being labelled with it by others. And it's not a single definition either, except amongst the more militant parts of the gay community.

Fact is that everyone is probably at least partly gay. I've often said I'd have Roger Federer's babies because of the effortless grace and elegance he displays on the tennis court, lol.

That apart, I've never found another man sexually attractive in the least, and I like both genetic girls and tgirls to be as feminine and pretty as possible. And I will never bottom.

But if liking girls with that little extra makes me either wholly or partly gay, that's OK. It's a part of me and I'm entirely comfortable with it.

I know what I like and I like what I know.

[Rabbiteyes]

We're Not Gay And We're Not Straight

Not gay? Not straight?

Does that make you graight? :)

[robertlouis]

Not gay? Not straight?

Does that make you graight? :)


Nope. Stray. :dancing:

[Prospero]

Stray graights

[Prospero]

There is a laundromat in West London called "Go Gay"

[hiten369]

Human Sexuality is Complicated... (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXAoG8vAyzI)

[girl]

How about this for terminology.. You are "men who are attracted to transsexual women" and "men who are attracted ALSO to transsexual women" ... and for some cases, "men who are attracted (ALSO) to transsexual women, and crossdressers and transvestites and genderqueers and whatever you can think of..."

I hope there are more than some people who are just "men interested in women".

[btmmale4toptg]

Yup! :)

http://31.media.tumblr.com/a28721a28f7b634742e5c6205275b60e/tumblr_mr0q76GtTT1qevf0zo1_500.jpg

[Castor_Troy05]

To quote one of my favourite movies




The world is changing, music is changing, drugs are changing, even men and women are changing. One thousand years from now there'll be no guys and no girls, just wankers. Sounds great to me

You see, if you ask me, we're heterosexual by default, not be decision. It's just a question of who you fancy.

It's all about aesthetics and it's fuck all to do with morality

[bluesoul]

To quote one of my favourite movies
used to have a major crush on kelly mcdonald

[Castor_Troy05]

Ah yes Kelly McDonald, met her and her husband once at a music festival, she's stunning in real life too

[rockabilly]

We are all in the gutter but some of us are looking at the stars.

[finultimo]

Yup! :)

http://31.media.tumblr.com/a28721a28f7b634742e5c6205275b60e/tumblr_mr0q76GtTT1qevf0zo1_500.jpg

never say better :party:

[trish]

I wasn't getting enough thumbs down votes, so I thought I'd post something on this thread.

Imagine a man and a woman find that they are attracted to each other. In the course of the developing relationship the woman reveals (as timely as possible, but it is always a difficult moment to face) that she is currently a pre-op transexual). Surprised at first, perhaps feeling betrayed, the man shortly decides that in spite of her physiology, he can accept her for the women she is. The relationship continues. Perhaps they even (after many discussions and adventures together) they decide to get married. Is this man a heterosexual? Of course. Is she? Of course. At least there’s is nothing revealed in the story that would lead one to say otherwise.

Now imagine the same story, except the woman being trans is a deal-braker. Are they both still heterosexuals? Yes, of course. But it’s a sad story. Perhaps he wants to have children by the women he eventually marries. Perhaps he just can’t bear the fact that she’s transgender. That can happen even if she is post-op. Sad. But understandable.

Now imagine the same story, but this time all along the man thought he clocked the woman of his attractions right away as a transsexual. But he’s wrong. When he discovers she’s not, it’s a deal-braker. First of all, this story is just as sad as prior story; and certainly less understandable. Second, let’s once again ask the question, “Is he a heterosexual?” Ans: Maybe, maybe not. If he is, he is a heterosexual with a fetish.

Now there’s nothing wrong with fetishes. They are the spice of life. It is quite all right to occassionally act out fantasies and even objectify your lover, or some aspect of him or her. One key word here is “occassionally.” Some of us girls make or have made a substantive living of having healthy fun with male libidos. I know a lot of heterosexual men who enjoy spending an evening fondling a tgirl’s cock. It’s a fetish that some men enjoy and others find repulsive, like drinking a woman’s piss or licking the soles of her shoes.

But (imo) if you let your fetish take a permanent hold on your psyche, so that its presence or absence becomes a deal-braker obstructing the formation of natural healthy relationships, then needless to say, that kind of fetish is not so healthy. I’m wary of anyone who tells me they date transgender women exclusively and that it’s prejudicial to criticize them because being attracted exclusively to transgender women is like being gay and attracted exclusively to men. I disagree. Homosexuality, like heterosexuality, is a sexual orientation. Attraction exclusively to transgender women is not.

One contrary argument is that gender is a continuum. Not every man is either straight or gay. There are shades of in between and exclusive attraction to transgender women is somewhere in the in between.

There are a lot of things to criticize in this argument. 1) Sexual orientation is not gender identification. 2) Being a transgender person doesn’t entail that you’re somewhere in between male and female on the gender continuum. 3) Exclusive attraction to transsexual women is not a sexual orientation nor a gender identity; if male is attracted to a transsexual woman (for the right reasons), then he is attracted to a woman and is therefore a heteosexual, not something between hetero and homo. I can already hear someone object to the parenthetical proviso “for the right reasons.” That is addressed by 4) transgender is not a sexual orientation. Transgender is something a person sometimes becomes to reconcile a tragic mismatch between their physiologic gender and their percieved gender. It is not a sexual orientation. Now to address the topic of right reasons. The “right reasons” are the reasons that prevail as right in any sort of healthy relationship. Gay men seek gay men. Heterosexual men seek heterosexual women and vice-versa. Not being the appropriate sexual orientation can be a legitimate deal-braker (an appropriate and right reason for ending the romantic part of the relationship). But transgender is not a sexual orientation. So being or not being transgender is not by itself a legitimate deal-braker. Anyone for whom being transgender or not is a deal-braker, is sadly a person in the unhealthy grip of a powerful fetish.

[bluesoul]

the first and second scenario remind me of any typical jerry springer episode- where the guy supposedly had "no idea".

the third scenario is the typical hungangels chaser scenario- where they're aggressively seeking out a t-girlfriend for a "serious" relationship that doesn't involve "donations"

[trish]

the first and second scenario remind me of any typical jerry springer episode- where the guy supposedly had "no idea".

the third scenario is the typical hungangels chaser scenario- where they're aggressively seeking out a t-girlfriend for a "serious" relationship that doesn't involve "donations"Yeah, I agree the scenarios are pretty lame. I made them up to introduce the idea of using a "deal-braker" as a kind of test to decide whether one's fetish has gotten out of hand. You can use it for any kind of fetish. Big humongous tits, for example...a rather common fetish. A lot of men would consider it a bonus if they married someone with humongous fun bags...and that's just fine...it IS a bonus. But if having or not having humongous fun bags is a deal-braker, then the fetish has gotten out of hand and is likely ruining your life and will ultimately make your partner miserable.

[hiten369]

On your 1st point, you are right, sexual orientation is not gender identification.

2.I don't think anyone, that uses the continuum argument, has suggested that a transgendered person is somewhere in between male and female. A transgendered person is a combination, like all of us, of sex, gender identity, sexual orientation, romantic orientation, and sexual behavior.

3. You are also right that being exclusively attracted to a transsexual person is not a sexual orientation nor a gender identity. As I stated above, there are many different factors. Although, IMO, I don't think someone would be exclusively attracted to a transsexual person. But I disagree with your argument that if male is attracted to a transsexual woman then therefore a heterosexual. Now does that mean he is automatically in between hetro and homo? Not necessarily but he could be. Adding fetish into this argument seems a bit unnecessary and doesn't make a lot of sense because fetishes are sexual/intimate activities that can be performed solo, with 2 people or with a group of people.

*on a side note: it seems more likely that wanting to have sex with a transgendered person is not a fetish but is most likely the result of a persons sexual behavior and/or romantic orientation. And I say this because wanting to have sex, of any kind, is not a fetish it is human nature. If a guy wants to have sex with a girl, can we really call that a fetish? If a guy wants to have anal sex with a girl then I would call that a fetish.
*

And finally, I'll use myself as an example.
Sex: Male
Gender Identity: Man
Sexual Orientation: mostly straight, but gay on a very small level, or partially bi.
Romantic Orientation: woman (non-transgendered)
Sexual Behavior: I could say none because I haven't had sex or I could simply put masturbation. And I want to have sex with a woman and a transsexual woman.

For me none of these factors are set in stone so they could change.

[trish]

Thanks for the well considered comments. Just a couple of points in reply.


... I disagree with your argument that if male is attracted to a transsexual woman then therefore a heterosexual.This isn't quite what I said. I do agree that non-heterosexuals may be sexually attracted to a transsexual woman.

IMO a man whose sexual interests are focused exclusively on transsexual women is harboring a fetish. On this we probably will have to agree to disagree.

[Prospero]

:iagree::iagree::iagree: So wholly eloquently put. I would love to meet trish.
I wasn't getting enough thumbs down votes, so I thought I'd post something on this thread.....

Imagine a man and a woman find that they are attracted to each other. In the course of the developing relationship the woman reveals (as timely as possible, but it is always a difficult moment to face) that she is currently a pre-op transexual). Surprised at first, perhaps feeling betrayed, the man shortly decides that in spite of her physiology, he can accept her for the women she is. The relationship continues. Perhaps they even (after many discussions and adventures together) they decide to get married. Is this man a heterosexual? Of course. Is she? Of course. At least there’s is nothing revealed in the story that would lead one to say otherwise.

Now imagine the same story, except the woman being trans is a deal-braker. Are they both still heterosexuals? Yes, of course. But it’s a sad story. Perhaps he wants to have children by the women he eventually marries. Perhaps he just can’t bear the fact that she’s transgender. That can happen even if she is post-op. Sad. But understandable.

Now imagine the same story, but this time all along the man thought he clocked the woman of his attractions right away as a transsexual. But he’s wrong. When he discovers she’s not, it’s a deal-braker. First of all, this story is just as sad as prior story; and certainly less understandable. Second, let’s once again ask the question, “Is he a heterosexual?” Ans: Maybe, maybe not. If he is, he is a heterosexual with a fetish.

Now there’s nothing wrong with fetishes. They are the spice of life. It is quite all right to occassionally act out fantasies and even objectify your lover, or some aspect of him or her. One key word here is “occassionally.” Some of us girls make or have made a substantive living of having healthy fun with male libidos. I know a lot of heterosexual men who enjoy spending an evening fondling a tgirl’s cock. It’s a fetish that some men enjoy and others find repulsive, like drinking a woman’s piss or licking the soles of her shoes.

But (imo) if you let your fetish take a permanent hold on your psyche, so that its presence or absence becomes a deal-braker obstructing the formation of natural healthy relationships, then needless to say, that kind of fetish is not so healthy. I’m wary of anyone who tells me they date transgender women exclusively and that it’s prejudicial to criticize them because being attracted exclusively to transgender women is like being gay and attracted exclusively to men. I disagree. Homosexuality, like heterosexuality, is a sexual orientation. Attraction exclusively to transgender women is not.

One contrary argument is that gender is a continuum. Not every man is either straight or gay. There are shades of in between and exclusive attraction to transgender women is somewhere in the in between.

There are a lot of things to criticize in this argument. 1) Sexual orientation is not gender identification. 2) Being a transgender person doesn’t entail that you’re somewhere in between male and female on the gender continuum. 3) Exclusive attraction to transsexual women is not a sexual orientation nor a gender identity; if male is attracted to a transsexual woman (for the right reasons), then he is attracted to a woman and is therefore a heteosexual, not something between hetero and homo. I can already hear someone object to the parenthetical proviso “for the right reasons.” That is addressed by 4) transgender is not a sexual orientation. Transgender is something a person sometimes becomes to reconcile a tragic mismatch between their physiologic gender and their percieved gender. It is not a sexual orientation. Now to address the topic of right reasons. The “right reasons” are the reasons that prevail as right in any sort of healthy relationship. Gay men seek gay men. Heterosexual men seek heterosexual women and vice-versa. Not being the appropriate sexual orientation can be a legitimate deal-braker (an appropriate and right reason for ending the romantic part of the relationship). But transgender is not a sexual orientation. So being or not being transgender is not by itself a legitimate deal-braker. Anyone for whom being transgender or not is a deal-braker, is sadly a person in the unhealthy grip of a powerful fetish.

[Misterman1993]

I'm straight and I've confirmed this. I like cis and trans women. Let's face if we we're gay, then transwomen wouldn't appeal to us at all. Hell even some really femme FTMs look good to me too. Only you can know who you are and what you're into. Just take life one day at a time and don't stress yourself out.

[theANCEIENTWAY]

Hello, I'm new here and wish to at least attempt to answer the question about why straight guys struggle. Please allow this to be my introductory post.

it's because of social and cultural expectations that we struggle with this. You see, all of America society has social and cultural expectations. That is to say, most people think that because "i'm" this way then everybody has to be the same. In short, what Americans value most is conformity and expect everyone to conform to how they think people should be.

thus, they lock us into our gender identity and social roles.

And if it's broken, then it causes a lot of confusion.

i am struggling with this myself. I have always been taught that anything other than heterosexual man and women is wrong, and it is hard to break a lifetime of conditioning.

But, perhaps there could be a new term. because being aroused by transsexualism is not one thing, it is a combination of both masculinity and femininity.

Some do look very good, and being attracted to them is a confusing thing.

I hope I haven't offended anyone with my opinion.

[nysprod]

I so wish this thread would go away...is there any way to get rid of it?

[Lester316]

There are no end of people who come here and post threads trying to label how others identify themselves owing to what they find attractive - or start arguments either way.

I for one would like all such things declared as a redundant topic, which clearly only appeals to trolling and think such posts should fall under the same rules as posting links to tube sites; instant deletion and repeated infractions get a ban.

[giovanni_hotel]

If HA is to exist as a site, there's always going to be new members logging on trying to understand their attraction to TS.

Yeah the topics are redundant but if they help one person come to terms with being NORMAL, I don't see the problem.

[Lester316]

If HA is to exist as a site, there's always going to be new members logging on trying to understand their attraction to TS.

Yeah the topics are redundant but if they help one person come to terms with being NORMAL, I don't see the problem.

I agree and should calrify my comments. I'm talking generally about threads that set out to provoke angry debates/responses - not about a particular thread having not read all of this one for example.

Threads which ask for help or advice, or are just trying to understand who they want to be should be encouraged. Just hopefully the trolls can be identified along the way.

[fred41]

I wasn't getting enough thumbs down votes, so I thought I'd post something on this thread.

Imagine a man and a woman find that they are attracted to each other. In the course of the developing relationship the woman reveals (as timely as possible, but it is always a difficult moment to face) that she is currently a pre-op transexual). Surprised at first, perhaps feeling betrayed, the man shortly decides that in spite of her physiology, he can accept her for the women she is. The relationship continues. Perhaps they even (after many discussions and adventures together) they decide to get married. Is this man a heterosexual? Of course. Is she? Of course. At least there’s is nothing revealed in the story that would lead one to say otherwise.

Now imagine the same story, except the woman being trans is a deal-braker. Are they both still heterosexuals? Yes, of course. But it’s a sad story. Perhaps he wants to have children by the women he eventually marries. Perhaps he just can’t bear the fact that she’s transgender. That can happen even if she is post-op. Sad. But understandable.

Now imagine the same story, but this time all along the man thought he clocked the woman of his attractions right away as a transsexual. But he’s wrong. When he discovers she’s not, it’s a deal-braker. First of all, this story is just as sad as prior story; and certainly less understandable. Second, let’s once again ask the question, “Is he a heterosexual?” Ans: Maybe, maybe not. If he is, he is a heterosexual with a fetish.

Now there’s nothing wrong with fetishes. They are the spice of life. It is quite all right to occassionally act out fantasies and even objectify your lover, or some aspect of him or her. One key word here is “occassionally.” Some of us girls make or have made a substantive living of having healthy fun with male libidos. I know a lot of heterosexual men who enjoy spending an evening fondling a tgirl’s cock. It’s a fetish that some men enjoy and others find repulsive, like drinking a woman’s piss or licking the soles of her shoes.

But (imo) if you let your fetish take a permanent hold on your psyche, so that its presence or absence becomes a deal-braker obstructing the formation of natural healthy relationships, then needless to say, that kind of fetish is not so healthy. I’m wary of anyone who tells me they date transgender women exclusively and that it’s prejudicial to criticize them because being attracted exclusively to transgender women is like being gay and attracted exclusively to men. I disagree. Homosexuality, like heterosexuality, is a sexual orientation. Attraction exclusively to transgender women is not.

One contrary argument is that gender is a continuum. Not every man is either straight or gay. There are shades of in between and exclusive attraction to transgender women is somewhere in the in between.

There are a lot of things to criticize in this argument. 1) Sexual orientation is not gender identification. 2) Being a transgender person doesn’t entail that you’re somewhere in between male and female on the gender continuum. 3) Exclusive attraction to transsexual women is not a sexual orientation nor a gender identity; if male is attracted to a transsexual woman (for the right reasons), then he is attracted to a woman and is therefore a heteosexual, not something between hetero and homo. I can already hear someone object to the parenthetical proviso “for the right reasons.” That is addressed by 4) transgender is not a sexual orientation. Transgender is something a person sometimes becomes to reconcile a tragic mismatch between their physiologic gender and their percieved gender. It is not a sexual orientation. Now to address the topic of right reasons. The “right reasons” are the reasons that prevail as right in any sort of healthy relationship. Gay men seek gay men. Heterosexual men seek heterosexual women and vice-versa. Not being the appropriate sexual orientation can be a legitimate deal-braker (an appropriate and right reason for ending the romantic part of the relationship). But transgender is not a sexual orientation. So being or not being transgender is not by itself a legitimate deal-braker. Anyone for whom being transgender or not is a deal-braker, is sadly a person in the unhealthy grip of a powerful fetish.

I think this covers it very well at every angle...

[LI SEAN08]

Nothing wrong with this thread. It interested me, cauxse I use to always wonder what the hell am I doing with a TG Gurl or even today withg CD gurls when I have a nice loo0king GF for many years!! But hey, if it feels good, I just do it!!! No hangups here!!!!

[trish]

I so wish this thread would go away...is there any way to get rid of it?Just stop rubbing it.

[harry24844722]

In my opinion if you don't fancy or fuck guys then u ain't gay. That's why I like ts not tv as the feminine form should be the focus for me and a stripped down TV looks too much like a dude!

[hippifried]

I'm introverted & bent. Do I qualify?

[Jake4]

I don't care what anyone thinks I am. I love to suck tgirl cock, I love to get fucked by tgirls, and I love to fuck tgirls.

[nysprod]

I wasn't getting enough thumbs down votes, so I thought I'd post something on this thread.

Imagine a man and a woman find that they are attracted to each other. In the course of the developing relationship the woman reveals (as timely as possible, but it is always a difficult moment to face) that she is currently a pre-op transexual). Surprised at first, perhaps feeling betrayed, the man shortly decides that in spite of her physiology, he can accept her for the women she is. The relationship continues. Perhaps they even (after many discussions and adventures together) they decide to get married. Is this man a heterosexual? Of course. Is she? Of course. At least there’s is nothing revealed in the story that would lead one to say otherwise.

Now imagine the same story, except the woman being trans is a deal-braker. Are they both still heterosexuals? Yes, of course. But it’s a sad story. Perhaps he wants to have children by the women he eventually marries. Perhaps he just can’t bear the fact that she’s transgender. That can happen even if she is post-op. Sad. But understandable.

Now imagine the same story, but this time all along the man thought he clocked the woman of his attractions right away as a transsexual. But he’s wrong. When he discovers she’s not, it’s a deal-braker. First of all, this story is just as sad as prior story; and certainly less understandable. Second, let’s once again ask the question, “Is he a heterosexual?” Ans: Maybe, maybe not. If he is, he is a heterosexual with a fetish.

Now there’s nothing wrong with fetishes. They are the spice of life. It is quite all right to occassionally act out fantasies and even objectify your lover, or some aspect of him or her. One key word here is “occassionally.” Some of us girls make or have made a substantive living of having healthy fun with male libidos. I know a lot of heterosexual men who enjoy spending an evening fondling a tgirl’s cock. It’s a fetish that some men enjoy and others find repulsive, like drinking a woman’s piss or licking the soles of her shoes.

But (imo) if you let your fetish take a permanent hold on your psyche, so that its presence or absence becomes a deal-braker obstructing the formation of natural healthy relationships, then needless to say, that kind of fetish is not so healthy. I’m wary of anyone who tells me they date transgender women exclusively and that it’s prejudicial to criticize them because being attracted exclusively to transgender women is like being gay and attracted exclusively to men. I disagree. Homosexuality, like heterosexuality, is a sexual orientation. Attraction exclusively to transgender women is not.

One contrary argument is that gender is a continuum. Not every man is either straight or gay. There are shades of in between and exclusive attraction to transgender women is somewhere in the in between.

There are a lot of things to criticize in this argument. 1) Sexual orientation is not gender identification. 2) Being a transgender person doesn’t entail that you’re somewhere in between male and female on the gender continuum. 3) Exclusive attraction to transsexual women is not a sexual orientation nor a gender identity; if male is attracted to a transsexual woman (for the right reasons), then he is attracted to a woman and is therefore a heteosexual, not something between hetero and homo. I can already hear someone object to the parenthetical proviso “for the right reasons.” That is addressed by 4) transgender is not a sexual orientation. Transgender is something a person sometimes becomes to reconcile a tragic mismatch between their physiologic gender and their percieved gender. It is not a sexual orientation. Now to address the topic of right reasons. The “right reasons” are the reasons that prevail as right in any sort of healthy relationship. Gay men seek gay men. Heterosexual men seek heterosexual women and vice-versa. Not being the appropriate sexual orientation can be a legitimate deal-braker (an appropriate and right reason for ending the romantic part of the relationship). But transgender is not a sexual orientation. So being or not being transgender is not by itself a legitimate deal-braker. Anyone for whom being transgender or not is a deal-braker, is sadly a person in the unhealthy grip of a powerful fetish.

I respect Trish's thoughts on this but I have to wholeheartedly disagree.

To accept it would mean that a man cannot have a preference for transgender woman else he is just living in the grip of a fetish that's consuming him. And it renders transgender women illegitimate as beings worthy of real feelings and love simply because of who they are.

[trish]

...To accept it would mean that a man cannot have a preference for transgender woman else he is just living in the grip of a fetish that's consuming him. And it renders transgender women illegitimate as beings worthy of real feelings and love simply because of who they are.

The first sentence correctly states my view, but only insofar as the “grip” is understood to be no stronger than the “preference.” The way the words are usually used one can have a preference for -say buxom blonds- but not be in the grip of a fetish.

The second sentence is posed as if it followed from the first. Transgender women are worthy of love for all the reasons that any person is worthy of love, the mismatch between their gender identity and their sex as reported on their birth certificate shouldn’t enter into it.

Though we’ve never met, I’m fairly sure you’re a fun and loving man. I find it difficult to believe that you could not love a woman who wasn’t transgender. Preference is one thing... deal-breaker is another.

Certainly you can understand that no woman would want a man who couldn’t love her because she’s transgender. So why would a woman (trans or not) want a man who couldn’t love her if she wasn't transgender?

[nysprod]

Certainly you can understand that no woman would want a man who couldn’t love her because she’s transgender. So why would a woman (trans or not) want a man who couldn’t love her if she wasn't transgender?

Of course a genetic woman would not want a man if he couldn't love her cuz she wasn't transgender.

But that's not your point, which is that a man is not allowed to have a preference specifically for transgender women. What you're saying is:

Hetero male having a preference for genetic women is allowed
Gay man having a preference for gay men is allowed
Man having a preference for transgender women is not allowed because that is simply a fetish.

Your point (which I disagree with) implies that a man cannot, or should not, love a transgender woman because she is transgender...he's only allowed to love her in spite of her being transgender.

[trish]

Of course a genetic woman would not want a man if he couldn't love her cuz she wasn't transgender.
What I said was, "...why would a woman (trans or not) want a man who couldn’t love her if she wasn't transgender?" Notice the parenthetical as well as the counterfactual "if she wasn't".


Hetero male having a preference for genetic women is allowed
Gay man having a preference for gay men is allowed
Man having a preference for transgender women is not allowed because that is simply a fetish.What I'm saying is there's a distinction between sexual orientation and gender identity.


Your point (which I disagree with) implies that a man cannot, or should not, love a transgender woman because she is transgender...he's only allowed to love her in spite of her being transgender.If he is inclined toward women, then whether she is trans or not should enter into it (with the provisos about child bearing etc. mentions in the original post back in 2013). If there's any "spite" at all, it would be better for both parties to confront it as soon as possible.

[holzz]

does seeing a man make you hard?

would you enjoy a genetic man:

- sucking your cock
- fucking you
- you fucking him

do these thoughts make you physically cringe?

but does an MTF TS doing these make you hard? make you want her cock in your arse?

if the former do, you're gay, if the latter set do, you're not.

[nysprod]

What I'm saying is there's a distinction between sexual orientation and gender identity.

Fine, but what does that have to do with a guy who prefers transgender women having nothing more than a fetish for them?


If he is inclined toward women, then whether she is trans or not should enter into it.

Obviously that works for you and that's ok...but to just make a blanket statement about what should and should not enter into the equation denies reality and totally negates the possibility of loving someone as they are (transgender) simply because a man has that preference.

[trish]

Fine, but what does that have to do with a guy who prefers transgender women having nothing more than a fetish for them?It defuses your attempt at an analogy between those who choose compatibly oriented romantic companions and those who insist that their romantic partners be women who have or once had dicks.


...but to just make a blanket statement about what should and should not enter into the equation denies reality and totally negates the possibility of loving someone as they are (transgender) simply because a man has that preference.

There's nothing wrong with fetishes, or even marrying a partner who exemplifies your fetishes as long as you're both happy; nor is there anything I'm saying that stands in the way of that.

You are right to point out that I am, at least in part, expressing my personal opinion. I worked hard to become the woman I am; to gain acceptance as a women in my family, among my friends and in society. I want my lover to regard me as one-hundred percent woman. If I learned that not having that thing between my legs was a deal-breaker, I would have to totally re-evaluate the relationship. That may just be me...but I think you'll find most transgender women agree. Things are a bit turned around in HA-Land because it's populated by fans of our unique condition.

[nysprod]

It defuses your attempt at an analogy between those who choose compatibly oriented romantic companions and those who insist that their romantic partners be women who have or once had dicks.

People insist on a whole bunch of things in their partner, it's just another thing on the list of possibilities



There's nothing wrong with fetishes, or even marrying a partner who exemplifies your fetishes as long as you're both happy; nor is there anything I'm saying that stands in the way of that.

Whether you approve of fetishes isn't the point, it's that you regard a man who prefers tg women only as a fetishist.


If I learned that not having that thing between my legs was a deal-breaker, I would have to totally re-evaluate the relationship.

Right...you're expressing a preference in your partner, which really is no different than a man expressing his preference for a tg woman.

[trish]

Right...you're expressing a preference in your partner, which really is no different than a man expressing his preference for a tg woman.Yes, I prefer that his love for me not be contingent upon his fetishes.


People insist on a whole bunch of things in their partner, it's just another thing on the list of possibilitiesThis has nothing to do with your false analogy. Romantic partners need to have compatible sexual orientation. Desire for a transgender women is not a sexual orientation. It's not even a gender identity. It's a fetish based on the desired person's mismatch between her gender-identity and her sex as reported on her birth certificate. There is no analogy.

Whether you approve of fetishes isn't the point, it's that you regard a man who prefers tg women only as a fetishist.The point is not whether I regard it as a fetish, but why my thinking it is (or why others thinking it is) bothers you. The post you're objecting to was posted back in 2013. Stop rubbing it and this thread will go away. I'm sure we can just agree to disagree on this one.

[nysprod]

I'm sure we can just agree to disagree on this one.

Indeed we can