How do you feel about tips in restaurants?

[Stavros]

I don't know Applebee in the US but I have been aware for many years that tipping is essential in US restaurants (it is illegal to tip in China, and often optional in other countries); but this story by the waitress who was sacked after the customer complained his bill was posted online raises questions about the salary she was being paid -$3.50 an hour? is THAT legal?- as well as his Christian beliefs: 'I give God 10% why should I give you 18%'. I feel the waitress was right and Applebee is wrong to sack the staff, he could have asked to see the manager to explain why he wasn't payng the tip.

For the record, I have had some rubbish meals in the US; I have also had some splendid ones, its that kind of country; but the worst in North America was in Montreal. The link is below the article.

Tips are not optional, they are how waiters get paid in America

An Applebee's diner refused to leave a tip for religious reasons. The waitress who exposed it wonders if Jesus will pay her bills
Chelsea Welch (http://www.guardian.co.uk/profile/chelsea-welch)



http://1.2.3.9/bmi/static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2013/2/1/1359730849277/Applebees_receipt_460.jpg
A customer at an Applebee's restaurant in St. Louis left no tip and a note saying, "I give God 10%. Why do you get 18?"



I was a waitress at Applebee's restaurant in Saint Louis. I was fired Wednesday for posting a picture on Reddit.com (http://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/comments/17i382/my_mistake_sir_im_sure_jesus_will_pay_for_my_rent/)of a note a customer left on a bill. I posted it on the web as a light-hearted joke.
This didn't even happen at my table. The note was left for another server, who allowed me to take a picture of it at the end of the night.
Someone had scribbled on the receipt, "I give God 10%. Why do you get 18?"
I assumed the customer's signature was illegible, but I quickly started receiving messages containing Facebook profile links and websites, asking me to confirm the identity of the customer. I refused to confirm any of them, and all were incorrect.
I worked with the Reddit (http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/reddit) moderators to remove any personal information. I wanted to protect the identity of both my fellow server and the customer. I had no intention of starting a witch-hunt or hurting anyone.
Now I've been fired.
The person who wrote the note came across an article about it, called the Applebee's location, and demanded everyone be fired -- me, the server who allowed me to take the picture, the manager on duty at the time, the manager not on duty at the time, everyone. It seems I was fired not because Applebee's was represented poorly, not because I did anything illegal or against company policy, but because I embarrassed this person.
In light of the situation, I would like to make a statement on behalf of wait staff everywhere: We make $3.50 an hour. Most of my paychecks are less than pocket change because I have to pay taxes on the tips I make.
After sharing my tips with hosts, bussers, and bartenders, I make less than $9 an hour on average, before taxes. I am expected to skip bathroom breaks if we are busy. I go hungry all day if I have several busy tables to work. I am expected to work until 1:30am and then come in again at 10:30am to open the restaurant.
I have worked 12-hour double shifts without a chance to even sit down. I am expected to portray a canned personality that has been found to be least offensive to the greatest amount of people. And I am expected to do all of this, every day, and receive change, or even nothing, in return. After all that, I can be fired for "embarrassing" someone, who directly insults his or her server on religious grounds.
In this economy, $3.50 an hour doesn't cut it. I can't pay half my bills. Like many, I would love to see a reasonable, non-tip-dependent wage system for service workers like they have in other countries. But the system being flawed is not an excuse for not paying for services rendered.
I need tips to pay my bills. All waiters do. We spend an hour or more of our time befriending you, making you laugh, getting to know you, and making your dining experience the best it can be. We work hard. We care. We deserve to be paid for that.
I am trying to stand up for all of us who work for just a few dollars an hour at places like Applebee's. Whether a chain steakhouse or a black-tie establishment, tipping is not optional. It is how we get paid.
I posted a picture to make people laugh, but now I want to make a serious point: Things like this happen to servers all the time. People seem to think that the easiest way to save money on a night out is to skip the tip.
I can't understand why I was fired over this. I was well liked and respected at Applebee's. My sales were high, my managers had no problems with me, and I was even hoping to move up to management soon. When I posted this, I didn't represent Applebee's in a bad light. In fact, I didn't represent them at all.
I did my best to protect the identity of all parties involved. I didn't break any specific guidelines in the company handbook – I checked. But because this person got embarrassed that their selfishness was made public, Applebee's has made it clear that they would rather lose a dedicated employee than an angry customer. That's a policy I can't understand.
I am equally baffled about how a religious tithe is in any way related to paying for services at a restaurant. I can understand why someone could be upset with an automatic gratuity. However, it's a plainly stated Applebee's policy that a tip is added automatically for parties over eight like the one this customer was part of. I cannot control that kind of tip; it's done by the computer that the orders are put into. I've been stiffed on tips before, but this is the first time I've seen the "Big Man" used as reasoning.
Obviously the person who wrote this note wanted it seen by someone. It's strange that now that the audience is wider than just the server, the person is ashamed.
I have no agenda here. I seek no revenge against the note writer. I have no interest in exposing their identity, and, at this point, I'm not even sure I want my job back. I was just trying to make a joke, but I came home unemployed.
I've been waiting tables to save up some money so I could finally go to college, so I could get an education that would qualify me for a job that doesn't force me to sell my personality for pocket change.
While this story has garnered immense media attention, my story is not uncommon. Bad tips and harsh notes are all part of the job. People get fired to keep customers happy every day.
As this story has gotten popular, I've received inquiries as to where people can send money to support me. As a broke kid trying to get into college, it's certainly appealing, but I'd really rather you make a difference to your next server. I'd rather you keep that money and that generosity for the next time you eat out.
Editor's note: Chelsea added the final two paragraphs at 2:30pm EST on Friday.




http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/feb/01/fired-applebees-waitress-needs-tips

[Prospero]

I think it is a disgraceful commercial practice where restaurants believe that the salaries of their staff should depend upon tips. Staff should be paid a decent wage.

Many restaurants now include a service charge on the bill. It is claimed that this is divided up between staff. I've no idea if this is true.

I would like to see serving staff paid properly and then, if they do a decent (or even better an excellent) job get tips on top, directly from customers which they get to keep.

[Willie Escalade]

I always tip...even when the service is not up,to par (I consider why). Why? Because I used to be a server in a restaurant and I know what they're going through. I actually usually OVER-tip...even more if the service was extraordinary. Yes, I was payed the minimum wage as well (I worked at an M&M Soul Food restaurant).

Damn shame...I LIKE Applebee's.

And from my experience, church people are some of the worst customers...ESPECIALLY on a Sunday. That's coming from both being a server AND as a customer in a restaurant with them. See story above.

[Quiet Reflections]

I always tip at least 20 percent if the service is decent. The restaurant had every right to fire the girl for posting a customers personal info online but the customer was wrong for not going to the manager about bad service if that was the case. Mandatory tips are silly anyway and if the service is bad I make sure it isn't added to my bill.

[amberskyi]

I always tip at least 20 percent if the service is decent. The restaurant had every right to fire the girl for posting a customers personal info online but the customer was wrong for not going to the manager about bad service if that was the case. Mandatory tips are silly anyway and if the service is bad I make sure it isn't added to my bill.

Wow mandatory typing is bad even tho that person is making 3.50 an hour? Lmao okay

[BigDF]

I always tip at least 20% because I've dated waitresses in the past and my wife is a restaurant cook. She makes pretty good money, since she is paid a living wage. A good waitress can make nearly what she makes at this restaurant, because most of the customers are local and know the staff well. A place like Applebees though is different and while I'm not surprised this person was fired, I think the management overreacted to the situation. The customer in question was obviously an idiot, as his note indicated.

[Acron]

I tipped in China and they didnt have a problem. I just heard you dont tip in some Asian countries before you eat or anything because the quality you get might not be as good as what your tip would suggest it is.

I got a shock at just how much tipping goes on in America. Not saying its wrong or anything but its so much different to England.

[Prospero]

I tip 99 per cent of the time too - the only exceptions being if I have had totally lousy service, or rudeness from my server (I once had a stand up row with the owner of a restaurant when I sent a dish back because the food was badly off. He told me no one else had complained... which was hardly a defence! ) But I still tipped the server.

But despite that they should NOT depend upon tips to make a living.

France seems to have the system right where service is automatically compris. But then being a waiter or waitress is considered a real profession there.

[Stavros]

I was puzzled by the author's claim that her minimum wage was $3.50 an hour and checked online; apparently the US Federal Minimum wage should be $7.25 but obviously many employers do not pay this. Even $5 an hour should be considered an insult, and its not good saying they make extra on top if this woman was mostly making $9 an hour.

In the UK the official minimum wage is £6.19 for workers over 21 which is $9.73; it goes down to £4.98 if a worker is between 18-20 ($7.83); £3.68 for under-18's ($5.78) and £2.65 for apprenticeships ($4.16).

In France the official minumum wage is E9.40 ($12.70) and in Japan ranges from between 618-739 Yen (($6.63-$7.93).

In Norway, Sweden, Germany and Switzerland there are no official minimum wages other than in some professions, but they have strong union representation and collective bargaining with employers.

I don't mind tipping for good service, but I think the basic wage should be a living wage -tipping is supposed to be an Extra, not a compensation for the employer's parsimony.

[kmersh]

I tip anywhere between 15%-20% in the USA depending on the type of service and restaurant I am dinning in.

In Europe I generally leave a tip if the service was good to excellent but usually just a Euro or two. I lived in Switzerland for a while and at least in Switzerland I am told that servers go to school to learn their profession and are paid a salary by the restaurant.

In the USA servers are generally not trained beyond whatever the specific restaurant offers and thus the belief that they can be paid less than minimum wage. I am not sure that I agree with that practice, but it is what it is.
k

[RallyCola]

i saw this story and found i quite funny because i am one to leave notes on bills as well. then when i saw that she was fired, i believe that applebees showed that a $34 customer is more important to them than good PR. They should have stuck by their employee AND their policy of adding gratuity to bills of large parties. Perhaps her error was leaving the customer's name/signature on the bill but still, dismissal was excessive.

Now, as for tipping. I tip well when deserved and I tip poorly when deserved. I start at 15% and go up or down if I am impressed or depressed with the service. The largest tip I have ever left was somewhere around 40% of the bill because I know that I drank much more than that for free. I have never left $0 for a tip because when service is horrid...nothing gets your point across like a penny. Leaving no tip could mean you are just cheap and don't tip. Leaving a penny as a tip and a note about the terrible service gets a manager to look at the ticket and the employee.

[TSPornFan]

People should not have to tip. We tip because these companies are legally allowed to pay these people awful wages. Our representatives should change the law and make these greedy companies pay better wages.

[RallyCola]

People should not have to tip. We tip because these companies are legally allowed to pay these people awful wages. Our representatives should change the law and make these greedy companies pay better wages.

PEOPLE DO NOT HAVE TO TIP. It isn't required, just expected.

it figures you'd say something like this.

[amberskyi]

PEOPLE DO NOT HAVE TO TIP. It isn't required, just expected.

it figures you'd say something like this.

What exactly is wrong with the point he's trying to make? He's basically saying that they should pay waiters/waitresses more so they don't have to survive off of tips (cause there's people like you who don't think it's mandatory).no one can live off of $3 dollars a hour and that's pretty much the standard wage for a waiter in the us.
It doesn't really surprise me tho that in this shit country we not only pay the people who serve us shit but give them shit for expecting a tip.

[Jericho]

I find the idea of tipping distasteful, especially when it's expected.
Pay people a living wage!

[Jericho]

Also, whom do you tip?
Your waitress, cab driver, the guy who carries your bags to your hotel room?
what about the guy who picks up your garbage, your postman, bus drivers, do you tip them?

[RallyCola]

What exactly is wrong with the point he's trying to make? He's basically saying that they should pay waiters/waitresses more so they don't have to survive off of tips (cause there's people like you who don't think it's mandatory).no one can live off of $3 dollars a hour and that's pretty much the standard wage for a waiter in the us.
It doesn't really surprise me tho that in this shit country we not only pay the people who serve us shit but give them shit for expecting a tip.


i subscribe to the theory that employers pay you just enough money so you don't quit. if your incentive in the service industry is to exceed a customer's expectations because your pay is dependent on it, you may be more motivated to go a good job. waitresses, devoid of the need for a tip, would be inclined to offer little more customer service than the check out girl at mcdonalds.

amber...as a person who provides a service to others and may likely be tipped...i can't see why you don't see how this is a much better alternative to paying higher wages and negating tips all together. the best waitresses at the finest restaurants can pull in a ridiculous amt tax free

it is no different than a real estate broker or car salesman...pay is dependent on performance. it's the way it should be. his point is stupid. a tip is nothing more than "commission pay" over base

[Prospero]

Tips? Yes, to Garbage collectors at Christmas (or they strew all your Rubbish across the garden), window cleaners, milkman, postman, the paperboy..... and in hotels yes, the bellboy and the porter who carries your luggage, and room service and the maid. cabbies.

Anyone on here who has ever frequented female escorts in London will also be familiar with the 'something for the maid" thing too - a tip you're more or less obliged to ay upfront for the old gal who shows you to the escort. Not encountered that in years.

I'm with Rallycola on tipping in restaurants. A derisory tip for wretched service does get the point over... but as I said earlier restaurateurs should pay their stuff a decent wage.

[RallyCola]

oh...i never "tip" escorts. that's where i draw the line. i will tip someone who is working for a company and whose wages are largely out of their control except for going above and beyond the expected level of service. independent contractors who set their own rates are not people who should be tipped, IMHO. having never visited a brothel and only indie girls, i've never had to tip the maid so to speak.

[RallyCola]

... but as I said earlier restaurateurs should pay their stuff a decent wage.

what is a decent wage?

the federal minimum wage is $7.25. Even if you triple it...i wouldn't consider that a decent wage. you need to pay people commensurate with their skills and education and more importantly how easily replaceable they are. If tomorrow, a waitress decided she would only work for Applebees for $10 an hour, plus tips...the sad fact is that there are people who would undercut her and and do it for less. There will always be more people in need of a job than there are jobs available.

I don't think restaurants are under any pressure to increase wages. they are under pressure to ensure the restaurant is full and profitable because then the hourly wage they pay their servers is completely inconsequential. Only when restaurants suck and no one wants to go there, can the hourly wage be important.

[trish]

Restaurants in the US do not pay their employees a living wage, let alone the legal minimum wage for other jobs. At least the staff who wait on tables can supplement their income with tips (the general rule is 20%). The waiters and waitresses are not responsible for the ambiance, the food, the conversation at the table next to yours, what's playing on the juke box or the TV etc., yet their tips often suffer should any of these prove annoying. Cooks are often paid very low salaries as well and even when the food is very good they are never tipped. Owners are out to make a buck, and if it means stepping on the backs of their workers so be it.

[trish]

I heard this story being discussed on NPR yesterday as I was driving home. It seems the customer is suing because his receipt, showing his signature, was photocopied and posted on the internet. The claim is that his signature is personal and protected by privacy laws. Can that be? Isn't your signature a facet of your public face? You sign public petitions, contracts, checks, etc. A signature is usually taken to be a public proof of one's private identity.

[TSPornFan]

i subscribe to the theory that employers pay you just enough money so you don't quit. if your incentive in the service industry is to exceed a customer's expectations because your pay is dependent on it, you may be more motivated to go a good job. waitresses, devoid of the need for a tip, would be inclined to offer little more customer service than the check out girl at mcdonalds.

amber...as a person who provides a service to others and may likely be tipped...i can't see why you don't see how this is a much better alternative to paying higher wages and negating tips all together. the best waitresses at the finest restaurants can pull in a ridiculous amt tax free

it is no different than a real estate broker or car salesman...pay is dependent on performance. it's the way it should be. his point is stupid. a tip is nothing more than "commission pay" over base

You need to look at why people work at these jobs. These jobs may be their only option. People work crappy jobs because its the best option they have at the moment.

America says it is the land of opportunity. Yes, it is the land of opportunity for the rich. Most people die in the same class they were born in. The American Dream doesn't exist. It's a joke. America is full of inequality. America is one of the most unequal nations on Earth.

[Jericho]

Tips? Yes, to Garbage collectors at Christmas (or they strew all your Rubbish across the garden), window cleaners, milkman, postman, the paperboy..... and in hotels yes, the bellboy and the porter who carries your luggage, and room service and the maid. cabbies.

Apparently, Postmen aren't allowed to accept tips (i always make sure mine gets a bottle at xmas..He goes above and beyond).

But the binmen can fuck right off, lazy bunch of cunts!
Was a time, they'd come up the drive, take the shite down, then bring the bin back up. Now, i have to sort the rubbish out, carry it down to the bottom of the drive, then go hunting around the street for my bin because they're too fukkin lazy to put it back where they found it...FUCK 'EM!

[RallyCola]

You need to look at why people work at these jobs. These jobs may be their only option. People work crappy jobs because its the best option they have at the moment.

America says it is the land of opportunity. Yes, it is the land of opportunity for the rich. Most people die in the same class they were born in. The American Dream doesn't exist. It's a joke. America is full of inequality. America is one of the most unequal nations on Earth.

That is the biggest load of horse shit. that is the attitude of a defeatist and someone that wants to blame everyone other than themselves for their predicament. yes, america isn't a fair place and having money makes life a lot easier, but moving about the class system is not difficult if you are not afraid of hard work.

if you work at a job because it is your only option...then that's the job you deserve.

my parents' combined gross income was 40k a year when i was a child. they struggled to pay rent in a shitty apt in jackson heights queens and never owned a new car or fancy labels on their clothes. presently, i earn significantly more than that because i paid attention in school and i'm still just a fellow.

though it is true that many people are grossly overpaid and over valued, far less are really underpaid or under valued. if you earn 50k a year but think you should earn 150k...you are probably not realistic about your own potential. you may think you are undervalued, but the market doesn't so stop your bitching or do something about it.

other than students working their way through school or developmentally/physically disabled people...if you are a person in a low income position, you've done something wrong in life.

[Prospero]

I agree Jericho re bin men but woe betide you if you don't 'bribe" i.e. tip them. They actually come knock and my door and ask for a tip.

[TSPornFan]

That is the biggest load of horse shit. that is the attitude of a defeatist and someone that wants to blame everyone other than themselves for their predicament.

if you work at a job because it is your only option...then that's the job you deserve.

my parents' combined gross income was 40k a year and i presently earn significantly more than that because i paid attention in school and i'm still just a fellow.

though it is true that many people are grossly overpaid and over valued, far less are really underpaid or under valued. if you earn 50k a year but think you should earn 150k...you are probably not realistic about your own potential.

other than students working their way through school or developmentally/physically disabled people...if you are a person in a low income position, you've done something wrong in life.

I'm normally nice to people. Dude, you're an asshole. A person's social status does not mean they made mistakes in their lives. In America, your social class determines the quality of your education. In America, your race determines your pay.

There are many college graduates who are working at these low wage jobs because these jobs are their only option. Is that their fault? NO. You can't make a "job creator" hire you.

People need to stop blaming the poor for being poor. People need to look at our social structures because our culture, government, structure, and society are the problems.

[RallyCola]

I agree Jericho re bin men but woe betide you if you don't 'bribe" i.e. tip them. They actually come knock and my door and ask for a tip.

really? i have never tipped the garbage men. when we had our co-op, we tipped the handymen and porters in general, whose responsibilities including collecting garbage among other things. it has never crossed my mind to tip the guys in the truck.

here in NYC, a garbage man starts at 34K a year as a base before overtime and ends up at near 70K by 5.5 years in. that's enough money for a job where your only skills is to drive a truck and pick up heavy dirty things.

[Jericho]

I agree Jericho re bin men but woe betide you if you don't 'bribe" i.e. tip them. They actually come knock and my door and ask for a tip.


Yer kidding?
Cheeky fukkers!
If they tried that around here, they'd get the tip of some fukkers boot up their arse! :ignore:

[Prospero]

I know Rally, but if you live in NYC then. unless you have a brownstone or out in the burbs (certainly in Manhattan) you're probably in an apartment building where you never have any contact with these guys. Its all doormen and janitors. But, as you know, outside of Britain's city centres, most everyone lives in their own houses - with drives and front paths etc - and we all have a more direct relationship with the garbage collectors, mailmen, etc etc. They come onto your property - so you don't want them dropping bins and crap on the roses or whatever.

I was unaware you postmen were not supposed to accept tips. Mine has never refused (and he is a good guy anyway.)

[Prospero]

Well I live in a more genteel neighbourhood than "the corner booth at titty twister."

[RallyCola]

I'm normally nice to people. Dude, you're an asshole. A person's social status does not mean they made mistakes in their lives. In America, your social class determines the quality of your education. In America, your race determines your pay.

There are many college graduates who are working at these low wage jobs because these jobs are their only option. Is that their fault? NO. You can't make a "job creator" hire you.

People need to stop blaming the poor for being poor. People need to look at our social structures because our culture, government, structure, and society are the problems.

lol...the fucking race card. you are just a walking cliche aren't you.

1st off...i am an asshole and an elitist. i did not come from money but will never begrudge anyone what they have. anyone at any time can make the best of a situation.

there is one huge fallacy about a college degree, i will admit. just getting one doesn't mean you are qualified for anything. doing well, networking, getting an advanced degree...these are keys to success...not just getting your degree.

please stop blaming anyone but yourself for your short comings and stop having a chip on your shoulder. if you are not receiving waiver services, its all up to you, and only you to make them most of your potential.

[RallyCola]

for the record, i am NOT saying that a rich white straight man doesn't have a ludicrous advantage over a black lesbian midget born into an impoverished family but this society offers that woman the best chance of changing her situation among anything globally.

you cannot fault anyone for what they are born into...you can only fault someone for what they do with what they have.

let us be clear on one thing as well...i respect only educated people. when i say i am an elitist, it pertains to intellect and skill. i don't care about how much money you have because it is meaningless. i didn't go to the ivy league...i went to rutgers and new jersey medical school. i still have a better h-index than my cohorts and am a fellow at columbia. that's the son of doorman and bank teller who doesn't knew i would never be pigeonholed by my parent's race and social status

[TSPornFan]

lol...the fucking race card. you are just a walking cliche aren't you.
QUOTE]

You're very ignorant. I doubt you have an education. It is commonly known that minorities are paid less than whites because of their race. Minorities have less opportunities than whites.

[QUOTE=RallyCola;1272265]for the record, i am NOT saying that a rich white straight man doesn't have a ludicrous advantage over a black lesbian midget born into an impoverished family but this society offers that woman the best chance of changing her situation among anything globally.

you cannot fault anyone for what they are born into...you can only fault someone for what they do with what they have.

let us be clear on one thing as well...i respect only educated people. when i say i am an elitist, it pertains to intellect and skill. i don't care about how much money you have because it is meaningless. i didn't go to the ivy league...i went to rutgers and new jersey medical school. i still have a better h-index than my cohorts and am a fellow at columbia. that's the son of doorman and bank teller who doesn't knew i would never be pigeonholed by my parent's race and social status

That is what you're saying.

This society doesn't offer women the best chance of changing their situation. This society makes life worse on women. They are paid less than men. The police rarely gives a damn about women when they are rape. Most single women work minimal wage jobs. Most men do not pay child support. No, life in America is worse for women then it is for me.

[Jericho]

Well I live in a more genteel neighbourhood than "the corner booth at titty twister."


Don't start that shite with me, you overpadded southern softie! :tongue:

But seriously, no, it's a Royal Mail thing, posties aren't allowed to accept tips.
But obviously, if you're not telling anyone, they're not going to.

Tho as for the binmen...fuck 'em!

[RallyCola]

[quote=RallyCola;1272253]lol...the fucking race card. you are just a walking cliche aren't you.
QUOTE]

You're very ignorant. I doubt you have an education. It is commonly known that minorities are paid less than whites because of their race. Minorities have less opportunities than whites.



That is what you're saying.

This society doesn't offer women the best chance of changing their situation. This society makes life worse on women. They are paid less than men. The police rarely gives a damn about women when they are rape. Most single women work minimal wage jobs. Most men do not pay child support. No, life in America is worse for women then it is for me.


i'm not disputing that minorities are paid less. i'm saying i don't care. if a white guy in my department is making more than me, its unfair and illegal, but it's not his fault for accepting what he is offered. you are comparing apples to apples there...2 people of "equal" qualifications, test scores, whatever.

you however are going overboard by comparing someone who is a waiter to someone that is a garbage man to someone what is an accountant. they are all quit different and have varying social value. garbage men are necessary because we would have trash built up around us or lines at the dump if we had to go there individually. Accountants and waitresses are needless jobs and easily replaceable. Neither is integral to your daily life as you can go to a buffet and serve yourself or eat at home, or you can do your own taxes. The difference is that the accountant may deserve more respect for his achievements and abilities.

Here is how you can determine how important any person is in your life, and therefore determine the amount of respect they deserve for the position they occupy: how easy can you train their replacement? using that judgement allows me to not give 2 shits about a person's race or social status because that's an apples to apples comparison.

[Dino Velvet]

I wish my mailman and garbage man switched jobs. Everything would be delivered and taken away much better.

[RallyCola]

I wish my mailman and garbage man switched jobs. Everything would be delivered and taken away much better.

lol...that might in fact be true. good call.

[amberskyi]

i subscribe to the theory that employers pay you just enough money so you don't quit. if your incentive in the service industry is to exceed a customer's expectations because your pay is dependent on it, you may be more motivated to go a good job. waitresses, devoid of the need for a tip, would be inclined to offer little more customer service than the check out girl at mcdonalds.

amber...as a person who provides a service to others and may likely be tipped...i can't see why you don't see how this is a much better alternative to paying higher wages and negating tips all together. the best waitresses at the finest restaurants can pull in a ridiculous amt tax free

it is no different than a real estate broker or car salesman...pay is dependent on performance. it's the way it should be. his point is stupid. a tip is nothing more than "commission pay" over base

im not going to compare my situation to that of an waitress.while i may get tipped i dont depend on tips to eat and im sure as hell not making 3 bucks an hour.
i think tipping in restaurants is mandatory because i know what these waiters are making.i have a flat rate i tip if the service is mediocre and i may tip more is service was excellent.ive rarely never tipped and the only times that has happened was because the service was beyond horrible.

[RallyCola]

im not going to compare my situation to that of an waitress.while i may get tipped i dont depend on tips to eat and im sure as hell not making 3 bucks an hour.
i think tipping in restaurants is mandatory because i know what these waiters are making.i have a flat rate i tip if the service is mediocre and i may tip more is service was excellent.ive rarely never tipped and the only times that has happened was because the service was beyond horrible.

tipping is never mandatory though...it is voluntary and customary but nevertheless, you should never feel as if you MUST tip a certain amount.

i don't really care about the base pay of a particular person. they will be given a tip commensurate with their level of service and how much I value their contribution to my experience.

if base pay was what was important, then that person shouldn't be a waitress. they are working for tips, not that little hourly check. they knew the job when they took it.

i dated a girl in undergrad that worked with kids with autism. daily, she was hit, had feces smeared on her, etc and she did this as a direct care worker for $10 a hour. where was her tip? she was a caregiver for people who put there kids in group homes because they didn't want to take care of them. how many of you would wipe the ass of some disabled kid spitting on you for $10 a hour to put food on the table or buy textbooks. so please, spare me about the poor waitress who can earn money tax free.

[amberskyi]

tipping is never mandatory though...it is voluntary and customary but nevertheless, you should never feel as if you MUST tip a certain amount.

i don't really care about the base pay of a particular person. they will be given a tip commensurate with their level of service and how much I value their contribution to my experience.

if base pay was what was important, then that person shouldn't be a waitress. they are working for tips, not that little hourly check. they knew the job when they took it.

i dated a girl in undergrad that worked with kids with autism. daily, she was hit, had feces smeared on her, etc and she did this as a direct care worker for $10 a hour. where was her tip? she was a caregiver for people who put there kids in group homes because they didn't want to take care of them. how many of you would wipe the ass of some disabled kid spitting on you for $10 a hour to put food on the table or buy textbooks. so please, spare me about the poor waitress who can earn money tax free.

your an awesome person full of compassion and empathy i see

[RallyCola]

your an awesome person full of compassion and empathy i see

i am in fact an awesome person, but devoid of empathy. but that's far off from the original topic.

while we are on the original topic...is anyone joining in on the boycott of applebees in support of the fired server? i haven't been to an applebees in 4 years or so...but i don't like the way they caved so easily because a receipt of a photo went viral. their policy was to add 18% to large party bills..its on their menu...the customer should have brought the issue up with the manager, not make a comment on a bill then complain when they are made fun of. clearly, this cunty pastor bitch can dish it out but can't take it.

[Anubis1779]

I actually went as far as sending Applebee's an email b/c their cowardice pissed me off so much, not that I expect a reply, but to tell them they can guarantee I will never give them a dime of my money and will bad mouth them to all my friends and family. It's pathetic that the bitch pastor got all pissed off b/c they called her out on her bullshit and wanted everyone fired. I worked in restaurants for enough years that I make sure I take care of servers every time I eat out, 20% is minimum, and I tip $5 on anything less than $20 just because they work the same amount to take care of me when I feel like eating cheap as they would when I'm eating big. Fuck Applebee's and fuck pastor Alois Bell.

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow/applebees-defends-firing-waitress-pastor-receipt-192100973.html

[stan.smith]

I think tipping is one of those "to each his own" situations. a lot of factors can be taken into consideration such as service provided, quality of food and drinks and lets not forget the customers financial situation. i strongly believe that restaurants should not be allowed to add a tip already to the bill. and personally for me i think 18% is too much.

[RallyCola]

I actually went as far as sending Applebee's an email b/c their cowardice pissed me off so much, not that I expect a reply, but to tell them they can guarantee I will never give them a dime of my money and will bad mouth them to all my friends and family. It's pathetic that the bitch pastor got all pissed off b/c they called her out on her bullshit and wanted everyone fired. I worked in restaurants for enough years that I make sure I take care of servers every time I eat out, 20% is minimum, and I tip $5 on anything less than $20 just because they work the same amount to take care of me when I feel like eating cheap as they would when I'm eating big. Fuck Applebee's and fuck pastor Alois Bell.

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow/applebees-defends-firing-waitress-pastor-receipt-192100973.html

:iagree: people should boycott so the can feel pressure from more than just one customer

[RallyCola]

I think tipping is one of those "to each his own" situations. a lot of factors can be taken into consideration such as service provided, quality of food and drinks and lets not forget the customers financial situation. i strongly believe that restaurants should not be allowed to add a tip already to the bill. and personally for me i think 18% is too much.


i see your point in so far as you don't want it added to the bill automatically but the point is that it is the advertised policy to do so and you were advised of it going into the transaction. at that point, you need to ask the manager to take care of the situation, not take it upon yourself to lecture a waitress following established company protocol then call for her dismissal when she points out how big of a cunt you are.

anyone else find it ironic that this cunty pastor couldn't FORGIVE the waitress for her sin?

[ed_jaxon]

I tip anywhere from 15% to 20% depending on the service.

The one time I stiffed a waitress was in a buffet. Now normally you leave a couple of bucks even though they don't serve you anything but drinks but this time I had no change.

I walked out and did not leave a tip rationalizing it in my mind that tips are for service of food.

I'll be damned if I did not leave my damned phone on the table and while normally I get things back in situations like this, this time I did not. I chalked it up to karma and from then on I always tip well no matter what.

[Jericho]

I think tipping is one of those "to each his own" situations. a lot of factors can be taken into consideration such as service provided, quality of food and drinks and lets not forget the customers financial situation. i strongly believe that restaurants should not be allowed to add a tip already to the bill. and personally for me i think 18% is too much.

Now see, quality of food and drinks

How does the waitress have any control over that?
She could be the best waitress in the world, but the food and drink are still shite...Her fault, spank her tip?

It's a vile iniquitous practice that needs stamping out!

[stan.smith]

Now see, quality of food and drinks

How does the waitress have any control over that?
She could be the best waitress in the world, but the food and drink are still shite...Her fault, spank her tip?

It's a vile iniquitous practice that needs stamping out!

when i say food and drinks i mean more over the drinks not so much food because out of tip you give the bartender and the person who sits u down gets u all comfortable they get a cut. the so called "chefs" dont get tips as far as corporate restaurants are concerned. ive worked at one of these corporate chains before lol

[stan.smith]

i see your point in so far as you don't want it added to the bill automatically but the point is that it is the advertised policy to do so and you were advised of it going into the transaction. at that point, you need to ask the manager to take care of the situation, not take it upon yourself to lecture a waitress following established company protocol then call for her dismissal when she points out how big of a cunt you are.

anyone else find it ironic that this cunty pastor couldn't FORGIVE the waitress for her sin?

of course cant argue when its advertised. i rem when i was living in miami for a short while all the restaurants in south beach had an 18% gratuity on the bill and i specifically remembered that not being advertised lol. classic touch on the pastor couldn't FORGIVE the waitress btw!!!

[Stavros]

All I would add is that the pastor said 'I give God 10%..' whereas one would hope any Pastor gives God 100%. I think its clear from the posts that most people think waiting staff are poorly paid, but it seems to me that wages across the USA and across many professions have failed to keep pace with the rise in the cost of living -I believe the generally low wages now paid in the US are also part of the cause of your sluggish economy. The Bush era tax cuts were supposed to release capital for entrepreneurs to invest in businesses, creating jobs, whereas they just disadvantaged most Americans. The logic suggests the average American should have a wage increase, have more money to spend on their mortgage, their children's education, purchasing goods in shops -and eating out occasionally....

[sukumvit boy]

Having once been in the restaurant,nightclub business I always try to tip 15%-20% or more. They really have to be a total fuck-up to get stiffed by me.

[wiltthestilt]

There ought to a mandatory 15% service charge. This is not a "gratuity." It is a charge. The extra 5% or whatever you give should be contingent on service.

[dskreet2]

In my opinion, whatever product or service you are selling, the price a customer pays should cover ALL BUSINESS RELATED COSTS, Profit, and sales taxes charged by the government.(period!!!) There should not be any service fees, hidden costs, etc. When that business reports income on its tax return, they are not reporting all those separate fees/charges, they are showing GROSS INCOME!!! The taxes are deducted as a business expense.

Gratuity is gratuity, and should only be a mandatory minimum with large parties that require extra service.

Service Fees, etc are NOTHING but a SCAM!!!

[NRT]

does this scene explains it?

Reservoir Dogs - Tips For The Tippers - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=enJwYaeolXc)

[fivekatz]

Having once been in the restaurant,nightclub business I always try to tip 15%-20% or more. They really have to be a total fuck-up to get stiffed by me.Agreed.

[Jericho]

does this scene explains it?



Fuk, I'd forgotten just how good that film was.
I'm going to go watch it right now!

[Tarik Abaddon]

Man, I came into this thinking about that Reservoir Dogs scene but NRT beat me to it. I think Mr Pink sums it up pretty well.

Tipping is fine if the service deserves it but just assuming that a tip will be given even if you're a terrible server is ridiculous.

Also have to agree with what others were saying about the abysmal wages waiters are paid, but then the minimum wage is pathetic as it is and is certainly not enough.

[Willie Escalade]

Having once been in the restaurant,nightclub business I always try to tip 15%-20% or more. They really have to be a total fuck-up to get stiffed by me.


Agreed.

Same here.

[Remy757Photog]

I use to be a cab driver (4 & 1/2 years), and while I never expected a tip (knowing the human condition) when I did receive one it really made my day at best (2 separate occasions tipped $100) and would at least put a smile on my face ($1-$5). In my book every little bit helps, and so I've always gone with if you are servicing me I'm going to leave a minimum $5-10 tip and usually around $20. I will admit that I don't usually do the math and give the exact percentage though.

[Castor_Troy05]

While I usually do tip in most instances, I prefer it to be at my discretion. Not being from the US where it's expected I believe, I usually tip between 10-15% depending on the quality of service received.

I tip cab drivers too but never service employees like garbage men and postmen. Especially as I'm the one who does everything except press the button on the garbage truck to put it in there. The postmen down under ride motorbikes right up to your mailbox so again, no reason to tip there either

[robertlouis]

I'll give a larger tip when even although the service might not have been that great, it's clear that the waiter or waitress has been doing their level best in an overworked place. However, if food is under or overcooked or otherwise unsatisfactory, I'll make my point politely and am unlikely to tip.

Here in the UK the best service is usually to be found in Asian or Indian restaurants. The rule of thumb is the higher the price, the worse the service, and if the place has pretensions, just get a takeaway.

[BeardedOne]

I was unaware you postmen were not supposed to accept tips. Mine has never refused (and he is a good guy anyway.)

In the US the posties are allowed to accept 'gifts' so long as they are under a certain value. Many of the carriers and clerks where I work might get something around the holidays as a recognition of good service and less than surly behaviour. Sometimes it is a gift card for one of the local stores or a small food item, but rarely cash. It's never expected and always appreciated. The carriers like Newman from Seinfeld and Elmer from Funny Farm are consistently ignored at these times and often bitch about how 'cheap' their customers are.


There ought to a mandatory 15% service charge. This is not a "gratuity." It is a charge. The extra 5% or whatever you give should be contingent on service.

Most chain restaurants and larger independents will add 15-20% automatically if it is a party of six or more. That's what happened with the Applebee's check in this nonsense (And the pastor and her group asked for separate checks to try and get out of it, as can be seen in the amounts on the offending check). So, not only is the 'pastor' a bitch, but a cheating cunt as well.


I use to be a cab driver (4 & 1/2 years), and while I never expected a tip (knowing the human condition) when I did receive one it really made my day at best (2 separate occasions tipped $100) and would at least put a smile on my face ($1-$5). In my book every little bit helps, and so I've always gone with if you are servicing me I'm going to leave a minimum $5-10 tip and usually around $20. I will admit that I don't usually do the math and give the exact percentage though.

Remy, you and I have to trade tales some day. I drove taxicrabs for four years in Boston and limos in Boston, Philly, NY, and DC. Our cabs operated on a 50% meter commission, but in Boston proper most were leased and every penny counted. I always gave the best service, fastest/most comfortable ride I could and was rewarded accordingly. I never complained about the amount of a tip (One regular always tipped a shiny new quarter, the same tip he'd given to the driver every day since the 1920s, never adjusted for inflation and rising cab fares) and never stressed over it. I must have been doing something right, as my tips often paid the rent when the fare split didn't.

That said:

I've seen two things throughout the thread that have not been clarified. One being that restaurant servers aren't getting the legal minimum wage. The painful truth is that they ARE getting the legal minimum wage for servers. The current Pennsylvania minimum wage is $7.25 an hour but is only $2.83 per hour for tipped employees. This is on par with minimum wage in other states/nationally. There is fine print in the PA law that states that an employer is supposed to make up any difference between that minimum + tips that doesn't meet or exceed the $7.25 amount, but I've never known an employer to do that (One would assume that the tips for an hour's work would usually exceed the minimum).

The other inaccuracy is the claim that tips are 'tax free'. While gratuities make up a significant part of the underground economy they are NOT 'tax free'. Employees are expected to claim their tips to the employer to be reported in their weekly income. If no tips are reported, some employers will insert an estimated amount, based on some formula of hours worked, or leave the slot blank and leave it up to the IRS to come knocking on the employee's door later down the road. And trust me, the IRS is one, nasty mistress and will err on the high side in any kind of income discrepancy audit. If someone claims income from a tipped profession (Restaurant server, transportation, hotel, etc.) and doesn't show some reasonable amount under the gratuities section the little red lights start flashing at the IRS.

[Antonpbar]

I tip anywhere inbetween 5 and 15 percent and only on a few occasions not tipped at all when service was terrible.

Over here in the UK minimum wage is flat depending on what age you are no matter what job you do, that said one of my friends worked at Frankie and Bennys and could get £30-£50 for a 6 hour shift just in tips.

On the flip side I am a telecoms engineer and am completely forbidden to take tips of any kind other than a cup of tea/coffee and at a push a biscuit.

One thing i remember about when i spent time in the USA me and a three of my collegues went out to eat, we had just finished a late shift and all of us still wore our military uniforms. When time came to pay for the Bill the waitress told us someone at another table had already paid for it in a way of saying thank-you to how we helped out as he put it "our boys". We where flattered and very greatfull of this, but because we at that time were on food allowance we decided to give all the money we would have spent to the waitress in tips (roughly 140 dollars as we all had steaks and beers etc) she asked us are we sure so we told her she had to take it, and ofcourse for the next couple of months until we left for the UK we tipped well and got excellent service every time.

[Audrina.Marie]

I wait tables at the moment in the U.S. and let me tell you leaving a note on the check doesn't get a managers attention like one put it. No management ever sees a signed check unless that costumer calls in to dispute something and they need to pull it out of records for verification. Secondly for you cheap fuckers out there who think you don't have to tip get a grip and get off your high horses. Servers are people too and need to be treated with respect. We aren't your god damned slaves so remember that. Yes we get paid $4.30 an hour or some crap like that but honestly i cant tell you the exact amount because most of us don't receive anything on our paychecks. That 95% of the time gets taken for taxes and insurance. I think i got maybe 5 checks last year and all where for less than $1. Another thing no one brought up was that a server needs to tip out as well. Now that amount depends on the restaurants policy but for me its 4.4% of my total shifts sales. So if you feel like your too cool for school and want to tip me $10 on a $100 check because your $15 alcoholic drink wasn't strong enough, then Im actually only pocketing $5.60 for that hour you've been sitting at my table. 15% in the United States is mandatory. 18% if you had a good time the table was kept clean, drinks refilled, clean silverware was brought for desert, plates delivered to share, etc. and 20% if they went above and beyond and that varies depending on each guests needs but some like to be left alone and some like to be chatted up during their meal. Some like you to personally box up their left overs some don't. Some want you to take pictures of the table, keep their kid occupied, or sing a birthday song or whatever that establishment does. But all of this isn't because we are lifelong best friends people. Its so that you have a good time and tip me well.

[Dino Velvet]

I was a manager and used to love defending my waitresses in front of unruly customers. They'd tell me, "We'll never come here again!" I'd respond, "Tell your friends too!" So many people act like they never even leave their own homes. Social misfits. That's who Swanson TV Dinners are for.

[Remy757Photog]

Remy, you and I have to trade tales some day. I drove taxicrabs for four years in Boston and limos in Boston, Philly, NY, and DC. Our cabs operated on a 50% meter commission, but in Boston proper most were leased and every penny counted. I always gave the best service, fastest/most comfortable ride I could and was rewarded accordingly. I never complained about the amount of a tip (One regular always tipped a shiny new quarter, the same tip he'd given to the driver every day since the 1920s, never adjusted for inflation and rising cab fares) and never stressed over it. I must have been doing something right, as my tips often paid the rent when the fare split...

I actually liked the way it works down here in the Hampton Roads area, we lease the cab for a flat rate and keep all that's made during shift. I leased mine on weekly basis so can stayed with me 24/7 allowing me pop out and work whenever it suited me. I generally spent 4 days earning the lease money and rest of the week on profit. I passed out my own business cards to decent people for repeat business directly to my cell. Also would run the meter but give flat rate to regular customers so they know how much they saved riding with me.

[Willie Escalade]

Speak on it, Audrina!

[Quiet Reflections]

Good service=good tip, Bad service = bad tip plain and simple. Sure the wait staff are people and need to earn money but don't fault the customer all the time. Sometime those bad moods and cigarette smoke come through to us no matter how hard someone tries to hide them. If im coming out to spend my money and you want a little more of it on top of what im paying for my food at least have the ability to know the menu, keep my glass filled and smile. I don't want a hand job at the table I just want someone to be polite. I never bitch at wait staff for poorly cooked food because that isn't their fault unless they put in my order wrong. However before the food gets there and after it is on the table they need to at least check in on my table with a bit of manners. Lets not pretend every waiter deserves a tip just for showing up, its called work for a reason.

[broncofan]

I was a waiter and people would tip even when I made mistakes if they could tell I was trying. It was extremely rare that I got stiffed. Bearded one is right that tipped employees are supposed to get more than the minimum wage when tips are added in.

Unless the waiter or waitress is trying to be rude I always tip (one time in my life I did not). Sometimes I hesitate but I just don't have the heart to stiff them.

Also got to appreciate Dino's post. People think they can abuse waiters and waitresses and threaten the restaurant with a loss of business. Nice to have a manager stick up for their wait staff if they're right and the customer is being an asshole.

[fivekatz]

In the US the posties are allowed to accept 'gifts' so long as they are under a certain value. Many of the carriers and clerks where I work might get something around the holidays as a recognition of good service and less than surly behaviour. Sometimes it is a gift card for one of the local stores or a small food item, but rarely cash. It's never expected and always appreciated. The carriers like Newman from Seinfeld and Elmer from Funny Farm are consistently ignored at these times and often bitch about how 'cheap' their customers are.



Most chain restaurants and larger independents will add 15-20% automatically if it is a party of six or more. That's what happened with the Applebee's check in this nonsense (And the pastor and her group asked for separate checks to try and get out of it, as can be seen in the amounts on the offending check). So, not only is the 'pastor' a bitch, but a cheating cunt as well.



Remy, you and I have to trade tales some day. I drove taxicrabs for four years in Boston and limos in Boston, Philly, NY, and DC. Our cabs operated on a 50% meter commission, but in Boston proper most were leased and every penny counted. I always gave the best service, fastest/most comfortable ride I could and was rewarded accordingly. I never complained about the amount of a tip (One regular always tipped a shiny new quarter, the same tip he'd given to the driver every day since the 1920s, never adjusted for inflation and rising cab fares) and never stressed over it. I must have been doing something right, as my tips often paid the rent when the fare split didn't.

That said:

I've seen two things throughout the thread that have not been clarified. One being that restaurant servers aren't getting the legal minimum wage. The painful truth is that they ARE getting the legal minimum wage for servers. The current Pennsylvania minimum wage is $7.25 an hour but is only $2.83 per hour for tipped employees. This is on par with minimum wage in other states/nationally. There is fine print in the PA law that states that an employer is supposed to make up any difference between that minimum + tips that doesn't meet or exceed the $7.25 amount, but I've never known an employer to do that (One would assume that the tips for an hour's work would usually exceed the minimum).

The other inaccuracy is the claim that tips are 'tax free'. While gratuities make up a significant part of the underground economy they are NOT 'tax free'. Employees are expected to claim their tips to the employer to be reported in their weekly income. If no tips are reported, some employers will insert an estimated amount, based on some formula of hours worked, or leave the slot blank and leave it up to the IRS to come knocking on the employee's door later down the road. And trust me, the IRS is one, nasty mistress and will err on the high side in any kind of income discrepancy audit. If someone claims income from a tipped profession (Restaurant server, transportation, hotel, etc.) and doesn't show some reasonable amount under the gratuities section the little red lights start flashing at the IRS.In fact the employees are supposed to report actual tips which the employer can report or the employer can opt to simply report 15% of receipts as tips.