Pope's sudden resignation sends shockwaves through Church

[Dino Velvet]

So when's the Diane Sawyer interview?

http://news.yahoo.com/pope-resigns-saying-no-longer-strength-fulfill-ministry-112923467.html


Pope's sudden resignation sends shockwaves through Church

By Philip Pullella | Reuters – 59 mins ago


VATICAN CITY (Reuters) - Pope Benedict said in a historic announcement he no longer had the mental and physical strength to run the Roman Catholic Church and would become the first pontiff in more than 700 years to resign, leaving his inner circle "incredulous".
Church officials tried to relay a climate of calm confidence in the running of a 2,000-year-old institution but the decision could lead to one of the most uncertain and unstable periods in centuries for a Church besieged by scandal and defections.
The Church has been rocked during Benedict's nearly eight-year papacy by child sexual abuse crises and Muslim anger after the pope compared Islam to violence. Jews were upset over rehabilitation of a Holocaust denier and there was scandal over the leaking of the pope's private papers by his personal butler.
In the announcement read to cardinals in Latin, the German-born pope, 85, said: "Well aware of the seriousness of this act, with full freedom I declare that I renounce the ministry of Bishop of Rome, Successor of St Peter ...
"As from 28 February 2013, at 20:00 hours (2 p.m. ET) the See of Rome, the See of St. Peter will be vacant and a conclave to elect the new Supreme Pontiff will have to be convoked by those whose competence it is."
The pope, known for his conservative doctrine, did not intend to influence the decision of the cardinals who will enter a secret conclave to elect a successor, Vatican spokesman Father Lombardi Federico said.
Benedict stepped up the Church's opposition to gay marriage, underscored the Church's resistance to a female priesthood and to embryonic stem cell research.
A new leader of the world's 1.2 billion Roman Catholics could be elected as soon as Palm Sunday, on March 24 and be ready to take over by Easter a week later, he said.
EX-POPE AND REIGNING POPE
Lombardi said the pope did not fear a possible "schism" but several popes in the past, including Benedict's predecessor John Paul, refrained from stepping down precisely because of the confusion and division that could be caused by having an "ex-pope" and a reigning pope living at the same time.
This could create a particularly difficult problem if the next pope is a progressive who influences such teachings as the ban on women priests and artificial birth control and its insistence on a celibate priesthood.
"This is disconcerting, he is leaving his flock," said Alessandra Mussolini, a parliamentarian who is granddaughter of Italy's wartime dictator.
"The pope is not any man. He is the vicar of Christ. He should stay on to the end, go ahead and bear his cross to the end. This is a huge sign of world destabilization that will weaken the Church."
The pope's elder brother Georg Ratzinger, a frail 89-year-old priest who shares the pope's passion for music, told reporters in the Bavarian town of Regensburg where he once conducted the cathedral choir that he had been "very surprised" to learn of his brother's resignation.
"He alone can evaluate his physical and emotional strength," said Ratzinger.
Lombardi said Benedict would first go to the papal summer residence south of Rome and then move into a cloistered convent inside the Vatican walls. It was not clear if Benedict would have a public life.
The last Pope to resign willingly was Celestine V in 1294 after reigning for only five months, his resignation was known as "the great refusal" and was condemned by the poet Dante in the "Divine Comedy". Gregory XII reluctantly abdicated in 1415 to end a dispute with a rival claimant to the papacy.
NO SPECIFIC ILLNESS, NO DEPRESSION
Lombardi said Benedict's decision showed "great courage". He ruled out any specific illness or depression and said the decision was made in the last few months "without outside pressure".
While the pope had slowed down recently - he started using a cane and a wheeled platform to take him up the long aisle in St Peter's Square - he had given no hint recently that he was mulling such a dramatic decision.
"I am really surprised," said Ricardo Rodriguez, a Portuguese tourist in St Peter's Square. "I hope the next pope can be better than this one doing the best for the world and Catholics," he said.
Elected in 2005 to succeed the enormously popular John Paul, Benedict never appeared to feel comfortable in a job he said he never wanted. He had wanted to retire to his native Germany to pursue his theological writings, something which he will now do from a convent inside the Vatican.
The resignation means that cardinals from around the world will begin arriving in Rome in March and after preliminary meetings, lock themselves in a secret conclave.
There has been growing pressure on the Church for the cardinals to shun European contenders and choose a pope from the developing world in order to better reflect parts of the globe where most Catholics live and where the Church is growing.
"MIND AND BODY"
The pope told the cardinals that in order to govern "...both strength of mind and body are necessary, strength which in the last few months, has deteriorated in me to the extent that I have had to recognize my incapacity to adequately fulfill the ministry entrusted to me."
He referred to "today's world, subject to so many rapid changes and shaken by questions of deep relevance for the life of faith".
Before he was elected pope, the former Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, was known by such critical epithets as "God's rottweiler" because of his stern stand on theological issues.
After a few months, he showed his mild side but he never drew the kind of adulation that had marked the 27-year papacy of his predecessor John Paul.
The Archbishop of Canterbury, leader of the worldwide Anglican communion at odds with the Vatican over women priests, said he had learned of the pope's decision with a heavy heart but complete understanding.
German Chancellor Angela Merkel said the pope's decision must be respected if he feels he is too weak to carry out his duties. British Prime Minister David Cameron said: "He will be missed as a spiritual leader to millions."
Elected to the papacy on April 19, 2005 when he was 78 - 20 years older than John Paul was when he was elected - Benedict ruled over a slower-paced, more cerebral and less impulsive Vatican.
CHEERS AND SCANDAL
But while conservatives cheered him for trying to reaffirm traditional Catholic identity, his critics accused him of turning back the clock on reforms by nearly half a century and hurting dialogue with Muslims, Jews and other Christians.
Under the German's meek demeanor lay a steely intellect ready to dissect theological works for their dogmatic purity and debate fiercely against dissenters.
After appearing uncomfortable in the limelight at the start, he began feeling at home with his new job and showed that he intended to be pope in his way.
Despite great reverence for his charismatic, globe-trotting predecessor -- whom he put on the fast track to sainthood and whom he beatified in 2011 -- aides said he was determined not to change his quiet manner to imitate John Paul's style.
A quiet, professorial type who relaxed by playing the piano, he managed to show the world the gentle side of the man who was the Vatican's chief doctrinal enforcer for nearly a quarter of a century.
The first German pope for some 1,000 years and the second non-Italian in a row, he travelled regularly, making about four foreign trips a year, but never managed to draw the oceanic crowds of his predecessor.
The child abuse scandals hounded most of his papacy. He ordered an official inquiry into abuse in Ireland, which led to the resignation of several bishops.
Scandal from a source much closer to home hit in 2012 when the pontiff's butler, responsible for dressing him and bringing him meals, was found to be the source of leaked documents alleging corruption in the Vatican's business dealings, causing an international furor.
Benedict confronted his own country's past when he visited the Nazi death camp at Auschwitz.
Calling himself "a son of Germany", he prayed and asked why God was silent when 1.5 million victims, most of them Jews, died there during World War Two.
Ratzinger served in the Hitler Youth during World War Two when membership was compulsory. He was never a member of the Nazi party and his family opposed Adolf Hitler's regime.
(Philip Pullella; editing by Peter Millership, Ralph Boulton, Janet McBride)

http://media.zenfs.com/en-US/video/video.reutersnews.com/2013-02-11T155958Z_2_LOVE91A18FXVF_RTRMADP_BASEIMAGE-960X540_VATICAN-POPE-RESIGNATION-ROUGH-CUT-O.JPG

[Prospero]

No comment.....

[Dino Velvet]

Wonder who the next Don... errrr... sorry, Pope will be?

[flabbybody]

I had no idea this was the type of position you could resign from.
Who do you notify? God ?

[Dino Velvet]

I had no idea this was the type of position you could resign from.
Who do you notify? God ?

You give him a kick too, Flabby.

If God fires a pope does he carve the termination notice on a pink rock?

[Molly D'Vyne]

You give him a kick too, Flabby.

If God fires a pope does he carve the termination notice on a pink rock?

I'm pretty sure when God fires a pope it's called death. Gotta give this guy props for sticking it to the deity and leaving on his own accord.

[LibertyHarkness]

good he was a prick .

[Stavros]

good he was a prick .

Nah...I reckon you envy the Pope those red velvet slippers with gold embroidery he gets to wear which even you can't afford...

[Dino Velvet]

I'm pretty sure when God fires a pope it's called death.

What a jerk. Last time I got fired they just had 2 security guards present.

[Prospero]

And God Dino - cept he's invisible

[LibertyHarkness]

Nah...I reckon you envy the Pope those red velvet slippers with gold embroidery he gets to wear which even you can't afford...

mate i seen them in primark already .. :)

[flabbybody]

good he was a prick .
Brits still pissed Vatican didn't grant King Henry his divorce request

[TSCURIOUS]

I just sent in my Resume!!
Hope to at least get a phone interview!

[trish]

Once he resigns they should just retire the position.

[martin48]

Do you think they discovered that he contained traces of choirboy DNA?

[Odelay]

I knew I'd get the best take on the pope's resignation on this board. BTW, he's going back to being called Joe Ratfucker - er, I mean, Joe Ratzinger.

[robertlouis]

Now this would make things interesting. And unlike all his predecessors, he would be immortal and indestructible.

As for the white smoke at his election, well.....

[Dino Velvet]

I live between Good Shepherd, St. Paul's, and St Timothy's. Today I walked by Good Shepherd. It was a ghost town in front of that church but a block away the Presbyterians were feeding lunch to about 40 homeless people at All Saint's. Good for the Presbyterians actually caring for the poor and needy. Many Catholics are very insecure about giving money to their church. A bunch donated recently supposedly earmarked for Catholic cemeteries was found out to pay lawyer bills. The lies... the lies. A house of cards can easily be turned into a tinder box.

[Dino Velvet]

Now this would make things interesting. And unlike all his predecessors, he would be immortal and indestructible.

As for the white smoke at his election, well.....

Not talking about this fella instead? He'll make you worship the bishop.

http://i614.photobucket.com/albums/tt221/My_Farts_Cause_Global_Warming/UltimateWarriorSuckingOffTheHulkster.gif

[robertlouis]

This just in from Ireland....

[Ben]

good he was a prick .

Best comment so far....

[Dino Velvet]

This just in from Ireland....

Hey Robert, photoshop him into that pervy dead Jimmy guy from over there.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-AiKQSIqLl-I/UIvcc7Srj0I/AAAAAAAAbtw/uUQyJVo0I2g/s1600/Jimmy+Savile+and+the+Pope..jpg

[robertlouis]

Hey Robert, photoshop him into that pervy dead Jimmy guy from over there. [/IMG]

Savile was awarded a papal knighthood, presumably for services to kiddy-fiddling.

Here's a nice joke a pal in the UK sent me earlier today:

A Horse walks in to a pub and the barman says you're too late, we're joking about the pope now. And Richard III, nursing his pint in the corner, agrees.

[Ben]

Sinead O'Connor: 'Pope Benedict's Greatest Achievement Is This Act of Retiring'

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/earshot/sinead-oconnor-pope-benedicts-greatest-420477

[Dino Velvet]

Wonder if that loudmouth from New York is gonna take his place? All full of pride and other sins. I did hear his name him mentioned.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDEsTHCFFVs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eahML0Ho894

[robertlouis]

My money's on the dick in San Francisco. Remember him?

[robertlouis]

At last the truth behind the resignation - old Benny was just a clothes pony all along....

[Dino Velvet]

There's gonna be great pics floating around all week. Love to see a few funny gifs too.

[sukumvit boy]

Great pics robertlouis,lmao.
This is getting to be a trend. Don't forget the Dali Lama started it when he retired,
March 19,2011.
http://www.dalailama.com/messages/tibet/retirement

[martin48]

.....

[martin48]

The Pope is just a good catholic and pulling out before he finishes.

[robertlouis]

The Pope is just a good catholic and pulling out before he finishes.


Excellent Sir! :Bowdown::Bowdown::Bowdown:

[martin48]

It gets worse (or better)

[tsadriana]

And the world ends just because the Pope resigned?Another blocke in a dress will replace him ....The most hypocrite institutions in the world are the church ....

[robertlouis]

Plenty of internet speculation that the Pope resigned in order to secure immunity form prosecution by an unnamed European state who wanted to charge him as the head of the church for all of their crimes against children - the abuse, the cover-ups, the lies, the payoffs.

If that's organised religion, I want no part of it. Sadly, millions of believers will choose to shut their eyes and carry on supporting this grotesque and disgusting institution. Fools.

[Dino Velvet]

The Pope is just a good catholic and pulling out before he finishes.

I give it to you on that one too. Nice one.:cheers:

I'm also stealing it and telling it to my aunt's new Irish husband.

[tsadriana]

Plenty of internet speculation that the Pope resigned in order to secure immunity form prosecution by an unnamed European state who wanted to charge him as the head of the church for all of their crimes against children - the abuse, the cover-ups, the lies, the payoffs.

If that's organised religion, I want no part of it. Sadly, millions of believers will choose to shut their eyes and carry on supporting this grotesque and disgusting institution. Fools.
Yeah pedos and rapiists in the chruch..i dont know why ,but my toillet is better place to pray ,rather then a shitty chruch with shit fake people in it,,every criminal goes to church on sunday .

[robertlouis]

Yeah pedos and rapiists in the chruch..i dont know why ,but my toillet is better place to pray ,rather then a shitty chruch with shit fake people in it,,every criminal goes to church on sunday .

You grew up in Italy Adriana, yes? What was it like, especially the church?

[robertlouis]

Another candidate....

[hippifried]

And the world ends just because the Pope resigned?Another blocke in a dress will replace him ....The most hypocrite institutions in the world are the church ....

I'm sure somebody's world ended over this bullshit. With that much power & money involved, dirt naps start happening more frequently when plans don't work out as planned. Just sayin'...

[martin48]

I give it to you on that one too. Nice one.:cheers:

I'm also stealing it and telling it to my aunt's new Irish husband.

Do tell me the reaction!

[martin48]

Another candidate....

Let's hear it for Pope Joan - apparently she was pope in 9th century for a few years. This isJohanna von Ingelheim in the 2009 film

[Odelay]

Picking a new pope is like picking your nose... you end up having to dig really deep and what you come out with in the end usually doesn't look all that appealing.

[trish]

How many infallible people can there be to choose from?

[martin48]

How many infallible people can there be to choose from?
Just you and me and, of course, My my my

And Jamie!!!!

[Stavros]

How much is the Pope paid -say, on an annual basis?

[Dino Velvet]

Picking a new pope is like picking your nose... you end up having to dig really deep and what you come out with in the end usually doesn't look all that appealing.

And you know you've yanked a real good one when there's brain attached to it.

[Dino Velvet]

Uhhhhhhhhh... Whoopsie.

http://news.yahoo.com/did-cross-dressing-priest-sex-ring-bring-down-174300640--politics.html


Did A Cross-Dressing Priest Sex Ring Bring Down Benedict XVI?

By Barbie Latza Nadeau | The Daily Beast – 3 hrs ago


Of all the rumors floating around (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/02/15/conspiracy-theories-why-did-the-pope-really-quit.html) about just why Pope Benedict XVI is hanging up (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/02/11/the-pope-resigns-good-decision.html) his camauro, one has taken on a life of its own. According to several well-placed vaticanisti--or Vatican experts--in Rome, Benedict is resigning after being handed a secret red-covered dossier that included details about a network of gay priests who work inside the Vatican, but who play in secular Rome. The priests, it seems, are allegedly being blackmailed by a network of male prostitutes who worked at a sauna in Rome’s Quarto Miglio district, a health spa in the city center, and a private residence once entrusted to a prominent archbishop. The evidence reportedly includes compromising photos and videos of the prelates--sometimes caught on film in drag, and, in some cases, caught ‘in the act’.
Revelations about the alleged network are the basis of a 300-page report supposedly delivered to Benedict on December 17 by Cardinals Julian Herranz, Joseph Tomko and Salvatore De Giorgi. According to the press reports, it was on that day that Benedict XVI decided once and for all to retire, after toying with the idea for months. He reportedly closed the dossier and locked it away in the pontifical apartment safe to be handed to his successor to deal with. According to reports originally printed by La Repubblica newspaper and the newsweekly Panorama (and followed up across the gamut of the Italian media), the crimes the cardinals uncovered involved breaking the commandments “Thou shalt not steal” and “Thou shalt not commit adultery,” the latter of which has been used in Vatican-speak to also refer also to homosexual relations instead of the traditional reference to infidelity.
The trio of cardinals who authored the report, known in the Italian press as the ‘007 Priests,’ were commissioned by Benedict to dig into the Vatileaks (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/05/28/did-the-pope-s-butler-paolo-gabriele-really-do-it.html) scandal that rocked the Holy See last fall when the pope’s butler, Paolo Gabriele, was convicted of stealing secret papal documents and leaking them to the press. The sleuthing cardinals ran a parallel investigation to the Vatican tribunal’s criminal case against the butler, but theirs was far more covert and focused not on the mechanics of the leaks, but on who within the Roman Curia might be the brains behind them. And, according to the leaked reports, what the ‘007 Priests’ found went far beyond the pope’s private desk. “What’s coming out is very detailed X-ray of the Roman Curia that does not spare even the closest collaborators of the Pope,” wrote respected Vatican expert Ignazio Ingrao in Panorama. “The Pope was no stranger to the intrigues, but he probably did not know that under his pontificate there was such a complex network and such intricate chains of personal interests and unmentionable relationships.”
The existence of a gay priest network outside the fortified walls of Vatican City is hardly news, and many are wondering if it is only the tip of the proverbial iceberg of sex scandals. In 2010, investigative journalist Carmello Abbate went undercover with a hidden camera to write a shocking expose called “Good Nights Out for Gay Priests” (http://italia.panorama.it/Le-notti-brave-dei-preti-gay).
Abbate caught the priests on hidden camera dirty dancing at private parties and engaging in sex acts with male escorts on church property. He also caught them emerging from dark bedrooms just in time to celebrate mass. In one postcoital scene, a priest parades around seminaked, wearing only his clerical vestments. “This is not about homosexuality,” Abbate told The Daily Beast (http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2010/07/27/the-vatican-s-gay-priests.html) when he published the expose. “This is about private vices and public virtues. This is about serious hypocrisy in the Catholic Church.”
Because so much of the secret lives of gay priests is actually not so secret thanks to Abbate’s expose and subsequent book, Sex and the Vatican (http://www.amazon.com/Vatican-Viaggio-segreto-regno-casti/dp/8856618672), many are wondering what else could be hidden in the alleged red-covered dossier. Vatican elite have also been loosely tied to a number of other secular scandals during Benedict’s tenure, including the ultra-tawdry affair between former governor of Lazio Piero Marrazzo and several transvestite prostitutes, including one named “Brenda” who was found burned to death in 2009 (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2009/11/04/berlusconis-tranny-defense.html). At the time that Marrazzo’s relationships with the transvestites were discovered, his driver reportedly told investigators that several high-ranking priests and even cardinals were customers of Rome’s elite transsexual circuit, though no proof was ever provided and no one has ever been arrested tied to the transsexual prostitution circuit . Nor has anyone mentioned whether reference to these crimes might also be in the dossier. But Marrazzo was whisked off to the Vatican-owned Monte Cassino abbey south of Rome to do his penance, and he even wrote a letter to Vatican Secretary of State Tarciso Bertone (http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2012/07/08/vatileaks-scandal-exposes-secrets-of-pope-s-empire.html) asking for Pope Benedict XVI’s forgiveness.
Whatever secrets the red binders supposedly hold will have to remain just that until the next pope is elected. But Ingrao believes its contents are so important that the dossier will be like the 118th cardinal in the conclave. “Many new skeletons from the closets of the cardinals could come out until the beginning of the conclave,” says Ingrao. “Many voters know or claim to know the secrets of their brothers, but it is already clear that the new pope who leaves the Sistine Chapel will have to be scandal-free in order to proceed with cleaning up [what] Ratzinger has left for his successor.”

[Odelay]

Wait a minute... I'm confused about terminology. Are gay guys who dress up in drag, actually cross-dressers? I have several gay friends and colleagues through the years that were always dressing up in drag - at parties, mostly. I never thought of them as cross dressers. I guess I think of cross dressers as straight guys who all of a sudden are bi-curious. They dress up to score, not as some party costume gimmick. I don't know, maybe there's no distinction.

[broncofan]

How much is the Pope paid -say, on an annual basis?
Per anum? Quite a lot I reckon.:)

[martin48]

How much is the Pope paid -say, on an annual basis?

The pope gets no salary and is not allowed worldly possessions. The pension benefits are great though

[robertlouis]

The pope gets no salary and is not allowed worldly possessions. The pension benefits are great though

That's clever. :Bowdown:

Although I would imagine that unlike the islamic version it doesn't involve 72 virgins....

[Dino Velvet]

That's clever. :Bowdown:

Although I would imagine that unlike the islamic version it doesn't involve 72 virgins....

He already had those here... and then some.

[zerrrr]

I posted this in the other thread and it bears some repeating. When Pope John Paul II was suffering through Parkinson's Benedict XVI ran the church as the number 2 person. Now that he had his pacemaker replaced in December and his health is failing the question becomes does he put the church in the same position as he was in with John Paul II?

Most people do not know that because it has not been widely reported or actually the media ignores it because it does not make for an interesting story.

I actually think it is refreshing that a leader of any organization is willing to step aside rather than continue despite knowing that they cannot completely fulfill the obligations.

We were rolling Strom Thurman into Congress when it was not apparent that he could fulfill the office. Our society is now built upon people trying to maintain a crumbling power structure and for me it is nice that someone is willing to step aside.

[martin48]

He already had those here... and then some.

No pension benefits for you then.

[Prospero]

Exellent Martin.

For many Roman Catholics surely the virgins would be off the opposite gender.

[martin48]

Indeed. "Pass me another choir boy, this one has cracked!"

[martin48]

Another one bites the dust

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21572724

Trying to make humans feel guilty about our sexual urges doesn't work

[Prospero]

Gives a whole new meaning to the departing Pope having been "in the Hitler Youth."

[martin48]

Can we have a caption competition for the picture?

[robertlouis]

Meanwhile in Scotland.....

Cardinal Keith O'Brien, Archbishop of Edinburgh and St Andrews, and Britain's most senior Catholic, has been forced to resign after allegations, so far unspecified, were made by priests and ex-priests about him indulging in "inappropriate behaviour" with them in the past, usually after a drinking session.

This is the same man who has been outspoken in his condemnation of homosexuality and is arguably the most powerful voice in the UK in the campaign against gay marriage, yet his hypocrisy has been laid bare for all to see.

The papers are of course full of apologists, including, I sadly note, Bruce Kent, praising him for his stance against nuclear weapons. It will be very interesting to see how this will develop in the wake of the Pope's resignation and the never-ending clamour of scandals that threaten to swamp the church.

Those who blithely say that the church has come through worse in the past seem to be forgetting that this is the 21st century where everyone has a view and large numbers have devices which enable them to express it.

Can the church survive? And, just as importantly, should it?

http://http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/cardinal-obriens-resignation-pressures-scandal-hit-1733068

[Prospero]

Meanwhile there was a rather fun little film that came out about 18 months ago called "Habemus Papem" - a comedy about a cardinal named as pope who suddenly decides he doesn't want the job and goes on the run. The film is flawed but worth seeking out.

WE HAVE A POPE Official UK Trailer - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m0GUU4JEXxA)
"Habemus Papam" di Nanni Moretti - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5g8HFzsYV9k)

[robertlouis]

Another late entry. Tiddles for Pope!

[martin48]

Another late entry. Tiddles for Pope!

Given the look of the other candidates, I'd go for Tiddles.

[robertlouis]

Given the look of the other candidates, I'd go for Tiddles.

And, after all, is the Pope CAT-holic? :D

[Dino Velvet]

Another late entry. Tiddles for Pope!

http://www.hungangels.com/vboard/attachment.php?attachmentid=559171&stc=1&d=1361975744

If the Pope were a cat I'd be considered a good CATholic too since I feed the poor and needy every morning in the backyard. Even a few infidel racoons and non-believer squirrels too.

[trish]

No. Curse those thieving, atheist squirrels. They steal birdseed and gnaw the feeders to ruination. I pay good money for those feeders too. Compared to squirrels, CATholics are well behaved. Murderous, but well behaved.

[Prospero]

What about catholic DOGma though?

[Prospero]

a true CATholic then....

[Dino Velvet]

No. Curse those thieving, atheist squirrels. They steal birdseed and gnaw the feeders to ruination. I pay good money for those feeders too. Compared to squirrels, CATholics are well behaved. Murderous, but well behaved.

All the extra berries on the trees keep my squirrels honest. Not a lick of violence nor a drop of blood ever.

The racoons are the ones with the bad table manners washing their ass in the water bowl after supper.

[martin48]

No. Curse those thieving, atheist squirrels. They steal birdseed and gnaw the feeders to ruination. I pay good money for those feeders too. Compared to squirrels, CATholics are well behaved. Murderous, but well behaved.


I'm pretty certain squirrels aren't atheist. I have evidence

[trish]

Awe! They're so cute....













when they're stuffed.

[robertlouis]

Awe! They're so cute....













when they're stuffed.

That, Trish, is beyond disgusting. And it's illegal in 49 states, Kentucky being the obvious exception.

[robertlouis]

This has been around for a while, but it's pretty topical.

Tim Minchin who's Australian is probably the funniest songwriter around. In the tradition of Tom Lehrer at his very best.

And how cool are the Aussies? His backing band is Australia's most prominent symphony orchestra. The lyrics are online too. It's brilliant.

http://http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pB958pxquj0

[robertlouis]

Makes you wonder just what Jesus would make of it all......

Wiretapping inside the vatican.

http://http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/01/vatican-wiretap-vatileaks_n_2792956.html?utm_hp_ref=religion&utm_hp_ref=fb&src=sp&comm_ref=false#sb=797704,b=facebook

[robertlouis]

This made me laugh. And it's probably pretty close to the truth.

[Stavros]

Cardinal Keith O'Brien who resigned as head of the Catholic Church in Scotlland has now admitted he tried to seduce a young seminarian in 1980 -I don't know why this has broken now, other than the upcoming conclave of cardinals being a political issue. At its root this really does suggest that if men (and presumably in the case of nuns, women) cannot wholly commit their bodies and souls to the service of God, then either they should change jobs, or be allowed to marry and have full relationships. I once vaguely knew an Irish Catholic who left the priesthood because celibacy was too much to sacrifice. And, if it happened, these scandals ought to decrease in frequency. We are, after all, expected to believe that the Pope is a Virgin.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21649475

[Prospero]

I agree with your sentiments Stavros. it does seem absurd that these guys are expoected to be abstinent for their entire lives. Time for this to be liberalised. Things were much less rigorous in medieval times I believe.
I too knew a man who had been a monk and left for much the sae reasons as the priest you mention.

[trish]

If they dabble in little boys because they can't remain faithful to their vowels of celibacy, how is it they feel no compulsion to dabble in say spirit crystals, tarot, Zoroastrianism, or the sacrificial ritualism of Tezcatlipoca? Apparently Catholicism can lure the spirit to slumber, but not the loins.

[Prospero]

Well they got the God part nailed down....

[fred41]

In all seriousness,I believe child molesters just go where the opportunity seems greatest...and where better to find cover than religious communities that guard against public scrutiny. The more open the church becomes...the harder it will be for a deviate to hide there...same as with the orthodox Jewish community,for example.

That being said, celibacy is a separate issue...it seems almost cruel to deny oneself any ability to have intimate contact with another adult for the rest of ones life. It seems unnatural. I've often wondered if homosexuals sometimes become priests because they think they can deny it to themselves with devoutness ...or because that is simply where all the men are, so to speak.

[trish]

In all seriousness,I believe child molesters just go where the opportunity seems greatest...I think this is true when it applies(how's that for a tautology?), but I really don't think it explains the preponderance of molestation by priests. The preponderance of homosexual rape in prison isn't due to homosexuals getting themselves sent to jail because of all the captive man-bait there. We know rather that prison is an environment that encourages man on man anal sex. I think it's likely that celibacy in the Church is similar, that it creates the conditions that make the behavior almost inevitable.

[TSBootyLondon]

These latest 'allegations' are an absolute disgrace and I fear their only on the surface of what is to come however the reality will always be where one is exposed within the walls of the church, 20 remain protected for their heinous crimes against children, many now old or sadly dead.
The catholic religion is tired and dated, they receive fewer candidates to the brotherhood each year, something they bought onto themselves.

Whereas I agree the expectation for a priest to remain celibate to god needs to change it remains that these men entered into the clergy knowing what would be expected.
Allot of priest, especially in Ireland were raised by the brothers some born in convents, bastard children they were called! The natural progression for many and knowing nothing else was becoming priests themselves. Many abused as children. The abused becomes the abuser! and it wasn't just the priest who abused his position, Nuns were equally as brutal and cruel to children, even young adults.

The Catholic Church is being destroyed from with its own walls!

[Dino Velvet]

I hear the dude from Ghana has a good shot. There will be a scandal saying he was actually born in Hawaii.

[robertlouis]

Meanwhile, Cardinal Keith O'Brien, the UK's most senior Catholic, admits that the allegations of sexual misconduct against him were in fact true.

I can feel compassion for the man, but nothing but contempt for his office and for the institution that connived at his behaviour.

http://http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/mar/03/cardinal-keith-obrien-admits-sexual-misconduct

[Jericho]

Father Jack for Pope...Get it all out in the open. :shrug

[martin48]

I hear the dude from Ghana has a good shot. There will be a scandal saying he was actually born in Hawaii.

You mean he might be a secret Muslim?

[martin48]

Father Jack for Pope...Get it all out in the open. :shrug

That'll be an ecumenical matter!

[hippifried]

You mean he might be a secret Muslim?

Or a secret Catholic.

[robertlouis]

That'll be an ecumenical matter!

Indeed.

[Dino Velvet]

Cardinal Mahony's Twitter. Start reading Feb 11. Seems like such a good man who could do no wrong. Prayers!

If someone grabbed him by the neck he'd probably have a surprised look on his face.

https://twimg0-a.akamaihd.net/profile_images/3097184355/6e416035e5003b1667cbf6a9105fd777_normal.jpeg
https://twitter.com/CardinalMahony