Ask A Republican

[Erika1487]

So three weeks until I "leave my job with the GOP for good" On Wednesday November 9th, and I have been reflecting about the past couple years and what it has meant to me.
I have decided to share some inside knowlege, not details related to the current election, but the ways and means of how we the GOP have gone about fliping the tables around since 2008.

So here is the deal I will try to anwser all questions honestly as possible with out holding back., But will try to keep to a couple a day.

So go ahead ask away.

Remember no topic or question will be out of bounds just ask and I will try to anwser.


Erika

[Dino Velvet]

Forget Republican or Democrat, how do you consider your politics, Conservative or Liberal. Are you more Moderate or Hard Lined? How have your beliefs changed in the last year?

Sorry for asking more than one question.

[Erika1487]

Forget Republican or Democrat, how do you consider your politics, Conservative or Liberal. Are you more Moderate or Hard Lined? How have your beliefs changed in the last year?

Sorry for asking more than one question.
No problem Dino.
Back when I was first started into politics I was very far right, but over the last couple years I have moved to the center on many issues and now consider myself a moderate.

Over the last year I have become much more centered in my approach to political issues with in the LGBT community, so much so that the old GOP stance on most issues, would put me at great odd with my employers at times. I have seen the "light" as they say, and have become very disenfranchised over fund rising efforts that cater to "religious extremists" elements within our party. I am at a personal level working on finding a better understanding of the LGBT community and what thier needs are. Currently I am working on a small side project. I am looking at the raw unemployment numbers with in the LGTB community and seeing how we can improve the situation in Ohio through our Jobs Council the governor has set up.

Hope that anwsers yor questions Dino

[Stavros]

Preamble: the emergence of the Tea Party, and the refusal of 'Tea party' representatives in the House to compromise on legislation has illuminated the rift that exists betweeen the 'big money, big government Republicans' and the Tea Party upstarts who have described John Boehner and his GOP colleagues as RINO -Republican in Name Only. Yet it is also true that Ronald Reagan in his first inaugural address said Government is not the solution to our problem, Government IS the problem.. and then went on to increase federal spending like there was no tomorrow. Michele Bachmann in a tv debate last month went as far as it is possible to, saying no one should pay the federal government a penny of taxes, for anything- a point on which she was not challenged.

Question: What relationship is the next GOP candidate for the Presidency likely to have with Tea Party candidates?

In the past radicals and extremists have either died out or merged into the system -the Tea Party looks genuuinely different, and more disruptive/destructive for the GOP. The quotes above and some of the ideas are from Matt Bai's fascinating analysis of the GOP over 10 pages in the New York Times:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/16/magazine/does-anyone-have-a-grip-on-the-gop.html?_r=1&hpw

[Faldur]

and the refusal of 'Tea party' representatives in the House to compromise on legislation

Not to steal your thunder Stavros but I think that portion of your comment would be more accurately written, and the insistence of 'Tea Party' representatives to stand on principal and serve the people who elected them.

[Stavros]

Hmmm, Faldur....An interesting spin on the events that appeared to expose the gap between the 'establishment'/RINO wing of the GOP and the 'Principled' Tea Party enthusiasts -which makes it more pungent when asking if a candidate -say Romney, is going to campaign in states for GOP candidates who want, in effect, to turn the Presidency into a ceremonial job that requires the White House incumbent to shake hands with a lot of foreign dignitaries, pin medals on servicemen and women, and open a lot of public buildings -presumably cutting red tape with the scissors he had to buy himself at Wal-Mart.

In the meantime, I await the official verdict of your GOP representative on HA...

[Erika1487]

Preamble: the emergence of the Tea Party, and the refusal of 'Tea party' representatives in the House to compromise on legislation has illuminated the rift that exists betweeen the 'big money, big government Republicans' and the Tea Party upstarts who have described John Boehner and his GOP colleagues as RINO -Republican in Name Only. Yet it is also true that Ronald Reagan in his first inaugural address said Government is not the solution to our problem, Government IS the problem.. and then went on to increase federal spending like there was no tomorrow. Michele Bachmann in a tv debate last month went as far as it is possible to, saying no one should pay the federal government a penny of taxes, for anything- a point on which she was not challenged.

Question: What relationship is the next GOP candidate for the Presidency likely to have with Tea Party candidates?

In the past radicals and extremists have either died out or merged into the system -the Tea Party looks genuuinely different, and more disruptive/destructive for the GOP. The quotes above and some of the ideas are from Matt Bai's fascinating analysis of the GOP over 10 pages in the New York Times:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/16/magazine/does-anyone-have-a-grip-on-the-gop.html?_r=1&hpw

Ok to the question: What relationship is the next GOP candidate for the Presidency likely to have with Tea Party candidates?
I am glad you asked this question Stravos

The current GOP field unlke those of the years past have taken a very decidedly hard right turn. I am going to be honest if any one GOP canidate other than Mitt Romney gets the nomination then they will stack thier cabinet with Tea Party idealouges which has the potential turn to be a disaster in the making.
Now to disect the Tea Party itself you have to understand who they are .
Most if not all are HARD RIGHT Republican voters who can't stand comprimise or the idea of a black president.
So in way you have the very hard core conservative Republican base, thrown in with smige of racism and paranoia of government. The old school Middle of the road GOP party officals and voters can't stand them because they are ruining what should be a slam dunk easy win for a modrate GOP canidate in 12. Imo this has the making of another Goldwater election.

I hope this anwsers your question Stravos

[Faldur]

Ok to the question: What relationship is the next GOP candidate for the Presidency likely to have with Tea Party candidates?
I am glad you asked this question Stravos

The current GOP field unlke those of the years past have taken a very decidedly hard right turn. I am going to be honest if any one GOP canidate other than Mitt Romney gets the nomination then they will stack thier cabinet with Tea Party idealouges which has the potential turn to be a disaster in the making.
Now to disect the Tea Party itself you have to understand who they are .
Most if not all are HARD RIGHT Republican voters who can't stand comprimise or the idea of a black president.
So in way you have the very hard core conservative Republican base, thrown in with smige of racism and paranoia of government. The old school Middle of the road GOP party officals and voters can't stand them because they are ruining what should be a slam dunk easy win for a modrate GOP canidate in 12. Imo this has the making of another Goldwater election.

I hope this anwsers your question Stravos

Wow, where to begin. "Potential turn to be a disaster in the making". Based on what facts? Responsible government equals disaster? I would say its a slim and almost nonexistent potential.

Most are HARD RIGHT, well if believing in personal responsibility and a government for the people and by the people equals HARD RIGHT, count me in. Cant stand the idea of a black president? That is absolute rubbish, and baseless. Funny how a black conservative is currently leading in the republican primaries. Oh, wait if he is a conservative he cannot be black. Now my lady that is prejudice.

Mitt Romney is another cast in the mold establishment politician. Electing him would offer very little change to anything we have seen in the passed 10 1/2 years. If the election was held between Mitt and Obama the Tea Party would vote for Mitt. Americans care about our country, our current commander in chief has done more to destroy the economic condition of our country than any other president in history. Mitt stepping into office would be like re-electing GWB, but at the end of the day he will destroy less than the current occupant.

The GOP has become a bunch of career politicians who are nothing more than democrat lite. The last election showed what the voters of the country were thinking. You want to shrug that off, its ok.. we have another election coming. Maybe this time the Elite Gop will take notice, and STEP DOWN.

[Stavros]

Erika -you have answered the question, but in doing so, and with Faldur's follow up, seem to me to confirm what Matt Bai was analysing in his article -the GOP is split. I do not agree with you on racism -yes, I am sure there are racists in the Tea Party movement, but unless there has been a visit from the Holy Ghost recently, there are racists in the mainstream GOP and the Democratic Party too -some links to background analysis of the Tea Part that Prospero provided a while back also suggest the backers of the Tea Party are not part of the conventional GOP fund-raising corps. In the UK it is argued that voters will turn away from a party if they perceive it to be divided, which feeds in to your Goldwater hypothesis.

Here are two Foreign Policy questions I would put to a Presidential candidate if I had the choice -you can answer them if you like, and maybe indicate what questions you would put to a Presidential candidate if he visited your town.

1. As President will you get over America's 50-year old hissy fit and open full diplomatic and trading relations with Cuba?

2. As President, what actions will you take to create a nuclear-free zone in the Middle East?

[Dino Velvet]

2. As President, what actions will you take to create a nuclear-free zone in the Middle East?

That's a good question that I'd like to see anyone answer. I assume you weren't just talking about the Muslim part of the Middle East but the whole enchilada. How do we deter Iran's nukes when we cannot even discuss what Israel has?

[russtafa]

i thought the republican party feed the slaves.so what happened?

[ed_jaxon]

In the 1930's and 40's blacks moved en masse to support Roosevelt who was thought of as a traitor to his party for his support of the poor and working classes.

The Republican party also shifted to the right with strong southern support.

[russtafa]

In the 1930's and 40's blacks moved en masse to support Roosevelt who was thought of as a traitor to his party for his support of the poor and working classes.

The Republican party also shifted to the right with strong southern support.
so black became white and white became black wow!

[Faldur]

In the 1930's and 40's blacks moved en masse to support Roosevelt who was thought of as a traitor to his party for his support of the poor and working classes.

The Republican party also shifted to the right with strong southern support.

The bastards! Whom without the Civil Rights Act of 1964 would have never passed, voted 82% by Republicans.

[russtafa]

The bastards! Whom without the Civil Rights Act of 1964 would have never passed, voted 82% by Republicans.
huh?

[Silcc69]

The bastards! Whom without the Civil Rights Act of 1964 would have never passed, voted 82% by Republicans.

You are right but you also need to mention the Republicans "Southern Strategy" which is the reason black went from voting mainly republican to democrat.

Southern strategy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_strategy)

[Quiet Reflections]

So three weeks until I "leave my job with the GOP for good" On Wednesday November 9th, and I have been reflecting about the past couple years and what it has meant to me.
I have decided to share some inside knowlege, not details related to the current election, but the ways and means of how we the GOP have gone about fliping the tables around since 2008.

So here is the deal I will try to anwser all questions honestly as possible with out holding back., But will try to keep to a couple a day.

So go ahead ask away.

Remember no topic or question will be out of bounds just ask and I will try to anwser.


Erika
so many republicans are below the poverty line and receiving welfare and/or live lifestyles that fit with general democratic values so why is it that they think a republican party loaded with the wealthy would look out for them when all facts point to the contrary. I would also like to know why a republican that makes 30,000 a year would be against a tax hike for the rich that would help them more than hurt them. One more thing when a republican on welfare or any other public assistance hears that the heads of their party want to end the programs that help them eat,pay rent,live, or whatever, why would they continue to support them? What reason or response would the party give that individual to keep them around? If it matters I'm am not a democrat.

[Stavros]

Dino -Israel officially denies that it has nuclear weapons, a measure of its arrogance since its history is well documented -Tony Blair has consistently refused to acknowledge their existence, but TB (along with Gordon Brown) has been a member of the Labour Friends of Israel for years (David Cameron and the recently disgraced Liam Fox are both members of the Conservative Friends of Israel). Blair and Cameron have ignored the fate of a nuclear engineer, Mordechai Vanunu, who leaked information on Israel's nuclear capacity to the British press in 1986, and was then kidnapped in Rome airport, put on trial and sent to gaol for 18 years. He is now a British subject but is not allowed to travel outside the country or 'talk to foreigners', a bizarre ruling but typical of the Kafkaesque character of the law in that country.

Israel''s nuclear capability was developed at Dimona in the 1950s with substantial help from France, given that Eisenhower was disinterested in Israel and acted against the country at the time of the Suez crisis in 1956. Although the USSR was the first country to recognise Israel in 1948 and David Ben-Gurion claimed to be a socialist, Israel's nuclear strategy was based on solid Cold War principles -its missiles were targeted on sites in the USSR; maybe they still are, although closer targets would make sense.

The point today would be that if nuclear deterrence make sense -that one nuclear state will be deterred from attacking another precisely because of the threat of annihilation should nuclear weapons be used -means that it is entirely logical for Iran -indeed, all of the Middle Eastern states to acquire nuclear weapons to deter an Israeli attack. This kind of escalation not only saps the states of money they should be using for long-term issues related to the end of oil, it also increases political tensions at a time when the changing nature of the Arab states in particular is causing great anxiety. A nuclear free Middle East would be better than what we have now, but of course there would be issues of verification if Israel and Iran were to officially decomission their facilities. The US was not overtly opposed to Iran going nuclear in the 1970s when the Shah proposed it, and when the rise in oil prices gave Iranians dreams of magical transformation. These days, the country is so badly run the world's second largest source of gas has to import it because its gas industry is so inefficient.

As a policy I dont expect it to happen, but I await Erika's informed response to this and the Cuba question.


The question I asked about divided loyalties in US parties cannot be answered historically in a simple way, because Republican and Democrats have changed over time, and at different times in history both parties promoted the rights of African Americans, while at other times they were either cool, or hostile to the same agenda. I think by the 1960s most Americans were in favour of civil rights, and I see no radical difference between either the GOP or the Democrats on this issue.

[Dino Velvet]

Dino -Israel officially denies that it has nuclear weapons, a measure of its arrogance since its history is well documented -Tony Blair has consistently refused to acknowledge their existence, but TB (along with Gordon Brown) has been a member of the Labour Friends of Israel for years (David Cameron and the recently disgraced Liam Fox are both members of the Conservative Friends of Israel). Blair and Cameron have ignored the fate of a nuclear engineer, Mordechai Vanunu, who leaked information on Israel's nuclear capacity to the British press in 1986, and was then kidnapped in Rome airport, put on trial and sent to gaol for 18 years. He is now a British subject but is not allowed to travel outside the country or 'talk to foreigners', a bizarre ruling but typical of the Kafkaesque character of the law in that country.

Israel''s nuclear capability was developed at Dimona in the 1950s with substantial help from France, given that Eisenhower was disinterested in Israel and acted against the country at the time of the Suez crisis in 1956. Although the USSR was the first country to recognise Israel in 1948 and David Ben-Gurion claimed to be a socialist, Israel's nuclear strategy was based on solid Cold War principles -its missiles were targeted on sites in the USSR; maybe they still are, although closer targets would make sense.

The point today would be that if nuclear deterrence make sense -that one nuclear state will be deterred from attacking another precisely because of the threat of annihilation should nuclear weapons be used -means that it is entirely logical for Iran -indeed, all of the Middle Eastern states to acquire nuclear weapons to deter an Israeli attack. This kind of escalation not only saps the states of money they should be using for long-term issues related to the end of oil, it also increases political tensions at a time when the changing nature of the Arab states in particular is causing great anxiety. A nuclear free Middle East would be better than what we have now, but of course there would be issues of verification if Israel and Iran were to officially decomission their facilities. The US was not overtly opposed to Iran going nuclear in the 1970s when the Shah proposed it, and when the rise in oil prices gave Iranians dreams of magical transformation. These days, the country is so badly run the world's second largest source of gas has to import it because its gas industry is so inefficient.

As a policy I dont expect it to happen, but I await Erika's informed response to this and the Cuba question.


The question I asked about divided loyalties in US parties cannot be answered historically in a simple way, because Republican and Democrats have changed over time, and at different times in history both parties promoted the rights of African Americans, while at other times they were either cool, or hostile to the same agenda. I think by the 1960s most Americans were in favour of civil rights, and I see no radical difference between either the GOP or the Democrats on this issue.

In the Middle East Israel has been allowed to play by a different set of rules than anyone else. I'd love to be energy independent enough that we can turn our back on the whole Middle East and let them thrive or die based on their own decisions at their own hands. I haven't been shamed or manipulated enough by Rabbis or Christian preachers nor any phrase in The Bible to lay down my life so Israel stays in the hands of "The Chosen People".

Many people in America are getting fed up. Simply discussing Israel having nukes gets you shouted down and demonized as an anti-Semitic. When people aren't allowed to discuss what ails them they look for a different cure to the disease.

Israel and the Saudis are always trying to get us to go after Iran. If war is inevitable according to them, let the Israelis fight with Saudi financial backing. We don't owe either anything. Let our soldiers come home now. They're our soldiers, not theirs.

[russtafa]

In the Middle East Israel has been allowed to play by a different set of rules than anyone else. I'd love to be energy independent enough that we can turn our back on the whole Middle East and let them thrive or die based on their own decisions at their own hands. I haven't been shamed or manipulated enough by Rabbis or Christian preachers nor any phrase in The Bible to lay down my life so Israel stays in the hands of "The Chosen People".

Many people in America are getting fed up. Simply discussing Israel having nukes gets you shouted down and demonized as an anti-Semitic. When people aren't allowed to discuss what ails them they look for a different cure to the disease.

Israel and the Saudis are always trying to get us to go after Iran. If war is inevitable according to them, let the Israelis fight with Saudi financial backing. We don't owe either anything. Let our soldiers come home now. They're our soldiers, not theirs.they all hate each other and it go's back a thousand years

[Erika1487]

Wow, where to begin. "Potential turn to be a disaster in the making". Based on what facts? Responsible government equals disaster? I would say its a slim and almost nonexistent potential.

Most are HARD RIGHT, well if believing in personal responsibility and a government for the people and by the people equals HARD RIGHT, count me in. Cant stand the idea of a black president? That is absolute rubbish, and baseless. Funny how a black conservative is currently leading in the republican primaries. Oh, wait if he is a conservative he cannot be black. Now my lady that is prejudice.

Mitt Romney is another cast in the mold establishment politician. Electing him would offer very little change to anything we have seen in the passed 10 1/2 years. If the election was held between Mitt and Obama the Tea Party would vote for Mitt. Americans care about our country, our current commander in chief has done more to destroy the economic condition of our country than any other president in history. Mitt stepping into office would be like re-electing GWB, but at the end of the day he will destroy less than the current occupant.

The GOP has become a bunch of career politicians who are nothing more than democrat lite. The last election showed what the voters of the country were thinking. You want to shrug that off, its ok.. we have another election coming. Maybe this time the Elite Gop will take notice, and STEP DOWN.

Faldur I understand where you're coming from, but hoenstly are you from Ohio??? Do you really understand who the tea party is down here??
I pesonally tried to reach out to the tea party in my part of the state by attending 3 of thier "meetings" in diffreint areas in SE Ohio and at each meeting I was greeted with nothing, but hostilty and anger. I can only guess why they dislike thier own party in this state and can assure you after they pulled thier little bullshit stunt in Spring of 10' no one at party hq gives damn to what they think....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUnCUabCsgY
I do not have

[Erika1487]

so many republicans are below the poverty line and receiving welfare and/or live lifestyles that fit with general democratic values so why is it that they think a republican party loaded with the wealthy would look out for them when all facts point to the contrary. I would also like to know why a republican that makes 30,000 a year would be against a tax hike for the rich that would help them more than hurt them. One more thing when a republican on welfare or any other public assistance hears that the heads of their party want to end the programs that help them eat,pay rent,live, or whatever, why would they continue to support them? What reason or response would the party give that individual to keep them around? If it matters I'm am not a democrat.

Hello Quiet

Here is the deal when you talk about Republican policy & politics in S.E Ohio it has nothing to do with income, and everything to do with issues. Infact many folks under 10,000 a yr vote GOP down here. Why you ask? Simply this, there is an basic fear partly instilled by the GOP that there is always a 'boogie man' ready and willing to take your job,guns, income(more taxes) ect.... This is the way politics down here have been run for decades. Scare the undereducated poor working class shitless and they will vote for anyone with an R behind thier name. I don't always agree with this tactic, but it does produce results. Personally I think the Merit and ablity of a canidate should be the capstone of thier campign not fear tactics. Just my 2cents

[Silcc69]

Wow, where to begin. "Potential turn to be a disaster in the making". Based on what facts? Responsible government equals disaster? I would say its a slim and almost nonexistent potential.

Most are HARD RIGHT, well if believing in personal responsibility and a government for the people and by the people equals HARD RIGHT, count me in. Cant stand the idea of a black president? That is absolute rubbish, and baseless. Funny how a black conservative is currently leading in the republican primaries. Oh, wait if he is a conservative he cannot be black. Now my lady that is prejudice.

Mitt Romney is another cast in the mold establishment politician. Electing him would offer very little change to anything we have seen in the passed 10 1/2 years. If the election was held between Mitt and Obama the Tea Party would vote for Mitt. Americans care about our country, our current commander in chief has done more to destroy the economic condition of our country than any other president in history. Mitt stepping into office would be like re-electing GWB, but at the end of the day he will destroy less than the current occupant.

The GOP has become a bunch of career politicians who are nothing more than democrat lite. The last election showed what the voters of the country were thinking. You want to shrug that off, its ok.. we have another election coming. Maybe this time the Elite Gop will take notice, and STEP DOWN.

He is also DEAD LAST in fundraising for the GOP candidates.

[BluegrassCat]

Now to disect the Tea Party itself you have to understand who they are .
Most if not all are HARD RIGHT Republican voters who can't stand comprimise or the idea of a black president.
So in way you have the very hard core conservative Republican base, thrown in with smige of racism and paranoia of government. The old school Middle of the road GOP party officals and voters can't stand them because they are ruining what should be a slam dunk easy win for a modrate GOP canidate in 12. Imo this has the making of another Goldwater election.


Wow, I'm impressed by your candor and intellectual honesty. I thought you were just a party hack but clearly I was wrong.

[Dino Velvet]

Faldur I understand where you're coming from, but hoenstly are you from Ohio??? Do you really understand who the tea party is down here??
I pesonally tried to reach out to the tea party in my part of the state by attending 3 of thier "meetings" in diffreint areas in SE Ohio and at each meeting I was greeted with nothing, but hostilty and anger. I can only guess why they dislike thier own party in this state and can assure you after they pulled thier little bullshit stunt in Spring of 10' no one at party hq gives damn to what they think....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUnCUabCsgY
I do not have

There are extreme religious right wingers in my family that make me look like a hippy Deadhead. They ridiculed a cousin of mine who died of AIDS but were still willing to take his money after his death. My cousin was nice to everyone. They had their feelings about him not because of anything he did to them but for what he was. Erika, if you were in their presence they would be terrible to you. I can't speak for all extreme religious right wingers but I can speak for these ones. I'll never have anyone from that part of the family in my house again unless their heads are nailed above the fireplace.

They're such good Christians that they've made 3 babies out of wedlock while the heathen devil-worshipers in California get married first before conceiving a child. Such hypocrisy. I'll see them all in Hell one day and we'll play Cowboys vs Cossacks.

[african1]

No problem Dino.
Back when I was first started into politics I was very far right, but over the last couple years I have moved to the center on many issues and now consider myself a moderate.

Over the last year I have become much more centered in my approach to political issues with in the LGBT community, so much so that the old GOP stance on most issues, would put me at great odd with my employers at times. I have seen the "light" as they say, and have become very disenfranchised over fund rising efforts that cater to "religious extremists" elements within our party. I am at a personal level working on finding a better understanding of the LGBT community and what thier needs are. Currently I am working on a small side project. I am looking at the raw unemployment numbers with in the LGTB community and seeing how we can improve the situation in Ohio through our Jobs Council the governor has set up.

Hope that anwsers yor questions Dino

Got a question:

in your extensive experience, how many far right Republicans are closeted who are fighting (as they call it) their sexual demons?

Thank you

[african1]

Now to disect the Tea Party itself you have to understand who they are .
Most if not all are HARD RIGHT Republican voters who can't stand comprimise or the idea of a black president.
So in way you have the very hard core conservative Republican base, thrown in with smige of racism and paranoia of government. The old school Middle of the road GOP party officals and voters can't stand them because they are ruining what should be a slam dunk easy win for a modrate GOP canidate in 12. Imo this has the making of another Goldwater election.


Totally agree. It is way too obvious and clear that the rocket ascend of the tea party only occured when Obama took office, with infamous slogans like: We want our America back. meaning we want our white america back.
Nevertheless the Tea Party may be a blessing in disguise. It will at least show those gullible voters who call themselves independent and who cannot make up their minds due in general to a lack of principles and strong beliefs that such elements will bring about the destruction of this great nation of ours. As witnessed first hand with the credit downgrade.

These givens all but make Obama unbeatable. I for one was praying for Michelle Bachmann or Sarah Palin to win the Republican nomination. Because it would be just fun to watch them lose. But Herman Cain Vs. Obama would be great to watch as well. It would be a testimony of this country's evolution and maturity in matters of race to have two African Americans as the main contenders of the highest office in the land. Alas, this is unattainable since Cain's fund raising machine has serious flaws and cardinal defects. Ergo the default nominee Mitt Romney who would lose since he has no fire nor fervor behind him. He will not excite enough conservative voters to win. (the right block that wins elections for Republicans). Think Bob Doll in 1996.

It is important to note that those candidates who have a shot at winning and dream of the big ticket decided to sit this one out. a la Hillary in 2004. But all perfect plans tend to fail sometimes when a big storm occurs: like that of Obama in 2008.

Good discussion folks

[Silcc69]

Why do these republicans always seem to never want to cut military spending? I was watching the debates a bit yesterday and only Paul seemed to get it. I mean we spend more money on military expenditures than the next top 5 nations COMBINED. Would it really hurt us to spend more money than just the top 4? And it also seems that Mitt Romney being a mormon is not a good look for him.

[Stavros]

Because a lot of our media in the UK is influenced by trends in the US, we now have 'head-to-head' debates between the leaders of the three main parties at general election time. The problem is that the format doesn't allow anyone to drill down into specific policies -it is all about creating an impression: that Mr X is clear and polished, that Mr Y fumbleshis answers, that Mr G is devious and so on. If you had a debate for one hour on topic, then four or five candidates could at least have more than one minute and you could ask the question about defence spending which would at least allow people who do have an answer the chance to give it -OR, are the candidates afraid that too much detail will put voters off? Suppose all the candidates know they have to cut the budget for defence by 5% -if they let on then one of the others will campaign aganst the other -He is going to sack the soldiers, etc etc. But you are right, Silcc, there is room for manoeuvre on this issue.

Incidentally, Liam Fox, who was our defence secretary, was battling the overloaded ministry and trying to cut as much as he could without being made to 'walk the plank' -and its likely that some of the dirt on him that was leaked to the presss came from inside his own dept and was designed to get him out of the job so that all those paper pushers and semi-retired generals could continue to strut ther stuff in Whitehall.

[Dino Velvet]

Got a question:

in your extensive experience, how many far right Republicans are closeted who are fighting (as they call it) their sexual demons?

Thank you

Your guess is as good as mine. I guess a few rubes that fall of the end of a turnip truck that I'm blood related to gives me extensive experience. Sorry but I still don't feel qualified to comment. Not crazy about extreme lefties either as my problem is with the "extreme" part. I'm more comfortable in the mushy middle.

[ed_jaxon]

I'll ask a question.

Why isn't Huntsman getting more love from the GOP?

[Erika1487]

There are extreme religious right wingers in my family that make me look like a hippy Deadhead. They ridiculed a cousin of mine who died of AIDS but were still willing to take his money after his death. My cousin was nice to everyone. They had their feelings about him not because of anything he did to them but for what he was. Erika, if you were in their presence they would be terrible to you. I can't speak for all extreme religious right wingers but I can speak for these ones. I'll never have anyone from that part of the family in my house again unless their heads are nailed above the fireplace.

They're such good Christians that they've made 3 babies out of wedlock while the heathen devil-worshipers in California get married first before conceiving a child. Such hypocrisy. I'll see them all in Hell one day and we'll play Cowboys vs Cossacks.
Well Dino honestly it is has been hard dealing with the religous right within the GOP. I have found out about many donors that just make my skin crawl and and make me sick to my stomach. I am sorry you have had trouble with your family, I have not had that much trouble yet, but my former church "Rose of Sharon Holiness Chuch" would have me presently committed for the way I live now.

Wow, I'm impressed by your candor and intellectual honesty. I thought you were just a party hack but clearly I was wrong.

Thank you Blugrass, I can surprise once in awhile ;)

[Erika1487]

Totally agree. It is way too obvious and clear that the rocket ascend of the tea party only occured when Obama took office, with infamous slogans like: We want our America back. meaning we want our white america back.
Nevertheless the Tea Party may be a blessing in disguise. It will at least show those gullible voters who call themselves independent and who cannot make up their minds due in general to a lack of principles and strong beliefs that such elements will bring about the destruction of this great nation of ours. As witnessed first hand with the credit downgrade.

These givens all but make Obama unbeatable. I for one was praying for Michelle Bachmann or Sarah Palin to win the Republican nomination. Because it would be just fun to watch them lose. But Herman Cain Vs. Obama would be great to watch as well. It would be a testimony of this country's evolution and maturity in matters of race to have two African Americans as the main contenders of the highest office in the land. Alas, this is unattainable since Cain's fund raising machine has serious flaws and cardinal defects. Ergo the default nominee Mitt Romney who would lose since he has no fire nor fervor behind him. He will not excite enough conservative voters to win. (the right block that wins elections for Republicans). Think Bob Doll in 1996.

It is important to note that those candidates who have a shot at winning and dream of the big ticket decided to sit this one out. a la Hillary in 2004. But all perfect plans tend to fail sometimes when a big storm occurs: like that of Obama in 2008.

Good discussion folks

I wish I had a crystal ball, to look in the future and tell you who the GOP canidate is going to be, but from my understanding it's basiclly between Perry & Romney, with the real bulk of the GOP machine pulling for anyone not Romney....


in your extensive experience, how many far right Republicans are closeted who are fighting (as they call it) their sexual demons?
Good Question.....
I would say at least 10-15% keep it on the 'Down Low', but there is an suprising number of young gay Republicans, male,female,transgender,black and white that are not only proud to be gay, but proud to be Republican.

[Erika1487]

I'll ask a question.

Why isn't Huntsman getting more love from the GOP?

No ground game, poor politcal execution, and to be honest he just is not a very exciting canidate. I think that it will be Perry or Romney, it's just a hunch though.

[Erika1487]

1. As President will you get over America's 50-year old hissy fit and open full diplomatic and trading relations with Cuba?[QUOTE]

Yes & No on that one Stavros Yes I would Open trading, but only for humanitairan aid, goods such, as Food, Medicine, Clothing, Captial goods would be forbidden until Cuba's own Human rights come cole to meeting our standards. If and when they could manage that, than yes I would open full trading once agian.

[QUOTE=Stavros;1027072]2. As President, what actions will you take to create a nuclear-free zone in the Middle East?

Well tbh I think Israel should have the ablity to defend itself from another pending holocaust by all means necessary, that includes short range nuclear weapons. I do think that in the end anlysis that the middle east and Israel in general has been a flash point for over 3,000 years no matter who leads who, war in the name of God for or agianst will rage on for years to continue sadly :(

[robertlouis]

Excellent thread, Erika. And I admire your candour as well.

My question: in light of the acknowledged disaster that was the Bush administration's foreign policy, what changes would a new Republican president have to make to convince the rest of the world that his/her (hah!) installation in the White House wouldn't mean a return to the bad old days? And as a subset of that question, are there any aspects of Obama's foreign policy that you would retain?

Thanks.

[Erika1487]

Excellent thread, Erika. And I admire your candour as well.

My question: in light of the acknowledged disaster that was the Bush administration's foreign policy, what changes would a new Republican president have to make to convince the rest of the world that his/her (hah!) installation in the White House wouldn't mean a return to the bad old days? And as a subset of that question, are there any aspects of Obama's foreign policy that you would retain?

Thanks.

Well W's foreign policy had some serious flaws, but was at least steady at what its goals where no matter the cost. Obama's Policy seems to be some werid hybrid of Bush's miltary and Clinton's Diplomacy, so it's the one thing I have yet critized the President for to date, because I agree with it!:yayo: Shocking!!
I think that Perry or Romney would probably hold a Much harder line in defending Israel and maybe take an fairly aggressive stance on Iran. If an Republican does win in 12 you could expect a return to more of a Bush style Presidency.

[robertlouis]

Well W's foreign policy had some serious flaws, but was at least steady at what its goals where no matter the cost. Obama's Policy seems to be some werid hybrid of Bush's miltary and Clinton's Diplomacy, so it's the one thing I have yet critized the President for to date, because I agree with it!:yayo: Shocking!!
I think that Perry or Romney would probably hold a Much harder line in defending Israel and maybe take an fairly aggressive stance on Iran. If an Republican does win in 12 you could expect a return to more of a Bush style Presidency.

Thanks Erika. That's what I was afraid of lol.

[Dino Velvet]

Well tbh I think Israel should have the ablity to defend itself from another pending holocaust by all means necessary, that includes short range nuclear weapons. I do think that in the end anlysis that the middle east and Israel in general has been a flash point for over 3,000 years no matter who leads who, war in the name of God for or agianst will rage on for years to continue sadly :(

Then how do we keep Iran from getting a nuke when they might claim they are trying to deter their first holocaust? If there's any military force, let the Israelis, who have the most at stake, do it and let the Saudis pay for it.

[Erika1487]

Then how do we keep Iran from getting a nuke when they might claim they are trying to deter their first holocaust? If there's any military force, let the Israelis, who have the most at stake, do it and let the Saudis pay for it.

I am far from being a Israel supporter at all costs, but two things Dino, You can be of Iranian desent and visit Israel without issue or harm, If a Israeli visits Iran (of Jewish decent) they get beheaded in the name of god. As long as Iran keeps the volume of their complete lunacy turned up all the way, why should they be allowed to have any sort of say in the middle east peace process?? I am in strong belief that Qatar & the Saudis have a big role to play in the peace process. I am still watching what the long term effects are of Mubarak out of power is doing to the power balance of Hamas..

[Stavros]

Erika, thanks for your replies -as expected, you attached conditions to the USA re-opening normal relations with Cuba. There are times in politics when progress can only begin when those conditions are set aside -you did not mention Castro as the Bogey Man, and the possibility that the US is waiting for him to die before real 'change' sets in. Nevertheless, you are a Republican, and for that your policy making perspective to me is not cautious, but backward.

On a nuclear middle east, again, you are more interested in hedging your bets than taking a bold initiative. As I just pointed out to Heather in the Wall St occupation thread, Israel is a political creation -political zionism as a form of Jewish nationalism has little to do with God or the Bible, even if some Jews insist that it gives them rights nobody else can share. Most of Israel's leaders have been atheists, and there is a lot of tension between the secular communities on the coast, and the Religious and Settler communities who get cheap housing and in the case of Religious Jews are exempt from serving in the armed forces. To move forward on the Middle East, means recognising that weapons of mass destruction are horrific in themselves, expensive, and generate precisely the kind of 'arms race' that you find threatening in the case of Iran. The US has had more than one opportunity to repair its relations with Iran, but chickened out, just as Israel promoted HAMAS during the first Intifada to counter the influence of Arafat. These people are all realists, the reason they don't sit down and negotiate a practicable peace is lack of trust -the USA and the leader of the 'Quartet', Antony Blair, have shown themselves on too many occasions to be biased in favour of Israel -President Carter in this regard deserves to be applauded for the effort he made to bring together two unlikely signatories to a peace treaty -Begin and Sadat: and the fact that those two, and subsequently Rabin and Arafat could also shake hands on a deal -a deal opposed by Netanyahu and blocked and shredded by him and Sharon since 1992- proves that with a determined leadership, the USA can overcome Arab suspicions -but as I say, these advances were made through Democrat Presidents -I think the Republican Party with its weird, anti-Jewish, Pro-Israeli Christian Zionists (I can't believe I am writing this) baying in the background, will chicken out of a confrontation with Israel just as Obama has. Netanyahu is not just an insult to your President, he insults us all. It looks bleak, but if Obama gets a second term, I would like to see the US break down the walls of suspicion and prejudice in this time of change in the Middle East -I fear a Republican will be addicted to 'more of the same', which will undermine the long term prospects for peace.

[BigDF]

Well W's foreign policy had some serious flaws, but was at least steady at what its goals where no matter the cost. Obama's Policy seems to be some werid hybrid of Bush's miltary and Clinton's Diplomacy, so it's the one thing I have yet critized the President for to date, because I agree with it!:yayo: Shocking!!
I think that Perry or Romney would probably hold a Much harder line in defending Israel and maybe take an fairly aggressive stance on Iran. If an Republican does win in 12 you could expect a return to more of a Bush style Presidency.
Lord, help us!

[giovanni_hotel]

Why did Marco Rubio LIE about his family being exiles from the Castro regime??

[Silcc69]

[quote=Stavros;1027072]1. As President will you get over America's 50-year old hissy fit and open full diplomatic and trading relations with Cuba?[QUOTE]

Yes & No on that one Stavros Yes I would Open trading, but only for humanitairan aid, goods such, as Food, Medicine, Clothing, Captial goods would be forbidden until Cuba's own Human rights come cole to meeting our standards. If and when they could manage that, than yes I would open full trading once agian.



Well tbh I think Israel should have the ablity to defend itself from another pending holocaust by all means necessary, that includes short range nuclear weapons. I do think that in the end anlysis that the middle east and Israel in general has been a flash point for over 3,000 years no matter who leads who, war in the name of God for or agianst will rage on for years to continue sadly :(

Interesting that makes me wonder why on earth do we treat Cuba like this but then bend over backwards for China?

[Dino Velvet]

I am far from being a Israel supporter at all costs, but two things Dino, You can be of Iranian desent and visit Israel without issue or harm, If a Israeli visits Iran (of Jewish decent) they get beheaded in the name of god. As long as Iran keeps the volume of their complete lunacy turned up all the way, why should they be allowed to have any sort of say in the middle east peace process?? I am in strong belief that Qatar & the Saudis have a big role to play in the peace process. I am still watching what the long term effects are of Mubarak out of power is doing to the power balance of Hamas..

Thanks for your answer. :cheers:

[BigDF]

[quote=Erika1487;1029235][quote=Stavros;1027072]1. As President will you get over America's 50-year old hissy fit and open full diplomatic and trading relations with Cuba?

Interesting that makes me wonder why on earth do we treat Cuba like this but then bend over backwards for China?Cuba hasn't got the money or economic power that China has.:geek:

[trish]

Cuba has no political power or leverage, but ex-Cubans in Miami wield a lot of political power. Our hissy-fit is essentially their hissy-fit.

[Silcc69]

[quote=Silcc69;1029554][quote=Erika1487;1029235]Cuba hasn't got the money or economic power that China has.:geek:

True but it makes us looks like a bunch of hypocrites.

[robertlouis]

[quote=Stavros;1027072]

Yes & No on that one Stavros Yes I would Open trading, but only for humanitairan aid, goods such, as Food, Medicine, Clothing, Captial goods would be forbidden until Cuba's own Human rights come cole to meeting our standards. If and when they could manage that, than yes I would open full trading once agian.



As long as the US maintains that living contradiction of any claim it has to be any kind of leader on human rights called Guantanamo, which just happens to be on Cuban soil, that's a pretty empty declaration.

[russtafa]

[quote=Erika1487;1029235]

As long as the US maintains that living contradiction of any claim it has to be any kind of leader on human rights called Guantanamo, which just happens to be on Cuban soil, that's a pretty empty declaration.

they should have never ever opened Guantanamo they should have have handed their prisoners over to the Northern Alliance and let them deal with the problem

[african1]

Why should we care about Israel?

[Stavros]

From the point of view of military strategists Israel is important because it is viewed as a pro-American, nuclear-armed state in a volatile region where the US has 'vital interests', and 'actors' -states and non-state actors- who have been attacking the USA since 1968-defending Israel is seen by some as defending the USA. Although the volume of Middle Eastern oil that the US imports has declined in recent years, it is is still substantial, and the region has been the fulcrum of so much violence since 1918 that it remains one of the world's 'troublespots'. But the US also has secure relations with the Governments of Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, the UAE and the smaller emirates, and therefore has good relations with a democratically elected government -Israel- and the rest which are autocracies. Some argue that Israel, aside from the cost of 'loans and grants' which run into millions of $$ year, is in fact a strategic liability and that it is precisely the USA's guarantee of Israeli security that means the USA is not an 'honest broker' and that makes the USA vulnerable to attack from Israel's enemies. If the roots of all this tension and violence are the conseqence of the creation of Israel and the dismal relations between Israel and the Palestinians, the logical step is to pursue meaningful peace -something we have discussed a lot.

For Americans, I don't know this: just how powerful and decisive is the so-called Religious Right, or 'Christian Zionist' phenomenon? The argument, which you will get from Michele Bachmann, is that Jesus is going to return and heal the world (dare I say cleanse it?) -not in Idaho or Central China, but he is coming home which presumably should mean Nazareth rather than either Jerusalem or a cave near the Dead Sea - and, on that Great Day, Jews will convert, and they must convert, they will recognise that they were wrong all those centuries and that a humble Jew who was born in a stable really is The Messiah -Bachmann and people like her, believe it is crucial to support Israel -not out of any passion for Judaism, but because of the geography. If you want to add in the Tribulations, the End Times, the Anti-Christ and the language and imagery of the Book of Revelation, go ahead, but the question I ask is, how decisive is the Religious Right going to be in the next Presidental election, given that the voters turned against it last time around?

If Jesus died for all of us, why shouldn't he decide to make his return to central Australia, or Belgium? Or -wait for it- Cuba...

[african1]

From the point of view of military strategists Israel is important because it is viewed as a pro-American, nuclear-armed state in a volatile region where the US has 'vital interests', and 'actors' -states and non-state actors- who have been attacking the USA since 1968-defending Israel is seen by some as defending the USA.

Actually the region is volatile because of the Israel and not despite of it. The lack of peace and the final resolution of the conflict in Palestine caused us a lot of hatred over there.

Most Arab people have a deep appreciation and respect for the US and only say negative things about us when they mention our foreign policy. This partnership with Israel is just too costly to the united states.

We are blindly fighting other people's wars because of Lobby-ism and Fundamentalism. Plain and simple.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZbzs5BwBLA

[Faldur]

If Jesus died for all of us, why shouldn't he decide to make his return to central Australia, or Belgium? Or -wait for it- Cuba...

The Bible clearly states it will be at the Sausalito, CA Starbucks, just off main street.

[Faldur]

Why did Marco Rubio LIE about his family being exiles from the Castro regime??

He didn't, the story that claimed that was completely debunked.

[giovanni_hotel]

He didn't, the story that claimed that was completely debunked.


Rubio said his family came to the U.S. after Castro came into power. Immigration records show that his family came to the U.S. in 1956, during the Batista regime.

It wasn't 'debunked'. Rubio is a phoney and he's not a part of the Cuban exile community in Florida.

Look it up. The first rule when looking for 'facts' from Faux News is that whatever you're hearing is probably a LIE.

[Erika1487]

Why did Marco Rubio LIE about his family being exiles from the Castro regime??

I really can't speak for Rubio pesonally, but his family is from Cuba, maybe got the dates are fuzzy?? It happens more often around election time that politcal leaders start to get "fuzzy about numbers" on purpose to try to appeal to a lager base.

[Erika1487]

Cuba has no political power or leverage, but ex-Cubans in Miami wield a lot of political power. Our hissy-fit is essentially their hissy-fit.


True but it makes us looks like a bunch of hypocrites.



As long as the US maintains that living contradiction of any claim it has to be any kind of leader on human rights called Guantanamo, which just happens to be on Cuban soil, that's a pretty empty declaration.

I honestly think that if Obama loses than whoever the GOP canidate will be would not support trade with Cuba without some sort of change. Oh Btw Club Gitmo is not even the worst retintion centers America Operates there are some 'Black Sites' in Eastern Europe that would make your skin crawl....

[Faldur]

Rubio said his family came to the U.S. after Castro came into power. Immigration records show that his family came to the U.S. in 1956, during the Batista regime.

It wasn't 'debunked'. Rubio is a phoney and he's not a part of the Cuban exile community in Florida.

Look it up. The first rule when looking for 'facts' from Faux News is that whatever you're hearing is probably a LIE.

Firstly you might want to check into the guy at he WP that wrote the article, how he even has credibility is beyond me.

Also might want to take a peak at this info taken from the Fox News Miami Herald. What Fox News doesn't own the Miami Herald? My bad..

The Washington Post just released this interesting story headlined “Marco Rubio’s compelling family story embellishes facts, documents show.” The paper flagged a clear inaccuracy in his official Senate biography that states the Senator’s parents “came to America following Fidel Castro’s takeover.”

That’s false. Rubio’s parents came to the US before then, in 1956. They remained in the US after Castro took over in 1959. They returned to Cuba for brief stints early on, before the country devolved into Soviet-style totalitarianism.

But the top of the story suggests Rubio himself has given this “dramatatic account:” that “he was the son of exiles, he told audiences, Cuban Americans forced off their beloved island after ‘a thug,’ Fidel Castro, took power.”

However, the story doesn’t cite one speech where Rubio actually said that.

To back up the lead, the Washington Post excerpts from a 2006 address in the Florida House where Rubio said “in January of 1959 a thug named Fidel Castro took power in Cuba and countless Cubans were forced to flee… Today your children and grandchildren are the secretary of commerce of the United States and multiple members of Congress…and soon, even speaker of the Florida House.”

The catch: If you listen to the speech, Rubio isn’t just talking about those who specifically fled Cuba after Castro took power. He doesn’t say that his parents fled Cuba. Instead, he was talking about “a community of exiles.” That is: He was talking about all the Cubans who live in Miami.

[Stavros]

Another way of looking at Cuba would be to ask the questions: What does the USA want from Cuba; and, What does Cuba want from the USA?

So far Cuba's petroleum industry has been onshore, but the growth of deepwater exploration and production in the Gulf Of Mexico has revived the speculation about the eastern zone where it laps the shores of south Florida, Cuba and the Bahamas. The Bahamas will be undertaking deepwater exploration in co-operation with the Norwegian state company, Statoil, I am assuming that Cuba can't get co-operation with Russian or Chinese companies, or that there are legal issues concerning exploration in waters that might be close to the USA -the UK has a similar problem with Argentina and the Falkland Islands/Malvinas Islands basin.

So here is an opportunity for the USA to set aside old enmities, create a new alliance with Cuba, and make some good old fashioned money bring that black gold from deep underground to the surface. Exxon has the expertise, and the capital -Cuba needs both: I hear wedding bells already; and I can smell the aroma of Cohiba's...

Why not, America? Help your Cuban buddies, and they will help you.

[Erika1487]

Another way of looking at Cuba would be to ask the questions: What does the USA want from Cuba; and, What does Cuba want from the USA?

So far Cuba's petroleum industry has been onshore, but the growth of deepwater exploration and production in the Gulf Of Mexico has revived the speculation about the eastern zone where it laps the shores of south Florida, Cuba and the Bahamas. The Bahamas will be undertaking deepwater exploration in co-operation with the Norwegian state company, Statoil, I am assuming that Cuba can't get co-operation with Russian or Chinese companies, or that there are legal issues concerning exploration in waters that might be close to the USA -the UK has a similar problem with Argentina and the Falkland Islands/Malvinas Islands basin.

So here is an opportunity for the USA to set aside old enmities, create a new alliance with Cuba, and make some good old fashioned money bring that black gold from deep underground to the surface. Exxon has the expertise, and the capital -Cuba needs both: I hear wedding bells already; and I can smell the aroma of Cohiba's...

Why not, America? Help your Cuban buddies, and they will help you.

There are six major steps Cuba could take to improve economic and political conditions within it'sown borders but refuses to do so.

These include:

1)Adopting free-market policies that include a reform of Cuba's constitution and passage of laws to abolish all legal prohibition of private enterprise and property ownership.

2)Holding democratic elections in the context of a politically pluralist society in which the Communist Party is compelled to compete with democratic organizations and political parties.

3)Freeing all political prisoners currently in Cuban jails.

4)Disbanding the Interior Ministry's security police and the Committees for the Defense of the Revolution, which function as thought-control police and as spies in every neighborhood in Cuba.

5)Eliminating the Marxist political indoctrination, which is a central feature of Cuba's education system.

6)Restoring all confiscated assets and properties to their rightful owners, or agreeing to pay appropriate compensation for what the regime has stolen from them.

Without moving forward the oppression of the Cuban people will sadly continue.....

[robertlouis]

The Bible clearly states it will be at the Sausalito, CA Starbucks, just off main street.

Do you have any idea what he'll order, Faldur? :wiggle:

I don't think he's a latte kind of guy.

[Faldur]

Do you have any idea what he'll order, Faldur? :wiggle:

I don't think he's a latte kind of guy.

Is there any doubt? caramel macchiato..

[robertlouis]

Is there any doubt? caramel macchiato..

Surely MOUNT Carmel macchiato?

Did Starbucks do the coffee to go with the loaves and fishes too? :)

[Stavros]

There are six major steps Cuba could take to improve economic and political conditions within it'sown borders but refuses to do so.

These include:

1)Adopting free-market policies that include a reform of Cuba's constitution and passage of laws to abolish all legal prohibition of private enterprise and property ownership.

2)Holding democratic elections in the context of a politically pluralist society in which the Communist Party is compelled to compete with democratic organizations and political parties.

3)Freeing all political prisoners currently in Cuban jails.

4)Disbanding the Interior Ministry's security police and the Committees for the Defense of the Revolution, which function as thought-control police and as spies in every neighborhood in Cuba.

5)Eliminating the Marxist political indoctrination, which is a central feature of Cuba's education system.

6)Restoring all confiscated assets and properties to their rightful owners, or agreeing to pay appropriate compensation for what the regime has stolen from them.

Without moving forward the oppression of the Cuban people will sadly continue.....

Erika, I don't doubt that these conditions you impose on Cuba relate to the established political mind-set in the US and possibly in both parties, but your list also exposes the double-standard that exempts Cuba from the investment that has made the People's Republic of China crucial to the US economy -free elections? Secret Police? Political Prisoners? And if China is exempt, how about Saudi Arabia -free elections? Indoctrination in schools? Political Prisoners? It is a laudable list of freedoms, and Cuba doesn't do well on the index, but that should not be barrier to the US quite apart from its own political prisoners...there is money to be made, Erika, and Cuba has a lot of potential -and, as they say in politics, Follow the Money -for all your moral rectitude, I don't think Morals are going to shape the future in your part of the world.

[robertlouis]

Erika, I don't doubt that these conditions you impose on Cuba relate to the established political mind-set in the US and possibly in both parties, but your list also exposes the double-standard that exempts Cuba from the investment that has made the People's Republic of China crucial to the US economy -free elections? Secret Police? Political Prisoners? And if China is exempt, how about Saudi Arabia -free elections? Indoctrination in schools? Political Prisoners? It is a laudable list of freedoms, and Cuba doesn't do well on the index, but that should not be barrier to the US quite apart from its own political prisoners...there is money to be made, Erika, and Cuba has a lot of potential -and, as they say in politics, Follow the Money -for all your moral rectitude, I don't think Morals are going to shape the future in your part of the world.

I think the other thing here, Stavros, is that every side of politics in the US shares the same convenient and collective amnesia about the circumstances which created the Cuban revolution - Batista's corrupt, cruel and savage regime propped up by US dollars and CIA intrigue, the same things which disfigured Latin American politics for decades after the false dawn of independence from Spain in the 19th C.

Add America's craven and immediate subservience to the dubious Cuban lobby with all of its mafia associations and a chance was lost. In the circumstances, with an openly hostile superpower just across the water, where else could Cuba as an isolated fledgling nation turn in the late 50s other than Russia? Then came the attempted invasion at the Bay of Pigs debacle, arguably the US's greatest foreign policy faux pas until Iraq.

Castro never was and certainly is no angel, but Americans need to look into their souls and recognise that the 50 year stand-off is very largely of their own making.

[Stavros]

I think that is a fair point RobertLouis-the USA lost an offshore island to a revolution, and revolutions never make people feel comfortable because they are so disruptive -and Cuba did dress itself in anti-American, anti-Imperialist robes, and try to export the revolution, initially in Venezuela. Inn that context it was probably not going to be easy for the US to ignore the previous history and just accept and deal with Castro, and his alliance with the USSR was one of his many mistakes; but Cuba generated the most extraordinary passions at the time, and much irrational thinking. That said, since Fidel has given up power, and in the broader context of what does and doesn't matter, I do think there could be a rapprochement, in spite of what Erika says -but it would have to be acceptable to both sides. The USA dominates the Caribbean, it is a centrifugal force, I don't see how any of the island states can expect to prosper and survive without reaching an accommodations with the USA -this was one reason why the bizarre 'revolution' in Grenada failed. It doesn't mean the islands have to bow down to the US, but the opportunity for good relations is there.

[robertlouis]

I guess that the rules of realpolitik mean that the accommodation with the US, largely on its terms, is inevitable. Shame nevertheless.

The continuing tension and the ebb and flow of relations between the former soviet union and its erstwhile satellites and clients some 20 years after the collapse of the central state demonstrate that such things are never easily or rapidly achieved.

[giovanni_hotel]

Firstly you might want to check into the guy at he WP that wrote the article, how he even has credibility is beyond me.

Also might want to take a peak at this info taken from the Fox News Miami Herald. What Fox News doesn't own the Miami Herald? My bad..

The Washington Post just released this interesting story headlined “Marco Rubio’s compelling family story embellishes facts, documents show.” The paper flagged a clear inaccuracy in his official Senate biography that states the Senator’s parents “came to America following Fidel Castro’s takeover.”

That’s false. Rubio’s parents came to the US before then, in 1956. They remained in the US after Castro took over in 1959. They returned to Cuba for brief stints early on, before the country devolved into Soviet-style totalitarianism.

But the top of the story suggests Rubio himself has given this “dramatatic account:” that “he was the son of exiles, he told audiences, Cuban Americans forced off their beloved island after ‘a thug,’ Fidel Castro, took power.”

However, the story doesn’t cite one speech where Rubio actually said that.

To back up the lead, the Washington Post excerpts from a 2006 address in the Florida House where Rubio said “in January of 1959 a thug named Fidel Castro took power in Cuba and countless Cubans were forced to flee… Today your children and grandchildren are the secretary of commerce of the United States and multiple members of Congress…and soon, even speaker of the Florida House.”

The catch: If you listen to the speech, Rubio isn’t just talking about those who specifically fled Cuba after Castro took power. He doesn’t say that his parents fled Cuba. Instead, he was talking about “a community of exiles.” That is: He was talking about all the Cubans who live in Miami.

You're parsing.

If Rubio claims he's the son of exiles whenever he lambasts the Castro regime in speeches and suggest ALL Cubans are refugees from the Cuban dictatorship, well that simply isn't true.

There is a population of Cuban ex-pats who faced incarceration and possible death in lieu of escaping Communist Cuba. That's a small and select population and doesn't reflect the plight of every Cuban refugee.

What you posted doesn't refute anything, and actually reinforces that Rubio is a fraud.

Just because Rubio's family left under Batista, returned briefly for some explicable reason BACK to Cuba then left again(!!), doesn't make him the 'son of exiles'.

It would be like a Jew whose family left Germany in 1931, returned in 1933 and left again, later describing himself as the son of survivors of the Nazi death camps.

What if Obama went around saying he is the legacy of slavery in the U.S.??
Assholes like Herman Cain would be tearing BHO a new one for this blatant inaccuracy because being 'Black' in America is quite different than being the descendant of African American slaves.

Rubio got caught in a lie he thought IMO was 'fuzzy' enough that he would never get called on it.

Either Rubio's parents left the gold paved streets of the U.S. because they couldn't make it here economically(despite the lavish affection Rubio heaps upon the freedom and opportunity afforded his family here), or they returned to Communist Cuba because they were sympathetic to the Castro regime.

You choose.

Regardless Rubio is full of shit.

[Erika1487]

I really have nothing to add to the Cuba topic boys & girls, you know where I stand.

Here is a new direction to point this thread in...

Political imagery.....
To be specific political imagery that I personally have used to help 'educate' the good students at my University in Republican Politics.

Take a look at our Operation Red November flyer/image from last year....and compare that to the Nazi Eagle...notice anything similar??
The main image is from the National College Republicans in D.C I just embossed our name over top of it for effect.
I seen the similarity right off and asked the brass in D.C about it, and was told it is a 'Image of Strength' and that it was voted on by the national CR Board 'unanimously' as their fall operation logo..
I used this Logo on no fewer than five social networks and posted it all over campus, It was such a sucess that we even bought t-shits with the logo on it for our students. Not a single student even noticed once that the logo's are even related.

Looking back I now feel a little guilty at such a blatant tatic. Your probably asking why did she share this?? Simple really I want to show what really goes on behind the scenes of the Republican party and I just revealed the tip of a very large iceberg.
Oh btw I am not a Nazi or support Nazi idealolgy, It is what I was told to use by the national CR's

[Silcc69]

I really have nothing to add to the Cuba topic boys & girls, you know where I stand.

Here is a new direction to point this thread in...

Political imagery.....
To be specific political imagery that I personally have used to help 'educate' the good students at my University in Republican Politics.

Take a look at our Operation Red November flyer/image from last year....and compare that to the Nazi Eagle...notice anything similar??
The main image is from the National College Republicans in D.C I just embossed our name over top of it for effect.
I seen the similarity right off and asked the brass in D.C about it, and was told it is a 'Image of Strength' and that it was voted on by the national CR Board 'unanimously' as their fall operation logo..
I used this Logo on no fewer than five social networks and posted it all over campus, It was such a sucess that we even bought t-shits with the logo on it for our students. Not a single student even noticed once that the logo's are even related.

Looking back I now feel a little guilty at such a blatant tatic. Your probably asking why did she share this?? Simple really I want to show what really goes on behind the scenes of the Republican party and I just revealed the tip of a very large iceberg.
Oh btw I am not a Nazi or support Nazi idealolgy, It is what I was told to use by the national CR's

Good grief!

[BluegrassCat]

I really have nothing to add to the Cuba topic boys & girls, you know where I stand.

Here is a new direction to point this thread in...

Political imagery.....
To be specific political imagery that I personally have used to help 'educate' the good students at my University in Republican Politics.

Take a look at our Operation Red November flyer/image from last year....and compare that to the Nazi Eagle...notice anything similar??
The main image is from the National College Republicans in D.C I just embossed our name over top of it for effect.
I seen the similarity right off and asked the brass in D.C about it, and was told it is a 'Image of Strength' and that it was voted on by the national CR Board 'unanimously' as their fall operation logo..
I used this Logo on no fewer than five social networks and posted it all over campus, It was such a sucess that we even bought t-shits with the logo on it for our students. Not a single student even noticed once that the logo's are even related.

Looking back I now feel a little guilty at such a blatant tatic. Your probably asking why did she share this?? Simple really I want to show what really goes on behind the scenes of the Republican party and I just revealed the tip of a very large iceberg.
Oh btw I am not a Nazi or support Nazi idealolgy, It is what I was told to use by the national CR's


I don't see the problem. As far as I know bald eagles committed no crimes against humanity and maintain their perch as our major national symbol. Swastikas are right out.

The only problem I see is the blood spatter style as though Red November is about violence. The bird is really the least offensive part.

[Stavros]

Originally Posted by Erika1487
I really have nothing to add to the Cuba topic boys & girls, you know where I stand.

And I thought politics was about debate...!

[Silcc69]

Erika tell me about abortion. I have always seen how Republicans claim to be so prolife but they don't seem to be interested in overturning Roe vs. Wade. Why is that?

[Ben]

No problem Dino.
Back when I was first started into politics I was very far right, but over the last couple years I have moved to the center on many issues and now consider myself a moderate.

Over the last year I have become much more centered in my approach to political issues with in the LGBT community, so much so that the old GOP stance on most issues, would put me at great odd with my employers at times. I have seen the "light" as they say, and have become very disenfranchised over fund rising efforts that cater to "religious extremists" elements within our party. I am at a personal level working on finding a better understanding of the LGBT community and what thier needs are. Currently I am working on a small side project. I am looking at the raw unemployment numbers with in the LGTB community and seeing how we can improve the situation in Ohio through our Jobs Council the governor has set up.

Hope that anwsers yor questions Dino

The Republican Party, not Republicans perse, are quite bad on LGBT issues. I'm not a fan of political parties.
But I like conservatives. Real conservatives. Ya know, the ones who believe in morality and traditional values and the rule of law.
And even the belief in free markets. But, well, a free market ends up as monopoly unless you force them to be free....
But we don't live in a so-called free market. Because the state plays a substantial role in the economy. I mean, the history of America has seen, again, substantial state intervention which precludes a free market or free market capitalism.
Anyway, what are your views on health care and taxation??????? :)

[Erika1487]

I don't see the problem. As far as I know bald eagles committed no crimes against humanity and maintain their perch as our major national symbol. Swastikas are right out.

The only problem I see is the blood spatter style as though Red November is about violence. The bird is really the least offensive part.

Well Bluegrass I am trying to make amends with the communtiy at large over what I have done in my politcal past. The way I see it, by giving access to GOP politics behind the scenes you can uderstand what makes the GOP mind tick.

[Erika1487]

Originally Posted by Erika1487
I really have nothing to add to the Cuba topic boys & girls, you know where I stand.

And I thought politics was about debate...!

Stavros my friend, I am willing to discuss many a great topic, but I have very strong feelings and have stated them, there is really not much else to say.

[Erika1487]

Erika tell me about abortion. I have always seen how Republicans claim to be so prolife but they don't seem to be interested in overturning Roe vs. Wade. Why is that?

The simple anwser is this: Any politcal issue that appeals to "family values" as such, the religous right gets fired up, donates wads 0f $$, in return for politcal speeches and air time on Fox news talking about, how abortion is wrong. The truth however, is that many upperclass young women get abortions, most are done in private clinics far out of sight of the public so not to rile the masses. I think that if most GOP leaders would be real honest with themselves they would admit that all "family values" politcal issues are just clever ways to rasie big money off politcally active churches....:2cent

[Erika1487]

The Republican Party, not Republicans perse, are quite bad on LGBT issues. I'm not a fan of political parties.
But I like conservatives. Real conservatives. Ya know, the ones who believe in morality and traditional values and the rule of law.
And even the belief in free markets. But, well, a free market ends up as monopoly unless you force them to be free....
But we don't live in a so-called free market. Because the state plays a substantial role in the economy. I mean, the history of America has seen, again, substantial state intervention which precludes a free market or free market capitalism.
Anyway, what are your views on health care and taxation??????? :)

Healthcare should be freedom choice, not made publicly mandatory.

Taxation should be simple logic, but in reality it is a cluster fuck of endless loopholes. If it where me I would have a flat 15% percent tax on all Corparations and pesonal income over 500,000 under that it would be prorated down based on income.

[Silcc69]

Good stuff Ericka so what about gun control. I was reading an article a while back that said Democrats are the best salesmens for guns. Because of all of the fear mongering and such. But i'm sure gun sales account for a good amount of tax money and banning them outright is never going to happen.

[Stavros]

Healthcare should be freedom choice, not made publicly mandatory

I admire so much about the USA, yet there are weaknesses which confound reason: what on earth is your problem with social responsibility, Erika?

Your argument that people should be 'free' to choose their own arrangements for health care begs the obvious question for something that at some point must cost money:

What do poor people do if they cannot afford to buy health insurance, in what sense are they, in Milton Friedman's words, Free to Choose?

What do people do who are so dysfunctional they cannot think more than 4 hours ahead, each day, and then fall ill?

What happens to, even middle class people who have to make hard choices and decide that college fees for Child No 1 must take precedence over their health care for three to four years? And so on.

In the UK we have had a National Health Service since 1948, but if you want to, you can augment that by buying private health insurance, dentistry and so on. The NHS is funded from a tax levied on wages that everyone except the unemployed and the elderly pay.

In one of my recent jobs, for example, my gross monthly salary was £2, 595 [$4,156] out of which I paid £394 [$631] in tax, and for National Insurance (health) £188 [$301]. Is that so much to pay for a guarantee that health care will be free at the time of its use? It gives me access to a General Practitioner in my local area for all my aches and pains; it gives me access to a General Hospital should I need the Emergency Unit or be hospitalised for some operation; it gives me access to dental care, psychiatric care and even, should I desire it (which I don't!) SRS -now of course there are variations in the quality of service in all departments, it's not a perfect system: but my NHS contributions help fund my own AND everyone else's, and that is important to me.

My NHS contributions help train doctors and nurses, haematologists and microbologists and radiographers; it is an all-inclusive system that recognises everry individual as having an Equal Right to Care, regardless of their income or social standing. Yes, the system is abused - I used to work in a casualty dept so I have seen an ambulance arrive at the door with someone who called the emergency services because they had a belly ache -but that is not the point: which is: health care, like education, like housing, like food, is a human right. You should be ashamed to call yourself a human being and deny other people the right to health care because you don't want to contribute to anything other than your own private fund. But I guess that's what Republicans believe, I don't believe it is representative of America.

[giovanni_hotel]

+1, Stavros.

[hippifried]

what on earth is your problem with social responsibility, Erika?

What's to understand?
Republicans are the ones who root like hell for Scrooge every year, & get pissed off at the end of the story when those liberal ghosts turn him soft.

They've been so AynRandisized over the last several decades, that they've turned into seagulls.
Mine mine mine (Finding Nemo) - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-3e0EkvIEM&feature=related)

[Faldur]

Lol, don't look now guys but your socialism is showing..

http://media.economist.com/images/20081115/D4608EU1.jpg
http://sanctification.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/image.jpg

[trish]

Don't look now but your naivete is showing.

[Silcc69]

Since when did "affordable healthcare" become "free healthcare"?

[Ben]

Lol, don't look now guys but your socialism is showing..

http://media.economist.com/images/20081115/D4608EU1.jpg
http://sanctification.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/image.jpg

Noam Chomsky articulates what socialism actually is. I mean, we don't live in a capitalist system nor do we live in a socialist system. (Actually, there aren't any socialist systems.... I mean, the core of socialism is worker control of production.
So, people control their own lives, their own working conditions, their own communities.) Would an ACTUAL socialist system work? Who knows. Maybe it would. Maybe it wouldn't.
And the idea that Obama is even remotely socialist is preposterous. (As for capitalism. Well, maybe it would be a good idea. But we've never had anything remotely resembling it. And the reason we haven't had it is because the owning class would never permit it. I mean, they insist on a powerful state to protect them from the ravages of the market. HENCE the bailing out of the banks. Which has absolutely nothing to do with capitalism.)
Take, say, Obamacare. It isn't government run, as it were. But a lot of Americans do not believe in a so-called gift economy.
The idea that I should be concerned about other people. I mean, why should I care if the old woman down the street has health care or enough to eat.
But we've been inculcated since we were wee kids -- through TV and corporate propaganda &/or advertising, through school and even graduate school -- that we shouldn't care about other people.
But Adam Smith -- the so-called father of capitalism -- said the fundamental attribute of being a human being is care and concern for others.
But our culture has driven that out of our heads. Ya know, no one else matters. Future generations don't matter. It's very rational. But extremely scary.
I mean, one could take that rationality to one's own family and say, Why should I care about members of my family or my wife or girlfriend? It simply makes no sense. But we don't do that. We care about friends and family. But the idea of caring about others has been driven out of our heads....

Chomsky on Socialism - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4Tq4VE8eHQ)

[Faldur]

Since when did "affordable healthcare" become "free healthcare"?

Since Obummer Care passed, or was "deemed passed". But Barry saw the writing on the wall of the astronomical costs that were associated with it and he abolished on his own last week.

Since when did "affordable health care" become a right? So let me get this straight, were going to let the 48% of deadbeat Americans tell us what affordable is? Ya, like thats going to happen. We've seen what "affordable tax rates" got us.

When you have a country where 48% of the working population tries to dictate what goodies they should receive you have the fucked up mess that is America today. Thank God we have a Constitution to protect those of us who are productive members of society. So unless you have the ability to ratify the Constitution stick to your little hippie gatherings and let the big boys produce.

And Trish, the one who deems everyone who apposes her as "stupid". How old are you? Late 20's? At what point are you going to get off your duff and become a contributing member of the society you so like to trash.

There is an election in 2012, the country spoke in 2010 the press tried to poo-poo it as a fluke. We will speak again next November, and we really don't care if the liberal fringe is listening or not. Were taking our country back.

[Silcc69]

Since Obummer Care passed, or was "deemed passed". But Barry saw the writing on the wall of the astronomical costs that were associated with it and he abolished on his own last week.

Since when did "affordable health care" become a right? So let me get this straight, were going to let the 48% of deadbeat Americans tell us what affordable is? Ya, like thats going to happen. We've seen what "affordable tax rates" got us.

When you have a country where 48% of the working population tries to dictate what goodies they should receive you have the fucked up mess that is America today. Thank God we have a Constitution to protect those of us who are productive members of society. So unless you have the ability to ratify the Constitution stick to your little hippie gatherings and let the big boys produce.

And Trish, the one who deems everyone who apposes her as "stupid". How old are you? Late 20's? At what point are you going to get off your duff and become a contributing member of the society you so like to trash.

There is an election in 2012, the country spoke in 2010 the press tried to poo-poo it as a fluke. We will speak again next November, and we really don't care if the liberal fringe is listening or not. Were taking our country back.

Parallel versions appear in Mark (http://www.hungangels.com/wiki/Book_of_Mark) 10:24-25 (http://bibref.hebtools.com/?book=%20Mark&verse=10:24-25&src=NIV), and Luke (http://www.hungangels.com/wiki/Book_of_Luke) 18:24-25 (http://bibref.hebtools.com/?book=%20Luke&verse=18:24-25&src=NIV).


The saying was a response to a young rich man (http://www.hungangels.com/wiki/Jesus_and_the_rich_young_man) who had asked Jesus what he needed to do in order to inherit eternal life. Jesus replied that he should keep the commandments, to which the man stated he had done. Jesus responded, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me." The young man became sad and was unwilling to do this. Jesus then spoke this response, leaving his disciples astonished.
That sounds just like these so called hypochristians ahem Faldur.

[Stavros]

When the NHS was created in 1945, it was part of a wave of nationalisations that the British people voted for -health, education, transport, coal and steel were the outstanding examples. But the Labour Government did not nationalise banking, insurance, chemicals and so on, so it was not exactly 'socialism red in tooth and claw', it was the messy compromise that has characterised a lot of Labour politics. Labour in the UK was not alone, most of Europe has national health, its not even controversial, unless some idiot wants to get rid of it.

At the moment, the Conservative idiot right are trying to undermine the NHS because of its costs, by chipping away at various functions which they want the private sector to take on; yet the private sector in health was never abolished: in addition to the mandatory tax we pay, if you want you can buy your own private health insurance, also known here as Queue jumping. No party will get elected in the UK if it pledges to dismantle the health service, its as simple as that, which is why Tories tend to opt for the disguised terrorism of reform.

The Progressive Party in 1912 proposed the creation of a National Health Service in the US, but failed to win the election. The UK went from having a mixed private/charitable health service before 1945 to an integrated one after it, I know that in a country the size of the USA it will always be an expensive proposition, but if you can organise your national defence under one federal department, why can't you do the same for health care? I don't see any proposals to dismantle the armed forces and privatise them, so that, for example, it would be up to Alaska or Ohio to form their own armies which, if they wish, they can send into war on the request of Congress. The benefits far outweigh the costs, and yes many of the costs would not be so great if so many illnesses were not induced by what some would call irresponsible personal behaviour, such as alcohol related cancer, obesity and so forth.

But what does it say about the morals, the values of American society if you have no interest in pooling modest sums of money for the greater benefit of all? You pay taxes for so many things, why not pay an affordable tax for health care that applies equally to all Americans across the USA?

[Faldur]

Parallel versions appear in Mark (http://www.hungangels.com/wiki/Book_of_Mark) 10:24-25 (http://bibref.hebtools.com/?book=%20Mark&verse=10:24-25&src=NIV), and Luke (http://www.hungangels.com/wiki/Book_of_Luke) 18:24-25 (http://bibref.hebtools.com/?book=%20Luke&verse=18:24-25&src=NIV).


The saying was a response to a young rich man (http://www.hungangels.com/wiki/Jesus_and_the_rich_young_man) who had asked Jesus what he needed to do in order to inherit eternal life. Jesus replied that he should keep the commandments, to which the man stated he had done. Jesus responded, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me." The young man became sad and was unwilling to do this. Jesus then spoke this response, leaving his disciples astonished.
That sounds just like these so called hypochristians ahem Faldur.

At last check Silcc, I didn't see the book of Mark referenced in the Constitution of the United States, nor the Bill of Rights. Your references are to personal responsibility. Big difference between a community of people helping those in need, and a large group of lazy asses screaming and yelling about what they "think" they are entitled to.

[Silcc69]

At last check Silcc, I didn't see the book of Mark referenced in the Constitution of the United States, nor the Bill of Rights. Your references are to personal responsibility. Big difference between a community of people helping those in need, and a large group of lazy asses screaming and yelling about what they "think" they are entitled to.

We have something called separation of church and state. Something the Republicans seem to despise. So I bought this up you bring up the constitution so are you for separation of church and state?

[Faldur]

We have something called separation of church and state. Something the Republicans seem to despise. So I bought this up you bring up the constitution so are you for separation of church and state?

Absolutely, 100% agreement. Religion has no place in politics, and if you look Jesus himself said so. How one gains there moral compass is an individual right. But to impose that pathway or belief on any other individual is wrong.

[Silcc69]

Absolutely, 100% agreement. Religion has no place in politics, and if you look Jesus himself said so. How one gains there moral compass is an individual right. But to impose that pathway or belief on any other individual is wrong.

I wish your party would practice that.

[Erika1487]

Good stuff Ericka so what about gun control. I was reading an article a while back that said Democrats are the best salesmens for guns. Because of all of the fear mongering and such. But i'm sure gun sales account for a good amount of tax money and banning them outright is never going to happen.

Gun control is a nonexistent term in the Republican party's vernacular and never will be. In terms of firearms there are two types :
1)full auto & silenced firearms fall under having a federal firearms license from the ATF
2) All other weapons fall under the 2nd Amendment and need no license needed with the exception of having a Conceal Carry Permit.
(my beloved 44Mag S&W for example)

That is the Republican stance. Anything short of full support of the 2nd amendment as described above results in a short stay for a GOP office holder.

[Erika1487]

Healthcare should be freedom choice, not made publicly mandatory

I admire so much about the USA, yet there are weaknesses which confound reason: what on earth is your problem with social responsibility, Erika?

Your argument that people should be 'free' to choose their own arrangements for health care begs the obvious question for something that at some point must cost money:

What do poor people do if they cannot afford to buy health insurance, in what sense are they, in Milton Friedman's words, Free to Choose?

What do people do who are so dysfunctional they cannot think more than 4 hours ahead, each day, and then fall ill?

What happens to, even middle class people who have to make hard choices and decide that college fees for Child No 1 must take precedence over their health care for three to four years?


Here is the issue at hand my friend Stavros:

In this country there is a HUGE MEDICAL SAFETY NET KNOWN AS MEDICAID/MEDICARE

Medicaid ran by individual states for the purpose of helping the poor/disabled/Elderly of low income means. This program catches most of what the insurance companies refer to as the 'uninsurable'.

Medicare ran by the Federal Gov't is designed to help the Elderly/Disabled for the rest of thier natural life
Where does this land the middle class? Well on the lower end they may quaify for a Medicaid program, but more than likely they do not. Now what? How about getting another Job or getting a better job with benifits so you can have medical insurance! The system is not perfect far from it, but we do have some ofthe best Dr's and Hospitals in the world. Many folks from Socalized countries (Canada) come across our borders daily, for healthcare because thier system is such an abject failure.
Getting a job, taking care of your family that is the American way, not some extreme Republican idea.

[Dino Velvet]

Gun control is a nonexistent term in the Republican party's vernacular and never will be. In terms of firearms there are two types :
1)full auto & silenced firearms fall under having a federal firearms license from the ATF
2) All other weapons fall under the 2nd Amendment and need no license needed with the exception of having a Conceal Carry Permit.
(my beloved 44Mag S&W for example)

That is the Republican stance. Anything short of full support of the 2nd amendment as described above results in a short stay for a GOP office holder.

When I bought my last gun I joked with the salesman that Barack Obama's face sells guns like Uncle Ben's sells rice.

http://images.cheezburger.com/completestore/2009/9/6/128967406119872496.jpg

[ed_jaxon]

Here is the issue at hand my friend Stavros:

In this country there is a HUGE MEDICAL SAFETY NET KNOWN AS MEDICAID/MEDICARE

Medicaid ran by individual states for the purpose of helping the poor/disabled/Elderly of low income means. This program catches most of what the insurance companies refer to as the 'uninsurable'.

Medicare ran by the Federal Gov't is designed to help the Elderly/Disabled for the rest of thier natural life
Where does this land the middle class? Well on the lower end they may quaify for a Medicaid program, but more than likely they do not. Now what? How about getting another Job or getting a better job with benifits so you can have medical insurance! The system is not perfect far from it, but we do have some ofthe best Dr's and Hospitals in the world. Many folks from Socalized countries (Canada) come across our borders daily, for healthcare because thier system is such an abject failure.
Getting a job, taking care of your family that is the American way, not some extreme Republican idea.

Unfortunately the "bootstraps" argument isn't really real world.

There was a time when a man or woman would get a job and keep that job for 30 - 40 years retire and get the gold watch. Those days are gone.

Now most people I know work two jobs just to keep close to being able to make ends meet.

Over the last couple of decades there has been a shift where workers never stay too long on a job and might have several distinct careers in their work life. Some of this is on the workers leaving for better opportunities but most of it is on companies adding to the shareholders profits ( which is their primary goal) at the expense of their workers.

Cheaper labor, shrinking benefits and a new work paradigm has made the job of the everyday worker much harder.

There is no way that one can just say, "if you don't have insurance just go get a job with insurance" It don't work that way. not a lot of jobs out there.

I am lucky that my main job gives me great insurance but I am the exception not the norm. And even I work three jobs (two of which are in bars) and just got out of grad school to make sure I can live the life I want.

But here is the good news. In environments like this there is a lot of money to be made for those willing to take risks as entrepreneurs.

But please don't say that to those whose circumstances preclude them from taking such risks.

[Erika1487]

[QUOTE=Dino Velvet;1033758]When I bought my last gun I joked with the salesman that Barack Obama's face sells guns like Uncle Ben's sells rice.

Dino I honestly believe any Democract would have driven gun sales, but ammo has honestly gone insane, It cost me .54Cents a round just to reload my 44 these days:( Store ammo? 44Mag runs about $1.25 a round for good ammo......

[Dino Velvet]

[QUOTE=Dino Velvet;1033758]When I bought my last gun I joked with the salesman that Barack Obama's face sells guns like Uncle Ben's sells rice.

Dino I honestly believe any Democract would have driven gun sales, but ammo has honestly gone insane, It cost me .54Cents a round just to reload my 44 these days:( Store ammo? 44Mag runs about $1.25 a round for good ammo......

I only need ammo for the range now luckily. I have enough ammo stored away to arm a militia. I have a .44 also and am aware of the expense for rounds. I don't reload but I use Federal 230 Grain JHP.

[Stavros]

Thanks for the reply Erika, but the issue is not the quality of your medical professionals.

I think it was a mistake for LBJ to create two systems, Medicare and Medicaid, to me that is a recipe for inefficiency -and as for having a 'safety net' for the poor, apart from being patronising, what happens when, for the sake of the argument, the number of people defined as 'poor' doubles in a decade, placing tremendous strain on the service? I think that the USA has it wrong on health care, and that what Obama pushed through was done in haste, there should have been a complete overhaul, and the creation of one system for all, on the assumption that Americans are all equal.....

[Erika1487]

Unfortunately the "bootstraps" argument isn't really real world.

There was a time when a man or woman would get a job and keep that job for 30 - 40 years retire and get the gold watch. Those days are gone.

Now most people I know work two jobs just to keep close to being able to make ends meet.

Over the last couple of decades there has been a shift where workers never stay too long on a job and might have several distinct careers in their work life. Some of this is on the workers leaving for better opportunities but most of it is on companies adding to the shareholders profits ( which is their primary goal) at the expense of their workers.

Cheaper labor, shrinking benefits and a new work paradigm has made the job of the everyday worker much harder.

There is no way that one can just say, "if you don't have insurance just go get a job with insurance" It don't work that way. not a lot of jobs out there.

I am lucky that my main job gives me great insurance but I am the exception not the norm. And even I work three jobs (two of which are in bars) and just got out of grad school to make sure I can live the life I want.

But here is the good news. In environments like this there is a lot of money to be made for those willing to take risks as entrepreneurs.

But please don't say that to those whose circumstances preclude them from taking such risks.

Ed the system is far, from perfect and I don't have all the anwsers. I think most who are in the "middle' are in trouble financially for medical expences, but to punish them futher by socializing our medical system and charge those who don't choose coverage is just wrong.

[Erika1487]

[quote=Erika1487;1033773]

I only need ammo for the range now luckily. I have enough ammo stored away to arm a militia. I have a .44 also and am aware of the expense for rounds. I don't reload but I use Federal 230 Grain JHP.

Ahh Dino a man after my own tastes :cheers:

[Erika1487]

Thanks for the reply Erika, but the issue is not the quality of your medical professionals.

I think it was a mistake for LBJ to create two systems, Medicare and Medicaid, to me that is a recipe for inefficiency -and as for having a 'safety net' for the poor, apart from being patronising, what happens when, for the sake of the argument, the number of people defined as 'poor' doubles in a decade, placing tremendous strain on the service? I think that the USA has it wrong on health care, and that what Obama pushed through was done in haste, there should have been a complete overhaul, and the creation of one system for all, on the assumption that Americans are all equal.....

Well if it doubles we still pay, that is what the safety net is there for....to catch those who have fallen, reach down and give them a hand to get them back on thier feet. Why have a Social programs if they don't help? How do we pay...well at this point my guess is as good as yours. I think we are getting good at printing money out of thin air though ;)

[Dino Velvet]

[quote=Dino Velvet;1033780]

Ahh Dino a man after my own tastes :cheers:

You use a .44 Mag for self-defense? What do you load it with? I have my .44 for target practice and to put in someone's mouth when I want information. My Sig P220 .45 ACP is what I reach for when I hear a funny noise.

[Erika1487]

You use a .44 Mag for self-defense? What do you load it with? I have my .44 for target practice and to put in someone's mouth when I want information. My Sig P220 .45 ACP is what I reach for when I hear a funny noise.

Yes I do! Right now I use Hornaday 44Mag 300Grain XTP. It is not for the weak of heart!

[Dino Velvet]

Yes I do! Right now I use Hornaday 44Mag 300Grain XTP. It is not for the weak of heart!

Those are for humans? You must have a ring of 500 lb Samoan burglars.

[Erika1487]

Those are for humans? You must have a ring of 500 lb Samoan burglars.

Well to tbh a well placed 40grain 22Winchester Mag might knock someone down, but at 300 grain I want them to hit the floor and not get up. I like to refer to it as the one shot theory. Although if what ever I am shooting at is still moving after 5 shots 300 grain lead in thier chest I might have to find a bigger gun, or save that last bullet for me!

[robertlouis]

Others have said the same, but I'd like to add my own applause for the remarkable frankness and honesty you've shown in providing answers on this thread, Ericka. There are still many significant issues on which you and I may never agree, but my respect and admiration for you as a person of integrity has consistently risen throughout the duration of this willingly self-imposed inquest.

It's also been illuminating to see you take a step back from some of the more extreme policy pronouncements of the GOP and even more significantly from some of the tactics that you're aware they have used in the past and are still using.

Let me wish you every success after you've severed that formal connection with the party. Good for you.

[Erika1487]

Others have said the same, but I'd like to add my own applause for the remarkable frankness and honesty you've shown in providing answers on this thread, Ericka. There are still many significant issues on which you and I may never agree, but my respect and admiration for you as a person of integrity has consistently risen throughout the duration of this willingly self-imposed inquest.

It's also been illuminating to see you take a step back from some of the more extreme policy pronouncements of the GOP and even more significantly from some of the tactics that you're aware they have used in the past and are still using.

Let me wish you every success after you've severed that formal connection with the party. Good for you.

Thank you Robert

I have my core beliefs they won't change, but on many social issues I am very much a moderate/independent. I feel this is a good way to discuss/disclose the many facets of the GOP while not being under their scruitny. My departure on Nov 9th will not be with out regrets, but my life carries on and if the party won't change to support me, I will change without the party.

[russtafa]

bloody hell i envy you guys i would love to have this equipment

[robertlouis]

Thank you Robert

I have my core beliefs they won't change, but on many social issues I am very much a moderate/independent. I feel this is a good way to discuss/disclose the many facets of the GOP while not being under their scruitny. My departure on Nov 9th will not be with out regrets, but my life carries on and if the party won't change to support me, I will change without the party.

Once again Erica, good for you. You're taking a bold step and I hope that it all works out.

[Erika1487]

I have been waiting for Trish to chime in with a question about Republicans and the education system for a week now.....

[Odelay]

When Citizens United came down from the Supreme Court, was the GOP leadership's reaction:

a) Finally, a lifeline! We can continue going head to head with Dems despite demographics being against us.

or,

b) Woo hoo! We're gonna crush the Dem's for decades to come.

[Odelay]

I am far from being a Israel supporter at all costs, but two things Dino, You can be of Iranian desent and visit Israel without issue or harm, If a Israeli visits Iran (of Jewish decent) they get beheaded in the name of god. As long as Iran keeps the volume of their complete lunacy turned up all the way, why should they be allowed to have any sort of say in the middle east peace process?? I am in strong belief that Qatar & the Saudis have a big role to play in the peace process. I am still watching what the long term effects are of Mubarak out of power is doing to the power balance of Hamas..

Iran is simply not a great place to visit whether you're Israeli or not. But your statement leads one to think that all Jews are persecuted and perhaps beheaded in Iran, and I know that's not true. There is a significant minority Jewish population that lives peaceably in Iran. Iran's problem with Israel is the same as all of the other Arab countries, they feel the country was unfairly taken from the Palestinians. It's a geography thing, not a religious thing.

[Erika1487]

When Citizens United came down from the Supreme Court, was the GOP leadership's reaction:

a) Finally, a lifeline! We can continue going head to head with Dems despite demographics being against us.

or,

b) Woo hoo! We're gonna crush the Dem's for decades to come.

I would say a combanation of both,
A) we can finally compete with union spending
B) It's time to kick some ass.

Political fundrasing has alys been a well organized shell game on both sides of the isle though.

[Odelay]

If I was a loyal Republican, which I'm not, who should I be rooting for in this Ohio GOP spat? Who are the good guy(s)? Are Kasich's staff members really as bad as DeWine is making them out to be? http://www.toledoblade.com/State/2011/12/04/State-GOP-chief-Kasich-team-clash-over-party-control.html

[Erika1487]

If I was a loyal Republican, which I'm not, who should I be rooting for in this Ohio GOP spat? Who are the good guy(s)? Are Kasich's staff members really as bad as DeWine is making them out to be? http://www.toledoblade.com/State/2011/12/04/State-GOP-chief-Kasich-team-clash-over-party-control.html
As much as I hate to say it the party is right on this one.
Kasich wants control of the party plain and simple.Over the last year it has gotten worse, because Kasich wants to purge the 'blue rinos'.
I can tell you on a personal level John Kasich is not a bad guy, but politically he is a pure asshole, who is a 'his way or the highway' type of leader.. Ohio issue 2 was a complete failure and it all rests on the shoulders of the Governor. He blames the party for lack of support, but the truth is it was at best a failed policy to start with.

[Odelay]

As much as I hate to say it the party is right on this one.
Kasich wants control of the party plain and simple.Over the last year it has gotten worse, because Kasich wants to purge the 'blue rinos'.
I can tell you on a personal level John Kasich is not a bad guy, but politically he is a pure asshole, who is a 'his way or the highway' type of leader.. Ohio issue 2 was a complete failure and it all rests on the shoulders of the Governor. He blames the party for lack of support, but the truth is it was at best a failed policy to start with.

I've followed Kasich's career for at least 20 years. He has charisma and is pretty intelligent and articulate. I think, as you say, his political style has gotten him into some trouble as Guv.