The Holocaust

[InHouston]

Comments ...

[Quinn]

The evidence is absolutely overwhelming. To question it is like questioning if the Earth is, in fact, round.

-Quinn

[flabbybody]

I don't think the numbers on my grandmother's arm were put there by the local tattoo parlor.

the very act of posing the question is offensive and deserves no further attention.

[GroobySteven]

the very act of posing the question is offensive and deserves no further attention.
Agreed - ridiculous question.
seanchai

[TomSelis]

If people don't believe the Holocaust didn't happen, what's next?

[Gus The Dagger]

Its a big fat lie. It is just impossible for something like that to ever happen.

[Gus The Dagger]

I think the 3 MILLION Gypsies/Gays/Handicapped/Blacks and other people who didn't fit in The Master Race.

[Quinn]

Anyone hear of the Turkish Holocaust where 1 million Turks died?

Luckily, I'm British ... we invented concentration camps.

Turkish Holocaust? I’m guessing that you are specifically referencing the Armenian Genocide/Holocaust. It definitely doesn't seem to get that much international attention. The Turkish government won't even allow discussion of the issue by any domestic body of note and completely denies that it ever took place – despite the evidence. It's as big an issue for Armenians as the Potato Famine is to many Irish and the Holocaust is to Jews.

Regarding the concentration camps, you Brits have to share to share the credit with the Spanish. They started using them at about the same time in Cuba as the British did in South Africa during the second Boer War.

-Quinn

[Darren]

Its a big fat lie. It is just impossible for something like that to ever happen.

Gus, I take back that offer to help you with computer stuff in that other thread.

/I've BA in History, WWII focus

[Felicia Katt]

“From the holocausts of the day he lights his own flaming torch. It illuminates what we are, what we have wrought, what we must renounce.”
Harold Clurman

Anyone who believes there was no Holocaust is totally in the dark. and should be flamed

FK

[Gus The Dagger]

Its a big fat lie. It is just impossible for something like that to ever happen.

Gus, I take back that offer to help you with computer stuff in that other thread.

/I've BA in History, WWII focus

I was just kidding. Of course it happened, some of my relatives died in c-camps. Theres a guy that lives in my building that escaped the camp. His whole family died there and was tied in razor-wire.

[Canucklehead]

Unfortunately it is STILL HAPPENING.
Does anyone remember the whole mess in the former Yugoslavia?(sp) I seem to recall the newscasters throwing around the words "Ethnic Cleansing".
A lot of the violence in Somalia during the late 90's was between different ethnic tribes.
Unfortunately as long as human beings are involved, it will probably keep happening.

[InHouston]

the very act of posing the question is offensive and deserves no further attention.
Agreed - ridiculous question.
seanchai

I started this poll because the other night I watched a rerun of the president of Iran’s speech to the people on the anniversary of the Iranian Islamic revolution back on Feb 11, 1979. The Iranian president spoke repeatedly on how Iran promotes the light of truth and compassion as an example for all the world’s people, while Iranians paraded effigies of Uncle Sam and other unidentified Israeli dummies impaled on wooden sticks, and banners reading “Down with Israel”, “Down with Denmark”, and most notably “The Holocaust is a big lie”.

He then formally challenged the West to allow an impartial commission of scholars, scientists, and historians, to investigate the outlandishly false claim of The Holocaust put forth by the Zionist regimes of the world.

Given this, I thought the poll to be quite relevant.

[InHouston]

im horrofied that such a post can be allowed to remain this long...maybe being jewish im just sensitive since ive had so much family lost in the camps..or maybe im just offended that the poster implied that its up in the air...perhaps had he said what he just did about the iranian comments and if anyone bought the bullshit, then ide be more ok...im holnestly gasping for air...

in response to the iranian not so clever tactic in requesting a commision on the matter...

Allan dershowitz was once invited to attend a forum to debate whether the holocaust existed...he was very torn, since if he attended he would give credibility to the fact that the topic is even debatable, but if he didnt attend, surely the organizers of the event would brag about how even allan dershowitz was afraid to attend because he knew it was a hoax...finally, he came up with a clever solution, he wrote back to the comittee saying he would love to attend but only if added to the debate would be a debate on gravity and on whether the earth was flat or round...

Don't get me wrong, I am a realist, unlike some on this site, which inspired me to post this poll. The Holocaust in fact (and tragically) happened, and I didn't start this poll because of any uncertainty on my part regarding that fact. To deny the Holocaust is comparable to denying the empirical fact that the Earth revolves around the Sun. A friend of mine, currently pursuing a doctorate in Microbiology at Rice University in Houston, visits the Holocaust museum once a week on his lunch break to remind him of the wickedness wrought in the world. I walk in that light of the truth myself, and I’m not even Jewish.

There are always such divergent (and delusional) views on this site that I couldn’t resist seeing where everyone stands on the absurd claim that the Holocaust is a lie. The entire speech by the president of Iran was quite unsettling and alarming for me to watch -- Hitler Reincarnate. He’s been reported to be quite the influential and great public speaker to the people of Iran (as was Adolf Hitler) and I witnessed his spurious charisma myself. I sat with galvanized contempt as he blended an alluring mixture of religion, mysticism, world politics, and most appalling to me “science”, solely for propaganda to brainwash the Iranians into servile support of the oxymoron of their nation’s “scientific clergy”.

There are people who still believe the moonwalk was a hoax, and that our past two elections were fraudulent, and that intelligence on WMD’s was all a contrived lie by the administration. Therefore, I just wanted to see how many people would believe a claim as ridiculous as “The Holocaust is a lie”. That’s was my intention and nothing more – simply an opinion poll.

[Skillet]

Yes, its a lie. So is WW2, in fact. And Vietnam, and the existence of birds, too. All lies. This concludes today's visit from the sarcasm fairy.

[scavenger]

If the doubters would take the time to read up and watch anything available on the Nuremberg trials something would quickly become clear.

The excuses given by the defendants were varied. "I didnt know", "I was only following orders", "If we didnt do as we were told we would be executed"

But none, not even one of them claimed that it didnt happen.


Dave

[Kramer]

wow 4 people actually voted yes?!?!?! Thats pretty dumb. :?

[chefmike]

There are people who still believe the moonwalk was a hoax, and that our past two elections were fraudulent, and that intelligence on WMD’s was all a contrived lie by the administration. Therefore, I just wanted to see how many people would believe a claim as ridiculous as “The Holocaust is a lie”. That’s was my intention and nothing more – simply an opinion pol

J, it's obvious that the purpose of his thread was a thinly veiled attempt to promote his necon agenda....

As for Iran...we're fucked regardless... since the gang of chickenhawks in the whitehouse have shredded our military resources for their big lie in Iraq....

Lies about WMD's?...fraudulent elections?...where do people come up with these delusional theories? Maybe you should pull your head out of your ass and get a clue...hint, you won't find it at your local NRA or John Birch Society meetings...

And the fact that he finally managed to show his true agenda by lumping in these matters with the Holocaust shows how shameless the rush, oreilly, hannity reich-wing rabble are...

[tubgirl]

but legend is so easy, and now he's leaving

[InHouston]

J, it's obvious that the purpose of his thread was a thinly veiled attempt to promote his necon agenda....


:violin True to form as always ChefMike. And by the way, what is a necon? That a new Japanese import?

[InHouston]

inhouston, with all due respect, u said alot but really didnt respond to anything troublesome...

ur previous post explained ur position, there was no need to reiterate it...my concern was with u posting and polling as though it was a fair question, had u said "did u guys hear what the asshole from iran said, how many of u actually believe this shit?" and then polled, it would be acceptable...

ur lil story is all good and well, but the horror felt by me, and perhaps others, is for the general querrying nature of ur post and perhaps the fear that uneducated people might stumble across it and think perhaps it is a debatable issue...

I don't feel the matter is debatable. But what I anticipated has happened; five people have voted “yes” thus far.

[AllanahStarrNYC]

is this really a post or a joke?

i mean- how could anyone not believe the holocaust did not happen?

what people do often forget is that it was not only jews who were exterminated- 5 miliion non jews were also exterminated-perscuted that included polish citezens, homosexuals, afro-europeans, the disabled, gypssies, and jehovas witnesses

[Jack619]

It is absurd to ask this question.

[BeardedOne]

If you don't believe the Holocaust happened, and you're reading this board, you're next.

[Janus]

WTF kind of question is this?

I've been to the camps in Poland. You can't make up evidence like that.

[GiaCallMe]

Another reason why there shoudl be a Politics forum. Also, Russia had a Hlocaust al their own under Stalin.

[Felicia Katt]

There are people who still believe the moonwalk was a hoax, and that our past two elections were fraudulent, and that intelligence on WMD’s was all a contrived lie by the administration. Therefore, I just wanted to see how many people would believe a claim as ridiculous as “The Holocaust is a lie”. That’s was my intention and nothing more – simply an opinion poll.
Only a lunatic fringe believes, despite all the evidence to the contrary, that the moonwalk was a fraud. Only a lunatic fringe, with a larger supremist agenda tries to deny there was a holocaust. But the WMD and the election controversies are real and not cut from the whole cloth. A majority of people believe that the Administration manipulated the evidence on WMD to support a pre-existing agenda for invading Iraq, and there is substantial evidence to support their point of view, with more evidence and more witnesses coming to light every day. And there is plenty of credible evidence to suggest that the last two elections were not done completely on the up and up. When the elected official who certifies an election is the local campaign manager for the winner of the election, and when Supreme court justices have family members who work for the candidate that they find in favor of, that invites the kind of incredulity that many people have about how truly democratic our democracy still is.

For you to try to stitch these other areas of legitimate controvery and concern in with those ridiculous flat earth fictions is just tacky and wrong. Not to hem and haw about things, I think you did this thread just to needle us.

FK

[InHouston]

For you to try to stitch these other areas of legitimate controvery and concern in with those ridiculous flat earth fictions is just tacky and wrong. Not to hem and haw about things, I think you did this thread just to needle us.
FK

As I explained earlier (while you cavil and quibble from your defeatist soapbox), as the Iranian president spoke on the anniversary of the Islamic Revolution in Iran, citizens were holding up banners stating “The Holocaust is a big lie”. That is the primary reason I posted this poll to see if anyone on this forum believes that claim. And on the matter of my “alleged” attempt to stitch together areas of “legitimate controvery” (whatever “controvery” means) with “ridiculous flat earth fictions”, you’re doing all the stitching (and needling) here.

[Reddman]

For you to try to stitch these other areas of legitimate controvery and concern in with those ridiculous flat earth fictions is just tacky and wrong. Not to hem and haw about things, I think you did this thread just to needle us.
FK

As I explained earlier (while you cavil and quibble from your defeatist soapbox), as the Iranian president spoke on the anniversary of the Islamic Revolution in Iran, citizens were holding up banners stating “The Holocaust is a big lie”. That is the primary reason I posted this poll to see if anyone on this forum believes that claim. And on the matter of my “alleged” attempt to stitch together areas of “legitimate controvery” (whatever “controvery” means) with “ridiculous flat earth fictions”, you’re doing all the stitching (and needling) here.


Inhouston while it's quite sad and disturbing to see there are some board members actually taking a yes vote on the issue, it's just a hop,skip and jump away from you coming up with this bullshit "faux" poll. All for what??? People take task with you and you spin it to some sort of lesson on fringe lunatic opinions (no holocaust, fake moonwalks) vs. legit debates (WMD, legit elections) being one and the same. FK did not stitch or needle anything together she simply read your own words:

InHouston wrote:
There are people who still believe the moonwalk was a hoax, and that our past two elections were fraudulent, and that intelligence on WMD’s was all a contrived lie by the administration. Therefore, I just wanted to see how many people would believe a claim as ridiculous as “The Holocaust is a lie”. That’s was my intention and nothing more – simply an opinion poll.

I guess you will just try spin this too. Seems like the sad souls who voted yes are not the only ones suffering from delusion here.

[Felicia Katt]

And on the matter of my “alleged” attempt to stitch together areas of “legitimate controvery” (whatever “controvery” means) with “ridiculous flat earth fictions”, you’re doing all the stitching (and needling) here.
Since it was correctly spelled earlier in the post, its funny but not surprising to me that you wouldn't get that when I typed controvery, I was saying controversy, but left out an S. Because I don't think you could find your own S with both hands LOL

meow

FK

[hondarobot]

Out of 38 votes, 8 people actually believe the Holocaust is some sort of "lie". That just strikes me as increadibly disturbing.

I'm willing to bet those 8 people are not regular contributors to the board and would never publicly state their opinion on this matter. I'm certainly not advocating a witch hunt or anything, but I bet no-one steps up to the plate and says "Death camps!? what a bunch of bullshit!", and stands by such a statement.

I may be wrong, and they have every right to remain anonymous and to their opinions, I'm just saying the results of this are surprising to me.

[thanos]

I'm certain those some (if not most) of the infamous "its a lie" voters are doing it for shock value.

[BlackAdder]

Heh....well you know...



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_moon_landing_hoax_accusations

[BlackAdder]

And birds are totally fake...those are small flying dinosaurs.

[LAtoNY]

And these current situations aren't happening either...

Ethnic cleansing in Sudan in the past 3 years has resulted in 200,000 killings and millions being driven from their homes.

Thousands slaughtered in Uzbekistan by the military during a town meeting May, 2005.

Close to 1,000,000 forcibly removed from their homes in Zimbabwe to "restore order and sanity" last year.

[InHouston]

And on the matter of my “alleged” attempt to stitch together areas of “legitimate controvery” (whatever “controvery” means) with “ridiculous flat earth fictions”, you’re doing all the stitching (and needling) here.
Since it was correctly spelled earlier in the post, its funny but not surprising to me that you wouldn't get that when I typed controvery, I was saying controversy, but left out an S. Because I don't think you could find your own S with both hands LOL

meow

FK

:lies What a crock-a-shit rebuttal that was. Make sure you check for traffic behind you as you backpedal.

[InHouston]

I'm certain those some (if not most) of the infamous "its a lie" voters are doing it for shock value.

:popcorn Yep ... I agree, and I'd bet at least one (if not more) actually believe it to be a lie.

[Skillet]

And birds are totally fake...those are small flying dinosaurs.
Yes, and they were all created in a lab somewhere by Sam Neil, who glued feathers on them. Though, where he got the feathers, is unclear.

[Felicia Katt]

What a crock-a-shit rebuttal that was. Make sure you check for traffic behind you as you backpedal.
You didn't offer anything to rebut. I didn't have to back up at all. You don't ever back what you say. You were fronting by trying to equate people with legitimate political questions with holocaust deniers and moon walk fraud lunatics. When I called you on it, your response was to play innocent about your motives for this thread and to play dumb about your sophistry. Since Reddmann rightly read you, totally, right before me on your BS justification for, and prevarication in, this thread I tried to be gracious and humorous and not pile on your petty reply and you sidestepped from playing dumb to plain nonsense. Oh, and as far as playing really dumb on my little typo, if you know a 5 dollar word like cavil, I'm more than pretty sure you knew I meant controversy. I guess you can spell check, better than you can fact check. And you really should check that attitude of yours at the door.

FK

[Reddman]

The Holocaust WAS MORE SEVEAR THEN ANERICAN SLAVERY.....FIRST OFF IT HAPPEND IN MODERN TIMES AND IT NEARLY WIPED OUT ALL OF THE EUROPEAN JEWS....OK, IM SURE IM GOING TO GET FLACK FOR THAT STATEMENT BUT ITS TRUE.....DONT GET ME WRONG , SLAVERY WAS AN ABOMBINATION TOO....BUT NO ONE WANTED TO EXTERMINATE THE SLAVES THEY WERE KEPT ALIVE TO WORK THE FEILDS.....BUT THE JEWS OF EUROPE WERE ALMOST EXTERMINATED IN LESS THEN A 5 YEAR PEROID....IM NOT JEWISH, BUT FACT IS FACT.....THE PLAN WAS TO EXTERMINATE THE JEWISH RACE....IT WAS NO MYTH IT IS FACT!!!!!!!!!!

OK I'll bite and take the bait (sighing) since it's so friggin' obvious that's why you replied as you did. Why do you even bring the Afrikan slave trade into the picture at all??? It's not a head count competition on human suffering. Since time immortal human kind has wrecked genocide on people perceived as "other".

Of course I forgot you are the preeminent expert on all things Black (my ex is half black, my kids are quarter, I've done a bid, i know folk from the projects ...bah bah bah) God man pick up a book or at least learn to Google shit sometimes.

Now i'm not calling you a racist or anything I'm saying just saying you are pretty ignorant. The Middle Passage was no joke. Hint google Middle Passage along with Afrikan Holocaust start reading True numbers for deaths during the transportation cycle alone of Afrikans to the Caribbean, North and South America plus Europe is debatable but if more than 40% survived it was considered a success. That's a whole lotta Afrikans. Millions perhaps easily tens of millions perhaps maybe,even you could concede that.Hell let's tie in the more than 500 hundred years of suffering of people of African descent through Slavery, Imperialism, Colonialism, Invasions and Exploitation that should get the figures up there too. Til then please just STFU. Oh yeah here's a link to get ya started big guy:

http://www.africanholocaust.net/news_ah/dark_voyage_hell_below.htm



Happy reading Mega.

[InHouston]

What a crock-a-shit rebuttal that was. Make sure you check for traffic behind you as you backpedal.
You didn't offer anything to rebut. I didn't have to back up at all. You don't ever back what you say. You were fronting by trying to equate people with legitimate political questions with holocaust deniers and moon walk fraud lunatics. When I called you on it, your response was to play innocent about your motives for this thread and to play dumb about your sophistry. Since Reddmann rightly read you, totally, right before me on your BS justification for, and prevarication in, this thread I tried to be gracious and humorous and not pile on your petty reply and you sidestepped from playing dumb to plain nonsense. Oh, and as far as playing really dumb on my little typo, if you know a 5 dollar word like cavil, I'm more than pretty sure you knew I meant controversy. I guess you can spell check, better than you can fact check. And you really should check that attitude of yours at the door.

FK

FK, My poll was trolling for opinions on one matter and nothing more. In a subsequent post, I shared a couple of personal thoughts with someone on what I feel are unfounded beliefs, and you jumped in here critical of me. Therefore, I will graciously reciprocate.

I’ve yet to see a shred of empirical evidence from you on any/all your claims (regarding politics) beyond the “cut and paste” soapbox rhetoric you provide from questionable and typical sources. Nuff of that.

On the matter of your misspelling, I’ll splurge on another five dollar word of common parlance for you – “duh”. I knew you meant “controversy”. The intended word was nothing short of “obvious”. I find it astonishing that I feel I need to clarify the “obvious” to you. Nuff of that.

And you weren’t playing dumb about the misspelling either; you are dumb. You don’t think. You’re rash and you plagiarize and regurgitate the ideas of others, hence why your posts are so mundane. You’re the typical servile minion enslaved to the folly of “group think” and a “web-link junkie” at that – you’re unable to “think without a link”. Fortunately, that’s your problem and not mine. Nuff of that.

On “sophistry” and “prevarication”; (with eyes rolling) in that light I’m compelled to tell you that your writing (like your thinking) is obtuse and of poor construct. Bolstering your case by lacing a suppurating dung pile of drivel with a couple of hastily chosen words that “ornate” rather than “substantiate” is at best a cute, amusing, and novice attempt at sophisticated word usage, and painfully demonstrates a weak and immature case on your part. If you could wean yourself from the nipple of web-surfing for content you qualify as “good stuff”, and actually practiced the much more challenging art of articulating a genuine thought or two of your own, your writing skills (and overall rationale) would probably improve. Nuff of that.

Now you’ll accuse me of being evasive. Rationalize my response however you must. I don’t evade you; I avoid your shoddy rhetoric out of boredom and lack of interest. You’re about as interesting as that atavistic self-appointed mogul named Michael Moore. :sleep

[Felicia Katt]

Sweetie, I don't know what your problem is, but you have more issues than a big city newstand. I don't need to accuse you of being evasive. You do that nicely on your own. And I can't rationalize what you say because its so unreasonable. You are the one bandying big words, full of sound and fury, but signifying nothing. You are the one mistaking the petty red marking of typos as meaningful debate, instead of actually addressing the topic's merits. You are the one engaging in bitter personal attacks. You are the one who never, ever provides any support for any of your views. You seem to think anger and attitude are equal to attribution, but they aren't. You may not like my sources, but at least I provide them. And none of them have ever been Michael Moore. I doubt you can say that Rush or Hannity have never been the basis of what you ditto here. You might not like hearing what I have to say, but thats your problem, not the result any shortfall in my writing or reasoning. I'll stand by and for what I say while you continue to squat to excrete your hateful responses.

hugs and kisses

FK

[Jamie Michelle]

Below are writings from the persecuted dissident side:

"Alleged 'Holocaust Denier' Germar Rudolf Interviewed," Bloed Bodem Eer Trouw, NationalVanguard.org, December 6, 2005:

http://www.nationalvanguard.org/story.php?id=7117

"Free [Book] Downloads from CHP at vho.org--English Language Material":

http://vho.org/dl/ENG.html

[Felicia Katt]

That site is from a Holocaust "revisionist". How someone so blind can held up by anyone as having any kind of vision is truly beyond me. And to claim status as a victim of persecution, when they are spitting on the graves of so many real victims of persecution is even more offensive

FK

[December]

Its a big fat lie. It is just impossible for something like that to ever happen.

It did happen, but you get enough people thinking it didn't, it will happen again-maybe not to the same victims, but some other marginalized minority that it's easy to stir up hate against-maybe Christians, or Muslims next time? Maybe it will happen to you, or someone you know?

Hitler said "no one will remember the Albanians" and he was right-the Ottomans slaughtered a million Albanians in 1917 and nobody CARED (other than the Albanians), Stalin starved an entire country to death (40 million people) in the 1930's in the Ukraine. There's precedent for what the Nazis did, and there have been those that would emulate them given resources-half of Africa for starters.

It's one of the aftereffects of dehumanizing your opposition-it becomes acceptable to do the most impossible acts of barbarity against them and their families.


The Holocaust happened, it has happened before and it likely will happen again.

[Jamie Michelle]

That site is from a Holocaust "revisionist". How someone so blind can held up by anyone as having any kind of vision is truly beyond me. And to claim status as a victim of persecution, when they are spitting on the graves of so many real victims of persecution is even more offensive

FK

The persecution I spoke of above is quite literal and real. Many of these historical revisionists are literally imprisoned for years on end and their books are literally burned by the government.

The Nazis never died, they just changed their names. Nowadays they're known as the governments of the Federal Republic of Germany, the Republic of Austria, and the French Republic.

As Michael Rivero of www.WhatReallyHappened.com has said:

""
People who claim Elvis is alive don't get death threats. People who claim to have seen Bigfoot aren't hounded out of their jobs and careers. People who think the world is flat don't get thrown in jail.

What is it about this one question that makes certain people so afraid that they act like gangsters and terrorists?
""

And further by Michael Rivero:

""
Truth needs no laws to support it. Throughout history, from Galileo to Zundel, only lies and liars have resorted to the courts to enforce adherence to dogma.

History is full of genocides, and for all, ALL, save one, the victims of those genocides encourage full examination of all the facts that the true scale of the crimes be known, while the perpetrators seek to keep the crimes hidden. Only in the case of the holocaust do the victims call for punishment against anyone who wants to take a closer look.

If the people who question the orthodox account of the Holocaust are just nut cases, then let them speak, refute them with the hard evidence, and ridicule them. Why throw them in jail, if they are so very wrong? You don't see people who claim Elvis is still alive being thrown in jail. You don't see people who claim the government has UFOs in secret hangers in the desert publicly reviled and smeared in the media. Only in this one area of inquiry is there mere asking of a question greeted with such open panic and desperate measures.
""

[Felicia Katt]

Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
George Santayana

Its one thing if people want to be conspiratorially ignorant about Elvis or Area 51. Whats the harm? But when its about the inhumane, systematic near extermination of an entire race of people, its another thing entirely. It too hurtful to the survivors, too encouraging to their victimizers, and too dangerous to anyone else who might be consumed in the next genocide. Modern Nazis are't in government. They cloak themselves on web sites or in quasi-scholarly articles. Its an ideological retro virus just waiting for a weakened politcal immune system to re-emerge. If some countries chose to immunize themselves against such blatantaly false and hateful speech, so be it.

FK

[chefmike]

Elie Wiesel's statement, "...to remain silent and indifferent is the greatest sin of all..."stands as a succinct summary of his views on life and serves as the driving force of his work. Wiesel is the author of 36 works dealing with Judaism, the Holocaust, and the moral responsibility of all people to fight hatred, racism and genocide.

Born September 30, 1928, Eliezer Wiesel led a life representative of many Jewish children. Growing up in a small village in Romania, his world revolved around family, religious study, community and God. Yet his family, community and his innocent faith were destroyed upon the deportation of his village in 1944. Arguably the most powerful and renowned passage in Holocaust literature, his first book, Night, records the inclusive experience of the Jews:

Never shall I forget that night, the first night in camp, which has turned my life into one long night, seven times cursed and seven times sealed. Never shall I forget that smoke. Never shall I forget the little faces of the children, whose bodies I saw turned into wreaths of smoke beneath a silent blue sky.
Never shall I forget those flames which consumed my faith forever.
Never shall I forget that nocturnal silence which deprived me, for all eternity, of the desire to live. Never shall I forget those moments which murdered my God and my soul and turned my dreams to dust. Never shall I forget these things, even if I am condemned to live as long as God Himself. Never.
And Wiesel has since dedicated his life to ensuring that none of us forget what happened to the Jews.

http://xroads.virginia.edu/~CAP/HOLO/ELIEBIO.HTM

[Jamie Michelle]

Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
George Santayana

Its one thing if people want to be conspiratorially ignorant about Elvis or Area 51. Whats the harm? But when its about the inhumane, systematic near extermination of an entire race of people, its another thing entirely. It too hurtful to the survivors, too encouraging to their victimizers, and too dangerous to anyone else who might be consumed in the next genocide. Modern Nazis are't in government. They cloak themselves on web sites or in quasi-scholarly articles. Its an ideological retro virus just waiting for a weakened politcal immune system to re-emerge. If some countries chose to immunize themselves against such blatantaly false and hateful speech, so be it.

FK

The Bushes aren't merely just Nazis, they *invented* the Nazis. Hitler got his funding from the occult Brotherhood of Death (a.k.a., the Order of Skull & Bones). Bonesman Prescott Bush (Bush, Sr.'s father) had one of his banks and a number of his companies seized in 1942 under the Trading with the Enemy Act for his financing of the Nazis even during wartime. It's also interesting to note that the skull and bones symbol used by the Brotherhood of Death is the same symbol worn on the Nazi SS uniform. The Brotherhood of Death didn't take this symbol from the Nazis, as this had been their symbol long before the Nazis ever came on the scene. Rather, the Nazis took this symbol from their financiers.

But the notion that because political dissidents were persecuted in the past therefore the government needs to persecute political dissidents in order to prevent the persecution of political dissidents from happening is an absurd contradiction in terms. The original Nazis were wrong for burning books and persecuting political dissidents, and so also are the modern Nazis.

This has nothing to do with trying to prevent tyranny, because it is tyranny. Rather, it has to do with what it has always had to do with throughout the history of government. It has to do with dissent, in and of itself. That is, thought-crime. The show of dissent is the proof that one is a heretic, and it is the heretics which governments fear the most and have feared the most throughout history.

[Quinn]

:screwy

-Quinn

[Jamie Michelle]

Elie Wiesel's statement, "...to remain silent and indifferent is the greatest sin of all..."stands as a succinct summary of his views on life and serves as the driving force of his work. Wiesel is the author of 36 works dealing with Judaism, the Holocaust, and the moral responsibility of all people to fight hatred, racism and genocide.

Born September 30, 1928, Eliezer Wiesel led a life representative of many Jewish children. Growing up in a small village in Romania, his world revolved around family, religious study, community and God. Yet his family, community and his innocent faith were destroyed upon the deportation of his village in 1944. Arguably the most powerful and renowned passage in Holocaust literature, his first book, Night, records the inclusive experience of the Jews:

Never shall I forget that night, the first night in camp, which has turned my life into one long night, seven times cursed and seven times sealed. Never shall I forget that smoke. Never shall I forget the little faces of the children, whose bodies I saw turned into wreaths of smoke beneath a silent blue sky.
Never shall I forget those flames which consumed my faith forever.
Never shall I forget that nocturnal silence which deprived me, for all eternity, of the desire to live. Never shall I forget those moments which murdered my God and my soul and turned my dreams to dust. Never shall I forget these things, even if I am condemned to live as long as God Himself. Never.
And Wiesel has since dedicated his life to ensuring that none of us forget what happened to the Jews.

http://xroads.virginia.edu/~CAP/HOLO/ELIEBIO.HTM

"An Atrocity Against History, and the People," Arthur R. Butz:

http://pubweb.northwestern.edu/~abutz/dnews/OneBookOneChicago.html

[Jamie Michelle]

:screwy

-Quinn

I notice that that is a reference to yourself. You are correct about yourself in the above.

[Quinn]

:screwy

-Quinn

[Jamie Michelle]

:screwy

-Quinn

I notice that that is a reference to yourself. You are again correct about yourself in the above.

[Quinn]

Biography of the Author

Born in Austin, Texas and raised in the Leander, Texas hill country, the nativeborn Augustinian, James Redford [aka Jamie Michelle], is a born again Christian who was converted from atheism by a direct revelation from Jesus Christ. He is a scientific rationalist who considers that the Omega Point (i.e., the physicists’ technical term for God) is an unavoidable result of the known laws of physics. His personal website can be found at http://geocities.com/vonchloride/

:screwy

-Quinn

[Jamie Michelle]

Elie Wiesel's statement, "...to remain silent and indifferent is the greatest sin of all..."stands as a succinct summary of his views on life and serves as the driving force of his work. Wiesel is the author of 36 works dealing with Judaism, the Holocaust, and the moral responsibility of all people to fight hatred, racism and genocide.

Born September 30, 1928, Eliezer Wiesel led a life representative of many Jewish children. Growing up in a small village in Romania, his world revolved around family, religious study, community and God. Yet his family, community and his innocent faith were destroyed upon the deportation of his village in 1944. Arguably the most powerful and renowned passage in Holocaust literature, his first book, Night, records the inclusive experience of the Jews:

Never shall I forget that night, the first night in camp, which has turned my life into one long night, seven times cursed and seven times sealed. Never shall I forget that smoke. Never shall I forget the little faces of the children, whose bodies I saw turned into wreaths of smoke beneath a silent blue sky.
Never shall I forget those flames which consumed my faith forever.
Never shall I forget that nocturnal silence which deprived me, for all eternity, of the desire to live. Never shall I forget those moments which murdered my God and my soul and turned my dreams to dust. Never shall I forget these things, even if I am condemned to live as long as God Himself. Never.
And Wiesel has since dedicated his life to ensuring that none of us forget what happened to the Jews.

http://xroads.virginia.edu/~CAP/HOLO/ELIEBIO.HTM

"An Atrocity Against History, and the People," Arthur R. Butz:

http://pubweb.northwestern.edu/~abutz/dnews/OneBookOneChicago.html

See also:

"A Prominent False Witness: Elie Wiesel," Robert Faurisson:

http://web.archive.org/web/20040204002329/http://www.ihr.org/leaflets/wiesel.html

[chefmike]

Now we know that jamie is not only a raving paranoid lunatic, but a raving paranoid anti-Semitic lunatic...maybe there are valid medical reasons for lobotomies, after all...in jamies case it could only be an improvement...

[Jamie Michelle]

Biography of the Author

Born in Austin, Texas and raised in the Leander, Texas hill country, the nativeborn Augustinian, James Redford [aka Jamie Michelle], is a born again Christian who was converted from atheism by a direct revelation from Jesus Christ. He is a scientific rationalist who considers that the Omega Point (i.e., the physicists’ technical term for God) is an unavoidable result of the known laws of physics. His personal website can be found at http://geocities.com/vonchloride/

:screwy

-Quinn

Save for your "screwy" reference to yourself, all of the above is quite true. Below people can read the article from which the above is extracted, of which article was originally published at Anti-State.com (published under my legal name):

"Jesus Is an Anarchist," James Redford, revised and expanded edition, November 9, 2005:

http://www.geocities.com/vonchloride/anarchist-jesus.pdf

[Jamie Michelle]

Now we know that jamie is not only a raving paranoid lunatic, but a raving paranoid anti-Semitic lunatic...maybe there are valid medical reasons for lobotomies, after all...in jamies case it could only be an improvement...

I have nothing against the semite race.

[Jamie Michelle]

u are as ugly on the inside as u are on the outside...and to quote peter griffin describing james carville "I can handle ugly, but this is like circus ugly"...

I assume that's a reference to yourself. Since I haven't seen a picture of you, I don't know whether to agree with you yet.

[Jamie Michelle]

ive posted my pic in the past, ide be willing to wager a straight guy would rather fuck me than u...

Well, Miss Thang, you're welcome to have your straight guy. No need to start a cat-fight over your insecurities regarding your looks.

[Felicia Katt]

The Holocaust is open for discussion, but not for denial. There is a difference. But lets be clear and not in denial about what we are discussing here. The victims of the Holocaust didn't get a trial, or a short sentence for a witting and willing violation of well established law. They were rounded up and herded into death camps. The Nazi's didn't just burn books, they burned women and children, the old, the infirm, the disenfranchised. And not for spreading irresponsible falsehoods, but out of simple xenophobic hatred. For anyone to try to claim moral equivalency for some neo-nazi apologists, who want to wipe the slate clean, so they can start chalking up casualties once again is just offensive.

FK

[Felicia Katt]

Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it, and eventually they will believe it”
Adolf Hitler

Its pretty obvious that the "revisionists" follow this. But they really should consider getting behind this instead.

"The man who has no sense of history, is like a man who has no ears or eyes"”
Adolf Hitler

They have eyes, but cannot see, ears, but cannot hear. If only their tongues were similarly inactive

FK

[Jamie Michelle]

The Holocaust is open for discussion, but not for denial. There is a difference. But lets be clear about what we are discussing here. The victims of the Holocaust didn't get a trial, or a short sentence for a witting and willing violation of well established law. They were rounded up and herded into death camps. The Nazi's didn't just burn books, they burned women and children, the old, the infirm, the disenfranchised. And not for spreading irresponsible falsehoods, but out of simple xenophobic hatred. For anyone to try to claim moral equivalency for some neo-nazi apologists, who want to wipe the slate clean, so they can start chalking up casualties once again is just offensive.

FK

What happened to the Jews (and many other political dissidents, such as homosexuals and Gypsies) during World War II by the German government is nothing so unique. Joseph Stalin and Mao Tse-tung make Hitler look like a piker when it comes to mass-murder.

The problem here is that peaceful speech is made into a crime. Thus, the so-called "Holocaust" has been made into an article of religious dogma, the questioning or denial of which is punished via imprisonment and the burning of books--just like what the original Nazis did.

That is a violation of human rights, i.e., to be free from the use of force so long as one has not initiated the use of force. Denying some doctrine does not violate anyone's natural rights, and hence to respond with force is itself a violation of a person's natural rights, since said response involves the initiation of the use of force.

But even the motives told to us for this aggression are not sincere. The notion that because political dissidents were persecuted in the past therefore the government needs to persecute political dissidents in order to prevent the persecution of political dissidents from happening is an absurd contradiction in terms.

Again, this has nothing to do with trying to prevent tyranny, because it is tyranny. Rather, it has to do with what it has always had to do with throughout the history of government. It has to do with dissent, in and of itself. That is, thought-crime. The show of dissent is the proof that one is a heretic, and it is the heretics which governments fear the most and have feared the most throughout history.

[Jamie Michelle]

u bring to mind the late william kuntsler...

while im a bleeding heart liberal on every social issue and very openminded on other isues, i defend the ACLU and its ilk even in areas where im uncomfortable and feel theyre on the side of creeps, child molesters and rapists...while i obviously abhor and dont sympathize (legend u fuckin idiot) with these miscreants, i do understand on a legal level that everyone deserves representation, not so much the individual, but the system to function properly...so i understand the work that jeffrey dahmer, this fuckin hijcaker and other horrible people's attorneys are doing...but youlle usually see these attorneys doing their duties in very businesslike fashion with little or no attachment to their clients...

kuntsler was differant, he actually zealously defended known murderers and violent terrorists with glee and was reported to have prayed with the blind sheik before trials in his office despite not even being muslim..it seemed that he wasnt defending these people with the logic enumerated above, but just wanted to be a dick and fuck with people...


I haven't followed that much of William Kunstler's work very closely. But the likely reason he was so friendly with the "Blind Sheik" was because Kunstler knew for a certainty that the accused terrorists in the 1993 World Trade Center bombing were patsies set-up by the U.S. government, and that it was in fact the U.S. government which manufactured the bomb and staged the 1993 World Trade Center bombing.

For more on that, see the below:

########################################

It was the FBI that bombed the World Trade Center in 1993:

None of this would be known today if it were not for the FBI's undercover agent Emad A. Salem taping his conversations with his FBI handlers (unbeknownst to them). Salem thought that the FBI might try to pin it on him so he took measures to protect himself. Indeed, without the FBI the '93 WTC bombing would never have happened, as it was agent Salem who built the bomb for the would-be Muslim "terrorists." Salem wanted to use fake ingredients for the "bomb" but the FBI ordered him to make a real one. When the making of the bomb was complete Salem told the FBI that they could now arrest the would-be terrorists, but the FBI told Salem that the bombing is to go forward. After agent Salem went public with his tapes in a news conference the FBI found it necessary to pay him over a million dollars just to shut him up.

For more on the above, see the below New York Times article:

"Tapes Depict Proposal to Thwart Bomb Used in Trade Center Blast," Ralph Blumenthal, New York Times, October 28, 1993:

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b3c830e34de.htm

And see also:

"Who Bombed The World Trade Center? FBI Bomb Builders Exposed," Paul DeRienzo, Frank Morales and Chris Flash, The Shadow, October 1994/January 1995 Issue:

http://pdr.autono.net/WhoBombedWTC.html

On the above webpage you can find the below two audio clips from one of Emad A. Salem's recorded conversations with one of his FBI handlers, FBI Special Agent John Anticev:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/emad%20salem.mp3

The above clip is an excerpt from the below longer clip:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/SalemWBAI.mp3

The above clips were recorded from a broadcast on WBAI Radio in the city of New York which aired this taped conversation between Emad A. Salem and FBI Special Agent John Anticev.

The below transcript is from 2:57 to 4:31 min:sec from the longer clip (SalemWBAI.mp3):

FBI Special Agent John Anticev: But, uh, basically nothing has changed. I'm just telling you for my own sake that nothing, that this isn't a salary, that it's--you know. But you got paid regularly for good information. I mean the expenses were a little bit out of the ordinary and it was really questioned. Don't tell Nancy I told you this. [Nancy Floyd is another FBI Special Agent who worked with Emad A. Salem in his informant capacity.]

Emad A. Salem: Well, I have to tell her of course.

Anticev: Well then, if you have to, you have to.

Salem: Yeah, I mean because the lady was being honest and I was being honest and everything was submitted with a receipt and now it's questionable.

Anticev: It's not questionable, it's like a little out of the ordinary.

Salem: Okay. Alright. I don't think it was. If that's what you think guys, fine, but I don't think that because we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the D.A. and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful, great case!

Anticev: Well.

Salem: And then he put his head in the sand and said "Oh, no, no, that's not true, he is son of a bitch." [Deep breath.] Okay. It's built with a different way in another place and that's it.

Anticev: No, don't make any rash decisions. I'm just trying to be as honest with you as I can.

Salem: Of course, I appreciate that.

Anticev: And as far as the payments go, and everything like that, they're there. I guarantee you that they are there.

########################################

For more on government-staged terrorism, see the below post by me:

"Documentation on Government-Staged Terrorism," September 30, 2005:

http://www.armleg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2&mforum=libertyandtruth



i think what makes u such a horror and just so nasty on the eyes is ur between the lines joy at espousing ur views..whether there is legitimacy to ur point of view is being overshadowed by ur presentation and determination to disseminate ur shit....

i can honestly say, based on only a few posts here, u may be from the handful of people ive come across in my life that i hate most...i genuinely would not shake hands with u and would be repulsed to eat in ur presence...

That's to be expected, since I only speak truth.

[Felicia Katt]

so I guess Hilter was only guilty of misdemeanour genocide? Or holocaust in the second degree?

that kind of reductionist argument is ridiculous. hateful anti-holocaust crap, is neither speech or peaceful. Its inciting, not insightful. Its a matter of context too. It might be ok to have an opinion about the afterlife, but you shouldn't voice it at a funeral. Its ok to yell fire at a quail hunt, but not in a crowded movie house. Requiring some restraint in countries where they still haven't washed the bloodstains of national guilt for their involvement in the holocaust is appropriate. Showing some respect for people still bleeding from the holocaust is also appropriate. The "revisionists don't want to speak. They can do that. What they want to do is scream, to intimidate the victims, in perpetuation of the evil done to them, or to instigate and motivate the victimizers. Free speech doesn't mean it has no costs. Here, if they can't play by the rules (and all the evidence is that they don't want to, instead donning the white hood of anti-semitic martyrdom) they get sent to the penalty box. Not the oven, not the gas chamber.

FK

[Jamie Michelle]

so I guess Hilter was only guilty of misdemeanour genocide? Or holocaust in the second degree?


Hitler was guitly of mass-murder. That is quite enough to qualify for the death-penalty.



that kind of reductionist argument is ridiculous. hateful anti-holocaust crap, is neither speech or peaceful. Its inciting, not insightful. ...


Of course it is speech. One has to either speak it or write it down. Either way it is speech. Nor is there anything non-peaceful in speaking or writing, so long as one uses one's own property (or the property of another who has allowed it) to do so, and so long as one does not overtly threaten to initiate the use of force against another.



... Its a matter of context too. It might be ok to have an opinion about the afterlife, but you shouldn't voice it at a funeral. Its ok to yell fire at a quail hunt, but not in a crowded movie house. ...


The latter example has to do with property rights. One is only allowed into a movie theater on certain terms. To falsely yell fire in a movie theater would be a trespass against the owner of the theater. Or, if the owner falsely yelled fire, then this would be a fraud committed against his patrons, of who paid to see a movie.



... Requiring some restraint in countries where they still haven't washed the bloodstains of national guilt for their involvement in the holocaust is appropriate. ...


What is appropriate is to abide by people's human rights, i.e., to not aggress against people for saying things that others dislike.



... Showing some respect for people still bleeding from the holocaust is also appropriate. The "revisionists don't want to speak. They can do that. ...


No they cannot do that. It is illegal. They are imprisoned for years on end and their books are burned. Obviously you don't even know what you are speaking of, given your comments in this post of yours.



... What they want to do is scream, to intimidate the victims, in perpetuation of the evil done to them, or to instigate and motivate the victimizers. Free speech doesn't mean it has no costs. Here, if they can't play by the rules (and all the evidence is that they don't want to, instead donning the white hood of anti-semitic martyrdom) they get sent to the penalty box. Not the oven, not the gas chamber.

FK

If they die then they often get sent to "the oven," i.e., to be cremated. Nor have I seen any evidence that the Nazis used "gas chambers" to murder people.

From your above comments it's quite obvious that you have not so much as the slightest clue as to what in the world you are talking about. Yet your great ignorance does not keep you from spouting nonsense.

What I have said in this very post of mine would get me many years in prison if I were in most of Europe. Had I written a book saying what I have said in this thread then the governments of most of Europe would literally burn all my books. Nor would I be allowed to present any defense, since any defense of my claims would be labeled as so-called "Holocaust denial," and thereby be dissallowed no matter how true it is. Not that such an "offense" even requires a defense, since even if wrong, one has the absolute right to be wrong in one's viewpoint.

As I said previously, that is a violation of human rights, i.e., to be free from the use of force so long as one has not initiated the use of force. Denying some doctrine does not violate anyone's natural rights, and hence to respond with force is itself a violation of a person's natural rights, since said response involves the initiation of the use of force.

But even the motives told to us for this aggression are not sincere. The notion that because political dissidents were persecuted in the past therefore the government needs to persecute political dissidents in order to prevent the persecution of political dissidents from happening is an absurd contradiction in terms.

Again, this has nothing to do with trying to prevent tyranny, because it is tyranny. Rather, it has to do with what it has always had to do with throughout the history of government. It has to do with dissent, in and of itself. That is, thought-crime. The show of dissent is the proof that one is a heretic, and it is the heretics which governments fear the most and have feared the most throughout history.

[Felicia Katt]

Jamie, no matter what the facts are, they seem to get warped and twisted to fit your own bizarre theories. Why do you behave the way you do here? Are you dealing with your feelings of inferiority by clinging to a construct where only you have have superior knowlege so everyone else is your inferior. Or maybe its easier to blame some wide ranging global cabal conspiring to keep you down, rather than accepting your own complicity in your failed lot in life. Whatever drives you, you are spinning your wheels . All you engender here is hate or anger or contempt. You aren't doing yourself, or your causes any good. If your goal here is to win hearts and minds, you might as well stay in the locker room, because the game is over before you ever take the field. No one loves what you say. Everyone minds that you disrupt threads by saying it.
Now, you are apparently denying the holocaust. No gas chambers. No ovens. Just a mass murder. Not even genocide. You are equating holocaust deniers with holocaust victims, which is the most grotesque distortion imaginable. They are only victims of their own twisted hateful agenda. And you aren't a victim here of anything other than your own social-personality problems. The truth isn't out there. Its in you, if you can stand the self examination finding it would take.

FK

[Jamie Michelle]

Jamie, no matter what the facts are, they seem to get warped and twisted to fit your own bizarre theories. Why do you behave the way you do here? Are you dealing with your feelings of inferiority by clinging to a construct where only you have have superior knowlege so everyone else is your inferior. Or maybe its easier to blame some wide ranging global cabal conspiring to keep you down, rather than accepting your own complicity in your failed lot in life. Whatever drives you, you are spinning your wheels . All you engender here is hate or anger or contempt. You aren't doing yourself, or your causes any good. If your goal here is to win hearts and minds, you might as well stay in the locker room, because the game is over before you ever take the field. No one loves what you say. Everyone minds that you disrupt threads by saying it.
Now, you are apparently denying the holocaust. No gas chambers. No ovens. Just a mass murder. Not even genocide. You are equating holocaust deniers with holocaust victims, which is the most grotesque distortion imaginable. They are only victims of their own twisted hateful agenda. And you aren't a victim here of anything other than your own social-personality problems. The truth isn't out there. Its in you, if you can stand the self examination finding it would take.

FK

I merely speak the truth, which is a hated and feared thing by the masses. I didn't come here to be loved. I came here to speak truth.

I'm quite secure in myself that I do not seek the approval of others. To do so would be to divert from the path of truth, since truth and popularity are quite different things.

The world wouldn't be in the mess that it is if the masses loved truth.

[Hara_Juku Tgirl]

The Holocaust i.e genocide is a sad and painful part of human history. So No. Its not a lie but a fact.

~Kisses.

HTG

[Jamie Michelle]

i think the time had come to not engage this creep in any more converstaion, just ignore him/her/it...i think ill go with IT

IT is just looking for reactions, the more IT is beaten the more IT grows, like a horror movie...enough is enough...

finally someone who got their ass kicked throughout school deserved it...surely IT was beaten, insulted and made to feel like a wierdo in every phase of life...perhaps at certain stages IT didnt deserve it, but in retrospect IT deserved it all...

How befitting of you: approval of assault against those you disagree with.

So far as my school days go, I could handle myself just fine against petty thugs like you. What I disliked most about school was that it was an indoctrination-system designed to create unthinking, veritable zombies who would go along with what the establishment told them.

For much more on that, see the below resources:

"The Educational System Was Designed to Keep Us Uneducated and Docile":

http://www.thememoryhole.org/edu/school-mission.htm

The Underground History of American Education: A Schoolteacher's Intimate Investigation Into The Problem Of Modern Schooling by John Taylor Gatto:

http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/underground/index.htm

http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/chapters/index.htm

[Jamie Michelle]

STOP!!!!!! PLEAS!!!

IT knows that its a fact, everyone does, IT wants u to fight, IT wants u to react, PLEASE IGNORE IT!!!!!!!!

would u be posting and saying that gravity really exists? please... its so sad to know that this creepy fucking creature is sitting laughing at home at all the havock it has created...IT doesnt have a ife, IT is miserable and desperate for attention...IT says anything and everything to get a reaction...

IGNORE IT!!!

You already said words to the above effect in your previous "Wed Feb 22, 2006 5:45 am" post. But yet you here contradict your own previous imploration. Such is not surprising considering your lack of a coherent argument against me, and indeed the incoherent arguments you have made against me.

[Felicia Katt]

J, to quote Rod Stewart, there ain't no point in talking when there's nobody listening. She came here to "speak truth" not to listen to it. I've listened to what she had to say, and found no merit in it, whatsoever. Any kernels of truth she may have added are just lost in the chaff and husks of her paranoid delusional world view. Its no longer worth the effort and aggravation to sift through it all. So, while I don't agree with demeaning or denigrating her, reluctantly I do agree with disregarding her.

FK

[GroobySteven]

What's the logic guy called in the comic Viz?
That's Jamie Michelle - completely and utterly, hatstand.
seanchai

[InHouston]

IT is just looking for reactions, the more IT is beaten the more IT grows, like a horror movie...enough is enough...


I agree fuck IT.

:trolls

[Bluejay]

This is the most shameful and disgusting thread, I have ever had the displeasure of viewing.

Some of the views expressed have been extremely obsence and offensive.

Enough is Enough!

[ian]

The evidence is overwhelming.

It's far from a lie.

[ian]

Something tells me that Jamie Michelle was an X Files fan.

Jeez, do they still make Viz?


Yep, Viz is still running strong.

[Felicia Katt]

with all the discussion about Historical Revisionism and all, I thought a clear example of how fair and meaningful and accurate these revisionists efforts truly are was appropriate.

FK

[BKghost]

This may be here bor there, just felt I had to say it:

No one EVER alows us to forget the Jews or the Holocaust,

YET

I have heard time and time again about the black holocaust that happened here in the US "why can't you black people just forgive and forget?"


Just seems fucked up to me.

[BKghost]

what seems to be fucked up is noting ur accentuation of the word EVER and the implication that ur bigger problem is the jewish reminders as opposed to the perhaps lack of the same on the black side...while i think that white america is terrible in many regards and in some ways still is being insensitive in treating the whole slave problems of our countries past, i think youde get more credibility if u didnt seem pissed at the constant reminder, oh god, how fuckin annoying, must effect u daily, of the jewish holocaust...

Actually I ADMIRE the way the Jewish community hold their battle scars up for everyone to see and recognise, "this is what was done to me", simply wish the same was afforded the blk community in this country instead of the old "get over it" attitiude that pervails.

[Jamie Michelle]

its amazing how great these actors were, eh? lost so much weight for their roles as persecuted jews...how the hell they get passed over for oscars?

It's called starvation. Look it up.

[Jamie Michelle]

J, to quote Rod Stewart, there ain't no point in talking when there's nobody listening. She came here to "speak truth" not to listen to it. I've listened to what she had to say, and found no merit in it, whatsoever. Any kernels of truth she may have added are just lost in the chaff and husks of her paranoid delusional world view. Its no longer worth the effort and aggravation to sift through it all. So, while I don't agree with demeaning or denigrating her, reluctantly I do agree with disregarding her.

FK

Indeed the truth does make you paranoid--hence you attempt to run away from the horrific truth, and hence your psychological projection upon me.

I also notice that you had no comments concerning the fact that the U.S. government blew up the World Trade Center in 1993 (among many other staged terrorist attacks by the U.S. government). Apparently the U.S. government staging terrorist attacks against the U.S. public in order to obtain more funding, power and control is just fine with you, yet I'm bad because I'm against that.

As well, your deceased boyfriend would still be alive today had this country followed the principles of liberty and truth, such as I have been expounding upon on this forum. Yet now your boyfriend is dead, having been lied into fighting a mass-murderous war of aggression in order to make rich and powerful elites even more rich and powerful. But because I speak out against that, that makes me bad. That's some interesting non-logic on your part.

Below is my previously-posted section concerning the U.S. government-staged 1993 World Trade Center bombing, of which you apparently find to be just hunky-dory:

########################################

It was the FBI that bombed the World Trade Center in 1993:

None of this would be known today if it were not for the FBI's undercover agent Emad A. Salem taping his conversations with his FBI handlers (unbeknownst to them). Salem thought that the FBI might try to pin it on him so he took measures to protect himself. Indeed, without the FBI the '93 WTC bombing would never have happened, as it was agent Salem who built the bomb for the would-be Muslim "terrorists." Salem wanted to use fake ingredients for the "bomb" but the FBI ordered him to make a real one. When the making of the bomb was complete Salem told the FBI that they could now arrest the would-be terrorists, but the FBI told Salem that the bombing is to go forward. After agent Salem went public with his tapes in a news conference the FBI found it necessary to pay him over a million dollars just to shut him up.

For more on the above, see the below New York Times article:

"Tapes Depict Proposal to Thwart Bomb Used in Trade Center Blast," Ralph Blumenthal, New York Times, October 28, 1993:

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b3c830e34de.htm

And see also:

"Who Bombed The World Trade Center? FBI Bomb Builders Exposed," Paul DeRienzo, Frank Morales and Chris Flash, The Shadow, October 1994/January 1995 Issue:

http://pdr.autono.net/WhoBombedWTC.html

On the above webpage you can find the below two audio clips from one of Emad A. Salem's recorded conversations with one of his FBI handlers, FBI Special Agent John Anticev:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/emad%20salem.mp3

The above clip is an excerpt from the below longer clip:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/SalemWBAI.mp3

The above clips were recorded from a broadcast on WBAI Radio in the city of New York which aired this taped conversation between Emad A. Salem and FBI Special Agent John Anticev.

The below transcript is from 2:57 to 4:31 min:sec from the longer clip (SalemWBAI.mp3):

FBI Special Agent John Anticev: But, uh, basically nothing has changed. I'm just telling you for my own sake that nothing, that this isn't a salary, that it's--you know. But you got paid regularly for good information. I mean the expenses were a little bit out of the ordinary and it was really questioned. Don't tell Nancy I told you this. [Nancy Floyd is another FBI Special Agent who worked with Emad A. Salem in his informant capacity.]

Emad A. Salem: Well, I have to tell her of course.

Anticev: Well then, if you have to, you have to.

Salem: Yeah, I mean because the lady was being honest and I was being honest and everything was submitted with a receipt and now it's questionable.

Anticev: It's not questionable, it's like a little out of the ordinary.

Salem: Okay. Alright. I don't think it was. If that's what you think guys, fine, but I don't think that because we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the D.A. and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful, great case!

Anticev: Well.

Salem: And then he put his head in the sand and said "Oh, no, no, that's not true, he is son of a bitch." [Deep breath.] Okay. It's built with a different way in another place and that's it.

Anticev: No, don't make any rash decisions. I'm just trying to be as honest with you as I can.

Salem: Of course, I appreciate that.

Anticev: And as far as the payments go, and everything like that, they're there. I guarantee you that they are there.

########################################

For more on government-staged terrorism, see the below post by me:

"Documentation on Government-Staged Terrorism," September 30, 2005:

http://www.armleg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2&mforum=libertyandtruth

[chefmike]

:smh :screwy :spam :crap :trolls

[Jamie Michelle]

:smh :screwy :spam :crap :trolls

That is more of your psychological projections.

I notice that you had no comments concerning the fact that the U.S. government blew up the World Trade Center in 1993 (among many other staged terrorist attacks by the U.S. government). Apparently the U.S. government staging terrorist attacks against the U.S. public in order to obtain more funding, power and control is just fine with you, yet I'm bad because I'm against that.

Below is my previously-posted section concerning the U.S. government-staged 1993 World Trade Center bombing, of which you apparently find to be just hunky-dory:

########################################

It was the FBI that bombed the World Trade Center in 1993:

None of this would be known today if it were not for the FBI's undercover agent Emad A. Salem taping his conversations with his FBI handlers (unbeknownst to them). Salem thought that the FBI might try to pin it on him so he took measures to protect himself. Indeed, without the FBI the '93 WTC bombing would never have happened, as it was agent Salem who built the bomb for the would-be Muslim "terrorists." Salem wanted to use fake ingredients for the "bomb" but the FBI ordered him to make a real one. When the making of the bomb was complete Salem told the FBI that they could now arrest the would-be terrorists, but the FBI told Salem that the bombing is to go forward. After agent Salem went public with his tapes in a news conference the FBI found it necessary to pay him over a million dollars just to shut him up.

For more on the above, see the below New York Times article:

"Tapes Depict Proposal to Thwart Bomb Used in Trade Center Blast," Ralph Blumenthal, New York Times, October 28, 1993:

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b3c830e34de.htm

And see also:

"Who Bombed The World Trade Center? FBI Bomb Builders Exposed," Paul DeRienzo, Frank Morales and Chris Flash, The Shadow, October 1994/January 1995 Issue:

http://pdr.autono.net/WhoBombedWTC.html

On the above webpage you can find the below two audio clips from one of Emad A. Salem's recorded conversations with one of his FBI handlers, FBI Special Agent John Anticev:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/emad%20salem.mp3

The above clip is an excerpt from the below longer clip:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/SalemWBAI.mp3

The above clips were recorded from a broadcast on WBAI Radio in the city of New York which aired this taped conversation between Emad A. Salem and FBI Special Agent John Anticev.

The below transcript is from 2:57 to 4:31 min:sec from the longer clip (SalemWBAI.mp3):

FBI Special Agent John Anticev: But, uh, basically nothing has changed. I'm just telling you for my own sake that nothing, that this isn't a salary, that it's--you know. But you got paid regularly for good information. I mean the expenses were a little bit out of the ordinary and it was really questioned. Don't tell Nancy I told you this. [Nancy Floyd is another FBI Special Agent who worked with Emad A. Salem in his informant capacity.]

Emad A. Salem: Well, I have to tell her of course.

Anticev: Well then, if you have to, you have to.

Salem: Yeah, I mean because the lady was being honest and I was being honest and everything was submitted with a receipt and now it's questionable.

Anticev: It's not questionable, it's like a little out of the ordinary.

Salem: Okay. Alright. I don't think it was. If that's what you think guys, fine, but I don't think that because we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the D.A. and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful, great case!

Anticev: Well.

Salem: And then he put his head in the sand and said "Oh, no, no, that's not true, he is son of a bitch." [Deep breath.] Okay. It's built with a different way in another place and that's it.

Anticev: No, don't make any rash decisions. I'm just trying to be as honest with you as I can.

Salem: Of course, I appreciate that.

Anticev: And as far as the payments go, and everything like that, they're there. I guarantee you that they are there.

########################################

For more on government-staged terrorism, see the below post by me:

"Documentation on Government-Staged Terrorism," September 30, 2005:

http://www.armleg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2&mforum=libertyandtruth

[chefmike]

:smh :screwy :spam :crap :trolls :thumbsdown

[Jamie Michelle]

:smh :screwy :spam :crap :trolls :thumbsdown

Again, more of your psychological projections.

I notice that you had no comments concerning the fact that the U.S. government blew up the World Trade Center in 1993 (among many other staged terrorist attacks by the U.S. government). Apparently the U.S. government staging terrorist attacks against the U.S. public in order to obtain more funding, power and control is just fine with you, yet I'm bad because I'm against that.

Below is my previously-posted section concerning the U.S. government-staged 1993 World Trade Center bombing, of which you apparently find to be just hunky-dory:

########################################

It was the FBI that bombed the World Trade Center in 1993:

None of this would be known today if it were not for the FBI's undercover agent Emad A. Salem taping his conversations with his FBI handlers (unbeknownst to them). Salem thought that the FBI might try to pin it on him so he took measures to protect himself. Indeed, without the FBI the '93 WTC bombing would never have happened, as it was agent Salem who built the bomb for the would-be Muslim "terrorists." Salem wanted to use fake ingredients for the "bomb" but the FBI ordered him to make a real one. When the making of the bomb was complete Salem told the FBI that they could now arrest the would-be terrorists, but the FBI told Salem that the bombing is to go forward. After agent Salem went public with his tapes in a news conference the FBI found it necessary to pay him over a million dollars just to shut him up.

For more on the above, see the below New York Times article:

"Tapes Depict Proposal to Thwart Bomb Used in Trade Center Blast," Ralph Blumenthal, New York Times, October 28, 1993:

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b3c830e34de.htm

And see also:

"Who Bombed The World Trade Center? FBI Bomb Builders Exposed," Paul DeRienzo, Frank Morales and Chris Flash, The Shadow, October 1994/January 1995 Issue:

http://pdr.autono.net/WhoBombedWTC.html

On the above webpage you can find the below two audio clips from one of Emad A. Salem's recorded conversations with one of his FBI handlers, FBI Special Agent John Anticev:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/emad%20salem.mp3

The above clip is an excerpt from the below longer clip:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/SalemWBAI.mp3

The above clips were recorded from a broadcast on WBAI Radio in the city of New York which aired this taped conversation between Emad A. Salem and FBI Special Agent John Anticev.

The below transcript is from 2:57 to 4:31 min:sec from the longer clip (SalemWBAI.mp3):

FBI Special Agent John Anticev: But, uh, basically nothing has changed. I'm just telling you for my own sake that nothing, that this isn't a salary, that it's--you know. But you got paid regularly for good information. I mean the expenses were a little bit out of the ordinary and it was really questioned. Don't tell Nancy I told you this. [Nancy Floyd is another FBI Special Agent who worked with Emad A. Salem in his informant capacity.]

Emad A. Salem: Well, I have to tell her of course.

Anticev: Well then, if you have to, you have to.

Salem: Yeah, I mean because the lady was being honest and I was being honest and everything was submitted with a receipt and now it's questionable.

Anticev: It's not questionable, it's like a little out of the ordinary.

Salem: Okay. Alright. I don't think it was. If that's what you think guys, fine, but I don't think that because we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the D.A. and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful, great case!

Anticev: Well.

Salem: And then he put his head in the sand and said "Oh, no, no, that's not true, he is son of a bitch." [Deep breath.] Okay. It's built with a different way in another place and that's it.

Anticev: No, don't make any rash decisions. I'm just trying to be as honest with you as I can.

Salem: Of course, I appreciate that.

Anticev: And as far as the payments go, and everything like that, they're there. I guarantee you that they are there.

########################################

For more on government-staged terrorism, see the below post by me:

"Documentation on Government-Staged Terrorism," September 30, 2005:

http://www.armleg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2&mforum=libertyandtruth[/quote]

[chefmike]

:smh :screwy :spam :crap :trolls :thumbsdown

[Jamie Michelle]

:smh :screwy :spam :crap :trolls :thumbsdown

I see you have nothing of substance to contribute to this discussion. All you have is more of your psychological projections.

I notice that you had no comments concerning the fact that the U.S. government blew up the World Trade Center in 1993 (among many other staged terrorist attacks by the U.S. government). Apparently the U.S. government staging terrorist attacks against the U.S. public in order to obtain more funding, power and control is just fine with you, yet I'm bad because I'm against that.

Below is my previously-posted section concerning the U.S. government-staged 1993 World Trade Center bombing, of which you apparently find to be just hunky-dory:

########################################

It was the FBI that bombed the World Trade Center in 1993:

None of this would be known today if it were not for the FBI's undercover agent Emad A. Salem taping his conversations with his FBI handlers (unbeknownst to them). Salem thought that the FBI might try to pin it on him so he took measures to protect himself. Indeed, without the FBI the '93 WTC bombing would never have happened, as it was agent Salem who built the bomb for the would-be Muslim "terrorists." Salem wanted to use fake ingredients for the "bomb" but the FBI ordered him to make a real one. When the making of the bomb was complete Salem told the FBI that they could now arrest the would-be terrorists, but the FBI told Salem that the bombing is to go forward. After agent Salem went public with his tapes in a news conference the FBI found it necessary to pay him over a million dollars just to shut him up.

For more on the above, see the below New York Times article:

"Tapes Depict Proposal to Thwart Bomb Used in Trade Center Blast," Ralph Blumenthal, New York Times, October 28, 1993:

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b3c830e34de.htm

And see also:

"Who Bombed The World Trade Center? FBI Bomb Builders Exposed," Paul DeRienzo, Frank Morales and Chris Flash, The Shadow, October 1994/January 1995 Issue:

http://pdr.autono.net/WhoBombedWTC.html

On the above webpage you can find the below two audio clips from one of Emad A. Salem's recorded conversations with one of his FBI handlers, FBI Special Agent John Anticev:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/emad%20salem.mp3

The above clip is an excerpt from the below longer clip:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/SalemWBAI.mp3

The above clips were recorded from a broadcast on WBAI Radio in the city of New York which aired this taped conversation between Emad A. Salem and FBI Special Agent John Anticev.

The below transcript is from 2:57 to 4:31 min:sec from the longer clip (SalemWBAI.mp3):

FBI Special Agent John Anticev: But, uh, basically nothing has changed. I'm just telling you for my own sake that nothing, that this isn't a salary, that it's--you know. But you got paid regularly for good information. I mean the expenses were a little bit out of the ordinary and it was really questioned. Don't tell Nancy I told you this. [Nancy Floyd is another FBI Special Agent who worked with Emad A. Salem in his informant capacity.]

Emad A. Salem: Well, I have to tell her of course.

Anticev: Well then, if you have to, you have to.

Salem: Yeah, I mean because the lady was being honest and I was being honest and everything was submitted with a receipt and now it's questionable.

Anticev: It's not questionable, it's like a little out of the ordinary.

Salem: Okay. Alright. I don't think it was. If that's what you think guys, fine, but I don't think that because we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the D.A. and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful, great case!

Anticev: Well.

Salem: And then he put his head in the sand and said "Oh, no, no, that's not true, he is son of a bitch." [Deep breath.] Okay. It's built with a different way in another place and that's it.

Anticev: No, don't make any rash decisions. I'm just trying to be as honest with you as I can.

Salem: Of course, I appreciate that.

Anticev: And as far as the payments go, and everything like that, they're there. I guarantee you that they are there.

########################################

For more on government-staged terrorism, see the below post by me:

"Documentation on Government-Staged Terrorism," September 30, 2005:

http://www.armleg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2&mforum=libertyandtruth

[chefmike]

:smh :screwy :spam :crap :trolls :thumbsdown

[Jamie Michelle]

:smh :screwy :spam :crap :trolls :thumbsdown

No need to project upon me your own psychological conditions.

Again I notice that you had no comments concerning the fact that the U.S. government blew up the World Trade Center in 1993 (among many other staged terrorist attacks by the U.S. government). Apparently the U.S. government staging terrorist attacks against the U.S. public in order to obtain more funding, power and control is just fine with you, yet I'm bad because I'm against that.

Below is my previously-posted section concerning the U.S. government-staged 1993 World Trade Center bombing, of which you apparently find to be just hunky-dory:

########################################

It was the FBI that bombed the World Trade Center in 1993:

None of this would be known today if it were not for the FBI's undercover agent Emad A. Salem taping his conversations with his FBI handlers (unbeknownst to them). Salem thought that the FBI might try to pin it on him so he took measures to protect himself. Indeed, without the FBI the '93 WTC bombing would never have happened, as it was agent Salem who built the bomb for the would-be Muslim "terrorists." Salem wanted to use fake ingredients for the "bomb" but the FBI ordered him to make a real one. When the making of the bomb was complete Salem told the FBI that they could now arrest the would-be terrorists, but the FBI told Salem that the bombing is to go forward. After agent Salem went public with his tapes in a news conference the FBI found it necessary to pay him over a million dollars just to shut him up.

For more on the above, see the below New York Times article:

"Tapes Depict Proposal to Thwart Bomb Used in Trade Center Blast," Ralph Blumenthal, New York Times, October 28, 1993:

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b3c830e34de.htm

And see also:

"Who Bombed The World Trade Center? FBI Bomb Builders Exposed," Paul DeRienzo, Frank Morales and Chris Flash, The Shadow, October 1994/January 1995 Issue:

http://pdr.autono.net/WhoBombedWTC.html

On the above webpage you can find the below two audio clips from one of Emad A. Salem's recorded conversations with one of his FBI handlers, FBI Special Agent John Anticev:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/emad%20salem.mp3

The above clip is an excerpt from the below longer clip:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/SalemWBAI.mp3

The above clips were recorded from a broadcast on WBAI Radio in the city of New York which aired this taped conversation between Emad A. Salem and FBI Special Agent John Anticev.

The below transcript is from 2:57 to 4:31 min:sec from the longer clip (SalemWBAI.mp3):

FBI Special Agent John Anticev: But, uh, basically nothing has changed. I'm just telling you for my own sake that nothing, that this isn't a salary, that it's--you know. But you got paid regularly for good information. I mean the expenses were a little bit out of the ordinary and it was really questioned. Don't tell Nancy I told you this. [Nancy Floyd is another FBI Special Agent who worked with Emad A. Salem in his informant capacity.]

Emad A. Salem: Well, I have to tell her of course.

Anticev: Well then, if you have to, you have to.

Salem: Yeah, I mean because the lady was being honest and I was being honest and everything was submitted with a receipt and now it's questionable.

Anticev: It's not questionable, it's like a little out of the ordinary.

Salem: Okay. Alright. I don't think it was. If that's what you think guys, fine, but I don't think that because we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the D.A. and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful, great case!

Anticev: Well.

Salem: And then he put his head in the sand and said "Oh, no, no, that's not true, he is son of a bitch." [Deep breath.] Okay. It's built with a different way in another place and that's it.

Anticev: No, don't make any rash decisions. I'm just trying to be as honest with you as I can.

Salem: Of course, I appreciate that.

Anticev: And as far as the payments go, and everything like that, they're there. I guarantee you that they are there.

########################################

For more on government-staged terrorism, see the below post by me:

"Documentation on Government-Staged Terrorism," September 30, 2005:

http://www.armleg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2&mforum=libertyandtruth[/quote]

[chefmike]

:smh :screwy :spam :crap :trolls :thumbsdown

[Quinn]

Citing this intelectual tripe as evidence of government complicity in domestic terror attacks is akin to citing a Marvin the Martian Cartoon as evidence of alien attempts to blow up the Earth. :screwy

-Quinn

[Jamie Michelle]

Citing this intelectual tripe as evidence of government complicity in domestic terror attacks is akin to citing a Marvin the Martian Cartoon as evidence of alien attempts to blow up the Earth. :screwy

-Quinn

Odd that you should say that, since I haven't cited any of your intellectual tripe.

But I did notice that you had no comments concerning the fact that the U.S. government blew up the World Trade Center in 1993 (among many other staged terrorist attacks by the U.S. government). Apparently the U.S. government staging terrorist attacks against the U.S. public in order to obtain more funding, power and control is just fine with you, yet I'm bad because I'm against that.

Below is my previously-posted section concerning the U.S. government-staged 1993 World Trade Center bombing, of which you apparently find to be just hunky-dory:

########################################

It was the FBI that bombed the World Trade Center in 1993:

None of this would be known today if it were not for the FBI's undercover agent Emad A. Salem taping his conversations with his FBI handlers (unbeknownst to them). Salem thought that the FBI might try to pin it on him so he took measures to protect himself. Indeed, without the FBI the '93 WTC bombing would never have happened, as it was agent Salem who built the bomb for the would-be Muslim "terrorists." Salem wanted to use fake ingredients for the "bomb" but the FBI ordered him to make a real one. When the making of the bomb was complete Salem told the FBI that they could now arrest the would-be terrorists, but the FBI told Salem that the bombing is to go forward. After agent Salem went public with his tapes in a news conference the FBI found it necessary to pay him over a million dollars just to shut him up.

For more on the above, see the below New York Times article:

"Tapes Depict Proposal to Thwart Bomb Used in Trade Center Blast," Ralph Blumenthal, New York Times, October 28, 1993:

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b3c830e34de.htm

And see also:

"Who Bombed The World Trade Center? FBI Bomb Builders Exposed," Paul DeRienzo, Frank Morales and Chris Flash, The Shadow, October 1994/January 1995 Issue:

http://pdr.autono.net/WhoBombedWTC.html

On the above webpage you can find the below two audio clips from one of Emad A. Salem's recorded conversations with one of his FBI handlers, FBI Special Agent John Anticev:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/emad%20salem.mp3

The above clip is an excerpt from the below longer clip:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/SalemWBAI.mp3

The above clips were recorded from a broadcast on WBAI Radio in the city of New York which aired this taped conversation between Emad A. Salem and FBI Special Agent John Anticev.

The below transcript is from 2:57 to 4:31 min:sec from the longer clip (SalemWBAI.mp3):

FBI Special Agent John Anticev: But, uh, basically nothing has changed. I'm just telling you for my own sake that nothing, that this isn't a salary, that it's--you know. But you got paid regularly for good information. I mean the expenses were a little bit out of the ordinary and it was really questioned. Don't tell Nancy I told you this. [Nancy Floyd is another FBI Special Agent who worked with Emad A. Salem in his informant capacity.]

Emad A. Salem: Well, I have to tell her of course.

Anticev: Well then, if you have to, you have to.

Salem: Yeah, I mean because the lady was being honest and I was being honest and everything was submitted with a receipt and now it's questionable.

Anticev: It's not questionable, it's like a little out of the ordinary.

Salem: Okay. Alright. I don't think it was. If that's what you think guys, fine, but I don't think that because we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the D.A. and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful, great case!

Anticev: Well.

Salem: And then he put his head in the sand and said "Oh, no, no, that's not true, he is son of a bitch." [Deep breath.] Okay. It's built with a different way in another place and that's it.

Anticev: No, don't make any rash decisions. I'm just trying to be as honest with you as I can.

Salem: Of course, I appreciate that.

Anticev: And as far as the payments go, and everything like that, they're there. I guarantee you that they are there.

########################################

For more on government-staged terrorism, see the below post by me:

"Documentation on Government-Staged Terrorism," September 30, 2005:

http://www.armleg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2&mforum=libertyandtruth[/quote][/quote]

[ManOfSteel]

uhh.........words

[Felicia Katt]

Jamie, I don't know what your problem is, but you make no sense, at all. What "deceased boyfriend" are you babbling about. I didn't lose anyone in 9-11 or the aftermath. You, apparently, lost your way, or your mind then though. This thread has NOTHING to do with 9-11, except that in your world the holocaust and 9-11 were both staged. If you deny the holocaust, I'm sorry, but that makes you nuttier than a squirrel convention. And if you believe your own government hijacked planes and flew them into skyscrapers for political gains, you are just paranoid. There is no shortage of proof that the Nazi's systematically tried to exterminate the Jews, along with gays, and gypsies and other "undesirables". There is way more proof you apparently reject for that sad reality than you have ever offered for your far fetched, far flung conspiracy. I'm not projecting anything onto you. I'm rejecting what you say. You may be sincere in your beliefs, but trust me, you are not even remotely persuasive about them. No one is buying anything you are trying to sell here. If you have something on topic to actually add to a thread, do so, but please stop posting all your cut and paste screwball boilerplate where it has no place.

FK

[hondarobot]

I haven't really followed this thread, it's just too much stuff to read :)

But it does raise an interesting point. One of those "burning of the Reichstag" type deals. Nobody figured that out at the time.

It's worthy of examining is all I'm saying. This guy isn't a nut just because he thinks there are things going on below the surface.

I'm just saying. . .

On the other hand, I have no idea what he's talking about really. I didn't actually read it all.

[Jamie Michelle]

Jamie, I don't know what your problem is, but you make no sense, at all. What "deceased boyfriend" are you babbling about. I didn't lose anyone in 9-11 or the aftermath. You, apparently, lost your way, or your mind then though. This thread has NOTHING to do with 9-11, except that in your world the holocaust and 9-11 were both staged. If you deny the holocaust, I'm sorry, but that makes you nuttier than a squirrel convention. And if you believe your own government hijacked planes and flew them into skyscrapers for political gains, you are just paranoid. There is no shortage of proof that the Nazi's systematically tried to exterminate the Jews, along with gays, and gypsies and other "undesirables". There is way more proof you apparently reject for that sad reality than you have ever offered for your far fetched, far flung conspiracy. I'm not projecting anything onto you. I'm rejecting what you say. You may be sincere in your beliefs, but trust me, you are not even remotely persuasive about them. No one is buying anything you are trying to sell here. If you have something on topic to actually add to a thread, do so, but please stop posting all your cut and paste screwball boilerplate where it has no place.

FK

I suppose it was some T-girl here named Jen who lost her boyfriend. You zombies are all so similar in your thought-processes--or, rather, lack thereof--that there's really no point in trying to distinguish you.

And, no need to project upon me your own psychological conditions.

But I did notice that you had no comments concerning the fact that the U.S. government blew up the World Trade Center in 1993 (among many other staged terrorist attacks by the U.S. government). Apparently the U.S. government staging terrorist attacks against the U.S. public in order to obtain more funding, power and control is just fine with you, yet I'm bad because I'm against that.

Below is my previously-posted section concerning the U.S. government-staged 1993 World Trade Center bombing, of which you apparently find to be just hunky-dory:

########################################

It was the FBI that bombed the World Trade Center in 1993:

None of this would be known today if it were not for the FBI's undercover agent Emad A. Salem taping his conversations with his FBI handlers (unbeknownst to them). Salem thought that the FBI might try to pin it on him so he took measures to protect himself. Indeed, without the FBI the '93 WTC bombing would never have happened, as it was agent Salem who built the bomb for the would-be Muslim "terrorists." Salem wanted to use fake ingredients for the "bomb" but the FBI ordered him to make a real one. When the making of the bomb was complete Salem told the FBI that they could now arrest the would-be terrorists, but the FBI told Salem that the bombing is to go forward. After agent Salem went public with his tapes in a news conference the FBI found it necessary to pay him over a million dollars just to shut him up.

For more on the above, see the below New York Times article:

"Tapes Depict Proposal to Thwart Bomb Used in Trade Center Blast," Ralph Blumenthal, New York Times, October 28, 1993:

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b3c830e34de.htm

And see also:

"Who Bombed The World Trade Center? FBI Bomb Builders Exposed," Paul DeRienzo, Frank Morales and Chris Flash, The Shadow, October 1994/January 1995 Issue:

http://pdr.autono.net/WhoBombedWTC.html

On the above webpage you can find the below two audio clips from one of Emad A. Salem's recorded conversations with one of his FBI handlers, FBI Special Agent John Anticev:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/emad%20salem.mp3

The above clip is an excerpt from the below longer clip:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/SalemWBAI.mp3

The above clips were recorded from a broadcast on WBAI Radio in the city of New York which aired this taped conversation between Emad A. Salem and FBI Special Agent John Anticev.

The below transcript is from 2:57 to 4:31 min:sec from the longer clip (SalemWBAI.mp3):

FBI Special Agent John Anticev: But, uh, basically nothing has changed. I'm just telling you for my own sake that nothing, that this isn't a salary, that it's--you know. But you got paid regularly for good information. I mean the expenses were a little bit out of the ordinary and it was really questioned. Don't tell Nancy I told you this. [Nancy Floyd is another FBI Special Agent who worked with Emad A. Salem in his informant capacity.]

Emad A. Salem: Well, I have to tell her of course.

Anticev: Well then, if you have to, you have to.

Salem: Yeah, I mean because the lady was being honest and I was being honest and everything was submitted with a receipt and now it's questionable.

Anticev: It's not questionable, it's like a little out of the ordinary.

Salem: Okay. Alright. I don't think it was. If that's what you think guys, fine, but I don't think that because we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the D.A. and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful, great case!

Anticev: Well.

Salem: And then he put his head in the sand and said "Oh, no, no, that's not true, he is son of a bitch." [Deep breath.] Okay. It's built with a different way in another place and that's it.

Anticev: No, don't make any rash decisions. I'm just trying to be as honest with you as I can.

Salem: Of course, I appreciate that.

Anticev: And as far as the payments go, and everything like that, they're there. I guarantee you that they are there.

########################################

For more on government-staged terrorism, see the below post by me:

"Documentation on Government-Staged Terrorism," September 30, 2005:

http://www.armleg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2&mforum=libertyandtruth

[Jamie Michelle]

shut the fuck up!!!

I agree that you should, J, if your silence is that important to you.

[Jamie Michelle]

blah blah....why wont u just go...its not even fun cleverly insulting u, ur just fucking annoying, u have no friends, no life, no future, just go...ur the only person ive ever seen on this site that doesnt have a single person on their side...just a fuckin looney, please go or say something really horrible so u can get banned....

I merely speak the truth, which is a hated and feared thing by the masses. I didn't come here to be loved. I came here to speak truth.

I'm quite secure in myself that I do not seek the approval of others. To do so would be to divert from the path of truth, since truth and popularity are quite different things.

The world wouldn't be in the mess that it is if the masses loved truth.

[Jamie Michelle]

ok good, u spoke it now go, why annoy people? u said ur piece its here for anyone to read or search later on...why stick around? just to annoy? we are all not buying what ur selling finished...u come to a jewish neighborhood and try and sell bacon, they dont buy it, u give a speech about how delicious it is, they dont buy it, u beg, they dont buy it, u give it out free, they dont take it, u pack up and leave simple.....u said ur piece, im sorry if i was mean to u, anything, ill say or concede anything, this just isnt fun with u anymore...u win, u fuckin win, u speak the truth and we dont wanna hear it, but thats the key, we dont wanna hear it....please go nicely...have class...ur the winner...go, u won, we lost....please, im begging u...ill say or do anything reasonable not to have to stumble across ur long truths anymore, it breaks up any flow to any post...thank u sweetie, and i love ur hair, i was just being mean and jealous..i love u, i really do, muahs...ill miss u...

Of course you don't want the truth. That was quite obvious to begin with. In that regard, the above post of yours is quite redundant.

[tsntx]

why hasnt this miserable excuse of a cunt been banned yet????... good fucking god!!!

[Felicia Katt]

But Jen, you haven't commented as to the fact the US blew up the World trade Center yet LOL

I am against banning people, but can we please put a limit on her ability to keep reposting the same crap over and over and over. if you respond, she reposts it, if you ignore her she reposts it. If you post about something else, she reposts it. She may need to keep repeating it for some reason, but we don't need to keeo rehearing it, do we?



FK

[Jamie Michelle]

But Jen, you haven't commented as to the fact the US blew up the World trade Center yet LOL

I am against banning people, but can we please put a limit on her ability to keep reposting the same crap over and over and over. if you respond, she reposts it, if you ignore her she reposts it. If you post about something else, she reposts it. She may need to keep repeating it for some reason, but we don't need to keeo rehearing it, do we?

FK

I keep reposting it to demonstrably prove how much you and your ilk detest the truth, and how you keep running away from the truth.

As yet you haven't addressed the fact that the U.S. government blew up the World Trade Center in 1993 (among many other staged terrorist attacks by the U.S. government). Apparently the U.S. government staging terrorist attacks against the U.S. public in order to obtain more funding, power and control is just fine with you, yet I'm bad because I'm against that.

Below is my previously-posted section concerning the U.S. government-staged 1993 World Trade Center bombing, of which you apparently find to be just hunky-dory:

########################################

It was the FBI that bombed the World Trade Center in 1993:

None of this would be known today if it were not for the FBI's undercover agent Emad A. Salem taping his conversations with his FBI handlers (unbeknownst to them). Salem thought that the FBI might try to pin it on him so he took measures to protect himself. Indeed, without the FBI the '93 WTC bombing would never have happened, as it was agent Salem who built the bomb for the would-be Muslim "terrorists." Salem wanted to use fake ingredients for the "bomb" but the FBI ordered him to make a real one. When the making of the bomb was complete Salem told the FBI that they could now arrest the would-be terrorists, but the FBI told Salem that the bombing is to go forward. After agent Salem went public with his tapes in a news conference the FBI found it necessary to pay him over a million dollars just to shut him up.

For more on the above, see the below New York Times article:

"Tapes Depict Proposal to Thwart Bomb Used in Trade Center Blast," Ralph Blumenthal, New York Times, October 28, 1993:

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b3c830e34de.htm

And see also:

"Who Bombed The World Trade Center? FBI Bomb Builders Exposed," Paul DeRienzo, Frank Morales and Chris Flash, The Shadow, October 1994/January 1995 Issue:

http://pdr.autono.net/WhoBombedWTC.html

On the above webpage you can find the below two audio clips from one of Emad A. Salem's recorded conversations with one of his FBI handlers, FBI Special Agent John Anticev:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/emad%20salem.mp3

The above clip is an excerpt from the below longer clip:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/SalemWBAI.mp3

The above clips were recorded from a broadcast on WBAI Radio in the city of New York which aired this taped conversation between Emad A. Salem and FBI Special Agent John Anticev.

The below transcript is from 2:57 to 4:31 min:sec from the longer clip (SalemWBAI.mp3):

FBI Special Agent John Anticev: But, uh, basically nothing has changed. I'm just telling you for my own sake that nothing, that this isn't a salary, that it's--you know. But you got paid regularly for good information. I mean the expenses were a little bit out of the ordinary and it was really questioned. Don't tell Nancy I told you this. [Nancy Floyd is another FBI Special Agent who worked with Emad A. Salem in his informant capacity.]

Emad A. Salem: Well, I have to tell her of course.

Anticev: Well then, if you have to, you have to.

Salem: Yeah, I mean because the lady was being honest and I was being honest and everything was submitted with a receipt and now it's questionable.

Anticev: It's not questionable, it's like a little out of the ordinary.

Salem: Okay. Alright. I don't think it was. If that's what you think guys, fine, but I don't think that because we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the D.A. and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful, great case!

Anticev: Well.

Salem: And then he put his head in the sand and said "Oh, no, no, that's not true, he is son of a bitch." [Deep breath.] Okay. It's built with a different way in another place and that's it.

Anticev: No, don't make any rash decisions. I'm just trying to be as honest with you as I can.

Salem: Of course, I appreciate that.

Anticev: And as far as the payments go, and everything like that, they're there. I guarantee you that they are there.

########################################

For more on government-staged terrorism, see the below post by me:

"Documentation on Government-Staged Terrorism," September 30, 2005:

http://www.armleg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2&mforum=libertyandtruth

[Jamie Michelle]

Of course you don't want the truth. That was quite obvious to begin with. In that regard, the above post of yours is quite redundant.You don't care about "truth"; what you desperately want is negative attention. You're a weak-minded malcontent, James. You're anti-social in the true sense. The moral highground that you claim is imaginary.

And yet you still haven't addressed the fact that the U.S. government blew up the World Trade Center in 1993 (among many other staged terrorist attacks by the U.S. government). Apparently the U.S. government staging terrorist attacks against the U.S. public in order to obtain more funding, power and control is just fine with you, yet I'm bad because I'm against that.

Below is my previously-posted section concerning the U.S. government-staged 1993 World Trade Center bombing, of which you apparently find to be just hunky-dory:

########################################

It was the FBI that bombed the World Trade Center in 1993:

None of this would be known today if it were not for the FBI's undercover agent Emad A. Salem taping his conversations with his FBI handlers (unbeknownst to them). Salem thought that the FBI might try to pin it on him so he took measures to protect himself. Indeed, without the FBI the '93 WTC bombing would never have happened, as it was agent Salem who built the bomb for the would-be Muslim "terrorists." Salem wanted to use fake ingredients for the "bomb" but the FBI ordered him to make a real one. When the making of the bomb was complete Salem told the FBI that they could now arrest the would-be terrorists, but the FBI told Salem that the bombing is to go forward. After agent Salem went public with his tapes in a news conference the FBI found it necessary to pay him over a million dollars just to shut him up.

For more on the above, see the below New York Times article:

"Tapes Depict Proposal to Thwart Bomb Used in Trade Center Blast," Ralph Blumenthal, New York Times, October 28, 1993:

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b3c830e34de.htm

And see also:

"Who Bombed The World Trade Center? FBI Bomb Builders Exposed," Paul DeRienzo, Frank Morales and Chris Flash, The Shadow, October 1994/January 1995 Issue:

http://pdr.autono.net/WhoBombedWTC.html

On the above webpage you can find the below two audio clips from one of Emad A. Salem's recorded conversations with one of his FBI handlers, FBI Special Agent John Anticev:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/emad%20salem.mp3

The above clip is an excerpt from the below longer clip:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/SalemWBAI.mp3

The above clips were recorded from a broadcast on WBAI Radio in the city of New York which aired this taped conversation between Emad A. Salem and FBI Special Agent John Anticev.

The below transcript is from 2:57 to 4:31 min:sec from the longer clip (SalemWBAI.mp3):

FBI Special Agent John Anticev: But, uh, basically nothing has changed. I'm just telling you for my own sake that nothing, that this isn't a salary, that it's--you know. But you got paid regularly for good information. I mean the expenses were a little bit out of the ordinary and it was really questioned. Don't tell Nancy I told you this. [Nancy Floyd is another FBI Special Agent who worked with Emad A. Salem in his informant capacity.]

Emad A. Salem: Well, I have to tell her of course.

Anticev: Well then, if you have to, you have to.

Salem: Yeah, I mean because the lady was being honest and I was being honest and everything was submitted with a receipt and now it's questionable.

Anticev: It's not questionable, it's like a little out of the ordinary.

Salem: Okay. Alright. I don't think it was. If that's what you think guys, fine, but I don't think that because we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the D.A. and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful, great case!

Anticev: Well.

Salem: And then he put his head in the sand and said "Oh, no, no, that's not true, he is son of a bitch." [Deep breath.] Okay. It's built with a different way in another place and that's it.

Anticev: No, don't make any rash decisions. I'm just trying to be as honest with you as I can.

Salem: Of course, I appreciate that.

Anticev: And as far as the payments go, and everything like that, they're there. I guarantee you that they are there.

########################################

For more on government-staged terrorism, see the below post by me:

"Documentation on Government-Staged Terrorism," September 30, 2005:

http://www.armleg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2&mforum=libertyandtruth

[chefmike]

blah blah....why wont u just go...its not even fun cleverly insulting u, ur just fucking annoying, u have no friends, no life, no future, just go...ur the only person ive ever seen on this site that doesnt have a single person on their side...just a fuckin looney, please go or say something really horrible so u can get banned....

I merely speak the truth, which is a hated and feared thing by the masses. I didn't come here to be loved. I came here to speak truth.

I'm quite secure in myself that I do not seek the approval of others. To do so would be to divert from the path of truth, since truth and popularity are quite different things.

The world wouldn't be in the mess that it is if the masses loved truth.

You have been officially martyred, Saint Jamie...now go away.

[Jamie Michelle]

And yet you still haven't addressed the fact that the U.S. government blew up the World Trade Center in 1993 (among many other staged terrorist attacks by the U.S. government). Apparently the U.S. government staging terrorist attacks against the U.S. public in order to obtain more funding, power and control is just fine with you, yet I'm bad because I'm against that.

No. You're bad because you're crazy and ugly. You're a paranoid schizophrenic in bad makeup.

And yet you still haven't addressed the fact that the U.S. government blew up the World Trade Center in 1993 (among many other staged terrorist attacks by the U.S. government). Apparently the U.S. government staging terrorist attacks against the U.S. public in order to obtain more funding, power and control is just fine with you, yet I'm bad because I'm against that.

Below is my previously-posted section concerning the U.S. government-staged 1993 World Trade Center bombing, of which you apparently find to be just hunky-dory:

########################################

It was the FBI that bombed the World Trade Center in 1993:

None of this would be known today if it were not for the FBI's undercover agent Emad A. Salem taping his conversations with his FBI handlers (unbeknownst to them). Salem thought that the FBI might try to pin it on him so he took measures to protect himself. Indeed, without the FBI the '93 WTC bombing would never have happened, as it was agent Salem who built the bomb for the would-be Muslim "terrorists." Salem wanted to use fake ingredients for the "bomb" but the FBI ordered him to make a real one. When the making of the bomb was complete Salem told the FBI that they could now arrest the would-be terrorists, but the FBI told Salem that the bombing is to go forward. After agent Salem went public with his tapes in a news conference the FBI found it necessary to pay him over a million dollars just to shut him up.

For more on the above, see the below New York Times article:

"Tapes Depict Proposal to Thwart Bomb Used in Trade Center Blast," Ralph Blumenthal, New York Times, October 28, 1993:

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b3c830e34de.htm

And see also:

"Who Bombed The World Trade Center? FBI Bomb Builders Exposed," Paul DeRienzo, Frank Morales and Chris Flash, The Shadow, October 1994/January 1995 Issue:

http://pdr.autono.net/WhoBombedWTC.html

On the above webpage you can find the below two audio clips from one of Emad A. Salem's recorded conversations with one of his FBI handlers, FBI Special Agent John Anticev:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/emad%20salem.mp3

The above clip is an excerpt from the below longer clip:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/SalemWBAI.mp3

The above clips were recorded from a broadcast on WBAI Radio in the city of New York which aired this taped conversation between Emad A. Salem and FBI Special Agent John Anticev.

The below transcript is from 2:57 to 4:31 min:sec from the longer clip (SalemWBAI.mp3):

FBI Special Agent John Anticev: But, uh, basically nothing has changed. I'm just telling you for my own sake that nothing, that this isn't a salary, that it's--you know. But you got paid regularly for good information. I mean the expenses were a little bit out of the ordinary and it was really questioned. Don't tell Nancy I told you this. [Nancy Floyd is another FBI Special Agent who worked with Emad A. Salem in his informant capacity.]

Emad A. Salem: Well, I have to tell her of course.

Anticev: Well then, if you have to, you have to.

Salem: Yeah, I mean because the lady was being honest and I was being honest and everything was submitted with a receipt and now it's questionable.

Anticev: It's not questionable, it's like a little out of the ordinary.

Salem: Okay. Alright. I don't think it was. If that's what you think guys, fine, but I don't think that because we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the D.A. and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful, great case!

Anticev: Well.

Salem: And then he put his head in the sand and said "Oh, no, no, that's not true, he is son of a bitch." [Deep breath.] Okay. It's built with a different way in another place and that's it.

Anticev: No, don't make any rash decisions. I'm just trying to be as honest with you as I can.

Salem: Of course, I appreciate that.

Anticev: And as far as the payments go, and everything like that, they're there. I guarantee you that they are there.

########################################

For more on government-staged terrorism, see the below post by me:

"Documentation on Government-Staged Terrorism," September 30, 2005:

http://www.armleg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2&mforum=libertyandtruth

[chefmike]

:screwy

[Jamie Michelle]

:screwy

You are projecting upon me your own psychological condition.

As yet you still haven't addressed the fact that the U.S. government blew up the World Trade Center in 1993 (among many other staged terrorist attacks by the U.S. government). Apparently the U.S. government staging terrorist attacks against the U.S. public in order to obtain more funding, power and control is just fine with you, yet I'm bad because I'm against that.

Below is my previously-posted section concerning the U.S. government-staged 1993 World Trade Center bombing, of which you apparently find to be just hunky-dory:

########################################

It was the FBI that bombed the World Trade Center in 1993:

None of this would be known today if it were not for the FBI's undercover agent Emad A. Salem taping his conversations with his FBI handlers (unbeknownst to them). Salem thought that the FBI might try to pin it on him so he took measures to protect himself. Indeed, without the FBI the '93 WTC bombing would never have happened, as it was agent Salem who built the bomb for the would-be Muslim "terrorists." Salem wanted to use fake ingredients for the "bomb" but the FBI ordered him to make a real one. When the making of the bomb was complete Salem told the FBI that they could now arrest the would-be terrorists, but the FBI told Salem that the bombing is to go forward. After agent Salem went public with his tapes in a news conference the FBI found it necessary to pay him over a million dollars just to shut him up.

For more on the above, see the below New York Times article:

"Tapes Depict Proposal to Thwart Bomb Used in Trade Center Blast," Ralph Blumenthal, New York Times, October 28, 1993:

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b3c830e34de.htm

And see also:

"Who Bombed The World Trade Center? FBI Bomb Builders Exposed," Paul DeRienzo, Frank Morales and Chris Flash, The Shadow, October 1994/January 1995 Issue:

http://pdr.autono.net/WhoBombedWTC.html

On the above webpage you can find the below two audio clips from one of Emad A. Salem's recorded conversations with one of his FBI handlers, FBI Special Agent John Anticev:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/emad%20salem.mp3

The above clip is an excerpt from the below longer clip:

http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/SalemWBAI.mp3

The above clips were recorded from a broadcast on WBAI Radio in the city of New York which aired this taped conversation between Emad A. Salem and FBI Special Agent John Anticev.

The below transcript is from 2:57 to 4:31 min:sec from the longer clip (SalemWBAI.mp3):

FBI Special Agent John Anticev: But, uh, basically nothing has changed. I'm just telling you for my own sake that nothing, that this isn't a salary, that it's--you know. But you got paid regularly for good information. I mean the expenses were a little bit out of the ordinary and it was really questioned. Don't tell Nancy I told you this. [Nancy Floyd is another FBI Special Agent who worked with Emad A. Salem in his informant capacity.]

Emad A. Salem: Well, I have to tell her of course.

Anticev: Well then, if you have to, you have to.

Salem: Yeah, I mean because the lady was being honest and I was being honest and everything was submitted with a receipt and now it's questionable.

Anticev: It's not questionable, it's like a little out of the ordinary.

Salem: Okay. Alright. I don't think it was. If that's what you think guys, fine, but I don't think that because we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the D.A. and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful, great case!

Anticev: Well.

Salem: And then he put his head in the sand and said "Oh, no, no, that's not true, he is son of a bitch." [Deep breath.] Okay. It's built with a different way in another place and that's it.

Anticev: No, don't make any rash decisions. I'm just trying to be as honest with you as I can.

Salem: Of course, I appreciate that.

Anticev: And as far as the payments go, and everything like that, they're there. I guarantee you that they are there.

########################################

For more on government-staged terrorism, see the below post by me:

"Documentation on Government-Staged Terrorism," September 30, 2005:

http://www.armleg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2&mforum=libertyandtruth

[chefmike]

:sleep