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Willie Escalade
12-16-2012, 11:00 PM
...To Gun-Toting, Tyranny-Fighting, ‘Kindergarteners Need To Carry Guns’ Preaching Americans

NOT MY WORDS...just an article passed to me.

http://samuel-warde.com/2012/12/open-letter-to-gun-toting-tyranny-fighting-kindergarteners-need-to-carry-guns-to-school-preaching-americans/
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The U.S. has experienced sixty-two mass shootings in the last 30 years at the average rate of two per year since 1982. However, twenty-five of those shootings occurred in the last six years and seven mass shootings this year alone.

The problem is escalating and there are clear reasons why and an objective understanding of those reasons will bring us answers.

For starters, the increase in firearms has far exceeded population growth in recent years. Back in 1995 there was an estimated 200 million guns in the hands of private citizens. Today, that number has increased at the rate of 50% to around 300 million. However, the U.S. population only increased by 20% during that same period. At this rate, by 2020 there will be a gun for every man, woman and child – if not sooner.

Additionally, of grave importance are the recent roll backs of gun restrictions across the United States. In the past 4 years alone the NRA and its political backers has pushed through 99 laws making guns easier to own and carry in public across 37 states. At the same time the NRA has been able to roll back laws enabling government to track guns.

Currently 8 states allow private citizens to take their firearms with them to bars and in Missouri, intoxicated individuals are allowed to shoot to kill, so long as they believe they are “acting in self-defense”. In Louisiana, citizens are allowed to take their guns to church and most alarming (considering the events of last week) Kansas allows ordinary citizens to carry concealed weapons inside K-12 schools. Earlier this year the Colorado Supreme Court issued a ruling allowing individuals to carry concealed weapons on college campuses making it the 5th state to allow firearms on campuses.

80% of our states now recognize gun permits from other states, creating grave concern over lax states such as Virginia where applicant need only complete a brief online course to obtain a weapons permit. Due to the ease of obtaining a permit in Virginia, the state is now being flooded with out-of-state applicants effectively making their regulations – or lack thereof – the law of the land in a majority of our country’s states.

The increase in firearms, coupled with the decrease in governmental regulation should be decreasing the number s of firearm deaths and mass shootings as gun advocates would have us believe – correct? In reality, the rates of firearm murders are not decreasing over the course of the past 30+ years, nor as shown above has the rate of mass shootings, To the contrary these numbers are increasing with the exception of the period of time the U.S. had a ban on assault rifles.

I’ve heard gun-toting friends claim, “It’s too bad one of the teachers wasn’t carrying.” What about that?

A recent study found one striking pattern in the data: “In not a single case was the killing stopped by a civilian using a gun. [...] And in recent rampages in which armed civilians attempted to intervene, they not only failed to stop the shooter but also were gravely wounded or killed”.

The report goes on to note:
“Armed civilians attempting to intervene are actually more likely to increase the bloodshed, says [Dr. Stephen] Hargarten [a leading expert on gun violence and emergency medicine], ‘given that civilian shooters are less likely to hit their targets than police in these circumstances.’ A chaotic scene in August at the Empire State Building put this starkly into perspective when New York City police officers confronting a gunman wounded nine innocent bystanders.”

So the problems are clear – and the solutions rather obvious.

Mass shootings and deaths by firearm are not unique to the United States. However, what is unique is our inability to work towards any meaningful solutions.

Back in 2001 around 3,000 people were killed in the attack on the World Trade Center and the United States embarked on an ongoing global “War on Terrorism” which has cost literally tens of thousands of lives. Yet more than 10,000 people are being killed annually by firearms at home, but we are not allowed to even discuss solutions.

When automobiles, toys or other manufactured goods are deemed unsafe they are recalled. New laws and regulations put into place. When food items, drugs or medical procedures are deemed the same – there are quick solutions put into effect. Yet when tens of thousands of persons are killed by handguns over an incredibly short period of time with numbers escalating significantly in just the last few years – we are somehow deemed un-American for daring to ask questions, for asking for some sort of national dialogue on the matter.

To me, the problem seems to be a lack of clarity and vision by the gun lobby and other gun proponents. They consistently see things in terms of black and white. “I want my guns unfettered or restrained by any government regulation or oversight. You can pry my dead fingers off the trigger if you try in implement any control whatsoever.”

This attitude is contrasted by those of us on the other side of the fence who merely want to talk about solutions. I have never talked or written of going into people’s homes and seizing their guns. Nor have I ever spoken of taking away the right to bear arms. But there is a need for meaningful look at laws and regulations in light of the overwhelming evidence that what we currently have in place is simply not working.

And don’t be fooled by the claims of the gun lobby that private citizens do not want meaningful gun-control laws in place. They love to point to polls such as a recent one conducted by Pew that found only 45% of Americans favor the broad idea of stricter gun laws. However, polls asking more specific questions consistently paint a completely different picture.

For example, take a look at these figures:
88 percent want to prohibit those on the terror watch list from buying guns (January 2011 American ViewPoint/Momentum Analysis poll)

86 percent believe in further background checks, regardless of where a gun is purchased (January 2011 American ViewPoint/Momentum Analysis poll)

69 percent want to limit the number of guns a citizen can buy in a period of time (April 2012 Ipsos/Reuters poll)

66 percent want a National gun registry (January 2011 American ViewPoint/Momentum Analysis poll)

63 percent want a ban on high capacity clips (January 2011 CBS News poll)

p.s.
1. For those of you wanting to whimper about Mexico, its ban on firearms and failure to curb gun related deaths, don’t forget that a huge majority of those firearms come from the USA. That Mexico stands as a shining testament to the fact that our overly lax gun laws are not only killing our own countrymen and women – they pose a threat to the stability of the entire continent.

2. For those of you wanting to whine about tyranny – in the words of my dearest friend:

“To all of you John Wayne wannabe douchewagons who think you need guns to protect us all from tyranny:
I would love to see any one of you have a go at the Army, Navy, Air Force, Marines, Coast Guard, CIA, FBI, ATF, Border Patrol et al with their tanks, unmanned aerial drone, Hellfire missiles, Apache helicopters, F18s, B2 bombers and armored Hummers with 50 caliber roof-mounted fully automatic machine guns etc. with whatever you have in your gun cabinets. That is a stupid, antiquated argument that makes as much sense as trying to put out a fucking firestorm with a thimble full of water, you delusional lunatics.”

3. For those of you who are still not convinced that the whole problem with the mass shooting of 20 innocent children last week was a lack of more firearms on the scene, take a look at the videos included below you fucktards.

4. For those of you shrieking: this is not about guns – it is about mental health. Fuck-off. It is about guns. What person in their right mind want one who just “flew over the cuckoos nest” to be packing a weapon capable the literal annahiliation of dozens of people in mere seconds. And all you right-wing gun-packing Kool-Aid swilling fruitloops want to use a lack of proper health services as an excuse for the mass killing of children and not guns, how about we erect a mental asylum in your backyard? What was that? NIMBY? “Not in my backyard”? That is what I thought. And if you really believe that proper care is the answer, why are you lying awake a night worry about the socialistic, Nazi, facist, Marxist, communist Kenyan healthcare system???

5. And for all you liberals out there sitting there all smug, wrapped up in righteous indignation – don’t think for an instant that we are letting you off the hook just yet.

As we all know, GUNS KILL PEOPLE and it’s not politicizing anything to talk about it. Common sense dictates we do no less. WE DEMAND it stop right now. How long are we going to keep letting this happen and how many more people have to die before we cease allowing the lunatic-fringe conspiracy theorists, my pea-shooter is going to protect American from the imminent onslaught of tyranny, and NRA gun nuts run this country with their archaic arguments and fear-mongering nonsense?

If we are complacent about these horrors and continue to let Wayne LaPierre and his NRA cronies push us around, we have blood on our hands, too. It should be at least as difficult to legally own a gun as it is to legally drive a car.
WE NEED MORE GUN REGULATIONS NOW!

(Don’t forget, it’s working out pretty damn well for the rest of the planet.)

CCW permit holders don’t protect innocent people. They kill them.

Odelay
12-17-2012, 12:12 AM
Not saying that the gun enthusiasts who propose arming kindergarten teachers are a one for one match with those who hate teachers unions and who believe teachers are overpaid, but there surely is an overlap between the two groups.

My question is: how much more $ per year are you willing to give teachers for:
1. Learning how to shoot, and maintaining their skills
2. Extra time each day they spend arming up and disarming down
3. Hazard pay associated with being an armed combatant in a dangerous place.
4. Life insurance credits associated with premiums which will skyrocket on them.
5. Errors & omission/Liability insurance in case there is an accident in the class room

Seems as if we're talking about raising their pay 50-100%. Are these gun enthusiasts willing to pay extra higher taxes to fund arming teachers? Would love to hear from them on this count.

GroobySteven
12-17-2012, 12:03 PM
Not saying that the gun enthusiasts who propose arming kindergarten teachers are a one for one match with those who hate teachers unions and who believe teachers are overpaid, but there surely is an overlap between the two groups.

My question is: how much more $ per year are you willing to give teachers for:
1. Learning how to shoot, and maintaining their skills
2. Extra time each day they spend arming up and disarming down
3. Hazard pay associated with being an armed combatant in a dangerous place.
4. Life insurance credits associated with premiums which will skyrocket on them.
5. Errors & omission/Liability insurance in case there is an accident in the class room

Seems as if we're talking about raising their pay 50-100%. Are these gun enthusiasts willing to pay extra higher taxes to fund arming teachers? Would love to hear from them on this count.


I'm not willing to spent any on arming teachers. All research shows that when an "amateur" even if trained, tries to take on armed people, that more often than not they get themselves killed or escalate the situation. What if one of these teachers snap? I know a lot of teachers, I was a one myself for a few years, frankly there are some right nutjobs amongst them.

Thanks for this post, Willy - using it instead of retyping to the fuckwits I have on my personal facebook.

Odelay
12-18-2012, 01:54 AM
Seanchai, I don't think arming teachers is a good idea, either. I just posted this comment as there might be some incongruities in the collective ideas of some who do support arming teachers.

And it's interesting because since I've posted this, I have seen an argument made for arming teachers where the blogger actually elaborated on how it might be implemented. He was advocating that teachers do this on their own time and own dime. They would buy their own weapons, secure licenses to carry, do the training on their own time, and not cost the taxpayers any additional money... and they would do this for... wait for it... the good of the children.

These people aren't to be taken seriously.

GroobySteven
12-18-2012, 02:01 AM
I've just had to defriend a longtime friend on FB as that was his position and I'm so angry at the idiocy of it all.

robertlouis
12-18-2012, 04:54 AM
I've just had to defriend a longtime friend on FB as that was his position and I'm so angry at the idiocy of it all.

I got a couple of people on fB quoting biblical passages to justify keeping guns. They've been defriended too.

I also invited anyone who is against reasonable gun controls to defriend me. Pleased to see that some have done so. Not stereotyping, but as most of my fB contacts are in the music business, they tend to be country musicians from the south. Funny, that.....

And when I read about prayer chains and the like it drives me nuts. It's well-meaning and it provides some illusory short-term comfort, but without action, it's worthless. Scream, shout, write, march, protest, lobby by all means necessary to move away from your gun-fetishising culture, but don't pray unless you also mean to do something about it.

Willie Escalade
12-18-2012, 06:03 AM
I have friends on Facebook as well that feel more guns is the answer. No matter how much I disagree with them, I'll respect their opinion...even though the consequences could be massive in the wrong situation.

C'mon...allowing guns into a sporting event? Can you imagine what would happen at a Chiefs/Raiders or Red Sox/Yankees game? If people though the beat down after that Giants/Dodgers game was bad, just wait until guns are involved.

That goes for arming teachers as well. What a crock of bullshit...

trish
12-18-2012, 06:52 AM
I've got relatives who are telling me this happened because we've chased God out of the classroom! I can respect the opinionators, 'cause they're people afterall, but it's exactly these dumbass opinions I can't respect.

robertlouis
12-18-2012, 06:54 AM
I have friends on Facebook as well that feel more guns is the answer. No matter how much I disagree with them, I'll respect their opinion...even though the consequences could be massive in the wrong situation.

C'mon...allowing guns into a sporting event? Can you imagine what would happen at a Chiefs/Raiders or Red Sox/Yankees game? If people though the beat down after that Giants/Dodgers game was bad, just wait until guns are involved.

That goes for arming teachers as well. What a crock of bullshit...

I've also read comments and posts over on fB where people are openly angry about the shooting - not because of the obscene horror, but because they see it as a pretext for these nasty libs to take their precious guns away.

Sadly, it's a dialogue of the deaf. The two sides are so entrenched that there's unlikely to be constructive common ground. So in a few months time when it happens again, with another massacre of the innocents, the rest of the civilised world will shake its head in uncomprehending bafflement while the US wrings its hands, says something must be done, does fuck all and the cycle repeats itself forever. I worry about your country.

robertlouis
12-18-2012, 06:56 AM
I've got relatives who are telling me this happened because we've chased God out of the classroom! I can respect the opinionators, 'cause they're people afterall, but it's exactly these dumbass opinions I can't respect.

Under the Constitution, was God ever formally in the classroom unless permitted by states laws?

And saying a prayer wouldn't have slowed Lanza down one bit. Morons.

Willie Escalade
12-18-2012, 07:07 AM
If they want prayer back in the classroom, send them to a private school. Not everyone in the world believes in God; I wish folks would stop trying to push that down our throats.

I was raised Catholic and went to a private school by the way.

Things won't be changing too much anytime soon. THAT'S a guarantee.

robertlouis
12-18-2012, 07:35 AM
No comment necessary.

95racer
12-18-2012, 04:37 PM
The shooting in the Oregon shopping mall was stopped by a cpl citizen. I am for allowed carry in schools. There have been other incidents that were stopped by cpl citizens. Numerous laws were broken by the school shooter. What is passing more laws going to do? Criminals don't care about laws.

trish
12-18-2012, 05:10 PM
The shooting in the Oregon shopping mall was stopped by a cpl citizen. ...

No, it wasn't.

Oregon Mall Shooting Stopped By Licensed Gun Carrier - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dsV6TCwd0o)

All we have some guy named Nick with an uncorroborated story in which he says he thinks the shooter (Jacob) ended the spree early with suicide because the shooter was aware that he (Nick) had him (Jacob) in his sights.

Only persons predisposed to reinforce their beliefs and fantasies about how guns are the answer to gun violence will swallow that story whole.

Odelay
12-19-2012, 01:54 AM
No, it wasn't.

Oregon Mall Shooting Stopped By Licensed Gun Carrier - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dsV6TCwd0o)

All we have some guy named Nick with an uncorroborated story in which he says he thinks the shooter (Jacob) ended the spree early with suicide because the shooter was aware that he (Nick) had him (Jacob) in his sights.

Only persons predisposed to reinforce their beliefs and fantasies about how guns are the answer to gun violence will swallow that story whole.

God, what a douchebag. He needs to get a life. Heroes don't gloat about their actions.