How Long is a Film on DVD?

[Stavros]

I have a problem with the three box sets of films by Theo Angelopoulos. If I look up the details on imdb, or on the dedicated Angelopoulos web-site, I note that the films are often between five and fifteen minutes longer than the versions I have on DVD. Now, I have seen some scenes from the films marked as 'Deleted from the DVD release' on YouTube -but I also read somewhere that the speed of a film will vary between PAL and NTSC so that it isn't that scenes have been cut, just the speed varies. Anyone got any ideas? Are DVD versions of films the same as the one seen in the theatre?

[dc_guy_75]

There could be many different versions of DVDs.

Example: Blockbuster would only rent edited versions of many movies (and Walmart did too). Google it.

[Dino Velvet]

I have a problem with the three box sets of films by Theo Angelopoulos. If I look up the details on imdb, or on the dedicated Angelopoulos web-site, I note that the films are often between five and fifteen minutes longer than the versions I have on DVD. Now, I have seen some scenes from the films marked as 'Deleted from the DVD release' on YouTube -but I also read somewhere that the speed of a film will vary between PAL and NTSC so that it isn't that scenes have been cut, just the speed varies. Anyone got any ideas? Are DVD versions of films the same as the one seen in the theatre?

Five and fifteen minutes seems like a lot. I know the versions differ in speed which translates into some running time difference. But that much?

I completely relate to your problem with my love of Horror Films and always looking for the most complete versions. I Google and look for message boards that end up answering my question.

Here's a place I go. Maybe you can find your film there. http://www.avmaniacs.com/forums/index.php
Great board regardless.

Did you look through the IMDb board?

[bubbski]

Source materials in 24 frame per sec when converted to PAL generally run 4% fast (25/24ths). That's 2.4 minutes over an hour.

[the_corner]

I would not be impressed if some of the material goes straight from 24fps to PAL.... basically, playing back a 24fps film at 25fps like Bubbski says.

At the same time, when going to NTSC, the customary process is to do a pulldown... either a 3:2 pulldown or a 2:3:3:2 pulldown... which would yield a picture of the same duration as the original, and hence making slightly different than the PAL version.

Then there are always many versions of the DVDs. The director's cut, the extended version and so on and so forth.

[Stavros]

Dino -thanks for the link to avmaniacs, I shall join. I have been going through the reviews on IMDB but they are years old for the most part -ie they predate the Artificial Eye box sets-I am about to watch the last three but won't read the reviews of them until I have watched the films.

DC Guy and Corner-I am concerned that there are multiple and censored versions, I am aware of Director's Cuts, but not sure if they make a difference as the ones I can think of -Blade Runner -I wouldn't watch anyway. I assume that copyright must have something to do with it as well as directors like Angelopoulos who probably had an urge to revisit and recut films. Either way I think the cover of the box should state that the version has been censored/abridged.

Bubbski -some of the earlier Angelopoulos films are four hours long, which means by your speeds that could make a difference of 9 minutes -and I believe some films have also been cut by -the distributors? Not sure who.

My problem I think is down to Artificial Eye, they have released three boxed sets with all the long feature films, and not a single commentary or extra on any of the 14 films; in addition to which in a few parts of Ulysses' Gaze, the film becomes very grainy -I thought this might be a deliberate choice by the director, but I now recall that Artificial Eye's version of Cyrano (with Depardieu) becomes so grainy by the end it is almost unwatchable. Artificial Eye have been criticised for the absence of complimentary material in their box of Tarkovsky films, so maybe its the company.

[Dino Velvet]

Dino -thanks for the link to avmaniacs, I shall join. I have been going through the reviews on IMDB but they are years old for the most part -ie they predate the Artificial Eye box sets-I am about to watch the last three but won't read the reviews of them until I have watched the films.

DC Guy and Corner-I am concerned that there are multiple and censored versions, I am aware of Director's Cuts, but not sure if they make a difference as the ones I can think of -Blade Runner -I wouldn't watch anyway. I assume that copyright must have something to do with it as well as directors like Angelopoulos who probably had an urge to revisit and recut films. Either way I think the cover of the box should state that the version has been censored/abridged.

Bubbski -some of the earlier Angelopoulos films are four hours long, which means by your speeds that could make a difference of 9 minutes -and I believe some films have also been cut by -the distributors? Not sure who.

My problem I think is down to Artificial Eye, they have released three boxed sets with all the long feature films, and not a single commentary or extra on any of the 14 films; in addition to which in a few parts of Ulysses' Gaze, the film becomes very grainy -I thought this might be a deliberate choice by the director, but I now recall that Artificial Eye's version of Cyrano (with Depardieu) becomes so grainy by the end it is almost unwatchable. Artificial Eye have been criticised for the absence of complimentary material in their box of Tarkovsky films, so maybe its the company.

Stavros, isn't the UK still pretty tough on film censorship? For Horror Films, if I couldn't get a good American restoration I'd get the Dutch version.

I wish you luck on that board. Use Google typing in your problem and some magical solution could come up. Happened to me when I didn't think there was a chance to it. Let's get to the bottom of this.

Is there any objectionable content that might be censored?

http://www.blogomatic3000.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/VideoNastiesDefGuide.jpg

[Stavros]

The Human Centipede II has been banned, and I assume that if it is not available in the UK as a DVD, anyone bringing it into the country could be arrested under the Obscene Publications Act; but I assume it can be purchased online.

Re: Human Centipede:
The BBFC [British Board of Film Classification] described the central plot of the film as the "sexual arousal of the central character at both the idea and the spectacle of the total degradation, humiliation, mutilation, torture and murder of his naked victims".
It took the rare move of refusing to classify the film and explaining that no amount of cuts would allow them to give it a certificate.
"There is little attempt to portray any of the victims in the film as anything other than objects to be brutalised, degraded and mutilated for the amusement and arousal of the central character, as well as for the pleasure of the audience," the BBFC said.
The board also said The Human Centipede II may breach the Obscene Publications Act, and "poses a real, as opposed to a fanciful, risk that harm is likely to be caused to potential viewers".
The BBFC says it has withheld certification for 28 films, including the Centipede sequel, since 2000. The previous example was Grotesque, a 2009 Japanese horror film whose premise was likewise deemed dangerously offensive.

The full report from which this is quoted is here:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2011/jun/06/human-centipede-sequel-bbfc

Wikipedia has an edited list of films banned in the UK, here:
List of films banned in the United Kingdom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_films_banned_in_the_United_Kingdom)


I should add that a banned film can be shown -although Corman's desperately awful film The Trip was banned in the 1970s, I saw it as a member of the New Cinema Club, a private club that specialised in showing banned films or films without a certificate, for bad language, sex and violence usually -eg, Ai No Corrida (banned for a while) -Norman Mailer's films Beyond the Law (actually very funny and a minor improvement on his detestable writing), and Maidstone; and Jonas Mekas film The Brig. Even in the 1980s the German film, Taxi zum Klo could only be shown in a private club -the Screen on the Hill in London NW3 converted itself into a private club for its run -but the film had about 15 minutes censored even then, owing to allegations of paedophilia.

[Dino Velvet]

The Human Centipede II has been banned, and I assume that if it is not available in the UK as a DVD, anyone bringing it into the country could be arrested under the Obscene Publications Act; but I assume it can be purchased online.

Re: Human Centipede:
The BBFC [British Board of Film Classification] described the central plot of the film as the "sexual arousal of the central character at both the idea and the spectacle of the total degradation, humiliation, mutilation, torture and murder of his naked victims".
It took the rare move of refusing to classify the film and explaining that no amount of cuts would allow them to give it a certificate.
"There is little attempt to portray any of the victims in the film as anything other than objects to be brutalised, degraded and mutilated for the amusement and arousal of the central character, as well as for the pleasure of the audience," the BBFC said.
The board also said The Human Centipede II may breach the Obscene Publications Act, and "poses a real, as opposed to a fanciful, risk that harm is likely to be caused to potential viewers".
The BBFC says it has withheld certification for 28 films, including the Centipede sequel, since 2000. The previous example was Grotesque, a 2009 Japanese horror film whose premise was likewise deemed dangerously offensive.

The full report from which this is quoted is here:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2011/jun/06/human-centipede-sequel-bbfc

Wikipedia has an edited list of films banned in the UK, here:
List of films banned in the United Kingdom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_films_banned_in_the_United_Kingdom)


I should add that a banned film can be shown -although Corman's desperately awful film The Trip was banned in the 1970s, I saw it as a member of the New Cinema Club, a private club that specialised in showing banned films or films without a certificate, for bad language, sex and violence usually -eg, Ai No Corrida (banned for a while) -Norman Mailer's films Beyond the Law (actually very funny and a minor improvement on his detestable writing), and Maidstone; and Jonas Mekas film The Brig. Even in the 1980s the German film, Taxi zum Klo could only be shown in a private club -the Screen on the Hill in London NW3 converted itself into a private club for its run -but the film had about 15 minutes censored even then, owing to allegations of paedophilia.

Stavros, why would your film be censored like the ones I like? What's in it that anyone could object to? You get good versions of Miike films over there?

Human Centipede II took place in the UK too. First one was tits. The Doctor.

[Stavros]

In the case of Angelopoulos I think there must be more than one version of some of the films, they were politically explosive in Greece in the 1970s, but there isn't anything that would bother a censor. I have decided to write to Artificial Eye for their view on it, also to explain the complete absence in three boxed sets of a single addition.

[Dino Velvet]

In the case of Angelopoulos I think there must be more than one version of some of the films, they were politically explosive in Greece in the 1970s, but there isn't anything that would bother a censor. I have decided to write to Artificial Eye for their view on it, also to explain the complete absence in three boxed sets of a single addition.

Stavros, you mentioned it's a box set. I'm not familiar with Angelopoulos or his films so if you can give the individual titles I'll look around a bit for answers.

You have a fairly large movie collection, don't you? As for me, the more I have the more I need.